STRANGE STONEHENGE #3 | Blick Mead - 5,000 years before the sarsen stones.
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- Опубликовано: 26 апр 2023
- Because we can, we're devoting a few shows to the lesser-known aspects of the Stonehenge landscape. In STRANGE STONEHENGE #3 we present an introduction to the magical site of BLICK MEAD.
(Also look out for The Coneybury Anomaly and The Wilsford Shaft).
It could be argued that without Blick Mead there would be no Stonehenge.
A bold conjecture indeed but we hope that after you’ve heard this discussion you’ll agree that this site - that predates the stone monument that a we know and love by thousands of years - is way more important to the whole Stonehenge landscape than many realise.
Let’s see if we can make the case.
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Springs that never freeze have always been significant, and sometimes magical. And it turns things PINK!
For obvious reasons, sites like Blick Mead (with an abundance of perpetually available water) have always had strong appeal to people living in the vicinity or those traveling through as hunter-gatherers. Blick Mead is indeed a “magical” site. An interesting parallel, although without some of Blick Mead’s special features (yet with its own set of highly attractive qualities) is the Gault Site in Central Texas, which is a perpetual source of water (even in drought conditions, which are not uncommon in the region) and where more-or-less continuous human activity has been going on for the past 16,000 years. While local culture never became as highly integrated over the centuries as in the Blick Mead - Stonehenge area, the Gault Site is fascinating because it evidences the variations that occurred in local cultures and ways of life in response to changing conditions - all revolving around water as THE essential element for any human society. There’s a good summary about the Gault Site on Wikipedia (if anyone’s interested), with many other professional resources also available online. Thank you gentlemen for another excellent review and discussion of a rather unknown, yet highly important, site.
I'm in the process of studying to become a landscape archaeologist, and Blick Mead is suuuper fascinating to me. Stonehenge smoneshmenge as far as my interest is concerned when it comes to the wider landscape. The potential of sedentary peoples in the mesolithic, and the shape of the landscape that forms almost a funnel or bottleneck for prey to be herded down and cornered as well as the unfreezing spring opens up a whole new way of thinking about the people who lived there. It's amazing and I wish there was more out and known about it, but maybe on the other hand I don't so I can come and work on it one day too.
An interesting point comparing stone age people; Some American Indians shared an area they called "the happy hunting grounds", located in the area of what is now Kentucky, (Which is what the word, Ken tuc he means), where few people lived but many tribes came at different times of the year, to hunt, usually for Winter or Spring food, including plant life and fish. This being a shared area, it was a "no war zone". I wonder of Salisbury Plain might have been like that?
I think they had swingers parties
I like it! Ritual sex and orgies were often part of gatherings, same as now.@@randomcomputer7248
I am very much in appreciation of you gentlemen! It’s a go to good day when I get to have a coffee and listen to all the fascinating things prehistory slowly reveals to us all.✌️💗🤘
“I don't know no more” was a perfect summation of so much of science, inviting us to keep looking.
I've driven by it many, many times in the past but never even knew it was there! And why is the spring at a constant temperature year-round? An interview with David Jacques would be greatly appreciated.
One site ! A lucky find, in that it hasn't been obscured by several millennia of Civilisation:- cultivation and building. When you think of how many springs and pools would have been settled from the Neolithic period onward there must be so many others that have been lost, obscured, destroyed, or perhaps just waiting to be discovered. I hope some more of these might be found now this one has been so publicly lauded, and public interest has been aroused. However, where I come from in Australia such sites are relatively common; perhaps given another few millennia the original inhabitants might have started building Henges. I have certainly seen stone arrangements of circles and corridors whilst working in remote desert areas. I wish there was more archaeological research on these sites with thousands of blades and microliths just sitting on the surface here near springs, waterholes and flint outcrops. Perhaps one day it will happen, but sadly now being in my 70s, I doubt that I will be around to see it. In the meantime, I enjoy being subscribed to channels such as yours!
When you are up to your elbows in aurochs, it's hard to remember you were here to clear the mead
sounds like the farside comic where the Cattle train is heading west and the cattle see the cattle skull in the desert where "they've never been"
Thanks for doing what you do lads ❤
Fascinating image at 14:02 So many signs of prior habitation right across the whole area.
Thanks for sharing again.
I don't know nothing either. And the more I know I don't know , the less, I'm afraid, I know anything at all. Now I'm confused.
I love learning anything I can about Blick Mead. Thank you for covering this again!
Were aurox migritory? Or have a pattern of behavior that would draw hunters from other areas during certain season?
Settlement is a strong word for that age. Turkey and the various ‘Tepe’ has challenged ideas about settled cultures in that time frame, but climate differences could make British equivalents difficult.
🌳🌳🌳Really interesting chat. Thoroughly enjoyed listening in today . Thankyou and I look forward to the next one . 🌳🌳🌲
Should have waited before jumping in ,you have answered my question
Always time well spent gentleman.
THANK U GUYS, SHARE WITH FAMILY AND FRIENDS
Thank you. Watching from Alaska.
Dear God you guys weren’t kidding about Aurochs being scary s.o.b.’s! They stood 6ft tall at the shoulder, weighed up to 3,300lbs and had 31” horns. Its size is like in between a modern bull and an elephant.
Thanks.
Those pre Celtic Cheddar WHG Group. Indeed an interesting part of the story.
Did they know if they ate the Eels at that time? The eels had to get to the waterways at sometime just wondering if they enjoyed them, maybe they transplanted them. Thank you as always Gentlemen hope you stay safe and healthy.
Fascinating again. Thanks chaps.
First time I've heard of this site, and it was a fascinating introduction: first I thought you were talking about an archeologist, whom I've never heard of, next I thought in might be an alcoholic beverage: evidence for which had turned up perhaps in Durington Walls.
LOL
A little bit of knowledge...
Imagine the strategic importance of constant temperature water during a hard winter!!!! Imagine its effect on personal hygiene and public health at the site. The inhabitants WOULD live longer, if they had year round access to water that did not kill you with hypothermia, after ten minutes.
Core sampling around the site to discover the extent of the archeology, is a must. I would not be surprised if you found that at some point it had been the equivalent of a neolithic city. The implications are staggering. You could be looking at one birthplace of trade. The water would have encouraged people to stay put, creating unsustainable pressure on local food sources, AND necessity to regulate the use of the water source. Trade for food would have been essential, so what did they have to trade? Evidence for quality leather goods would be hard to find. But where did all this flint come from??????
Sigh…
A little bit of knowledge…
yep better worded than my: "where's the potable drinking source"
What an interesting place! Enjoyed listening to your discussion, even though I'm a bit late to the mesolithic Blick Mead hunt!
Thank you for your work!
Thousands of years before Stonehenge, Guys - no connection other than proximity. Probably the distant ancestors of the builders or maybe not.
Have any of the remains been seasonably categorised, would be interested to see if it was seasonal or settled
Wow!
I used to devour books on Stonehenge when i was a child. It's great to be able to pull up various studies and theories now at the drop of a hat.
Sulis Minerva! A protein lover's paradise!
Really interesting subject, I'd never heard of this site! How recently did light skin evolve? For some reason I had it in my head that it'd be older than this site at least.
I'm not surprised they find bones from aurochs as well as lots of flint objects, including weapons and tools, in the area. I've got a feeling time is overdue to rethink the reasons why Stonehenge and quite a few other stone constructions all over the British isles (and elsewhere, too, not least in France...) were built. And why they look like they do. 👇👇👇
Firstly, I think I should emphasize that I'm no expert on this stuff. I'm an amateur (and sort of proud of it! ;)
Also, I think it's worthwhile keeping in mind we're talking about HUMONGOUS time spans of development and traffic here. When did the aurochs and human beings first step into the Salisbury Plain? If I've got it right, this is a part of Britain that was NOT covered by ice in either of the two last ice ages. I find it reasonable to believe ice ages and geology were significant for the first appearances of all kinds of beings...
I've got a feeling Stonehenge, as well as several other stone constructions, functioned as traps, sort of. Built on purpose to be able to lead big animals, mainly aurochs, one by one, into the stone circles. With hunters waiting behind each and every standing stone with their spears or bows and arrows. It would be an «all against one» situation, where even a big animal like the aurochs would be left no chance to survive. The hunters would have practically all the odds for survival on their side.
I think it is worthwhile noticing that the aurochs went exctinct in Britain supposedly 3000 years ago, while the last aurochs on the European mainland died in Poland, from natural causes, in year1627 (according to Wikipedia) How comes these magnificent, huge animals went extinct on the British isles millennia earlier? Perhaps because the hunting methods had become too effective + too little knowledge about sustainability (sort of like modern whaling "industry", bringing some whales almost to extinction due to «improved» equipments and techniques...)?
I find it reasonable to believe this also could explain the Stonehenge Cursus (and similar constructions elsewhere) Could they be remains of enclosures for keeping herds of animals, like aurochs, locked up («aurochs corrals»)? Eventually equipped with some kind of wooden fence on top, with similar function as «scaring sticks» found on melting glaciers in recent years, for instance in Norway, where I'm located (pardon my English, it's not my first language, as I'm sure appears...)
For info/ pics of 'scaring sticks', search 👉secretsoftheice scaring sticks the thin line
The Norwegian scaring sticks were supposedly mounted in lines, like fences, on the glaciers to lead herds of reindeer towards groups of hunters. Could herds of aurochs, and other big animals, be led in similar ways? I can't see why not. Provided use of bigger, more solid sticks, of course.
BTW: I believe this is the case even for some of the monuments in your fab Standing With Stones-documentary. Including the Dartmoor stone rows. I've got a feeling those rows were made to lead big animals from one location to another. But the stones, that still can be seen there, are «only» half of the constructions. The scaring sticks, or some other wooden attachments with similar functions, are long gone, of course.
Also, I believe nomadic hunters on the British isles may have had some kind of links to similar groups of hunter/ gatherers in Scandinavia at a very early stage. Even before Doggerland was engulfed by the North Sea. I think there is a fair chance those hunter/ gatherers followed their prey due to seasonal wanderings. Not only prey on land, but even sea animals.
Could even rock carvings, supposedly up to around 6000 years old, as far north as in Alta, not far away from North Cape - the northernmost tip of mainland Europe - be depicting enclosures built on similar purpose to those I suspect you can see the remains of at Salisbury? I believe they can, as one carving seem to depict an enclosure with animals in it (for info/ pics of the Alta rock carvings, search 👉 jiebmaluokta fangstgjerde)
I see no reason one way of herding/ hunting animals on the northern tip of Europe should NOT be known to contemporary people on the British isles as well. Perhaps that's even where it originated? And then «exported» up along the Norwegian coast in lighter versions, still based on same principles, throughout centuries and millennia? All the time being adapted to the locations by people moving further and further north?
I've got a feeling such connections may be linked even to rock carvings along the Norwegian coast line. I believe the petroglyphs may have served as communications between groups of hunter/ gatherers trafficing the coast, due to prey/ seasons. Pretty much like modern road signs informing current travellers, those rock carvings may have had the functions as reminders/ and/ or bearers of info for groups of hunter/ gatherers moving up along the coast at various times. The ocean being their «highway», the rivers their «side roads».
FYI, I'm not going to make this a thread about Norwegian rock carvings, of course not, but I do find it relevant here to bear in mind Norwegian petroglyphs tend to be chategorized into two main groups: 1. «Hunter's carvings» up north (the oldest ones) 2.«Agricultural carvings», which I suspect can be a somewhat misleading/ confusing term, partly because boats are (next to cup marks) their most numerous motifs. Those carvings are mainly located in the southern areas, and supposedly dates from Nordic bronze age.
I've got a feeling some people might claim I cannot prove my theories here? If so, they're right I cannot PROVE much of it. Except that logically my theories are probably more solid than several others! :)
For instance: Stonehenge + quite a few other monuments demanded HUMONGOUS amounts of time and efforts to create. Is it likely that people back then would have the time/ interest of putting all that time and efforts into anything else than increasing their supply of food? I don't think so. It seems to me sheer logic most of their time was for keeping up their supply of food. And probably also to increase it, due to population growth?
Please note; I'm NOT suggesting other current or former theories about Stonehenge are all wrong. Of course not. The monument and it's surroundings may e.g well have had one or more additional functions. For instance as a «calendar" or observatory of stars and stuff, to keep up with animals wanderings, growth seasons and other important events (mind recent research suggesting dots in European cave paintings served as "almanacs" for various animals' seasonal movements) I suspect people back then had great understanding and insight in nature. Including due to observing the movements of celestial objects. But I don't think they had to drag HUMONGOUS stones all the way from Wales to Salisbury to perform such a task (which I btw suspect may have had to do with tribes' ownership/ rights to Stonehenge and/ or the events taking place there and/ or the area in general, but that's a sheer speculation, of course...)
Besides, can anybody PROVE my theories here are wrong? Were they there back in the day, so that they can tell for sure? ;).
I think I'll leave it with that. At least for now...
Have a fab weekend! 🤓
Crikey! Will try and read through at the cafe later. Hitting the road today….
@@MikePole_the_kiwi Thanks, Mike! Excellent. Take care on the road!
Got any references for those ‘scaring sticks’? They sound intriguing….
@@MikePole_the_kiwi Good point. I've added searchwords - secretsoftheice scaring sticks the thin line - to the txt now. Thanks. 👍
So glad to have found this podcast. Fascinating stuff.
In times of plenty, Australian Aboriginals would break the leg of a kangaroo and keep it near a billabong until it was needed for food.
Re hunters not being local to Blick Mead, the Carleton Elk found in the Fylde in 1970, (N W Lancashire coastal plain, ) had been wounded 3 weeks before he died but also had fresh wounds from axes and had a barbed point embedded in his body that is similar to the famous point dredged up in the 1930s over Doggerland. As far as I know there is some possible evidence of small Mesolithic camps on the Pennine foothills about 20 miles inland. This suggests that the hunters were probably highly mobile as the Fylde, pre 18th century land drainage was low small drumlins and peat bogs so not hospitable for even semi permanent camp sites. There was a large kettle hole, (Marton Mere, nit the Cheshire one ) which covered an area about 1 x 6 miles less than an hours walk to the south. Now much reduced and part of a sssi. But again surrounded by peat bogs. (Hence the name of the local seaside town of Blackpool). All this suggests to this rank amateur that Mesolithic hunters probably covered many miles on their hunting trips. Some of that terrain being somewhat treacherous.
even today, bad shot? wounded deer will still instinctively head to a creek bed. loose your blood trail, follow the creeks
@@oddevents8395this one went into a dew pond. He was found about 150 metres down a slope from my parents house. A man was digging a trench for house foundations. The archaeologists were called in and took soil samples. Pollen from birch and hazel was found. They estimated 10,000 bce. I told my son about it when he was about 2 and he would say "poor elk" every time we walked past as he imagined it trying to escape. He was only young. 0:03
@Helena McGinty wow! i'm very new to all this. Got interested in it by accident now I'm here for personal reasons, lol. aka we've been lied to about our past big time. Hope he's cool with it now. Similar experience for a child, when one of mine was about 7, he shot his first squirrel, some intestine was poking out and his words were "why'd we do this again? it stuck with him a while but after cleaning them, fish and deer he's good now lol.
As usual your topic is enthralling and informative. As a retired Aussie teacher palaeontology and archeology have always been areas of interest. TT was a program I wish would come back but in longer format.
D'you know what I wish? I wish I knew what they called the place then. :)
Really really interesting. Love you guys. Not a challenge in any way, but a question .. Knap of Hower and Scara .. pre date stone henge by ? 700 years? That makes Stone henge look pretty primitive? Do you think? 700 is a long time? We should dig up more and find out more, we are delving to time where even geology is a part of the storey.
Inuit sometimes hunt moose by gut pew-pewing them with a small arrow and later the .22 caliber. You can retreat after and just watch that big dangerous beast from a distance till it starts to struggle and fade.
Poking an aurox in the leg would slow it but not make it less dangerous.
It all depends on the amount of available hunters. The Inuit thing is done alone, the families used to split into small groups at hunting camps. They don't have much help.
Heaps of flints means a rain of arrows. I wouldn't over-interpret the point in the leg as significant.
Or spears. I forget the year the bow was available.
Can we find out what Prof.David Jacques favourite biscuit is please. 😸😽😼😻
Was the whole area a tour/pilgrimage site? A camp? A round up?
What's the time stamp where you explain what it is besides a place with flint and bones?
I'm not sure in the age of McDonald's and ordering on line with one day delivery we can relate to 1000's of years of civilization.
There is a living relative of Cheddar man. Check him out.
How does this compare with Starr Carr in Yorkshire?
Do people in england ever go arrowhead hunting? I just found one in one of the springs on my dads ranch so im curious
Hi
No pics
The method used to define the appearance said that South Africans would be white.
I dont want to sound condescending here lads but I would imagine that if you dug a test pit along the banks or near the Avon ANYWHERE in this area you'd find some Mesolithic remains. The area has clrearly been used by humans for a very long time.
Further to this went there today. If one can delete the A303 from the landscape and imagine what it used to look like back then it gets very interesting.
No hunter is going to try to wound an animal in the foot to slow it down... A properly placed shot in the vital organs will slow it down even better if it doesn't kill it outright. I would say the bigger the animal is, the *less* you want to shoot it in the foot. A large slightly wounded animal is a very dangerous thing, especially at bow or spear hunting distances. Try that on a moose and you'd be a dead man.
My best guess is he was going for a kill shot and missed his optimal target.. Perhaps was able to track him down and dispatch him after that, or perhaps he was hunting with a friend and his buddy's arrow hit home and took it down.
you mean stone henge or what we call stone henge built in 1958 by 'archaeologists'? this is all conjecture
Oh for crying out loud! You mean in 1958 the archaeologists built the Stonehenge that is depicted in the 14th century Manuscript of Brut? The Stonehenge painted by Lucas de Heere in 1575? The Stonehenge painted by Constable in 1835? The Stonehenge painted by Turner in 1825ish? The Stonehenge drawn and painted repeatedly two centuries ago by William Blake? The Stonehenge engraved by William Stukely around the same time? Yes, of course the archaeologists built it in 1958 and created a whole load of art forgeries to add weight to their deception...
If only conspiracy theorists woulld just do a little research rather than spout other peoples' nonsense. A quick visit to the English Heritage website will give you the history of restorations (unless you think those are all lies as well). Yes, concrete was added beneath certain stones in some of those restorations, essentially to make sure that a 25 ton Sarsen wouldn't fall on visitors. R
first after 55 seconds.
Gypsy race. Rudston monolith
Cut the PC, your old enough to have some curage.
There is no proof whatsoever that Cheddar man was black. My understanding is that researchers only said he MAY have had a darker skin but that “a lighter complexion cannot be ruled out.” Apparently we are not even close to being able to determine skin colour from ancient remains. Also that was the only thing you showed a photo of. I would have liked to have seen the slate and flint artefacts or even the spring. The bust of Cheddar Man is merely an artist’s impression from the damaged skull, a previous reconstruction is as different from this as chalk is from cheese. Blue eyes don’t appear with black skin because dark eyes like dark skin, are there for sun protection.
probably relative to the Native Copper Colored Peoples of N.A. hit by disasters and rounded up in the Slave trade