I understand that battle in GoT was shot badly for MOST people, but for us early HDR very expensive high NITs quality display people, it was perfectly fine. They did bugger up tho.
I love how good the setup was for Aegon to make the stupid decision. Alicent keeps blaming him for everything whilst being his mother and failing to prepare him is also extremely poetic. Such a good start of the war.
I can only imagine the realisation: "we started the equivalent of a nuclear war for the sake of getting you on the throne and now we want you to do absolutely nothing and be our puppet for the rest of your life"
@@Constantinch no, that's bad writing. Just like Alicent trying to decapitate Rhaenyra for protecting her bastard child that mutilated her son in episode 7 and then spending this entire season more concerned for Rhaenyra's family than her own.
They managed to make Aegon a very tragic character, a victim of his own family in all regards. A negletful father, a hateful mother that does nothing but belittle him, a brother who tries to end him. Lots of stuff show to set up the tragedy
They did a sterling job on Aegon (and Aemonds) character felt sorry for him at times but can’t get past the fighting pits with his own illegitimate children and F Aemond using her own daughters dragon to kill meyles nah won’t be sad to see his demise
Daemon saw himself with an eye patch reminded me of Luke Skywalker in TESB. When he walks into the Cave of Dagobah, he saw Vader’s helmet in his hallucination. Then he smashed it, revealing his own face.
I felt so bad for sunfyre. Perhaps the only living thing that loved/cared for Aegon and Aegon returning the same kindness to Sunfyre. Seeing the poor dragon get mauled and scream in pain only for it to yet again get blasted by Aemond was saddening.
Loved the details showing their bond; Sunfyre using his wing to shield Aegon from Vhagar's flames. Then finding him curled up around Aegon on the ground.
@@cosmictreason2242 I’m not 100% sure and don’t recall that details in the book. I’m guessing it had something to do with the neck bite and Meleys trying to breathe/shoot fire at the same time only to be blocked by Vhaegar. When Vhaegar fell, she was aware she was falling therefore landed on two feet
I can’t believe they got me to actually feel as sad as when a dog dies in a movie/tv show. Sunfyre was a good boy and it really bummed me out watching that scene knowing how much he truly cared for aegon.
I thought the symbolism of the figurine that Alicent broke in this episode was it being the same piece she gave Viserys in season 1 when she was younger. It symbolized that she tried doing all of this *for him* and ended up messing it up instead.
I loved how this show portrayed how the veteran dragons and dragon riders fight in aerial combat. Agon (and Sunfyre) shooting flame at Meleys and Rhaenys, thus obscuring their own vision. Meanwhile, Meleys takes advantage of this by maneuvering while her opponent is blinded, and gets in position to blindside. Twice Meleys attacks Sunfyre. First while Sunfyre was trying to find her after getting out of his own fireball, and second while the panicked young dragon was trying to gain altitude while in agony. When Vhagar and Meleys charge each other, we see the veteran Vhagar snatch Meleys before deploying flame. And later, when Vhagar blindsides Meleys using the castle. Even if the castle wasn't there, the cliff still would have provided enough cover. The dragons fly fast enough that the closing speed would ensure that, if one could close the distance to a point where the other has no time to react.
eh, i saw barely any difference between aegon and rhaenys idfk what you guys are talking about. it just seems like fanboying has taken hold of most people, I was actually looking forward to rhaenys pulling off some tactical moves instead of just saying "Meleys Attack" "Attack Meleys" wow, such skill, impressive
A marvellous showing for Aemond. No notes. As for Aegon, I found myself pitying Aegon. Absolutely nothing was ever expected of him from anyone. Completely lost and neglected, it's no wonder he became pathetic. At least in F&B he had a loving mother. Don't even get me started on Sunfyre. Our first real showing of the two them together and... damn. Lastly. Didn't hate her, per se, but I'm glad I won't be seeing Rhaenys anymore. Perpetually smug and bitter isn't endearing to me. And this is coming from someone who loved the Queen of Thorns right until the end.
The "Queen of Thornes" had a charm to her dialogue and interactions and they all made sense in the context of the story and of her house, she was a great character while Rhaenys never did.
Seeing Sunfyre get mauled and designed with having 0 battle experience was sad. Hearing its screams of pain as well. The only thing that probably truly loved Aegon 😔
Watching the group geek out with excitement over a good show is SO much better than watching them have to sh!t on the normal crap. Wish there were more opportunities for this kind of review.
There was a Kingmaker in the 15th century in England. It was Richard Neville, 16th Earl of Warwick, killed at the Battle of Barnet in 1471, during the Wars of the Roses.
Yes one my favorite story with king Edward and queen Elizabeth woodville the is actually a tv show about call the white queen and it has a lot of game of thrones actors in it
The War of the Roses IS the plot of A Game of Thrones (specifically The War of the 5 Kings). The Yorks are the Starks, the Lancasters are the Lannisters. Robb is the young king Edward, who never lost a battle, Talisa/Jeyne is the White Queen Elizabeth Woodville, Cersei is Margaret of Anjou, Eddard is Richard of York, and so on…
@mermaidreviews4693 Yes, I saw the white queen with Rebecca Ferguson (Dune, and MI franchise). I also saw the white princess with Jodie Comer. I studied the Wars of the Roses and had to do an assignment on Warwick. Fascinating period.
@@patriciafenwick5846 I find the writing on these shows to be sharper than on some of the GoT shows personally. If someone really wanted to have their own GoT, they could basically do a multi seasons series about the War of the Roses and insert a few supernatural elements in it.
Idk if they speak about this later in the video, but I think only kings and heirs know about it. The dagger is just a symbol of power and the king has it...
I believe it is on the dagger itself however heat must be applied from my understanding. We see him holding the dagger when Cole arrives but it is not glowing. Was it heated by the dragons breathe possibly. Did Aemond find it while it was still glowing possibly. My real question would be what is the importance of knowing it? For traditions sake yes the king/queen has always told their heir but that didn't stop Aegon II.
Damn I wanted to hate rheneys and aegon but I never could. And sunfyre painful screeches and meleys looking at rheneys before dying always breaks my heart.
That ruined me lol. The first time Meleys looks back at her to make sure she’s fine. The last seconds of her life looking at Rheneys got me in the feels
I still remember all those people dying. The reason I hated her was more on a meta level: Daemon does horrible shit and everyone (rightfully) thinks he is a monster that would order the murder of a child (which he likely did). Aemon does horrible shit and his own mom admits she thinks he is unhinged psycho. Rhaenys does horrible shit and no one ever mentions it in while she gets to be the voice of reason cautioning everyone. The dragon dying was really sad but I actually glad that Rhaenys is out of the story now. Edit: Gone back paddle a bit now that emotions aren’t running as high anymore. That scene was definitely emotional effect and the actress did a great job with what she was given. I didn’t hate her (hate is a very strong emotion) I found her more annoying since the writers wanted to have their cake and eat it two. They did that silly scene in episode 9 cause they thought it would look really cool and then pretended it didn’t really happen (“Yeah, but GoT civilians don’t count.”). Either go with the scene and have her be a darker character (which could have been very interesting) or cut out the part where she kills dozens if not hundreds of people (like you pretend she didn’t).
The scene where Vaegar enters the battlefield and the music stops. People stop screaming. Everyone just looks up. The Erie quiet before the intense chaos.
If you pretend the dumb dragon scene of episode 9 didn't happen, Rhaenys' arc becomes so much better. She would actually have been believable as a voice for peace, she wouldn't have been responsible for the war happening in the first place, and her death would have been tragic as the most peace-minded character being the first to fall in battle (although her dreams about a peaceful solution still were completely irrational and naive, of course). It really feels like that's how the showrunners want us to look at it. They realize how bad that scene was and are now trying to pretend it never happened. Unfortunately, that's not how it works.
I think it's possible, however, to look at her insistence on loitering around the battle scene as her trying to "make up" for her gargantuan screwup in season one by not killing Aegon when she had the chance, and also trying to make up for all the lost time (and initiative) the Blacks have had sitting on their hands waiting for Rhaenyra to realise that, yes, you are _at war already_ ; ironically by doing so she left herself vulnerable to Aemond Granted, that could have been emphasised a little better, but in any case what's done is done and I'm kinda relieved that we're done with the character so I won't have to worry about the writers trying to puff them up as some sort of noble heroine anymore 😄
That dumb scene would make so much more sense if they pointed out all the gates of the dragon pit were closed and the only way for her to escape was to go through the roof
that scene wasn't even in the books, in the book aegon flies around on sunfyre during his coronation. If they were smart they could have just had rhaenys escape kingslanding on her dragon without killing people and have a short standoff with aegon and sunfyre which would help build rooks rest up even more
@@SaeedUrRehman1 That still wouldn't have fixed it, as no one knew she was there and she could easily just have waited until the coronation was over before escaping.
Melyss being roughly double or a bit over double the size of sunfire and then vhagar being 2-3x the size of melyss was depicted so well and it was absolutely chilling
Meleys is described in the book as the fastest dragon alive at the time. So this had nothing to do with fear of getting outran by Vahgar. I feel this was Rhaenys being a dragon. Even before this conflict, Rhaenys is always described as fierce and fearless. She knew it would likely be her end but she also knew that there was a chance she could win and she took it.
I saw it as her understanding that this is her best chance to maime Vheagar and impact the Greens ability to defend against multiple dragons in the future.
Fastest doesn't mean highest stamina. There is room to say she could out distance especially after battle with gunfire. I do agree that is not the most likely vibe though
It feels really good to watch and talk about great television again... I can hear it the panels voices... It's actual excitement compared to dread of talking about the wokeacolyte...
This dragon battle was epic. I love GG Martin work. I really hope he had finished the books before GOT catch up. I hope G.G Martin fhinish the story. Its a great story to leave it unfinished.
I really think they could’ve addressed Rhaenys’ actions in episode 9 in this episode and given her a bit of a redemption arc. When Rhaenys is doing one of her lectures, just have a character say something to her like: “Princess, you have killed more small folk than anyone in this conflict thus far, maybe instead of flying high in your dragon, you for once think of the people on the ground beneath you”. That would’ve contextualised the scene where she is looking down at the destruction below her at rooks rest, and decides to turn around and fight again. It would’ve been her acknowledging that she was wrong and wants to try and put things right.
@@SirCunningham-m5ythe problem is though that the writers don't realize that she did anything wrong that episode. All she did was girl boss into the sun to make her escape. So they don't realize there's even a mistake to redeem
Maybe the exits were closed except for the front top entrance. Even mentioning that would help make sense of the scene or showing rhaenys trying to escape but couldn't so she eventually had to do a vertical kool-aid man. She'd seen lord Caswell hanged for trying to escape(although she didnt know the exact reason shed still know her life is in danger), so it would be her neck if she didn't somehow get out.
48:07 Exactly! Even in the previous episode when she singled out Aemond, "Aemond...you know what he is.." to Rhaenyra. It's like, Your SON, the one you raised. If he's a "monster," you made him one, Alicent. It's weird in-world & in the audience ppl dont seem to always acknowledge Alicent's "mothering".
FWIW I think there is a consistent complaint that the greens are completely misrepresented in this series, for better and for worse. They're a much more bonded family in the books.
The reason I am not Team Black is Rhaenyra is a terrible decision maker , her life has shown this. Sending Rhaenys by herself was such a poor move. She doesn’t strike me as someone who would rule well. She should have never abandoned Kingslanding if she was serious and she should have connected with the people.
Bc Alicent finally said the quiet part out loud, he doesn't know shit about anything, and doesn't want to listen to anyone who DOES know and is way smarter than he is. Like his little brother is known to have grown up obsessed with studying history, philosophy, and battle and larys strong even telling him harrenhall is worse than worthless but he's like NO ITS A BIG CASTLE AND I SAY WE NEED IT
@@jlogan2228But that is Alicent and the councils fault; they put him on the throne against his will and convinced him it was something he should desire. So now that he desires it for the reasons they put in his head they then pull back and want him to shut up.
Are we sure he was trying to kill him? Or was he just happy to see him as collateral? He was sheaving his sword when Cole found him. I don't think he was about to finish him off.
@@sivad1025 remind me again what Rhaenyra ever did? She literally ate cakes and did nothing, lmao. Meanwhile, Aegon and Sunfyre were the MVPs of the dance. 👋
Seems like the first thing to do fighting Vhagar is to tear out the membranes on her wings. Seems like losing even one membrane between two "fingers" would noticeably impact her ability to maintain altitude, her speed and make her even less maneuverable. When she's debuffed, it will be even easier to get in there and claw the belly. But why not the rider? Rhaenys didn't care if she got Vhagar, as long as she got Aemon.
We definitely need an Aegon the Conqueror/Aenys Targaryen/Maegor the Cruel show that could go like 5-6 seasons (Think how HotD did it with the time jumps) and have it end with Jaeherys taking the throne and having his reign of peace leading straight into the events of House of the Dragon. HBO should build the brand back up and eventually once they have a few successful shows in the bag like hopefully HotD, Aegon's Conquest, Hedge Knight, Robert's Rebellion etc. they remake Game of Thrones and by that point fingers crossed GRRM has the books finished.
eh sorry but I've seen what happens when people have martin's bullet points and try to make something or when they have a vague outline and try to do to much to expand on it. We end up with GOT season 7 and 8 or dumb ideas like rhaenyra sneaking into kingslanding. The only other adaptations I want of this world are the dunk and egg show they're already doing and in maybe 30 years when the books are hopefully done and enough time has passed (really delusional in my optimism here) a full animated remake of ASOIAF
@@idawg7332 I'm not gonna say HotD is perfect. GoT seasons 1-3 still outshine it and there's definitely some girlbossing/adherence to the message here but at least the acting, production value, dialogue, music, special FX etc. Are top notch. It's an actual show with flaws instead of just agenda driven crap like The Acolyte. Yes a fully animated GoT would be amazing and would probably be the best route to go.
@@LivingGhost1 I mostly enjoy HOTD too despite some of the issues you mentioned but keep in mind, with HOTD they atleast have a complete written out story to go off of. Now they could adapt aegon and his sons same way. But from what I've heard after dunk and egg the next show is that 10000 ships series which has no real source material besides what...a page in world of ice and fire and a few lines in the books? That sounds like a disaster to me. Also I could easily see an aegon show turning into a story about how aegon was a useless idiot and visenya and rhaenys did all the work
When Rhaenys strapped in, I knew it was over. I heard Neegan's voice in my head talking about the size of the lady nuts on her. It's one thing to fight and risk dying. It's another to know you're going to die and do it anyway.
Rhaenryra's council not even bringing up the possibility of Vagar or other dragons showing up is really dumb. The way it was played you could tell Rhaenys knew that dying was a real probability, so it would take one line from her being like "I will do my part" to move on from the topic.
This episode cemented to me just how dumb Rhaenys was. The battle at the moment of Aegon's fall was a net positive for her and the Blacks: she burned like half of the army, the king was almost certainly dead (killed by his brother no less!), and she had a clean getaway. Instead of that, she decides to stay and take on the biggest dragon alive, and in turn the Blacks lose arguably their most powerful dragon and dragonrider... the sheer fucking hubris.
my head cannon is that after Rhaenys didn't kill the greens when she escaped, she has a burden of guilt for not ending the war right then and there, and to me it felt like she was looking for Aegon and less looking to fight vhagar
@@michaeljones9221 That sounds very good, yes, but I doubt the show will take that route, seeing how the writers barely brought up her decision in episode 9 (and even then, Rhaenys "dunked on" Daemon when he brought up the subject). But yes, I would like that to be the case as well.
on top of that she flew low to the ground toward a large blindspot. As soon as they showed the castle in front of her, I was just like "oh she's dead, he's hiding behind the castle." and sure enough...
What i find annoying is that they watched the episode, and have the scene right there, playing, and still don't notice that Aemond is ALREADY sheathing his sword before Cole calls for him. ???
True, unbelievable. They even manage to laugh at the idea, being convinced he was there to kill him. The boys were not in form for this review, far from it
@nintendsoad agreed, all of the *descendents* of non-dragon riders should have to pay for the dragons they never oppressed. *corrected thanks to cosmicreason2242
Whoever thought of making Sunfire act like a damn golden retriever during the suit up is both a genius and and major asshole for making me love Sunfire so much five minutes before it's brutally mauled by Malese
That moment that Maelys was looking back at Rheanys while her neck was being crushed was such a great touch. A final goodbye look, knowing she was a goner.
Two take-aways. Otto is NOWHERE to be seen(great move;the feeling of freefall without him is is visceral) and castles are actually used as castles. And oh yeah,Cristan is every bit the Lancelot in this plot,epic fall from grace and innocense.
I think another tactical consideration for Rooks Rest from the Blacks’ POV is that it is perceived to be an easy victory for the Greens. So presumably they would have no need for a dragon because they wouldn’t need one to win
Jaehaerys wasn't in line for the thrown either. He was the 3rd son of Aenys. Aegon the Uncrowned would have received the prophecy from Aenys who was told directly from Aegon the Conqueror. But Aegon the Uncrowned and Viserys were both killed by Maegor. Jaehaerys was a young boy when he, his sister and mother fled from Kingslanding. Making it very hard to believe he would have received the prophecy from either of his older brothers!
Ya but Jaehaerys was essentially a genius, super well read. Super into his family legacy. Mega Targaryen supremacist. There’s a million different ways he could have gotten hold of the prophecy. Plus Aegon the uncrowneds wife survives into Jarhaerys reign, she could have known the prophecy. There’s a million ways to answer that question.
That being said tho, the prophecy would most likely die with Maegor cuz he just exploded and destroyed everything lmfao it’s a tragedy we don’t get Maegor on screen
@@Rounderyathecruel The first 4 seasons of Game of Thrones. The intro song is the same, they keep alluding to 'the song of ice and fire'. it's trying so hard to grab onto the same audience, but delivers such a worse product.
I would like to point out the threat of dragons was pointed out in the council meeting before Rhaenys volunteered to go. Jace says "he will burn Cole's line and return before Kings landing has time to raise the alarm." I took that as them assuming all of the dragons were still in Kings Landing.
The problem with living in New Zealand is that I see this stream dropping while I'm at work, and still have to go home and watch HotD before I can listen to this! Good television and better critics make Mondays a whole lot better than they used to be at least.
To make the dragons fight midair the way birds of prey are doing it, mainly with their claws locking into each other, shows a great understanding of animal behavior. There was clearly not only the idea of creating a bombastic scene but to be as realistic as possible. My only complain is that Vhagar winning with an ambush attack again is a bit of too staged and too convenient. If anything it should have been the other way around and Meleys should have used her superior speed and agility for quick ambushes while Vhagar has to completely rely on her size to overpower her opponent. She's not that quick and is spotted easily plus when she hides behind the castles wall/cliffs she basically can't see Meleys just like Meleys can't see her so Vhagar finding the perfect moment to blindly ambush and having success with that is just too convenient.
its funny you can say they wanted to be realistic as possible, and follow with the complaint that absolutely destroyed the scene. Its a shame that the character of Rhaenys that the show-writers have written is one that I can believe would honestly be dumb enough to re-engage after essentially winning the war. But they wanted to make Aemond a regicide for drama, and she needed her girl-boss moment. In the books she never had the opportunity to flee, so it wasnt an issue. She fought hard in a 2v1 and in the fighting Sunfyre lost a wing and Aegon got burned.
Vhagar raised a lot of dust and smoke when she landed. She used it as cover to crawl away and prepare an ambush, while Meylys was recovering from their tussle. Still a bit impractical, based on Vhagar's sheer size.
@@tmanqz I kinda have to disagree. Rhaenys was fighting alone against an enemy much larger and more powerful than herself. She was likely trying to press the advantage, while she assumed Vhagar was down, because she's not sure if she can repeat the damr trick with Vhagar and come out on top. She was likely trying to catch Vhagar before she went into the air. Because Vhagar's size gives her a huge reach and weight advantage, but if she could catch her on her belly, or land on her back. Unfortunately, Vhagar moves surprisingly quickly when she needs to.
I will pity the dragons the most from the episode and the show. Such loyal, magnificent creatures with soft hearts, fighting a pointless war over a seat. Every scene in which they got harmed or killed hit hard in this episode because I love dragons in general. Alicent is such a pathetic mother it's hard to describe and that led to her son's doom. Perfect writing.
I love how they depict Eamond and Vahgar, his cunning snd her experience combined make them a terrifying duo. They fight in ways you don’t expect them too.
Only when he is not autistically screeching at every medieval inaccuracy, so I'd say it's pretty much 50/50... (haven't watched this stream yet, so I could be wrong this time...)
While i'm a shadiversity subscriber, his particular brand of autism is offputting in this setting, idgaf about the crenellations tbh or ya sword, if I did id be over on your channel trying to hear about em. I'm saying this as a sword-collecting autist myself. You can tell everyone on the panel is just kinda like "Ugh, yeah okay shad" when he brings up the crenellations. Save that shit for the people who care, you got your own channel and brand for a reason.
What a fantastic episode, it's so refreshing to actually watch something that's good and enjoyable. The characters are so interesting and multifaceted rather than incompetent like The Acolyte. The pair are such polar opposites and it's so fascinating to see the discourse between both these shows. Can't wait for next week's episode!
I think one thing that I thought was interesting was when Meleys was fighting sunfyre for a bit they showed sunfire bite off a horn instead of going for the neck or something or the belly. It shows how inexperienced sunfyre and aegon is and how they had no chance.
The show was awesome, but the jump scare kill shot will get old if they keep doing it. Think logically, that dragon is as big if not bigger than a 747 basically, htf do you lose sight of it? It’s being forced, if you understand bfm / acm tactics this would make sense and be perfectly logical.
I think with Rhaenys also deciding to come back and basically fight to the death is because she found out about Corlys’ bastards or at least one of them. In the earlier scene you can see that thought she “accepts” it and understands the reasoning, it still hurts her and damages her pride. further more she feels like this is yet another thing she lost. Her husband was probably the last thing that was keeping her going. And with him having bastards in a way she lost him as well. The combination of what the guys said of her feeling tired and Corlys bastard just put her in a mindset of this is it for me, I’m out.
What I hate about this episode of HotD is the "cut to black" scenes. It's like you're watching this awesome battle sequence then the black screen. I said "is that it?" while looking at the time "it's too short." I was relieved there's more when it cuts to the next scene. And then... it happened again!!! But all in all, great episode. Cole hyping the army when Aegon flies in & Vhagar's entrance into the battle are awesoooomeee.
Rheaneras mistake was thinking she was going to be the first to be willing to unleash the dragons. She should never have allowed one dragon to go alone knowing vhagar is a possible enemy to encounter.
Shad is wrong @2:17:02 Vaghar is not the fastest. She is the oldest and the largest, born in 52 BC (Before Aegon's Conquest), and with much more fighting experience than any of the other Dragons of this age. Melys is much younger (born 129 AC) and is described as faster than both Caraxes and Vhagar, and fearsome. In the books, Rhaenys turns to meet the attack by both Dragons (Sunfyre and Vaghar), knowing she doesn't have a chance against them. But they have changed things here, the dynamic of that fight, and book Rhaenys is not the insufferable preacher, with a chip on her shoulder as in the show. I love book Rhaenys a lot, but I could give a fig about show Rhaenys. Good riddance! And before someone comes up with "but unreliable sources" mantra about the book. Well, I don't see why and how can the writers of the show be considered more reliable. lol After all, they are just an additional version, nothing more. Which is why stories based on "unreliable narrator" are not the best, for me. But I suppose that's not a problem for the show because the majority of the viewers haven't read the book. And even among the readers, I'm guessing many might agree with the changes, since F&B is not a proper narrative book like ASOIAF, where important changes are not welcomed by the book readers. Re-Aegon and the prophecy. That's 100% an afterthought. It has been something that some fans had come up with long time ago, and George kinda liked it. And for a good reason, because Aegon's "inactivity" for so many years, before turning west, always felt bizzarre and lacking. At that time, Geroge didn't have everything figured out. He is a "gardener" remember? And sometimes, the gardener, needs a bit of "help". 😉But I remember Elio and Linda talking about it, way before the show was in the horizon, and completely negating that it was a thing as far as canon and George was concerned. Ultimately, It fits the story, so it doesn't bother me that much. But let's not kid ourself, and call it what it is, an afterthought. What bothers me is that they used it in the show. It should've stayed out, because it has nothing to do with the Dance of the Dragons. The only reason they used it is because they still want to keep a link (like a continuity) between GOT and HoD, given the debacle with GOT, and TPTWP is that link. But more importantly, they wanted to give both to Rhaenyra and Alicent a "good" excuse, because "only men scheme", and only "men want and cause wars". 😏 Therefore, the prophecy it is used for Rhaenyra as a "calling". It's basically what motivates her. She isn't doing this because she wants that throne and because it is her goddamn birthright (which it is by the way.) There isn't a trace of book Rhaenyra, who after she lost the baby, and this was before Lucery's death, blames the greens for that and says; "They stole my crown and murdered my daughter and they shall answer for it." There is no Rhaenyra in the show, who is "quick to anger and never forgot a slight", and says to Aegon's messenger: "Tell my half-brother I will have my throne or his head." Nope! We can't have that! Instead, we have a "reasonable" and "responsible" Rhaenyra, who despite everything, exercises restrain and is trying to mediate until the very last. She is doing this for the "greater good", and all that jazz, because of the Prophecyyyy! A prophecy by the way, which turns out to be a joke in GOT, but I digress. lol So, no, she can't abdicate, Shad. No matter how much you try to find a "hidden" moral lesson on "selfishness". That's not the intention here, because there is no chance in hell that the viewers would not understand her motivations and sympathise with her. It will always be: Yes, she did this or that, BUT....The writers know this. It is done on purpose, not by accident. On the other hand, TPTWP it was also used for Alicent, but as a "misunderstanding" tool. And that was even worse.🙄🙄🙄 IMO, TPTWP prophecy in the HoD is the weakest and the lamest things, so far. It is so cringe that every time I hear it I wince. It comes off as fake. It is true what Garry says, it is not over yet, and we'll have to wait and see how it plays out. However, GOT should've taught us something. So, I would call them out, when it's due.
Exactly, also, how does the TPWWP prophecy told by Viserys confirm that Rhaenyra should be the ideal heir ? Why not Aegon, the person succeeding should not matter as long as it is a Targaryen right ? Why did Rhaenyra think that she is now a rightful heir.
I’m guessing because Viserys told her about it and not Aegon because he named and saw her as the rightful heir for the story to be passed down to. If he had wanted Aegon he would have told him and Rhaynera knows this whether it makes her the ideal heir I don’t know but I’d definitely chose her over Aegon to. Also I don’t like the use of TPTWP because it turned out to mean nothing in GoT but again that makes for what’s happening here because of it all the more sad
@@Ps_10_10 Why? He is a dragon rider he is more useful than 99,99999% of population. They already ignore him there is literally no point in killing him.
The scene where Alicent is visited by the grand meister shows just how good this production is. Everything was so subtle. The camera pans down to her touching her belly. She drinks...as the camera pans away. '...Sir Criston Cole...'
Alright let's analyse this in detail. To all those who keep saying "why doesn't Rhaenys just fly away?", please think of her options considering the fact that Vhagar is completely unscathed and hasn't just flown from Dragonstone to Rook's rest and so is also completely fresh when she joins the fight: 1: fly to dragonstone. Congrats, now you're leading Aemond and Vhagar towards your queen, granddaughter, husband and Rhaenyra's heir, all nicely congregated inside the dragonstone keep. Aemond and Cole planned this ambush knowing the black's thinking would be "Aemond/Vhagar won't leave King's landing", which would lure out a dragon for them to kill. It's a one-shot opportunity that they're not about to waste, so Aemond 100% is following Meylys to take her out. If Rhaenys turns back, she forces the fight with Vhagar to happen over dragonstone, because if she doesn't hold there Aemond is just going to incinerate the castle and everyone in it as well as the presumably present and riderless Vermax, Syrax and Moondancer. And if she fights him there it'll almost certainly be the same outcome as at Rook's rest with the other three riders only having a few minutes warning. That's not enough time to reach their dragons and get them into the sky. Even if they do, unless the four of them can coordinate perfectly, one decently aimed dracarys from Vhagar and Jace/Vermax and Baela/Moondancer are literally toast. If the stars align perfectly Rhaenys would probaly be fighting alongside Rhaenyra and Syrax for their lives, which is still incredibly dangerous for both of them. More likely Rhaenyra would lift off just as Rhaenys is being killed, at which point a slightly wounded Vhagar probably kills her and Syrax too, ending the war right there. Now maaaaybe you can make the argument that since Meylys is being described as the fastest dragon in the book that she'd have a slight head start between reaching dragonstone and Aemond catching up, and so could raise the alarm in time. But with how short the flight is to dragonstone, and the speeds displayed here on screen I'm skeptical whether that's show cannon, and if it is, how much leadtime it would be. In any case, flying to dragonstone risks her granddaughter and her betrothed (we all know Baela would not have hesitated a moment to help her, and Jace is equally eager to prove himself) and I really don't blame Rhaenys for not willing to risk watching those two die in front of her. The only way this doesn't hold up is if you really believe that under no circumstances would Aemond pursue, and I just don't buy that. He's not afraid of anyone besides Daemon who he knows is at Harrenhal, is not afraid of kinslying, is supremely self-confident, and wants the glory of winning a major battle if not the war. I'm sorry, he isn't letting Rhaenys get away once she shows up. No way in hell. 2: fly west towards Harrenhal. Caraxes/Daemon and Meylys/Rhanys is probably the one combo that Aemond wouldn't be confident facing on his own, so he'd probaly not pursue. However you might as well put up a big sign with an arrow pointing east saying "go ahead, have fun", since that's just giving Aemond clearance to fly to dragonstone and kill everyone there at his leizure, probably piecemeal, before Daemon can even be reched to call upon for help. And if you think that Syrx, Vermax and Moondancer can take Vhagar on their own (take some bites/score some hits sure, but actually kill her? yeah no), then I have a bridge in brooklyn to sell you. That's no real option either. 3: do as she did. Stand and fight were you are to defend the castle you came to defend, and do at least enough damage to Vhagar so that Aemond won't risk flying across the bay afterwards, and maybe, if you get lucky, try and take the greens trump card out in one fell swoop. If Vhagar goes down, so do the greens, it's that simple. It doesn't quite work, but she does do sizeable damage and forces him to the ground, before Aemond makes use of the smoke and the castle to burst out from below (ironically, the same tactic Rhaenys used against Aegon earlier on), taking her out. Still, that earlier skydance and fall didn't look pleasant for Vhagar, and since I suspect Aemond will be needed in King's landing now that Aegon is, uh... let's be friendly and say "no longer in a fit state to rule" to take care of that political mess, Rhaenys was ultimately succesful, even if it did cost her her life.
You guys didn't bring up Agon picking up the dagger at the end. Isn't that the dagger with the prophecy on it? You brought the dagger up earlier in the stream regarding Allicent researching, but not at the end. So, is that the dagger? He show has been focusing on that dagger, and at the end of this episode making a point of showing Agon picking it up. If it is the dagger with the prophecy, what would be the significance of Agon picking it up?
Aemond picked it up. Aegon is the king that fell with sunfyre. Yes, that is the dagger with the prophecy. Since Aemond knows how to speak and read, he might have read the prophecy
@@wc8289 Yeah, I get peoples names mixed up all the time in this show. I actually have a family tree with the actors pictures that I reference sometimes.
It’s insane that the acolyte and HOTD have similar budgets. And I love the 1 hour-ish episodes vs 27 minutes. Where is all the budget going in the acolyte?
@@sparkycjsLove Gary but it’s also pretty dumb too when he just has to blatantly say what things mean like during the dragon fight lol, everyone else was like “yeah that’s cool subtle meaning” then Gary’s like “it’s a DANCE of dragons!”
Fuckin gross tbh, he does it too much for Gary to not be like "Bro stop that shit, people don't like it and leave comments on every stream you do it in" Makes Australians look like a bunch of fkn children. I'm a sub of his but his particular brand of autism is offputting in this setting too, idgaf about the crenellations tbh or ya sword, if I did id be over on your channel trying to hear about em. I'm saying this as a sword collecting autist myself. You can tell everyone on the panel is just kinda like "Ugh, yeah okay shad" when he brings up the crenellations. Save that shit for the people who care, you got your own channel and brand for a reason.
I thought Rhaenyra was going to go to battle with the rationale that if she wins, she rallies more bannermen to her cause, and if she dies, the war is over before too many people have died. I see that as within her character, given how determined she is to avoid war. I thought that's what they were leading into, and if she AND Aegon died at the same battle, what a shitshow that would have made everything.
Epic dragon turn around. She killed the kings dragon survived amons and was fleeing with victory in tow.. and the red dragon looked at her❤ lol we don't flee B
Shad forgets that with most reptiles, the gals are bigger than the guys. In fact, that pertains to insects, some birds, and many other animals. It's mostly just mammals where the boys are bigger. And dominant males having harems, so maybe that's the value in having size.
How can the biggest dragon be so elusive though? it's the 2nd person that "i can't see it! where is it?!" - "Watch out watch out watch out! RKO out of nowhere!!!". It's the size of a sky-scrapper, how can you not see it?!
I had the same but opposite reaction. Why the Fuck would you fly that closely to the only thing large enough (the castle) to hide the giant dragon!?! I thought Rhaeneys was a little experienced. Keeping it at a distance & using the smaller dragon’s speed & maneuverability to yeet Aemond out of his saddle was the move.
Combat experience my friend. And flying into the sun, into and out of the clouds, the same way entire bomber squadrons evaded fighters in WWII. Or stashing entire tank divisions in small stretches of forest, etc. Being big doesn't mean you're easily visible at all times. And sure she takes a bit longer to turn than Meleys or Sunfyre, but Vhagar is a bad old bitch
Notice how Alicent was looking for Kiny Visary’s books Aegon: “I had them removed!” Alicent: ‘even with all their knowledge!?!’ Aegon: “I said I had them removed, I didn’t burn them!!” She’s looking to see anything on the song of ice and fire rhaeynera mentioned last episode She probably won’t find anything though as the last season stated that story is only told vocally from the current ruler to the heir
That was good but if Rheynes was such a battle hardened dragon rider she would have immediatly known Vhagar being so huge could only hide one place and atleast flown up higher yet she flew right over it like a total noob! And i get Vhagar has to win because of the book but even watching it we said 'hes behind the castle' right away because he physicaly could not hide behind anything else. Also Vhagar should have never been able to leave Kings Landing unnoticed, they had riders patroling to watch for that very reason! So there are some major problems here but it was still a really good episode. Glad too finally have the action we wanted and it was worth the wait!
Bro you are very right but they like the show, they're never going to make a harsh criticism of it. Which is kinda hypocritical... maybe Ryan would've done better than the panel with this episode.
@@dankato6380 the bricks flying, the huge explosion, vhagar crawling in the ground, etc. I undestood the scene right away, not only she is the biggest, she has also the best camouflage. The mud on the cliff, the sea, everything counted and backed the writing. I loved it.
Why was the castle the only place Aemond could hide? Earlier he was hiding in the trees and could have been then as well. Rhaenys may have headed for the water as Aemond could have been anywhere in the tree line but he was one step ahead.
I was yelling at Rhaenys after she took out Sunfyre and slammed Vhagar because she should have retreated back to Dragonstone to give word that Kingslanding was weak or to get the others to take on Vhagar. I mean, she took out one dragon, but now your most experienced rider and dragon are lost for basically nothing. 2:05:04 Im so glad yall discussed this a little.
But to Gary's credit I agree with him that she was just tired and done with it all. So she took the suicidal risk to just maybe take Vhagar out. Making the march to Kingslanding far easier and shifting the tide of the war.
A battle.
A battle in daylight.
A battle in daylight shot competently.
What year is this?
You're telling me I don't have to adjust my TV's contrast and brightness to watch this episode? Lol
@@hankrearden5460 Yes. Back to the settings I had it at originally before the last shitty battle. I've come full circle.
Actually it would have been better if i didnt see anything from that battle.
I understand that battle in GoT was shot badly for MOST people, but for us early HDR very expensive high NITs quality display people, it was perfectly fine.
They did bugger up tho.
but a battle once again resolved by "reinforcements" trope. Too many GOT battles end with reinforcements trope.
Aemond - Speaks eloquently in High Valyrian.
Aegon - 'Si...er...Correcto'
"A river there chief"- Aldo the Apache
Gorlamee
I love how good the setup was for Aegon to make the stupid decision. Alicent keeps blaming him for everything whilst being his mother and failing to prepare him is also extremely poetic. Such a good start of the war.
I can only imagine the realisation:
"we started the equivalent of a nuclear war for the sake of getting you on the throne and now we want you to do absolutely nothing and be our puppet for the rest of your life"
@@Constantinch no, that's bad writing. Just like Alicent trying to decapitate Rhaenyra for protecting her bastard child that mutilated her son in episode 7 and then spending this entire season more concerned for Rhaenyra's family than her own.
It’s stupid as fuck. The greens aren’t even a thing anymore, in the book they were a family that actually cared about eachother.
Gary isn't shy about stating the show is much better than the book. I never read it but do most of the people who read the book hate the show?
GRRM stated that the show is how the events actually happened, and the book is historical propaganda.
As soon as sunfyire was being all cute and affectionate with Aegon you knew something horrible was on the way
I find Aegon to be absolutely hilarious but also really sad. Man really just wants to be loved.
Well he is a rapist, We can't even entertain the thought of liking the guy
It was also sad to see his dragon truly love him and seeing Aegon smile back. Only for his dragon to be mauled and get absolutely crushed.
@@TweedTonesthe golden boys 😢
@@TweedTonesSunfyre is a loyal steed. It was sad to see him get maimed this episode, but his story is far from over.
@@TweedTones Aegon is a literal r*pist. I feel very sorry for Sunfyre, but I hope his rider ended up extra crispy.
They managed to make Aegon a very tragic character, a victim of his own family in all regards.
A negletful father, a hateful mother that does nothing but belittle him, a brother who tries to end him.
Lots of stuff show to set up the tragedy
ohh poor aegon, he treated aemond like trash when they were kids, and keep doing it.
@@diogovieira5563 I don't think making fun of someone and getting burned alive are comparable in weight.
@@diogovieira5563 Neglectful father and hateful mother are the reasons why he became a bully in the first place.
They did a sterling job on Aegon (and Aemonds) character felt sorry for him at times but can’t get past the fighting pits with his own illegitimate children and F Aemond using her own daughters dragon to kill meyles nah won’t be sad to see his demise
He was always my favorite Targaryen after reading Fire & Blood because of how tragic his character is
Daemon saw himself with an eye patch reminded me of Luke Skywalker in TESB. When he walks into the Cave of Dagobah, he saw Vader’s helmet in his hallucination. Then he smashed it, revealing his own face.
I felt so bad for sunfyre. Perhaps the only living thing that loved/cared for Aegon and Aegon returning the same kindness to Sunfyre. Seeing the poor dragon get mauled and scream in pain only for it to yet again get blasted by Aemond was saddening.
It really hit hard when Sunfyre was suffering from wounds; she genuinely adored Aegon and he returned the affection in kind. Poor dragon :(
Loved the details showing their bond; Sunfyre using his wing to shield Aegon from Vhagar's flames. Then finding him curled up around Aegon on the ground.
Why do dragons explode on impact, but ONLY when they die? Vhaegar didn't 💁♂️
@@cosmictreason2242 I’m not 100% sure and don’t recall that details in the book. I’m guessing it had something to do with the neck bite and Meleys trying to breathe/shoot fire at the same time only to be blocked by Vhaegar. When Vhaegar fell, she was aware she was falling therefore landed on two feet
I can’t believe they got me to actually feel as sad as when a dog dies in a movie/tv show. Sunfyre was a good boy and it really bummed me out watching that scene knowing how much he truly cared for aegon.
I love them finally reincorporating their Valyrian language.
The dialogue this episode was so good.
The difference in quality between this and the acolyte is insane
No joke
The acolyte is totally devoid of quality. Not a single redeeming aspect. Not one.
@frankie3010 lol ok low quality bait
@frankie3010 If it's not bait, then I'm sorry about your brain damage. I hope life isn't too hard being handicapped. 🙏
Garbage in, garbage out.
I thought the symbolism of the figurine that Alicent broke in this episode was it being the same piece she gave Viserys in season 1 when she was younger. It symbolized that she tried doing all of this *for him* and ended up messing it up instead.
Exactly this. That's what I gathered as well
I loved how this show portrayed how the veteran dragons and dragon riders fight in aerial combat. Agon (and Sunfyre) shooting flame at Meleys and Rhaenys, thus obscuring their own vision. Meanwhile, Meleys takes advantage of this by maneuvering while her opponent is blinded, and gets in position to blindside. Twice Meleys attacks Sunfyre. First while Sunfyre was trying to find her after getting out of his own fireball, and second while the panicked young dragon was trying to gain altitude while in agony.
When Vhagar and Meleys charge each other, we see the veteran Vhagar snatch Meleys before deploying flame. And later, when Vhagar blindsides Meleys using the castle. Even if the castle wasn't there, the cliff still would have provided enough cover. The dragons fly fast enough that the closing speed would ensure that, if one could close the distance to a point where the other has no time to react.
Not to mention Meleys plummeting Vhagar to the ground knowing that the smaller lighter dragon could break away safely while V takes a fall
eh, i saw barely any difference between aegon and rhaenys idfk what you guys are talking about.
it just seems like fanboying has taken hold of most people, I was actually looking forward to rhaenys pulling off some tactical moves instead of just saying "Meleys Attack"
"Attack Meleys"
wow, such skill, impressive
A marvellous showing for Aemond. No notes.
As for Aegon, I found myself pitying Aegon. Absolutely nothing was ever expected of him from anyone. Completely lost and neglected, it's no wonder he became pathetic. At least in F&B he had a loving mother.
Don't even get me started on Sunfyre. Our first real showing of the two them together and... damn.
Lastly. Didn't hate her, per se, but I'm glad I won't be seeing Rhaenys anymore. Perpetually smug and bitter isn't endearing to me. And this is coming from someone who loved the Queen of Thorns right until the end.
So you think Rhaenys is bitter, smug, and you’re glad she’s dead…yet you loved her until her death. This is what we call hypocritical and retarded.
@@pooloftim8263
Where did OP say he love Rhaenys?
A marvellous showing of Aemond?
Bruh he was a pu$sy in this episode
The "Queen of Thornes" had a charm to her dialogue and interactions and they all made sense in the context of the story and of her house, she was a great character while Rhaenys never did.
I loved the scene where Aemond taunts Aegon in High Valaryian.
Ageon yelling at Larys strong made me laugh out loud “ ITS YOUR FUCKING CASTLE “
“Yes but it’s more crippled than me” that got me absolutely hilarious haha
also the little face he makes after he says "you all bore me"
Once I saw that Aegon was drunk I knew he was done for. He was so desperate to prove himself and it bit him in the ass hard. Poor Sunfyre.
Seeing Sunfyre get mauled and designed with having 0 battle experience was sad. Hearing its screams of pain as well. The only thing that probably truly loved Aegon 😔
Beware of King Aegon, good sir. He may survive us yet!
@@TweedTonesit was hilarious
Targaeryans don't burn so the only thing that can kill him is the fall. If the dragon fell first then he's probably fine
@@denisako6493 LOL, dude what! Targaeryans burn just as much as any other person!
Watching the group geek out with excitement over a good show is SO much better than watching them have to sh!t on the normal crap. Wish there were more opportunities for this kind of review.
There was a Kingmaker in the 15th century in England. It was Richard Neville, 16th Earl of Warwick, killed at the Battle of Barnet in 1471, during the Wars of the Roses.
Yes one my favorite story with king Edward and queen Elizabeth woodville the is actually a tv show about call the white queen and it has a lot of game of thrones actors in it
The War of the Roses IS the plot of A Game of Thrones (specifically The War of the 5 Kings). The Yorks are the Starks, the Lancasters are the Lannisters. Robb is the young king Edward, who never lost a battle, Talisa/Jeyne is the White Queen Elizabeth Woodville, Cersei is Margaret of Anjou, Eddard is Richard of York, and so on…
@mermaidreviews4693 Yes, I saw the white queen with Rebecca Ferguson (Dune, and MI franchise). I also saw the white princess with Jodie Comer. I studied the Wars of the Roses and had to do an assignment on Warwick. Fascinating period.
@@patriciafenwick5846 I find the writing on these shows to be sharper than on some of the GoT shows personally. If someone really wanted to have their own GoT, they could basically do a multi seasons series about the War of the Roses and insert a few supernatural elements in it.
@@jonathangutner517even GRRM couldn't be original
Since they've established that Aemond is proficient in high valerian, should we figure that he read the prophecy on the knife since he now has it?
Great observation.
Idk if they speak about this later in the video, but I think only kings and heirs know about it. The dagger is just a symbol of power and the king has it...
Pretty sure the shows song of ice and fire is only spoken verbally to the heir of throne in private
No
I believe it is on the dagger itself however heat must be applied from my understanding. We see him holding the dagger when Cole arrives but it is not glowing. Was it heated by the dragons breathe possibly. Did Aemond find it while it was still glowing possibly. My real question would be what is the importance of knowing it? For traditions sake yes the king/queen has always told their heir but that didn't stop Aegon II.
I like the lord of Harrenhall. He's the only actually honest character. He's got nothing to gain and only a haunted castle to keep.
Simon is a castellan, Larys is the lord
Damn I wanted to hate rheneys and aegon but I never could. And sunfyre painful screeches and meleys looking at rheneys before dying always breaks my heart.
That ruined me lol. The first time Meleys looks back at her to make sure she’s fine. The last seconds of her life looking at Rheneys got me in the feels
F*** this show 😂 it can be so good and yet terrible how stupid she died
I still remember all those people dying. The reason I hated her was more on a meta level: Daemon does horrible shit and everyone (rightfully) thinks he is a monster that would order the murder of a child (which he likely did). Aemon does horrible shit and his own mom admits she thinks he is unhinged psycho. Rhaenys does horrible shit and no one ever mentions it in while she gets to be the voice of reason cautioning everyone.
The dragon dying was really sad but I actually glad that Rhaenys is out of the story now.
Edit: Gone back paddle a bit now that emotions aren’t running as high anymore. That scene was definitely emotional effect and the actress did a great job with what she was given.
I didn’t hate her (hate is a very strong emotion) I found her more annoying since the writers wanted to have their cake and eat it two. They did that silly scene in episode 9 cause they thought it would look really cool and then pretended it didn’t really happen (“Yeah, but GoT civilians don’t count.”). Either go with the scene and have her be a darker character (which could have been very interesting) or cut out the part where she kills dozens if not hundreds of people (like you pretend she didn’t).
@@19Ledor i didn't forget that scene still the worse scene. It's crazy how 1 bad scene can hurt the character.
@@19Ledor That's cause the show always want to make Team Black look like the good guys. So even if they do bad shit, it's embelished.
The scene where Vaegar enters the battlefield and the music stops. People stop screaming. Everyone just looks up. The Erie quiet before the intense chaos.
Vhaegar was so silent 😂
I was so scared that when it cut to black, it would fade to after the battle was over lol. Traumatized by Disney editing.
Definitely my favorite HoTD episode of all seasons.
If you pretend the dumb dragon scene of episode 9 didn't happen, Rhaenys' arc becomes so much better. She would actually have been believable as a voice for peace, she wouldn't have been responsible for the war happening in the first place, and her death would have been tragic as the most peace-minded character being the first to fall in battle (although her dreams about a peaceful solution still were completely irrational and naive, of course).
It really feels like that's how the showrunners want us to look at it. They realize how bad that scene was and are now trying to pretend it never happened. Unfortunately, that's not how it works.
I think it's possible, however, to look at her insistence on loitering around the battle scene as her trying to "make up" for her gargantuan screwup in season one by not killing Aegon when she had the chance, and also trying to make up for all the lost time (and initiative) the Blacks have had sitting on their hands waiting for Rhaenyra to realise that, yes, you are _at war already_ ; ironically by doing so she left herself vulnerable to Aemond
Granted, that could have been emphasised a little better, but in any case what's done is done and I'm kinda relieved that we're done with the character so I won't have to worry about the writers trying to puff them up as some sort of noble heroine anymore 😄
That dumb scene would make so much more sense if they pointed out all the gates of the dragon pit were closed and the only way for her to escape was to go through the roof
that scene wasn't even in the books, in the book aegon flies around on sunfyre during his coronation. If they were smart they could have just had rhaenys escape kingslanding on her dragon without killing people and have a short standoff with aegon and sunfyre which would help build rooks rest up even more
Unfortunately nothing is perfect. But HOTD is certainly amazing
@@SaeedUrRehman1 That still wouldn't have fixed it, as no one knew she was there and she could easily just have waited until the coronation was over before escaping.
Melyss being roughly double or a bit over double the size of sunfire and then vhagar being 2-3x the size of melyss was depicted so well and it was absolutely chilling
Meleys is described in the book as the fastest dragon alive at the time. So this had nothing to do with fear of getting outran by Vahgar. I feel this was Rhaenys being a dragon. Even before this conflict, Rhaenys is always described as fierce and fearless. She knew it would likely be her end but she also knew that there was a chance she could win and she took it.
I saw it as her understanding that this is her best chance to maime Vheagar and impact the Greens ability to defend against multiple dragons in the future.
Fastest doesn't mean highest stamina. There is room to say she could out distance especially after battle with gunfire.
I do agree that is not the most likely vibe though
It feels really good to watch and talk about great television again... I can hear it the panels voices... It's actual excitement compared to dread of talking about the wokeacolyte...
When meleys fell vhagar, i was screaming 'get outta there, meleys!'
This dragon battle was epic. I love GG Martin work. I really hope he had finished the books before GOT catch up. I hope G.G Martin fhinish the story. Its a great story to leave it unfinished.
I really think they could’ve addressed Rhaenys’ actions in episode 9 in this episode and given her a bit of a redemption arc. When Rhaenys is doing one of her lectures, just have a character say something to her like: “Princess, you have killed more small folk than anyone in this conflict thus far, maybe instead of flying high in your dragon, you for once think of the people on the ground beneath you”.
That would’ve contextualised the scene where she is looking down at the destruction below her at rooks rest, and decides to turn around and fight again. It would’ve been her acknowledging that she was wrong and wants to try and put things right.
Agreed, it was a mistake not to properly address the ending of episode 9.
@@SirCunningham-m5ythe problem is though that the writers don't realize that she did anything wrong that episode. All she did was girl boss into the sun to make her escape. So they don't realize there's even a mistake to redeem
@@FactoryDan It's a shame they didn't pick up on their mistake when writing the second season.
Maybe the exits were closed except for the front top entrance. Even mentioning that would help make sense of the scene or showing rhaenys trying to escape but couldn't so she eventually had to do a vertical kool-aid man. She'd seen lord Caswell hanged for trying to escape(although she didnt know the exact reason shed still know her life is in danger), so it would be her neck if she didn't somehow get out.
Finally that old hag is dead.
48:07 Exactly! Even in the previous episode when she singled out Aemond, "Aemond...you know what he is.." to Rhaenyra. It's like, Your SON, the one you raised. If he's a "monster," you made him one, Alicent.
It's weird in-world & in the audience ppl dont seem to always acknowledge Alicent's "mothering".
FWIW I think there is a consistent complaint that the greens are completely misrepresented in this series, for better and for worse. They're a much more bonded family in the books.
The reason I am not Team Black is Rhaenyra is a terrible decision maker , her life has shown this. Sending Rhaenys by herself was such a poor move. She doesn’t strike me as someone who would rule well. She should have never abandoned Kingslanding if she was serious and she should have connected with the people.
Yeah it is strange considering they have the numbers advantage in terms of dragons. Worst thing Rhaenyra can do is split them up.
@@doomguy4945 agree
Jace and baelas dragons are tiny, they wouldn't do anything to vhagar
Funny how the Green counsel puts Aegon down even though THEY put him on the throne. A power he did not want. It was all out of pettiness and spite.
Bc Alicent finally said the quiet part out loud, he doesn't know shit about anything, and doesn't want to listen to anyone who DOES know and is way smarter than he is. Like his little brother is known to have grown up obsessed with studying history, philosophy, and battle and larys strong even telling him harrenhall is worse than worthless but he's like NO ITS A BIG CASTLE AND I SAY WE NEED IT
@@jlogan2228But that is Alicent and the councils fault; they put him on the throne against his will and convinced him it was something he should desire. So now that he desires it for the reasons they put in his head they then pull back and want him to shut up.
Aemond trying to kill his brother is foreshadowing his sanity
Are we sure he was trying to kill him? Or was he just happy to see him as collateral? He was sheaving his sword when Cole found him. I don't think he was about to finish him off.
He was when he attacked Sunfyre, but not when he found him. Probably was just staring at his chard body like a creep
The episode made me sympathize with king aegon
The man really tried
No he didn't lol He partied, stayed drunk and did nothing as king except execute a bunch of innocent men and fire his competent advisors
@@sivad1025 yes, the bar really is that low now.
Tried? Shit of a man, shit of a king.
@@sivad1025 remind me again what Rhaenyra ever did? She literally ate cakes and did nothing, lmao. Meanwhile, Aegon and Sunfyre were the MVPs of the dance. 👋
@sera8792 Oh, I agree. I'm on Team Green to the end. Rhaenyra is insufferable. But Aegon is only marginally preferable
Seems like the first thing to do fighting Vhagar is to tear out the membranes on her wings.
Seems like losing even one membrane between two "fingers" would noticeably impact her ability to maintain altitude, her speed and make her even less maneuverable.
When she's debuffed, it will be even easier to get in there and claw the belly. But why not the rider?
Rhaenys didn't care if she got Vhagar, as long as she got Aemon.
We definitely need an Aegon the Conqueror/Aenys Targaryen/Maegor the Cruel show that could go like 5-6 seasons (Think how HotD did it with the time jumps) and have it end with Jaeherys taking the throne and having his reign of peace leading straight into the events of House of the Dragon. HBO should build the brand back up and eventually once they have a few successful shows in the bag like hopefully HotD, Aegon's Conquest, Hedge Knight, Robert's Rebellion etc. they remake Game of Thrones and by that point fingers crossed GRRM has the books finished.
no, they will skip all the brutal stuff for girlbossing.
eh sorry but I've seen what happens when people have martin's bullet points and try to make something or when they have a vague outline and try to do to much to expand on it. We end up with GOT season 7 and 8 or dumb ideas like rhaenyra sneaking into kingslanding. The only other adaptations I want of this world are the dunk and egg show they're already doing and in maybe 30 years when the books are hopefully done and enough time has passed (really delusional in my optimism here) a full animated remake of ASOIAF
Maegor the Honourable* good sir.
@@idawg7332 I'm not gonna say HotD is perfect. GoT seasons 1-3 still outshine it and there's definitely some girlbossing/adherence to the message here but at least the acting, production value, dialogue, music, special FX etc. Are top notch. It's an actual show with flaws instead of just agenda driven crap like The Acolyte. Yes a fully animated GoT would be amazing and would probably be the best route to go.
@@LivingGhost1 I mostly enjoy HOTD too despite some of the issues you mentioned but keep in mind, with HOTD they atleast have a complete written out story to go off of. Now they could adapt aegon and his sons same way. But from what I've heard after dunk and egg the next show is that 10000 ships series which has no real source material besides what...a page in world of ice and fire and a few lines in the books? That sounds like a disaster to me. Also I could easily see an aegon show turning into a story about how aegon was a useless idiot and visenya and rhaenys did all the work
When Rhaenys strapped in, I knew it was over. I heard Neegan's voice in my head talking about the size of the lady nuts on her. It's one thing to fight and risk dying. It's another to know you're going to die and do it anyway.
Rhaenryra's council not even bringing up the possibility of Vagar or other dragons showing up is really dumb. The way it was played you could tell Rhaenys knew that dying was a real probability, so it would take one line from her being like "I will do my part" to move on from the topic.
Anyone notice the cup Aegon knocks off the table before he goes to RR? A golden dragon that he pushes to its destruction 😢
Aye figured that was a massive foreshadowing
Also when alicent drops that stone dragon the wing breaks and in the books aegons dragon has its wind torn off
This episode cemented to me just how dumb Rhaenys was. The battle at the moment of Aegon's fall was a net positive for her and the Blacks: she burned like half of the army, the king was almost certainly dead (killed by his brother no less!), and she had a clean getaway. Instead of that, she decides to stay and take on the biggest dragon alive, and in turn the Blacks lose arguably their most powerful dragon and dragonrider... the sheer fucking hubris.
my head cannon is that after Rhaenys didn't kill the greens when she escaped, she has a burden of guilt for not ending the war right then and there, and to me it felt like she was looking for Aegon and less looking to fight vhagar
@@michaeljones9221 That sounds very good, yes, but I doubt the show will take that route, seeing how the writers barely brought up her decision in episode 9 (and even then, Rhaenys "dunked on" Daemon when he brought up the subject). But yes, I would like that to be the case as well.
Spoken like an honorless petaQ
they would have caught up to her
on top of that she flew low to the ground toward a large blindspot. As soon as they showed the castle in front of her, I was just like "oh she's dead, he's hiding behind the castle." and sure enough...
What i find annoying is that they watched the episode, and have the scene right there, playing, and still don't notice that Aemond is ALREADY sheathing his sword before Cole calls for him. ???
True, unbelievable. They even manage to laugh at the idea, being convinced he was there to kill him. The boys were not in form for this review, far from it
@@conradsong5377because they missed one small detail?
Dragon rights need to be respected
Fully semi automatic assault dragon with the shoulder thing thet goes up.
Got to free these dragons from their chains. What could be, unburdened by what has been.
Dragon Lives Matter
Reparations should be paid by ALL in Westeros
@nintendsoad agreed, all of the *descendents* of non-dragon riders should have to pay for the dragons they never oppressed.
*corrected thanks to cosmicreason2242
The CGI for this episode looked way better than the recent Kong vs Godzilla film.
Ive always had a hard time watching the dragons die, they remind me of dogs for some reason and I know this is gonna be a hard series.
Whoever thought of making Sunfire act like a damn golden retriever during the suit up is both a genius and and major asshole for making me love Sunfire so much five minutes before it's brutally mauled by Malese
Seeing the dragons die is heartbreaking. They cry out and are just doing what their riders tell them to do. And they are loyal as dogs too
It's so refreshing to watch a competent and engaging story.
HoD: Cole has been covering himself in glory.
Me: oh that’s a death sentence right there lol
That moment that Maelys was looking back at Rheanys while her neck was being crushed was such a great touch. A final goodbye look, knowing she was a goner.
😦😢
Sir Cole is gonna be pissssssed when he learns the queen is moon teaing his babies.
Lol what? She and Cole would be screwed if she got pregnant. He'd be pissed if she wasnt using moon tea
@@kalecraft8906 Yeah Cole would most likely be executed if they find out.
looool hell knawl...Sir Cole would be in favour of the abortion cuz otherwise he is screwed
i thon aaemon his cristons and laicents child the one from brackon
Illegitimate babies.
Two take-aways. Otto is NOWHERE to be seen(great move;the feeling of freefall without him is is visceral) and castles are actually used as castles. And oh yeah,Cristan is every bit the Lancelot in this plot,epic fall from grace and innocense.
I think another tactical consideration for Rooks Rest from the Blacks’ POV is that it is perceived to be an easy victory for the Greens. So presumably they would have no need for a dragon because they wouldn’t need one to win
Jaehaerys wasn't in line for the thrown either. He was the 3rd son of Aenys. Aegon the Uncrowned would have received the prophecy from Aenys who was told directly from Aegon the Conqueror. But Aegon the Uncrowned and Viserys were both killed by Maegor. Jaehaerys was a young boy when he, his sister and mother fled from Kingslanding. Making it very hard to believe he would have received the prophecy from either of his older brothers!
Just another example of why this show is the 'young adult' version of the story. Awful writing. Trying so hard to tie itself onto a better show.
@@vit4mint685what “better” show?
Ya but Jaehaerys was essentially a genius, super well read. Super into his family legacy. Mega Targaryen supremacist. There’s a million different ways he could have gotten hold of the prophecy. Plus Aegon the uncrowneds wife survives into Jarhaerys reign, she could have known the prophecy. There’s a million ways to answer that question.
That being said tho, the prophecy would most likely die with Maegor cuz he just exploded and destroyed everything lmfao it’s a tragedy we don’t get Maegor on screen
@@Rounderyathecruel The first 4 seasons of Game of Thrones. The intro song is the same, they keep alluding to 'the song of ice and fire'. it's trying so hard to grab onto the same audience, but delivers such a worse product.
I would like to point out the threat of dragons was pointed out in the council meeting before Rhaenys volunteered to go. Jace says "he will burn Cole's line and return before Kings landing has time to raise the alarm." I took that as them assuming all of the dragons were still in Kings Landing.
All they needed was a scene where Rhaenys says "I feel so bad that I killed all those peasants for no reason" and I would have liked her character.
That and regret she didn’t kill the greens when she had the chance
The problem with living in New Zealand is that I see this stream dropping while I'm at work, and still have to go home and watch HotD before I can listen to this!
Good television and better critics make Mondays a whole lot better than they used to be at least.
Same for me in Europe, I have to wait even longer lol
To make the dragons fight midair the way birds of prey are doing it, mainly with their claws locking into each other, shows a great understanding of animal behavior. There was clearly not only the idea of creating a bombastic scene but to be as realistic as possible. My only complain is that Vhagar winning with an ambush attack again is a bit of too staged and too convenient. If anything it should have been the other way around and Meleys should have used her superior speed and agility for quick ambushes while Vhagar has to completely rely on her size to overpower her opponent. She's not that quick and is spotted easily plus when she hides behind the castles wall/cliffs she basically can't see Meleys just like Meleys can't see her so Vhagar finding the perfect moment to blindly ambush and having success with that is just too convenient.
its funny you can say they wanted to be realistic as possible, and follow with the complaint that absolutely destroyed the scene. Its a shame that the character of Rhaenys that the show-writers have written is one that I can believe would honestly be dumb enough to re-engage after essentially winning the war. But they wanted to make Aemond a regicide for drama, and she needed her girl-boss moment. In the books she never had the opportunity to flee, so it wasnt an issue. She fought hard in a 2v1 and in the fighting Sunfyre lost a wing and Aegon got burned.
Rhaenys was supposed to be experienced one yet she forgot the first rule of dogfight, never take your eyes off of your opponent
Nah no need to stare at that giant lizard all the time, it's not like it can hide or anything.
She didn't know Vhagar had a Romulan cloaking device.
Vhagar raised a lot of dust and smoke when she landed.
She used it as cover to crawl away and prepare an ambush, while Meylys was recovering from their tussle.
Still a bit impractical, based on Vhagar's sheer size.
When you lose the advantage ...retreat...regroup to fight again. Tactical mistake.
@@tmanqz I kinda have to disagree.
Rhaenys was fighting alone against an enemy much larger and more powerful than herself.
She was likely trying to press the advantage, while she assumed Vhagar was down, because she's not sure if she can repeat the damr trick with Vhagar and come out on top.
She was likely trying to catch Vhagar before she went into the air. Because Vhagar's size gives her a huge reach and weight advantage, but if she could catch her on her belly, or land on her back.
Unfortunately, Vhagar moves surprisingly quickly when she needs to.
I will pity the dragons the most from the episode and the show. Such loyal, magnificent creatures with soft hearts, fighting a pointless war over a seat. Every scene in which they got harmed or killed hit hard in this episode because I love dragons in general.
Alicent is such a pathetic mother it's hard to describe and that led to her son's doom. Perfect writing.
See Drogon knew this and melted the iron throne that caused so much destruction
@@dottzie33 In the end, Drogon was the smartest character in GoT Se8 xD
The strap scenes probably also foreshadowing aemond vs daemon
It was also foreshadow few times in season 1, so its pretty obvious to catch up to it at this point
First thing I thought...saw it and smiled 😄
We bringed the Fring that's what matters.
Bringed?
@@lawrence09151 Correct, bringed. You have to bring the Fring. You can't brung the Frung.
I love how they depict Eamond and Vahgar, his cunning snd her experience combined make them a terrifying duo. They fight in ways you don’t expect them too.
Does Shad have to eat and smack in the mic the whole stream?
Only when he is not autistically screeching at every medieval inaccuracy, so I'd say it's pretty much 50/50... (haven't watched this stream yet, so I could be wrong this time...)
While i'm a shadiversity subscriber, his particular brand of autism is offputting in this setting, idgaf about the crenellations tbh or ya sword, if I did id be over on your channel trying to hear about em. I'm saying this as a sword-collecting autist myself. You can tell everyone on the panel is just kinda like "Ugh, yeah okay shad" when he brings up the crenellations. Save that shit for the people who care, you got your own channel and brand for a reason.
MVPs, Aemond, Cole.
Another kill for our Baby Monk
Uhtred would have been so proud. 🥲
Good to see other people have seen Last Kingdom
@@nerevar2185that was a good show to watch especially the behind the scenes they looked like they had a good laugh making that show
@@nerevar2185 legit one of the most underrated shows ever made
Melys the female dragon is emoting better than all of the cast of the acolyte
What a fantastic episode, it's so refreshing to actually watch something that's good and enjoyable. The characters are so interesting and multifaceted rather than incompetent like The Acolyte. The pair are such polar opposites and it's so fascinating to see the discourse between both these shows.
Can't wait for next week's episode!
I think one thing that I thought was interesting was when Meleys was fighting sunfyre for a bit they showed sunfire bite off a horn instead of going for the neck or something or the belly. It shows how inexperienced sunfyre and aegon is and how they had no chance.
The show was awesome, but the jump scare kill shot will get old if they keep doing it. Think logically, that dragon is as big if not bigger than a 747 basically, htf do you lose sight of it? It’s being forced, if you understand bfm / acm tactics this would make sense and be perfectly logical.
Fingers crossed for Big Bird Tully and The Count 🧛♂️
I think with Rhaenys also deciding to come back and basically fight to the death is because she found out about Corlys’ bastards or at least one of them. In the earlier scene you can see that thought she “accepts” it and understands the reasoning, it still hurts her and damages her pride. further more she feels like this is yet another thing she lost. Her husband was probably the last thing that was keeping her going. And with him having bastards in a way she lost him as well. The combination of what the guys said of her feeling tired and Corlys bastard just put her in a mindset of this is it for me, I’m out.
Ye great thinking I like this 👍🏻
What I hate about this episode of HotD is the "cut to black" scenes. It's like you're watching this awesome battle sequence then the black screen. I said "is that it?" while looking at the time "it's too short." I was relieved there's more when it cuts to the next scene. And then... it happened again!!!
But all in all, great episode. Cole hyping the army when Aegon flies in & Vhagar's entrance into the battle are awesoooomeee.
Well it was much longer than the book one
Damn Ryans floor pizza making him sick again to miss this episode.
Rheaneras mistake was thinking she was going to be the first to be willing to unleash the dragons. She should never have allowed one dragon to go alone knowing vhagar is a possible enemy to encounter.
Shad is wrong @2:17:02 Vaghar is not the fastest. She is the oldest and the largest, born in 52 BC (Before Aegon's Conquest), and with much more fighting experience than any of the other Dragons of this age. Melys is much younger (born 129 AC) and is described as faster than both Caraxes and Vhagar, and fearsome. In the books, Rhaenys turns to meet the attack by both Dragons (Sunfyre and Vaghar), knowing she doesn't have a chance against them. But they have changed things here, the dynamic of that fight, and book Rhaenys is not the insufferable preacher, with a chip on her shoulder as in the show. I love book Rhaenys a lot, but I could give a fig about show Rhaenys. Good riddance! And before someone comes up with "but unreliable sources" mantra about the book. Well, I don't see why and how can the writers of the show be considered more reliable. lol After all, they are just an additional version, nothing more. Which is why stories based on "unreliable narrator" are not the best, for me. But I suppose that's not a problem for the show because the majority of the viewers haven't read the book. And even among the readers, I'm guessing many might agree with the changes, since F&B is not a proper narrative book like ASOIAF, where important changes are not welcomed by the book readers.
Re-Aegon and the prophecy. That's 100% an afterthought. It has been something that some fans had come up with long time ago, and George kinda liked it. And for a good reason, because Aegon's "inactivity" for so many years, before turning west, always felt bizzarre and lacking. At that time, Geroge didn't have everything figured out. He is a "gardener" remember? And sometimes, the gardener, needs a bit of "help". 😉But I remember Elio and Linda talking about it, way before the show was in the horizon, and completely negating that it was a thing as far as canon and George was concerned. Ultimately, It fits the story, so it doesn't bother me that much. But let's not kid ourself, and call it what it is, an afterthought. What bothers me is that they used it in the show. It should've stayed out, because it has nothing to do with the Dance of the Dragons.
The only reason they used it is because they still want to keep a link (like a continuity) between GOT and HoD, given the debacle with GOT, and TPTWP is that link. But more importantly, they wanted to give both to Rhaenyra and Alicent a "good" excuse, because "only men scheme", and only "men want and cause wars". 😏 Therefore, the prophecy it is used for Rhaenyra as a "calling". It's basically what motivates her. She isn't doing this because she wants that throne and because it is her goddamn birthright (which it is by the way.) There isn't a trace of book Rhaenyra, who after she lost the baby, and this was before Lucery's death, blames the greens for that and says; "They stole my crown and murdered my daughter and they shall answer for it." There is no Rhaenyra in the show, who is "quick to anger and never forgot a slight", and says to Aegon's messenger: "Tell my half-brother I will have my throne or his head." Nope! We can't have that! Instead, we have a "reasonable" and "responsible" Rhaenyra, who despite everything, exercises restrain and is trying to mediate until the very last. She is doing this for the "greater good", and all that jazz, because of the Prophecyyyy! A prophecy by the way, which turns out to be a joke in GOT, but I digress. lol
So, no, she can't abdicate, Shad. No matter how much you try to find a "hidden" moral lesson on "selfishness". That's not the intention here, because there is no chance in hell that the viewers would not understand her motivations and sympathise with her. It will always be: Yes, she did this or that, BUT....The writers know this. It is done on purpose, not by accident. On the other hand, TPTWP it was also used for Alicent, but as a "misunderstanding" tool. And that was even worse.🙄🙄🙄
IMO, TPTWP prophecy in the HoD is the weakest and the lamest things, so far. It is so cringe that every time I hear it I wince. It comes off as fake. It is true what Garry says, it is not over yet, and we'll have to wait and see how it plays out. However, GOT should've taught us something. So, I would call them out, when it's due.
Dude, it's fictional. No one read your essay and none gives a fak
Exactly, also, how does the TPWWP prophecy told by Viserys confirm that Rhaenyra should be the ideal heir ? Why not Aegon, the person succeeding should not matter as long as it is a Targaryen right ? Why did Rhaenyra think that she is now a rightful heir.
I’m guessing because Viserys told her about it and not Aegon because he named and saw her as the rightful heir for the story to be passed down to. If he had wanted Aegon he would have told him and Rhaynera knows this whether it makes her the ideal heir I don’t know but I’d definitely chose her over Aegon to. Also I don’t like the use of TPTWP because it turned out to mean nothing in GoT but again that makes for what’s happening here because of it all the more sad
It’s cool that the dragons fight like eagles where they grab their claws and spin to the ground.
Where was Whispers Guy when king is Flying away with his Dragon?
WHY NO ONE STOPPING THE KING
bcoz everyone wanted him dead , especially aemond
@@Ps_10_10 Why? He is a dragon rider he is more useful than 99,99999% of population. They already ignore him there is literally no point in killing him.
The scene where Alicent is visited by the grand meister shows just how good this production is. Everything was so subtle. The camera pans down to her touching her belly. She drinks...as the camera pans away.
'...Sir Criston Cole...'
about as subtle as an aegon mace smash to the face
I did like how both sunfyre and melays drew attention to themselves before they got two close by screeching
Then Vhegar swoops in so silently
Alright let's analyse this in detail. To all those who keep saying "why doesn't Rhaenys just fly away?", please think of her options considering the fact that Vhagar is completely unscathed and hasn't just flown from Dragonstone to Rook's rest and so is also completely fresh when she joins the fight:
1: fly to dragonstone. Congrats, now you're leading Aemond and Vhagar towards your queen, granddaughter, husband and Rhaenyra's heir, all nicely congregated inside the dragonstone keep. Aemond and Cole planned this ambush knowing the black's thinking would be "Aemond/Vhagar won't leave King's landing", which would lure out a dragon for them to kill. It's a one-shot opportunity that they're not about to waste, so Aemond 100% is following Meylys to take her out. If Rhaenys turns back, she forces the fight with Vhagar to happen over dragonstone, because if she doesn't hold there Aemond is just going to incinerate the castle and everyone in it as well as the presumably present and riderless Vermax, Syrax and Moondancer. And if she fights him there it'll almost certainly be the same outcome as at Rook's rest with the other three riders only having a few minutes warning. That's not enough time to reach their dragons and get them into the sky. Even if they do, unless the four of them can coordinate perfectly, one decently aimed dracarys from Vhagar and Jace/Vermax and Baela/Moondancer are literally toast. If the stars align perfectly Rhaenys would probaly be fighting alongside Rhaenyra and Syrax for their lives, which is still incredibly dangerous for both of them. More likely Rhaenyra would lift off just as Rhaenys is being killed, at which point a slightly wounded Vhagar probably kills her and Syrax too, ending the war right there.
Now maaaaybe you can make the argument that since Meylys is being described as the fastest dragon in the book that she'd have a slight head start between reaching dragonstone and Aemond catching up, and so could raise the alarm in time. But with how short the flight is to dragonstone, and the speeds displayed here on screen I'm skeptical whether that's show cannon, and if it is, how much leadtime it would be. In any case, flying to dragonstone risks her granddaughter and her betrothed (we all know Baela would not have hesitated a moment to help her, and Jace is equally eager to prove himself) and I really don't blame Rhaenys for not willing to risk watching those two die in front of her.
The only way this doesn't hold up is if you really believe that under no circumstances would Aemond pursue, and I just don't buy that. He's not afraid of anyone besides Daemon who he knows is at Harrenhal, is not afraid of kinslying, is supremely self-confident, and wants the glory of winning a major battle if not the war. I'm sorry, he isn't letting Rhaenys get away once she shows up. No way in hell.
2: fly west towards Harrenhal. Caraxes/Daemon and Meylys/Rhanys is probably the one combo that Aemond wouldn't be confident facing on his own, so he'd probaly not pursue. However you might as well put up a big sign with an arrow pointing east saying "go ahead, have fun", since that's just giving Aemond clearance to fly to dragonstone and kill everyone there at his leizure, probably piecemeal, before Daemon can even be reched to call upon for help. And if you think that Syrx, Vermax and Moondancer can take Vhagar on their own (take some bites/score some hits sure, but actually kill her? yeah no), then I have a bridge in brooklyn to sell you. That's no real option either.
3: do as she did. Stand and fight were you are to defend the castle you came to defend, and do at least enough damage to Vhagar so that Aemond won't risk flying across the bay afterwards, and maybe, if you get lucky, try and take the greens trump card out in one fell swoop. If Vhagar goes down, so do the greens, it's that simple. It doesn't quite work, but she does do sizeable damage and forces him to the ground, before Aemond makes use of the smoke and the castle to burst out from below (ironically, the same tactic Rhaenys used against Aegon earlier on), taking her out. Still, that earlier skydance and fall didn't look pleasant for Vhagar, and since I suspect Aemond will be needed in King's landing now that Aegon is, uh... let's be friendly and say "no longer in a fit state to rule" to take care of that political mess, Rhaenys was ultimately succesful, even if it did cost her her life.
Aegon felt like he wasn't doing anything. And pushed to feel involved
They had to make Sunfyre a giant puppy. The only time I felt any emotion during the battle was listening to him screech in pain.
2:18:00 is false. This actress was not in Game of Thrones.
It’s so refreshing to hear you guys praise a show that deserves it. It’s nice to have a show that actually does deserve it, lol!
You guys didn't bring up Agon picking up the dagger at the end. Isn't that the dagger with the prophecy on it? You brought the dagger up earlier in the stream regarding Allicent researching, but not at the end. So, is that the dagger? He show has been focusing on that dagger, and at the end of this episode making a point of showing Agon picking it up. If it is the dagger with the prophecy, what would be the significance of Agon picking it up?
Aemond picked it up. Aegon is the king that fell with sunfyre. Yes, that is the dagger with the prophecy. Since Aemond knows how to speak and read, he might have read the prophecy
@@wc8289 Yeah, I get peoples names mixed up all the time in this show. I actually have a family tree with the actors pictures that I reference sometimes.
It’s insane that the acolyte and HOTD have similar budgets. And I love the 1 hour-ish episodes vs 27 minutes. Where is all the budget going in the acolyte?
This review needed Ryan. Gary doesn't have the moment to moment knowledge to be the "book reader" of the group.
True. No hate on these guys I like them but Ryan knows his stuff
We don’t need a book reader. I just enjoy the discussion of the show and don’t enjoy the potential spoilers coming from knowledge of the book.
Gary likes dropping his knowledge and giving spoilers too
I'm betting Ryan will speak on this episode next week.
@@sparkycjsLove Gary but it’s also pretty dumb too when he just has to blatantly say what things mean like during the dragon fight lol, everyone else was like “yeah that’s cool subtle meaning” then Gary’s like “it’s a DANCE of dragons!”
I dont know if anyone brought it up but Harrenhal is basically a temple to the old gods because of all the weirwoods used in its construction.
STOP EATING SHAD, STOP EATING! Omg dude is unbearable
Yh right! He can't not eat for 3 hrs!? Lol
@anarchy.... lmao! I mean, at least hit the damn mute button and don't try and talk with your gob full!
Fuckin gross tbh, he does it too much for Gary to not be like "Bro stop that shit, people don't like it and leave comments on every stream you do it in"
Makes Australians look like a bunch of fkn children.
I'm a sub of his but his particular brand of autism is offputting in this setting too, idgaf about the crenellations tbh or ya sword, if I did id be over on your channel trying to hear about em. I'm saying this as a sword collecting autist myself. You can tell everyone on the panel is just kinda like "Ugh, yeah okay shad" when he brings up the crenellations. Save that shit for the people who care, you got your own channel and brand for a reason.
the old guy in harrenhall is so good for some i reason like seeing him around , old wise guy
HEROINHALL💉👀
I thought Rhaenyra was going to go to battle with the rationale that if she wins, she rallies more bannermen to her cause, and if she dies, the war is over before too many people have died. I see that as within her character, given how determined she is to avoid war. I thought that's what they were leading into, and if she AND Aegon died at the same battle, what a shitshow that would have made everything.
Watching final 20mins ... rooks battle beforehand worth the wait mfersz
Lol Cole only has 1500 soldiers on rooks
Epic dragon turn around. She killed the kings dragon survived amons and was fleeing with victory in tow.. and the red dragon looked at her❤ lol we don't flee B
Her name was Rhaenys .. and a true dragon queen that never wassss
She turned around knowing she didn't need too.. well nothing but downhill from here now that the badass fem on dragon back is dead
Shad forgets that with most reptiles, the gals are bigger than the guys. In fact, that pertains to insects, some birds, and many other animals. It's mostly just mammals where the boys are bigger. And dominant males having harems, so maybe that's the value in having size.
Daemon and Aemond are anagrams. If that doesn't make their mirror image symbolism obvious I don't know what does.
I do not think Aemond was trying to kill him, it just was meant to look like that.
How can the biggest dragon be so elusive though? it's the 2nd person that "i can't see it! where is it?!" - "Watch out watch out watch out! RKO out of nowhere!!!". It's the size of a sky-scrapper, how can you not see it?!
I don't know what you mean? If it came by night and landed in the forest, it could very much easily be concealed
It was covered in grass and branches, lying on the ground, covered by trees. (purposely)
You can hide almost anything in a forest.
I had the same but opposite reaction.
Why the Fuck would you fly that closely to the only thing large enough (the castle) to hide the giant dragon!?! I thought Rhaeneys was a little experienced.
Keeping it at a distance & using the smaller dragon’s speed & maneuverability to yeet Aemond out of his saddle was the move.
I had the same thought
Combat experience my friend. And flying into the sun, into and out of the clouds, the same way entire bomber squadrons evaded fighters in WWII. Or stashing entire tank divisions in small stretches of forest, etc. Being big doesn't mean you're easily visible at all times. And sure she takes a bit longer to turn than Meleys or Sunfyre, but Vhagar is a bad old bitch
Notice how Alicent was looking for Kiny Visary’s books
Aegon: “I had them removed!”
Alicent: ‘even with all their knowledge!?!’
Aegon: “I said I had them removed, I didn’t burn them!!”
She’s looking to see anything on the song of ice and fire rhaeynera mentioned last episode
She probably won’t find anything though as the last season stated that story is only told vocally from the current ruler to the heir
That was good but if Rheynes was such a battle hardened dragon rider she would have immediatly known Vhagar being so huge could only hide one place and atleast flown up higher yet she flew right over it like a total noob! And i get Vhagar has to win because of the book but even watching it we said 'hes behind the castle' right away because he physicaly could not hide behind anything else. Also Vhagar should have never been able to leave Kings Landing unnoticed, they had riders patroling to watch for that very reason! So there are some major problems here but it was still a really good episode. Glad too finally have the action we wanted and it was worth the wait!
I think it's bc being a great dragon rider doesn't make you a great soldier and the greens obviously have WAY better tacticians in cole and Aemond.
Bro you are very right but they like the show, they're never going to make a harsh criticism of it. Which is kinda hypocritical... maybe Ryan would've done better than the panel with this episode.
@@dankato6380 the bricks flying, the huge explosion, vhagar crawling in the ground, etc. I undestood the scene right away, not only she is the biggest, she has also the best camouflage. The mud on the cliff, the sea, everything counted and backed the writing. I loved it.
Why was the castle the only place Aemond could hide? Earlier he was hiding in the trees and could have been then as well. Rhaenys may have headed for the water as Aemond could have been anywhere in the tree line but he was one step ahead.
I was yelling at Rhaenys after she took out Sunfyre and slammed Vhagar because she should have retreated back to Dragonstone to give word that Kingslanding was weak or to get the others to take on Vhagar. I mean, she took out one dragon, but now your most experienced rider and dragon are lost for basically nothing. 2:05:04
Im so glad yall discussed this a little.
But to Gary's credit I agree with him that she was just tired and done with it all. So she took the suicidal risk to just maybe take Vhagar out. Making the march to Kingslanding far easier and shifting the tide of the war.
I felt worse for the dragon dying than Rhaenys...she was kind of a terrible character
No, she wasn't.
@@A_Final_Hit tell that to all the people she crushed...