Still life painters of that period made extensive watercolour studies of reusable motifs (oysters, peeled lemons, etc) as references, the way we may use photos today. This helps explain how they could capture such perishable subjects in the slow medium of oil painting. Some of these references have survived but being on paper they are fragile and rarely shown.
I did see some of them in my research. Actually, I know museums and galleries are extra careful with watercolor paintings and some of those paintings did fade over time, but there are also a great number that have aged amazingly. I don't want people to think watercolor is as fleeting as it sometimes is implied to be. In fact, some watercolors from India and the Middle East dating back to the early centuries (created for manuscripts) are amazingly colorful. Just something to consider. But, yes, they did use that medium for studies. Here's a watercolor floral by Huysum: artsandculture.google.com/asset/flower-still-life-c-1734-jan-van-huysum/WQFkgRAXr3K-KQ And a fruit reference image: artsandculture.google.com/asset/the-summer-lodden-sept-1832-a-still-life-study-of-three-apples-james-sillett-1764-1840-british/OgHKUWBcc46i-g
Even though there were no photographies, the camera lucida and the camera obscura were available back then. You still had to have a live object for that, but you could use them to project an image into a surface (much like a modern projector). This allowed a higher level of detail that is not easy to reach with the naked eye. Of course, this is not to diminish the author's skill, which is great.
Few can afford (in time or money) that level of patience. Botanical artists are doing beautiful detailed work and I've seen highly detailed contemporary paintings that would make my head spin were I to try it.
1:07 It's especially great the way that Jan van Huysum guides the viewer's eye off to the distant horizon in the centre of the piece. There is a nearly-visible X that emanates from the corners towards the centre.
Thank you for showing us these wonderful paintings Jill. Such beautiful pieces and your right there would be few artists, in this busy world who would be able to devote this amount of time and energy to producing such a masterpiece
Time and patience- What an interesting subject Jill. Also, the mental energy to call upon must have been enormous. Whether it be art or music neither can be achieved without a considerable amount of mental energy. I take my hat off to such people !
Wow! I didn’t realize the process it took to paint these motifs. What a challenge it must have been to replace one item with another knowing that it’s impossible to be exactly the same. Jan’s work was magnificent before and knowing what I know now, even more incredible. Thanks again Jill. I never want your presentations to stop. Til next time
Jil, thanks so much for all the time, effort, knowledge and experience in this video and others. This is a wake up call for many of us who paint in layers. Absolutely impressive detailed work. I do have the patience but I usually worry about the amount of time I take to finish a painting. After watching the video I don’t feel too bad but admiration and great respect for the masters. It is breathtaking to see each area of the painting so detailed with absolute precision. Amazing. Blessings and take care.❤❤❤
Has any one else noticed the fly and the insects on the fruits and flowers? Amazing! Now l want to see these paintings in person to see the brushstrokes.
I saw it in person, and it's even more amazing looking at it in real life. Pictures do not do this painting justice. Also, it was very very very difficult to see brushstrokes. The painting surface looked so smooth.
In my point of view, for I paint in my free/spare time only, I can not even fathom to imagine having so much patience. I've turned from classical style after the very first half-size portrait to an impressionistic/expressionistic genre for the mere fact to finish a painting faster! Although in that I've found myself. Yet I also think this is dependending on temperament too. Giving it a second thought, some wise ones may after all have the patience. Thank you for the wonderful presentation!
In fact, I'm in the process of reworking my own painting process for the very same reason. Time. I bet there are many out there who could relate to your comment, Bobby.
I've been a professional pianist all my life. The question at the end of your video regarding patience and devotion to craft is applicable to my world.
That makes sense, actually. I find that there are a lot of commonalities between the visual and musical arts. You may not realize it, but music is very inspiring to most visual artists...
@@JillPoyerdFineArt Thank you for your response. As we both know, music has inspired many painters especially in the last hundred and fifty years. And, of course, was one of the foundations and ideas that underpinned abstract/non-objective work.
@@LockportDan My apologies if my response came across wrong. I often wonder if musicians know how important their work is to us, but you're clearly very informed. My mother was nearly a pianist. When I was young, my brother and I would sit under the piano (a grand) and listen to her play Chopin and some Rachmaninoff. Some of my favorite memories... Chopin still inspires me.
@@JillPoyerdFineArt No apologies necessary. My father was a concert pianist. I fell in love with the sound of the piano. Not music. That came later. I can't stop thinking about this glorious painting. Thank you!
I wondered how and from where the painters got their paint. I am amazed at the phenomenal level of detail in every object in the painting and the light, too. I cannot imagine, though, how they could paint without heat! Now, a well financed painter could afford someone to keep the fire going all day, I suppose, chop the wood, prepare meals, wash clothes, plant, maintain, and harvest a garden of vegetables and fruit ... ah ... but the rest of us do all that and go to a "job" and raise children!
Hola Jill!!!😀😀😀 Fue Hermoso Disfrutar de tus comentarios sobre está pintura haciéndonos notar la complejidad y el trabajo realizado en ese tiempo en particular. Muchísimas Gracias por tan Profundo y exacto análisis. Lo disfrutamos Muchísimo!!!!😀😀😀😀 Muchas Gracias!!!!❤❤❤
What an interesting video. And I can tell you that the major obstacle to my development as an artist is lack of patience. It t is a good thing it is just a hobby for me.
It was a very interesting video, thank you! I'm not sure modern artists are less patient, we are just expected to have new work to present much more often. Especially those of us who try to do art full time. Unfortunately we cannot afford to work months or years on just one piece.
It took time to allow applications to dry, camera obscura, and the use of mirrors to “map” observations on to a 2d screen where all available to a successful painter of this period in history. Such artists were highly trained daugehtsman, a skill when combined with such secret techniques yielded what we marvel at today as completely “free Hand” mastery in painting. It’s time we began to appreciate the magician’s genius rather than continue mythologizing Mastery.
Well, by using a mix of walnut oil in the layers with a drier and safflower oil, the dry time comes down to about a day before the walnut oil tacks up enough to go over once more. Walnut oil dries throughout its body, rather than forming a "skin down" like linseed oil, this is how modern oil painters of this subject matter speed their drying time without compromising quality. Grinding your own oil pigments also can have advantages because you can alter the allowances of pigment to oil ratios, and depending upon the pigment, this will speed dry times as well. These painting are not that thickly applied, so this alone speeds drying time, too, especially where walnut oil is concerned.
It's rare to have such a level of patience. It's kind of another talent to have. Especially glazing is something which needs to have both pre and post planning. I can't assume the speed of the time in individual life in those centuries , obviously still 24 hours in a day. But sometimes I feel the current century is really fast , tiresome. Even if someone is just walking , the surroundings make him feel ,"why aren't you running?"😅
Jill: do we have this level of patience and devotion to craft, today? Me: no 😴 😂😂. One could argue, though, that watercolour botanical artists do have such devotion. I refer fellow RUclipsrs to the works of Anna Mason, Billy Showell, Michael Lakin, and botanical books published by Kew Gardens and Search Press. I would be remiss not to mention the awfully beautiful book, Petal, by Adriana Picker.
Oh, that’s so true. I forgot about the many watercolor botanical artists today. I was thinking the answer was likely no, but maybe I’m not thinking broadly enough.
@@JillPoyerdFineArt I think I would have forgotten about them too if I wasn’t actively trying to get my hands on Petal. I saw flip throughs of that book here on RUclips and I just love the freshness and the detail in the Adriana’s paintings. I’m not sure what mediums she used, though. Having said all of the preceding, I do wonder if a oil-paint artists still work in thin transparent layers.
@@awatercolourist There are many that still do, but I I would guess that the majority (?) incorporate glazes with other application methods as opposed to building most of the painting through glazes. I have seen quite a few contemporary artists who do realistic, highly-glazed oils.
@@JillPoyerdFineArt Technology! I think technology, for the most part made/makes people LAZY and if I might add, STUPID! I refer you to the so called " Smartphone"!!💀😈😡And of course, the almost absolute rejection of God and the Knowledge of God!😇✌🏻
I disagree. I think we still do. I think the internet and capitalism makes it easy for us to come to the conclusion that such dedication to craft no longer exists today but lets not forget that unlike today, we don’t have access to nearly every painting/work of art that was made back then. There’s a reason these guys are referred to as “The masters”. Also the rise of modernity and subsequently postmodernity, brought about the shift to a more conceptual formulation of art, thus contemporary artist’s nowadays tend to dedicate their lives to expressing certain concepts or ideas rather than just representation which I think, isn’t so easily recognized as requiring such dedication.
I've actually seen some incredible contemporary paintings, but as good as they are they don't seem to have this level of complexity (and perhaps detail). Of course, maybe I just haven't seen it.
Still life painters of that period made extensive watercolour studies of reusable motifs (oysters, peeled lemons, etc) as references, the way we may use photos today. This helps explain how they could capture such perishable subjects in the slow medium of oil painting. Some of these references have survived but being on paper they are fragile and rarely shown.
I did see some of them in my research. Actually, I know museums and galleries are extra careful with watercolor paintings and some of those paintings did fade over time, but there are also a great number that have aged amazingly. I don't want people to think watercolor is as fleeting as it sometimes is implied to be. In fact, some watercolors from India and the Middle East dating back to the early centuries (created for manuscripts) are amazingly colorful. Just something to consider. But, yes, they did use that medium for studies.
Here's a watercolor floral by Huysum:
artsandculture.google.com/asset/flower-still-life-c-1734-jan-van-huysum/WQFkgRAXr3K-KQ
And a fruit reference image:
artsandculture.google.com/asset/the-summer-lodden-sept-1832-a-still-life-study-of-three-apples-james-sillett-1764-1840-british/OgHKUWBcc46i-g
Even though there were no photographies, the camera lucida and the camera obscura were available back then. You still had to have a live object for that, but you could use them to project an image into a surface (much like a modern projector). This allowed a higher level of detail that is not easy to reach with the naked eye.
Of course, this is not to diminish the author's skill, which is great.
Few can afford (in time or money) that level of patience. Botanical artists are doing beautiful detailed work and I've seen highly detailed contemporary paintings that would make my head spin were I to try it.
1:07 It's especially great the way that Jan van Huysum guides the viewer's eye off to the distant horizon in the centre of the piece.
There is a nearly-visible X that emanates from the corners towards the centre.
It's an incredible composition. I like your observations. I actually see an S-Shape, but I suppose I can see how you get an X.
Thank you for showing us these wonderful paintings Jill. Such beautiful pieces and your right there would be few artists, in this busy world who would be able to devote this amount of time and energy to producing such a masterpiece
I suspect most people are too busy, but maybe it will inspire us all to take a little more time, if possible?
Great point. I often wonder what we're all busy doing.
And why.
Time and patience- What an interesting subject Jill. Also, the mental energy to call upon must have been enormous. Whether it be art or music neither can be achieved without a considerable amount of mental energy. I take my hat off to such people !
Me, too. I used to have more patience than I do now, but it was never at that level. It's amazing. I bet we could train ourselves to be more patient.
Wow! I didn’t realize the process it took to paint these motifs. What a challenge it must have been to replace one item with another knowing that it’s impossible to be exactly the same. Jan’s work was magnificent before and knowing what I know now, even more incredible. Thanks again Jill. I never want your presentations to stop. Til next time
He is amazing, isn't he? Glad you enjoyed it, Liliana
The trick is to work at several paintings at the same time, I guess. Thank you for sharing.
Definitely it definitely helps if it takes you months or years to finish one painting work on 30 of them at a time
Jil, thanks so much for all the time, effort, knowledge and experience in this video and others. This is a wake up call for many of us who paint in layers. Absolutely impressive detailed work. I do have the patience but I usually worry about the amount of time I take to finish a painting. After watching the video I don’t feel too bad but admiration and great respect for the masters. It is breathtaking to see each area of the painting so detailed with absolute precision. Amazing. Blessings and take care.❤❤❤
I’m so glad you enjoyed it and have the patience needed in your own work. We need such patience in this time.
Has any one else noticed the fly and the insects on the fruits and flowers? Amazing! Now l want to see these paintings in person to see the brushstrokes.
I saw it in person, and it's even more amazing looking at it in real life. Pictures do not do this painting justice.
Also, it was very very very difficult to see brushstrokes. The painting surface looked so smooth.
@@boardcertifiable Lucky you 😄. Thanks for sharing!
In my point of view, for I paint in my free/spare time only, I can not even fathom to imagine having so much patience. I've turned from classical style after the very first half-size portrait to an impressionistic/expressionistic genre for the mere fact to finish a painting faster! Although in that I've found myself. Yet I also think this is dependending on temperament too. Giving it a second thought, some wise ones may after all have the patience. Thank you for the wonderful presentation!
In fact, I'm in the process of reworking my own painting process for the very same reason. Time. I bet there are many out there who could relate to your comment, Bobby.
I've been a professional pianist all my life. The question at the end of your video regarding patience and devotion to craft is applicable to my world.
That makes sense, actually. I find that there are a lot of commonalities between the visual and musical arts. You may not realize it, but music is very inspiring to most visual artists...
@@JillPoyerdFineArt Thank you for your response. As we both know, music has inspired many painters especially in the last hundred and fifty years. And, of course, was one of the foundations and ideas that underpinned abstract/non-objective work.
@@LockportDan My apologies if my response came across wrong. I often wonder if musicians know how important their work is to us, but you're clearly very informed. My mother was nearly a pianist. When I was young, my brother and I would sit under the piano (a grand) and listen to her play Chopin and some Rachmaninoff. Some of my favorite memories... Chopin still inspires me.
@@JillPoyerdFineArt No apologies necessary. My father was a concert pianist. I fell in love with the sound of the piano. Not music. That came later. I can't stop thinking about this glorious painting. Thank you!
Cant imagine the level of patience old masters had.. did they work on multiple paintings at a time
Isn't it incredible? Yes, they did usually have several paintings going at once (related to drying time, etc)
I very much enjoyed this excellent video!
I wondered how and from where the painters got their paint. I am amazed at the phenomenal level of detail in every object in the painting and the light, too. I cannot imagine, though, how they could paint without heat! Now, a well financed painter could afford someone to keep the fire going all day, I suppose, chop the wood, prepare meals, wash clothes, plant, maintain, and harvest a garden of vegetables and fruit ... ah ... but the rest of us do all that and go to a "job" and raise children!
Hola Jill!!!😀😀😀 Fue Hermoso Disfrutar de tus comentarios sobre está pintura haciéndonos notar la complejidad y el trabajo realizado en ese tiempo en particular. Muchísimas Gracias por tan Profundo y exacto análisis. Lo disfrutamos Muchísimo!!!!😀😀😀😀 Muchas Gracias!!!!❤❤❤
¡Me alegro de que te haya gustado, Víctor!
What an interesting video. And I can tell you that the major obstacle to my development as an artist is lack of patience. It t is a good thing it is just a hobby for me.
Oh, you're not alone. I think most people today suffer from that, but we can work on it perhaps. I know I'm trying to.
It was a very interesting video, thank you! I'm not sure modern artists are less patient, we are just expected to have new work to present much more often. Especially those of us who try to do art full time. Unfortunately we cannot afford to work months or years on just one piece.
That's a good point, Szilvia
Loved it
Thank you, Steve! Glad you enjoyed it
It took time to allow applications to dry, camera obscura, and the use of mirrors to “map” observations on to a 2d screen where all available to a successful painter of this period in history. Such artists were highly trained daugehtsman, a skill when combined with such secret techniques yielded what we marvel at today as completely “free Hand” mastery in painting. It’s time we began to appreciate the magician’s genius rather than continue mythologizing Mastery.
To answer your question , about time and devotion, I don’t see it in most art work Bering done now
Well, by using a mix of walnut oil in the layers with a drier and safflower oil, the dry time comes down to about a day before the walnut oil tacks up enough to go over once more. Walnut oil dries throughout its body, rather than forming a "skin down" like linseed oil, this is how modern oil painters of this subject matter speed their drying time without compromising quality. Grinding your own oil pigments also can have advantages because you can alter the allowances of pigment to oil ratios, and depending upon the pigment, this will speed dry times as well. These painting are not that thickly applied, so this alone speeds drying time, too, especially where walnut oil is concerned.
It's rare to have such a level of patience. It's kind of another talent to have. Especially glazing is something which needs to have both pre and post planning.
I can't assume the speed of the time in individual life in those centuries , obviously still 24 hours in a day. But sometimes I feel the current century is really fast , tiresome. Even if someone is just walking , the surroundings make him feel ,"why aren't you running?"😅
Well put, Nil. It does seem like a kind of talent, especially today.
Patience is scarce.
💛💛💛💛💛💛💛💛💛
Jill: do we have this level of patience and devotion to craft, today?
Me: no 😴
😂😂. One could argue, though, that watercolour botanical artists do have such devotion. I refer fellow RUclipsrs to the works of Anna Mason, Billy Showell, Michael Lakin, and botanical books published by Kew Gardens and Search Press. I would be remiss not to mention the awfully beautiful book, Petal, by Adriana Picker.
Oh, that’s so true. I forgot about the many watercolor botanical artists today. I was thinking the answer was likely no, but maybe I’m not thinking broadly enough.
@@JillPoyerdFineArt I think I would have forgotten about them too if I wasn’t actively trying to get my hands on Petal. I saw flip throughs of that book here on RUclips and I just love the freshness and the detail in the Adriana’s paintings. I’m not sure what mediums she used, though. Having said all of the preceding, I do wonder if a oil-paint artists still work in thin transparent layers.
@@awatercolourist There are many that still do, but I I would guess that the majority (?) incorporate glazes with other application methods as opposed to building most of the painting through glazes. I have seen quite a few contemporary artists who do realistic, highly-glazed oils.
@@JillPoyerdFineArt That’s interesting to know. Thanks 😊
I do
Answer to last question: Sadly, Very rarely!😭 If at all!
It IS hard these days, isn't it?
@@JillPoyerdFineArt Technology! I think technology, for the most part made/makes people LAZY and if I might add, STUPID! I refer you to the so called " Smartphone"!!💀😈😡And of course, the almost absolute rejection of God and the Knowledge of God!😇✌🏻
I disagree. I think we still do. I think the internet and capitalism makes it easy for us to come to the conclusion that such dedication to craft no longer exists today but lets not forget that unlike today, we don’t have access to nearly every painting/work of art that was made back then. There’s a reason these guys are referred to as “The masters”. Also the rise of modernity and subsequently postmodernity, brought about the shift to a more conceptual formulation of art, thus contemporary artist’s nowadays tend to dedicate their lives to expressing certain concepts or ideas rather than just representation which I think, isn’t so easily recognized as requiring such dedication.
@@shinijemi Points well taken!✌🏻But what IS art? Ha ha!🤪🤓👍🏻
@@seano1642 Lol… I don’t know.. All I know is, art rhymes with fart.
If you eat banana, you numba one brain big good banana. Love you Jill, My Sweet banana.
Pay Chant
First! 👋🏼
You're amazing!
Why, thank you 😂
I guess that's why today we have good painters , but not GREAT painters nor MASTERS
I've actually seen some incredible contemporary paintings, but as good as they are they don't seem to have this level of complexity (and perhaps detail). Of course, maybe I just haven't seen it.
nope. We are not patient. Everytinng I paint gets 3 hours of attention tops
Three hours is about my limit, too, Aleksey.
No, we mostly don't. I have the patience but the bills don't have ANY patience!
Ahh, well said. So true, Mark.