I did the same mod to an old drill vise that I use. It is very useful, particularly holding thin stuff for drilling. The vise is also strong enough for light milling.
Yes-haw! You keep on doing things that make me say" why haven't I done that, or I need one of those" Excellent bit of work, thanks for the video, cheers!
Hi Winky, if you undercut the steps with a dovetail cutter, (to a sharp) you can bite into material and take some aggressive cuts without the work pulling out. Keep innovating!
I thought about that just to eliminate the possibility of a radius in the strep but I didn't want to dull my expensive dovetail cutter. I may do this anyway.
@@WinkysWorkshop I actually use hardened Kurt jaws and formed the angular step in the surface grinder. Be sure to polish the sharp edge or it will chip away. I use it with everything from slippery plastics to 304.
Great video, thanks Later today, I plan on making a video showing your printing press device. I’m afraid I will not be able to do it justice. Just show it off. In part B I will actually show them the letter that you sent me describing its use.
That's a good idea, unless you have to do a lot of drilling close to the edge of your parts. That's the only drawback that comes to mind. It's definitely a good idea for secondary jaws.
I made a set of sacrificial jaws for my mill vice out of aluminum for this very reason. I figured I may be get a year or tow out of them. That was five years ago and I'm still using them today 🤣
Did you use a solid carbide end mill. Or did you use high speed steel end mill to cut the jaws on the vise. I was under the impression the jaws was real hard and almost impossible to cut with out annealing them first. But it seems you had no problems doing it. I know solid carbide bits get very pricey to buy. And the vise you have do you mind giving the info on where you purchased it. I really like that it opens 5 1\2 inches wide. I barely get 41\2 out of mine.
The jaws are very hard and I did use carbide. I love this vise. The only issue is the screw threads are not protected and swarf gets in them. I spray WD40 on them and it seems to keep them clean. The link to the vise is in the description. Carbide is not that high priced unless you buy name brands and I have found that unknown brands (or no brand) end mills do just as well. I bought a 1/2" 3 flute end mill from Temu for about 12 bucks and they work better that ones i paid $35 for. I bought 4 more.
@@WinkysWorkshop the vice brand you have is a company I have used and they seem very reliable “HHIP”? “Import” presumably but quality approved I think. I bought a new Kurt a couple years ago spending the fundage because I like to buy form the USA and all American stuff when I can. It is a form of support for me. I’m not passing judgement, just my personal preference. I use Shars too.
@@cogentdynamics Yeah, I agree with buying USA but dang the price is crazy high sometimes. I refuse to buy from Shars because they do not sand behind their products. I had two backing plate go bad (bad cast iron and the threads crumbled). One was 3 month old and the other almost a year. 30 day return policy is absolute! Never again.
@@WinkysWorkshop I checked out the link and they have a good selection of 5 c collets. I am missing the 7/16" from my set so I may order one from them. Thanks for the link seems they have a good selection of machine accessories. Did they give you a discount code?
@@terrycannon570 No they did not. They are a good company to work with and in general I think there products are good. Sometimes I get free stuff from vendors but in this case I bought the vice. I recently bought some spiral flute taps from them and 2 out of 4 were terrible. I've had the same problems with taps on Amazon. I buy from McMaster Carr now and they are great (Greenfield) but they don't sell spiral taps.
I’m considering doing that to my vise. Is that a standard depth and width? What do you think about a little bit of an under cut on the bottoms? Thanks for the video!
I believe that screw in the movable jaw should be no more that snug. I'd even back it off a tiny bit, to be sure that the half ball inside is free to float. And when I was working in a CNC shop I would back that screw out and lift the the jaw free for a good cleaning with almost every setup. I must admit that I'm not so diligent in my home shop.
I disagree about the ball. In fact you can clamp toward the top of the jaw and measure the jaw life if its not tight. However, in daily usage you have to be able to leave is snug of the jaw is hard to move.
I have been told to do just what you did. My friend made a lot of the parts we installed in RRD. I haven’t done that because I am afraid to mill such hard of steel. I assume you milled with carbide? The risk to me that my 6” Kurt jaws are rather expensive which I prefer not to mess them up. Your step jaws saves a lot of PITA with parallels moving around and getting chips under them while doing repetitive parts. Thanks again Mark, for your insight and super practical solutions.
Yes carbide, I think I paid about 30 or 35 for new jaws, it took some of the worry out of screwing up. Who was the friend that made al the parts for RRD
@ my company Crossfield/press tech and I was the USA manager, technician, salesman and whatever. Most of the mechanical parts we did custom was couplings, web guides, gear boxes, scanner head brackets, compensator rollers and ball screw assemblies. I became Cogent Dynamics where we did many of those projects including insulated cylinder bearing blocks to allow electrostatic ink transfer system. Mostly Rotogravure. Much was done In Spartanburg, Lynchburg and places like Salem Gravure and other Quebecor locations. My friends shop is in the Chicago suburbs called Fern Manufacturing. He began in the mid to late ‘70s. My first machines were hand me downs when he was working at nights in an old barn. He has always helped me (we met in 1970 in H.S.). But I only get the ideas to make me think and try to understand. They are incredibly capable. I was told years back that I need “step jaws” he would not explain how to do them since I was previously informed on how to do lots of operations. I had not considered milling my Kurt Jaws (100 bucks + and I assumed to be ground). I have not seen them commercially available. Only a small step was needed. Your 0.100” step was something I hadn’t considered. Brilliant!
I would have made 2 loose parallels with a step on. Same principle but you woukd still have virgin vice jaws. Still machine the step on them to a known distance from the back face. Beware that YOUR step corners may have a radius from the cutter, really need a slight undercut to ensure the work sits properly on the flat or chamfer the work. Regards from Australia.
Machining steps in thick parallels is a good method although the tendency to move around along with the possibility of swarf getting under or behind them is a huge negative. I thought about the radius, it was a fairly new end mill and looks like a very small radius. I thought about using a dovetail cutter to cut a relief. I just didn't want to dull my expensive cutter of the hardened jaws.
@@WinkysWorkshop Just a thought. If you have a Dremel tool with those tiny cut off wheels, hold it at 45 degrees and carefully undercut the corner by 15 thou or so. Regards.
@@WinkysWorkshoptry using springs between the parallels, it keeps them snug against the jaws and base. They also take out the backlash in the vise so it opens with only a slight movement of the handle.
Stepped jaws are a good idea. My thought was to just clamp the jaws closed after knowing the fixed jaw was square . Then mill the step in both jaws at the same time by beginning milling at the center line of the two jaws as clamped together. By off setting the passes result is the 0.100" by 0.100" step in each jaw. It is not to do it better nor worse, just my approach to the job is different.
I expected you to measure the jaw first then keep machining until the jaw step measures 0.1 smaller. It's a good way to keep a record of the size instead of guessing the final pass. Thick parallels the same height as your jaws also work really well with the top half inch reduced to 0.2 thick. Then add the step as your jaws. Being thicker at the bottom they have less tendency to fall over while having clearance at the top.
It doesn't make a difference in most instances, but consideration should be made about the radius the endmill leaves in the inside corner of the cut. Could skew the part.
Why I watch Winky's Workshop. Measure, then Measure AGAIN, before assuming the cut is wrong . . . It must be the COFFEE you drink! ;-) And use of Files! As a beginning Jeweler, my Mentor chided me for not using the "Flex Shaft" in our shop... I finally explained to him, My THEORY: A person can spend Almost an hour with a file, to make the Same mistake done with a Flex Shaft, in a millisecond !!!! philip, from the Great Pacific NorthWET, Oregon Division USA
Pacific NorthWET... Ha, I love it. I grew up in WA and can relate. I live in KY now. Too hot in the summer and cold in the winter but I do like the SUN (and the available hardwood).
I did the same on my milling vise some time ago. It works perfectly fine.
Its a big plus I think
@@Rustinox we would like to see information on hard milling. Speeds and feeds are quite critical.
Very nice work mister Winky. Clever idea. Good work
Thanks
Very cool idea. I'd love to do this on my shop vises.
Cool, Thanks
I did the same mod to an old drill vise that I use. It is very useful, particularly holding thin stuff for drilling. The vise is also strong enough for light milling.
I agree... very useful
Thank you for sharing.👍
Thanks for watching
I just did something similar for my shaper vice. Great idea.
Regards, Preso
Thanks Mark, yeah, it worked well. It's not ideal in some situation but overall its a great advantage.
Yes-haw! You keep on doing things that make me say" why haven't I done that, or I need one of those" Excellent bit of work, thanks for the video, cheers!
Haha... Thanks
Well done,Mark.Thank you.
Glad you enjoyed it Thanks
Hi Winky, if you undercut the steps with a dovetail cutter, (to a sharp) you can bite into material and take some aggressive cuts without the work pulling out. Keep innovating!
I thought about that just to eliminate the possibility of a radius in the strep but I didn't want to dull my expensive dovetail cutter. I may do this anyway.
@@WinkysWorkshop I actually use hardened Kurt jaws and formed the angular step in the surface grinder. Be sure to polish the sharp edge or it will chip away. I use it with everything from slippery plastics to 304.
@@rayp.454 I wondered if milling Kurt jaws. Speeds and feeds would be crucial. Can’t rub or I would fail!
Very good thanks. I am planning a two piece vice for my mill and my include hat now!
I think it is a huge plus most the time
Hello Winky, excellent video, thanks for sharing, cheers.😄👍👍👍👍👍
Thanks from me! haha
Great idea winky, I've hit my Jaws before and destroyed a cutter,they are extremely hard..Great video, keep'um coming..
Yeah, the carbide did ok but HSS would have been bad.
Great video, thanks
Later today, I plan on making a video showing your printing press device. I’m afraid I will not be able to do it justice. Just show it off.
In part B I will actually show them the letter that you sent me describing its use.
Sounds great! Looking forward to seeing it. The full name is Harmonic Drive. Good luck, its hard to describe!
That's a good idea, unless you have to do a lot of drilling close to the edge of your parts. That's the only drawback that comes to mind. It's definitely a good idea for secondary jaws.
I made a set of sacrificial jaws for my mill vice out of aluminum for this very reason. I figured I may be get a year or tow out of them. That was five years ago and I'm still using them today 🤣
Yeah... its a fairly small ledge so most often it wont be an issus
They sell aluminum jaws too. I considered these but I figured I would end up leaving these jaws in place for a long time. I wanted them to wear well.
Did you use a solid carbide end mill. Or did you use high speed steel end mill to cut the jaws on the vise. I was under the impression the jaws was real hard and almost impossible to cut with out annealing them first. But it seems you had no problems doing it. I know solid carbide bits get very pricey to buy. And the vise you have do you mind giving the info on where you purchased it. I really like that it opens 5 1\2 inches wide. I barely get 41\2 out of mine.
The jaws are very hard and I did use carbide. I love this vise. The only issue is the screw threads are not protected and swarf gets in them. I spray WD40 on them and it seems to keep them clean. The link to the vise is in the description. Carbide is not that high priced unless you buy name brands and I have found that unknown brands (or no brand) end mills do just as well. I bought a 1/2" 3 flute end mill from Temu for about 12 bucks and they work better that ones i paid $35 for. I bought 4 more.
@@WinkysWorkshop the vice brand you have is a company I have used and they seem very reliable “HHIP”? “Import” presumably but quality approved I think. I bought a new Kurt a couple years ago spending the fundage because I like to buy form the USA and all American stuff when I can. It is a form of support for me. I’m not passing judgement, just my personal preference. I use Shars too.
@@cogentdynamics Yeah, I agree with buying USA but dang the price is crazy high sometimes. I refuse to buy from Shars because they do not sand behind their products. I had two backing plate go bad (bad cast iron and the threads crumbled). One was 3 month old and the other almost a year. 30 day return policy is absolute! Never again.
Thanks Mark
You're welcome!
@@WinkysWorkshop I checked out the link and they have a good selection of 5 c collets. I am missing the 7/16" from my set so I may order one from them. Thanks for the link seems they have a good selection of machine accessories. Did they give you a discount code?
@@terrycannon570 No they did not. They are a good company to work with and in general I think there products are good. Sometimes I get free stuff from vendors but in this case I bought the vice. I recently bought some spiral flute taps from them and 2 out of 4 were terrible. I've had the same problems with taps on Amazon. I buy from McMaster Carr now and they are great (Greenfield) but they don't sell spiral taps.
Nice idea.
Thanks
Thats what i have on my Bridgport. And i love it
Cool
Nice project. The jaws being hard may have caused the end mill to flex. As you said, better to be off on the low side.
Well done.
Dave.
I agree, thanks
I’m considering doing that to my vise. Is that a standard depth and width? What do you think about a little bit of an under cut on the bottoms? Thanks for the video!
A slight undercut is a very good idea. The jaws are hard and I didn't want to dull my dovetail cutter
👍
Thanks
I believe that screw in the movable jaw should be no more that snug. I'd even back it off a tiny bit, to be sure that the half ball inside is free to float. And when I was working in a CNC shop I would back that screw out and lift the the jaw free for a good cleaning with almost every setup. I must admit that I'm not so diligent in my home shop.
I disagree about the ball. In fact you can clamp toward the top of the jaw and measure the jaw life if its not tight. However, in daily usage you have to be able to leave is snug of the jaw is hard to move.
I have been told to do just what you did. My friend made a lot of the parts we installed in RRD. I haven’t done that because I am afraid to mill such hard of steel. I assume you milled with carbide? The risk to me that my 6” Kurt jaws are rather expensive which I prefer not to mess them up. Your step jaws saves a lot of PITA with parallels moving around and getting chips under them while doing repetitive parts. Thanks again Mark, for your insight and super practical solutions.
Yes carbide, I think I paid about 30 or 35 for new jaws, it took some of the worry out of screwing up. Who was the friend that made al the parts for RRD
@ my company Crossfield/press tech and I was the USA manager, technician, salesman and whatever. Most of the mechanical parts we did custom was couplings, web guides, gear boxes, scanner head brackets, compensator rollers and ball screw assemblies. I became Cogent Dynamics where we did many of those projects including insulated cylinder bearing blocks to allow electrostatic ink transfer system. Mostly Rotogravure. Much was done In Spartanburg, Lynchburg and places like Salem Gravure and other Quebecor locations. My friends shop is in the Chicago suburbs called Fern Manufacturing. He began in the mid to late ‘70s. My first machines were hand me downs when he was working at nights in an old barn. He has always helped me (we met in 1970 in H.S.). But I only get the ideas to make me think and try to understand. They are incredibly capable. I was told years back that I need “step jaws” he would not explain how to do them since I was previously informed on how to do lots of operations. I had not considered milling my Kurt Jaws (100 bucks + and I assumed to be ground). I have not seen them commercially available. Only a small step was needed. Your 0.100” step was something I hadn’t considered. Brilliant!
@@cogentdynamics I think you told me about Crossfield before. We had your register system on a couple of presses. I'm in KY
Are the jaws hardened?
Yes, which is probably why I had some trouble getting the exact size.
Maybe relieve the iside corner of the step?
Excellent idea, I didn't want to dull my dovetail cutter
The vise here came with stepped jaws...... Nise project anyway.
Some do here also. Thanks
I would have made 2 loose parallels with a step on. Same principle but you woukd still have virgin vice jaws. Still machine the step on them to a known distance from the back face. Beware that YOUR step corners may have a radius from the cutter, really need a slight undercut to ensure the work sits properly on the flat or chamfer the work. Regards from Australia.
Machining steps in thick parallels is a good method although the tendency to move around along with the possibility of swarf getting under or behind them is a huge negative. I thought about the radius, it was a fairly new end mill and looks like a very small radius. I thought about using a dovetail cutter to cut a relief. I just didn't want to dull my expensive cutter of the hardened jaws.
@@WinkysWorkshop Just a thought. If you have a Dremel tool with those tiny cut off wheels, hold it at 45 degrees and carefully undercut the corner by 15 thou or so. Regards.
@@daveticehurst4191 Good idea, might attach it to the side of my spindle and use the x axis.
@@WinkysWorkshoptry using springs between the parallels, it keeps them snug against the jaws and base. They also take out the backlash in the vise so it opens with only a slight movement of the handle.
@@marley589 Yes this works well but the spring sometimes gets in the way. while drilling.
Thin parallels work for me. If I was going to do my vice jaws I'd do them on the grinder
I think a grinder would be hard to get the inside corner sharp. I have parallels but for any kind of mass production they move around.
@ I have a surface grinder that's old but works good and square corners aren't an issue. Don't do much production work here lol That's why I retired🤪
@@jimbennett1519 I'm retired too. I need to slow down.
@@WinkysWorkshop we only do this stuff we want to. Stay off the couch, like I am now ATM 😝
Stepped jaws are a good idea. My thought was to just clamp the jaws closed after knowing the fixed jaw was square . Then mill the step in both jaws at the same time by beginning milling at the center line of the two jaws as clamped together. By off setting the passes result is the 0.100" by 0.100" step in each jaw. It is not to do it better nor worse, just my approach to the job is different.
Cutting slots with an end mill it not very accurate. The swarf in the cut moved the end mill around.
I expected you to measure the jaw first then keep machining until the jaw step measures 0.1 smaller. It's a good way to keep a record of the size instead of guessing the final pass. Thick parallels the same height as your jaws also work really well with the top half inch reduced to 0.2 thick. Then add the step as your jaws. Being thicker at the bottom they have less tendency to fall over while having clearance at the top.
I wasn't really guessing but you're right, measuring the thickness would have been better that using an edge finder.
It doesn't make a difference in most instances, but consideration should be made about the radius the endmill leaves in the inside corner of the cut. Could skew the part.
Very true, I thought about using my dovetail cutter but i didn't want to dull it on the hardened jaws.
EFECTIVAMENTE ESA PEQUEÑA DIFERENCIA PUEDE SER¿¿¿¿¿¿¿ POR QUE LAS PORDAZAS UNA ES FIJA Y LA OTRA NO ??????????????????
Maybe so
Why I watch Winky's Workshop.
Measure, then Measure AGAIN, before assuming the cut is wrong . . . It must be the COFFEE you drink! ;-)
And use of Files!
As a beginning Jeweler, my Mentor chided me for not using the "Flex Shaft" in our shop...
I finally explained to him, My THEORY: A person can spend Almost an hour with a file, to make the Same mistake done with a Flex Shaft, in a millisecond !!!!
philip, from the Great Pacific NorthWET, Oregon Division USA
Pacific NorthWET... Ha, I love it. I grew up in WA and can relate. I live in KY now. Too hot in the summer and cold in the winter but I do like the SUN (and the available hardwood).