Jonathan Tallon presents a careful analysis of different interpretations of this text on his channel. I haven't watched Winger's 4 part series on this issue but unfortunately when I have heard him speak on other issues, he seems stuck. He realizes the problems with the tradition he's been taught but doesn't realize the unsoundness of those interpretations of the Bible.
@@MusicalRaichuYou just accused the man of wrongdoing immediately following an admission of not listening to the reference the material suggested in the first place.
@@The_Word_Is_The_Way I think you missed "I have heard him speak on other issues". Where do I "accuse" him? I point out a weakness. I have no evidence that he deliberately wronged someone. Also I might point out that evanjelical views on this issue are just as "revisionist". They were invented late 70s, only a few years earlier than affirming views.
@@MusicalRaichu “Where do I "accuse" him?” I think you didn’t grasp the gravity of your own statement. “He realizes the problems with the tradition he's been taught but doesn't realize the unsoundness of those interpretations of the Bible.” If the man is continuing with something that he knows is problematic or outright false, then he is purposefully feeding people misinformation to say the least. “Also I might point out that evanjelical views on this issue are just as "revisionist". They were invented late 70s, only a few years earlier than affirming views.” First, you are obligated to provide information to substantiate your claim. Without said information, this is a baseless assertion and fails to meet the burden of proof principle. An in depth study on the Rabbinical teachings on Jewish Law will reveal much that stands in direct opposition to your claim. Moreover, there actually were early church figures whose statements on the issue we still have today. John Chrysostom and Cyprian presented a strong objection against these acts.
Actually, it is by grace we have been saved through faith, and this is the gift of God - not by works so that no one can boast. Our sanctification as people in Christ is not something hung over our heads as "show signs of improvement or else you won't inherit the kingdom of God", but is something we are promised God in his faithfulness will work in us (check out 1 Thessalonians 5:23). We once were thieves and murderers and whatnot, but NOW we are made alive in Christ and we have a new and beautiful inheritance. Those who are made alive in Christ have an inheritance that cannot be taken away. Of course we are to live as fitting of members of the body of Christ, but God's grace is for us. Even though we still sin in this life, we can be assured of our salvation. This is why in Romans, Paul can say in full confidence that nothing can separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Our LGBT+ brothers and sisters in Christ are absolutely members of the body of Christ just like we are. You might think what they are doing is something not permissible in Scripture, but even if that were true (and I am convinced it is not), God's grace would still be for them. Christians have been disagreeing for centuries over what is and is not permissible - sometimes on very serious matters. Is my salvation contingent on me getting it all right? Thank God the assurance of our salvation is not in our hands, but in God's. If our salvation were contingent on our ability to get everything just perfect and right, all of us would be doomed. But like we read in Scripture, it is by grace we have been saved, and this is a gift. It's not something we have or can earn. As Christians we will continue to disagree on what is permissible according to Scripture. However, the gospel and Christ himself is the center of our faith, and we are called to live in unity with one another in spite of our differences. This means we live in unity with those who disagree with us so long as they profess Christ, and we all can approach the throne of God with confidence because of the amazing saving work of Jesus.
@@cruzaderawaken9600 your belief that homosexuality is a sin is very fallacious considering all verses used against homosexuals weren't directed towards them
Your comment with no detail is even more weak. And you obviously can't fully judge this unless you went and read the book. But I suspect that would be too challenging to your belief system and you would not do that. I'm not saying that he is right or you are right, but your comment is simply part of modern attack culture.
I love the way he sets up his presentations. Very organized and easy to follow. Thank you
ruclips.net/user/livel10C0ZEtfT8?si=K3I5uGWxg2f-uPii
For a clear expositional teaching on this passage view Mike Winger's 4 part series on this.
Mike Winger does an excellent job exposing the lie of this revisionist doctrine.
Jonathan Tallon presents a careful analysis of different interpretations of this text on his channel.
I haven't watched Winger's 4 part series on this issue but unfortunately when I have heard him speak on other issues, he seems stuck. He realizes the problems with the tradition he's been taught but doesn't realize the unsoundness of those interpretations of the Bible.
@@MusicalRaichuYou just accused the man of wrongdoing immediately following an admission of not listening to the reference the material suggested in the first place.
@@The_Word_Is_The_Way I think you missed "I have heard him speak on other issues".
Where do I "accuse" him? I point out a weakness. I have no evidence that he deliberately wronged someone.
Also I might point out that evanjelical views on this issue are just as "revisionist". They were invented late 70s, only a few years earlier than affirming views.
@@MusicalRaichu “Where do I "accuse" him?”
I think you didn’t grasp the gravity of your own statement.
“He realizes the problems with the tradition he's been taught but doesn't realize the unsoundness of those interpretations of the Bible.”
If the man is continuing with something that he knows is problematic or outright false, then he is purposefully feeding people misinformation to say the least.
“Also I might point out that evanjelical views on this issue are just as "revisionist". They were invented late 70s, only a few years earlier than affirming views.”
First, you are obligated to provide information to substantiate your claim. Without said information, this is a baseless assertion and fails to meet the burden of proof principle. An in depth study on the Rabbinical teachings on Jewish Law will reveal much that stands in direct opposition to your claim. Moreover, there actually were early church figures whose statements on the issue we still have today. John Chrysostom and Cyprian presented a strong objection against these acts.
homophobia is the real sin.
No
So is lying
@@The_Word_Is_The_Way Homophobics know all about telling lies and dirty fibs more than most!
Any desire that will make you forget the Lord will make you not to be part of the kingdom..
Actually, it is by grace we have been saved through faith, and this is the gift of God - not by works so that no one can boast. Our sanctification as people in Christ is not something hung over our heads as "show signs of improvement or else you won't inherit the kingdom of God", but is something we are promised God in his faithfulness will work in us (check out 1 Thessalonians 5:23). We once were thieves and murderers and whatnot, but NOW we are made alive in Christ and we have a new and beautiful inheritance. Those who are made alive in Christ have an inheritance that cannot be taken away.
Of course we are to live as fitting of members of the body of Christ, but God's grace is for us. Even though we still sin in this life, we can be assured of our salvation. This is why in Romans, Paul can say in full confidence that nothing can separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Our LGBT+ brothers and sisters in Christ are absolutely members of the body of Christ just like we are. You might think what they are doing is something not permissible in Scripture, but even if that were true (and I am convinced it is not), God's grace would still be for them.
Christians have been disagreeing for centuries over what is and is not permissible - sometimes on very serious matters. Is my salvation contingent on me getting it all right?
Thank God the assurance of our salvation is not in our hands, but in God's. If our salvation were contingent on our ability to get everything just perfect and right, all of us would be doomed. But like we read in Scripture, it is by grace we have been saved, and this is a gift. It's not something we have or can earn.
As Christians we will continue to disagree on what is permissible according to Scripture. However, the gospel and Christ himself is the center of our faith, and we are called to live in unity with one another in spite of our differences. This means we live in unity with those who disagree with us so long as they profess Christ, and we all can approach the throne of God with confidence because of the amazing saving work of Jesus.
@@juliakwiatkowski647 are you a Christian and Affirming? Just curious
@@anxiaati4464 as it so happens, I am.
@@juliakwiatkowski647 okay.. Thank you for your kind heart.. GOD BLESS
@@juliakwiatkowski647 What a gracious and Christ-like response Julia. God bless you sister.
The wages of sin is death.
Which sin is that? Pride and arrogance perhaps? And remember God doesn't rate sins only people who are trying to make points like the Pharisees did.
meh
Including the sin of homosexuality
@@Jenny-px5tuAll sin.
@@cruzaderawaken9600 your belief that homosexuality is a sin is very fallacious considering all verses used against homosexuals weren't directed towards them
His arguments are weak.
Your comment with no detail is even more weak. And you obviously can't fully judge this unless you went and read the book. But I suspect that would be too challenging to your belief system and you would not do that. I'm not saying that he is right or you are right, but your comment is simply part of modern attack culture.
meh
I would like to see a debate between Dr. James Brownson and Dr. James White.
@@cruzaderawaken9600Only these revisionists are scared to death of that actually happening. You and I both know why.
@@The_Word_Is_The_Way Brownson is there go to guy now, so why shouldn't he debate
this would have to be the most boring, tortuous, tangential lecture i have seen on Romans 1. This guy seems to love rabbiting on