Schiit Lyr+ Tube Hybrid Headphone Amp - Super versatile, super fun!
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- Опубликовано: 4 авг 2024
- Schiit Lyr+: www.schiit.com/products/lyr
This review of the Schiit Lyr+ looks at how it performs as a solid state amp, how it performs as a tube amp and then how it compares to other options like the Schiit Asgard 3, Jotunhiem 2 and Singxer SA-1. The video also contains some notes about tube rolling with the Lyr+ too.
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00:00 Introduction
01:39 Glamour video
02:38 Specs & features
04:27 Device tour
05:34 Volume control
09:07 Internal technology
11:22 Sound quality
13:41 Lyr+ vs Asgard 3
16:14 Lyr+ vs Jotunheim 2
21:36 Lyr+ vs Singxer SA-1
23:22 Lyr+ tube rolling
23:28 Psvane 6SN7
24:11 Cossor 6SN7
24:44 Sylvania 6SN7GTB (NOS)
25:39 Electro Harmonix 6SN7EH
27:08 Final conclusions
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#audiophile #audioreview #headphoneamp 
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Thanks for a very well-organized, articulate, and ultimately super-helpful review! Love your descriptions of sound qualities (in general) and in this case how they can shift using different tubes. Thank you for the service you bring to those of us who aren't able to listen to the equipment before we buy.
My pleasure! I'm so glad it was helpful. 🙂
Passion for Sound...
Your reviews seem straightforward and honest. Very thorough. STAY THAT WAY.
I certainly intend to. Glad you found it that way as it's always my intention :)
I have mine on order for 3 weeks with the bi-frost. I ordered mine without the tube and ordered ones from valves and more. So grateful for your review!!!
Glad I could help! You're in for a treat with that stack. Enjoy! 🙂🙂
Terrific review. Thanks for going the extra mile with comparisons that you KNEW people would ask and wonder about. Bravo. It definitely helps me plan my upgrade path.
So glad you liked it and that I could help! 🙂🙂
felicitations ⚡⚡🎊 mate I have a (Mystery Box) package for you, gist the above username for acknowledgment.🏆🏆🏆⚡
If you press and hold the gain switch for 4 seconds, you can switch from tube to solid state or vice versa. No need for the remote.
Yep. It's entirely possible to switch gain stage mode without the remote.
Clearly I didn't read the manual properly! Thanks both! 🙂🙂
love the blips! thank you for the review and happy new year to everyone here :-)
Glad you liked it! Happy New Year!!
I have the BF 2 and Asgard so this very thorough review was Extremely helpful. Thank you.
So glad it was helpful! Happy listening 🎧🙂
felicitations ⚡⚡🎊 mate I have a (Mystery Box) package for you, gist the above username for acknowledgment.🏆🏆🏆⚡
As always, astonished by your reviews. Thank you so much.
My pleasure! 🙂🙂
felicitations ⚡⚡🎊 mate I have a (Mystery Box) package for you, gist the above username for acknowledgment.🏆🏆🏆⚡
I have recently gotten a Lyr 3. I think it rocks! Cheers, Laughlin.
Glad you're enjoying it, R00s!
Incredible review as always Lachlan
Thank you! 🙂🙂
felicitations ⚡⚡🎊 mate I have a (Mystery Box) package for you, gist the above username for acknowledgment.🏆🏆🏆⚡🏆
Thanks for this review! I was always hoping you would review this amp and it's great to see it getting attention. Schiit really does a great job at basically every price point, don't they?
I completely agree that Schiit do a great job at producing great performance/value at each price level they play at. So glad you liked the review!
felicitations ⚡⚡🎊 mate I have a (Mystery Box) package for you, gist the above username for acknowledgment.🏆🏆🏆⚡🏆
Good thorough review as usual, thank you. Haha! there was a Schiit at the end 😅😅
Yes, I missed 2 apparently 🙂. Glad you liked the review!
I like the EH gold too, good value tube without having to go nuts with NOS. Top review! 👍 💥 😃
Glad you liked the review 🙂🙂
Great review Lachlan. Would love to see more tube rolling 🙂. My Lyr+ literally arrived this morning. So for any Australian friends out there thinking about buying direct from Schiit. I ordered on 5th Jan and it was delivered here in Perth on the 12th Jan. That was paying for Priority Post (which is US$140). I'm very impressed with the Schiit service (no pun intended).
Schiit are great like that. Congrats on the purchase! I have a couple of NOS tubes that just arrived so I'll probably do a little follow-up post of some sort soon. Hope you love your Lyr+ as much as I do
@@PassionforSound I'm listening to the Lyr+ with a Shuguang Treasure CV181-Z tube (US$70). Still burning in the tube, but it is sounding pretty gorgeous!
[Path: USB → SMSL M200 → Lyr+ → Hifiman Arya]
Thanks for the tip! I've got some Shuguang KT-88s in my 8200R and I love them so that's an interesting tube to me for sure
felicitations ⚡⚡🎊 mate I have a (Mystery Box) package for you, gist the above username for acknowledgment.🏆🏆🏆⚡
Very thorough review, thanks! I love the Lyr+ because of its versatility. It's many different sound signatures in one, a very good solid state amp with the speed and snappiness you'd expect, and a tube hybrid with tons and tons of 6SN7 options available. I'm a fan of stepped attenuators so that's also a plus, and the fact it's motorized and can be controlled via remote means I can lean back in my chair without ever having to sit up.
I had some very bad luck with mine though, and I had to send it back to Schiit twice for repair. I'm wondering if it's really sensitive to "dirty" power coming from the wall, but the jury's still out on that. I'll be adding a power conditioner to my setup just in case.
A couple important notes regarding inaccuracies in the review. As mentioned by another commenter, the gain stage mode can be switched without the remote by holding the gain button for four seconds. This is also mentioned in the manual. It takes about 20 seconds for the amp to cycle between the modes.
Jason Stoddard has also stated the tube is NOT hot pluggable. This was an idea he tried to implement, but couldn't get to work in the final product. So in my opinion it's not good that the review even suggests this is possible.
I didn't fact check what I heard about hot-swapping tubes because I would never recommend it. It's a shame that this idea has circulated enough that it got to me without me even seeking the info or being active on forums. I definitely recommend against people trying it!
That's a bummer about your bad luck! Hopefully the power conditioner helps solve the issue.
Really excellent review! I purchased this amp and you are right about giving it some break in. Does not need much to smooth out. I also got the gold pin EH tube, the cryo "Kevin's Stash" version from Upscale Audio. I like it much better than the Tungsol. More detailed and dimensional while at the same time smoother and more liquid.
As I was getting to know the Lyr +, I was not really able to stay in critical analytical mode listening. This amp easily puts me in a state where I am emotionally immersed in the music.
Glad you liked the review. I completely agree that this isn't a critical listening amp (in a good way) - it's too enjoyable 🙂
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Excellent review, you just saved me buying some cossors for my ENVY amp,I have just added some linlai WE300B replicas and was surprised by the sound improvement to my Envy...
So glad I could help. Yes, not much a fan of the Cossors!
You are spot on with the electro-harmonix tube. I was actually really disappointed with the lyr+ compared to the Asgard with the tube that shipped with it. But the new EH tube woke it up, lightened and clarified the sound, but still takes just enough edge off my BD 1770 pros that I can listen to them all day now without fatigue. Thanks for the recommendation!
That's great news! So glad I could help 🙂🙂
EH tubes are really worth it, I had gold pins and they really do a difference. Mullard tubes are still superior for my taste, especially as power tubes (many people focus on buffer but power also determine clarity and impact)
I think Schiit really takes the cake with their Lyr amps. As we've talked about on Discord, it can be a bit dry or textured (depending on where your preferences fall and what you listen to) but the ability to add a bit of tube flavor is sort of like some good honey in your tea. It just can really complete the experience vs. EQ, where I feel like EQ is more like.. changing the sound of the listening device you know? This is one of your better reviews imo in terms of your thoroughness and putting the amp into perspective. Really great sounding amp, will drive pretty much everything effortlessly (with the normal caveats), and looks pretty cool to boot.
Thanks Ninja!
What are the normal caveats? [the Dt880s, Susvara, Argons?]
@@harackmw for things like the Susvara, the Abyss products, and harder to drive planars (whatever they may be) you'd probably want to invest in the right amps. But a DT880 600ohm or the Argons are no issue whatsoever. I'd be curious to know how well they drive a DCA headphone like the Stealth or Expanse, I know the Noire liked the Lyr but I think the flagship DCAs are a level harder to drive.
@@dasninjastix Ah I see. For things like the A90 and schiit gear you see some reviewers claim that is as high as you need to go for power but when I have gone digging into more reviews and forums people complain they are still not driving many headphones properly. Hard to sus out what is actually the truth, especially when people complain that max ratings for amps are not necessarily going to be clean power, etc. They also feel like fired hazards with how hot they get. I kind of want an amp with enough power to not have to get so damn hot but be able to run my shit properly.
@@harackmw I'm no expert on the subject unfortunately, I try to play the price to performance game when it comes to source equipment and live within the confines of realistic expectations, plus I only have so much desk space for DACs and Amps. I agree with Passion for Sound that "power" isn't the end all be all, and that buying gear for the specs on paper is going to disappoint people because of the various synergies that exist between equipment. It's hard to gauge what to buy based on measurements, it's hard to gauge what to buy based on subject impressions and preference. That's just the way it is. For example, I would like to (at some point) acquire an amp whose primary characteristic is dense, heavy, hard hitting dynamics and depth over space. No idea how to source that. No idea if my DACs of choice (Mojo2 and EF400) are going to play nice enough for me to get the full extent of those characteristic I want or if I have to get a different DAC altogether. In the last couple of months I've taken the approach of not recommending anything to anyone because the more experience I accumulate the more I realize how frigging personal everyone's own listening experience is. I do think the Lyr is very capable amp for the price but it's all moot if you don't like its character. I do think it will sufficiently drive all but that upper 90% of headphones, but whether it'll play nice with your DAC or your headphones, it's so hard to say.
Great review, as always.
Thanks Robert!
felicitations ⚡⚡🎊 mate I have a (Mystery Box) package for you, gist the above username for acknowledgment.🏆🏆🏆⚡
I considered myself a solid state citizen and had my eye on the Jotenheim for two years. Snuck a pilgrimage to the Schittr store when visiting LA family this Xmas. A bit disappointed the Jot didn’t blow away my (from memory) feelings about my current Asgard 2 (class A SS). Then for kicks I listened to the Folk-whatever-name multi-tube limited production amp. Had to put ice on my chin since my jaw had dropped to the table. Same modest borrowed headphones (AKG K701 close cousins to my familiar Q701), same track, same Bifrost DAC. HUGE soundstage, detail without sacrificing bass, wow. I will never again make fun of spending such a sum on an amp. Not that I can. So I went to the Lyr. While not in that god-tier of performance I realized it delivers more of the qualities that feel, to me, like an upgrade over my Asgard and newly-acquired Nitsch Piety. So I’ll soon be a tube guy. And a subjectivist. Live and learn, fun hobby, eh?
That's great that you could try them all for yourself! The Folkvangr is definitely very special, isn't it!? The Lyr+ might not be as magic as the Vang, but it's more versatile and still wonderful, especially with a nice tube upgrade
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This was exactly the comparison I needed. I’ve been hemming and hawing because it doesn’t have a balanced out, so your comparison with the Jotunheim clinched it for me. Thanks!
So glad I could help!
The sounds you chose for censoring the "Schiit"s had me dying! 🤣
Glad you enjoyed it! Some people hated it 😂
Thanks Much! Passion for Sound
Always a pleasure
Another home run review! Of course my opinion differs on a few points subjectively. But, you are on point!
Thanks Tyson!
felicitations ⚡⚡🎊 mate I have a (Mystery Box) package for you, gist the above username for acknowledgment.🏆🏆🏆⚡🏆
i dont have a Lyr but i did get one of those gold pin 6SN7EH following your recommendation. using it in the gain section of my Eufonica otl . sounds great to my ears!
👍
So glad you're liking it!
Great review. I always like that your reviews cover, "Should you upgrade?" and "How does it compare at the price point to other products?"
I like to approach every review as a consumer/end user (which is what I ultimately am and why I do this - I love listening to music through the different bits of kit). I'm glad it's helpful. 🙂
I have a Lyr3 with AKG DAC, and an E50 with an assortment of properly burned in tubes, that drives my HE6SE v2. I'm not touching a thing. I'm completely satisfied each time I listen to music. Still I love watching the reviews
That's great that you've found your perfect chain! Thanks for still watching and commenting
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great review, I was expecting this one, hopefully soon I'll be able to order one, the Lyr + will definetely be my next headphone amp. Currently running a Bifrost 2 with a Dark Voice, the Lyr + will substitute the Dark Voice, and the DV will be for a pure analog rig.
I think you'll love the extra resolution and technical capabilities of the Lyr+. Enjoy!
@@PassionforSound I do think so too, thanks for your job.
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I also love that nos Sylvania gtb 6sn7. Works great in my otl amp for high impedance headphones . Also have a assortment of 6sn7 tubes from he, rca from the 40s and 50s haven't tried yet. Thanks!
Sounds like you've got some tube rolling fun to look forward to! 🙂
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Love the special sound effects - guess your toddler is responsible for that.🙂🙂
Haha. No, that was all me 😁
I used to use tung sol pre amp tubes on my Peavey 5150 they really help the midrange shine
felicitations ⚡⚡🎊 mate I have a (Mystery Box) package for you, gist the above username for acknowledgment.🏆🏆🏆⚡
Headphones are not my 1st choice for listening but having said that, I want the option.
My listening space is small but not near-field. (referring to speaker listening) and I am
quite interested in the new Schiit Aegir 2 - I anxiously await reviews. My preamp is decent
but it also needs replacing - ergo my keen interest in the Lyr +. This review has really
helped move me along the with the decision making process. I initially thought that the
Freya might be the best choice considering relevant reviews but other than cost - the Lyr
seems to be a better fit to my tastes. As well, the notion of tube rolling with just one tube
has obvious cost advantages - ego: more fun with less cost. (and the 6SN7's availability)
You have recently reviewed a 6SN7 made by Ray. Now, should I purchase the Lyr+ then
that tube will definitely by on my radar. Thank you so much for this informative review✅
I'm so glad I've been able to help. I think the Lyr+ with a Ray 6SN7 makes a lot of sense.
Thanks Lachlan
Thanks Heath!
Interesting review! My desktop setup involves an Asgard 3 and a Modius, and a Lyr/Bifrost sounds like a natural upgrade path. I've saved enough to go with a Lyr/Bifrost or a Burson Conductor 3XP. I fear the upgrade itch though. My Modi/Magni lasted about a year before I got the itch. The Asgard/Modius has made it about two years, but the itch is back. Not sure if I want to step one rung up the ladder or just grit my teeth and keep saving to climb up near the top with a Conductor 3XGT, GSX Mini / Yggdrasil, or something like that to hopefully keep the itch at bay for many years after.
That's a really good question you're asking yourself. I'm not sure what the best answer is, but both of your "endgame" ideas are excellent choices
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I have been thinking about pulling the trigger on this device for a while... this has sold me... thanks so much! Any idea how it might go with a Denafrips Ares II? I guess Ill find out soon enough either way ;-)
This should work fine with the Ares II. You might want to find a tube that's got a bit of extra bite to it to offset the softness of the Ares II. The stock tube will give you a good starting point still though
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Hello Lachlan…. very detailed review and I like in particularly your comparison with the Schiit HP amps & SA-1. And tube rolling discussions. This review of the Lry+ is a great companion to the RUclips review of the same item by Wave Theory.
I think however that there is an error in your discussion of the solid state portion of this amp’s design architecture. From what I can gleam on the manufacture’s webpage, the Lyr+is a discrete deign HP amp.
I may well have gotten that part wrong about the discrete vs integrated design. I don't remember where I got that from.
If and when I can hear the nuance in music I can't justify spending that kind of money. At least I get song recommendations to try and learn more about tubes!
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Thank you Lachlan and I’m a great fan of your awesome reviews. Currently I’m using Fiio K7 for my IEMs with iPad Pro to watch movies and listen to music. Want to upgrade from K7. For purely sound wise, which dac/amp combo do you recommend for around us$1000? Is the Mojo2 the best portable dac/amp sound wise? The IEMs I’m owning that are hardest to drive are the Fatfreq Maestro Mini and Unique Melody MEST II. Thank you in advance for your kind advice!
The Mojo 2 is pretty much unbeatable for that price I think. There are options like the Bifrost 2/64 and Jotunheim 2 that will probably be better, but they cost more and won't play well with IEMs like the Mojo 2 will.
@@PassionforSound Thank you so much Lachlan!!!👍👍👍
Hi Lachlan, got my Mojo 2 and WOW! Effect Audio Gaea IEM + Mojo 2 = total enjoyment. Million thanks again for your kind suggestion!🙏🙏🙏
Awesome! So glad you're enjoying it so much
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Any chance your going to review the xduoo ta-22? Curious about a lyr+ and ta-22 comparison
I don't have any current plans for the TA-22, but it's possible.
I've owned 2 Lyrs and liked their products but never loved them. I do eventually want try the Folkvangr as it's right there with the Cayin HA-3A which are both priced pretty competitively.
Sorry to hear the Lyrs never won you over. The Folkvangr is magic, but I don't know how it compares to the HA-3A
@@PassionforSound to clarify they weren’t bad but had a midfi sound to me. As my headphone collection got better and better they seemed to be the limiting items whereas the bifrost scaled. I ended up getting the quicksilver tube hp amp and auris ha2 se tube amp from there as well as some better solid states. For me the tube hybrid is not my preference so sticking full tube or full solid state. folkvangr is definitely on my list to try someday.
Ah, yeah. I totally agree with you that it's a mid-tier amp only. I'd recommend it up to about the $1000 headphone level (e.g. Anandas, Meze 109 Pro) and then I think it's worth going beyond Schiit's headphone amps to other brands
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This looks great! Could someone help with probably a silly question? I contacted Schiit about this and surprisingly just couldn’t get a straight answer😢
So if you were using the Lyr+ positioned between a preamp and power amp, could it be setup like this:
-Pre Out from the preamp into one of the Lyr inputs
-Pre Out out of Lyr to the power amp
-Then would toggling the Pre Out button on the front of the Lyr mean that you cut the audio to the power amp when you want to use headphones?
Or is it better to get an RCA ‘Y’ connector attached to the preamp , and simply run one cable to the Lyr and one to the power amp (meaning you’d have to switch the power amp off when using the headphones)?
Thanks all!
Your first option would definitely work. The only drawbacks I see are that you are complicating the signal path which can reduce the sound quality to your power amp and speakers. You'll also have to manage two volume controls, but that's not a big deal - just set one where you want it and then use the other for everything.
Excellent review. Does Lyr+ slam harder with or without tubes?
This would depend on the tube, but compared to the stock Tung-Sol tube provided by Schiit (connected to a BF2 OG) I found SS mode had a bit more mid-bass punch and slightly more thickness in that range. So for "fun" genres that don't need a lot of soundstage depth, I liked the SS mode more. I haven't had the chance to try other tubes yet.
@@PixelPipes Quite helpful. This tells me to stick with the Jotunheim 2.
I agree with PixelPipes. I also agree that the Jotunheim 2 is worth sticking with if you already own it - Lyr+ doesn't bring any additional slam
I know where you live, and I can procure an accordion or harmonica. My left ear demands revenge. Not so subtle threats aside, thanks for the video. The search continues.
Haha. Sorry about that one! Yes, the search continues. Hopefully I'll have a good recommendation soon, but not sure yet what it might be...
Hi Lachlan,
Ive got a question, i own Folkvangr paired with ZMF Atrium open.
Match made in heaven.
But im wanting a secondary amp, so am looking at Lyr+.
Im unsure if Lyr+ is any really better than Lyr3.
Also , will i find that im going to find either too far down in sound quality as to never use?
I know, big questions 😊😊😊
Hi Anna, I would personally not bother with the Lyr+ because it doesn't really offer any benefit over the Folkvangr with the Atriums. Unless you want it for a different reason (pre-amping, tube rolling, pure solid state mode, etc.) then I'd skip it and maybe look at something like the Geshelli Labs A3 Pro: bit.ly/GLA3Pro
Would it be worth a move to Lyr+ from a xDuoo TA-26? I'd like a smidge more control in output but don't want to lose the magic. I have a Shuguang Black Treasure CV181Z (6SN7 compatible) which I love to death at around 500 hours or more.
The only real benefit I see with the Lyr+ is the ability to drive lower impedance headphones and/or to run it without a tube sometimes. If neither of those are of interest then I'd stick to the TA-26.
A luck tester would be a very useful device indeed, whether in solid state or with tubes. 🙂
Ooh. That sounds like a very cool device
Hi Lachlan, I think the Lyr+ is discrete based on this description: Coherence ™ fully discrete, current-mode noninverting 6SN7/bipolar hybrid with constant transconductance output stage with Fusion Architecture™ depletion MOSFET gain fallback, 64-step relay ladder volume control
I don't know how hybrid amps work in general vs. solid state ones, but it's probably not as simple as Asgard 3 + a tube stage, so perhaps removing the tubes in the Lyr+ results in less layering than in the Asgard. Not sure if what I'm saying makes sense.
That makes total sense and you could well be right. I might have made an incorrect assumption on that one. Tubes generally do produce a greater sense of soundstage size and layering so maybe it's just that simple. Thanks for pointing out my oversight!
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How do you think the Lyr + would act as a preamp to the Burson Soloist > Bifrost 2 OG > KEK v2? Looking to add some tubbiness to my system. If it wouldn't be a good match, do you have a suggestion? Thank you for your time.
I think I'd be inclined to go for something more like the xDuoo TA-26 if you want tubeiness. The Lyr+ is pretty tame on tube flavour.
@@PassionforSound Thank you much
Hi passion so which amp sound as good or better at a lesser price ?
I have bitfrost 2/64 , powering zmf verite close . Lyr + price is out my range , so what is just as good or better ?
The Geshelli Labs A3 Pro is probably the best amp for a little less money
Thinking of getting this if my Vali 3 impresses. Schiit stacks don’t disappoint but I really want to explore tubes to play with my sound. Clear sound is getting a bit tiresome to me. I want a little more character we’ll see how it goes.
I'd be curious to hear how different the LYR+ Tube section sounds compared to the LYR3 which I own and like a lot
Me too! I've got patrons with the Lyr 3, but I've not tried it
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I wonder whether the LYR+ or the Jotunheim would fit better to a GRADO RS2X headphone with RMA Babyface MK1 as a DAC-input. I love mid-range, cymbals, and voice texture, live and classic music staging. I love tubes, too, but I don’t wiggle, juggle around, it should just work giving fun listening to all kinds of music, and best, don’t heat my desktop up at all.
Both are very good options. I'd think the Lyr+ might lean into the midrange and vocals a little more though so that might be the better choice for you.
What would be nice is to know how the lyr+ compares to your other tube amps. As this review was covering ss amps comparisons. It is hybrid ss and tube so I think it would make sense 🤔
The reason I didn't compare to any tube amps is because there's a wide gap between the price of the Lyr+ and anything else I have here so it wasn't going to be particularly helpful - the $1000+ tube amps will perform better and the
@@PassionforSound you make a very good point! thanks for the reply :)
My pleasure 🙂
May you try lyr+ with og empy? They said it has a great synergy with it.
I'm afraid that I don't own either of those anymore. Sorry!
so the impact of low end slam better on jot 2 than lyr with tube mode?
Jot 2 has a greater sense of bass punch
I never saw before that tennis ball type tubes 🙂
They're pretty funky, aren't they?
@@PassionforSound Yes,they are 🙂
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Will you review the Aune Flamingo in the future?
No current plans, but never say never 🙂
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Lachlan, how do you think this would pair with the DT 1990 Pro?
That would be a great match! You can tweak it further to your liking with the right tubes too
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So torn between buying the bifrost/lyr+ or d90se/ a90d that I don't think I can buy either one. I have no way of hearing any of them before purchase.
I might be able to help. Do you want an enjoyable and musically engaging system? Get the Schiit stack. Are you more focussed on neutrality and extracting every last tiny detail from the recording? Get the Topping stack. 🙂
Someone please tell me what is the best tube, anyone has tried aftermarket of course. I've heard that the better the tube, the more holographic the sound becomes. Please include where the tube can be bought and the price. Thanks for the help.
Tubes are hard to define as "best", but check these out: ruclips.net/video/AgN-YCasQJQ/видео.htmlsi=h_j8KSaZWZww3dJG
Lo recomiendas con hifiman he1000se??
The HE1000SE can sound better with a higher quality amp, but the Lyr+ will do fine with the HE1000SE
Chord dropped the price of the Mojo 2 to US$650. I have both and the Chord is my preference.
Do you mean you prefer to run your headphones straight from the Mojo 2 instead of going via the Lyr+?
Highly considering this to replace my JDS element, but I'm worried about your comments on the soundstage depth. Do you have any experience with the element and can comment on?
I have only reviewed one JDS product (I can't recall the model name, but it was the all-in-one with DAC and amp). The Element is built with integrated op-amps (not discrete) so the solid state mode of the Lyr+ will be comparable, but engaging the tube will definitely best the Element on soundstage depth based on my experiences with a bunch of similar amps.
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@@PassionforSound Thanks for replying! I would love comparison between this and the new Xduoo TA-22 if they're able to send you one.
I'll have to see what I can arrange, but the Lyr+ had to go home to Schiit.
Keep it up mate, your doing nothing but the best and your still improving by every video. Thanks to your videos I now have a Lyr and Modius, and now I'm search of my third headphone to pair with my LCD3 and Beyer T1.2
No review as a pre w/speakers? It does have a remote! Please do a follow up :D
I did use it as a pre, but there's really no point discussing the pre-amp performance separate from the headphone performance because the performance is the same so please transfer everything I said about headphones to listening with speakers.
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Did you wind up finding other tubes that worked well with the Lyr?
I didn't. My Lyr+ had to go back to Schiit. ☹️
Have you checked out the Apos Ray 6SN7 Select tubes? I reviewed them recently and they're brilliant! The higher level Reserve version are too.
Wave Theory covered them. @@PassionforSound
Yes, I saw. 🙂
Greatly prefer the Sylvania 6SN7GTB to the electro-harmonix 6SN7EH gold pin.
How does it compare to Burson Soloist? Is Soloist clearly superior? How do the low end and clarity in comparison? Thank you
I think the Soloist is a superior amp (it's also significantly more expensive). The Soloist is a discrete design and that tends to always give an edge to an amp when compared to an integrated op-amp design
@@PassionforSound Thank you!
@@PassionforSound Just a suggestion maybe you could do a roundup for what your favorite dac, amp, and combo unit in price brackets... Would be very helpful.
That's a great idea - thanks!
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Thanks for the careful review, but I have a huge question: if the Lyr+ ($650) and the Jotuheim ($400) are so close in performance, why the latter did not get a huge praise? I mean, the Lyr+ is ~60% more expensive and does not have the balanced inputs (which has better performance for *many* DACs) nor the convenience of a XLR output.
It's all about the versatility and tweakability of the Lyr+. Balanced inputs and outputs aren't particularly beneficial (despite what some people say) and having the tube rolling opportunity with the Lyr+ makes it perform like more than one amp.
Which sound is better Shiit lyr+ or Burson soloist 3x performance?
I'd personally take the Burson every time. Lyr+ has great versatility but lacks the resolution of the Lyr+
Thanks!
How does it compare to the Sparkos Gemini (at $300 more)?
I don't have the Lyr+ anymore to compare, but I think the Gemini is probably a little more resolving and way more versatile in terms of the tubes it can run. The Lyr+ is nice in that it can run fully solid state and the build quality and finish is significantly nicer.
@@PassionforSound ordered the I I ordered the Lyr+ w/tube and ordered a Waltham cryotube. Steve at Decware spoke very highly of these tubes, so we’ll see.
Hope you love it!
I'll bet that the Electro Harmonix tube with the regular pins (no gold plating) would sound just as good, and cost less?
No, they're actually constructed a bit differently internally, I believe. I've tried regular and gold pin variants in the past and they aren't identical tubes with some gold plating applied 🙂
@@PassionforSound Okay, maybe some of their tubes are different in addition to the gold plated pins? The Electro Harmonix 6922 tubes that I have used in my Audible Illusions Modulus preamps - which are *very* difficult to get tubes that are not microphonic - are the regular models. EH tubes in general are very robustly built, I think?
I've definitely had good luck with EH tubes. Most that I've tried seem to have a slightly thicker tonality than some other brands, but I tend to enjoy them
FWIW, the Tung-Sol tube that comes with the amp in my opinion doesn't work too well with Meze 109 Pro's. There's just too much mid-bass punch/bloom. SS mode is quite nice for those headphones. For HD600's I prefer the tube though. This is with USB to Bifrost 2/64 -> Lyr+. My previous setup was Chromecast Audio toslink to Modi Multibit (v1) and Valhalla 2 w/ JJ gold pin tubes for the gain stage to HD600's. Even though Lyr+ is clearly a better and more versatile amp, I'll need to confess that the relaxed presentation and the holographic soundstage of Valhalla 2 is something that I miss when listening to some of my favorite recordings.
That's interesting about the Valhalla - I've not yet heard one. I agree that the tubes can be a headphone-to-headphone thing though and what's best for one might not be best for all
@@PassionforSound Thanks for the tip re EH gold pin tube! I just ordered one for myself. Not too expensive at least here in Europe. 50€ including shipping from Banzai Music.
That's great news! I hope you like it as much as I do
@@PassionforSound This is a really wonderful tube! It pairs really well with Lyr+ and Meze 109 Pro's. At first I wasn't too impressed, but after few hours of burn-in the sound stage started to open up. Great recommendation, thank you so much!
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How does Valhalla 2 stack up against the Lyr+ and Jotunheim 2?
I haven't tried the Valhalla 2 to comment. Sorry.
Thanks for your response. Makes sense.
What would your recommendation be amongst these Schiit units and what would be a good headphone to pair for someone just venturing into headphones? I got a speaker based system that I enjoy. It has multiple Schiit units including a Bifrost 2.
Would love to get your thoughts on headphone setup. I can stretch my budget to 1.5-2k, though would be great if a good set up can be obtained for less so i can channel savings back to speakers lol😂
Are you starting from scratch or do you have some components already? What type of sound do you like? E.g. detailed, analytical, warm, bassy, etc.
@@PassionforSound i will start from scratch. Genre wise mostly classical and jazz from standards to more contemporary. Also, some electronic. I enjoy the immersive experience of a good soundstage and instrument separation. Soundwise, preferably neutral and detailed (not analytical or ear piercing highs), but if it had to lean onto one of warm or cold, i would prefer warm.
My choice of the Schiit gear as your source chain would be the Bifrost 2/64 and a Jotunheim 2. A Lyr+ might be a little better, but is also more expensive and will limit your headphone budget. The Geshelli A3 Pro is the best ultimate amp choice around the prices we're discussing, but not sure if you wanted to stay with Schiit and it's still going to stretch your budget a little.
As for headphones, I'd finish off this chain with one of these (in order of preference): 1) Meze 109 Pro, (2a) Sennheiser HD660 S2, (2b) Sivga SV023, (3) HiFiMan Ananda Nano (great headphone but leaning into brightness)
How does it work for Preamp?
The preamp output is directly comparable to the headphone output so what I've said here is transferrable for both outputs. Apologies if I forgot to clarify that transferability in the review.
@@PassionforSound Thank you sir! This is exactly what i needed to hear! Have a great day!
Glad I could help 🙂
I may have missed it, but I didn't hear anything about the inconvenient location of the power switch. Also, there is no pre out / hp out switch. I can't see how one can leave the phones in with the pre out engaged - surely a recipe for potential damage (if phones left plugged in) and unnecessary wear and tear on the jack and cord (if you remove phones when listening to speakers).
If only the design was a little more polished, I would give the Lyr + a shot as both a hp amp and pre.
The preout switch is the one to the left of the volume control. I didn't bother mentioning the power switch because we all know now that that's a Schiit thing that's here to stay even if we don't like it.
@Passion for Sound Thanks for replying. I meant that the switch only turns the pre out off and on but doesn't switch off the headphone out. I think this is a design flaw - why would one want to hear headphones and loudspeakers simultaneously?
I realised after I removed the notification that this was what you meant and you're right! It's a shame that you have to unplug your headphones if you don't want them playing at the same time as monitors/speakers. Not a deal breaker for me personally, but an output toggle for both would have been nice.
@@PassionforSound I agree. I hope they change this in future versions.
I like this dude, very odd you can’t say the name of the audio company
Yeah, there was a recent announcement that any foul language (including "sh1t") would result in demonetisation and a little channel like me needs every bit I can get!
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can this be used with turntable. Looking to build setup to hear LPs with headphones.
So long as you have a preamp for your turntable, it will be great!
@@PassionforSound Any suggestion out of Arya Stealth or Meze 109Pro or Sennheiser HD6xx/HD660SV2?
That's a very personal decision because the all sound quite different. The HD660S2 is great (review coming soon). I'd choose it over the HD6XX. The Arya Stealth and 109 Pro is a tougher question.
when I play a hybrid guitar amp that has a pre amp tube I notice little to no difference. Now all tube amp the sound is orgasmic both pre am and amp section. I guess in headphones it is different. would the Lyr sound good with the dt 1990 or the asgard 3 would be a better choice?
Yes, I don't know about hybrid guitar amps, but it's definitely different with the headphone amps because the tubes make a noticeable difference.
Both the Lyr+ and Asgard 3 will be great with the DT1990 so I'd base it on the tonality and qualities you're looking for based on the comparison in this review.
@@PassionforSound I always look at 3D sound stage and natural timbre where you can hear acoustical instruments the way they should be as well as good for editing music and good for rock metal and electronic music.
There is a new headphone coming on the 21st hd660s2 which has a V shape with extended sub bass and mid bass and slightly more highs which is making me a little confused why they chose to stay with the hd660 name and they will charge $600 for it. I think $600 is a lot to pay for a plastic headphone when we have the hifiman ananda and the dt 1990
I'll be reviewing them soonish so I'll be sure to compare to the Ananda Stealth and see what I hear...
You said Schiit at 10:17 uh oh hehehe
Yeah, I missed a couple I believe 😁
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So you do have to pull the tube to use the solid state?
No, you can just press a button on the remote or press and hold the gain button on the amp itself. The only thing is that the heater in the tube remains active even when not in use so if you plan to use the solid state mode for extended periods, you might want to remove the tube to prolong its life a little (but it's really not a big deal)
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I don't understand why if the line out is on the headphone output is also on. This seems like a bug, not a feature, and one I would find annoying listening to music and having the same music playing from my headphones next to my desk.
Yeah, that's a fair point that the preout probably should toggle the HP out. I just unplug the cans, but that can be a hassle if you're switching between speakers and cans regularly
Im a fan of your reviews, but in this one (as a constructive criticism) it would be better to at least share your experience on synergy and how it can drive different headphones of all type both dynamics (especially zmf stuff) and Planars especially power hungry ones. I guess this is very important for someone who watches headphone amps..
The question of synergy is actually a bit too subjective to cover as a reviewer because I might like the Lyr+ with a warmer headphone due to my personal preferences. That doesn't mean it's got definitively better synergy though, just that it's a pairing I like.
For all reviews, I do use a bunch of different headphones and will definitely comment if there's a pairing I find particularly good or bad, but if I don't flag anything specific it means it will drive anything well and then it comes down to what type of sound you're after personally. Some people like a lean headphone and a warm amp. Others like a warm headphone and a neutral amp, etc. so it's impossible for me to say what's a good/bad pairing unless there's a real standout
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A bleep was missed in the conclusion section ^.^
Yes, another around the 10-minute mark I think. I should be ok hopefully 🙂🙂
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Missed a "namebrand" at 10:20. Lol what RUclips loses their mind over.
You missed 29:06 lmao.
@@dangerzone007 Yup. I saw that, but I did not want to pile on. Oh, what language!!!
Love his content. Have separated from some greenbacks due to his advice; have not been disappointed.
Thanks for catching those, but once it's uploaded there's nothing I can do without replacing the video with a brand new one and then deleting this one.
I don't think RUclips will get too upset with me, but we'll see...
The word on 10:19 :P
Yeah, there were two I missed apparently 😁
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What's with all that sounds, man? :D
Just having some fun while preventing the RUclips bots from demonetising the video
Too bad there's no comparison to the previous version of the Lyr 3.
Yes. I would have liked to provide that if possible
Lol it's distracting but fun.
Yeah, had to make a slight trade-off to make it a bit more enjoyable 🙂
are there animal noises during the sound quality section [sounds like a cow at 12:27 then later a dog bark at 13:30 ] or am I becoming schizophrenic?
Yes, those are animal noises because this video was produced during a short period where RUclips went a bit extreme with their censorship approach to language such as Schiit. I explained it at the beginning of the video, but that would have been weird if you skipped to the sound quality chapter 😂
@@PassionforSound hahaha I was thinking the same thing
Could do what cheap audio man does and say something like “Skit” rather than the funny sounds which are a bit distracting.
I agree and with the added benefit of time saved during editing.
Yes, those stupid sound effects are incredibly juvenile and annoying.
Just trying to have a little fun. I won't do the same thing every time I do a Schiit review.
RUclips algorithm is out here making robots out of men
It's definitely a hungry beast with sometimes a specific appetite!
@@PassionforSound you’re not going to get eaten. Your content is too awesome. Thank you!
Thanks Rodney! 🙂🙂
youtube sucks; using it less & less and soon not at all
It's a double-edged sword. It's such a great place for independent creators like me to have a platform, but it would be cool if there were an easy alternative. I've considered uploading my videos onto Patreon, ad free and for just $1-2 per month, but I'm not sure people would discover them.
The problem with tubes is they add signal processing that the artist didn't intend.
Audio is highly subjective. There is no absolute rule.
Every component in any amp is adding some degree of filtering of the sound. Individually they might be inaudible, but it all adds up. The best option is to choose what you like as chasing what the artist intended is impossible. For starters, which artist? The musicians? The producer? The mastering engineer? Which master version? What gear did they use to listen to it and how did it sound to them as a result?
@@PassionforSound if the engineer wanted a tubey sound they could have added that in the mix.
I agree with this point if you like accuracy. It’s the same thing with videophiles that want accuracy of colors on televisions. You can go after approximate accuracy which I kinda do on both video and audio but I also understand the people that just want to do something they enjoy. Both are fine as no one is going to come to your house and give you an award for being an objectivist or subjectivist. But I agree with the main point about tubes.
@@dangerzone007 Harmonic distortion is nowadays added in the mix, if the engineer so chooses. But the engineer could also have left that decision to the listener. Not to speak of recordings that were mixed before modern DAW era. I think it's great that with Lyr+ it takes only ~20 seconds to switch between tube and the solid stage.
I bought a Singxer SA-1 and found it to be highly veiled, and not at all resolving or detailed. I sold it at a loss of $200. I don't trust any of these reviewers.
What were you coming from, Mark? I've tried the SA-1 vs lots of devices and, for the price, it's excellent as a discrete amp. It's not as analytical or aggressive as some integrated amps, but that's what makes it enjoyable to me and many others.
In the end, if you prefer something else, that's fine.
@@PassionforSound I was previously using a 20 year old Creek OBH-11 SE pure class A amp (which finally broke down) with Sennheiser phones, which was far superior to the SA-1. After I got the Singxer SA-1 and noticed the veiled sound, I compared it to the headphone outputs of several integrated amps I have and the SA-1 came up completely lacking in transparency. I did not try the capacitor bypass mod because almost all reviewers said it only made a minor difference, and I thought doing the mod would diminish the resale value if I decided to sell it (I did sell it).
I replaced it with a Schiit Magnius running in balanced mode, input and output. The Magnius is highly transparent and accurate.
If you don't like accurate components, you should listen to better quality recordings that are properly engineered.
@@PassionforSound Let me be clear (no pun intended) and amplify (no pun intended) my previous comments about the SA-1. The SA-1 has a highly veiled sound and lacks transparency, and is the music listening equivalent of having sex with a condom (it's not anything like the real thing).
I've owned the Magnius and SA-1, Mark. You're completely entitled to your preferences of course, but what you're talking about is a preference towards the edgy and forward sound that many integrated op-amps produce (this is what the Magnius uses). Discrete designs like the SA-1 produce more layering to the sound which means that all the details are forward and in a "wall of sound" type presentation. Personally, I prefer that, but I also know quite a lot of viewers who are drawn to the forwardness of the integrated op-amp designs.
@@PassionforSound It’s not forward and edgy, it is accuracy. Reviewers don’t base their opinion on listening, they base their evaluation on price and design. They are just a bunch of sheep.
Change the pronunciation to “Skite”. We’ll know who you’re talking about and you’ll keep your monetization.
It's all good. RUclips quickly changed the rules after this and we're back to normal 🙂
I have no doubt that Schiit products sounds great, but they look very simply and cheaply built.
You're not the first person to say that so you're not alone. I personally really like their designs and the simple approach of using consistent chassis and cases means they can keep the costs down and focus on putting the costs into the great internal designs and tech.
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