A real Jim in the rough: Hydlide | NES Works 124
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- Опубликовано: 6 фев 2024
- Well, here we are. One of the worst games of all time! A huge disaster that insults the intelligence of anyone who owned an NES!
Nah, not really. Hydlide feels incredibly archaic as a 1989 NES release, but that doesn't reflect on the game itself so much as FCI's weird decision to publish it here so late. I think it probably would have fared well if they'd shipped it alongside Zanac back in 1987. But two years later? Why would anyone want this game when they could play a dozen better, Hydlide-inspired works instead?
Still, this is a game worth experiencing and attempting to understand, because it's pretty much the Rosetta Stone for action-RPGs. Seriously, it was a big deal. Just... not in 1989.
Production notes:
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NES footage captured from Analogue Nt Mini. Video upscaled to 720 with xRGB Mini Framemeister. "Before the Storm" courtesy of Jacob Le. 
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This game was an epiphany to six-year old me. I struggled with it for nearly a year before realizing that some media is just unpleasant. Prior to this I did not understand that fact. It was my first "Oh, it's not me. I'm not playing it wrong. This whole experience just really sucks, it's not my fault."
🤣
When I was a kid and ran into this game, I played it for 5 minutes and shut it off never to play again.
As a kid who grew up on episodes of MST3K from a very young age, I was very aware that some stuff is just bad and it can be fun to laugh at it.
Shaq Fu was that game for me..
Every kid has that piece of media that teaches them that objective awfulness exists
Video Works are a Hydlide of my week!
Best reason to be a patron is getting to make the obvious puns weeks ahead of everyone else.
YOOOOO! You are 2 of my favorite RUclipsrs! I'm subscribed to both of your channels!
Hell ya RND got good list videos
That blows my mind. It only took 5 years for Hydlide to go from revolutionary new concept to and archaic antique of a bygone era.
It's wild, isn't it? Nowadays a five-year-old game isn't all that different from one released today. Back then it was an entirely new universe every couple years.
Games had to come out fast back then, in just a year you could be left behind. A lot of nostalgia for that time (roughly 1980 to late 1990s I think?) is down to the excitement, there was always some unbelievable new thing just around the corner. It's insane that the NES/ Famicom was considered an impressive console in its day for more than 5 straight years.
@@holdingpattern245 And the NES only held on to that position because new mappers kept becoming available. If it had to stand on the ability of just the raw hardware, it wouldn't have lasted nearly as long. It had started to show its limitations only two years after release. The ability of cartridges to expand on the native capabilities of the hardware is what kept the NES going for so long.
@@Belgandthat counts though, their competitors never had such foresight
It's amazing how much technology advanced in those 5 years. Chip manufacturing improved many times over, so Hydlide, which was limited by chip technology, seems archaic compared to Mega Man 3, which was limited more by programming/time constraints than available hardware.
Hydlide being historically important but miserable to play now basically defines it. Looking forward to Monster Party.
It was miserable to play back then too but can't deny its influence.
Memories hit me like a freight truck as soon as Jeremy announced that Hydlide was going to be the next episode of NES Works. I would say this is my first true rental disappointment as I recall renting this game back in 1989. The box screamed that this was going to be such a fun adventure of fighting dragons! Even the back of the box had screenshots resembling The Legend of Zelda! After taking it home on a Friday afternoon I played for about 10 minutes and realized that I just wasted a weekend rental on this game. 6 year old me was so devastated as renting NES games came few and far between and had the realization that I chose poorly. I spend the remainder of that weekend playing my other games.
I'm glad that I got to get a better understanding of the historical impact of this game, but being one of those who hated the current moment in 1989...i felt that.
"6 year old me was so devastated as renting NES games came few and far between and had the realization that I chose poorly."
That made me think that Jeremy Parish should have started this video with a clip of the old knight from Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade saying, "He chose... poorly."
“Sometimes loving history means hating the current moment.”
You changed by viewpoint of this game. Beautiful. Thanks for the best video game channel in existence.
Ironically, the Japanese version of Hydlide refers to is as "Hydlide _Special"_ meaning it's supposed to be enhanced from the computer original, namely the addition of magic into the game, which had the knock-on effect of changing how the wizard puzzle works: originally you only had to take 5 fireballs from the wizards and then kill just one of them (cryptic, but somewhat something players can stumble upon by accident) + the Indiana Jones music from Hydlide 2 for no reason at all. So can it really be called an "upgrade" of any sorts?
That being said, it really is a revolutionary game out of time and such a shame how most of it's legacy has been lost to time (namely the fact that it couldn't spawn a long-lasting to this day franchise like Ys) and it's best remembered in the West for its infamous late port of the horribly dated first game over any of its sequels on the same console
Also didn't help that Super Hydlide, the Genesis version/remake of Hydlide III, came out in English less than a year after the NES version of the original game did; the second game never left Japan. While the third game has its quirks & flaws, it was an astonishingly ambitious game for its time (arguably too much so, in fact) & really showed just how simple the original game was, in comparison.
@@Obscusion2 Moreover, there's Virtual Hydlide being sort of a franchise killer by trying to remake the first game again but with a randomizer element (a concept ahead of its time) and awful pre-render graphics
But from the looks of it T&E had already moved on from the franchise by the third entry anyways because they were cashing into the highly-lucrative golf videogame market up until their eventual closure (so much in fact that Virtual Hydlide was made in an engine designed for golf games)
@@DeepWeeb VH was also case of creator Tokuhiro Naito taking elements of Hydlide's spiritual successor by him, the Rune Worth trilogy, & implementing it into Hydlide. For example, VH's gimmick about only giving level ups based on story progression, instead of traditional EXP, was something Rune Worth experimented with first. Naito was seemingly never content with simply repeating what worked the first time around and wanted to continue experimenting, even if it didn't always work out as intended. That's why he left T&E after VH & formed his own (short-lived) studio.
The music in Dragon Slayer I at 12:15 is a chiptune rendering of Anton Dvorak's Slavonic Dance No. 7, which was used hilariously in Allegro Non Troppo, a 1978 Italian parody of Disney's Fantasia.
it's honestly really funny how quickly games transformed from cutting-edge to ridiculous creaking relics back in those days
Imagine if Nintendo didn’t release a launch NES game like Donkey Kong or Baseball until 1989. That’s how absurd it was that they published Hydlide on the NES at that year.
Nintendo released Donkey Kong on the Gameboy in 1994. Of course, they expanded the formula considerably in that version.
I found my long lost brother!@@221b
Hydlide is such an important title that i can't hate it, despite the gripes about grinding. It took me a long time to finally put in the time to beat it, but once you get going, it's quite easy to finish. The progression of monsters to kill to give experience is instrumental in being able to progress. The Fairune series of games that borrows a lot from Hydlide has a feature that always tells you which enemies you should be aiming for next, though in those games there are so many quality of life features and the amount of grinding so negligible that they become more puzzle games than proper action RPGs.
Excellent video. Completely matches the sentiment I read from a few JP retro game players and their experience on the PC88.
I was surprised to find out there is rhythm and rhyme to the game, and ended up finishing it a few years back with the help of a guide. It’s kind of a guilty pleasure now. I am sure if I had played it in ‘89 I would not have gotten anywhere!
that looping 5x5 grid really hits different after playing homage-laden La Mulana. No wonder the english speaking audience had such a struggle getting a grip on that game's quirks, we didn't really get the right training from this generation's library we needed.
I remember being so disappointed when I brought this back from my local video store and found it wasn't a digital version of Jai Alai.
I actually kind of liked this when I rented it.
That said, I liked every RPG that came out - and still kind of do - so it's probably me that is the problem.
- Hydlide
- Dragon Slayer
- Tower of Druaga
3 earliest real time RPG that pioneered the genre.
And not coincidentally not one of them is really playable today.
I mean obviously you can play them, but the only reason you would is to experience a historic game, not for fun. In contrast there's quite a few early turn-based RPGs that you wouldn't call very good but which are still playable as games today. Rogue, the early Ultimas, even Wizardry if you're masochistic.
Makes me wonder what the earliest action RPG that is still fun to play would be. Xanadu maybe? Though even then I'd recommend skipping ahead to Zelda or Ys.
@@the_exegete that's true more I think about it.
Action RPGs on Japanese PC are very hard to play and appreciate.
@@the_exegete I wouldn't say Druaga is unplayable.
It never occurred to me that FCI was considered a below average publisher, but seeing their continued output, it really does show.
The only time I ever wrote Nintendo Power was for this game. I played it forever but was stuck. I had to dash into a tree to catch a bee, I think?
NP wrote me back with the solution and I beat the game the same day I got the letter.
Now that I’ve watched the video, it was definitely the tree fairy with the wasps where I was stuck.
I appreciate that you covered how Hydlide was an extremely late port of a PC game to the NES. Pretty terrible game, but in context it makes a lot more sense. For 1984 it was cutting edge indeed!
Like many, I first knew of Hydlide via the AVGN & ProJared (though I had known of Super Hydlide/Hydlide III since it came out on the Genesis), but in the years since I've come to really appreciate the game for what it is. Yes, it has aged but it's nowhere near as bad as people keep saying it is... except on the NES. The Windows 9x remake is easily the best way to play it today, though the Eggconsole version of the PC-88 original on Switch is also a good time, but the NES version is just crap. Glacial health regen, a poor saving system because there's no backup battery in the cart, and Hydlide II elements (the repetitive music & magic system) just shoved in, and an overall slower pace to it all just makes it a chore to play. The PC-88 original is just better in all regards, and the Eggconsole QOL inclusions (like 2x-4x speed) make it much easier to just get into & play today.
I don't know if you know this, but in the Windows 98 version, if you press the letter O on the keyboard, Jim goes into Overdrive mode, which makes him far more powerful and gain far more experience with each enemy slain.
@@ryanschrafel9576 Yep, it's partly why it's the best version. Use Overdrive to negate the grind of leveling, then turn it off & enjoy exploring & discovering the next part of the "plot", as it is.
My friend's older brothers got this game when it came out and wouldn't let us play it because we were "too young to understand it." It still holds this certain mystique to the point where I've considered buying it a few times, but then I remind myself that it's Hydlide 😄
I'm amused that they included the original logo on the actual gameplay screen, but the title screen logo is a throwback to 1983.
I know Druaga gets mentioned in this video, but some of the roaming enemies also resemble Octies from Namco's 1985 shooter Baraduke.
AVGN really dragged this game's reputation through the mud via misinformation. Sure it's not very good, but it was one of the first action RPGs ever made and it has great historical value because of that. We wouldn't have Zelda if we didn't have Hydlide.
He did that to a lot of (more or less) undeserving games.
It's always interesting when something is dated the day they went to the print. Although not all are as important as this one.
That reminds me of a story about Bubsy 3D. Towards the end of the game's dev cycle, some of the devs went to a trade show and saw Mario 64 on a kiosk. The devs were crushed because Bubsy was too deep in development to switch off tank controls and finished the game knowing Bubsy 3D never had a chance.
Hydlide was a terrible rental, but as an adult appreciating history I was glad to have had the experience. P. S. Very excited for Monster Party
I certainly wouldn't call Hydlide good or even adequate, but I DID find it oddly satisfying when I played through it a few years ago (with a walkthrough and rampant save state abuse, of course). It's very archaicism was somehow charming, though I definitely wouldn't have thought so had I payed for it on release.
Could be worse. It could be Virtual Hydlide.
Virtual Hydlide is a true oddity in that on first glance & play you'll hate it, but then when you learn more about (including that it likely is powered by a literal golf game engine) everything kind of makes sense & you wind up with more of a fondness for it. It's not exactly good, yes, but there's a indelible charm to it, oddly enough.
Hydlide registers to me as just an alright RPG, clearly from home computers. Virtual Hydlide is in a league of its own - it’s ridiculous, and that’s kinda why I’m fascinated by it. Would love to try it someday
Virtual Hydlide at least has this “slow motion train wreck” quality to it.
Nes Hydlide however is just boring to look at.
Virtual Hylide also looks more playable. And it’s on the Sega Saturn, which is always a very interesting console to do research on.
I actually really like Virtual Hydlide. It's ugly as heck, but it's pretty fun, and the music is actually pretty good.
I'm glad you posted this. I remember in Kindergarten (so, 1989-90) my friends and I using the term "Hydlide" to refer to any game that was absolutely, irredeemably awful. "Oh, you bought *that* game? That's some Hydlide right there." And yeah, i owned a copy, and yeah, I thought it was dollar-store Zelda (with a broken seal and mold and spiders inside).
It wasn't until decades later that I learned it was actually a much older game was released into our grubby little mitts well after we'd been spoiled on all the other games that iterated upon it. I still hate the game, but I respect it.
From Software made a Kinda-Sorta-remake of Hydlide in '3D Dot Game Heroes', with a cornicopia of old-school RPG references~
Regarding 'Monster Party', I remember Stop Skeletons From Fighting speculating that that game was developed by HUMAN Entertainment. Any light to shed on this next week?
Monster Party is absolutely by Human Entertainment, the credits share a lot of staff with Kabuki Quantum Fighter and, uh, Gilligan's Island.
If I'm not mistaken, Hydlide Special was the first Famicom game to ever feature Experience Points and Levelling Up. Likewise, a year earlier the MSX cartridge port of Hydlide was the first Japanese-developed game software to feature automatic password generation, to accurately preserve the player's state between gaming sessions. Even after the original PC-8801 release, it remained an incredibly important trailblazer... Doesn't mean I have to like playing it, though!
I had this game as a kid, and could never figure out anything. Most frustrating NES experience I ever had.
It shocks me Hydlide and Batman came out the same year. For whatever reason, Hydlide just felt _old_, even when it was new.
I remember playing this game at a friend's house a long time ago. Sadly the only thing memorable about it was its awful 20 second loop overworld theme that apparently plays throughout its entirety.
Jeremy Parish is a more chill Angry Video Game Nerd and you can't convince me otherwise.
The "Reasonably Annoyed Video Game Nerd"?
Instead of LJN games his anger button comes from Sokoban clones.
I remember this was actually my most hated NES title as a kid, even over the nonsense that is Deadly Towers. Hydlide made no sense to me at the time whatsoever and I was baffled how something could play so poorly. There wasn't even enough sense of discovery to keep me going onwards like Rambo or Ultima Exodus, it just felt like a unreasonable game centered around attrition and being obtuse.
Kid icarus is really hard too
That awful music is forever dancing around in my head now. A curse upon you, Mr. Parish, you, your descendants, and your descendant’s descendants. For three months.
You are the MAN! I say it again, best channel for vintage NES on RUclips. Thanks brother!!
I really enjoy Hydlide, even today. I get the same flow state feeling playing it as something like Tetris. The grinding is simple but requires just enough attention to keep you engaged. The music gets in your head and stays there. The map is small and the quest is short. It’s just a good immersive time, once you know what you’re doing.
I am sorry but enduring that horrible Hydlide tune is quite the challenge!
Hydlide was one of those games that looked intersting, promising even in pictures. You can see it has roleplaying elements and even looks Zelda ish if you squint. It was one of those that no one you knew talked about at school and didnt run acfoss a lot. Id have rented it if it was in my region at the time. Time and experience since then has shown we didnt mtiss out on a classic
Love to hear the word "ensorcelled"
This is an amazing channel! I do have a question! Are you using a filter or are you recording through a old cam recorder? If so, thats very cool! Anyways I enjoy to look through all your videos!
It’s a crappy, dying JVC VHS-C camcorder.
"Jim in the rough" was a much better title than the original "Uncut Jims"
Pot = Pothole. A Boy and His Blob logic.
I was going to say the same thing.
Would that make sense in Japanese?
@@todesziege The term "Pothole" as a loanword does appear to be used in Japanese, so maybe?
Every time I try to think of Hydlide, I think of Deadly Towers.
I'm not sure why.
I got this game because I had beaten the first Zelda and while waiting for the second one I wanted to play something similar.
It was, ehh...I had to grind a lot to become powerful enough to defeat certain enemies and Jeremy is right, the goals were not very clear. I liked the life bar concept ( I had not played Y's yet) but some of the secrets were odd.
Naming the knight "Jim" still causes me to scratch my head.
I remember picking Hydlide up a few years after release when my usual rental shop was selling off some old inventory and had it for a dollar or two. Unfortunately, I also bought Heroes of the Lance in the same sale. I had no idea what I was getting myself into.
I was under the impression that Tower of Druaga predated Hydlide. Is the internet lying to me about release dates?
The Tower of Druaga predated Hydlide by a few months, the developer has talked about how playing Druaga inspired Hydlide.
EDIT: Oh I just got the part where Jeremy talks about how much Hydlide inspired Druaga... may want to cut that bit, Jeremy. Hydlide did absolutely inspire Zelda though. It even has the same intro 'text crawl'. The Famicom/NES version of Hydlide is different from the original. It's "Hydlide Special" and has a magic system (introduced in Hydlide II), a terrible song (also from Hydlide II) and it sounds like there are a few other changes. I just beat the MSX version last month and don't remember the sandworms (but I do remember them in Hydlide II).
I’m listening to this on a commute to work. This sounds like a parody of 1980s video game tropes. I lost it at the part with the trees.
The thing, though, is that it's actually accurate to fairy lore, as fairies are generally associated with trees, in some fashion, across various beliefs, even if it's something as simple as just hiding in them.
I hold a very specific, life-long grudge against Hydlide on NES. Horrible, wildly disappointing game, especially when you're a kid starving for the _promise_ of what it _looked_ like, versus the gargantuan letdown it ultimately ended up being.
I forgot to mention its sequel, Super Hylide for Sega Genesis was improved in some ways, but Virtual Hylide for Sega Saturn was AWFUL!
Never drew the line between bump combat in Ys / Hydlide and Rogue, but yeah that makes sense.
The nice thing about Rogue combat is that you can back away from overwhelmingly strong monsters on your next turn instead of thinking you’re going to mow down an enemy and getting mowed down yourself
Only Jeremy could make Hydlide profound. Bravo, sir!
It's a shame the Famicom port came out later than it should *and* crowbar-ed unnecessary elements of the sequel into it, ruining the audio and 3rd fairy puzzle in the process. By no means is the PC-88 original a masterpiece, but it's still a decent puzzle adventure that greatly mitigated the obscurantist excesses of Druaga before it. The Windows remake deserves a re-release, I'd say, but Project EGG just brought the OG to Switch for anyone interested.
It is 1989… and there is NOT time for Hydlide.
This game singlehandedly introduced me to the AVGN. The irony of the knight’s name being revealed to be Jim also is not lost on me, nor did it appear to be lost on the Nerd given how disgusted he was to be sharing a first name with the protagonist of the game that he had been tearing down all throughout the video. 😆
12:25 - Clever character naming there!!
As a kid, I did NOT get the hang of this game. I was a console kid, unable to fathom why a character sprite would “attack” invisibly.
Hydlide was my most remorseful purchase, when I had it or Baseball Stars to choose from during a sale at KB Toys.
I still loathe it. Kuso game.
I love your titles, they get pretty creative at times 😁
*someone whistles the Indiana Jones theme*
Me, in 1985: Fan of Hydlide, eh?
Just wondering- how come whenever you mention Dragon Slayer, you always use footage of the Gameboy port? Sure, I remember that fondly (and that music is endlessly catchy), but it was probably the least version of the game, largely because it was almost completely unbeatable, given that the length of a complete playthrough was probably over 4 hours (or more than the life of a set of AA batteries) and it had neither a battery save nor a password. Or was it the only version ever to get a Western release?
I think it’s because it’s the one version Jeremy’s covered in the past on Game Boy Works/already had footage of it. That series covers GB releases from around the world, whereas NES Works is mainly focused on the US side of things.
As far as I can tell, the first game of the series the US got properly was Legacy of the Wizard on NES, and Faxanadu after that.
Ensourcled is my new favorite word
Gotta love the Indiana Jones theme music in this game.
Indiana Jim!
love me some scarlet grace, i hope they make another saga
but yeah, hydlide is pretty much the xevious of jrpgs, at least as far as influence in the genre goes anyway, but definitely not in polish or accessibility the way xevious is
The new one is dropping this year
Wow, hearing this stupid song just gave me flashbacks, its infuriating!. Pre-teen me rented this from Blockbuster, with no manual as per usual in those days. I had no idea what was going on, and no real way to figure it out...
“perambulatory” another one damn
randomized tree that you have to check all of them jeezus christ how were people suppose to figure that out
Hey boss do you want a full soundtrack? Nah, just make a 10 second tune and let it repeat infinitely
Had Hydlide growing up-- probably bought because of the easy "we LOVED Zelda, this looks JUST LIKE IT" logic. It was conquered by father at least once, I know, but I just enjoyed occasionally popping it in, accomplishing little (the mechanics of an RPG were beyond the young me at the time), but still attempting to understand more and more why this game did what it did compared to Zelda. It's a shame we got it as late as we did, it forces comparison to everything that came after, but winds up looking like the cheap Brazilian animation bootleg. One of Japan's most influential games, remembered as the Ratatoing of the NES.
Between this and Legacy of the Wizard, I think it's tied for baffling rental weekends.
Hydlide: More fun than Deadly Towers!
I love Hydlide 😃 it hit me at the perfect age and I loved the challenge. It was so thrilling when I finally beat it
Lol those trees remind me of one of my favorite Simpsons. Because trees can't defend themselves! Except for the Mexican fighting tree
I remember renting this, not understanding it, and going to play outside for the weekend. But as an adult that has developed a taste for vicious RPGs and classic kusoge.... I wanna play it. I NEED to play it.
Can't wait for Dragon Quest!
I rented this once and i still want my 2 dollars back.
“Sometimes, loving history means hating the current moment.” 👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
Didn't Druaga come out before Hydlide? Or is there some weirdness with release dates that I'm missing?
the original pc version peedates a lot of japanese games
The lead designer behind Hydlide said that Druaga was one of its inspirations, so I'd say yes.
"Mom, can we get Zelda?"
"We have Zelda at home!"
Zelda at home....
It's astounding how much slower, annoying, and worse looking the Famicom/NES version is than other versions, especially the older ones. It's really not a fair comparison to Zelda due to its age, but it makes one wonder why T&E Soft didn't seem to even look at contemporary works in the genre when porting it. I suppose it bears all the signs of a quick and dirty port, done either by a very small internal team or outsourced.
I owned this as a child and I wanted to enjoy it so much... It's so punishing
(This video taught me something about this game. Like I didn't know about the defensive combat. Like what!!)
“ensorcelled” definitely forcing that into my everyday vocabulary from now on
So many panties in a twist over a simple increase in the intricacy of pacman combat. Reminds me of the crocodile tears over Morrowind combat. Never would have guessed so many were so confused over such basic design concepts.
I remember renting this one and having no real idea wtf I was doing. always wild when those earlier famicom titles showed up way later over on NES, though!
We got a lot of those in 1989: Bomberman, Star Soldier, Kung-Fu Heroes, Mappy-Land, Hydlide, Dragon Warrior, Castlequest, King's Knight, Dig Dug II, etc. The NES was near the height of its popularity in North America and publishers scrambled to cash in on the craze while it lasted. Dusting off an old Famicom game was a quick way to bring product to market.
I'm just now starting the video, but I'm calling 0 days since Tower of Duraga was mentioned
You wish it was THAT game!
I have to assume that this game financially succeeded largely just because of the lack of games like this, so it sold well enough based on its novelty of concept. I’ve never played a Hydlide game even remotely fun once in my life, does such a thing exist? Maybe one of the obscure computer platforms it came out on before the Famicom faired better with it?
I remember renting this game back in the day. And even with just a rental, I felt ripped off! 😅
Thw limited run link doesn't load. error page
Always gotta be careful about ensorcelment.
It's a real danger these days.
Why am i hearing the Indiana Jones music in a part of the song.
It looks so bad when everything moves one whole tile at a time.
5:50 is demonic!! 🤒
ProJared's absolute hatred for this game is always a good watch. Thi game and Virtual Hydlide showed me that even JRPGs can be garbage despite it being a generally good genre.
so it's now an endless days without mentioning heyanko alien :P
gah the music.....
Ah yes, the game that got rented when you were one of the last kids to show up to the video store on a Friday night.
nice LOTR reference jeremy
It's funny how desperate game consoles were back in the day for software that their "seal of quality" amounted to a rubber stamp
To elaborate if this game came out on the NES at launch I think it would be far more permissible and accepted than when it came out given how far software on the platform had come by the time this was launched
There is an XP exploit involving a zombie.
1:55 'Ensorceled'
gott dayum