NO MIRACLES, NO FUNERALS | Good Omens Episode 3 FULL Reaction + Analysis
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- Опубликовано: 16 окт 2024
- I'll be frank, this episode wasn't my favorite. SUPPORT SAG-AFTRA/WGA. Also support those affected by the Maui Wildfires.
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Aziraphale was amused by Muriel's stock-comedy police officer costume and patter. but his reporter costume is only moderately better. Angels, I tell you.
The thing is, Crowley COULDNT miracle her into a better state. Even indirectly helping her was enough for him to be tortured. Aziraphale very well could've and thats why Crowley spends this entire episode picking apart his heaven tinted glasses so he can see that his perfect view of the world doesn't actually exist. But he proceeds to see things in black and white, because he is still at his core an angel. What I'd consider to be his most fatal flaw as it continually contributes to mess after mess which you can see later in the season too.
This episode isn't about Crowley learning a lesson, imo. It's about Aziraphale learning about grey morality. Crowley wasn't supposed to help Elspeth (he was severely punished for it), he was trying to nudge Aziraphale to do it, but Aziraphale was too stubborn in seeing everything as black and white.
I personally think that's giving Crowley a little too much credit. I saw as Crowley understanding why he has the urge to do the more compassionate things he does.
@@doctorcanonvo4647Crowley seems like he’s just there to screw around and enjoy a graveyard date with Azi to begin with, and only at the end does he actually take the situation seriously, so in that way, I see where you’re coming from. But Crowley already understands the grey morality of the situation right off the bat, whereas Aziraphale doesn’t, so the flashback is definitely more about the limits of Azi’s rigid morality.
@@doctorcanonvo4647giving Crowley too much credit? You mean the demon who refused to kill goats? He's a big softie.
I know everybody knows all this, but I just want to write this down anyway.
This episode made some great points about grave robbing: the people who do it are poor, and the ones who are victimized by it (the bereaved) are poor because they can't afford protections for their loved ones' graves. The rich can protect their graves and (extrapolating a bit) will be the ones who mostly benefit information gleaned from the stolen corpses. Aziraphae goes from grave robbing/bad to grave robbing/good, which isn't the point Crowley is making. When Morag is killed by a grave gun (set to protect a rich person's loved one's grave, presumably) and Elspeth wants to take her body to sell, Crowley notes that it hits different when it's someone you know. Elspeth only wants money to kill herself at this point, and she wants to be buried somewhere where people like her ("monsters," she calls them) will not be able to dig _her_ up.
The problem isn't that the doctor (excuse me, surgeon) is bad (on the wrong side) or Elspeth (or the poor in general, although there has always been a school of thought that poverty is a character defect) is bad (on the wrong side). The system is bad, but Crowley's main point is that everything has a context, and he tries to help his angel see this. And Crowley pays for doing this, as I don't think he'd willingly stay away from Aziraphale for such a long time. Hell punished him for those 90 guineas.
There's so much I want to say in response, but I can't without spoiling anything lol. I will say that, as all over the place as the flashbacks may seem at times, they're crucial context for the final conflict of the season. So definitely don't give up on them, and this is definitely a show to watch again with the perspective of knowing how it ends.
I do want to defend Crowley and Aziraphale a little bit in the flashback. Technically, they're not supposed to just miracle things better for people. Crowley can't just miracle a better situation for Elspeth because it would be seen as a good deed and he would be punished for it (which he was, even with the excuse of the laudanum; that was why he took it in the first place, so he could claim to be under the influence and not in his right mind). If you notice the timeline, he's dragged down to hell and Aziraphale doesn't see him again until (presumably) 35 years later, when he shows up asking for insurance in the form of Holy Water. He made one person's life better, and the consequence was so bad that he felt he needed to take more extreme precaution. ("Walls have ears.")
Aziraphale might be more likely to get away with helping Elspeth directly (except that 34 years earlier he was reprimanded for too many frivolous miracles), but he isn't really supposed to either. Unless he is specifically given a job by Heaven, his job is more to encourage humans to make the right choices, create their own fortune, etc. (He says as much in s1e1 while he and Crowley are getting drunk after Adam is born) Sort of like a wildlife documenter. Over time he becomes more lax with their miracles, as Heaven stops checking up as regularly, and after Armageddon when they mostly stop checking up at all. So he can get away with more direct miracles to influence humans.
(One last thing; I actually don't mind that the humans from s1 haven't made a return. I actually really liked them all, but I love the idea of new humans being introduced each season, with Crowley and Aziraphale and the other angels and demons being the constant over time. It feels like a microcosm of their actual life on earth; people live and die around them, but the celestials carry on.)
Love this.
I agree with all of this! Well said :D
This! This! This!
Exactly!
Yes I agree.
I like this episode more with every rewatch. At first I thought it was a bit all over the place but now I think it is meant to be a foil for episode two. In episode two Aziraphale and Crowley teamed up and managed to help Job out of a very unjust situation caused by the forces of God and Satan/Heaven and Hell. They found a way to cheat and save Job's children. In this episode we see that their interference doesn’t always result in a good outcome. They actively make the situation worse for the humans around them despite their good intentions. It shows that while they might be the most human angel and demon of the whole bunch, they’re still immortal beings and just visitors on earth. Both share a sense of fairness and justice but they tackle it from different angles. Crowley is more cynical - at least on the surface - and more aware of the problems in the system while Aziraphale has a more rigid idea of right and wrong, even though he is capable of changing his mind.
But while I think they really care about earth, I don’t think they see themselves as a part of it (yet?). In season one Crowley pitches the idea of running off together when the apocalypse hits several times. He likes earth and living among humans but ultimately he would choose another place over the risk of harm coming to him or Aziraphale. He’s also not as connected to humanity as one might expect after six thousand years. In the pilot episode Crowley seems more agitated about the fate of the sea life facing the apocalypse and in episode three during the scene with Noah's arc, he says „they can’t kill kids!“ as children and young goats run through the frame. And I don’t think he’s referring to the human children here. This fits with the Job episode where he spares the goats, too. And the first episode of season two when he’s properly giddy with excitement over the universe and then appalled when he learns it’s all just a wallpaper for humanity to marvel at.
And Aziraphale has no problems manipulating the humans around him to his advantage. He uses Maggie and Nina to hide his miracle from the angels. And in this episode the fate of the two girls just serves a the background for his philosophical argument with Crowley. That is, until he is confronted with real human suffering and his kind heart wins out over his selfish impulses.
I also think that neither Crowley nor Aziraphale directly interfere in the fate of Morag and Elspeth because that isn’t their job, so to speak. They’re supposed to influence humanity but not make choices for them. In a way all of humanity is just a big version of the Job story: a bet between God and Satan to see who can turn more souls to their side. There are consequences for Aziraphale and Crowley if they interfere with this game. This episode in the flashback Crowley was kidnapped back to hell for doing something good and last season they almost got destroyed for thwarting the apocalypse. I don’t think Crowley and Aziraphale are hero characters that team up to end the unfair system God created, I think at this point they’re doing exactly what Crowley stated in the first episode of this season: they’re trying to carve out a peaceful, fragile existence for themselves within this world, not tethered to either heaven or hell. But they have to walk a tightrope here because if they interfere with either Heaven or Hell’s plans, they are at risk of losing it all. So they are immortal beings in a world that is at the mercy of powers beyond their own, surrounded by impermanent humans with fleeting lives. It’s no wonder they act a bit detached and selfish at times. The only constant presence in their lives is each other.
I agree with you on the Nina and Maggie part. Maggie feels underdeveloped. I don't think it's a leap of logic that Maggie feels Nina hates her. Mostly because whatever is introduced of Maggie gives the impression she jumps headfirst to conclusions and always believes everyone hates her. But I don't think there is a need to bring characters from s1. Their story is finished. I don't think even if S2 was based on the ending Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman planned, they would have old characters who are unnecessary.
I wouldnt exactly consider Adam unecessary for the planned arc of the 2nd book. Anathema neither for that matter, though the burning of the prophecy book is obviously a signifier of the end of AN ARC for her, I would like for it to sort of bite them back when its needed. However Shadwell and Tracy I think deserve to be left behind and theres nothing really for Newt to do either
@@aspen1889 Don't know if they will want to bring Adam either. Adam turned into a normal kid at the end. So, it's not like he has his powers anymore unless the story somehow decides to magically return it to him. Adam doesn't want the powers either. His thing is that he is a normal kid. It doesn't seem right to bring him back into it?
@@oishidasgupta but he DOES have his ppwers still. He uses them in his final scene. His thing isnt about wanting to be a normal kid, its about how his want to protect and save the world clashes with his biblical destiny. He still wants to better the world and a now late teenage Adam coming back to stop the 2nd coming, especially cause he still has his powers would just be nice.
@@aspen1889third season 😊 I hope
Heaven really needs a training program for their Earth undercover agents.
Unfortunately the run time was cut because Covid regulations ate into the budget, and you can definitely see that in the development of minor characters like Nina and Maggie. However, to be completely honest, I'm glad their development was sacrificed rather than take time away from Aziraphale and Crowley.
I loved this season (probably more than the first) but I do mourn for the second season we *could* have got had the pandemic never happened.
I actually think the minisodes (stories set in the past) touch mainly on Aziraphale's character. In the present, most of the plot things happening are related to Aziraphale and the emotional arc is about Crowley. In the minisodes, its the other way round. In the Job story he learns he's allowed to make mistakes and not everyone fits into a strict box of following the rules. In this one he learns that not every decision is good or evil, and people don't always get a fair choice on what they decide to do. Crowley is the one causing all the things to happen with Job and the one helping Elspeth with the bodies and saving her. In the present, A is plot focused and C is emotionally focused, Azirphale is following all the clues and making things happen with Jim, whereas Crowley is learning to be less angry with Jim and more open with his emotions.
Yeah it's fascinating and also almoooost the direct inverse of s1 that way. All the plot *happens* bc of Crowley saying 'We can do something!' and then them trying to navigate how. And then the flashbacks were just to set up what they would risk for each other. This time around, the minisodes show the consequences of them subverting hell&heaven, which heeeeavily foreshadows the potential s3 I'm thinking.
But ultimately, due to their own incompetence, the plot of s1 moves on without them, and they only matter in the final moment. And again in s2, the plot moves around them, and what they both have learned only matter in the final moments. Because the minisodes this episode setup the emotional risks, we're left confused about the main plot until the end! (primarily confusion, tho that's mitigated somewhat for those of us that were suspicious about the fly from the word go)
Genuinely fascinating structure of a story.
Definite agreement with you on the Maggie/Nina arc. Neil said that thanks to COVID-related budget cuts, episodes were shortened so a lot of potential storyline developments got the axe. No spoilers of course, but in my opinion Nina and Maggie act more as a mirror for Aziracrow, and I do believe they were added as a human “support system” for the other characters (you’ll understand more what I mean by this at the end). I don’t know if it’s just acting choices, but I personally don’t really care for Maggie as a character so my view of her relationship with Nina is unfortunately diminished.
me neither. In my opinion the Nina / Maggie romance could have been left on the cutting floor without making this season worse. Could actually have been better cause it would have left more time for the other stuff.
I like your point that Aziraphale and Crowley know more than the average angel/demon about Earth and humans, but they don't know a lot. I think it has a LOT to do with them being immortal, actually. the show The Good Place explored this topic very well (I recommend it, if you haven't seen it). the whole point of good and evil only becomes crucial once you die and you are sentenced, if you weren't careful, to eternal damnation. on Earth, nothing is black or white, everything is shades of gray, and the only way to survive is to properly walk the thin line between the two. I don't think that Aziraphale realises that. I think that Crowley does, for the most part, because he already travelled "to the other side" and saw that, at its core, Heaven and Hell are not too different and the difference is in the details.
i’m not sure if you know this already but this season was created with a future season 3 in mind! neil gaiman has said that the stuff that he and terry plotted for a book sequel would be season 3, while s2 is the sort of sandwich filling in between them
precisely! so this is why it is so heavily character-focused. the 'real' story is coming in S03 and I expect it will be just as exciting as S01 was. this season was just the deep breath between two action scenes. this is why the fandom is so focused on getting the series renewed - you will see, it is as much for the plot as it is for the characters, if not more!
Exactly! Neil himself describes this season as the quiet and romantic jelly to the story's Apocalyptic Sandwich!
I personally think Maggie and Nina's relationship feels much less forced and has alot more chemistry than Anathema and Newt in season 1, but I do get what youre saying about them being there to move the main characters along.
I do think its good how all the storylines this series dont feel so seperate like series one but s1 feels like that because its a direct adaptation of the book and the story wasnt made for tv show structure initially.
This is all supposed to be a setup for season 3 which is based on the unwritten book 2, so I think theyre taking a moment to have a more character driven story to develop some things before we get into a big bulk of plot, which I can definitely get behind.
I think it's that Nina told her that Nina's partner thought she was having an affair after the power outage incident (oddly, caused by Crowley, who would soon be looking for other ways to get them together), and that's why she feels Nina must hate her. And probably feels she somehow deserves to be hated too, because it's that way sometimes. I think she just projects this because she's afraid of it.
that moment of aziraphale with the jar...Michael Sheen is so good
watching this late, actual thoughts will eventually follow
the ineffable poverty debate reminds me of the hoops you have to jump through for any kind of public assistance, even when we have oodles of evidence that the best thing to do to improve quality of life is just give people money, no strings attached
another nice commentary from you, i really enjoyed your perspective as always.
imo many parts of these episodes get more meaning the more you see from the season. at first i didn't really get what they wanted to get at with this flashback that they already didn't cover in the previous one, so i was just along the ride for another round of "aziraphale and crowley shenanigans" but imo when you get the whole season it does make a lot more sense for what they meant both for deepening the characters and also current plot-wise.
@ nina/maggie. i definitely think some more development would've been much appreciated for them, but i also didn't feel as if it wasn't enough for what the story was trying to get at. they both supposed to mirror aziraphale and crowley in many regards, and i think it's done purposefully by neil to the point he knows you as an audience will notice, and the moment you do you'll instantly feel like you know these characters in some way. but also i feel like their characterizations are quite effective. nina is a typically closed off person who's currently in a toxic relationship, while maggie is a sweet but rather insecure person. i don't think it's a stretch on her part that she felt as if nina was mad at her. nina, because of her toxic gf, was rather brash and on edge with her when they got locked up together so it did leave them on an awkward note. and since maggie is insecure imo she took it on herself and thought nina was mad at her in some part. which she wanted to clear since she likes her so much. so that's where the awning convo came from. i think it's kind of normal to overthink even simple awkward situations when it's about someone you're crushing on. at least that's how i saw it. but ahh yes i wish budged cuts didn't affect the run time of this season. neil was pretty forthcoming about how they had to cut down episodes and subplots. :/
i think this flashback for me continued to deepen the themes brought up in the job episode, but from a different, more broader perspective. while in the job episode we get to see job suffering because of a bet, he was still kind of a very extreme case. i mean, he was one guy in the unique position of being in god's favor. it has a lot of take-aways but it's still a pretty unique perspective. meanwhile here i felt like it was a lot more universal and relatable perspective where we saw the kind of human situation that was experienced by many, as part of their everydays. how inequality in class forces people to do immoral things and how sometimes even objectively immoral things can have a positive intention and impact behind them. it was another new realization for aziraphale to chew on. meanwhile we see crowley ending up being as the one who instantly understood the moral ambiguity of the situation and we again see him bringing the resolution by doing pure good. which ends in him being punished for real this time. interestingly when you put together the timelines of all past flashbacks this fits right before the one where he asks aziraphale for holy water for protection from hell. it is very heavily implied or theorized that this encounter was the trigger for that decision, that by doing good he was probably punished/tortured big time to the point he took drastic measures to protect himself from hell. also explains why he always acts so vehemently whenever aziraphale calls him nice or doing nice/kind things. if he is being punished for such a thing then it makes all the sense in the world.
sorry this is getting long but as a last thought - i dunno if i should feel bad or nah but i don't miss s1 characters. :'') i feel their stories were pretty much finished in s1. armageddon was shut down so there's no reason for the horsemen to be brought back. i never actually imagined that these two would keep in touch with the shadwell or adam gang either. maybe anathema if we really wanted to force it but even there she burned the prophecies, so. they really only ever interact with each other. ahh maybe it really is just me, tbh i read the book even before the first season dropped and even back then i always thought i wanted less of those side charas and more aziraphale/crowley focus, so maybe this season is just perfectly catering to my own tastes, that's why.
can't wait to see your next reaction as well, i'm always happy to see your videos pop up on my home page. thank you for sharing!
Really good observations. I certainly don't miss Shadwell, and while, I suppose, Death is always around somewhere, I don't need the Horsemen again. Maybe Adam could have a role to play, but that's a complicated speculation to get into. I know Gaiman said some of the first-season actors could come back in other roles. (Michael McKean was supposed to, but then COVID restrictions or something got in the way.) I enjoyed first season, but I've also loved all the character work and debates about the nature of good and evil and right and wrong and just the affection that Crowley and Aziraphale have for each other.
I'm not sure if this would be considered a spoiler, so I'll drop this a couple lines (It's about seasons)
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> There will be a season 3. Season 3 is the story that Neil and Terry wrote, and this season is what Neil wrote to bridge the gap between the book and the story they talked about. Neil said if Amazon doesn't pick up season 3, he'll do it himself.
About the cuts, and the reduced length of the episodes : it is true! Neil said that the production was burdened with extra cost due to the fact that they filmed in late 2021 when the pandemic was at an HIGH in the UK. So covid costs for the protection of cast and crew were very onerous, also time-consuming. Also post production was quite costly.
Initially, they had at least two more episodes planned and the duration of each was supposed to be more around the 50min-1hour mark.
Thank you so much for your reactions and for sharing your insights! I'm curious what your thoughts about Maggie and Nina will be after finishing watching this season. I definitely think them being a parallel to Aziraphale and Crowley's relationship is their main "purpose" this season but I tend to take things at face value so I'm excited to hear your thoughts in the future!
I don't think I see why you believe that in this ep, Crowley is the one learning about the value of life. I got the impression that Crowley was the one (more or less at least) who had his mindset in the right place. He knew how ridiculous the notion of "poverty is actually a blessing" is, and was there for the ride as Aziraphale came to understand the absurdity of it as well. I feel like Crowley hasn't really undergone any massive changes to his mindset as opposed to Aziraphale, you know?
Another thing is, I can totally understand why Aziraphale and Crowley are so careless in their interactions with El (acting as if she isn't there, not offering her any true help at the beginning, etc.). At this point, they've been on Earth interacting with milions of humans for almost 6000 years. I bet they've grown attached to some of them (Crowley more so than Aziraphale I bet), and watched many of them suffer and die. I cannot imagine them being able to interact with humanity for such a long time without becoming numb to some things and accepting them as just part of "mortal life" or sth. Plus, there is the question of - why should they help El and not someone else? If they helped El at the very beginning, why haven't they helped all the other poor people living in that alley or, hell, the entire Edinburgh? They clearly have the capacity for it. But they don't. I guess it could be blamed for the bureaucracy of Heaven and Hell, but I think there is more to that. Idk most of this I just thought up while writing this comment, so my thoughts might not be too well-fleshed out or I might simply be wrong in my interpretation.
Anyway, once again, thank you so much for the videos! I'll definitely be checking out your reactions to other TV series :3 Have a great weekend! 🤍
Hello! Firstly, love your reactions. Secondly, from what I understand about Christianity and Catholicism (basically from what I've learned from reading Saint Augustine, to be honest I was raised an asidous atheist) angels, and even demons, cannot and will not actively intervene in human lives, they will sort of guide and waft humans towards glory or damnation, but it is not their place to, for instance, save - or condamn- a person from poverty. Their concern is for the salvation or damnation of a soul, so they cannot give Elspeth money or save her and her friend from homelessness, that's not their business! Their interest is for her to make the right or wrong choices so that when the time comes she'll spend eternity in heaven if angelic influences dominated, or hell if otherwise. That is why Elspeth's friend could not be saved, and that is also why the whole little "be good here's 90 guineas" performance was quite out of order. So, yes, bottomline, they couldn't and shouldn't help her. Our darling heroes are, in fact, not human. Sorry for the obnoxiously long comment!
hey TK! thoughts as they come to me while listening to you (because I'd love to at least feel like I'm having a conversation with you :D)
re: Maggie thinks that Nina hates her. I agree that this is kind of odd. however, my first impression of Nina was kind of similar. not that she hates Maggie but that she doesn't particularly like people generally. she seemed kinda rude, a bit too blunt and a bit insensitive to me ("I wonder who buys records", "I'd be more worried that someone will break in and leave more records"...). Maggie seems to me to be a people-pleaser (like myself) and took Nina's general aloofness a bit too personally. I get that. but you are right - their chemistry is off, and I think there is a good reason for that - Maggie is in love with her fantasy of Nina, and Nina doesn't know Maggie at all (she is "the skinny latte" to her, literally).
I really appreciate that you are so honest with us viewers about how you feel about things and it's perfectly valid to feel the way you do! Your analyses are always great and interesting to see and then watch and rewatch as I mull them over.
I want to preface this by saying I am by no means saying this episode is bad, but I do agree it was all over the place and it also was one that didn't quite hit right, with me. I am happy for anyone who enjoyed it and loved it, it just ended up hitting some things that made it fail to resonate with me as much as others did.
Personally, I was very unsettled by both Aziraphale and Crowley talking about Wee Morag like she wasn't there at all and her having to put up with these two, clearly rich, dudes just talking about her and her life and her situation and butting into her life and messing it up and then messing it up more and then changing it all on might as well looked as a whim without giving her any choice or respecting any of the boundaries she tried to lay down.
It made my skin crawl and not in a good way, because I couldn't help but think of how it would feel, to be trying to eke out a living and make things better for me and the friend I care about and then have to do it through these two just talking about it, one of them pontificating about how my situation is actually good for me except it's not and it sucks and -- it just ended up hitting some really bad notes and making Wee Morag as less of a full character and more as a prop to the narrative both in-story and out of story, one that was treated as a prop also by Aziraphale and Crowley for a good chunk of their interactions with her.
I doubt I could have been able to handle it as she did, but I also thought that her not reacting to a lot of it was ... off key for me. Maybe because to me she looked not as if she did not care but so much as she was okay with that and that just ... did not work for me, personally. Just talking about my experience of watching the episode, not saying this has to be case for anyone else! But I'd have taken her being exasperated or frustrated while she was walking in the streets way better than her just sort of ... going along with it, with no particular feelings about it that I could pick up on.
In regards to Maggie and Nina, I also would have liked something more in terms of their interactions, to give more weight and impact to what we saw on screen. It felt as if there was a story there that we were seeing just pieces of rather than the whole of. I understand that there is only so much runtime we can dedicate to them with everything else that is going on, but I would also like a longer season (UK shows always tended to have shorter season than US ones, I know, but I still would like more eps for some of them!) if it meant I could get more of what was going on with them or also with Shax and Muriel and Gabriel!
I think all of their situations could have used a little bit more developing and they could have had some good shenanigans with Muriel and Crowley and Gabriel that could have been funny and entertaining if we just had had more time to work with!
Thank you for sharing your thoughts and analysis with us, it's always a pleasure to watch you react to something!
I think you mean Espeth at least some of the time when you are mentioning Wee Morag. I sometimes am not sure that mortals are hearing all of the dialogue-with-the-devil conversation going on here, although I know Elspeth engages with them on some of it. I will have to look out for that on the rewatch.
I love that Heaven/Hell is so incompetent investigating Azraphale and they still don't know how close he and Crowley are. There would be a century of phone records between them (I picture Crowley getting one of the very first phone lines for them), centuries of diary entries, Angel DNA on Crowley and his car, and demon DNA all over Aziraphale's bookshop. (I know they wouldn't have DNA but there would be an equivalent).
"this is the weirdest am I the asshole post ever" fucking killed me 😂
To me, you don't seem to understand Maggie at all. She is very un-American in her rather nervous disposition. To me, as a northern European, her behaviour is very relatable. She is anxious and also wants to continue talking to Nina whatever it takes.
I'm American, and there are people like that here too. I've also seen posts from autistic people saying how nice it is to have a character like her on TV and someone who was raised Mormon and left the church because she was gay related to her. I think there are probably a variety of people who like and don't like the character for various reasons.
Of course. I'm sorry for the way I phrased that. I meant to refer to the stereotypical US American that's portrayed as loud, confident and socially comfortable, in contrast to the stereotypical northern European. There are people of all sorts everywhere but in different proportions.
Our reactor here is clearly of a kind of badass disposition with lots of confidence, which is a far cry from Maggie in the series. To me, being autistic myself , there's nothing autistic about Maggie, just lack of self confidence
You pointed out things that I omitted on my watch and re-watch! You can you're 'just sitting close to the screen' but yet you notice soo much
10:16 OH BOY OK.
I have no idea if that was intentional, but your comment gave me an instant flashback.
Crowley goes too fast
Aziraphale goes too far
I just wanna say how much I really enjoy your reactions, especially to this series! I'll always come back to watch when you post a new video
I usually have nothing to comment, just like and try to share things i like. But for no reason i refreshed the page and my like disappeared. So here is my comment. I like ur content, and I'll try to support it as much as i can.
Also. *cries in bad english*
I couldnt quite piece the connection together myself but when i rewatched s1 after s2, Dalrymple is actually mentioned once or twice as a witchfinder i believe? theres just 2 or 3 blink and you miss it mentions of his name but i really dont know how or why hes connected to them or if there are any witchfinder easter eggs in his butchering place
I get that Crowley dropping Aziraphale’s books is funny, but it still bothers me. First because I love books. Secondly because Crowley knows Aziraphale loves those books.
agreed. it's funny but also a wee bit distressing. the points raised here about Crowley trying to draw a boundary concerning the Bentley kinda have me feeling a bit more complicated about it? not that either behavior (ie miraculous chop shop/shoddy shelving practices) is particularly ok, but more that the two are both a bit blinkered about their own sacred things, and not quite fully appreciating or respecting the other's values. *I'm sure that won't become an issue*
apologies for that horrific grammar, I'm not sure how to clarify without being here all night lol
And yeah, I do think this episode is showing Aziraphale gray morality, not Crowley. Crowley tries all throughout it, to show him that not everything is as clear-cut as it seems, and that everything has facets.
Your reactions are sooo good!!!
I think you're right with Nina and Maggie. It does frustrate me that their story seems to be them getting to know each other when they both own shops pretty much right next to each other on a street where everyone is is each other's business. I mean Maggie has clearly been there forever and Nina has at least been there long enough for Mrs Sandwich the Madame to be aware of her shitty abusive relationship and to be comfortable enough to offer opinions on it.
As far as themes and lessons, I love listening to your analysis because you pick up on so many themes that I didn't. I've been viewing both seasons exclusively through the lens of free will. Through all of season one Aziraphale is convinced that he doesn't have free will. "I can't disobey orders" is a running theme with him. Not I won't or I shouldn't. Crowley seems to be the only one out of all the angels and demons who realizes not only that he has free will, but the rest of them do too, only he doesn't seem to have the self reflection to put that into words. So we see time after time through history Crowley showing Aziraphale he has it, and then Aziraphale not quite getting it. He gets it in season two. He also doesn't have the self reflection to verbalize it, but he's shown a lot of growth in his independence of thought and decision making. I think that's really important in season two. 6000 years of not really getting that he has free will, and 4 years of kind of, sort of getting that he does.
Great points about the humanity of Crowley and Aziraphale and you've latched on to some things that some others are missing.
7:55 LMAOOOOOO
I personally loved this episode. LOVED it. Showed a lot of REALLY GREAT character moments.
And yes, Nina and Maggie do seem a bit under developed to me as well, but they served their purpose in the show quite well, i would say. And they are nonetheless, quite fun to watch most of the times
8:40 Downton Abbey is actually set in the early 20th century (1910s onwards I think) and this is the 1860s, so you’re half a century off, but close enough 😅
Once again, I love your insights! It'll be interesting when you compare this episode to the next one, with the themes of grey morality. Yeah, unfortunately, a lot of extra character stuff with Maggie and Nina had to be cut out due to budget and covid. Blame Amazon for that. They've done the best they could with what they got though. There's more I want to say, but I don't want to spoil. Let's just say that Neil has said that for many of the characters in Season 1, their stories are finished now and we shouldn't expect to see them in season 2. (For better or for worse.) Also, Season 2 is supposed to be a bridge between the first season and Season 3.
10:09 YOU ARE SO!! SO!! SO GOOD AT ANALYSIS!!!!! 20:42 AGAIN!!!
I really am sad that Nina and Maggie didn’t get as much development as they definitely deserved!! I really hope we get them back In season 3!!
I'm always glad to see Nina Sosanya. I really didn't pay as much attention to Maggie Service's first season character, but it was quite a change. It's also nice to see women over 30 getting some kind of a romance plotline.
Tiny thing. Crowley is pronounced like the bird
Yeah, I do definitely wish Nina and Maggie got more development. But I'm also not gonna lie and say that it's not the two main characters and their dynamic that I enjoy the most in this entire show, so... I'm not complaining too much. Just a few minutes more would have been nice, to establish why Maggie likes Nina in the first place, some more of their lives, and so on.
I think the reason he liked yellow was because of crowleys eyes
It's not that they have to justify a third season. The third season is what would have been the second book. This season is, well, a bridge between s1 and 3. Filler if you will. Mostly here to develop the characters and... Well, no spoilers.
I still don’t understand the “It’s always too late.” line.
That's an interesting line.
The world is always ending or about to be ending in this show, so it might be literal? Crowley is always feeling like he’s a day away from losing everything he cares about.
@@emmoo2701 Too late rather suggests the moment of losing it, though, doesn't it?
Why does Aziraphale talk so long instead of just saving her? Like Crowley was gonna argue against it?
No! It's very basic rules - human free choice. They are supposed to choose the good path and be rewarded with a better life, not just given money, according to Heaven. You know, like the US thinks about its citizens
@@livb6945 I meant the part where Morag was dying and Aziraphale is like I'm going to save her-I've made up my mind-You can't stop me-Oh, no, she's dead.
I do appreciate the burn on the U.S. government, though (and an unfortunate number of its citizens, I'm forced to admit).
I think it was less about trying to talk Crowley into agreeing with him, and more about him trying to talk himself into it. It's really REALLY something he's not supposed to do, much as he wants to. So he appeals to Crowley bc some outside validation will help him feel like he isn't doing such a bad thing. ("Oh, you're an angel, I don't think you can do the wrong thing." / **instant relief** "Oh! Oh, thank you! It's been bothering me.")
@@montanarose-sings This makes sense. This works for me. Thank you.
Crowley does start to argue against the idea of fixing Wee Morag- there's a very quiet "Aziraphale" from Crowley interjected in there. It's against the rules to interfere, and Crowley distracted him long enough for it to be too late.
The thing that confused me the most about this season is the casting choices, not the recasting of Bees but the actors that they reused because it's not addressed at all or acknowledged in universe. I won't say who because it took till the last episode for me to twig (i'm occasionally face blind) but it's driving me **up the wall** every time I rewatch an episode. Was it deliberate? Was it just that they really liked the actors (I do they are some of my favourites)? Was it covid limitations? Are they saying something? Was it Adam rearranging things to fit his new 'Adam was never the anti-christ' reality?
I think Neil just wrote new characters with those actors in mind because he wanted to keep them involved in the show -saw something to that effect in an interview clip somewhere.
@@spamerannethanks for letting me know :) it took me ages to figure out and I felt like I'd missed some important story point!