you forget, we killed all the skilled cops in pd2 It is a lore feature. Captain wnters just left a handbook that a random shild found when clearing out his desk.
@@k96man No joke, the only guy remaining from the Payday: The Heist days, is the guy who designed the masks, and funnily enough came up with the name. Not even a gameplay guy. It's literally payday in name alone
I'm pretty sure the issue with snipers not shooting at all is an attempt to fix how Payday 2's snipers would sometimes act like pro CS players and quickscope you as soon as they spawned, before they even turned on their lasers or got to the actual sniping position and basically being unreactable instant damage in certain heists. Of course, in true Overkill fashion they've basically overcorrected so badly that the enemy basically stopped shooting you at all (or they just outright broke the AI, it's hard to tell).
The funny thing is, mods in PD2 have fixed that too. In the Restoration mod, the audio starts to get quieter when he sees you, and shoots when it gets silent. It's a short window, but gives you a way to counter it.
As a game designer that's a really simpler fix, just have a timer that stops the Snipers from being able to shoot until the player spawns instead of doing map loading. It's not even that hard to do.
To make sure the damage (which is supposed to be QUICK anyways) isn't instant they added a... 7 SECOND aim time, yes, their laser floats around you for 7 SECONDS. For 7 SECONDS his laser is just swaying around.
@@maxdong3514Yea, impact flashes on moving players/close range and have him gas the players if they are not moving (or alternativly, he could continously launch gas on objectives to deny them for the players until he is taken care off)
Payday 2 has the "janky but made with love" style Payday 3 has the "PLEASE BUY THE GAME WE ARE GOING BANKRUPT" style edit: can you guys not fight in my replies it's a joke dont take it seriously
@@beagan8348 Insinuating that Payday 3 isn't fun. The only reason you say that is because it has less content than a game that had 10 years of support. Play launch Payday 2 for an extended period of time, you will be biting iron before long.
@ChaoticMess5618 no payday 3 is just worse, it even released with less heists than payday 2 on launch. being worse than payday 2 on launch is kind of really hard and they succeed fantastically
Bruh I used to play road rage and other heists on Overkill solo, and oh my god. It's literally baby sitting simulator. At least in payday 2 they compensated. The ai was horrible because of Diesel Engine, but they gave them alot of health so atleast they can tank dozers, revive you without dying, etc. In payday 3 we have no such compensation. The ai is still useless, they have no brains. The amount of times they've stood in the open to get sniped in astounding.
@@Bedic-Mag Real + You can select team boosts in PD2, like faster action speed, faster reloads, more sprinting stamina, hell, the bots could have INSPIRE ACE on a 2 minute cooldown along with everything i said before. But, in Classic Starbreeze Fashion, everything in PD3 HAD to be worse than PD2.
If the turret ever comes back it needs to stop having so much hp like ok repairable shields u can disable it for a few seconds then kill it but it has too much hp after no more shields
Honestly I think you could bring back the turret if you keep the satellite weakpoint and have that shut it down. Make it a bit smaller. Then its like, a super sniper in its purpose; Greatly endangers sightlines and requires quick aim to dispatch.
The turrets also have a damage cap so your absurd Zerk-Overkill-Unseen Strike Thanatos build cant double tap it. Realistically the only high speed way of killing it is crit akimbos, which are just OP on their own.
@@UnintelligibleYT Yeah the turret was definitely overtuned, but at least it had an effect on the map. If the FBI can showed up in a PD2 loud bank, it would be dispatched without leaving the bank just because of how vulnerable the dish is. The turret was at least "a problem" which required my crew to plan the rest of the heist around it.
@@UnintelligibleYT Its more like: "FBI! Special Agent Rebecca! From now on, I am-" *Satellite dish gets destroyed* "They destroyed the goddamn antenna"
it would have been cooler if the fucking FBI van actually spawned special FBI units. That'd make it actually feel important, maybe even have some special enemy variants...
Who would've known that an enemy called a cloaker is meant to cloak into the surround environment by hiding alone or in a group with others, instead of running towards you from 2 miles away.
To be honest, Payday the Heist got the best enemy ai, they got REALLY DAMM GOOD TACTICS, like pulling back and check the cameras to plan an assault, or send shields first, smoke and push, or send a bulldozer to distract you while a squad of cloakers infiltrated from behind. Not to mention how the swats used full auto only when you where close enough.
Funnily enough, a lot of it is smoke and mirrors and good level design/scripting (a lot like the AI of FEAR 1). Cameras really don’t do anything to the AI (found that out when looking on the wiki after being curious one day). Especially with the RNG events like a Bulldozer in the armored van in Slaughterhouse, or them hanging out in the vault or cloakers waiting by the escape - both that can happen in First World Bank. Them also speaking to/noting nearby specials, from what I know, doesn’t really do much but be an audio cue for the player on what’s nearby. Since they couldn’t afford voice actors for most of the specials. It makes it *feel* like the cops are smarter than they really are. When they’re really about the same as Payday 2’s AI. That’s what good atmosphere, clever design choices, and proper scripting/level design gets you.
@@SpecterSensorial The Bot AI animations were a nice touch, but they didn’t have to include knocked over animations that make them a still target or the sort of unnecessarily slow climbing animations. I remember a few singeplayer runs were ruined because the bots took forever to get to me. But yeah, I miss those little animations since they tied in well with the heisters actually talking about the stuff happening in the heist.
I feel like shields having destructible visors would make more sense if they actually reacted to it other than playing a voice-line. Like, what if shields were normally aggressive and constantly pushing up on you, but then if/when you break their visor, they go more defensive? They duck their head down (so you can't just continue shooting them through the broken visor), and remain stationary as cover to use by other cops, and don't just continue charge forward as you shoot them in the jaw repeatedly, making you have to switch up your tactics? Also you forgot mention the fact that shields are practically useless anyway because Starbreeze gave us a free "Kill the shield" button (shock grenade) and there's absolutely no reason not to bring that since (in my experience) it outperforms every other throwable.
I did not forget, I just didn't care, since I can kill the shield with the tiniest bullets without downsides. But you do have a point, there's so much more to be done with this game, just with the shield alone, alas, videogames are no longer a temple of innovation.
why are thier visors breaking in the first place? it supposed to be a ballistic shield and it can't resiste a pistole, they just slapped a car window on it, he even have a voice line saying who built this s'it 😭
The shields should have been way more durable, unless you are using explosives. Trying to destroy a shield head on with normal ammo should be like trying to kill a bulldozer with body shots. This gives the player a last resort option, if the shield is in a tight chokepoint with no way to flank it.
I be coming up with good ideas like this i know will never see the light of day. Gotta understand the money, management, and bureaucracy that snips most fun/passionate design choices because the motive is always income based nowadays 😂
Payday 2 cloaker: will find you and get you even if he has to break the laws of physics Payday 3 cloaker: can't get somebody that's standing on a table
PD 2 cloakers: hide in every corner and exploit distraction from other units to jump on you ( they are literally programmed to start closing on you when the assaults start and ambush during rest phases.) PD 3 cloakers: run in open ground, presenting themselves as the obvious targets.
I mean it's okay to enjoy the game, be optimistic about it, want it to succeed and improve, I hope I didn't take that away from you, it's not my goal. Maybe something *will* be done about it next year? Why not? It's not completely impossible. But if there is a comeback to happen, I don't believe it has happened yet. Doesn't mean it won't! But if nobody says anything, I don't see it happening.
one thing i noticed is that pd2 special enemies are memorable in a way pd3 specials aren't, they have personality and their skills and AI reflect that. kinda like the mercs in tf2 . their voice lines are all goofy but they carry weight because their coming from a competent threat, on paper saying YOUR UP AGAINST THE WALL AND I AM THE FUCKING WALL to an armed bank robber sounds stupid. in practice it doesnt come off as stupid, it really makes the game a lot more charming.
pd3 feels like one of those games that spent more time in the "obsessing over the game engine" phase over the "making the game fun" phase a fancy game engine and a couple of fancy ui changes does not make a game good
@@JanJansen985 yes PD2 was one of the few games where releasing the same thing would be a good choice pretty much all of the issues in pd2 were because of its terrible engine, moving to unreal would be a major upgrade
I was playing Payday 3 and Vermintide back to back and the Globadier really is everything the Nader should be, the moment the Globadier has direct line of sight his gas grenade basically homes in on your last known location, everyone shouts that he’s throwing a bomb that you can see flying through the air and it’s easy to avoid if you’re not in a bad position but absolutely devastating if you’re stuck in it. If you’re clever, you can sometimes trick him into gassing entire enemy hordes to death, the only hitch in the design is that he’s harmless until he has another grenade ready since his only other attack is a self destruct if his pack takes any damage, as indicated by an animation where he panics at the weird noises coming from his machinery before he glows red and starts charging at you
And what’s great was that he ran away if you had LoS on him making it harder to either shoot with your limited resources or chase after with your melee options. They could implement this with him throwing a flashbang and running away if the players get too close.
@@johnny_on_the_spot_02 Yeah when I saw the Nader at first I figured he was gonna be a spamming-type enemy where every couple seconds you can expect a flashbang or tear gas grenade being toss in your direction, but like it’s shown in the video he kinda just stands around shooting with his pretty weak gun and sometimes throws an inaccurate grenade Frankly I’d go all in and make the Naders AI prefer to hang back in attack squads just chucking stuff, Tasers and Dozers already had a monopoly in rushing right in for three games now so maybe giving the Nader a preference to always try to back up to a safe distance before throwing would do the trick in solving his long grenade pull animation As an aside it’d be cool if botched grenades can gas and stun the SWAT too like how killing him with a shot to the chest with flashbang anyone next to him, but that might make him too ineffective since squads don’t rush into like Skaven or L4D hordes or maybe even make players want him alive specifically to teamkill if the gas isn’t powerful enough to threaten them
And in darktide tox bomber throws gas and even if he completely missed, this gas cloud still buff enemies which passed through it. I guess thats the difference between developers who know what they are doing and some craigslist devs who were hired to replace all those tallented pd1/2 devs who left. At least there is hope with Den of Wolves
@@Kondratelo in fairness, we can’t expect human cops to get the same adrenaline high as Chaos cultist when wading through toxic mist so that mechanic is unique to them, but i think the point here is that Globadiers and Tox Bombers are so dangerous because they cut to the case - no guns or knives to tempt them with attacking with a sidearm, just plain old gas as their sole attack as soon as they have visual confirmation of the player, I think making Naders real trigger happy with their grenade attacks would solve the issue if touching their AI up is too much work for the devs
Something neat about the globadier is that he throws 2 globes in quick succession. If he misses the first, the second might hit and if you just move a bit to dodge the first, the second is comming in to move you further. And Sigmar protect you if 2 globadiers get their throws in while bogged down by a horde, it's a ww1 trenches reenactment.
Payday 3 flopped so hard they uncopyrighted the Roblox version (Notoriety) that they copyrighted on PD3 release. Now they get a cut of the money earned.
Real life drone operators: high altitude reconnaisance, explosives/smoke/incendiary/supply drops, direct FPV strikes PD3 drones: sits at the eye level doing nothing You wanted to make players look up? Drones would be perfect for that when fighting outside
Small problem: There is no one outside. Joking aside, there's so much to do with UAVs/robots/whatever, and yet, all we have is a walking flashbang and a walking gun. I don't even want to say it's flying when all it does is stay perfectly still, like there's a guy wearing a greensuit holding it on his head. The fuuuutuuuuure!
For the sniper specifically, I think they had to be changed in such a way due to how armor works in Payday 3. Armor doesn't regenerate, so Snipers have to be much slower so compensate to that change. They should be faster than they are currently, but they couldn't be introduced in the same state as Payday 2 snipers because of the armor differences.
Damn, if all roads lead to Rome then it seems all questionable game decisions lead to the armor system for Payday 3. A single change responsible for so many poor gameplay decisions...
man if only the Sniper enemy did this cool thing where it ignored your armor or something, too bad thats never been done before especially not in PAYDAY 2
@@what-ho1mf That's not what the Sniper did. The Sniper would deal damage past your armor and negated something known as "armor gating". Many games have a mechanic like this, Borderlands for example has "health gating" where if an enemy hits you for so much damage, as long as you were over half health, you wouldn't drop below that threshold. That's not exactly how it works, but it's close enough. The Sniper is Payday 2 destroyed your armor, AND hit your health, so "armor gating" didn't work as well against them. That same function could not be transferred over to Payday 3 because of how armor works in the general player economy.
@@nightmarepotato5000 I actually like the way armor works in Payday 3 more. They could just have the sniper ignore armor entirely and boost how fast they shoot so snipers are just as threatening as they were in Payday 2 but don't screw the player over by just destroying the economy.
Funny thing is, the underhand throw for the grenader *was* the close range combat fix in their minds. It wasn't always there, it was clearly mentioned in update notes. They made a equally useless, slightly quicker throw without a fucked up angle and called it a day.
The cloaker seems so inconsistent compared to PD2 & PDTH. like I remember breaking the cloaker now and again on PD2 but PD3's almost has an extended range or something
The ones in payday 3 straight up get you through walls, like they dont even check if there is an object in the way, or how far away they end up being when they are hitting you
12:39 "hes basically never seen holding it" bro i have over 100 hours in this game and just thought cloakers had no gun at all, never seen one use it. Thats how you know its bad.
I have a friend that is a massive Payday shill. Payday 2 DLC would drop and he would instantly buy it without thinking. He had me get it on one of its $1 sales and I played through P2 with him on every heist. I don't think it was really my thing after all that, but then he got me P3. Dealt with all the horrid server issues on launch, and then played every base heist with him. I was wholly unimpressed. I recognized so many things were just uninspired, lazy, or straight unfun. I wrote my negative review detailing my issues (which as far as I am aware only 1 of the 12 issues I pointed out were ever resolved, poorly of course) and I have never looked back. My friend however, continues to buy the DLC on insane copium and I saw him playing it recently trying to praise basic features as if the game is somehow in an acceptable state. I don't understand how people can be like this. Video is very entertaining and details these with just enough sass that it's enjoyable to point and laugh instead of realizing millions of people got rug pulled.
(RUclips censored my reply so here I go again) As someone who really loves PAYDAY and played it for thousands of hours, I can relate to anyone who tries to see the signs of lifes in the series. I think your friend is really thankful for the good times he's had with the series and only wantsit to continue, it's totally fair, after all it's not fun to witness something you like become uninspired trash for the profit of empty suits who don't understand what makes a videogame fun, let alone what makes a videogame work. I think he behaves the way that he does out of pure passion for PAYDAY and that's totally fair. He deserves better. Maybe one day he'll be disillusioned and hopefully that won't manage to stain the good memories he's made thanks to it. And then there's the *other* type of person who is overly positive with ulterior motives. They have something to gain out of Partnering up with what is essentially a legal scam, promoting said legal scam while claiming they were always very critical of this legal scam. While still promoting it. These people deserve to be fed to 17 famished cats with particularly raspy tongues for essentially exploiting the innocent humanity of people such as your friend. Thank you for your comment! (:
6:55 That one pretty much true, Starbreeze reused a lot of stuff from OTWD in PD3, down to the radio SFX that plays when Shade/Locke talks in the briefing and in-heist
and it doesn't bother anybody? That snipers were copypasted without checking if they worked with the flow of the game first? I'm all for recycling/reusing, but this is something else. This is a new low in quality. Surely I didn't discover this. So where's the coverage? Where are the brave, fair, critical, talented heroes of the soundwave when we need them? Praising Brown World Bank. Chasing the trend. Selling asbestos in the description.That's where. It's been like that since Day 1 and nobody with an audience and a reach says anything.
This really made me appreciate specials in Darktide, snipers and bombers being the most direct comparision. Bombers in that game don't even carry a gun, they just have good throwing arcs, the grenades explode fast, cover a big area and if the incendiary variant managed to pull the pin before dying then it still goes off where he died.
Also Mutant is ghe good subtype of L4D2 charger Instead of have infinite pummeling, it can make a turn around, which dodging become important part in playing.
The specials in that game are vital to teaching the player the core mechanic and gameplay. Snipers (along with other traditional disablers) teach the player the importance of - not only dodging - but also situational awareness. The horde in front of you isnt the ONLY thing you need to worry about, and being aware of your surrounding in order to point out snipers is critical. Bombers force the player to keep moving through consistent map denial and harassment, but make an effort to remain hidden themselves unless they absolutely have to exit cover. Pox bombers do this shit like crazy since their bombs can bounce off walls, they can literally bank shot heads across several rooms and gas you from a block away. Not that Payday 3 AI would ever be able to achieve this level of mechanical competence and game design...
You're the first of four separate people mentioning Darktide in the comments. (not counting replies below yours) I'll admit, I'm intrigued now. Might take a look at it, thanks (:
@@UnintelligibleYT It's a truly excellent game, nothing really competes with it in terms of game-feel. It's also made by Swedes, so it gets updated approximately once every three million years, but for a new player that's not really a problem.
Not really. For the most part theyve been clowning on starbreezes poor decisions, and saying "this update is overall good" when they come out but also complaining about bugs present. The highest praise I hear from them is "If you already own the game its worth trying, but probably not worth buying yet"
The elite police officer, trained and equipped with special forces equipment, has the godlike strategy of "running to confront 4 criminals equipped with heavy weapons using only batons"
First one laid out the concept, second one refined the concept, the third one started getting shitty and some became straight up dumpster fire. Very few franchises survive to the fourth one.
Funny how the shields got slightly better but completely defeated the point of the original shields. Since you don't have to save up valuable resources (explosives, AP ammo) you just don't have to line them up for the collateral. And besides, you are already encouraged to shoot at the heads so you are killing shields pretty much the same way you are killing everything else in PD 3.
I reinstalled PDTH some time ago and i was blown away by the fact that it has infinitely better design than whatever is going on in pd3. The cloakers on top of spawning in packs, they are constantly hiding around common choke points and trying to ambusing you and actually do a decent job at it, specially on diamond heist i felt. The bulldozers somehow do a better job charging because on top of being fast af, once they start moving they dont stop so they're just charging you while hipfiring like Tony Montana. The tasers are much more common and often show up with the shields, and maybe its because pdth punishes you real hard for rushing, but the shield feels like an even bigger nousance and feels like does a better job covering others because of how everyone's stance is lower. Somehow the specials felt threatening and somewhat smart even with the simpler AI.
And the spawncap? 25. 25 cops at a time. Even without playing on the hardest difficulty, they offer a challenge and they don't need to flood the map. PAYDAY 3 could never.
PDTH is in another league, sure it only had a handful of maps and those may have precomputed spawns to hell and back... but those bots were deadly bro. Shields were a serious threat, came paired with tasers, which is the nastiest combo. Bulldozers were terrifying, especially since you don't regen HP; you just hear the distorted radio and there he comes, from the smoke, one shot takes your armor, the next is a second away and takes most of your HP for good. Having at most just one medical 'device' per player (if you bring no ammo) coupled with the lack oh HP regen really did mean you had to at least think of what you're doing. You can't just drop that medic bag whenever you want, you had to put it in a good place.
They do what any other cop can do: kick some computer or some drill with their feet. Except there's four of them. And they're gray. Yaaaay... Like imagine, you're a SABOTAGE SPECIALIST and your speciality is using your feet to kick shit around. No tools, no gadgets, no nothing. Your feetsies. Like everybody else. Man.
@@UnintelligibleYT dude its the "hostage rescue units" that are gray and the "sabotage units" that are gold but neither do anything so i see how you got them mixed up
something i don't see people mention is that in payday 3 the music isn't reactive. it's just a soundtrack that plays throughout the heist. i would often forget that music is even playing
I think payday 3 was made to be "a game for everyone" so that its not challenging and anyone can feel like they can kill anything and that is just not how good games are. A game for everyone is a game for no one.
IMO this is a misdiagnosis considering attrition-based armor. Payday 3 is certainly more "crowd pleasing" now, after the array of baseline buffs things have gotten and Adaptive Armor and stuff, but I don't think it was specifically meant to be casual- Though it _was_ intentionally trying to appeal to CoD players from my understanding
This is another excellent video that will be seen internally. Sadly, the situation we find ourselves in means granular and technical improvements, like what you’re calling for here, are extremely unlikely, given the current scope and budget. What we MIGHT see at some point in the future is some sort of ‘AI Pass’ that makes cops more responsive and simplifies their behaviours, but we will not see wholesale or specific changes. The truth is, the game will never generate enough revenue to make such changes economical in their eyes and at the same time, the game wont improve to a point where it generates more revenue without making these sorts of changes. It’s a catch 22 that I don’t see us escaping. Even with the likes of Jacket. Payday is more powerful as an IP to license out, given its past glory and brand recognition. It’s a miserable future to consider, but critiques such as this one are still entertaining and instructive. I hope someone’s listening.
Maybe if someone, anyone with a better microphone and an already established online presence could've said something before me, before the point of no return, maybe, perhaps, perchance, SBZ & Co would've done something sooner? Alas, I guess I am the first person to discover the microphone. No one *is* listening, present tense, because it's way too late. You know where I'm going with this. But it don't mattuh. None of this mattuhs.
@@UnintelligibleYT Stop acting like a child. People can have a positive outlook on things, in the end, Knowley jumped ship and also started pointing things out. I'd say he started pointing out mistakes pretty soon actually, you can see he was starting to get skeptical since update 3.
payday 2 cloaker: if you dont check under your bed every 5 second imma drag you under payday 3 cloaker: *rings door bell* bonjour monsieur kindly sign this "i'm down" contract so i can kic- *dies*
Some RUclipsr says I should blame the empty suits managing the company, instead of criticising the gameplay developped by the developpers. He's right you know! They didn't do anything about that guy yet, it's not his fault. He'll keep making Armor 3, 7, 42, et cetera, ad eternam! Thanks, evil management of evil.
To be fair, of all the classes, I think the nader would be the hardest to code. I think they really should just remove him and give some sort of crowd control ability to all the normal cops. Some type of thing that an enemy can easily just directly throw at the player and quickly disorient them. Something that maybe, if the player is fast enough, they can even break when it's thrown at them. Maybe, if they fail to do that, the screen lights up in some kind of *flash* . Not sure what you'd call that, though.
The enemy nerfs kinda could make sense in the context of trying to middle ground it; the armour system is a massive nerf to the power fantasy but they wanted still *some* horde shoot fantasy, so the enemies were nerfed to enable it while the armour system still punished it. that's the theory that makes sense to me anyway
Its funny to think that notoriety, the roblox game that starbreeze has taken down and then licensed to make it part of the payday ip, is far more enjoyable and packed with content than their own fucking game
When Payday 3 was being announced, I followed the news. The special enemies sounded really cool at first, but that was because I had their PD2 counterparts in mind, just with extra features. You know, like how the Cloaker jumps at you outta nowhere, the Taser only making a sound and slight glow before stunning you, the Dozer charging in recklessly while blasting. PD3 managed to get all of these wrong, and for what, a shield that gets 1-tapped by the Deagle?
@@UnintelligibleYT I'd also argue that although the shields get better they defeated the point of the shields in PD 2. Shields in PD 2 force you to consume more valuable and less available resources ( sniper ammo or explosives) they opened another layer of strategy because now you have to think about how to use your explosives and AP ammo efficiently. Removing explosives and making shields vulnerable to all kinds of weapons although still kept the balance it also removed that layer of complexity.
Can we also talk about how much more personality the PD2 special enemies have? I can literally quote half the quotes of all Special enemies except the Taser where i can only think of "Lighting Bolt, Lighting Bolt" and ofcourse the Sniper For the others: Cloaker: "now go to the forums and cry like the little b#### you are!" "We call this a difficulty tweak" "Why are you hitting yourself? Why are you hitting yourself?" "The safeword is police brutality" Medic: "Take two in the morning" "Sorry im all out of morphine" "First time you get shot?" Bulldoser: "You're up against the wall. And I am the F####### WALL!!"
PD3 speciаls Cloаker: "I cаn do this аll dаy you little bit*h" Bulldozer: "Bonecrushing time" Shield: "You never get trough" Everyone still hаs their personаlities
It look me at least 50 to witness one cloaker with a gun. He had bugged out and was walking around, taunting us and shooting us on Touch The Sky, instead of charging. I think that's been fixed since, but, yeah, they removed what made him a cop: his gun. Womp womp.
The Nader is the most egregious. Genuinely the most threatening thing he does is runs in close range with the player and the weak spot explosion stuns them
You know, since the nader will always fuck up his grenade throws at close distance, what if he instantly released one when got too close to him? And he becomes the source of the gas? I mean sure, fart jokes, his but since the grenade belt explosion is the biggest threat of him most of the time, why not take that one step further.
@@doggiethepugthe turret vans in payday 2 kinda did that so that you didn't hid under their blindspot! Hey look starbreese, a special ability to overcome the shortcomings a enemy has in close range that you regressed on yet again.....
Holy crap bro, I had to do a double take at 28:14 for the WEBFISHING clip, I'm that one dude on the bench. I was not expecting to see that in a random video this morning. Awesome video though, Payday 3 being shit was a knife to the heart. Its tragic Raid World War 2 has received more meaningful updates since Payday 3 came out.
lmao hiii! It is you, I do remember the name "Saladmander", you showed up to usernamesex's island! The world is such a small place. Anyway, there a bittersweet irony to RAID's newer updates, it is a game that was rushed because Starbreeze wanted a quick cashgrab and abandonned because it was too rushed to be a success. Fast forward a few years and now PD3 is about to be abandonned because it is too rushed to be a success, (despite having all the time in the world), while RAID still gets updates from a small yet dedicated team. Sweet sweet irony.
So as it turns out, Starbreeze forcably aquired the rights to Notoriety (by issuing a DMCA then giving them a "join or die" offer). On December 16th, "Notoriety: A PAYDAY® Experience", launches. Yeah the news just dropped hours ago. What a time to be alive!
I'll defend one thing of the sniper - the idea that they switch to less powerful but more consistent damage when you get close is interesting. Badly executed, yes, but possibly interesting. (Meanwhile, being unable to hit a stationary target *and* making no sound when they do... not so defensible.)
An interesting game mechanic that unfortunately has yet to be improved since September '23. We're almost at Christmas '24 and nothing changed. By the time they do make it interesting if they do, it'll be too little too late, only a handful of players will get to experience it. That's not a fun thought ):
Got payday 2 recently and my first encounter with a cloaker was him hiding behind a chair and me staring at said chair wondering why it looked weird. He proceeded to lunge at me scaring the shit out of me and making me paranoid the rest of the match
The cloaker does have better ninja animations and they went crazy with them is just that it's completely broken and you will most likely never see them. The skills are also trash talk about that.
I think fixing the specials is one thing, but another necessary thing is having more of them. Their varied presentation is what makes Restoration Mod so fun and interesting (that, and actually good enemy design.) It's pretty inexcusable for Starbreeze/OVERKILL/LionGameLion/Gold & Sharke to neglect the core of the game like this. It is a skeleton.
Im not a big Payday player, Ive played 2 for a few dozen hours but its not in my normal cycle of games I play. I remember watching the Payday 3 videos as it was announced and shared and being excited, as that was around the time I had gotten into Payday 2, but also feeling an underlying sense of dread as things kind of werent making sense. Even as someone relatively not that invested compared to the rest of the community, I was far enough on the hype train that I barely paid attention to that dread, and the idea that things that people were saying were good changes made didnt actually seem to be good ideas. The how the youtubers playing marketers claimed the customization system was "streamlined", but when you actually looked at the system it was simply just gutted of the creativity 2 provided. They said that the AI was "Better than ever", but the changes seemed questionable almost to me. Still, I saw how happy everyone seemed to be and asked maybe if it was just me who had the issue, and deciding to see how things panned out in the longrun before I bought it. Im glad that I listened to my instinct and chose not to preorder the game, it was one of the smartest things Ive chosen *not* to do.
5:57 is a good point though. you could be playing Payday 2 with a fucking blindfold on with the music on 100% with a party going on in the background and still immediately register in your brain when a sniper’s attacking you. its game design 101 and yet starbreeze is sitting there asking themselves “where did we go wrong, how do we fix this” mf you did it already do it again 😂
I've said this with Cities Skylines 2 before and I'll say it here: This game has no business being so bad with how much dev time went into the previous ones. If the devs knew they were going to release a worse product that needed patches, then why the hell did they go with it?
Starbreeze does not believe in "it's ready when it's ready", they impose short developpment periods and hard release dates. The developpers had to do what they could with that. It leads to rushed, low-quality products, as seen with a good number of PAYDAY 2 updates, RAID:WWII, OTWD or PD3. Still doesn't excuse some of the stupidest stuff that hasn't clearly hasn't been thought through.
To appease the shareholders and investors. It’s why even an esteemed developer like CD Project Red released Cyberpunk in that broken and buggy state in the first place.
What the heck? You're spending 30 minutes of video to reassure my disinterest in ever touching the Payday 3, then, suddenly, on 30:12 you completely throw me upside down with a reference to a Flying Aya Fumo, making me want to try that out much more than any marketing this game ever had???
You'd be less ripped-off by buying a retail drone and a bootleg Fumo and recreate that yourself in real life. The Flying Aya Fumo mod has brought me great joy in these dark times of playing this brown game, alas, no amount of virtual Flying Aya Fumo will remove the brown stain.
one small point on payday 2's shields being worse than payday 3's, is that payday 2 still has a better version of the 3's shields than 3 - and it's marshal shields. like 3's shields, it's less defended at the front, but has an ability to punish ignoring it by blinding you. but unlike 3's shields, breaking marshal's shield is not the best course of action, as it makes marshal into a pseudo-dozer. baiting them into using their flashbangs to then stun THEM is the best course of action, and is also actually fun, rewarding both strategic thinking through not immediately killing them, and quick, precise reaction with giving players and unusually low and small timed target
modern gaming be like: ''the community needs to improve by buying DLC slop and being active in our streams so we could MAYBE think about improving the game''
Improve the game? b-b-but the youtubers said it was almost perfect, a rough diamond, the best game you can't play, absolutely flipping phenomenal, better than PAYDAY 2 in every possible way, playable to death, checking all the boxes gameplay-wise, and that it was great! What happened?
update: Yeah no it's the same shit on OVERKILL difficulty. Whoever telling me "OVERKILL difficulty, fixes all of this": put away the crack before the crack puts you away. I just played three heists on OVK, same deal as Very Hard, but bulletholes are bigger. Wooptidoo.
You'd think they would have the Cloaker at least spring up onto the table. All those acrobatics and dropping down from higher levels, running up walls, and slides during a rush, but cannot simply leap up onto a table for a dropkick.
You want the Cloaker, the athletic guy who can execute scripted wallruns, scripted grapplehook backflips and come out of flat black squares to do an tiny jump?? gamer's... they always want more. They whip the poor skinny game developer's who do many work to make game good and children happys. gamer's they cry when game isn' t perfect... there are starving children in africa... bottom text... #LetTheHeistBegin
@@UnintelligibleYT And most importantly, disengaging again if their rush was foiled. Like, if the Cloaker was dazed during their charge or the target went somewhere too impractical for the cloaker to pursue, at least drop a smoke and disappear again. The Cloaker is supposed to be a stealth unit. Cloak. It's in the unit's title. Man... Meanwhile for the Naders, the only time where I could justify them gassing nobody in particular is if they're gassing a known objective, especially one where the players have to stay in a circle to maintain. The perfect way to frustrate players and make Naders a higher priority, otherwise they get stalled and have to defend themselves for longer than they should. That's the only time a Nader gassing nothing makes sense. But they couldn't even do that. At least give THEM the smoke grenades if the regulars aren't going to use them.
Remember, Ulf Andersson and Simon Viklund, two of the professional game designers that has been making Payday 2 are not in this mess, but instead they made the new company called 10 Chambers and making GTFO which is really the breath of fresh air among the heist game, it may a bit janky for me because that time it developed with a few devs(including this two) but now they come up with new cyberpunk themed heist game called Den of Wolves that I’m all here for it. Kinda sucks that right now I’m watching Payday, one of my Childhood memories descended into the oblivion tho.
Unintelligible is so back, and Payday 3 is sadly so over! Video was another hit. Thank you for speaking the unedited truth without bias. I liked that you complimented PD3 shields a bit. Some questions: - What do you think about PD3's current state and future? - Will Piola make a video on enemies too?
Hey! 1) It's pretty bleak. I've been saying the game would die after its contractually obligated 18 months of post-release support and it looks like it's about to do just that. I don't think it'll improve much unless SBZ really changes the way they do game design. Which they haven't, since the guy who bungled Armor 1.0 is still in charge of Armor 2.0. So, not bright. 2) I pinged him with your question! Let's see what he says
you just made me remember I had a bit of a script (autistic rambling) for a crime boss video that I never made, I may or may not make it into a video though thanks for asking🥺
I am so sick of feeling bad for payday 3, fuck it to its core, it is a frustratingly unfun mess of a game that should never have been released the skill trees are boring and so un-unique I can't remember what most of them do and me personally can't be bothered to put together a proper build because they all feel so samey, stealth when first played gives vague and shit directions (you can at least say check lockers and or guards instead of just saying find the red key card) where you need to fail to properly learn layouts the worst offender being first world bank for this imo taking away from that heisting fantasy. I think this is because of the lack of preplanning it feels like we are going into heists blind and unprepared it got wore in the later heists of payday 2 but it tanked so hard for this newer game. then after learning layouts it becomes so boring there is no chance for additional random spawns of loot or even interesting alternate routs that can spawn instead the "changes" are the key card spawning on a desk in the corner of the map instead of a guard. grand...... I really tried to like this game there are times where I found myself having the best time with it but...fuck, it just feels bad to play at its core, a bandage from a medic bag isn't going to solve the huge amount of issues they just haven't done anything about, this game needs a god dam defibrillator
A point I'd like to add to your argument about Taser needing other cops, look at his design. Despite being distinct enough to pick from a line up of basics, he's just similar enough to be easily missed amidst the chaos of a crowd. Mostly dark colors, mostly the same silhouette, it all makes him easy to miss when you're being shot at from fifty different angles. And you get punished for making that exact mistake in Payday 2. Missing the Taser in a room can be all it takes for him to destroy you, because it helped bring him just a little extra time to get his tase off.
Unfortunately, when you outsource every single enemy model, which PAYDAY 3 did, some of the crucial elements are lost in translation. Making the Taser distinct and immediately identifiable was pretty well done in PD:TH in PD2. Different headgear with yellow accents in PDTH, distinct body and color palette in PD2, great! And then there's PAYDAY 3's. I don't personally have issues seeing him, thanks to his bright stripes and illuminated yellow goggles, but he does have the same skinny silhouette as every other normal SWAT, without a distinctive helmet, shoulders or body armor. Remove the colors and he's a regular cop with a Walkman on his hip. Does this hinder anyone's experience though? Maybe someone with a lesser vision or color perception would have a hard time? I'd love to hear more about that. I have no idea how anyone else feels about this but you've piqued my curiosity.
@UnintelligibleYT Oh I'm not suggesting this is a bad thing, in fact I believe it's a good thing. I also think PD2 did it better, actually. The Taser is what I can only describe as a "offensive stealth unit" where he forces his way up close to you and then hopes you don't notice him. He has a delay in his stun which puts him into this sort of role. Not like the Cloaker, who you should already be dead to if he ever gets close, and instead tries to hide his presence at a distance. Colors might make him stand out, but silhouettes are what the eye can process the fastest. Pd3 gets that right at least, but PD2 balanced it best in my opinion. Compare the SHAPE of the Taser to other cops, and compare that to how much other specials stand out. The Shield is a wall, the Bulldozer is huge, the Cloaker is thin, only the Medic compares to the Taser, and the Medic is bright red and white. The Taser's colors, on the other hand, are much subtler. Yeah he has some neon yellow but only in small amounts. He's just the right amount of hard to notice and distinct, so that when he's alone or only with one or two cops, he sticks out like a sore thumb, but when he's in a large group of basics and you're trying to deal with them... It's hard for the eye to notice the color when everything is a blur. His head plate might be different, but it's also very similar in color to his body, so that doesn't actually stand out much. In fact the biggest part of neon yellow that might break his silhouette, his rifle, is PUT AWAY AND HIDDEN when he's about to use his taser. I'm by no means saying that it's hard to tell who a Taser is, but he is SPECIFICALLY hard to notice during the more chaotic assaults in a heist, which is always where he causes the biggest problems. He is designed with the idea of "if you don't notice him, then he tasers you and the other cops finish you off." Every special might be stronger when they don't notice you, but the Taser NEEDS you to not notice him. I think spawning him alone in PD3 was an attempt to make him more stealthy, with him flanking or whatever, but it misses the point of HOW the Taser would go unnoticed: In crowded fights. Not to mention, in PD3 his neon yellow is placed at center mass instead of at the borders, with his gloves, chest, and even goggles making a recognizable silhouette now because there's a gap in the MIDDLE of the black, so even in crowds he's actually easier to notice now. To simplify all this: The eye notices shapes before colors, and PD3's Taser would even struggle in groups because his reworked design actually makes his shape more distinct because it creates a large gap amidst the black silhouette, instead of more subtle lines along the edges. I'm not the best at explaining these sorts of things, but I hope I made that clearer
What did they do to fuck up this bad, hire ROBLOX simulator developers? Sheltered LARPers that put 20 scopes on guns and think it makes them better? Game journalists???
Miodrag, senior game designer and game director for year 1 was a game journalist once. Never heard of him before? I wonder why. Also, his subpar Steam reviews and his minimal playtime in both PAYDAY games that came before, combined with the number of games he helped make (like 3 mobile games nobody knows about and OTWD, a game so bad the owners of TWD pulled out) probably also mean something, but I'm not sure what. It must be a coincidence. Surely I am overthinking it, as the redditors once said. While I'm sure he's not the only person to blame for bad game design on board, he is *senior* game designer, so, you know, not completely powerless in that department. He was also game director for a year, which is funny because the game direction the game had the entire time was abysmal But it must be a coincidinc. Surely I am overthinking it and I should blame Mats Mikkelsen, the chief executive business guy who hasn't played a videogame since Pong on the walls of a prehistoric grotto and who doesn't do game design, like some overrated overwatched underwashed Starbreeze Partner once said.
@@UnintelligibleYT This was a jokey comment, holy shit. I know game journalists were unironically bad but being bad enough to sink any game you get put in charge of is one hell of a stereotype to have. If they had ONE guy on QA that had their voice heard none of this would've happened. So either these dipshits were either too good to have a QA team at all or had their heads so far up their asses that the QA team was either made completely out of yes-men or had their begging complaints ignored. Holy hell. At this point throw the whole game out, Payday 3 is nothing but a cheap cardboard cutout of the Payday IP, trying to be kept up flimsly with nonsensical bullshit someone that has no idea how the game should work thought would be cool. Just a bunch of "great and innovative" ideas that will "bring forth an FPS renaissance" that are actually just garbage. But oh well, we aren't allowed to have anything nice under corporates, so its no surprise.
@@UnintelligibleYT It's getting very hard to make jokes nowadays, I'm going to have to scale things up to meaningless levels for irony to be more ridicilous than reality.
To be fair, I think Naders gassing the areas without players can be used as a feature, like they preemptively block ways to relocate, retreat and etc. However, this would require a bit of an event script (as in "if all or almost all the players are inside the room, gas one of the two doors") and we know the situation with event scripting in this game.
It actually seems like it's supposed to do that. Like in Payday 2 where some rooms would get Tear Gas, to prevent you from staying in them or having to take another route. But knowing how PD3 is, then it wouldn't be surprising that they messed up his AI.
Little known fact about naders: if there is a hostage nearby, they won't throw a gas grenade as not to kill the hostage. A lot of the time you were camping and not getting gassed was likely because you had a guy tied up near you
I don't remember having hostages in the clips I included, but it's been a while. IF ONLY THE GAME HAD A HOSTAGE COUNTER IN ITS HUD now that would be great.
![[Unintelligible]](http://yt3.ggpht.com/QYPOnLWfUvVkhKTRRAPNzQ6AKmZAZzqTRJMfgRJ_OCqcqjXpDg6wlpV6BrvYUYTPBUcf3qYE=s48-c-k-c0x00ffffff-no-rj)
![Blox Fruits Dragon Rework Update [Full Stream]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EqDAp8udhm0/mqdefault.jpg)
Is that a m0gi in the intro?? Fucking badass
What can I say, I only get the best cameos
and fwends (:
@@UnintelligibleYT your the best friend! ♥ :0
Is the plural of "a m0gi" "a m0gus"?
@@jdflasky1969
*AMOGUS*
you know payday 3 is bad when generalmcbadass just went to get a normal job instead of playing this shit
No fucking way 😭
if only you could say that in the class trial, it would solve the case
Besides, we peaked with Payday 2
Wait rly? He has a job? I mean, like outside of YT (cuz technically YT is also job)
Its because he fucking hates payday, not payday 3, just payday in general
you forget, we killed all the skilled cops in pd2 It is a lore feature. Captain wnters just left a handbook that a random shild found when clearing out his desk.
If the payday devs still had a sense of humor this sounds like a really funny comic
@@RepriseYTall the skilled devs were killed, but some rtards found the dev's development basement
THEY KILLED ALL THE GOOD COPS WITH A SPOON! 5 MILLION COPS DIED THAT WEEK!
I spent 90 dollars on an "end-of-service in 2026" game
2026? HAHAHAHA.
HAHa.
a.
Yeah. 2026 minus one. Haha. Oh man. The greatest heist of all and we're the loot.
@@UnintelligibleYT trust me bro theyre developing Payday 4 and it will be a creative map on fortnite
@@Core2julen
Notoriety 2
@@RaidenWithBiden Notoriety 3*
@@RaidenWithBidenthat would be nice
I unironically believe the PD3 Devs have never booted up PDTH and PD2 because we have problems and features missing that were there 13y ago.
Damn right
Are you implying that most of the people who made the previous games good are gone?
Because if I had a dollar for everytime that happened
@@k96man No joke, the only guy remaining from the Payday: The Heist days, is the guy who designed the masks, and funnily enough came up with the name. Not even a gameplay guy. It's literally payday in name alone
@MyUsersDark That just stings, like some sort of cosmic joke
@MyUsersDarkThat actually explains a lot
I'm pretty sure the issue with snipers not shooting at all is an attempt to fix how Payday 2's snipers would sometimes act like pro CS players and quickscope you as soon as they spawned, before they even turned on their lasers or got to the actual sniping position and basically being unreactable instant damage in certain heists. Of course, in true Overkill fashion they've basically overcorrected so badly that the enemy basically stopped shooting you at all (or they just outright broke the AI, it's hard to tell).
The funny thing is, mods in PD2 have fixed that too. In the Restoration mod, the audio starts to get quieter when he sees you, and shoots when it gets silent. It's a short window, but gives you a way to counter it.
As a game designer that's a really simpler fix, just have a timer that stops the Snipers from being able to shoot until the player spawns instead of doing map loading. It's not even that hard to do.
@@9000Dogs for all the weird things resmod does, i do like that
You can't fix the feature by disabling it
To make sure the damage (which is supposed to be QUICK anyways) isn't instant they added a... 7 SECOND aim time, yes, their laser floats around you for 7 SECONDS. For 7 SECONDS his laser is just swaying around.
The nader is more effective at disrupting the player with his chest of flashbangs blowing up than his intended mechanic
Profile picture checks out
Yep, heck, good idea, make him throw an impact flash at you at close range.
why is bro walking around wearing flashbangs for body armor
yuo see ivan ,
when your wear body armor of grenade
you cannot die of bullet
because you explode first
@@maxdong3514Yea, impact flashes on moving players/close range and have him gas the players if they are not moving (or alternativly, he could continously launch gas on objectives to deny them for the players until he is taken care off)
Payday 2 has the "janky but made with love" style
Payday 3 has the "PLEASE BUY THE GAME WE ARE GOING BANKRUPT" style
edit: can you guys not fight in my replies it's a joke dont take it seriously
As apposed to the exact same style happening in Payday 2, but your rose tinted goggles aint seeing it.
@ChaoticMess5618 balls
@ChaoticMess5618 or maybe the game was just actually fun, crazy right?
@@beagan8348 Insinuating that Payday 3 isn't fun. The only reason you say that is because it has less content than a game that had 10 years of support.
Play launch Payday 2 for an extended period of time, you will be biting iron before long.
@ChaoticMess5618 no payday 3 is just worse, it even released with less heists than payday 2 on launch. being worse than payday 2 on launch is kind of really hard and they succeed fantastically
b-but at least the bots revive themselves after 1 year and 2 months
Finally, they added co-op in the co-op game! Let them cook!
Bruh I used to play road rage and other heists on Overkill solo, and oh my god. It's literally baby sitting simulator. At least in payday 2 they compensated. The ai was horrible because of Diesel Engine, but they gave them alot of health so atleast they can tank dozers, revive you without dying, etc.
In payday 3 we have no such compensation. The ai is still useless, they have no brains. The amount of times they've stood in the open to get sniped in astounding.
@@Bedic-Mag Real
+ You can select team boosts in PD2, like faster action speed, faster reloads, more sprinting stamina, hell, the bots could have INSPIRE ACE on a 2 minute cooldown along with everything i said before.
But, in Classic Starbreeze Fashion, everything in PD3 HAD to be worse than PD2.
@@Bedic-Mag Payday 3 proves it's not because of the engine. It's because of incompetence on the dev side.
how on EARTH did they manage to mess up threatening car?
payday 2 HAS a threatening car, the one with the turret.
I really don't want to see the turret make a come back. That's one thing I agree with Miodrag on: pls no
If the turret ever comes back it needs to stop having so much hp like ok repairable shields u can disable it for a few seconds then kill it but it has too much hp after no more shields
Honestly I think you could bring back the turret if you keep the satellite weakpoint and have that shut it down. Make it a bit smaller. Then its like, a super sniper in its purpose; Greatly endangers sightlines and requires quick aim to dispatch.
The turrets also have a damage cap so your absurd Zerk-Overkill-Unseen Strike Thanatos build cant double tap it.
Realistically the only high speed way of killing it is crit akimbos, which are just OP on their own.
@@UnintelligibleYT Yeah the turret was definitely overtuned, but at least it had an effect on the map. If the FBI can showed up in a PD2 loud bank, it would be dispatched without leaving the bank just because of how vulnerable the dish is.
The turret was at least "a problem" which required my crew to plan the rest of the heist around it.
Is the swat van even real? I assumed it was a dream I had, theres no way that they thought some lady sitting in a van would be a real enemy.
FBI! Special Agent Rebecca! From now on, I am in charge.
@@UnintelligibleYT Its more like:
"FBI! Special Agent Rebecca! From now on, I am-"
*Satellite dish gets destroyed*
"They destroyed the goddamn antenna"
@@UnintelligibleYT Remember when Swat Vans had Remote controlled Gun turrets? I do.
@@CentreMetre Did they keep SWAT Turret Van? You know, only reason in Payday 2 to have ECM Jammer on loud missions?
it would have been cooler if the fucking FBI van actually spawned special FBI units. That'd make it actually feel important, maybe even have some special enemy variants...
Who would've known that an enemy called a cloaker is meant to cloak into the surround environment by hiding alone or in a group with others, instead of running towards you from 2 miles away.
Cloak and Dagger? Never heard of it!
To be honest, Payday the Heist got the best enemy ai, they got REALLY DAMM GOOD TACTICS, like pulling back and check the cameras to plan an assault, or send shields first, smoke and push, or send a bulldozer to distract you while a squad of cloakers infiltrated from behind.
Not to mention how the swats used full auto only when you where close enough.
And it did so with a spawncap of 25. Not 40 or 80. Two-Fiver. Man.
Funnily enough, a lot of it is smoke and mirrors and good level design/scripting (a lot like the AI of FEAR 1).
Cameras really don’t do anything to the AI (found that out when looking on the wiki after being curious one day).
Especially with the RNG events like a Bulldozer in the armored van in Slaughterhouse, or them hanging out in the vault or cloakers waiting by the escape - both that can happen in First World Bank.
Them also speaking to/noting nearby specials, from what I know, doesn’t really do much but be an audio cue for the player on what’s nearby. Since they couldn’t afford voice actors for most of the specials.
It makes it *feel* like the cops are smarter than they really are. When they’re really about the same as Payday 2’s AI.
That’s what good atmosphere, clever design choices, and proper scripting/level design gets you.
@Dr.Oofers I do love more the Hollywood like dodging they do, Also the friendly ai animations
@@SpecterSensorial The Bot AI animations were a nice touch, but they didn’t have to include knocked over animations that make them a still target or the sort of unnecessarily slow climbing animations. I remember a few singeplayer runs were ruined because the bots took forever to get to me.
But yeah, I miss those little animations since they tied in well with the heisters actually talking about the stuff happening in the heist.
@@Dr.OofersWhat do you think the "AI" is but scripting?
I feel like shields having destructible visors would make more sense if they actually reacted to it other than playing a voice-line.
Like, what if shields were normally aggressive and constantly pushing up on you, but then if/when you break their visor, they go more defensive? They duck their head down (so you can't just continue shooting them through the broken visor), and remain stationary as cover to use by other cops, and don't just continue charge forward as you shoot them in the jaw repeatedly, making you have to switch up your tactics?
Also you forgot mention the fact that shields are practically useless anyway because Starbreeze gave us a free "Kill the shield" button (shock grenade) and there's absolutely no reason not to bring that since (in my experience) it outperforms every other throwable.
I did not forget, I just didn't care, since I can kill the shield with the tiniest bullets without downsides.
But you do have a point, there's so much more to be done with this game, just with the shield alone, alas, videogames are no longer a temple of innovation.
why are thier visors breaking in the first place? it supposed to be a ballistic shield and it can't resiste a pistole, they just slapped a car window on it, he even have a voice line saying who built this s'it 😭
The shields should have been way more durable, unless you are using explosives. Trying to destroy a shield head on with normal ammo should be like trying to kill a bulldozer with body shots. This gives the player a last resort option, if the shield is in a tight chokepoint with no way to flank it.
I be coming up with good ideas like this i know will never see the light of day. Gotta understand the money, management, and bureaucracy that snips most fun/passionate design choices because the motive is always income based nowadays 😂
Payday 2 cloaker: will find you and get you even if he has to break the laws of physics
Payday 3 cloaker: can't get somebody that's standing on a table
PD 2 cloakers: hide in every corner and exploit distraction from other units to jump on you ( they are literally programmed to start closing on you when the assaults start and ambush during rest phases.)
PD 3 cloakers: run in open ground, presenting themselves as the obvious targets.
34:25 "even in RAID WW2 the good guys had smokes"
wait a fucking second
What's wrong about the statement?
Didn't the Germans have smoke grenades in WW2?
Hopefully a mistake or a poor taste joke
VVE ARE SO FVCING BACK
@@AlphaGargjoke?
every american on this website is megahitler until proven otherwise
I used to be a believer in payday 3's comeback but watching this made me realise just how flanderised yet softened the special units are
I mean it's okay to enjoy the game, be optimistic about it, want it to succeed and improve, I hope I didn't take that away from you, it's not my goal.
Maybe something *will* be done about it next year? Why not? It's not completely impossible. But if there is a comeback to happen, I don't believe it has happened yet.
Doesn't mean it won't! But if nobody says anything, I don't see it happening.
and consequently, it's made me appreciate PD2's more
I'm in the same boat. I had really forgotten how well fleshed out the game design in PD2 was in comparison...
Guess I'm going back to PD2.
@@UnintelligibleYT It's starbruh we're talking about. It is impossible
one thing i noticed is that pd2 special enemies are memorable in a way pd3 specials aren't, they have personality and their skills and AI reflect that. kinda like the mercs in tf2 . their voice lines are all goofy but they carry weight because their coming from a competent threat, on paper saying YOUR UP AGAINST THE WALL AND I AM THE FUCKING WALL to an armed bank robber sounds stupid. in practice it doesnt come off as stupid, it really makes the game a lot more charming.
pd3 feels like one of those games that spent more time in the "obsessing over the game engine" phase over the "making the game fun" phase
a fancy game engine and a couple of fancy ui changes does not make a game good
The UI is objectively worse
Isnt it just in Unreal?
@@JanJansen985 Yes
@@JanJansen985 yes
PD2 was one of the few games where releasing the same thing would be a good choice
pretty much all of the issues in pd2 were because of its terrible engine, moving to unreal would be a major upgrade
@zjanez2868 honestly PD2 is an achievement of an engine
They had a engine for car racing and made the worst car handling
I was playing Payday 3 and Vermintide back to back and the Globadier really is everything the Nader should be, the moment the Globadier has direct line of sight his gas grenade basically homes in on your last known location, everyone shouts that he’s throwing a bomb that you can see flying through the air and it’s easy to avoid if you’re not in a bad position but absolutely devastating if you’re stuck in it. If you’re clever, you can sometimes trick him into gassing entire enemy hordes to death, the only hitch in the design is that he’s harmless until he has another grenade ready since his only other attack is a self destruct if his pack takes any damage, as indicated by an animation where he panics at the weird noises coming from his machinery before he glows red and starts charging at you
And what’s great was that he ran away if you had LoS on him making it harder to either shoot with your limited resources or chase after with your melee options. They could implement this with him throwing a flashbang and running away if the players get too close.
@@johnny_on_the_spot_02 Yeah when I saw the Nader at first I figured he was gonna be a spamming-type enemy where every couple seconds you can expect a flashbang or tear gas grenade being toss in your direction, but like it’s shown in the video he kinda just stands around shooting with his pretty weak gun and sometimes throws an inaccurate grenade
Frankly I’d go all in and make the Naders AI prefer to hang back in attack squads just chucking stuff, Tasers and Dozers already had a monopoly in rushing right in for three games now so maybe giving the Nader a preference to always try to back up to a safe distance before throwing would do the trick in solving his long grenade pull animation
As an aside it’d be cool if botched grenades can gas and stun the SWAT too like how killing him with a shot to the chest with flashbang anyone next to him, but that might make him too ineffective since squads don’t rush into like Skaven or L4D hordes or maybe even make players want him alive specifically to teamkill if the gas isn’t powerful enough to threaten them
And in darktide tox bomber throws gas and even if he completely missed, this gas cloud still buff enemies which passed through it. I guess thats the difference between developers who know what they are doing and some craigslist devs who were hired to replace all those tallented pd1/2 devs who left. At least there is hope with Den of Wolves
@@Kondratelo in fairness, we can’t expect human cops to get the same adrenaline high as Chaos cultist when wading through toxic mist so that mechanic is unique to them, but i think the point here is that Globadiers and Tox Bombers are so dangerous because they cut to the case - no guns or knives to tempt them with attacking with a sidearm, just plain old gas as their sole attack as soon as they have visual confirmation of the player, I think making Naders real trigger happy with their grenade attacks would solve the issue if touching their AI up is too much work for the devs
Something neat about the globadier is that he throws 2 globes in quick succession. If he misses the first, the second might hit and if you just move a bit to dodge the first, the second is comming in to move you further. And Sigmar protect you if 2 globadiers get their throws in while bogged down by a horde, it's a ww1 trenches reenactment.
Payday 3 flopped so hard they uncopyrighted the Roblox version (Notoriety) that they copyrighted on PD3 release. Now they get a cut of the money earned.
Who gets the money? The Roblox game or Overkill?
Both.
No fucking shot they copystriked Notoriety and thats why i couldnt see it
Real life drone operators: high altitude reconnaisance, explosives/smoke/incendiary/supply drops, direct FPV strikes
PD3 drones: sits at the eye level doing nothing
You wanted to make players look up? Drones would be perfect for that when fighting outside
Small problem: There is no one outside.
Joking aside, there's so much to do with UAVs/robots/whatever, and yet, all we have is a walking flashbang and a walking gun. I don't even want to say it's flying when all it does is stay perfectly still, like there's a guy wearing a greensuit holding it on his head.
The fuuuutuuuuure!
For the sniper specifically, I think they had to be changed in such a way due to how armor works in Payday 3. Armor doesn't regenerate, so Snipers have to be much slower so compensate to that change. They should be faster than they are currently, but they couldn't be introduced in the same state as Payday 2 snipers because of the armor differences.
Damn, if all roads lead to Rome then it seems all questionable game decisions lead to the armor system for Payday 3. A single change responsible for so many poor gameplay decisions...
man if only the Sniper enemy did this cool thing where it ignored your armor or something, too bad thats never been done before especially not in PAYDAY 2
@@what-ho1mf That's not what the Sniper did. The Sniper would deal damage past your armor and negated something known as "armor gating". Many games have a mechanic like this, Borderlands for example has "health gating" where if an enemy hits you for so much damage, as long as you were over half health, you wouldn't drop below that threshold. That's not exactly how it works, but it's close enough. The Sniper is Payday 2 destroyed your armor, AND hit your health, so "armor gating" didn't work as well against them. That same function could not be transferred over to Payday 3 because of how armor works in the general player economy.
@@nightmarepotato5000 I actually like the way armor works in Payday 3 more. They could just have the sniper ignore armor entirely and boost how fast they shoot so snipers are just as threatening as they were in Payday 2 but don't screw the player over by just destroying the economy.
@what-ho1mf Yeah, except that's not how it worked in 2 either sooooo
Funny thing is, the underhand throw for the grenader *was* the close range combat fix in their minds. It wasn't always there, it was clearly mentioned in update notes.
They made a equally useless, slightly quicker throw without a fucked up angle and called it a day.
31:10 And she has her shield up to cover her... in case the chair decides to ambush her?
Pfft haha
The cloaker seems so inconsistent compared to PD2 & PDTH. like I remember breaking the cloaker now and again on PD2 but PD3's almost has an extended range or something
The ones in payday 3 straight up get you through walls, like they dont even check if there is an object in the way, or how far away they end up being when they are hitting you
12:39 "hes basically never seen holding it"
bro i have over 100 hours in this game and just thought cloakers had no gun at all, never seen one use it. Thats how you know its bad.
I have a friend that is a massive Payday shill. Payday 2 DLC would drop and he would instantly buy it without thinking. He had me get it on one of its $1 sales and I played through P2 with him on every heist. I don't think it was really my thing after all that, but then he got me P3. Dealt with all the horrid server issues on launch, and then played every base heist with him.
I was wholly unimpressed. I recognized so many things were just uninspired, lazy, or straight unfun. I wrote my negative review detailing my issues (which as far as I am aware only 1 of the 12 issues I pointed out were ever resolved, poorly of course) and I have never looked back. My friend however, continues to buy the DLC on insane copium and I saw him playing it recently trying to praise basic features as if the game is somehow in an acceptable state. I don't understand how people can be like this.
Video is very entertaining and details these with just enough sass that it's enjoyable to point and laugh instead of realizing millions of people got rug pulled.
(RUclips censored my reply so here I go again)
As someone who really loves PAYDAY and played it for thousands of hours, I can relate to anyone who tries to see the signs of lifes in the series.
I think your friend is really thankful for the good times he's had with the series and only wantsit to continue, it's totally fair, after all it's not fun to witness something you like become uninspired trash for the profit of empty suits who don't understand what makes a videogame fun, let alone what makes a videogame work.
I think he behaves the way that he does out of pure passion for PAYDAY and that's totally fair. He deserves better. Maybe one day he'll be disillusioned and hopefully that won't manage to stain the good memories he's made thanks to it.
And then there's the *other* type of person who is overly positive with ulterior motives. They have something to gain out of Partnering up with what is essentially a legal scam, promoting said legal scam while claiming they were always very critical of this legal scam. While still promoting it.
These people deserve to be fed to 17 famished cats with particularly raspy tongues for essentially exploiting the innocent humanity of people such as your friend.
Thank you for your comment! (:
6:55 That one pretty much true, Starbreeze reused a lot of stuff from OTWD in PD3, down to the radio SFX that plays when Shade/Locke talks in the briefing and in-heist
and it doesn't bother anybody? That snipers were copypasted without checking if they worked with the flow of the game first? I'm all for recycling/reusing, but this is something else. This is a new low in quality.
Surely I didn't discover this. So where's the coverage? Where are the brave, fair, critical, talented heroes of the soundwave when we need them? Praising Brown World Bank. Chasing the trend. Selling asbestos in the description.That's where. It's been like that since Day 1 and nobody with an audience and a reach says anything.
@@UnintelligibleYT hey to be fair, I doubt anyone else has played that terrible game.
@@JackdotC I played that game like a thousand hours but didnt realize the radio sfx thing
@@UnintelligibleYTnobody with an audience or reach is speaking about this because it’s been around since launch, people talk about new things
Maybe that guy with no commentary could make a video comparing PD3 to PD2 like they did with L4D2 and Back for Blood
PD2 Bulldozer: "YOU'RE UP AGAINST THE WALL, AND I AM THE FUCKING WALL!"
PD3 Bulldozer: "I'm a rock. Please trip on me. I beg you."
Wait, Operation Medic bag is over? This is how I find out?
I found out yesterday after I re-read the investor pdf lmao, I had to make last minute adjustments to the video to stay up to date.
I found out with MarioInATophat lol
This really made me appreciate specials in Darktide, snipers and bombers being the most direct comparision. Bombers in that game don't even carry a gun, they just have good throwing arcs, the grenades explode fast, cover a big area and if the incendiary variant managed to pull the pin before dying then it still goes off where he died.
And the snipers are incredibly deadly and will shoot you within a second of having there laser on you
Also Mutant is ghe good subtype of L4D2 charger
Instead of have infinite pummeling, it can make a turn around, which dodging become important part in playing.
The specials in that game are vital to teaching the player the core mechanic and gameplay. Snipers (along with other traditional disablers) teach the player the importance of - not only dodging - but also situational awareness. The horde in front of you isnt the ONLY thing you need to worry about, and being aware of your surrounding in order to point out snipers is critical.
Bombers force the player to keep moving through consistent map denial and harassment, but make an effort to remain hidden themselves unless they absolutely have to exit cover. Pox bombers do this shit like crazy since their bombs can bounce off walls, they can literally bank shot heads across several rooms and gas you from a block away.
Not that Payday 3 AI would ever be able to achieve this level of mechanical competence and game design...
You're the first of four separate people mentioning Darktide in the comments. (not counting replies below yours)
I'll admit, I'm intrigued now. Might take a look at it, thanks (:
@@UnintelligibleYT It's a truly excellent game, nothing really competes with it in terms of game-feel. It's also made by Swedes, so it gets updated approximately once every three million years, but for a new player that's not really a problem.
mio hasn't thought about this
@@piola8828 it's on the table
@@The_great_M0N0LITH furry stuff. Dudes a furry
Mio was still checking out furry art instead.
Don't worry. The payday 3 RUclipsrs will say the next update that does not fix the core gameplay problems will revive the game and make it good
PAYDAY is back! It was back... but now it's even more back!
Not really. For the most part theyve been clowning on starbreezes poor decisions, and saying "this update is overall good" when they come out but also complaining about bugs present. The highest praise I hear from them is "If you already own the game its worth trying, but probably not worth buying yet"
@@noborge shill's remorse
What RUclipsrs are YOU watching? Every one of them I frequent is as doom and gloom as the rest of us
@@katehikes1645 people are capable of changing their opinions
The elite police officer, trained and equipped with special forces equipment, has the godlike strategy of "running to confront 4 criminals equipped with heavy weapons using only batons"
I still can't believe the Devs thought this game ever had a chance. Third titles are actually cursed in the gaming industry now.
Perhaps valve was right
First one laid out the concept, second one refined the concept, the third one started getting shitty and some became straight up dumpster fire. Very few franchises survive to the fourth one.
That last clip you played of Starbreeze going "just support us!" gave me DSP E-Begger vibes. Lmao.
If Almir starts blowing bubbles on stream I'm going to lose it
9:23 Fun fact! The future is now, old man! Multiple systems already exist for attaching a taser to one’s rifle, in a various number of ways.
imagine forgetting to switch to taser underbarrel and just exploding someone's torso with your gun
@@Cayou-uw4tj "deploying taser!" **criminal turns into a fine red mist**
@@Blue-bf8lv a fine what?
@@big-plane350NO
Bait used to be bel- HOLY SHIT DID YOU JUST MENTION THE RED MIST!?!??!!!!!!!???
90% of the gameplay design budget went into making the shield do half of the job he was supposed to
Funny how the shields got slightly better but completely defeated the point of the original shields. Since you don't have to save up valuable resources (explosives, AP ammo) you just don't have to line them up for the collateral. And besides, you are already encouraged to shoot at the heads so you are killing shields pretty much the same way you are killing everything else in PD 3.
Sir a second [unintelligible] video has hit payday 3
So that's why they didn't buy me plane tickets
I reinstalled PDTH some time ago and i was blown away by the fact that it has infinitely better design than whatever is going on in pd3.
The cloakers on top of spawning in packs, they are constantly hiding around common choke points and trying to ambusing you and actually do a decent job at it, specially on diamond heist i felt.
The bulldozers somehow do a better job charging because on top of being fast af, once they start moving they dont stop so they're just charging you while hipfiring like Tony Montana.
The tasers are much more common and often show up with the shields, and maybe its because pdth punishes you real hard for rushing, but the shield feels like an even bigger nousance and feels like does a better job covering others because of how everyone's stance is lower.
Somehow the specials felt threatening and somewhat smart even with the simpler AI.
And the spawncap? 25. 25 cops at a time. Even without playing on the hardest difficulty, they offer a challenge and they don't need to flood the map.
PAYDAY 3 could never.
PDTH is in another league, sure it only had a handful of maps and those may have precomputed spawns to hell and back... but those bots were deadly bro.
Shields were a serious threat, came paired with tasers, which is the nastiest combo.
Bulldozers were terrifying, especially since you don't regen HP; you just hear the distorted radio and there he comes, from the smoke, one shot takes your armor, the next is a second away and takes most of your HP for good.
Having at most just one medical 'device' per player (if you bring no ammo) coupled with the lack oh HP regen really did mean you had to at least think of what you're doing. You can't just drop that medic bag whenever you want, you had to put it in a good place.
I just remembered that there are sabotage units... but they almost never do anything.
I forgot about those too! lol
They do what any other cop can do: kick some computer or some drill with their feet.
Except there's four of them. And they're gray. Yaaaay...
Like imagine, you're a SABOTAGE SPECIALIST
and your speciality is using your feet to kick shit around. No tools, no gadgets, no nothing. Your feetsies. Like everybody else.
Man.
sabotage squad when they pull a fire alarm
@@UnintelligibleYT dude its the "hostage rescue units" that are gray and the "sabotage units" that are gold but neither do anything so i see how you got them mixed up
@@incognitoduckling7505 Sick burn.
Nah man, this aint the games fault, it's just peak NYPD training.
something i don't see people mention is that in payday 3 the music isn't reactive. it's just a soundtrack that plays throughout the heist. i would often forget that music is even playing
give it some time, its not socially acceptable to say the music of 3 sucks yet, even though its abysmal
@@reorseX the mark my beloved
I think payday 3 was made to be "a game for everyone" so that its not challenging and anyone can feel like they can kill anything and that is just not how good games are. A game for everyone is a game for no one.
payday 2 did this much better just by adding a bunch of difficulties
@@sjfs231 The only thing that did was ruin the difficulty of anything
IMO this is a misdiagnosis considering attrition-based armor. Payday 3 is certainly more "crowd pleasing" now, after the array of baseline buffs things have gotten and Adaptive Armor and stuff, but I don't think it was specifically meant to be casual- Though it _was_ intentionally trying to appeal to CoD players from my understanding
@@thebushbros6626 wrong, game is fun and challenging above overkill for experienced players, and not too hard for new players below overkill.
Nintendo does a better job for making games for"everyone"
This is another excellent video that will be seen internally.
Sadly, the situation we find ourselves in means granular and technical improvements, like what you’re calling for here, are extremely unlikely, given the current scope and budget. What we MIGHT see at some point in the future is some sort of ‘AI Pass’ that makes cops more responsive and simplifies their behaviours, but we will not see wholesale or specific changes.
The truth is, the game will never generate enough revenue to make such changes economical in their eyes and at the same time, the game wont improve to a point where it generates more revenue without making these sorts of changes. It’s a catch 22 that I don’t see us escaping. Even with the likes of Jacket.
Payday is more powerful as an IP to license out, given its past glory and brand recognition. It’s a miserable future to consider, but critiques such as this one are still entertaining and instructive. I hope someone’s listening.
Maybe if someone, anyone with a better microphone and an already established online presence could've said something before me, before the point of no return, maybe, perhaps, perchance, SBZ & Co would've done something sooner?
Alas, I guess I am the first person to discover the microphone.
No one *is* listening, present tense, because it's way too late.
You know where I'm going with this. But it don't mattuh. None of this mattuhs.
Kknowley, what in the world are you doing up at 1:30 am watching random payday videos? go look at apex gaming pc's instead brother
@@UnintelligibleYT Made you look :3
Kknowley has gone from biggest Payday 3 fan to certified PD3 Opp. The arc of a lifetime.
@@UnintelligibleYT Stop acting like a child. People can have a positive outlook on things, in the end, Knowley jumped ship and also started pointing things out. I'd say he started pointing out mistakes pretty soon actually, you can see he was starting to get skeptical since update 3.
payday 2 cloaker: if you dont check under your bed every 5 second imma drag you under
payday 3 cloaker: *rings door bell* bonjour monsieur kindly sign this "i'm down" contract so i can kic- *dies*
The fact that Mio is still working on something after ruining so much about this game is extremely funny and extremely horrible at the same time
Some RUclipsr says I should blame the empty suits managing the company, instead of criticising the gameplay developped by the developpers.
He's right you know! They didn't do anything about that guy yet, it's not his fault. He'll keep making Armor 3, 7, 42, et cetera, ad eternam! Thanks, evil management of evil.
To be fair, of all the classes, I think the nader would be the hardest to code. I think they really should just remove him and give some sort of crowd control ability to all the normal cops. Some type of thing that an enemy can easily just directly throw at the player and quickly disorient them. Something that maybe, if the player is fast enough, they can even break when it's thrown at them. Maybe, if they fail to do that, the screen lights up in some kind of *flash* .
Not sure what you'd call that, though.
Maybe just remove his weakness and give him a grenade launcher. That'll make him something to worry about.
clearly payday 3 cops can't melee you because of training
What's sad about that is that even irl cops and soldiers learn limited cqc and melee techniques.
The enemy nerfs kinda could make sense in the context of trying to middle ground it; the armour system is a massive nerf to the power fantasy but they wanted still *some* horde shoot fantasy, so the enemies were nerfed to enable it while the armour system still punished it. that's the theory that makes sense to me anyway
The way they just added a simple "police assault" text at the top is so uninspiring that it's kinda funny
A year later, the HUD is still plain text and default unreal bars. "Let them cook" my ass, the oven isn't even on.
Its funny to think that notoriety, the roblox game that starbreeze has taken down and then licensed to make it part of the payday ip, is far more enjoyable and packed with content than their own fucking game
ROBLOX SWEEP
YOU'RE UP AGAINST A WALL AND I AM leaving, hopefully you and the wall are happy :) -Payday 3 Cowplower
IMMA DROP ON THESE fine ladies and gentlemen LIKE A delicate flower floating in the wind
When Payday 3 was being announced, I followed the news. The special enemies sounded really cool at first, but that was because I had their PD2 counterparts in mind, just with extra features.
You know, like how the Cloaker jumps at you outta nowhere, the Taser only making a sound and slight glow before stunning you, the Dozer charging in recklessly while blasting. PD3 managed to get all of these wrong, and for what, a shield that gets 1-tapped by the Deagle?
I was genuinely excited about the Nader. It's the only thing I was happy about, actually.
Ha. What an idiot. Stupid me.
@@UnintelligibleYT I'd also argue that although the shields get better they defeated the point of the shields in PD 2. Shields in PD 2 force you to consume more valuable and less available resources ( sniper ammo or explosives) they opened another layer of strategy because now you have to think about how to use your explosives and AP ammo efficiently. Removing explosives and making shields vulnerable to all kinds of weapons although still kept the balance it also removed that layer of complexity.
Can we also talk about how much more personality the PD2 special enemies have? I can literally quote half the quotes of all Special enemies except the Taser where i can only think of "Lighting Bolt, Lighting Bolt"
and ofcourse the Sniper
For the others:
Cloaker: "now go to the forums and cry like the little b#### you are!" "We call this a difficulty tweak" "Why are you hitting yourself? Why are you hitting yourself?" "The safeword is police brutality"
Medic: "Take two in the morning" "Sorry im all out of morphine" "First time you get shot?"
Bulldoser: "You're up against the wall. And I am the F####### WALL!!"
PD3 speciаls
Cloаker: "I cаn do this аll dаy you little bit*h"
Bulldozer: "Bonecrushing time"
Shield: "You never get trough"
Everyone still hаs their personаlities
BULLDOZER! COMING THROUGH🗣
@@fabiopauli420 bulldozer litterally taunting on you, showing how he don't give a crap
13:10
"Think, Cloaker! If you really wanted to kick me you would've jumped up here an hour ago!"
12:30 it’s definitely a bad sign that even after 200 hours of Payday 3, I’m only just learning that the Cloaker has a gun.
It look me at least 50 to witness one cloaker with a gun. He had bugged out and was walking around, taunting us and shooting us on Touch The Sky, instead of charging. I think that's been fixed since, but, yeah, they removed what made him a cop: his gun. Womp womp.
34:25 "Even in Raid WW2 the Good Guys had smokes."
Ah yes, my favorite good guys (the name gets censored/comment deleted lol) ;)
What can I say, RAID is the best Starbreeze product since PAYDAY 2, I can't help but honor it.
You get censored for saying German/American?
@@excier6074 The name of the german political party
@@BDozer666 the mario party
Hell even GTA 5 cops up PAYDAY 3's cops
GTA 5 still is worse GTA tho
This game struggles from "instead of making the enemies challenging but possible, lets just crank up the numbers a bit and call it a day."
The Nader is the most egregious. Genuinely the most threatening thing he does is runs in close range with the player and the weak spot explosion stuns them
I remember being excited for the nader, before the game released. New threat? New counters against the robbers? Sign me tHE FU-aaand it's trash.
You know, since the nader will always fuck up his grenade throws at close distance, what if he instantly released one when got too close to him? And he becomes the source of the gas? I mean sure, fart jokes, his but since the grenade belt explosion is the biggest threat of him most of the time, why not take that one step further.
@@doggiethepugthe turret vans in payday 2 kinda did that so that you didn't hid under their blindspot!
Hey look starbreese, a special ability to overcome the shortcomings a enemy has in close range that you regressed on yet again.....
I have met people who told me they like Payday 3. I asked if they had played Payday 2, they all answered no.
Holy crap bro, I had to do a double take at 28:14 for the WEBFISHING clip, I'm that one dude on the bench. I was not expecting to see that in a random video this morning.
Awesome video though, Payday 3 being shit was a knife to the heart. Its tragic Raid World War 2 has received more meaningful updates since Payday 3 came out.
lmao hiii! It is you, I do remember the name "Saladmander", you showed up to usernamesex's island! The world is such a small place.
Anyway, there a bittersweet irony to RAID's newer updates, it is a game that was rushed because Starbreeze wanted a quick cashgrab and abandonned because it was too rushed to be a success.
Fast forward a few years and now PD3 is about to be abandonned because it is too rushed to be a success, (despite having all the time in the world), while RAID still gets updates from a small yet dedicated team. Sweet sweet irony.
Nothing describes the fear of turning a corner and seeing a cloaker with the .5 seconds of realization that you will die in payday2
wow they got the Nader from em overhauls from Payday 2! i sure hope Starbreeze makes him a good special unit!
“Geneva Convention ain’t got nothing on me.”
Still can’t belive they killed noteriety on roblox for this 90 dollar piece of shit.
Notoriety at this point even before this dumpster fire released was better than payday 3(Waiting for the new version)
So as it turns out, Starbreeze forcably aquired the rights to Notoriety (by issuing a DMCA then giving them a "join or die" offer). On December 16th, "Notoriety: A PAYDAY® Experience", launches.
Yeah the news just dropped hours ago. What a time to be alive!
@@UnintelligibleYT No fucking way... that is insane. They couldn't make a better game so they just stole one!
@@UnintelligibleYTmy fucking god, they killed the friendly and happy version of Payday
I'll defend one thing of the sniper - the idea that they switch to less powerful but more consistent damage when you get close is interesting.
Badly executed, yes, but possibly interesting.
(Meanwhile, being unable to hit a stationary target *and* making no sound when they do... not so defensible.)
An interesting game mechanic that unfortunately has yet to be improved since September '23. We're almost at Christmas '24 and nothing changed.
By the time they do make it interesting if they do, it'll be too little too late, only a handful of players will get to experience it. That's not a fun thought ):
Could of been done with a spotter who helps the sniper.
The Virgin NYPD vs DC's Finest
Being 100% honest with you, I played this game on Gamepass, aside from Road Rage, I didn't even knew this game had snipers
Got payday 2 recently and my first encounter with a cloaker was him hiding behind a chair and me staring at said chair wondering why it looked weird. He proceeded to lunge at me scaring the shit out of me and making me paranoid the rest of the match
The cloaker does have better ninja animations and they went crazy with them is just that it's completely broken and you will most likely never see them. The skills are also trash talk about that.
I think fixing the specials is one thing, but another necessary thing is having more of them. Their varied presentation is what makes Restoration Mod so fun and interesting (that, and actually good enemy design.) It's pretty inexcusable for Starbreeze/OVERKILL/LionGameLion/Gold & Sharke to neglect the core of the game like this. It is a skeleton.
I disagree.
Skeletons are cool. This ain't.
Im not a big Payday player, Ive played 2 for a few dozen hours but its not in my normal cycle of games I play. I remember watching the Payday 3 videos as it was announced and shared and being excited, as that was around the time I had gotten into Payday 2, but also feeling an underlying sense of dread as things kind of werent making sense. Even as someone relatively not that invested compared to the rest of the community, I was far enough on the hype train that I barely paid attention to that dread, and the idea that things that people were saying were good changes made didnt actually seem to be good ideas. The how the youtubers playing marketers claimed the customization system was "streamlined", but when you actually looked at the system it was simply just gutted of the creativity 2 provided. They said that the AI was "Better than ever", but the changes seemed questionable almost to me. Still, I saw how happy everyone seemed to be and asked maybe if it was just me who had the issue, and deciding to see how things panned out in the longrun before I bought it. Im glad that I listened to my instinct and chose not to preorder the game, it was one of the smartest things Ive chosen *not* to do.
i really considered maybe buying this but thanks for saving my hard earned money to buy something better than overkills the walking dead : heist day.
5:57 is a good point though. you could be playing Payday 2 with a fucking blindfold on with the music on 100% with a party going on in the background and still immediately register in your brain when a sniper’s attacking you. its game design 101 and yet starbreeze is sitting there asking themselves “where did we go wrong, how do we fix this” mf you did it already do it again 😂
It's basic game design that's been in games for decades, it's not something PAYDAY 3's game designers understand
I've said this with Cities Skylines 2 before and I'll say it here: This game has no business being so bad with how much dev time went into the previous ones. If the devs knew they were going to release a worse product that needed patches, then why the hell did they go with it?
Starbreeze does not believe in "it's ready when it's ready", they impose short developpment periods and hard release dates. The developpers had to do what they could with that. It leads to rushed, low-quality products, as seen with a good number of PAYDAY 2 updates, RAID:WWII, OTWD or PD3.
Still doesn't excuse some of the stupidest stuff that hasn't clearly hasn't been thought through.
@@UnintelligibleYT It's a goddamn shame. These companies could be raking in the dough by the fistfuls but nah, c-suite needs their bonus NOW.
To appease the shareholders and investors. It’s why even an esteemed developer like CD Project Red released Cyberpunk in that broken and buggy state in the first place.
Starbreeze try not to reinvent the wheel challenge: impossible
What the heck? You're spending 30 minutes of video to reassure my disinterest in ever touching the Payday 3, then, suddenly, on 30:12 you completely throw me upside down with a reference to a Flying Aya Fumo, making me want to try that out much more than any marketing this game ever had???
the duality of man
You'd be less ripped-off by buying a retail drone and a bootleg Fumo and recreate that yourself in real life. The Flying Aya Fumo mod has brought me great joy in these dark times of playing this brown game, alas, no amount of virtual Flying Aya Fumo will remove the brown stain.
You say shifty AI, I say realistic competency
Every time a PD3 sale passes and i resist to buy it, i watch a video like this to validate my decision.
one small point on payday 2's shields being worse than payday 3's, is that payday 2 still has a better version of the 3's shields than 3 - and it's marshal shields. like 3's shields, it's less defended at the front, but has an ability to punish ignoring it by blinding you. but unlike 3's shields, breaking marshal's shield is not the best course of action, as it makes marshal into a pseudo-dozer. baiting them into using their flashbangs to then stun THEM is the best course of action, and is also actually fun, rewarding both strategic thinking through not immediately killing them, and quick, precise reaction with giving players and unusually low and small timed target
modern gaming be like: ''the community needs to improve by buying DLC slop and being active in our streams so we could MAYBE think about improving the game''
Improve the game? b-b-but the youtubers said it was almost perfect, a rough diamond, the best game you can't play, absolutely flipping phenomenal, better than PAYDAY 2 in every possible way, playable to death, checking all the boxes gameplay-wise, and that it was great!
What happened?
update: Yeah no it's the same shit on OVERKILL difficulty. Whoever telling me "OVERKILL difficulty, fixes all of this": put away the crack before the crack puts you away. I just played three heists on OVK, same deal as Very Hard, but bulletholes are bigger. Wooptidoo.
Oh ok
And also, if you NEED to play on higher difficulties to fix all the issues, THAT'S STILL NOT GOOD GAME DESIGN.
You'd think they would have the Cloaker at least spring up onto the table. All those acrobatics and dropping down from higher levels, running up walls, and slides during a rush, but cannot simply leap up onto a table for a dropkick.
You want the Cloaker, the athletic guy who can execute scripted wallruns, scripted grapplehook backflips and come out of flat black squares
to do an tiny jump??
gamer's... they always want more. They whip the poor skinny game developer's who do many work to make game good and children happys. gamer's they cry when game isn' t perfect... there are starving children in africa...
bottom text... #LetTheHeistBegin
(Yes, absolutely. Either that or cancelling the charge and switching back to their SMG, but I guess they haven't thought about either.)
@@UnintelligibleYT And most importantly, disengaging again if their rush was foiled. Like, if the Cloaker was dazed during their charge or the target went somewhere too impractical for the cloaker to pursue, at least drop a smoke and disappear again. The Cloaker is supposed to be a stealth unit. Cloak. It's in the unit's title. Man...
Meanwhile for the Naders, the only time where I could justify them gassing nobody in particular is if they're gassing a known objective, especially one where the players have to stay in a circle to maintain. The perfect way to frustrate players and make Naders a higher priority, otherwise they get stalled and have to defend themselves for longer than they should. That's the only time a Nader gassing nothing makes sense. But they couldn't even do that. At least give THEM the smoke grenades if the regulars aren't going to use them.
Remember, Ulf Andersson and Simon Viklund, two of the professional game designers that has been making Payday 2 are not in this mess, but instead they made the new company called 10 Chambers and making GTFO which is really the breath of fresh air among the heist game, it may a bit janky for me because that time it developed with a few devs(including this two) but now they come up with new cyberpunk themed heist game called Den of Wolves that I’m all here for it.
Kinda sucks that right now I’m watching Payday, one of my Childhood memories descended into the oblivion tho.
Unintelligible is so back, and Payday 3 is sadly so over!
Video was another hit. Thank you for speaking the unedited truth without bias. I liked that you complimented PD3 shields a bit.
Some questions:
- What do you think about PD3's current state and future?
- Will Piola make a video on enemies too?
Hey!
1) It's pretty bleak. I've been saying the game would die after its contractually obligated 18 months of post-release support and it looks like it's about to do just that. I don't think it'll improve much unless SBZ really changes the way they do game design. Which they haven't, since the guy who bungled Armor 1.0 is still in charge of Armor 2.0. So, not bright.
2) I pinged him with your question! Let's see what he says
you just made me remember I had a bit of a script (autistic rambling) for a crime boss video that I never made, I may or may not make it into a video though
thanks for asking🥺
Trains for 5 years to become a cloaker, can’t do anything because the robber stood on a box
19:45 pepper spray.
"Woah man you're way too close- *PEPPER SPRAAAAAAAY* "
its depressing knowing we'll never see something akin to pdth. that game got so many things right.
Den of Wolves is coming!! And GTFO exists
I am so sick of feeling bad for payday 3, fuck it to its core, it is a frustratingly unfun mess of a game that should never have been released the skill trees are boring and so un-unique I can't remember what most of them do and me personally can't be bothered to put together a proper build because they all feel so samey, stealth when first played gives vague and shit directions (you can at least say check lockers and or guards instead of just saying find the red key card) where you need to fail to properly learn layouts the worst offender being first world bank for this imo taking away from that heisting fantasy. I think this is because of the lack of preplanning it feels like we are going into heists blind and unprepared it got wore in the later heists of payday 2 but it tanked so hard for this newer game. then after learning layouts it becomes so boring there is no chance for additional random spawns of loot or even interesting alternate routs that can spawn instead the "changes" are the key card spawning on a desk in the corner of the map instead of a guard. grand...... I really tried to like this game there are times where I found myself having the best time with it but...fuck, it just feels bad to play at its core, a bandage from a medic bag isn't going to solve the huge amount of issues they just haven't done anything about, this game needs a god dam defibrillator
A point I'd like to add to your argument about Taser needing other cops, look at his design. Despite being distinct enough to pick from a line up of basics, he's just similar enough to be easily missed amidst the chaos of a crowd. Mostly dark colors, mostly the same silhouette, it all makes him easy to miss when you're being shot at from fifty different angles. And you get punished for making that exact mistake in Payday 2. Missing the Taser in a room can be all it takes for him to destroy you, because it helped bring him just a little extra time to get his tase off.
Unfortunately, when you outsource every single enemy model, which PAYDAY 3 did, some of the crucial elements are lost in translation.
Making the Taser distinct and immediately identifiable was pretty well done in PD:TH in PD2. Different headgear with yellow accents in PDTH, distinct body and color palette in PD2, great!
And then there's PAYDAY 3's. I don't personally have issues seeing him, thanks to his bright stripes and illuminated yellow goggles, but he does have the same skinny silhouette as every other normal SWAT, without a distinctive helmet, shoulders or body armor. Remove the colors and he's a regular cop with a Walkman on his hip.
Does this hinder anyone's experience though? Maybe someone with a lesser vision or color perception would have a hard time?
I'd love to hear more about that. I have no idea how anyone else feels about this but you've piqued my curiosity.
@UnintelligibleYT Oh I'm not suggesting this is a bad thing, in fact I believe it's a good thing. I also think PD2 did it better, actually.
The Taser is what I can only describe as a "offensive stealth unit" where he forces his way up close to you and then hopes you don't notice him. He has a delay in his stun which puts him into this sort of role. Not like the Cloaker, who you should already be dead to if he ever gets close, and instead tries to hide his presence at a distance. Colors might make him stand out, but silhouettes are what the eye can process the fastest. Pd3 gets that right at least, but PD2 balanced it best in my opinion. Compare the SHAPE of the Taser to other cops, and compare that to how much other specials stand out. The Shield is a wall, the Bulldozer is huge, the Cloaker is thin, only the Medic compares to the Taser, and the Medic is bright red and white. The Taser's colors, on the other hand, are much subtler. Yeah he has some neon yellow but only in small amounts. He's just the right amount of hard to notice and distinct, so that when he's alone or only with one or two cops, he sticks out like a sore thumb, but when he's in a large group of basics and you're trying to deal with them... It's hard for the eye to notice the color when everything is a blur. His head plate might be different, but it's also very similar in color to his body, so that doesn't actually stand out much. In fact the biggest part of neon yellow that might break his silhouette, his rifle, is PUT AWAY AND HIDDEN when he's about to use his taser.
I'm by no means saying that it's hard to tell who a Taser is, but he is SPECIFICALLY hard to notice during the more chaotic assaults in a heist, which is always where he causes the biggest problems. He is designed with the idea of "if you don't notice him, then he tasers you and the other cops finish you off." Every special might be stronger when they don't notice you, but the Taser NEEDS you to not notice him.
I think spawning him alone in PD3 was an attempt to make him more stealthy, with him flanking or whatever, but it misses the point of HOW the Taser would go unnoticed: In crowded fights. Not to mention, in PD3 his neon yellow is placed at center mass instead of at the borders, with his gloves, chest, and even goggles making a recognizable silhouette now because there's a gap in the MIDDLE of the black, so even in crowds he's actually easier to notice now.
To simplify all this: The eye notices shapes before colors, and PD3's Taser would even struggle in groups because his reworked design actually makes his shape more distinct because it creates a large gap amidst the black silhouette, instead of more subtle lines along the edges.
I'm not the best at explaining these sorts of things, but I hope I made that clearer
get me Bo Anderson on the phone RIGHT NOW
Heisters and operators! Have you found the hidden Bo Andersson that's hiding in the video? (;
Me cooking a turkey dinner in front of payday 3's sniper.
14:25 hes done with this game as well
Payday 3 was what made me realize the RUclipsrs I watched were total shills. I’m mad that I spent 90 dollars on this garbage lol
its okay max, at least you have Mona
@@reorseX uhh... about that...
What did they do to fuck up this bad, hire ROBLOX simulator developers? Sheltered LARPers that put 20 scopes on guns and think it makes them better? Game journalists???
Miodrag, senior game designer and game director for year 1 was a game journalist once. Never heard of him before? I wonder why.
Also, his subpar Steam reviews and his minimal playtime in both PAYDAY games that came before, combined with the number of games he helped make (like 3 mobile games nobody knows about and OTWD, a game so bad the owners of TWD pulled out) probably also mean something, but I'm not sure what.
It must be a coincidence. Surely I am overthinking it, as the redditors once said.
While I'm sure he's not the only person to blame for bad game design on board, he is *senior* game designer, so, you know, not completely powerless in that department. He was also game director for a year, which is funny because the game direction the game had the entire time was abysmal
But it must be a coincidinc. Surely I am overthinking it and I should blame Mats Mikkelsen, the chief executive business guy who hasn't played a videogame since Pong on the walls of a prehistoric grotto and who doesn't do game design, like some overrated overwatched underwashed Starbreeze Partner once said.
@@UnintelligibleYT This was a jokey comment, holy shit. I know game journalists were unironically bad but being bad enough to sink any game you get put in charge of is one hell of a stereotype to have.
If they had ONE guy on QA that had their voice heard none of this would've happened. So either these dipshits were either too good to have a QA team at all or had their heads so far up their asses that the QA team was either made completely out of yes-men or had their begging complaints ignored. Holy hell.
At this point throw the whole game out, Payday 3 is nothing but a cheap cardboard cutout of the Payday IP, trying to be kept up flimsly with nonsensical bullshit someone that has no idea how the game should work thought would be cool. Just a bunch of "great and innovative" ideas that will "bring forth an FPS renaissance" that are actually just garbage.
But oh well, we aren't allowed to have anything nice under corporates, so its no surprise.
Nothing is ever a joke with Starbreeze: the clownery is reality.
@@UnintelligibleYT It's getting very hard to make jokes nowadays, I'm going to have to scale things up to meaningless levels for irony to be more ridicilous than reality.
@@UnintelligibleYTthats a crazy detail.
Running Payday 2 on a Steam Deck is diabolical
To be fair, I think Naders gassing the areas without players can be used as a feature, like they preemptively block ways to relocate, retreat and etc. However, this would require a bit of an event script (as in "if all or almost all the players are inside the room, gas one of the two doors") and we know the situation with event scripting in this game.
It actually seems like it's supposed to do that. Like in Payday 2 where some rooms would get Tear Gas, to prevent you from staying in them or having to take another route.
But knowing how PD3 is, then it wouldn't be surprising that they messed up his AI.
and now they have a new mechanic coming called "overskill" which makes overkill weapons even more powerful, and making the game even easier
Little known fact about naders: if there is a hostage nearby, they won't throw a gas grenade as not to kill the hostage. A lot of the time you were camping and not getting gassed was likely because you had a guy tied up near you
I don't remember having hostages in the clips I included, but it's been a while.
IF ONLY THE GAME HAD A HOSTAGE COUNTER IN ITS HUD
now that would be great.
If you have a hostage they will simply switch their gas for flash bang granades. They don't stop trowing altogether.
Yeah tell that to the Nader who threw a gas at me and my hostages
The "lets go gambling bit" almost knocked me off my chair.