Maybe he'll get his arc in a Triple Deluxe remake, I'd love that, since Taranza is my favorite character in the franchise As a theory: Taranza could be in a quest collecting the stars to summon Nova, and bring Joronia back in the form he met her as, not commiting his mistake again, confessing Joronia his feelings, and finally getting to live happily with her. (I swear if this theory becomes canon I'd be so happy)
@Whale_Boi more likely if a taranza epilogue is made he will pursue the dimensional mirror as seen in the kirby star allies puzzle picture "rockability blues"
So I actually have a theory/headcanon on how Taranza got the Mirror and why Meta Knight was completely absent during the events of Triple Deluxe (I am assuming that there is only one Mirror): After the events of Amazing Mirror, Meta Knight probably took the Mirror into custody and moved it to a safe place to prevent an another disaster like that would happen. A game that could support the fact that Meta Knight has a place where he stores extremely powerful objects/entities is Kirby Squeak Squad: Meta Knight was the only one who knew that Dark Nebula was in the chest, and Daroach probably stole it from this "safe place". I also have a theory that this "safe place" is the Sacred Square. In Star Allies, Meta Knight's description says that as soon as he saw the Jamba Hearts falling from the sky, he immediately went there to protect it. But why would he go there? Why not protect like his ship or go check if Dedede and Kirby are alright? My theory is that he wanted to make sure the place was safe before being possessed. While he was carrying the mirror with him, Taranza was nearby, saw the mirror and he thought it would be a perfect gift for Sectonia. But how did Taranza get it from Meta Knight? Taranza kept stalking Meta Knight and watched where he hid the Mirror. Since Taranza was probably smart enough to not directly engage against Meta Knight, he waited the perfect opportunity. This opportunity will come with the events of Kirby Squeak Squad: Daroach stole the chest from the Sacred Square and Meta Knight went after him to retrieve it. Then Taranza sneaked inside the place where the Mirror was and then stole it. How did Taranza not know what that Mirror was capable of? Well since Floralia is very high up in the sky, the people there weren't affected by the Mirror, just like in Planet Robobot. How did Meta Knight not notice that the Mirror was missing? Well, since Kirby defeated both the Squeak Squad and Dark Nebula, he didn't feel the need to go back to the Sacred Square. How did Meta Knight not notice that the Mirror was missing afterwards? He was probably sure that no one else would find them. Daroach, despite being a master thief, was able to find only one of these artifacts and Meta Knight probably hides these items in different locations of the Sacred Square and the hiding spot could be more effective and good based on the danger of the object and rarely returns to that area to avoid arousing suspicion or interest of creatures with bad intentions, with the exception of Taranza. Now we arrive at the events of Triple Deluxe: Taranza stole the Mirror a long time ago, and so it gave enough time for Sectonia to be corrupted. The reason why Meta Knight was absent is because he found out the Mirror was missing and, before starting to look for it, he wanted to make sure that no other items had been stolen. After that, he started searching for it. How did Meta Knight not notice that Dedede's castle and Kirby's house were lifted up by a gigantic beanstalk? The Sacred Square is most likely very far away from Dream Land and so he was unable to see it (I'm not considering the Planet Popstar hub from Star Allies as a reliable distance source). After checking the entirety of the Sacred Square and its surroundings, Sectonia fused with the Dreamstalk and covered Popstar in vines. At this point, Meta Knight started to fight the vines. After Sectonia's defeat, Meta Knight immediately returns to Dream Land to see what happened. After Dedede and Bandana Waddle Dee explained to him what had happened, and none of them including Kirby mentioned seeing a mirror, he probably didn't consider the fact that Taranza stole it because Meta Knight assumed that the Mirror was only capable of unleashing chaos and by itself, and didn't consider that the Mirror was also able to corrupt the soul. In the end, Meta Knight will begin moving all these powerful items in better and safer hiding spots in the Sacred Square and after not having found the Mirror after weeks of searching, he thought it was gone for good.
The only logical conclusion is that her original name was joronia and after she took over the wasp she changed it to sectonia because it sounds more beautiful and every time the text says sectonia its referring to joronia because sectonia is the name people know her best by
I love me some dark and twisted theories (Big ol' Kikuo fan here hehe✌), though some of this seems off. (I'll get into the whole "Joronia" name in a bit, so for now I'll just refer good, bad, nerd, version of the queen as just "Sectonia") I feel like the idea of Sectonia always being manipulative and evil doesn't quite add up, only because she had always been referred to as a 'fair and kind queen' before the mirror's corruption had taken place. I find it as an interesting concept; but I just don't think it makes the most sense. I feel as though what we've sort of already come to know is really just where it's at and the pure manipulation really came after she had been corrupted. I do agree that some things do seem a bit messy with what HAL is doing and sort of comes off as "oh there could have been something evil going on all along!" but I don't think there's enough to truly say that Sectonia was always bad; that's just me though. I wont get into everything said in this video (but an exceptional great video nonetheless!) so I'll just go into random things that sort of come to mind; I think Sectonia's true jealousy and envy really only came from after she had been corrupted and never exactly had this type of envy. I feel like prior to the mirror's corruption, she had only had a little bit of envious of others but not in a way where it would be twisted or malicious, only because one thing that had always been apart of her was her obsession with beauty. More of an innocent type of envy, y'know? I don't doubt that somethings here are inspired by Japanese stories like the Jorogumo Yokai, but I don't think it's fully taking into inspiration (if that makes sense). I think mostly just the concept of her being a spider and changing into something beautiful is what was really taken as inspiration (though instead of a beautiful woman, it's a beautiful wasp queen.) I also don't think neither Taranza or Sectonia are a 1000 years old; in my mind, I had always pictured that they were both some sort of average adult age, kind of imagined them to maybe be around the age of like Susie or something. I had always pictured that the DNA from 1000 years ago was mostly in reference to that some part of Sectonia has existed for 1000 years, whether that being the species her and Taranza was and is, the wasp form she has, and or even the aspects of the Dreamstalk (considering the DNA to clone Sectonia was found in the Dreamstalk to begin with.) I had always just imagined that the 1000 year old DNA was in reference to the Spider species, it would mostly just be referencing an older generation of some sort. Joronia, it's a weird name, and it definitely does seem in reference to the "Jorogumo", but there does also exist a regular spider species as the "Joro Spider", which its full name would be the "Trichonephila clavata" (Note I found the full name via Wikipedia haha), so it is also entirely possible that the "Joro" part of the name just is in reference to the actual spider? Who truly knows aside from HAL and their cryptic shenanigans. ¯\_ (ツ)_/¯ If I had any sort of theory on the name 'Joronia', I suppose it being Sectonia's original name could possible? But I feel that if maybe it was, there would have been some sort of prior reference to it? You'd think Taranza would have at least mentioned something like it. (I also doubt that "Joronia" is a mistranslation, I know somethings in the Kirby games are known to not be translated too well, but I don't think this is a case of mistranslation). Some extra small theories of the name "Joronia": * Maybe it was a nickname that was given to Sectonia? Whether by someone in-game, or even just from HAL themselves. * Maybe this name could potentially tell us what species Taranza and Sectonia could be? Maybe it's a sort of possible reference to what they may be called? * I genuinely don't know if this is something HAL would do, but it's also fully possible that "Joronia" could just be a made-up name, maybe just a silly name they gave a random bot in Dream Buffet. Just a name that doesn't fully imply anything and is just something random they added into the game. It's hard to truly say what is and isn't correct, what is and isn't plausible... because this is HAL we're talking about. Legit a good chunk of the lore of Sectonia and Taranza was on Miiverse posts that you can't go to anymore aside from the archived posts (you can find these archived Miiverse posts online, via things like the Fandom Wiki n such.) I do wonder if we would have gotten a lot more information back then but we didn't; because according to an older interview about the development of Kirby: Robobot (you can also find this interview online, often on Wiki pages), apparently there was originally going to be a 2nd game of Triple Deluxe, presumably taking place after the events of the first one; but the game had turned its development into Robobot (which I can go into some theories about some of Susie's concept designs but that's not for now haha). We could have potentially seen more of this story but we ended up not getting it; but this could mean that they did have more ideas of Triple Deluxe that they maaayybbbe might go into in the future? Here's to holding out to there being a Triple Deluxe Remake with an extra story mode. ✌ * Forgive me for the long text, and especially if some of it is hard to understand lol- I just like talking about these sort of things and getting to see other peoples' perspective and theories of such as well. That being said, I enjoyed the video and even found some of your theories to be interesting! Wonderful work! ^^
It would probably be easier to just refer to the different sectonia's as spider or wasp I think I agree with most of your points but it's harder without the easy distinction.
@@TheRealSuperKirby Fair enough, I probably should have stuck with that haha! I do also sort of just wish HAL wasn't so vague and cryptic with some things altogether, it makes for a fun mystery and can be enjoyable to theorize about, but eventually it just gets a little tiring haha.
This video just further cements to me why Taranza is shown having such a hard moving on, it was always way more than just Sectonia. In conjunction with watching SMBMario's hypotheses on Taranza, it wouldn't surprise me if Taranza ends up going down a troubling route akin to Sectonia. If their species is said to only survive off of leeching power, it seems inevitable that Taranza will have to hurt those closest to him once again.
I think kirby clash deluxe story was made to show us what would happen if he did, but they put it in a alternate universe so they can still keep him good for now.
@@TheRealSuperKirby Wish it could've been expanded upon on a mainline game instead of a spinoff, but I of course get why they wouldn't do that since they keep story on the backburner. Although with them leaking out more details, it still gives me hope that we'll be seeing Taranza in some more relevant appearance someday.
@emi6700 it's not that, I think HAL might slowly being falling into the "sonic's friends" problem, where all these characters are kept around kirby to use whenever they feel like, they can't really keep them as "kirby's friends" if they randomly go on villain arcs.
@@TheRealSuperKirby Perhaps I'm just expecting too much, however they have been somewhat building to something. At the very least I would just want to get a clearer picture on what truly went down between Taranza and Sectonia, or more details on the nature of their species. This topic is just oozing potential.
Or maybe Joronia is just what Sectonia was called before she became the wasp, and the mirror just made her into a parasite. I’m pretty sure a pause screen description talking about the flower-eye-minion-things that Sectonia uses during the second phase of her fight says they were the discarded husks of previous things the Sectonia parasite had taken control of now used as puppets to attack with. Maybe she attempts to “befriend” other creatures from Floralia so she can eventually take control of them when the current body has stopped being “beautiful”. Edit: Or maybe Joronia means nothing and all of this is thinking too far. I honestly think I agree with Joronia meaning nothing because I just don’t want to deal with plot hole nonsense.
Awesome job with this! This isn't something a lot of channels have seriously covered, and you explained well everything from the early theories to your own. I hope this performs well, it'd be deserved! Separately, I've got a counter-theory if you're interested.
@TheRealSuperKirby This might be a little more bland, but what if the other being involved in Joronia's transformation was just, at least in the beginning, another form of Dark Matter? Most of the surrounding details could work pretty well with that, such as it leeching off of/controlling creatures, taking over their bodies (provided that's not just asset reuse, which it likely is), and forgetting its origin after taking so many forms (especially in the mirror world). The wasp form, or at least the basis for it, may have developed from Joronia's idea of beauty in a similar way to how D-Mind was created from Dark Taranza's idea of "savagery". This might leave a problem of whom the associate mentioned with the Sectonia Mask is meant to be, but that could be about something else. Furthermore, I think Sectonia's wasp-like design and Joro name are meant to be more like references (to a parasitic wasp coming from a spider and a spider transforming into a beautiful yet cruel woman respectively). If Joronia literally possessed a wasp character, where's the rest of this race? It's very far off from anything else in the game, and I doubt HAL would wait 10+ years to introduce this missing piece. Lastly, Triple Deluxe is in the middle of the story arc that started with late RtDl and ended with Star Allies. If the only piece of Void lore in Triple Deluxe is Sectonia Soul having some classic attacks, it'd be an outlier out of the four games (though it did have Amazing Mirror plot to deal with as well). P.S. Sorry if this is a bit hard to read, I got pretty tired but didn't want to forget this.
@CyanicCore I don't really follow, like, at all. Please elaborate. As for the "where is the rest of their race?" I don't think that's a very compelling argument. There's plenty of characters that are the only one of their race, coo, mr dooter, every memeber of the beast back besides gorimondo, but that doesn't mean they are special one of a kind creatures, they most likely have others in their species out there, we just don't see it because it makes a character stand out less if they have a bunch of identical brethren. But even still I think there's a high chance sectonia was a celebrity known for her beauty, and could possibly have hailed from somewhere else but moved to floralia.
@@TheRealSuperKirby Given the evidence presented in the video, namely the sectonia mask in SKC, it wouldn't be a leap to consider that the wasp individual was also in a position of high power alongside Taranza. It's clear to me that the three parties involved were very close-knit before the mirror incident Also I feel we shouldn't dismiss the possibility that "Joronia" could be the wasp person. It's my opinion atleast, that "Sectonia" fits the spider body much more because as stated by the KirbyWiki it describes she's "almost an insect" when she fits more with a parasitic being. It could also be in line with the inverse premise of the real world bugs you described.
@emi6700 possible, but its defiently leaning towards the spider being named joronia. She's the one who can't remember her form or name, her mask Is the one gone unnamed while the wasp mask is still called sectonia.
(Second comment) Perhaps as Joronia was going insane, Taranza was hanging out with Sectonia cuz he was worried. Joronia, the absolute DOB she became, got jealous and took Sectonia's body
I think the parasite would've parasitized Joronia's original spider body, made her ask Taranza for the Mirror, could've either used this as a reason to make Taranza think Joronia went mad by stealing Sectonia's body (when in reality Joronia wasn't even there anymore) or simply went insane about her looks, and decided to steal Sectonia's body.
another theory: sectonia stole queen joronia's body through the mirror to take power, it does say sectonia's parasitic species steal bodies, that species might live in the mirror world, and when taranza tried to still love her, it didnt touch her.
The whole thing about joronia being an evil manipulator from the start also Falls easily due to one of the evidences for sectonia's original name to be sectonia was that the japanese name of the bot was taranza and joronia
I assumed the name "Joronia" was derived from the "Jou" meaning "queen" in japanese, qhich made sense to me since she was the queen of Floralia, but I completely forgot about the Jorogumo and the Joro spider. Good catch!
I don't wanna be a party killer, but I think the sectonia mask description is a translation error. It would help if someone looked up the japanese description, but I am french and in the french description it is clearly stated that she ressembled one of her friends BEFORE her transformation. Concerning the whole Joronia thing, i think that's just a cool portemanteau of the joro spider and/or jorogumo (I mean a jorogumo is a spider hiding as a more beautiful woman so it would still be fitting) and sectonia. I mean both ends with onia, that would be a huge coincidence if the person getting possesed and the the person possesing shared the 4 last letter of their name.
Who's to say the French version isn't the one with the error? There's way too much evidence that stacks up for this to be an accident, and dark nebula being the ruler of the underworld was previously a translation error but was retconned into canon in the dedededirectory, so even if it used to be, things could change.
@@TheRealSuperKirby that's why we should have someone look up the japanese version. An random item description from a spin off making a reference to a previously known information instead of making a huge revelation about the whole plot of triple deluxe just seems more logic at first glance, so I wanted to point that out. The theory still has some interest, especially the many times queen sectonia has been referenced has a parasite even though it was never explained why. Anyway, keep up the good work !
When you go through the second level of Royal Road you can see in the background what looks like to be large oval purple tubes with Greenish Hexagonal DNA patterns swirling through them, don't know if it's connected to the fusion process in any way
The Mirror World appearing in both the A30 (Dream Kingdom) and the V01 (Main) universes... ... Perhaps these universes go along with some sort of "paths"? Like the Mirror World neighboring V01 and A30 which im certain are larger universes than it Then perhaps the APL space (magolor epilogue) fills the gap between those universes, so the cosmos of Kirby would be like this cosmic-scale lattice of, like, carbon atoms. Like a diamond. (Ob'm know, i never played the clash games)
14:28 I actually think Taranza was trying to impress Susie instead of Ribbon and Adeleine, and Susie unlike the latter two, is actually an adult. Because no way Nintendo would add T H A T into their games
@igorguimaraes5283 Yeah, something I've seriously overlooked is that susie 2.0's description says she was involved in an incident "as a child" which would logically mean in the present day she is NOT a child, she just felt young to me. Still, most likely young adult range vs gray hair to potentially 1000s of years old is a bit questionable. Hal probably should have put vividria in there instead of adeline and ribbon, but I get that they were chosen because of their idle animation and nothing more.
Even in that situation (which I think he was going for just Susie), Taranza still needs some information about development and needs a lot of interventions, definitely a few years of therapy for the other stuff. Like I want to say through the 4th wall "dude, get your priorities straight. There's just no chance in the universe."
I can explain the story in one second. They like each other wife go bye bye he angry 😡 he tried to take over king penguin It goes wrong to KRBob defeating and he gets flicking away from a bug. This is way better than the actual story prove me wrong
@@Moverboy potentially for ribbon and ado, but I should correct myself that Susie is most likely an adult, since in the Susie 2.0 description it says "as a child" which would mean she is no longer a child.
Hopefully I will not have to abandon my fixation and hope that Taranza was just going for Susie because if that included Ribbon and Ado, I'm gonna have to delete all my Taranza art, scrap my AU and write a paragraph long rant explaining why I had to abandon Kirby. I cannot in clear conscience follow it when a character I liked hypothetically turned out to be the worst kind of person.
@TheRealSuperKirby Still, I will not tolerate any To Catch a Predator stuff in the fiction I like because I will feel like I'm supporting that immoral stuff by still liking the franchise. That's just my opinion.
@dusktheowlgryphon that highly depends. Kirby Right back at ya had a whole episode about creeps trying to make a nasty anime about tiff (who is a child) and rightfully demeans those people in as many ways as possible, the kirby devs defiently don't endorse this stuff. Taranza isn't a "good person" he already has kidnapping under his belt, and there's no justifying motivation for his crimes, he was just a simp. He is a flawed character with a lot of depth, and until he gets the spotlight again, this little title screen skits probably won't be built upon, and the devs probably didn't think that deeply about it when they made it
Will hal ever let taranza be happy?
No.
He should get an epilogue like Magolor.
Maybe he'll get his arc in a Triple Deluxe remake, I'd love that, since Taranza is my favorite character in the franchise
As a theory: Taranza could be in a quest collecting the stars to summon Nova, and bring Joronia back in the form he met her as, not commiting his mistake again, confessing Joronia his feelings, and finally getting to live happily with her. (I swear if this theory becomes canon I'd be so happy)
@Whale_Boi more likely if a taranza epilogue is made he will pursue the dimensional mirror as seen in the kirby star allies puzzle picture "rockability blues"
It all fun and games until the Kirby triple deluxe remake has sectonia epilogue
Why not taranza,susie,and magolor fighting morpho knight. I mean the is about 4 heroes after all
So I actually have a theory/headcanon on how Taranza got the Mirror and why Meta Knight was completely absent during the events of Triple Deluxe (I am assuming that there is only one Mirror):
After the events of Amazing Mirror, Meta Knight probably took the Mirror into custody and moved it to a safe place to prevent an another disaster like that would happen.
A game that could support the fact that Meta Knight has a place where he stores extremely powerful objects/entities is Kirby Squeak Squad: Meta Knight was the only one who knew that Dark Nebula was in the chest, and Daroach probably stole it from this "safe place".
I also have a theory that this "safe place" is the Sacred Square. In Star Allies, Meta Knight's description says that as soon as he saw the Jamba Hearts falling from the sky, he immediately went there to protect it. But why would he go there? Why not protect like his ship or go check if Dedede and Kirby are alright? My theory is that he wanted to make sure the place was safe before being possessed.
While he was carrying the mirror with him, Taranza was nearby, saw the mirror and he thought it would be a perfect gift for Sectonia. But how did Taranza get it from Meta Knight? Taranza kept stalking Meta Knight and watched where he hid the Mirror. Since Taranza was probably smart enough to not directly engage against Meta Knight, he waited the perfect opportunity. This opportunity will come with the events of Kirby Squeak Squad: Daroach stole the chest from the Sacred Square and Meta Knight went after him to retrieve it. Then Taranza sneaked inside the place where the Mirror was and then stole it.
How did Taranza not know what that Mirror was capable of? Well since Floralia is very high up in the sky, the people there weren't affected by the Mirror, just like in Planet Robobot.
How did Meta Knight not notice that the Mirror was missing? Well, since Kirby defeated both the Squeak Squad and Dark Nebula, he didn't feel the need to go back to the Sacred Square.
How did Meta Knight not notice that the Mirror was missing afterwards? He was probably sure that no one else would find them. Daroach, despite being a master thief, was able to find only one of these artifacts and Meta Knight probably hides these items in different locations of the Sacred Square and the hiding spot could be more effective and good based on the danger of the object and rarely returns to that area to avoid arousing suspicion or interest of creatures with bad intentions, with the exception of Taranza.
Now we arrive at the events of Triple Deluxe: Taranza stole the Mirror a long time ago, and so it gave enough time for Sectonia to be corrupted.
The reason why Meta Knight was absent is because he found out the Mirror was missing and, before starting to look for it, he wanted to make sure that no other items had been stolen. After that, he started searching for it.
How did Meta Knight not notice that Dedede's castle and Kirby's house were lifted up by a gigantic beanstalk? The Sacred Square is most likely very far away from Dream Land and so he was unable to see it (I'm not considering the Planet Popstar hub from Star Allies as a reliable distance source).
After checking the entirety of the Sacred Square and its surroundings, Sectonia fused with the Dreamstalk and covered Popstar in vines. At this point, Meta Knight started to fight the vines. After Sectonia's defeat, Meta Knight immediately returns to Dream Land to see what happened. After Dedede and Bandana Waddle Dee explained to him what had happened, and none of them including Kirby mentioned seeing a mirror, he probably didn't consider the fact that Taranza stole it because Meta Knight assumed that the Mirror was only capable of unleashing chaos and by itself, and didn't consider that the Mirror was also able to corrupt the soul.
In the end, Meta Knight will begin moving all these powerful items in better and safer hiding spots in the Sacred Square and after not having found the Mirror after weeks of searching, he thought it was gone for good.
Wasnt dedede the one who owned the dark nébula chest tho?
Wasn't the Mirror World also located "high above the skies of Dream Land"? (as it's stated on the Kirby and the Amazing Mirror intro)
I would have never knew all this…
Especially that Taranza has gray hair I always assumed it was a helmet.
Same
this is lore for two characters mind you
The only logical conclusion is that her original name was joronia and after she took over the wasp she changed it to sectonia because it sounds more beautiful and every time the text says sectonia its referring to joronia because sectonia is the name people know her best by
@@hassanediallo2822 hmm, so you think the people were well aware of the body snatching or I am misunderstanding your comment?
@TheRealSuperKirby what i mean is that people best know her by sectonia i bet there's some who don't even know about her old name
I miss my wife tails, i miss her a lot, ill be back
Somebody NEEDS to make this
I love me some dark and twisted theories (Big ol' Kikuo fan here hehe✌), though some of this seems off.
(I'll get into the whole "Joronia" name in a bit, so for now I'll just refer good, bad, nerd, version of the queen as just "Sectonia")
I feel like the idea of Sectonia always being manipulative and evil doesn't quite add up, only because she had always been referred to as a 'fair and kind queen' before the mirror's corruption had taken place. I find it as an interesting concept; but I just don't think it makes the most sense. I feel as though what we've sort of already come to know is really just where it's at and the pure manipulation really came after she had been corrupted.
I do agree that some things do seem a bit messy with what HAL is doing and sort of comes off as "oh there could have been something evil going on all along!" but I don't think there's enough to truly say that Sectonia was always bad; that's just me though.
I wont get into everything said in this video (but an exceptional great video nonetheless!) so I'll just go into random things that sort of come to mind;
I think Sectonia's true jealousy and envy really only came from after she had been corrupted and never exactly had this type of envy. I feel like prior to the mirror's corruption, she had only had a little bit of envious of others but not in a way where it would be twisted or malicious, only because one thing that had always been apart of her was her obsession with beauty. More of an innocent type of envy, y'know?
I don't doubt that somethings here are inspired by Japanese stories like the Jorogumo Yokai, but I don't think it's fully taking into inspiration (if that makes sense). I think mostly just the concept of her being a spider and changing into something beautiful is what was really taken as inspiration (though instead of a beautiful woman, it's a beautiful wasp queen.)
I also don't think neither Taranza or Sectonia are a 1000 years old; in my mind, I had always pictured that they were both some sort of average adult age, kind of imagined them to maybe be around the age of like Susie or something. I had always pictured that the DNA from 1000 years ago was mostly in reference to that some part of Sectonia has existed for 1000 years, whether that being the species her and Taranza was and is, the wasp form she has, and or even the aspects of the Dreamstalk (considering the DNA to clone Sectonia was found in the Dreamstalk to begin with.) I had always just imagined that the 1000 year old DNA was in reference to the Spider species, it would mostly just be referencing an older generation of some sort.
Joronia, it's a weird name, and it definitely does seem in reference to the "Jorogumo", but there does also exist a regular spider species as the "Joro Spider", which its full name would be the "Trichonephila clavata" (Note I found the full name via Wikipedia haha), so it is also entirely possible that the "Joro" part of the name just is in reference to the actual spider? Who truly knows aside from HAL and their cryptic shenanigans. ¯\_ (ツ)_/¯
If I had any sort of theory on the name 'Joronia', I suppose it being Sectonia's original name could possible? But I feel that if maybe it was, there would have been some sort of prior reference to it? You'd think Taranza would have at least mentioned something like it. (I also doubt that "Joronia" is a mistranslation, I know somethings in the Kirby games are known to not be translated too well, but I don't think this is a case of mistranslation).
Some extra small theories of the name "Joronia":
* Maybe it was a nickname that was given to Sectonia? Whether by someone in-game, or even just from HAL themselves.
* Maybe this name could potentially tell us what species Taranza and Sectonia could be? Maybe it's a sort of possible reference to what they may be called?
* I genuinely don't know if this is something HAL would do, but it's also fully possible that "Joronia" could just be a made-up name, maybe just a silly name they gave a random bot in Dream Buffet. Just a name that doesn't fully imply anything and is just something random they added into the game.
It's hard to truly say what is and isn't correct, what is and isn't plausible... because this is HAL we're talking about. Legit a good chunk of the lore of Sectonia and Taranza was on Miiverse posts that you can't go to anymore aside from the archived posts (you can find these archived Miiverse posts online, via things like the Fandom Wiki n such.)
I do wonder if we would have gotten a lot more information back then but we didn't; because according to an older interview about the development of Kirby: Robobot (you can also find this interview online, often on Wiki pages), apparently there was originally going to be a 2nd game of Triple Deluxe, presumably taking place after the events of the first one; but the game had turned its development into Robobot (which I can go into some theories about some of Susie's concept designs but that's not for now haha).
We could have potentially seen more of this story but we ended up not getting it; but this could mean that they did have more ideas of Triple Deluxe that they maaayybbbe might go into in the future? Here's to holding out to there being a Triple Deluxe Remake with an extra story mode. ✌
* Forgive me for the long text, and especially if some of it is hard to understand lol- I just like talking about these sort of things and getting to see other peoples' perspective and theories of such as well. That being said, I enjoyed the video and even found some of your theories to be interesting! Wonderful work! ^^
It would probably be easier to just refer to the different sectonia's as spider or wasp
I think I agree with most of your points but it's harder without the easy distinction.
@@TheRealSuperKirby Fair enough, I probably should have stuck with that haha!
I do also sort of just wish HAL wasn't so vague and cryptic with some things altogether, it makes for a fun mystery and can be enjoyable to theorize about, but eventually it just gets a little tiring haha.
This video just further cements to me why Taranza is shown having such a hard moving on, it was always way more than just Sectonia.
In conjunction with watching SMBMario's hypotheses on Taranza, it wouldn't surprise me if Taranza ends up going down a troubling route akin to Sectonia. If their species is said to only survive off of leeching power, it seems inevitable that Taranza will have to hurt those closest to him once again.
I think kirby clash deluxe story was made to show us what would happen if he did, but they put it in a alternate universe so they can still keep him good for now.
@@TheRealSuperKirby Wish it could've been expanded upon on a mainline game instead of a spinoff, but I of course get why they wouldn't do that since they keep story on the backburner. Although with them leaking out more details, it still gives me hope that we'll be seeing Taranza in some more relevant appearance someday.
@emi6700 it's not that, I think HAL might slowly being falling into the "sonic's friends" problem, where all these characters are kept around kirby to use whenever they feel like, they can't really keep them as "kirby's friends" if they randomly go on villain arcs.
@@TheRealSuperKirby Perhaps I'm just expecting too much, however they have been somewhat building to something. At the very least I would just want to get a clearer picture on what truly went down between Taranza and Sectonia, or more details on the nature of their species. This topic is just oozing potential.
Or maybe Joronia is just what Sectonia was called before she became the wasp, and the mirror just made her into a parasite. I’m pretty sure a pause screen description talking about the flower-eye-minion-things that Sectonia uses during the second phase of her fight says they were the discarded husks of previous things the Sectonia parasite had taken control of now used as puppets to attack with. Maybe she attempts to “befriend” other creatures from Floralia so she can eventually take control of them when the current body has stopped being “beautiful”.
Edit: Or maybe Joronia means nothing and all of this is thinking too far. I honestly think I agree with Joronia meaning nothing because I just don’t want to deal with plot hole nonsense.
Pretty sure I collected every single secronia pause screen I could and there was nothing on the eyes.
@@TheRealSuperKirby I’m probably misremembering something, idk.
Awesome job with this! This isn't something a lot of channels have seriously covered, and you explained well everything from the early theories to your own. I hope this performs well, it'd be deserved! Separately, I've got a counter-theory if you're interested.
I'm interested
@TheRealSuperKirby This might be a little more bland, but what if the other being involved in Joronia's transformation was just, at least in the beginning, another form of Dark Matter? Most of the surrounding details could work pretty well with that, such as it leeching off of/controlling creatures, taking over their bodies (provided that's not just asset reuse, which it likely is), and forgetting its origin after taking so many forms (especially in the mirror world). The wasp form, or at least the basis for it, may have developed from Joronia's idea of beauty in a similar way to how D-Mind was created from Dark Taranza's idea of "savagery". This might leave a problem of whom the associate mentioned with the Sectonia Mask is meant to be, but that could be about something else. Furthermore, I think Sectonia's wasp-like design and Joro name are meant to be more like references (to a parasitic wasp coming from a spider and a spider transforming into a beautiful yet cruel woman respectively). If Joronia literally possessed a wasp character, where's the rest of this race? It's very far off from anything else in the game, and I doubt HAL would wait 10+ years to introduce this missing piece. Lastly, Triple Deluxe is in the middle of the story arc that started with late RtDl and ended with Star Allies. If the only piece of Void lore in Triple Deluxe is Sectonia Soul having some classic attacks, it'd be an outlier out of the four games (though it did have Amazing Mirror plot to deal with as well).
P.S. Sorry if this is a bit hard to read, I got pretty tired but didn't want to forget this.
@CyanicCore I don't really follow, like, at all. Please elaborate.
As for the "where is the rest of their race?" I don't think that's a very compelling argument. There's plenty of characters that are the only one of their race, coo, mr dooter, every memeber of the beast back besides gorimondo, but that doesn't mean they are special one of a kind creatures, they most likely have others in their species out there, we just don't see it because it makes a character stand out less if they have a bunch of identical brethren.
But even still I think there's a high chance sectonia was a celebrity known for her beauty, and could possibly have hailed from somewhere else but moved to floralia.
@@TheRealSuperKirby Given the evidence presented in the video, namely the sectonia mask in SKC, it wouldn't be a leap to consider that the wasp individual was also in a position of high power alongside Taranza. It's clear to me that the three parties involved were very close-knit before the mirror incident
Also I feel we shouldn't dismiss the possibility that "Joronia" could be the wasp person. It's my opinion atleast, that "Sectonia" fits the spider body much more because as stated by the KirbyWiki it describes she's "almost an insect" when she fits more with a parasitic being. It could also be in line with the inverse premise of the real world bugs you described.
@emi6700 possible, but its defiently leaning towards the spider being named joronia. She's the one who can't remember her form or name, her mask Is the one gone unnamed while the wasp mask is still called sectonia.
(Second comment)
Perhaps as Joronia was going insane, Taranza was hanging out with Sectonia cuz he was worried. Joronia, the absolute DOB she became, got jealous and took Sectonia's body
Wait a minute… I just realized Kirby’s stomach in Squeak Squad resembles the Nightmare orb.
It weirdly does, though you can change the pattern of it in game through collectibles. Probably just a similar pattern, being stars and all.
I think the parasite would've parasitized Joronia's original spider body, made her ask Taranza for the Mirror, could've either used this as a reason to make Taranza think Joronia went mad by stealing Sectonia's body (when in reality Joronia wasn't even there anymore) or simply went insane about her looks, and decided to steal Sectonia's body.
I like so much your lore videos.
another theory: sectonia stole queen joronia's body through the mirror to take power, it does say sectonia's parasitic species steal bodies, that species might live in the mirror world, and when taranza tried to still love her, it didnt touch her.
The whole thing about joronia being an evil manipulator from the start also Falls easily due to one of the evidences for sectonia's original name to be sectonia was that the japanese name of the bot was taranza and joronia
I assumed the name "Joronia" was derived from the "Jou" meaning "queen" in japanese, qhich made sense to me since she was the queen of Floralia, but I completely forgot about the Jorogumo and the Joro spider. Good catch!
When I saw shadow Kirby in star allies I said “that little *cannot say due to channel guidelines* lied to us”
I don't wanna be a party killer, but I think the sectonia mask description is a translation error. It would help if someone looked up the japanese description, but I am french and in the french description it is clearly stated that she ressembled one of her friends BEFORE her transformation. Concerning the whole Joronia thing, i think that's just a cool portemanteau of the joro spider and/or jorogumo (I mean a jorogumo is a spider hiding as a more beautiful woman so it would still be fitting) and sectonia. I mean both ends with onia, that would be a huge coincidence if the person getting possesed and the the person possesing shared the 4 last letter of their name.
Who's to say the French version isn't the one with the error? There's way too much evidence that stacks up for this to be an accident,
and dark nebula being the ruler of the underworld was previously a translation error but was retconned into canon in the dedededirectory, so even if it used to be, things could change.
@@TheRealSuperKirby that's why we should have someone look up the japanese version. An random item description from a spin off making a reference to a previously known information instead of making a huge revelation about the whole plot of triple deluxe just seems more logic at first glance, so I wanted to point that out. The theory still has some interest, especially the many times queen sectonia has been referenced has a parasite even though it was never explained why. Anyway, keep up the good work !
When you go through the second level of Royal Road you can see in the background what looks like to be large oval purple tubes with Greenish Hexagonal DNA patterns swirling through them, don't know if it's connected to the fusion process in any way
Kirby usually isn’t the first game we think of when we think of lore (wink wink fnaf) but this is honestly more depressing than Susie’s story
It literally is though
The Mirror World appearing in both the A30 (Dream Kingdom) and the V01 (Main) universes...
...
Perhaps these universes go along with some sort of "paths"? Like the Mirror World neighboring V01 and A30 which im certain are larger universes than it
Then perhaps the APL space (magolor epilogue) fills the gap between those universes,
so the cosmos of Kirby would be like this cosmic-scale lattice of, like, carbon atoms.
Like a diamond.
(Ob'm know, i never played the clash games)
What the heck are these acronyms?
@TheRealSuperKirby I like to identify universes with a three-character code. A30 comes from Aeon Hero and V01 comes from Void
@@angrysunflower222 ah
Taranza: the traumatized simp
This is amazing.
14:28 I actually think Taranza was trying to impress Susie instead of Ribbon and Adeleine, and Susie unlike the latter two, is actually an adult. Because no way Nintendo would add T H A T into their games
@igorguimaraes5283 Yeah, something I've seriously overlooked is that susie 2.0's description says she was involved in an incident "as a child" which would logically mean in the present day she is NOT a child, she just felt young to me.
Still, most likely young adult range vs gray hair to potentially 1000s of years old is a bit questionable.
Hal probably should have put vividria in there instead of adeline and ribbon, but I get that they were chosen because of their idle animation and nothing more.
@@TheRealSuperKirby Yeah, Taranza is still way older than Susie either way
Even in that situation (which I think he was going for just Susie), Taranza still needs some information about development and needs a lot of interventions, definitely a few years of therapy for the other stuff. Like I want to say through the 4th wall "dude, get your priorities straight. There's just no chance in the universe."
Yo, this video is amazing
Aaand if u don't mind, i'll use some of this information for a school project (litterally)
You have to post it to RUclips then
@@TheRealSuperKirby alr then :]
I can explain the story in one second. They like each other wife go bye bye he angry 😡 he tried to take over king penguin It goes wrong to KRBob defeating and he gets flicking away from a bug. This is way better than the actual story prove me wrong
@@Stink780 blud could NOT say this in 1 second
@@TheRealSuperKirbyNooooooooooo 😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢
14:35 is… is Taranza not like us?
@@Moverboy potentially for ribbon and ado, but I should correct myself that Susie is most likely an adult, since in the Susie 2.0 description it says "as a child" which would mean she is no longer a child.
Hopefully I will not have to abandon my fixation and hope that Taranza was just going for Susie because if that included Ribbon and Ado, I'm gonna have to delete all my Taranza art, scrap my AU and write a paragraph long rant explaining why I had to abandon Kirby. I cannot in clear conscience follow it when a character I liked hypothetically turned out to be the worst kind of person.
@@dusktheowlgryphon it's not that deep
@TheRealSuperKirby Still, I will not tolerate any To Catch a Predator stuff in the fiction I like because I will feel like I'm supporting that immoral stuff by still liking the franchise. That's just my opinion.
@dusktheowlgryphon that highly depends. Kirby Right back at ya had a whole episode about creeps trying to make a nasty anime about tiff (who is a child) and rightfully demeans those people in as many ways as possible, the kirby devs defiently don't endorse this stuff.
Taranza isn't a "good person" he already has kidnapping under his belt, and there's no justifying motivation for his crimes, he was just a simp.
He is a flawed character with a lot of depth, and until he gets the spotlight again, this little title screen skits probably won't be built upon, and the devs probably didn't think that deeply about it when they made it