🌲Greetings!🌲if you need low cost tree protection, you can order Browse Blockers here: www.browseblocker.com/ get 10 free when you state you saw this on RUclips when you go to checkout.
This is awesome, I'm just getting started but was really struggling with the idea of using herbicide. This has given the confidence to go in a non herbicide direction, can't wait to watch the next videos and see how this plays out, thank you!
I love your plan, low till seems to be what I'm chasing to. Did buckwheat this year in sandy soil here in South Carolina but the drought kept it way back hopefully this year will be better
I agree with you that many food plotters are over-reliant on glyphosate, but I think that can apply to those who practice conventional tillage as well. I think we should all learn to live with some level of weeds and grasses in our food plots in order to reduce the use of chemical herbicides, but I don't think it needs to be framed as a till vs no-till issue. It looks like there's quite a bit of cool season grass in your buckwheat, so your tillage does not appear to completely eliminate weeds/grasses in your plots, but I applaud your effort to reduce herbicide use.
I appreciate your view on herbicide use in food plots and mostly share your thoughts on it. As far a no till goes in my opinion mechanical tillage of the soil while I believe it should be limited as much possible is more natural than herbicides. In nature there are many ways soil disturbance can happen such as burrowing animals, dense concentrated herds of large mammals, animals wallowing, scratching or rooting around, erosion from floods, uprooted trees from wind, landslides, volcanic explosions, etc. But syntheitic herbicides are pretty unnatural and probably more damaging to overall soil life than occasional tillage. I think soil life is adapted to occasional soil disturbance as it is a natural part of most ecosystems and a requirement in early successional habitats. I think especially if we are converting a perennial sod to a food plot then tillage is probably the best way to go especially for larger areas. On your previous video I commented about how I use black plastic to shade out and kill grass sod and I think this is potentially a better method for smaller plots especially if time is not an issue. But on larger areas tillage is probably the best bet. I really like your content so far. You have a new subscriber!
Thanks for the feedback. Really interesting topic here so it’s fun to discuss. I agree that there are often instances of significant disturbance that occur naturally. Ponder this- on my land here I have 20 acres. 2 of them are tilled and the rest are heavily vegetated and have been since the glaciers receded in this area. Thus, 18 of my 20 acres are in permanent “no till”. That’s a percentage I’m happy with. I think no-till could have profound benefits if adopted on the industrial agriculture level. But my 2 acres out of 20 aren’t hurting my soils overall.
@@northernforestwhitetail yeah I agree completely. If someone does any tillage at all it should be kept to a minimum. I think in the initial establishment of a plot to terminate sod and fallow meadow is probably what most people should limit their tillage to. Annual tillage is probably unnecessary and really does more damage than just during the establishment stage of a plot especially when you extrapolate it to the entire midwest with conventional agriculture. But yeah I think it's really cool these discussions of regen ag practices are combining with food plotting and wild game habitat restoration. I am deeply passionate about the subject if you haven't realized it already lol but it's good to find like mind's for sure.
Hell yeah, super helpful info here. I get my water from the mountain that I hunt. I don't want to even risk any contamination if I can help it. My great grandkids might appreciate it.
Great video n info on this heated topic .. I think utilizing herbicide to get a solid start on an new overgrown plot is OK but TRULY seems based on the facts n research the buckwheat crop or cereal rye in summer then the August no till or low till method for your Fall plot is possibly the most effective route to take !! Continued Success 😎
Well thought out video. I agree with your take on chemical use. I wish I could afford a drill and a crimper, but that isn't in the cards. Looking forward to seeing the results of your mow and seed approach to planting brassicas. Presently, I am also using the low-till method as well.
Thanks for the feedback. I am really liking this method. I uploaded a video this morning showing some of the results. My brassicas are coming in nearly weed-free and beautiful.
nice dude! I feel like I finally found someone whos thinking about this stuff like me... you have a lot more experience tho! this has really encouraged me to explore and develop more no till plots cheers!!
I can no till plant my corn fields . When it comes to my food plots I spray to kill everything off atleast 2 weeks prior and I till. It works great for me and I have great results
I can't plant buckwheat in the spring as the deer will destroy it. Same with brassicas in the Fall. So I'm stuck with planting winter rye which the deer do love around me. Rye will grow anywhere. So to build my soil doesn't really help much as I will always be planting Rye. Going to try a shallow till this year without glyphosate.
Sounds like you and I have a similar situation. It’s incredible- as I was getting ready to terminate my buckwheat this summer, I noticed the deer starting to pound it. By the time I went and mowed the buckwheat, 50% of it was nothing but a trunk of the plant. The deer were eating it off. I’m likely going to need to give my brassicas a layer of rye here as well to keep up with browse pressure
What I’m trying this year is broadcasting buckwheat into standing rye / wheat, then rolled that down. I don’t have a crimper so I then lightly disked that perpendicular once hoping to really kill the stems. That buckwheat germinated well but it’s been so dang dry we will see how it grows. Then I’ll broadcast brassicas etc into the buckwheat and give it the same roll / perpendicular disk treatment. Without a crimper that’s the best I can come up with… I think the dead rye and buckwheat is going to gobble nitrogen so this fall I’ll probably get more annual clovers into that overseed. I’m wondering if I did a pure brassica stand if a rye overseed early spring could work to use the same process. First year trying little to no herbicide and same for tilling, time will tell. You bring up good points though, it’s not simple.
I like your idea. Similar to what I’m doing only I plan to mow mine down instead of rolling it down. I’m hoping I get a better kill that way. I’m a little worried I’ll get volunteer buckwheat coming back up after I mow. So that’s why I’m doing a test area where I’ll till or disk it in. My plot is new this year so I have a lot of grass in my cover crop. Another reason why I want to disk/till after I terminate my cover crop. I hope you update me on how your method works out. I like the idea!
Yes I should’ve mowed part of it as a side by side experiment… but so far the thick flat rye has done it’s job, the buckwheat germinated and hit bone dry conditions… but the thatch layer had to help. Finally got an inch of rain yesterday. Next step is trying to get a good buckwheat termination. I’m pretty sure a light disking is one of the lesser soil sins, in your case.
I'm planning to set up a food plot in what is currently tall prairie grasses. Would it be possible to simply 1) spread seed, and then 2) weed whack these grasses and leave them in place? No tilling or other forms of turning the soil? I'd think the fallen grasses would work like mulch, and as such the seeds could germinate in that mulch.
The issue with that approach is that the existing root systems would not allow the new seeds to take and get started. You would need to spray the existing grasses in this case.
I've always strayed from using herbicides I never liked the idea of a chemical going into the soil yes I know they say it dissappears in the soil but that study about gly in human urine tells me it doesn't completely dissappear. I run my disks just enough to break the top soil then seed in clover and turnips. Its what works for me. Also I'm pretty sure my soil would destroy a no till drill and that wouldn't fit my budget. In the end plots that are killed off with gly are going to have more forage for deer and less weeds, but I just don't like the chemical part of it and I'll sacrifice for a few weeds.
Good commentary. I'm low/no chemical as well. Have you tried some crimson clover and grains in your brassica plot for more diversity and browse tollerance?
I haven’t yet, no. My fear with clover mixed in is that it allows those plants to establish. Clover has sturdy tap roots that may be difficult to remove later. My plan is to plant enough acreage of brassicas so that the deer can’t eat them off. I’ve got 1.6 acres of brassicas so I’m hopeful that will be enough. Have you successfully planted clover and grains and had it supplement your brassicas?
@@northernforestwhitetail Absolutely and the deer prefer crimson clover over brassica. They do like the tillage radish by me as well. Crimson gives you tremendous nitrogen credit for next year when it dies off. They do well together.
I want to say i applaud the fact you took the time to do your own research and reach your own conclusions regarding human and wildlife health. That being said I can't help but disagree. Back when i tilled/disced i only did it 1-2 times a year and never considered that (low-till) not many people are tilling 4 times for 4 different crops for food plots. A good no till program with minimal equipment doesn't mean you have to go heavy on spray either. I don't own a crimper. Once you get a weed seed bank under control with good cover crops and spraying as needed you only need to spray one time a year before the fall crop goes in. I like light brassicas with rye and annual clovers balansa or berseem. The following spring the brassicas are gone but the clover/rye is kicking butt until your summer plot is ready. Broadcast directly into it as the fall crop is dying because it ran it's life cycle and cultipack. Then in the fall again one spray to terminate the summer crop. We are talking 1 quart per acre or less glyphosate 41% which really means less than a pint of active chemical per acre. For comparison sake 1)1" rain is nearly 30,000 gallons of water on that same acre. For me this is minuscule compared to the crazy amounts put into food at the grocery store or restaurants. That is one reason i raise my own meat and grow my own garden as much as i possibly can consume. Good video but i still think the millions of worms and trillions of microbes you kill plowing would rather see a tiny bit of gly next time.
I think you bring up fair points. I’ve been trying to look for ways to use cover crops and roller crimping to keep weeds under control. And we are all at different stages of our journey in the search for the perfect food plot approach. There may come a day where I utilize a little glyphosate- until then I’ll keep working at it. Thanks for sharing
I am having a nice ghtmare of a time getting a no-till food plot to take route. I have burned through so much glyphosate during this process. I killed off all of the perennial grasses and broadcasted buckwheat, cereal rye, wheat, clover, you name it! Nothing has done well and it all gets overtaken by weeds and perennial grasses. I’m about to break down and till but I really don’t want to lol.
@@BustedLimbOutdoors I’ve heard of a lot of guys having worse than normal weed problems this summer. Might have been the cool and rainy June we had. Either way it’s a journey- I’ve been dabbling in till and no-till food plotting and learning their strengths and weaknesses. Good luck!
Grant Woods talks a lot about no tilling on his RUclips channel without using a lot of chemicals. So not all no till needs herbicides. He calls his area the proving grounds because of the results over the years. I have terrible heavy clay soil and I’m still trying to decide what method will work best for me. The crimping which terminates the plot and no tilling to build the soil makes a lot of sense but most likely will take years to get any benefits. Great video I appreciate your views.
Yeah I’ve watched a lot of his videos. And thanks I appreciate your take as well. I do notice though that Dr. Grant has the multi-culture food plots and there’s nothing wrong with that if that’s what you want. I’m looking for a way to grow a pure brassica plot without the other competing plants. But Dr. Grant Woods will have better soil than I will as a result. It’s all trade offs. Thanks for watching!
Glyphosate is pretty much illegal in whole Europe now in commercial use, (you have to get an education on herbicides, At least here in Sweden) it’s kills salamanders etc which I have a lot of on my lands. Like your thoughts about it 👍🏻 sounds healthy 👍🏻
Hey thanks for the note- great to hear from you folks in Sweden! My bloodline is mostly Swedish so that’s cool to get a message from you. Yeah if there is any way I can reduce or eliminate glyphosate, I’m going to go that route first.
whats your opinion when you can't till. There area I hunt was a strip job and it full of common grass, small trees and autumn olive trees. We have some cut throughs with bushhog in the fields but is so rocky you can't till. I want to get a no till food plot going but not sure how to get it started. any info would be greatly appreciated.
In my mind, you either need to use tillage or herbicide to start a food plot. If you can’t till it, then I would spray. If you don’t want to use herbicide (like me) then one option you could try is waiting until spring when the grasses are dead and use a disc to break up the ground. This would take many passes with the disc but it’s an option. Another option if you dont want to use consumer herbicide is to make your own herbicide. There are recipes online that use salt and vinegar. I’d make 100% sure those homemade recipes don’t linger in the soil before using them though. Do you have access to a disc setup? Also, how big is your plot? Another option is 40’ by 100’ sheets of black plastic. You can lay these on the ground and they will kill everything under them. The plastic option would work for smaller plots 1/3 acre or so depending on what your budget is.
@@northernforestwhitetail I dont have access for disk, they bascially put top soil with seeds over the rocks. I am looking at doing 3 different areas that are 1/4 acre or less. just something to get some different food in
@@terrycolley5506 you will need to get rid of the existing grasses/weeds somehow. If you have big tarps at home, I would use those. You can also go on Amazon and buy the big rolls of black plastic but they are kinda speedy right now. Weight them down with rocks in the spring and leave them for several weeks until you are ready to plant. In real rocky soil like you have, I’d recommend something like winter rye. It’s highly browse tolerant, it’s a very strong attraction to deer, and grows in almost any soil condition. Remember you will need to terminate it again the following year.
Definitely not running your video down I've done your method for years even the new way with mowing the buckwheat down but when I tried it the buckwheat grew back off the stems but did die on first frost. People say that glyphasate "roundup" is so bad and gets in our streams, rivers all that. So I found out that's not the spray that is doing it. It's the sprays that you need a license to purchase. This is what I did because I live to hunt and fish and leave the land and water better than I came. I took a cheese cloth and put a bunch of soil into it and kept dipping it in the water in my 25gal sprayer then added my roundup actually more then I use to burn my plots. I sprayed it right through my front yard "I was trying to prove a point to a friend and we drank allot more then 2 beers that day" and through a part of a old pasture then hooked up the wand and prayed allot of different weeds. Not 1 thing died. That was last year on a sunny day and it rained 2 days later so it should have killed everything. Not 1 thing died or even set back. Thank God Jeff Sturgis knew what he was talking about when he said don't fill your sprayer with pond water or creek water. Roundup does neutralize when it hits the soil. Like I said I'm not running your video down I actually liked it allot
Nice field!! Doesn't no till keep the soil " compacted " and compacted soil is not the best either( from my research) . The ground does need air/ oxygen to keep the micro- organisms and the plant life active and healthy.i believe in" moderation "( eg.- chemicals every 2 yrs,tilling every other year ), just have to do it wisely and checking your plant health on a regular basis.
Yeah the research folks say that tilling and disking creates a hard pan. I suppose those studies are being conducted in big ag settings. But then you have hobby farmers and food plotters that have the opposite results. I like your idea of moderation. I may find that if weeds become too problematic, I may have to spray at some point. Time will tell.
Actually there are very negative effects of glyphosate and your approach is much healthier. Low till sounds like a great compromise for your situation. Clearly your plants love it!
I wouldn't describe a multi species plot as "low quality". I believe it's superior to a monoculture of brassicas. Brassicas don't withstand browse pressure well, don't provide spring food, leaves bare ground susceptible to erosion and drying, etc, and must include field rotations to prevent disease. Too many cons for me. There's better options.
Have you had better success with intermingling plant species on your food plots? I would believe you if you said yes. I’ve had a hard time beating a straight brassica plot (one could argue that radish, rape, and turnip mix is a multi species plot too).
@@mattmorse sounds like a nice mix. I could see that having a lot of drawing power. Do you have issues with the clover wanting to take over the next year? Do you disc or spray lightly to keep it from taking the plot over?
@@northernforestwhitetail Yes. I establish perennial clovers that remain from year to year. I then interseed rye and radish annually into the clover. I do have weed and grass issues from time to time, so I spray glyphosate at half the normal rate once every year or two.
@@mattmorse To Northern Forest Whitetails and Matt Morse: For your consideration: Brassicas are heavy feeders of nitrogen. Legumes (including clovers fixate nitrogen) Brassicas should be rotated to prevent diseases and insect infestations Brassicas do NOT build associations with mycorrhizal fungi Fall overseeded rye and clovers will green up earlier in the Spring to feed deer coming out of Winter Any monoculture planting will not provide diversity needed for mycorrhizal fungi and other soil organisms needed for soil health Mowing clovers (especially perennials) will set them back in the Fall to assist Fall planted forage growth Living roots are imperative for soil health Monocultures can be planted in strips and then rotated Bonus: Last year, oats planted with buckwheat did well in our drought in sand ground
Almost since the inception of no-till spraying, just seeing a field of weeds and grass completely dead with not one piece of green in it after a spraying just made me say to myself, that just doesn't look right. Not sure how that can be "good". I come from an area that was thriving with wild pheasants when I started hunting. No-till farming started at the same time (early 70's). Within five years the pheasants were all but gone. Not one other thing changed in that time. Anecdotal? IDK....just know what I witnessed. "Roundup" is paying out a lot of money in lawsuits for a reason and that's a huge company with plenty of money for the best lawyers for fight for them. Just my thoughts.
Yep I totally agree. People use no-till practices to improve the environment. And I think there are some real benefits of no till that shouldn’t be discounted. But at the same time, if you are dumping liters of harmful chemicals on the ground each year, that is not helping the environment. It’s all a balance
First off, I comment your chemical free commitment, but no-till does not mean that you have to use "a ton of herbicide". Our food plot program is chemical free after an initial disturbance to remove the existing vegetation and you can start that off with tillage instead of herbicide. Second, why are you striving for a monoculture to begin with? The goal of a pure brassica plot is not sustainable with the soil demands and risk of plant disease that comes with repetitive monocultures. Every time you till, you are stirring up the seed bank and encouraging more grasses and weeds. In addition to that, any time you try to grow a monoculture, you are asking for weeds which are there to fix a problem with the soil (protecting bare ground or providing nutrients where deficient). Planting a diverse blend is the best practice for soil health, and soil health is what is responsible for plant nutrient density, and that is what creates attraction. Deer don't seek out brassicas specifically, they seek out nutrient density and palatability. On top of that, deer and other wildlife prefer diversity, so the "lower quality multi-species food plot" statement is a contradiction. A diverse food plot plant is not only more attractive, but is more consistently attractive as it provides various food options for deer on days that they might not seek out brassicas. www.TheUntamedAmbition.com/foodplots
Thanks for the comment. Your note about a diversity of plant species being the best thing for soil health is true and I don’t dispute that at all. You will note in my full video that I encourage folks to research Gabe Brown and other no-till growers. I think the soil health benefits they work for are great. The difference here is that my main goal with a food plot is not maximizing soil health. If it was, then I would not have a food plot. I would plant it into native grasses and pollinators and occasionally mob graze it. My #1 priority for my food plot is to create the most attractive fall food source possible. In my observations, the best way for me to do that is to plant brassica family plants. In some areas, perhaps a multi-culture of plants is more attractive than brassicas? That could very well be. Another thing I will add is that several folks have tried to convince me that there is a third option here for weed control and that is roller crimping a cover crop over top of my fall food. I’ve done significant research on that topic though. When you press folks on this, eventually they will sheepishly admit that they do use herbicide or tillage occasionally to control weeds. So I appreciate you noting that you must first set the weeds back somehow (herbicide or tillage) at least to begin with. I am actually going to try roller crimping this summer to see if I can make that work and effectively suppress weeds. Thank again for watching and the discussion.
I agree with your last sentence. And I tip my hat to those who can truly do No-Till. For reasons I describe in my video, I’m opting for a less-healthy soil approach in exchange for other benefits.
I always have to laugh at people who won't use herbicides on their food plots, and then buy all their grain-based products and vegetables, fresh, frozen, or canned from a supermarket. 🤣
![Food Plots Without Herbicide [Brassicas]](/img/1.gif)
🌲Greetings!🌲if you need low cost tree protection, you can order Browse Blockers here: www.browseblocker.com/ get 10 free when you state you saw this on RUclips when you go to checkout.
This is awesome, I'm just getting started but was really struggling with the idea of using herbicide. This has given the confidence to go in a non herbicide direction, can't wait to watch the next videos and see how this plays out, thank you!
@@ThatOutdoors you bet thanks for watching!
I love your plan, low till seems to be what I'm chasing to. Did buckwheat this year in sandy soil here in South Carolina but the drought kept it way back hopefully this year will be better
Yep I’m hoping for that to work again next year
Thank you. The evidence with regard to glyphosate is beyond conclusive. I too plan to use the low-till method on my new land.
@@_eimine_ it’s a good option honestly. I like to avoid the chemical
#MAHA@@northernforestwhitetail
I agree with you that many food plotters are over-reliant on glyphosate, but I think that can apply to those who practice conventional tillage as well. I think we should all learn to live with some level of weeds and grasses in our food plots in order to reduce the use of chemical herbicides, but I don't think it needs to be framed as a till vs no-till issue. It looks like there's quite a bit of cool season grass in your buckwheat, so your tillage does not appear to completely eliminate weeds/grasses in your plots, but I applaud your effort to reduce herbicide use.
I appreciate your view on herbicide use in food plots and mostly share your thoughts on it. As far a no till goes in my opinion mechanical tillage of the soil while I believe it should be limited as much possible is more natural than herbicides. In nature there are many ways soil disturbance can happen such as burrowing animals, dense concentrated herds of large mammals, animals wallowing, scratching or rooting around, erosion from floods, uprooted trees from wind, landslides, volcanic explosions, etc. But syntheitic herbicides are pretty unnatural and probably more damaging to overall soil life than occasional tillage. I think soil life is adapted to occasional soil disturbance as it is a natural part of most ecosystems and a requirement in early successional habitats. I think especially if we are converting a perennial sod to a food plot then tillage is probably the best way to go especially for larger areas. On your previous video I commented about how I use black plastic to shade out and kill grass sod and I think this is potentially a better method for smaller plots especially if time is not an issue. But on larger areas tillage is probably the best bet. I really like your content so far. You have a new subscriber!
Thanks for the feedback. Really interesting topic here so it’s fun to discuss. I agree that there are often instances of significant disturbance that occur naturally. Ponder this- on my land here I have 20 acres. 2 of them are tilled and the rest are heavily vegetated and have been since the glaciers receded in this area. Thus, 18 of my 20 acres are in permanent “no till”. That’s a percentage I’m happy with. I think no-till could have profound benefits if adopted on the industrial agriculture level. But my 2 acres out of 20 aren’t hurting my soils overall.
@@northernforestwhitetail yeah I agree completely. If someone does any tillage at all it should be kept to a minimum. I think in the initial establishment of a plot to terminate sod and fallow meadow is probably what most people should limit their tillage to. Annual tillage is probably unnecessary and really does more damage than just during the establishment stage of a plot especially when you extrapolate it to the entire midwest with conventional agriculture. But yeah I think it's really cool these discussions of regen ag practices are combining with food plotting and wild game habitat restoration. I am deeply passionate about the subject if you haven't realized it already lol but it's good to find like mind's for sure.
Hell yeah, super helpful info here. I get my water from the mountain that I hunt. I don't want to even risk any contamination if I can help it. My great grandkids might appreciate it.
Just seems like common sense if you ask me. Thanks for sharing
Great video n info on this heated topic .. I think utilizing herbicide to get a solid start on an new overgrown plot is OK but TRULY seems based on the facts n research the buckwheat crop or cereal rye in summer then the August no till or low till method for your Fall plot is possibly the most effective route to take !! Continued Success 😎
Thanks!
Well thought out video. I agree with your take on chemical use. I wish I could afford a drill and a crimper, but that isn't in the cards.
Looking forward to seeing the results of your mow and seed approach to planting brassicas.
Presently, I am also using the low-till method as well.
Thanks for the feedback. I am really liking this method. I uploaded a video this morning showing some of the results. My brassicas are coming in nearly weed-free and beautiful.
nice dude! I feel like I finally found someone whos thinking about this stuff like me... you have a lot more experience tho! this has really encouraged me to explore and develop more no till plots cheers!!
Thanks and good luck this fall
I do it just like you do it! No chemicals! Great video!
It’s the way to go if you can make it work
I can no till plant my corn fields . When it comes to my food plots I spray to kill everything off atleast 2 weeks prior and I till. It works great for me and I have great results
@@sandych33ks1 it’s a great system- nothing wrong with it
I can't plant buckwheat in the spring as the deer will destroy it. Same with brassicas in the Fall. So I'm stuck with planting winter rye which the deer do love around me. Rye will grow anywhere. So to build my soil doesn't really help much as I will always be planting Rye. Going to try a shallow till this year without glyphosate.
Sounds like you and I have a similar situation. It’s incredible- as I was getting ready to terminate my buckwheat this summer, I noticed the deer starting to pound it. By the time I went and mowed the buckwheat, 50% of it was nothing but a trunk of the plant. The deer were eating it off. I’m likely going to need to give my brassicas a layer of rye here as well to keep up with browse pressure
Try a more diverse mix with sorghums added
We do have a soil builder that works in that situation.
What I’m trying this year is broadcasting buckwheat into standing rye / wheat, then rolled that down. I don’t have a crimper so I then lightly disked that perpendicular once hoping to really kill the stems. That buckwheat germinated well but it’s been so dang dry we will see how it grows. Then I’ll broadcast brassicas etc into the buckwheat and give it the same roll / perpendicular disk treatment. Without a crimper that’s the best I can come up with… I think the dead rye and buckwheat is going to gobble nitrogen so this fall I’ll probably get more annual clovers into that overseed. I’m wondering if I did a pure brassica stand if a rye overseed early spring could work to use the same process. First year trying little to no herbicide and same for tilling, time will tell. You bring up good points though, it’s not simple.
I like your idea. Similar to what I’m doing only I plan to mow mine down instead of rolling it down. I’m hoping I get a better kill that way. I’m a little worried I’ll get volunteer buckwheat coming back up after I mow. So that’s why I’m doing a test area where I’ll till or disk it in. My plot is new this year so I have a lot of grass in my cover crop. Another reason why I want to disk/till after I terminate my cover crop. I hope you update me on how your method works out. I like the idea!
Yes I should’ve mowed part of it as a side by side experiment… but so far the thick flat rye has done it’s job, the buckwheat germinated and hit bone dry conditions… but the thatch layer had to help. Finally got an inch of rain yesterday. Next step is trying to get a good buckwheat termination. I’m pretty sure a light disking is one of the lesser soil sins, in your case.
Spring planted rye will not vernalize.
I'm planning to set up a food plot in what is currently tall prairie grasses. Would it be possible to simply 1) spread seed, and then 2) weed whack these grasses and leave them in place? No tilling or other forms of turning the soil? I'd think the fallen grasses would work like mulch, and as such the seeds could germinate in that mulch.
The issue with that approach is that the existing root systems would not allow the new seeds to take and get started. You would need to spray the existing grasses in this case.
I've always strayed from using herbicides I never liked the idea of a chemical going into the soil yes I know they say it dissappears in the soil but that study about gly in human urine tells me it doesn't completely dissappear. I run my disks just enough to break the top soil then seed in clover and turnips. Its what works for me. Also I'm pretty sure my soil would destroy a no till drill and that wouldn't fit my budget. In the end plots that are killed off with gly are going to have more forage for deer and less weeds, but I just don't like the chemical part of it and I'll sacrifice for a few weeds.
I’m right there with ya. I like your system. And yeah the no-till drill is not in my budget
Good commentary. I'm low/no chemical as well. Have you tried some crimson clover and grains in your brassica plot for more diversity and browse tollerance?
I haven’t yet, no. My fear with clover mixed in is that it allows those plants to establish. Clover has sturdy tap roots that may be difficult to remove later. My plan is to plant enough acreage of brassicas so that the deer can’t eat them off. I’ve got 1.6 acres of brassicas so I’m hopeful that will be enough. Have you successfully planted clover and grains and had it supplement your brassicas?
@@northernforestwhitetail Absolutely and the deer prefer crimson clover over brassica. They do like the tillage radish by me as well. Crimson gives you tremendous nitrogen credit for next year when it dies off. They do well together.
Clover 🍀 is easy to eliminate if you just mow close just before they seed
I want to say i applaud the fact you took the time to do your own research and reach your own conclusions regarding human and wildlife health.
That being said I can't help but disagree. Back when i tilled/disced i only did it 1-2 times a year and never considered that (low-till) not many people are tilling 4 times for 4 different crops for food plots. A good no till program with minimal equipment doesn't mean you have to go heavy on spray either. I don't own a crimper. Once you get a weed seed bank under control with good cover crops and spraying as needed you only need to spray one time a year before the fall crop goes in. I like light brassicas with rye and annual clovers balansa or berseem. The following spring the brassicas are gone but the clover/rye is kicking butt until your summer plot is ready. Broadcast directly into it as the fall crop is dying because it ran it's life cycle and cultipack. Then in the fall again one spray to terminate the summer crop. We are talking 1 quart per acre or less glyphosate 41% which really means less than a pint of active chemical per acre. For comparison sake 1)1" rain is nearly 30,000 gallons of water on that same acre. For me this is minuscule compared to the crazy amounts put into food at the grocery store or restaurants. That is one reason i raise my own meat and grow my own garden as much as i possibly can consume. Good video but i still think the millions of worms and trillions of microbes you kill plowing would rather see a tiny bit of gly next time.
I think you bring up fair points. I’ve been trying to look for ways to use cover crops and roller crimping to keep weeds under control. And we are all at different stages of our journey in the search for the perfect food plot approach. There may come a day where I utilize a little glyphosate- until then I’ll keep working at it. Thanks for sharing
I am having a nice ghtmare of a time getting a no-till food plot to take route.
I have burned through so much glyphosate during this process.
I killed off all of the perennial grasses and broadcasted buckwheat, cereal rye, wheat, clover, you name it! Nothing has done well and it all gets overtaken by weeds and perennial grasses. I’m about to break down and till but I really don’t want to lol.
@@BustedLimbOutdoors I’ve heard of a lot of guys having worse than normal weed problems this summer. Might have been the cool and rainy June we had. Either way it’s a journey- I’ve been dabbling in till and no-till food plotting and learning their strengths and weaknesses. Good luck!
Grant Woods talks a lot about no tilling on his RUclips channel without using a lot of chemicals. So not all no till needs herbicides. He calls his area the proving grounds because of the results over the years. I have terrible heavy clay soil and I’m still trying to decide what method will work best for me. The crimping which terminates the plot and no tilling to build the soil makes a lot of sense but most likely will take years to get any benefits. Great video I appreciate your views.
Yeah I’ve watched a lot of his videos. And thanks I appreciate your take as well. I do notice though that Dr. Grant has the multi-culture food plots and there’s nothing wrong with that if that’s what you want. I’m looking for a way to grow a pure brassica plot without the other competing plants. But Dr. Grant Woods will have better soil than I will as a result. It’s all trade offs. Thanks for watching!
Newsflash - Grant Woods uses herbicides. He just doesn't show it on his channel.
@@danmartin9850 he mentions it quite alot in plot videos thou
Correct.
Refreshing video .
Thank you!
Glyphosate is pretty much illegal in whole Europe now in commercial use, (you have to get an education on herbicides,
At least here in Sweden) it’s kills salamanders etc which I have a lot of on my lands. Like your thoughts about it 👍🏻 sounds healthy 👍🏻
Hey thanks for the note- great to hear from you folks in Sweden! My bloodline is mostly Swedish so that’s cool to get a message from you. Yeah if there is any way I can reduce or eliminate glyphosate, I’m going to go that route first.
@@northernforestwhitetail cool I’ve got relatives in Minnesota so I have bloodline overs there to 😆
@@JCGCarlsson that’s awesome
whats your opinion when you can't till. There area I hunt was a strip job and it full of common grass, small trees and autumn olive trees. We have some cut throughs with bushhog in the fields but is so rocky you can't till. I want to get a no till food plot going but not sure how to get it started. any info would be greatly appreciated.
In my mind, you either need to use tillage or herbicide to start a food plot. If you can’t till it, then I would spray. If you don’t want to use herbicide (like me) then one option you could try is waiting until spring when the grasses are dead and use a disc to break up the ground. This would take many passes with the disc but it’s an option. Another option if you dont want to use consumer herbicide is to make your own herbicide. There are recipes online that use salt and vinegar. I’d make 100% sure those homemade recipes don’t linger in the soil before using them though. Do you have access to a disc setup? Also, how big is your plot? Another option is 40’ by 100’ sheets of black plastic. You can lay these on the ground and they will kill everything under them. The plastic option would work for smaller plots 1/3 acre or so depending on what your budget is.
@@northernforestwhitetail I dont have access for disk, they bascially put top soil with seeds over the rocks. I am looking at doing 3 different areas that are 1/4 acre or less. just something to get some different food in
@@terrycolley5506 you will need to get rid of the existing grasses/weeds somehow. If you have big tarps at home, I would use those. You can also go on Amazon and buy the big rolls of black plastic but they are kinda speedy right now. Weight them down with rocks in the spring and leave them for several weeks until you are ready to plant. In real rocky soil like you have, I’d recommend something like winter rye. It’s highly browse tolerant, it’s a very strong attraction to deer, and grows in almost any soil condition. Remember you will need to terminate it again the following year.
Definitely not running your video down I've done your method for years even the new way with mowing the buckwheat down but when I tried it the buckwheat grew back off the stems but did die on first frost.
People say that glyphasate "roundup" is so bad and gets in our streams, rivers all that. So I found out that's not the spray that is doing it. It's the sprays that you need a license to purchase. This is what I did because I live to hunt and fish and leave the land and water better than I came. I took a cheese cloth and put a bunch of soil into it and kept dipping it in the water in my 25gal sprayer then added my roundup actually more then I use to burn my plots. I sprayed it right through my front yard "I was trying to prove a point to a friend and we drank allot more then 2 beers that day" and through a part of a old pasture then hooked up the wand and prayed allot of different weeds. Not 1 thing died. That was last year on a sunny day and it rained 2 days later so it should have killed everything. Not 1 thing died or even set back. Thank God Jeff Sturgis knew what he was talking about when he said don't fill your sprayer with pond water or creek water. Roundup does neutralize when it hits the soil. Like I said I'm not running your video down I actually liked it allot
Thanks for the feedback and I appreciate you watching!
Nice field!! Doesn't no till keep the soil " compacted " and compacted soil is not the best either( from my research) . The ground does need air/ oxygen to keep the micro- organisms and the plant life active and healthy.i believe in" moderation "( eg.- chemicals every 2 yrs,tilling every other year ), just have to do it wisely and checking your plant health on a regular basis.
Yeah the research folks say that tilling and disking creates a hard pan. I suppose those studies are being conducted in big ag settings. But then you have hobby farmers and food plotters that have the opposite results. I like your idea of moderation. I may find that if weeds become too problematic, I may have to spray at some point. Time will tell.
Actually there are very negative effects of glyphosate and your approach is much healthier. Low till sounds like a great compromise for your situation. Clearly your plants love it!
Agreed- thanks for sharing
I wouldn't describe a multi species plot as "low quality". I believe it's superior to a monoculture of brassicas. Brassicas don't withstand browse pressure well, don't provide spring food, leaves bare ground susceptible to erosion and drying, etc, and must include field rotations to prevent disease. Too many cons for me. There's better options.
Have you had better success with intermingling plant species on your food plots? I would believe you if you said yes. I’ve had a hard time beating a straight brassica plot (one could argue that radish, rape, and turnip mix is a multi species plot too).
Yes. I plant clover, rye and radish together without any of the drawbacks of a brassica monoculture. I also use very little glyphosate.
@@mattmorse sounds like a nice mix. I could see that having a lot of drawing power. Do you have issues with the clover wanting to take over the next year? Do you disc or spray lightly to keep it from taking the plot over?
@@northernforestwhitetail Yes. I establish perennial clovers that remain from year to year. I then interseed rye and radish annually into the clover. I do have weed and grass issues from time to time, so I spray glyphosate at half the normal rate once every year or two.
@@mattmorse To Northern Forest Whitetails and Matt Morse:
For your consideration:
Brassicas are heavy feeders of nitrogen.
Legumes (including clovers fixate nitrogen)
Brassicas should be rotated to prevent diseases and insect infestations
Brassicas do NOT build associations with mycorrhizal fungi
Fall overseeded rye and clovers will green up earlier in the Spring to feed deer coming out of Winter
Any monoculture planting will not provide diversity needed for mycorrhizal fungi and other soil organisms needed for soil health
Mowing clovers (especially perennials) will set them back in the Fall to assist Fall planted forage growth
Living roots are imperative for soil health
Monocultures can be planted in strips and then rotated
Bonus: Last year, oats planted with buckwheat did well in our drought in sand ground
Almost since the inception of no-till spraying, just seeing a field of weeds and grass completely dead with not one piece of green in it after a spraying just made me say to myself, that just doesn't look right. Not sure how that can be "good".
I come from an area that was thriving with wild pheasants when I started hunting. No-till farming started at the same time (early 70's). Within five years the pheasants were all but gone. Not one other thing changed in that time. Anecdotal? IDK....just know what I witnessed.
"Roundup" is paying out a lot of money in lawsuits for a reason and that's a huge company with plenty of money for the best lawyers for fight for them.
Just my thoughts.
Yep I totally agree. People use no-till practices to improve the environment. And I think there are some real benefits of no till that shouldn’t be discounted. But at the same time, if you are dumping liters of harmful chemicals on the ground each year, that is not helping the environment. It’s all a balance
First off, I comment your chemical free commitment, but no-till does not mean that you have to use "a ton of herbicide". Our food plot program is chemical free after an initial disturbance to remove the existing vegetation and you can start that off with tillage instead of herbicide. Second, why are you striving for a monoculture to begin with? The goal of a pure brassica plot is not sustainable with the soil demands and risk of plant disease that comes with repetitive monocultures.
Every time you till, you are stirring up the seed bank and encouraging more grasses and weeds. In addition to that, any time you try to grow a monoculture, you are asking for weeds which are there to fix a problem with the soil (protecting bare ground or providing nutrients where deficient). Planting a diverse blend is the best practice for soil health, and soil health is what is responsible for plant nutrient density, and that is what creates attraction. Deer don't seek out brassicas specifically, they seek out nutrient density and palatability. On top of that, deer and other wildlife prefer diversity, so the "lower quality multi-species food plot" statement is a contradiction. A diverse food plot plant is not only more attractive, but is more consistently attractive as it provides various food options for deer on days that they might not seek out brassicas.
www.TheUntamedAmbition.com/foodplots
Thanks for the comment. Your note about a diversity of plant species being the best thing for soil health is true and I don’t dispute that at all. You will note in my full video that I encourage folks to research Gabe Brown and other no-till growers. I think the soil health benefits they work for are great. The difference here is that my main goal with a food plot is not maximizing soil health. If it was, then I would not have a food plot. I would plant it into native grasses and pollinators and occasionally mob graze it. My #1 priority for my food plot is to create the most attractive fall food source possible. In my observations, the best way for me to do that is to plant brassica family plants. In some areas, perhaps a multi-culture of plants is more attractive than brassicas? That could very well be. Another thing I will add is that several folks have tried to convince me that there is a third option here for weed control and that is roller crimping a cover crop over top of my fall food. I’ve done significant research on that topic though. When you press folks on this, eventually they will sheepishly admit that they do use herbicide or tillage occasionally to control weeds. So I appreciate you noting that you must first set the weeds back somehow (herbicide or tillage) at least to begin with. I am actually going to try roller crimping this summer to see if I can make that work and effectively suppress weeds. Thank again for watching and the discussion.
Tilling / dishing destroys the soil, period.
So… it is either no till or less healthy soil.
I agree with your last sentence. And I tip my hat to those who can truly do No-Till. For reasons I describe in my video, I’m opting for a less-healthy soil approach in exchange for other benefits.
I always have to laugh at people who won't use herbicides on their food plots, and then buy all their grain-based products and vegetables, fresh, frozen, or canned from a supermarket. 🤣
Good thing we don’t buy those things