Helpful,though more for a thoughtful discursive coffee,I think. A plain challenge of text is “vengeance is mine, declares the lord”. One for victims of calamity and injustice to hold to. Amazing that during New Testament times the large numbers of people that did not adhere to believing in an afterlife, ie the Sadducee’s. Although Hell,like most teachings develops when the chosen people are exiled to Babylon,it does help the church as a great motivation for reaching the lost! “Untold millions lie outside the fold,who will tell them how will they know”? Dick Dowcett’a book a former director with OMF, “God that’s not fair”,is also a good starting point! Maybe some of our atheist connections, need to remember that many of the WW1 soldiers and officers,believed in Hell due to experiencing trench warfare. The example of Houges as being described as Hell fire corner,is a good reminder of that very fact! Am delighted to have come across this channel, and look forward to learning more,thanks for share!
I wish brad could see this. When God visited me at age 21, I saw nothing, he spoke very basic things into my mind and heart and he melted me down to the ground by heating my body up and making it like jelly, he confirmed who jesus is and that he is the messiah who saves. i had heard the gospel at various points prior to this experience when I was totally alone.
I really like this, but two quick questions: what of ‘ransom’ as Jesus said in reference to himself, and what of those pictured as ‘outside’ in Revelation 22? Thanks!
Universalists actually do believe in a hell (of sorts). But the fact that there is no hell leaves the spurious universalist doctrine with no purifying agent. (The original Bible manuscripts do not contain the word "hell" or any word which means hell.)
You make a good point. Universalists _do_ believe in a hell (of sorts). But the fact that there is no hell leaves the spurious universalist doctrine with no purifying agent. (The original manuscripts do not contain the word "hell" or any word which means hell.)
Let me ask my universalist brothers and sisters a question. The unsaved will die a second time. (Die, as in 100%, all-the-way, dead.) Where in the Scriptures are they resurrected a second time? Anywhere?
Great question! The book of Revelation only takes us as far as the New Heavens and New Earth, at which time the Lake of Fire, which IS the Second Death, still exists. But Paul takes us further than anyone else in time: (Using Young's Literal Translation here; I always use literal versions for study, adding my thoughts in parenthesis throughout) 1Cor 15: 22 for even as in Adam all die, so also in the Christ all shall be made alive, (the same ALL that die in Adam will be made alive; so ALL descendants of Adam) 23 and each in his proper order, a first-fruit Christ, afterwards those who are the Christ's, in his presence, 24 then -- the end, when he may deliver up the reign to God, even the Father, when he may have made useless all rule, and all authority and power -- (at the END, meaning Christ doesn't reign "forever and ever" [bad translation], Christ will deliver up his rule, authority and power up directly to God) 25 for it behoveth him to reign till he may have put all the enemies under his feet -- 26 the last enemy is done away -- death; (done away is "katargeo" in Greek, which means abolish/nullify. The lake of fire IS the second DEATH, it is the last enemy, and DEATH will be abolished! What happens to those who were dead? Read on:) 28 and when the all things may be subjected to him, then the Son also himself shall be subject to Him, who did subject to him the all things, that God may be the all in all. (GOD will be ALL in ALL, HE will be everything in every person!)
It doesn't say the unsaved. That's a word you use. It does say the wicked and godless which does not equate to unsaved. Nowhere does the bible use the term the 'unsaved'. It also says God will restore the fortune of Sodom... How will that happen if they are all burning in Molochs fire.... Oh wait I mean Gods fire according to the Roman dogma. Also, it doesn't say forever and ever it says aionios et aionios or something like that I'm Greek which means for the ages of the ages.... Which can be translated as... A very long time. Also godless means selling your soul and ceasing to have Any image of God left in you. Study biblical history and context and stop reading the bible in a 21st century American way. It's shameful that Christians don't study the bible in it's original language. Remember the bible is written in Greek Aramaic and Hebrew... All other bibles are people's subjective translation where often things are superimposed on the text which do not exist.
@@misterbenbob9715 The words the Sadducees used to describe their belief in universal extinction (In English: “death,” “perish,” “destruction,” “destroy,” etc.) are the same words used in the Bible to describe the second death. I see no reason to assume that those words have completely different meanings today.
Hi Steve. Thanks for asking the question. So the short answer, in terms of defining hell the way evangelical fundamentalist have, no Jesus did not. I’m a former Southern Baptist. I still ordained and was teaching pastor for three large churches. We’ve all been let astray. Summarize, Jesus spoke of Gehenna / Gehinnom. Something completely different than the pagan teaching of eternal lasting tournament. Matthew 25 at the end it is not properly translated. The word eternal is not there. Not in the Greek. A better translation would be divine age or determined by God and fire is purifying. God is love plus nothing. Hell is real but not with a capital H. And a lot of us have already experienced it. Bottom line is we can’t go to heaven and remain hateful and angry. But we experience divine discipline things change.
That is a fair question, Steven. Four Hebrew and Greek words appear as "hell" in some--but not all--translations of the Bible. None of those four words means hell as hell is commonly understood today, i.e. a place of eternal conscious torment. So, no, Jesus did not speak on hell. All the best, my friend.
I ran across your post again today, Steve, and thought of something to add. This is an example of what Jesus really _did_ say. ✴ _For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish...._ [ "apollumi" - be utterly destroyed ] (John 3: 16, KJV)
Sorry God sent a prophet to end the sacrificial system and restore the Temple to its original function as a place where people of all nations could learn about God. Saul turned that prophet into just another failed Jewish messiah as far as the Jews were concerned. And John turned this failed messiah the Jews failed to recognize into God incarnate. God has replaced the Temple by giving us the Torah and the Prophets through the Christian Bible and many of us the ability to read it for ourselves. Shalom
Brad Jersak is always insightful. His critique of PSA is brilliant.
Thank you Brad, for stating this so simply…..this truth set me free….
I can think only one word, and that's LOVE, the very essence of who God is, and what Brad is ultimately describing.
Indeed. Spot on Jason.
Helpful,though more for a
thoughtful discursive
coffee,I think.
A plain challenge of text
is “vengeance is mine,
declares the lord”.
One for victims of calamity and
injustice to hold to.
Amazing that during New Testament
times the large numbers of
people that did not adhere
to believing in an afterlife,
ie the Sadducee’s.
Although Hell,like most teachings
develops when the chosen people
are exiled to Babylon,it does help
the church as a great motivation
for reaching the lost!
“Untold millions lie outside the
fold,who will tell them how will
they know”?
Dick Dowcett’a book a former
director with OMF, “God that’s
not fair”,is also a good starting
point!
Maybe some of our atheist connections,
need to remember that many of the WW1
soldiers and officers,believed in Hell due
to experiencing trench warfare.
The example of Houges as being described
as Hell fire corner,is a good reminder of that
very fact!
Am delighted to have come across this channel,
and look forward to learning more,thanks for
share!
What a great way to approach this important subject. Simple and direct. I went through a similar awakening process.
I wish brad could see this. When God visited me at age 21, I saw nothing, he spoke very basic things into my mind and heart and he melted me down to the ground by heating my body up and making it like jelly, he confirmed who jesus is and that he is the messiah who saves. i had heard the gospel at various points prior to this experience when I was totally alone.
Night Comes by DalecAllison
I really like this, but two quick questions: what of ‘ransom’ as Jesus said in reference to himself, and what of those pictured as ‘outside’ in Revelation 22? Thanks!
Read her gates will never be shut, Brad talks all about it.
He punish sin in Jesus that why when we accept Jesus all our sins were forgiven
They were forgiven before you accepted Jesus
Universalists actually do believe in a hell (of sorts). But the fact that there is no hell leaves the spurious universalist doctrine with no purifying agent. (The original Bible manuscripts do not contain the word "hell" or any word which means hell.)
Stop with the Clickbait.
Jersak believes there is a hell, it’s just not Dante’s hell. It is God’s refining fire!
You make a good point. Universalists _do_ believe in a hell (of sorts). But the fact that there is no hell leaves the spurious universalist doctrine with no purifying agent. (The original manuscripts do not contain the word "hell" or any word which means hell.)
Let me ask my universalist brothers and sisters a question. The unsaved will die a second time. (Die, as in 100%, all-the-way, dead.) Where in the Scriptures are they resurrected a second time? Anywhere?
Great question! The book of Revelation only takes us as far as the New Heavens and New Earth, at which time the Lake of Fire, which IS the Second Death, still exists. But Paul takes us further than anyone else in time:
(Using Young's Literal Translation here; I always use literal versions for study, adding my thoughts in parenthesis throughout)
1Cor 15:
22 for even as in Adam all die, so also in the Christ all shall be made alive, (the same ALL that die in Adam will be made alive; so ALL descendants of Adam)
23 and each in his proper order, a first-fruit Christ, afterwards those who are the Christ's, in his presence,
24 then -- the end, when he may deliver up the reign to God, even the Father, when he may have made useless all rule, and all authority and power -- (at the END, meaning Christ doesn't reign "forever and ever" [bad translation], Christ will deliver up his rule, authority and power up directly to God)
25 for it behoveth him to reign till he may have put all the enemies under his feet --
26 the last enemy is done away -- death; (done away is "katargeo" in Greek, which means abolish/nullify. The lake of fire IS the second DEATH, it is the last enemy, and DEATH will be abolished! What happens to those who were dead? Read on:)
28 and when the all things may be subjected to him, then the Son also himself shall be subject to Him, who did subject to him the all things, that God may be the all in all. (GOD will be ALL in ALL, HE will be everything in every person!)
@@Annatar That reading requires more eisegesis then I am comfortable with but I, nevertheless, appreciate your reply. All the best.
@@IsaacNussbaum no eisegesis. That's the literal reading. I'm just explaining what they're saying directly
It doesn't say the unsaved. That's a word you use. It does say the wicked and godless which does not equate to unsaved. Nowhere does the bible use the term the 'unsaved'. It also says God will restore the fortune of Sodom... How will that happen if they are all burning in Molochs fire.... Oh wait I mean Gods fire according to the Roman dogma. Also, it doesn't say forever and ever it says aionios et aionios or something like that I'm Greek which means for the ages of the ages.... Which can be translated as... A very long time. Also godless means selling your soul and ceasing to have Any image of God left in you. Study biblical history and context and stop reading the bible in a 21st century American way. It's shameful that Christians don't study the bible in it's original language. Remember the bible is written in Greek Aramaic and Hebrew... All other bibles are people's subjective translation where often things are superimposed on the text which do not exist.
@@misterbenbob9715 The words the Sadducees used to describe their belief in universal extinction (In English: “death,” “perish,” “destruction,” “destroy,” etc.) are the same words used in the Bible to describe the second death. I see no reason to assume that those words have completely different meanings today.
Didn't Jesus speak on Hell?
Hi Steve. Thanks for asking the question. So the short answer, in terms of defining hell the way evangelical fundamentalist have, no Jesus did not. I’m a former Southern Baptist. I still ordained and was teaching pastor for three large churches. We’ve all been let astray. Summarize, Jesus spoke of Gehenna / Gehinnom. Something completely different than the pagan teaching of eternal lasting tournament. Matthew 25 at the end it is not properly translated. The word eternal is not there. Not in the Greek. A better translation would be divine age or determined by God and fire is purifying. God is love plus nothing. Hell is real but not with a capital H. And a lot of us have already experienced it. Bottom line is we can’t go to heaven and remain hateful and angry. But we experience divine discipline things change.
That is a fair question, Steven. Four Hebrew and Greek words appear as "hell" in some--but not all--translations of the Bible. None of those four words means hell as hell is commonly understood today, i.e. a place of eternal conscious torment. So, no, Jesus did not speak on hell. All the best, my friend.
I ran across your post again today, Steve, and thought of something to add. This is an example of what Jesus really _did_ say. ✴ _For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish...._ [ "apollumi" - be utterly destroyed ] (John 3: 16, KJV)
Sorry God sent a prophet to end the sacrificial system and restore the Temple to its original function as a place where people of all nations could learn about God.
Saul turned that prophet into just another failed Jewish messiah as far as the Jews were concerned.
And John turned this failed messiah the Jews failed to recognize into God incarnate.
God has replaced the Temple by giving us the Torah and the Prophets through the Christian Bible and many of us the ability to read it for ourselves.
Shalom
Oh brother. This is just the serpent telling Adam and Eve, “you will not die” 2.0