Im so mad it took me 2 years to find this. Jute Gyte could have hours dedicated to explaining things like this in his music. Excellent explanation of an excellent piece.
I'm generally drawn towards off kilter, avant garde artists within black and death metal. That being said, few acts have given me such headaches as Jute Gyte has, although I've got tons of respect for Adam and his persistence with his craft. If anything, having such freedom when composing can lead to option paralysis pretty easily, but he just keeps churning out compelling stuff.
Awesome, always great to see more microtonal analysis. That dense polyrhythm is really cool of course as well, excellent choice of riff here. Regarding the closing question, it is objectively the case that you can produce music so complex that no human mind can truly process what is really happening under the surface. In the age of programmed music this is extremely easy to do as well, you can write a riff that is a 69:420 polyrhythm in 666-TET at 2000 BPM if you want (and if it doesn't melt your computer, that specific example might not be feasible but you get the idea) and while that would literally be "what the music is" it wouldn't be how anyone would perceive it, which is most likely just a thick wall of dissonant noise. However, if we stay away from the absolute physical limits of comprehension then it gets more interesting, since the point at which any detail becomes "too much" is going to vary from person to person. I think you've mentioned this a few times in these videos, experience and ability are obviously a factor in how quickly someone can process what they're hearing and how accurate their understanding is. Someone somewhere is struggling to bob their head to a simple 7/8 groove right now, while you're following Meshuggah and Car Bomb riffs to a degree that you could probably sub in for a song if one of their guitarists had a cramp. You should probably always write for the purpose of being understood (although saying what someone "should" do in art is a losing battle), but I think there is definitely value in pushing the limits since it's difficult to say what other people are going to be able to pick up on in time that will make their own experience with the music more interesting. For alienating experimental music I'd say a good rule of thumb is to write up to a level where you can just barely follow what's going on yourself, that way you can guarantee it's comprehensible (obviously, since you're comprehending it) but probably also ensuring that there will always be something more to discover for most people that aren't going to do a heavy analysis on their own. Plus it makes it interesting to revisit your old music, since with enough time you can forget what exactly is happening and be just as confused as anyone else.
Wow! Never thought anybody could explain Adam's music outside Adam himself. Incredible job sir ! If I decided to study music I think I would travel to NY and beg you to teach me ! Lol. Please do a piece about Colin 😉
Your conclusion definately helped to hear the music differently. I've known about Jute Gyte for quite some time and always appreciated the artistry, but your deconstruction really changed how my hearing percieved this section from "ok wtf that's surely interesting to write and definately an interesting artistic perspective but.. wtf" to "yooo this is sick". And I want to stress again, not only my cerebral perception changed but literally how I hear this music. Great work and I hope you do more stuff of the deep end of metal music. (and maybe take a look at vildhjartas recent album in terms of motivs, although that might be a mammoth of a project)
Probably the only person I follow on RUclips that I genuinely wait for more videos from. I know nothing about music theory, but this inspires me to try and learn so I can apply it to my own music.
That opening section of Oviri was always so difficult to wrap my head around. Thanks for shedding light on it. Especially with this album he really went all out with the rhythms
I agree that It’s interesting to look at the pitch composition method but that it doesn’t aid our listening experience very much. It kind of reminds me of the perpetual struggle in mathematics between pure and applied math. Pure math becomes infinitely more beautiful when we find its manifestations in nature and applications in real life. There’s value to both sides, and I tend to favor pure math, but I have to admit there’s a level of meaninglessness to it if we don’t ground it in the real at some point. My favorite example is imaginary numbers. Yes, you can use them and do math with them but what’s the point? Oh wait you need them to do physics correctly. It’s a fun but of history to study.
I like how pure math feels like an exploration of fictitious space thats generated by some simple rules, yet it creates structures and complexities that are not obvious just from the rules itself. It is basically like getting a better understanding of how game mechanics of a video game interact with each other. On the other hand, applied math, while it sometimes feels a bit crude, you can actually make programs based on it with our current computers and make yourself orient in the world, without too much error, which is a miracle by itself. I get a different category of feelings for both. I guess I do get different feelings for different way of looking at music too.
Very good video AS USUAL. Just to add to the comment about whether or not the note sequence could be considered a "row" (around 15:00), it's true that for 12 tone rows you would need all possible notes of the scale with no repetition but you could just consider this a "tone row" and make your Matrix based on that. Then you're not breaking any rules. And you won't get kicked out of music.
It's probably far too simplistic. But to me the link between concept and hearing is simply that this shit is so like mechanized, angular, and chaotic, that one's experience of the music is just that. Hopelessly chaotic, unnatural, disorienting. I also wonder if it is just art for art's sake. Whether or not the "quantum level" analysis of structure is necessary or meaningful sort of removes the question of expression. Apparently Adam gets something out of having these wild schemes and making music out of it. Some people get a rush out of being like "ah shit this is microtonal serial aleatoric black metal, sick." I think there's probably value in knowing that a structure "exists" regardless of whether or not you can hear it or latch it to your experience. The journey of understanding, and potentially hearing some or all of it eventually is a relevant expression and participation in art. IDK wtf im saying anymore lmao
i genuinely enjoy this music aesthetically. if you read his lyrics, they give more insight into the reasoning behind some of the musical choices. or maybe it's the other way around. anyway, it's pure nihilism and suffering in an universe that has "laws" expressed in mathematics but also a lot of random chaos. that's what the music seem to express. or to put it in another way: this is what depression looks like when you have a 200 IQ.
I think that's a good point! It definitely makes an aesthetic difference to me knowing *if* something has a structure even if I don't know or can't hear what that structure is
Glad to see someone shine a light on Jute Gyte. I've just started getting into music theory so I could get a better grasp of my guitar so I guess I'm a part of the caveman demographic of your viewers but it's still really refreshing to see analysis of the weird shit I'm into outside of music reviews hosted on blogs noone reads. All that aside, would you happen to have some recommendations for resources for a theory beginner like me?
Thanks! It's a question I get a lot, and will do a video about soon, but the short answer is that it depends on what you want to use it for. If you're into jazz or classical tradition harmony there's tons of stuff, if you want harmony theory for metal or anything about rhythm there's a lot less. Listening and learning stuff will always serve you well, and I also have some ideas for beginner videos that I want to make (though I find these require a lot more thought than the more advanced stuff lol)
@@metalmusictheory5401 If you ever get around to doing a beginners series that would be amazing. I've just started with a new guitar teacher and hope he can answer some of my theoretical questions since I want to up my own writing game. One thing I've been kinda curious about was if there is a sort of theory behind making a song feel grand, or well (I hate using that word) epic. I'm thinking of something like the second half of ISIS' Threshold of Transformation, or a lot of the stuff that YOB and Pallbearer do, or Hell (particularily on Hell III). Which is a very vague description I guess since I bet most of them use different techniques to lend grandeur to their music. I could've sworn I've once overread a discussion on this, and my memory is foggy but I think it was something along the lines of combining different scales, but I can't quite recall.
@@Intaminator Those sorts of theory ideas are tricky, because you probably won't find any common threads in all the examples that feel a certain way; that's part of why music theory is so frustrating and sometimes seems so opaque and unsatisfying, because what people really care about is making songs feel a certain way, but there are a million paths to get there and the feelings aren't normally reducible to simple (or even complex) theoretical concepts. But the deeper you get into music and the more you know about it the more you'll be able to figure out strategies for creating stuff that sounds how you want it to, if that makes sense. Good luck with lessons!
Wow this is super interesting, you make music analysis very interesting and useful - rather than dry - I have a question that I formed after my masters degree: what do you feel is the point of musical analysis? Sometimes i have felt people are just labelling sounds with arbitrary words for no reason, or drawing connections between things that aren’t connected. This video is great because it feels like a tutorial and dissection of a very aurally difficult passage. In turn acting like some form of compositional and practical guide. Do you have thoughts on this? I don’t believe musical aesthetics and experience can be fully scientifically understood, so I wondered if those ideas ever crop up in your analyses? P.s. Love your videos, very insightful and interesting.
Thank you! I think music analysis can do different things in different contexts, though the last few years I've kind of settled on the idea that music analysis is a way of sharing and expanding ways of hearing, though there are also plenty of useful compositional things you can get out of it sometimes. But I also sometimes feel like it's useless haha! And I definitely agree that there's nothing scientific about it. Best of luck with your masters, if you're asking these questions you're probably on the right track!
I make all of them! They're mostly either wacky arrangements of pop songs or wacky arrangements of the riff I talk about in the video. This one is a little thing I made with some theory students based on the horn riff in "Hips Don't Lie"
Looking through this, I'm curious how Adam created the runs at measures 18, 20, etc (the "transition measures"). Were they produced aleatorically as well? OR were they just chosen to sound like that?
Also only now I'm seeing that you've done analysis of some of my favorite songs, Old Alpine Pang, the Cavern, Mirror Reaper... Can't wait to dive into these too. Do you happen to be familiar with The Red Chords Fused together in revolving doors (particularily the track Dreaming in Dog Years)?
I have a quarter-tone guitar that I'm thinking of selling. I've had it for like 12 years and very rarely find any use for it, mainly because the frets are just way too small for my sausage fingers. If anyone's interested let me know.
10:35 Curious reversed riffs are one of the basic weapons of metal. Could be another trope. This just reverses/mirrors pretty much everything it can on top as using chance as a melodic idea generator and not matching the subdivisions from either end. The 4/4 and 3/4 measure almost seem like they are meant to make it more digestible, dont you think?
After looking it up it seems both ways of saying it are used, though you're right that there does seem to be a logical contradiction here. I guess when I say "3/4 sharp" I mean "three quarter tones sharp," which is the way I've heard it (though it's been a while since I've played anything microtonal with anyone so I might be misremembering)... though now I think about it maybe we just said half sharp and half flat because "A three halves flat" doesn't sound like something people say... Didn't give it enough thought when filming!
Fuck that was terrible to listen to. But glad to see the envelope getting pushed in some way. Someone will take good ideas from this and make something less awful on the ears. To black metal fans. I know it’s specifically designed to be awful. They did it well. I respect that.
Jute Gyte!? Alright mate, you win. I'm signing up to the Patreon.
Im so mad it took me 2 years to find this. Jute Gyte could have hours dedicated to explaining things like this in his music. Excellent explanation of an excellent piece.
I'm generally drawn towards off kilter, avant garde artists within black and death metal.
That being said, few acts have given me such headaches as Jute Gyte has, although I've got tons of respect for Adam and his persistence with his craft. If anything, having such freedom when composing can lead to option paralysis pretty easily, but he just keeps churning out compelling stuff.
YOU DID THE MICROTONES
Freaking excellent channel
Awesome, always great to see more microtonal analysis. That dense polyrhythm is really cool of course as well, excellent choice of riff here.
Regarding the closing question, it is objectively the case that you can produce music so complex that no human mind can truly process what is really happening under the surface. In the age of programmed music this is extremely easy to do as well, you can write a riff that is a 69:420 polyrhythm in 666-TET at 2000 BPM if you want (and if it doesn't melt your computer, that specific example might not be feasible but you get the idea) and while that would literally be "what the music is" it wouldn't be how anyone would perceive it, which is most likely just a thick wall of dissonant noise.
However, if we stay away from the absolute physical limits of comprehension then it gets more interesting, since the point at which any detail becomes "too much" is going to vary from person to person. I think you've mentioned this a few times in these videos, experience and ability are obviously a factor in how quickly someone can process what they're hearing and how accurate their understanding is. Someone somewhere is struggling to bob their head to a simple 7/8 groove right now, while you're following Meshuggah and Car Bomb riffs to a degree that you could probably sub in for a song if one of their guitarists had a cramp.
You should probably always write for the purpose of being understood (although saying what someone "should" do in art is a losing battle), but I think there is definitely value in pushing the limits since it's difficult to say what other people are going to be able to pick up on in time that will make their own experience with the music more interesting. For alienating experimental music I'd say a good rule of thumb is to write up to a level where you can just barely follow what's going on yourself, that way you can guarantee it's comprehensible (obviously, since you're comprehending it) but probably also ensuring that there will always be something more to discover for most people that aren't going to do a heavy analysis on their own. Plus it makes it interesting to revisit your old music, since with enough time you can forget what exactly is happening and be just as confused as anyone else.
Very well put!
Wow! Never thought anybody could explain Adam's music outside Adam himself. Incredible job sir ! If I decided to study music I think I would travel to NY and beg you to teach me ! Lol. Please do a piece about Colin 😉
Cool Esoctrilihum shirt! I was looking at getting the same one
Wow, what kind of mad man you have to be to come up with all of this!
In a good way of course
I’m in awe that you even attempted this. Excellent work as always! This must’ve been a Herculean effort.
I hardly ever finish these videos on the first watch because I look up the band and end up listening to a whole discography instead
Your conclusion definately helped to hear the music differently. I've known about Jute Gyte for quite some time and always appreciated the artistry, but your deconstruction really changed how my hearing percieved this section from "ok wtf that's surely interesting to write and definately an interesting artistic perspective but.. wtf" to "yooo this is sick". And I want to stress again, not only my cerebral perception changed but literally how I hear this music. Great work and I hope you do more stuff of the deep end of metal music. (and maybe take a look at vildhjartas recent album in terms of motivs, although that might be a mammoth of a project)
JUTE GYTE MY MAN HELL YEAH
Wild how much that second to last measure of 3/4 in the cycle helps almost make this sound like a more conventional metal progression
I feel the same way! Almost power chordy
Probably the only person I follow on RUclips that I genuinely wait for more videos from. I know nothing about music theory, but this inspires me to try and learn so I can apply it to my own music.
Thank you so much!
That opening section of Oviri was always so difficult to wrap my head around. Thanks for shedding light on it. Especially with this album he really went all out with the rhythms
I agree that It’s interesting to look at the pitch composition method but that it doesn’t aid our listening experience very much. It kind of reminds me of the perpetual struggle in mathematics between pure and applied math. Pure math becomes infinitely more beautiful when we find its manifestations in nature and applications in real life. There’s value to both sides, and I tend to favor pure math, but I have to admit there’s a level of meaninglessness to it if we don’t ground it in the real at some point. My favorite example is imaginary numbers. Yes, you can use them and do math with them but what’s the point? Oh wait you need them to do physics correctly. It’s a fun but of history to study.
Also I can’t wait to look into jute gyte more. Thanks for thantifaxath as well!
I like how pure math feels like an exploration of fictitious space thats generated by some simple rules, yet it creates structures and complexities that are not obvious just from the rules itself. It is basically like getting a better understanding of how game mechanics of a video game interact with each other. On the other hand, applied math, while it sometimes feels a bit crude, you can actually make programs based on it with our current computers and make yourself orient in the world, without too much error, which is a miracle by itself. I get a different category of feelings for both. I guess I do get different feelings for different way of looking at music too.
Very good video AS USUAL.
Just to add to the comment about whether or not the note sequence could be considered a "row" (around 15:00), it's true that for 12 tone rows you would need all possible notes of the scale with no repetition but you could just consider this a "tone row" and make your Matrix based on that. Then you're not breaking any rules. And you won't get kicked out of music.
It's probably far too simplistic. But to me the link between concept and hearing is simply that this shit is so like mechanized, angular, and chaotic, that one's experience of the music is just that. Hopelessly chaotic, unnatural, disorienting. I also wonder if it is just art for art's sake. Whether or not the "quantum level" analysis of structure is necessary or meaningful sort of removes the question of expression. Apparently Adam gets something out of having these wild schemes and making music out of it. Some people get a rush out of being like "ah shit this is microtonal serial aleatoric black metal, sick." I think there's probably value in knowing that a structure "exists" regardless of whether or not you can hear it or latch it to your experience. The journey of understanding, and potentially hearing some or all of it eventually is a relevant expression and participation in art. IDK wtf im saying anymore lmao
i genuinely enjoy this music aesthetically. if you read his lyrics, they give more insight into the reasoning behind some of the musical choices. or maybe it's the other way around. anyway, it's pure nihilism and suffering in an universe that has "laws" expressed in mathematics but also a lot of random chaos. that's what the music seem to express. or to put it in another way: this is what depression looks like when you have a 200 IQ.
I think that's a good point! It definitely makes an aesthetic difference to me knowing *if* something has a structure even if I don't know or can't hear what that structure is
Glad to see someone shine a light on Jute Gyte. I've just started getting into music theory so I could get a better grasp of my guitar so I guess I'm a part of the caveman demographic of your viewers but it's still really refreshing to see analysis of the weird shit I'm into outside of music reviews hosted on blogs noone reads.
All that aside, would you happen to have some recommendations for resources for a theory beginner like me?
Thanks! It's a question I get a lot, and will do a video about soon, but the short answer is that it depends on what you want to use it for. If you're into jazz or classical tradition harmony there's tons of stuff, if you want harmony theory for metal or anything about rhythm there's a lot less. Listening and learning stuff will always serve you well, and I also have some ideas for beginner videos that I want to make (though I find these require a lot more thought than the more advanced stuff lol)
@@metalmusictheory5401 If you ever get around to doing a beginners series that would be amazing. I've just started with a new guitar teacher and hope he can answer some of my theoretical questions since I want to up my own writing game. One thing I've been kinda curious about was if there is a sort of theory behind making a song feel grand, or well (I hate using that word) epic. I'm thinking of something like the second half of ISIS' Threshold of Transformation, or a lot of the stuff that YOB and Pallbearer do, or Hell (particularily on Hell III). Which is a very vague description I guess since I bet most of them use different techniques to lend grandeur to their music. I could've sworn I've once overread a discussion on this, and my memory is foggy but I think it was something along the lines of combining different scales, but I can't quite recall.
@@Intaminator Those sorts of theory ideas are tricky, because you probably won't find any common threads in all the examples that feel a certain way; that's part of why music theory is so frustrating and sometimes seems so opaque and unsatisfying, because what people really care about is making songs feel a certain way, but there are a million paths to get there and the feelings aren't normally reducible to simple (or even complex) theoretical concepts. But the deeper you get into music and the more you know about it the more you'll be able to figure out strategies for creating stuff that sounds how you want it to, if that makes sense. Good luck with lessons!
New ringtone just dropped: 5:57
Wow this is super interesting, you make music analysis very interesting and useful - rather than dry - I have a question that I formed after my masters degree: what do you feel is the point of musical analysis?
Sometimes i have felt people are just labelling sounds with arbitrary words for no reason, or drawing connections between things that aren’t connected. This video is great because it feels like a tutorial and dissection of a very aurally difficult passage. In turn acting like some form of compositional and practical guide.
Do you have thoughts on this? I don’t believe musical aesthetics and experience can be fully scientifically understood, so I wondered if those ideas ever crop up in your analyses?
P.s. Love your videos, very insightful and interesting.
Thank you! I think music analysis can do different things in different contexts, though the last few years I've kind of settled on the idea that music analysis is a way of sharing and expanding ways of hearing, though there are also plenty of useful compositional things you can get out of it sometimes. But I also sometimes feel like it's useless haha! And I definitely agree that there's nothing scientific about it. Best of luck with your masters, if you're asking these questions you're probably on the right track!
Such a great channel , thank you
Cheers BC
That... made sense. Wow.
Hey man, do you compose your outro song or are they someone else's material? Fantastic video as usual and praise Gyte!
I make all of them! They're mostly either wacky arrangements of pop songs or wacky arrangements of the riff I talk about in the video. This one is a little thing I made with some theory students based on the horn riff in "Hips Don't Lie"
@@metalmusictheory5401 That's very cool of you :)
Looking through this, I'm curious how Adam created the runs at measures 18, 20, etc (the "transition measures"). Were they produced aleatorically as well? OR were they just chosen to sound like that?
Also only now I'm seeing that you've done analysis of some of my favorite songs, Old Alpine Pang, the Cavern, Mirror Reaper... Can't wait to dive into these too. Do you happen to be familiar with The Red Chords Fused together in revolving doors (particularily the track Dreaming in Dog Years)?
Love The Red Chord! Been too long since I listened too them, need to put them back in rotation, thanks for the reminder!
Sick riff, sicker shirt
The outro music is 👌👌👌
I have a quarter-tone guitar that I'm thinking of selling. I've had it for like 12 years and very rarely find any use for it, mainly because the frets are just way too small for my sausage fingers. If anyone's interested let me know.
i’m interested but i live in south east asia lol
19:52 wait a sec... did you just Rick Roll us, Jute-Gyte-ified? Or I am hearing a bit of Dschinghis Khan's Moskau in there too?!
Haha it's a little jingle I made with some theory students based on the horn riff from "Hips Don't Lie"
@@metalmusictheory5401 ahh! of course, I can hear it immediately
Lol i went and litsened to the whole album front to back it was a lot to get through but lemme tell you man was that interesting
10:35 Curious reversed riffs are one of the basic weapons of metal. Could be another trope. This just reverses/mirrors pretty much everything it can on top as using chance as a melodic idea generator and not matching the subdivisions from either end.
The 4/4 and 3/4 measure almost seem like they are meant to make it more digestible, dont you think?
I agree that they're there to give it some more punch and momentum!
7:42 I always thought it was A, A-1/2-#, A#, A-3/2-#
Otherwise A-3/4-# Wohls be sharper than A#
After looking it up it seems both ways of saying it are used, though you're right that there does seem to be a logical contradiction here. I guess when I say "3/4 sharp" I mean "three quarter tones sharp," which is the way I've heard it (though it's been a while since I've played anything microtonal with anyone so I might be misremembering)... though now I think about it maybe we just said half sharp and half flat because "A three halves flat" doesn't sound like something people say... Didn't give it enough thought when filming!
AS A MUSICIAN I THINK THIS TYPE OF CHORDS AND AMBIENCE SOUND BETTER WHEN THEY ARE PLAYED SLOWLY🤔
I keep trying. I really can’t get into this. Can anyone help?
I've found a theme song for my 16bit game!
Have you looked into M.A.N who used 48 fret necks to play microtonal riffs?
Hello again.
U should collab with corey from 12tone, it would be really cool
Haha would love to down the road! Don't know if they're into metal at all?
Fuck that was terrible to listen to. But glad to see the envelope getting pushed in some way. Someone will take good ideas from this and make something less awful on the ears.
To black metal fans. I know it’s specifically designed to be awful. They did it well. I respect that.
d+d metal?
As cool as the composition is, I honestly just don't like hearing it lol
scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should. Or something like that. Lol
@@JoeBidensAdderall lmao
kyle rittenhouse