Hey Grim Reapers, The Iron Dome is not designed to intercept ballistic missiles. its not a bug just how the system works simple research before the video will get you all the answers. The code for the interceptor path is made for rockets trajectory. that's why it didn't manage to intercept Harms. that will be fixed in the next update. Iron Dome in real life only intercept rockets, UAVs and cruise missiles. any other target will be intercepted by David Sling. Thanks for the video but a lot of wrong statements and misleading information.
Not true.. Couple of years ago iron Dome successfully intercepted short ballistic missile from Syria above hermon mountain. It was revealed by multiple sources and probably was a missile from the fateh family (around 500km range)
Germany's lack of fun at 17:30 is not due to the lack of an aerobatics team. It's simply German doctrine. It's shown really well in the German flag. The black colour stands for work. The red colour stands for work. The yellow colour stands for work and the green colour stands for fun.
It's important to remember that Iron Dome is just one part of a layered defense system. It is not made to deal with jets or ballistic missiles, to my knowledge. There are other SAMs and anti-missile systems for that.
Yep, and a more important fact is the next generation "smarter" enough to build, maintain and operate" it. One indicator is how many young people actually get STEM and advance STEM DEGREES...
I have a theory. When the missile has just been launched, the instantaneous interception point can be on the "opposite side" for a split second if the speed difference is big enough at the instant the interceptor starts guiding. At rest, the interceptor would seek to be parallel with the targets flight path (in the same direction). Whether the interceptor is able to go there depends on how well it can turn at slow speed (and not accelerate as a result), and this one looks a little overmodeled in that respect. Once the interceptor has turned in the wrong direction, the target stays out of the seeker's FOV for the rest of the flight unless wagnercode magic happens. I think we saw this type of problem with S-200 early on, where it was never able to accelerate if the target was moving sideways. I discovered later that in real life, S-200 flies for like 10 to 15 seconds without guidance to keep it from doing stupid nonsense like that. Probably applies to most other missiles, too.
I came to the same conclusion. The missiles always fired in the opposite heading the threat is coming from. You are right about the guidance thing. The old SA-2 (radio guided) had its guidance antenna blocked by its booster. It would only be guided after staging. Gave the SEAD of the 60's time to kill the guidance radar.
We made the interception path to much real life rockets interceptions. the interceptor calculates a lot of lead and because the interception path is not tested on Harms it calculates a lot of lead and the result are flying away from the target. in terms of ballistic missiles, Iron Dome is not designed to intercept them, that's the job of David Sling or arrow 2\3.
@@casperscared This simplest way I can put it is that the missile starts guiding too early and too hard. Like many other missiles, it has no idea about its current or future speed and simply steers to place the target in a spot where it stays put in its field of view at that instant (collision course).
Lol i laughed so hard here: 15:10 "Good dodge" Best Episode, really enjoyed this one, and not because i'm from Israel and the Iron dome is in test, usually these DCS simulations are not suppose to be funny like that :) Great Job! To answer your questions and to put some logic to it: Iron dome is a C-RAM system, 0-70 km range, *ANY* other ballistic target that has a trajectory higher than 7 km cannot be shot down by ID, the idea behind it is to have a multi-tier layered Air-defense systems that overlaps each other, its not about the speed. it is more about the heights and the range, any rocket fired further than 70km will be intercepted by a system like PATRIOT or David's sling. The Iron dome is really not designs for threats other than rockets , mortars, Artellery and Cruise missiles, it also has the ability to engage drones/UAV. Imaging a Dome like "half ball" shape, that is the idea here, the same analogy can be explained like if u try to shoot down a ballistic missile using the Avenger/Pantsir-SM/Rapier/Sky Sabre
The Starwars system was basically a number of satellites armed with Xrasers (x-ray lasers) pumped by a hydrogen bomb explosion and directed toward ground targets or missiles in flight. Each satellite could strike multiple targets and I heard a rumour that they were also capable of broad area EMP. As I recall the tech was viable but the cost was prohibitive and there were problems with these H-bombs not being stable enough when hit by space junk. Nobody wanted to be accountable for a H-bomb landing in another country by mistake.
At 33:20 Iron Dome obviously mistook the fish as the primary threat, and still maintained a 94% pk. Great fun, but please rerun this test when the fix happens. Could you also try long range arty please?
I read an article a few months ago about using lasers for mosquito control in Africa. They're talking about homing in on the wing frequency of the ones that carry malaria and then engage them with a UV laser.
I don't know who said is?? BUT`at 11:05 some asked was the German guided missile as accurate as the British pigeon homing missile. It was not a Pigeon Homing Missile! It was classed as a Pigeon-controlled guided bomb and it was the USA that came up with the idea (along with the bat bomb..bat as in the animal) American behaviorist B. F. Skinner's attempt to develop a pigeon-controlled guided bomb. With the backing of The National Defense Research Committee (NDRC) was an organization created "to coordinate, supervise, and conduct scientific research on the problems underlying the development, production, and use of mechanisms and devices of warfare" in the United States from June 27, 1940, until June 28, 1941 YES I did have to check on Google to get the name and date right.
exatly and the Vikings were to be right not a arobatics team by name cause in germany thay were band after many crashes the Vikings were a Disply team of the MFG2 the Marine Fliger Geschwader
For clarity, the launchers of the Iron Dome aren't TELs because they don't incorporate an engine or running gear for movement. They're just erector/launchers minus the transporter component.
This could be part of the problem... "We had to remake the rockets in DCS in order for the radar to recognize them and be able to intercept them (these are limitations of DCS), so new rockets were added "
Yes but that was later the Problem started in 1962 When the Display taem ,that was training for the celebration of puting the F-104 into service, Crashed cause they lost orientation in clouds and all 4 Crashed On June 19, 1962, four Lockheed F-104F jet trainers crashed east of the Nörvenich air base after the pilots had lost their orientation in the clouds. All four pilots died. The accident had far-reaching consequences for the Bundeswehr's aerobatic teams.
@Medonja indeed. It's mainly an idea to overwhelm something like iron dome when you're going to launch multiple rockets to either overwhelm the tracking or exhaust the stores. I believe several new missiles have countermeasures.
@@mfreed40k - That’s why the Israelis have a layered system (aircraft, Iron Dome & Iron Beam), have Iron Dome only engage rockets that are going to hit population centers (towns, villages & cities) or facilities like Ben Gurion), and use Iron Beam that uses its own radar.
hmm, @39:00 just loading in after changing the orientation of a few of the launchers,, they are all facing the same way. (unless you changed all of their orientations), that seems a bit odd.
Cap, your dad probably worked with my Uncle who was employed by Hughes. He drove 2000 miles round trip to be at my wedding while in the last stages of Asbestos caused lung cancer. He was a minor WWII ace in the Pacific flying from carriers.
20:12 I found that happened in my tests too, spoiler alert, but it went weird and instead of intercepting the Iskanders I threw at it destroyed the near by town for me...
One reason high-powered lasers weren't practical as weapons in the 1980s was distortion from the atmosphere fouling up the aim and scattering the beam, reducing its effective range. We can use adaptive mirrors now (large arrays of small mirrors that move independently to create a lens) with real-time adjustments to focus the beam. Computers of a practical size weren't fast enough then to keep up with the rapid calculations needed back then, but that's changed a lot since then.
7:10 I have to be honest 4200 knots seems way too fast for the Tamir. It is a missile in roughly the same weight class and of similar characteristics to the AIM-9 so I really don't think it should be reaching Mach 6+ even more so when you consider the Tamir is ground-launched.
*_SuperBABY_* could take out the Iron Dome. The guys on the radar would be like, "Ahhh! He's so cute!" and he would unload devastation in their _face_ . It seems the Iron Dome does a good job of NOT duplicating targeting.
Yes, so a grouping where all the hits were within 5cm of each other but that grouping was centered around a point 5 cm to the left of the bullseye would be precise, a grouping thats within 5cm of the bullseye every time would be accurate (even if for example one hit is 5cm above the target while another is 5cm below the target giving a 10cm spread)
Just a heads up Cap, the Iron Dome does fire in unison if it's tracking multiple targets within rage at the same time. It's extremely lethal and cool as hell to watch on some videos that have been shot at night during a large rocket attack on Israel. Believe it was from 2010-2012 ish but it's out there and you can check it out. It's easier to see the missile trails since it happens at night!
The old school approach worked on the Russian AA. The US sent remote piloted junk planes with emitters that projected 3 B52 bombers each. Then, the drone swarms that included jambers and planes with HARM. Last were f18 bombing anything that survived. They compared BDA with satellite data and then beat the survivors.
I want to see 1990s new jersey and Wisconsin vs a modern Chinese destroyer at 25 miles Also I'd like to see you destroy different battleships/ battleship fleets with modern equipment. The high HP makes for fun videos when you try different strategies to do more damage. Love your videos.
The Chinese balloon with " 中国製 - ( Made in China ) got me laughing so hard ha ha ha! Nice detail 😜😂😂😂 Entertaining videos as always. Keep up the greatness! CHEERS ! 🍺🍺
So glad modern HARM's remember where the radar was. Kind of stupid for them to only keep track when the radar is hot. Supposedly, the newer HARMs can even track a radar that has turned off and started driving away....
Iron dome calculates the trajectory of the incoming threat - if it's following a purely ballistic path then it works out where the missile/rocket/shell will land, if the target area is deemed to be of low value then the system won't waste a missile intercepting a threat that isn't aiming at something important.
i wonder how it would perform against the 1990's sead attack if the f-16s fired their HARMs in RUK mode and from behind a mountain but at super close range
Though worth adding IronDome was optimised to hit small objects. Its just as effective targeting a scud missile as an 80mm mortar round. Another big element of Irondome is a large element of discretion based on predicted impact location to conserve ammo, it only fires if it thinks the projectile will hit something within its operating zone its been told to protect versus other systems that will just always intercept anything in their operating zone if they are capable of making an interception.
We made the interception path to much real life rockets interceptions. the interceptor calculates a lot of lead and because the interception path is not tested on Harms it calculates a lot of lead and the result are flying away from the target. in terms of ballistic missiles, Iron Dome is not designed to intercept them, that's the job of David Sling or arrow 2\3.
It’s really pretty simple system. It computes only ballistic paths. That’s why it’s shooting behind. Its going toward possible impact point and half way up missile goes pitbull with optical sensors in the mid of the rocket. That’s why it’s nimble. You are right. Anything going really fast … messes the fire sequence. Command vehicle can’t compute that.
21:45 you mean project Nautilus? (Nautilus laser system),develp in 1998 by THEL,they called the Demonstrator, which would utilize deuterium fluoride chemical laser technologies. In 2000 and 2001, THEL shot down 28 Katyusha artillery rockets and five artillery shells. On November 4, 2002, THEL shot down an incoming artillery shell. The prototype weapon was roughly the size of six city buses, made up of modules that held a command center, radar and a telescope for tracking targets, the chemical laser itself, fuel and reagent tanks, and a rotating mirror to reflect its beam toward speeding targets. It was discontinued in 2005 Now we have more modern system,same fanctional but more compacty (Not in size of building like Nautilus was ) and its in final aprouch ,its call Iron Beam
@Grim Reapers The Israeli military shot down a Saegheh drone during the February 2018 Israel-Syria incident. Israeli media reported that the UAV's design was indeed largely based on the RQ-170, IAF Brigadier General Tomer Bar said that the drone was quite advanced and emulated western technology.[41] From Wikipedia en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_RQ-170_Sentinel This is the event, if you can find more information. It was also shadowed by at least one Apache, since the drone was actually seen far, far in advance. It was shot down the moment it slid too far in to israeli air space.
I think the problem may be with the radar of the iron dome mod itself. It something is moving too quickly then radar speed and direction calculations can be reversed through velocity aliasing
That's not true. Iron Dome can launch 360 degrees. The problem is they are trying to intercept targets that Iron Dome is not designed to intercept. that's why the interceptor calculates a lot of lead and hits the ground. anything else then rockets and UAVs David Sling will be used to intercept. just misleading and wrong information in the video.
You might figure this out or not, but after it took down a plane in 96 , the R&D base was closed, but the National Lab nearby who has it, is still open and its still there.
We made the interception path to much real life rockets interceptions. the interceptor calculates a lot of lead and because the interception path is not tested on Harms it calculates a lot of lead and the result are flying away from the target. in terms of ballistic missiles, Iron Dome is not designed to intercept them, that's the job of David Sling or arrow 2\3.
Israel actually have different defense system against supersonic missile and it could in theory even intercept satellites. The active defense system is based on intercepting missiles and rockets launched towards the State of Israel. The array includes four defense systems: The "Hats 2" system - a medium and long-term (upper layer) interception system. The "Arrow 3" system - a system for long-term interception (upper layer). The "Iron Dome" system - a system for intercepting surface-to-surface rockets for short range (lower layer). The "Magic Wand" system - a medium and short-range surface-to-surface missile interception system and a medium- and long-range anti-missile interception system (lower layer)
Have you tried to reenact chrome dome? Have B-52's fly their pattern and have a nuclear launch from the Soviet's. I forgot what it was called when the u.s. thought the Russians actually launched a nuclear strike, at least for a moment. So, basically use both scenarios. To find out how effective chrome dome would or would not have been. Then try it with the B-1, then the B-2. Or at least different era's to see the difference.
@Grim Reapers Fun video, just a couple small corrections. All ballistic missiles achieve hypersonic speeds, but not all ballistic missiles are hypersonic weapons. A true hypersonic weapon needs to have a highly maneuverable final stage, so that it's harder to intercept. A Scud achieves hypersonic speeds, but doesn't have that maneuverable final stage. The Iskander is more similar to a Scud than it is to a true hypersonic weapon like China's DF-21. It has limited manuverability in its final stage. Which brings me to my second correction, the model for the Iskander M in game is not correct. All due respect to CH, but the Iskander is actually a two stage missile. I know that because the Kinzhal is basically a modified upper stage of the Iskander. Which is my third correction, the Kinzhal is a modified Iskander, not the other way around like you said in the video. The Kinzhal does achieve hypersonic speeds, but like the Iskander, has limited manuverability, so it also is not a true hypersonic weapon.
Question.. Can DCS simulate failures? What I mean is, if you go into the setting, can you set it up that random failures and emergencies happen during flight? Maybe you can set this up as a competition and see who can make it to a friendly runway? Or, maybe see who can figure out how to stabilize a plane during an emergency? I dunno, I'm just spit balling here.. I'm just getting a little bored with the more recent videos.
Thank you Cap for not using the Lord’s name in vain, seriously I love you guys, but can’t watch when that starts up. You guys are incredibly talented!!
Riyadh, Saudi Arabia...is where the Patriots shot down the Scuds and the warheads immediately fell and detonated within the city....Desert Shield/Desert Storm 1991
It's like Tamir missiles are running away from supersonic missiles or they're just like "ok, we can't beat these guys so let us be with them destroying our own cities" lol
I think when the missle moves to fast it tries to intercept it in the distance, Iron Dome wants to incept on the other side (in the ground), It doesn't know the ground is there.
I agree. I think this just a bug in the mod with how it’s calculating the intercept. Probably calculating too soon after the launch and too much lead. If its realistic the. It just shouldn’t fire. But I suspect it’s not realistic and will be fixed
@@joshuaanderson4090 We made the interception path to much real life rockets trajectory. the interceptor calculates a lot of lead and when the target is so fast the impact point is in the ground. anyway for this type of targets David sling or arrow 2\3 will used
@@idfmodsproject first the mod looks great and obviously works fabulous when it can calculate an intercept. IRL id guess that the system just wouldn't fire if it couldn't calculate a solution. Rather than wasting ammo. But I know grok experience mods sometimes have to take shortcuts to deal with various limitations. Overalls the team should be proud
For intercepting +Mach-2 missiles israel has the Jericho missile that works in sync with the Iron dome , The Iron dome will not fire if the computer detects a +Mach-2 , In this case the Jericho missile will be activated to intercept it
Cap, the service ceiling on Iron Dome is classified, but it’s a lot higher than 30,000’ in order to intercept long range rockets being fired from Lebanon & Gaza, and the “going the wrong way” is a glitch in CCS and something ID is not known to do…
The grad example looked just like any of the real footage I’ve seen of Iron Dome in action. Grad rockets fired into Israel these days aren’t coming out of a Soviet era launcher. As I understand it - many of the grad rockets are home built for the most part and fire from rails set up on the ground. It’s barely above the level of level of high power model rocketry. Regarding the debris - there’s also videos of some of that online from attacks on Israel. That debris can be dangerous in its own right - albeit far less than a rocket with a warhead hitting.
We made the interception path to much real life rockets interceptions. the interceptor calculates a lot of lead and because the interception path is not tested on Harms it calculates a lot of lead and the result are flying away from the target. in terms of ballistic missiles, Iron Dome is not designed to intercept them, that's the job of David Sling or arrow 2\3.
Actually, Iron dome is doing exactly what it is supposed to do. When a missile is detected without a possible solution, the system activates all ordinance to fire in the opposite direction in an attempt to remove the chance of secondary explosions on site. Most fire at inhabited areas, specifically, people that are taking too long of breaks in their car. I mean, someone is at least going to get part way into this comment before realizing it''s total BS.
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Hey Grim Reapers, The Iron Dome is not designed to intercept ballistic missiles. its not a bug just how the system works simple research before the video will get you all the answers. The code for the interceptor path is made for rockets trajectory. that's why it didn't manage to intercept Harms. that will be fixed in the next update. Iron Dome in real life only intercept rockets, UAVs and cruise missiles. any other target will be intercepted by David Sling.
Thanks for the video but a lot of wrong statements and misleading information.
Roger noted, please make David Sling now and we'll give that one a test on the same targets.
Caps response is classic. Why I watch.
Aren't the trajektories of ballistic missiles and rockets identical?
Not true..
Couple of years ago iron Dome successfully intercepted short ballistic missile from Syria above hermon mountain.
It was revealed by multiple sources and probably was a missile from the fateh family (around 500km range)
What about HIMARS? Iron dome should be able to intercept them
Germany's lack of fun at 17:30 is not due to the lack of an aerobatics team. It's simply German doctrine. It's shown really well in the German flag. The black colour stands for work. The red colour stands for work. The yellow colour stands for work and the green colour stands for fun.
I an agree🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
The damage model on the B17 was beautiful.
It's important to remember that Iron Dome is just one part of a layered defense system. It is not made to deal with jets or ballistic missiles, to my knowledge. There are other SAMs and anti-missile systems for that.
Including Patriot
Exactly; It's meant to be good enough to shoot down cheap rockets while itself being cheap enough for that to be sustainable.
David’s sling is the system that’s used to defend against ballistic missiles (like the U.S. THAD system)
Yep, and a more important fact is the next generation "smarter" enough to build, maintain and operate" it. One indicator is how many young people actually get STEM and advance STEM DEGREES...
@@rupertbeThe david sling is for medium-long range rockets. Arrow 3 us for ballistic ones
I have a theory. When the missile has just been launched, the instantaneous interception point can be on the "opposite side" for a split second if the speed difference is big enough at the instant the interceptor starts guiding. At rest, the interceptor would seek to be parallel with the targets flight path (in the same direction). Whether the interceptor is able to go there depends on how well it can turn at slow speed (and not accelerate as a result), and this one looks a little overmodeled in that respect. Once the interceptor has turned in the wrong direction, the target stays out of the seeker's FOV for the rest of the flight unless wagnercode magic happens. I think we saw this type of problem with S-200 early on, where it was never able to accelerate if the target was moving sideways. I discovered later that in real life, S-200 flies for like 10 to 15 seconds without guidance to keep it from doing stupid nonsense like that. Probably applies to most other missiles, too.
I came to the same conclusion. The missiles always fired in the opposite heading the threat is coming from.
You are right about the guidance thing.
The old SA-2 (radio guided) had its guidance antenna blocked by its booster. It would only be guided after staging. Gave the SEAD of the 60's time to kill the guidance radar.
We made the interception path to much real life rockets interceptions. the interceptor calculates a lot of lead and because the interception path is not tested on Harms it calculates a lot of lead and the result are flying away from the target. in terms of ballistic missiles, Iron Dome is not designed to intercept them, that's the job of David Sling or arrow 2\3.
Can you explain this in simple terms?
@@casperscared This simplest way I can put it is that the missile starts guiding too early and too hard. Like many other missiles, it has no idea about its current or future speed and simply steers to place the target in a spot where it stays put in its field of view at that instant (collision course).
Lol i laughed so hard here: 15:10 "Good dodge"
Best Episode, really enjoyed this one, and not because i'm from Israel and the Iron dome is in test, usually these DCS simulations are not suppose to be funny like that :)
Great Job!
To answer your questions and to put some logic to it:
Iron dome is a C-RAM system, 0-70 km range, *ANY* other ballistic target that has a trajectory higher than 7 km cannot be shot down by ID, the idea behind it is to have a multi-tier layered Air-defense systems that overlaps each other, its not about the speed. it is more about the heights and the range, any rocket fired further than 70km will be intercepted by a system like PATRIOT or David's sling.
The Iron dome is really not designs for threats other than rockets , mortars, Artellery and Cruise missiles, it also has the ability to engage drones/UAV.
Imaging a Dome like "half ball" shape, that is the idea here, the same analogy can be explained like if u try to shoot down a ballistic missile using the Avenger/Pantsir-SM/Rapier/Sky Sabre
Right. It's another layer of a layered air defense system
There's also David's sling, Arrow and i believe Israel operates Patriot?
Good deal, High keeping it relevant and to the point. Let your knowledge and skill shine.
The Starwars system was basically a number of satellites armed with Xrasers (x-ray lasers) pumped by a hydrogen bomb explosion and directed toward ground targets or missiles in flight.
Each satellite could strike multiple targets and I heard a rumour that they were also capable of broad area EMP.
As I recall the tech was viable but the cost was prohibitive and there were problems with these H-bombs not being stable enough when hit by space junk.
Nobody wanted to be accountable for a H-bomb landing in another country by mistake.
*In a frightened German accent*
"I see missiles turning towards me"
Hehehe I felt that.
yes i was
Get here 17 seconds after upload, can't wait for yet another amazing video!
At 33:20 Iron Dome obviously mistook the fish as the primary threat, and still maintained a 94% pk. Great fun, but please rerun this test when the fix happens. Could you also try long range arty please?
Hahaha good one
97% PK on Fish?! 😂
There's no German Aerobatics team since the accident at the Rammstein Airforce base in 1988 that gave the band its name.
The depth of geekitude of the GRa never fails to stun me. Livery/ skins from 1980s German naval display teams. Hats off.
I read an article a few months ago about using lasers for mosquito control in Africa. They're talking about homing in on the wing frequency of the ones that carry malaria and then engage them with a UV laser.
I don't know who said is??
BUT`at 11:05 some asked was the German guided missile as accurate as the British pigeon homing missile.
It was not a Pigeon Homing Missile! It was classed as a Pigeon-controlled guided bomb and it was the USA that came up with the idea (along with the bat bomb..bat as in the animal)
American behaviorist B. F. Skinner's attempt to develop a pigeon-controlled guided bomb. With the backing of The National Defense Research Committee (NDRC) was an organization created "to coordinate, supervise, and conduct scientific research on the problems underlying the development, production, and use of mechanisms and devices of warfare" in the United States from June 27, 1940, until June 28, 1941
YES I did have to check on Google to get the name and date right.
Hi Cap. The German Navy had her Fleet Air Arm, if you can call it. Of course from land bases. It was the Marineflieger. They flew F-104G and Tornado
exatly and the Vikings were to be right not a arobatics team by name cause in germany thay were band after many crashes
the Vikings were a Disply team of the MFG2 the Marine Fliger Geschwader
Shows how much I know about German cold war aviation, pretty much nothing.
@@grimreapers We are hier to help you always Cap
@@grimreapersP.S. Cap the Kormoran Missile is in core DCS for the German kolitition Tornadoes
For clarity, the launchers of the Iron Dome aren't TELs because they don't incorporate an engine or running gear for movement. They're just erector/launchers minus the transporter component.
This could be part of the problem... "We had to remake the rockets in DCS in order for the radar to recognize them and be able to intercept them (these are limitations of DCS), so new rockets were added "
Yup it is a known problem in game.
Greetings from Sweden!
Keep up the great work with this channel!
👌
Hey guys, thank you for these videos, I have learned a lot about missiles from you guys
German airshows: there was a little misshap in Rammstein if you remember....
Yes but that was later the Problem started in 1962
When the Display taem ,that was training for the celebration of puting the F-104 into service, Crashed
cause they lost orientation in clouds and all 4 Crashed
On June 19, 1962, four Lockheed F-104F jet trainers crashed east of the Nörvenich air base after the pilots had lost their orientation in the clouds. All four pilots died. The accident had far-reaching consequences for the Bundeswehr's aerobatic teams.
To paraphrase Bill Hicks, "Here comes one of those Buick SCUDs!”
Why is it I can imagine a HIMARS MIRV-like decoy that releases several high-radar return decoys to overwhelm systems like iron dome?
Iskander basicaly has this.
@Medonja indeed. It's mainly an idea to overwhelm something like iron dome when you're going to launch multiple rockets to either overwhelm the tracking or exhaust the stores. I believe several new missiles have countermeasures.
@@mfreed40k - That’s why the Israelis have a layered system (aircraft, Iron Dome & Iron Beam), have Iron Dome only engage rockets that are going to hit population centers (towns, villages & cities) or facilities like Ben Gurion), and use Iron Beam that uses its own radar.
Iron dome, the only missile that knows when to run away
…built by the French, question mark? 😂
Great stuff (Besides the mod quirks)
"IT TURNED, IT TURNED!"
The USN has had an operational laser system on a few of their ships for years.
hms york had one during first gulf war
And the Israelis have been deploying Iron Beam, a laser based system, for several years.
@@TraditionalAnglican the system isn't even operational yet
@@TraditionalAnglican Project was begun 17 years ago, Its been in testing for 12 years, first operational deployment expected 2024.
In ballistics, precision is how closely a series of projectiles group downrange and accuracy is how close to the point of aim they strike.
Thanks CH. Pure GR!
For science, fun and boom booms. GR best!
hmm, @39:00 just loading in after changing the orientation of a few of the launchers,, they are all facing the same way. (unless you changed all of their orientations), that seems a bit odd.
Been asking for this for a while
Delivered.
Cap, your dad probably worked with my Uncle who was employed by Hughes. He drove 2000 miles round trip to be at my wedding while in the last stages of Asbestos caused lung cancer. He was a minor WWII ace in the Pacific flying from carriers.
oof sounds like your dad is much more of a hero than mine! Nice to see they worked on same project.
@@grimreapers actually my Uncle, my dad was a refinery worker in WWII, keeping the Allied's planes going with high octane gasoline.
20:12 I found that happened in my tests too, spoiler alert, but it went weird and instead of intercepting the Iskanders I threw at it destroyed the near by town for me...
Awkward...
@@grimreapers It was very embarrassing for all involved...
One reason high-powered lasers weren't practical as weapons in the 1980s was distortion from the atmosphere fouling up the aim and scattering the beam, reducing its effective range. We can use adaptive mirrors now (large arrays of small mirrors that move independently to create a lens) with real-time adjustments to focus the beam. Computers of a practical size weren't fast enough then to keep up with the rapid calculations needed back then, but that's changed a lot since then.
7:10 I have to be honest 4200 knots seems way too fast for the Tamir. It is a missile in roughly the same weight class and of similar characteristics to the AIM-9 so I really don't think it should be reaching Mach 6+ even more so when you consider the Tamir is ground-launched.
Possibly why it was causing some problems with intercepting the faster targets?
German marineflieger did operate Tornado's after the f104.
Yes but no display team
@@FlybywireTheGerman it's a shame, a luftwaffe display team would be nice.
*_SuperBABY_* could take out the Iron Dome. The guys on the radar would be like, "Ahhh! He's so cute!" and he would unload devastation in their _face_ . It seems the Iron Dome does a good job of NOT duplicating targeting.
Wife has told me I am not allowed to launch SuperBABY at ANY modern defence systems.
precision is the grouping of the projectiles accuracy is how close you are on the target and recall= tp/(tp+fn)
Yes, so a grouping where all the hits were within 5cm of each other but that grouping was centered around a point 5 cm to the left of the bullseye would be precise, a grouping thats within 5cm of the bullseye every time would be accurate (even if for example one hit is 5cm above the target while another is 5cm below the target giving a 10cm spread)
The End of Ze world reference literally unlocked a core memory for me.
Just a heads up Cap, the Iron Dome does fire in unison if it's tracking multiple targets within rage at the same time. It's extremely lethal and cool as hell to watch on some videos that have been shot at night during a large rocket attack on Israel. Believe it was from 2010-2012 ish but it's out there and you can check it out. It's easier to see the missile trails since it happens at night!
I watched some interceptions at night. Looks cool as hell
The Iron Dome interceptor is based on the Derby, which is the Israeli equivalent to the AMRAAM. So it's heavier than a Sidewinder.
The Official Simba Fan Club has concluded Iron Dome missle are esentially Jason Bourne.
Congrats on super 👶 baby! Best decision i didnt know i should make. 😁
It could be that because of the speed, the solution is inside the ground (or beyond the site) so that's why they run that way.
Yes, the missiles start guiding and turning before they've had enough time to accelerate.
Can you do more of that? With drones and the Shahed-136 it will be interesting to see a swarm of UAV's challenging ID batteries.
The old school approach worked on the Russian AA. The US sent remote piloted junk planes with emitters that projected 3 B52 bombers each. Then, the drone swarms that included jambers and planes with HARM. Last were f18 bombing anything that survived. They compared BDA with satellite data and then beat the survivors.
@@Michael-rg7mxexcept you made this up
@@garlicdragon8664 That is the method that the US used against Iraq with Russian equipment. It was very complicated and multifaceted.
I want to see 1990s new jersey and Wisconsin vs a modern Chinese destroyer at 25 miles
Also I'd like to see you destroy different battleships/ battleship fleets with modern equipment.
The high HP makes for fun videos when you try different strategies to do more damage.
Love your videos.
The Chinese balloon with " 中国製 - ( Made in China ) got me laughing so hard ha ha ha! Nice detail 😜😂😂😂
Entertaining videos as always.
Keep up the greatness! CHEERS ! 🍺🍺
So glad modern HARM's remember where the radar was. Kind of stupid for them to only keep track when the radar is hot. Supposedly, the newer HARMs can even track a radar that has turned off and started driving away....
I was 100% on "Team Grump" thinking that swiveling those launchers would save the day 😂😞
Iron dome calculates the trajectory of the incoming threat - if it's following a purely ballistic path then it works out where the missile/rocket/shell will land, if the target area is deemed to be of low value then the system won't waste a missile intercepting a threat that isn't aiming at something important.
Iron dome missiles Too Smart!!! They see incoming and they are getting the heck out of there!!!
As for the Wasserfall V2 missile: the us later did the same. But the missiles where armed with nukes.
Nike Hercules??
We all need to buy Cap a beer for having baby-brain and still making videos for us to enjoy after work
I would like a beer yes please.
i wonder how it would perform against the 1990's sead attack if the f-16s fired their HARMs in RUK mode and from behind a mountain but at super close range
IronDome wasnt made to target fast missles.
It is layered with Arrow 2/3, David Sling and Barak 8 and in the future Iron Beam systems.
Noted thanks.
Though worth adding IronDome was optimised to hit small objects. Its just as effective targeting a scud missile as an 80mm mortar round. Another big element of Irondome is a large element of discretion based on predicted impact location to conserve ammo, it only fires if it thinks the projectile will hit something within its operating zone its been told to protect versus other systems that will just always intercept anything in their operating zone if they are capable of making an interception.
14:40 I flinched 🤣
20:30 maybe the launcher direction + the missile guidance system just hat a L and a bug?
That money shot when the viggens were flying was hilarious😂🤣😭
TAKE IT IN THE FACE!!! 🍆🫠
One of the highlights (that I am allowed to talk about) of my service in the IDF was seeing one in action.
The good news about the iron dome bug.....IRon DOme 2 video!!!!
David's Sling is the system Israel uses for Ballistic Missels
Thanks, they'll need to build that next.
We all saw how good Iron Dome is defending Tel Aviv. Just miraculous. The US Navy is putting it on ships now.
This video is AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I love it when you dust off the Viggens.
34:23 the actual missile is in use but i dont think the ground launched variant (iskander-K) is
Can’t be that hard of a fix. I have all the confidence they can get this done
We made the interception path to much real life rockets interceptions. the interceptor calculates a lot of lead and because the interception path is not tested on Harms it calculates a lot of lead and the result are flying away from the target. in terms of ballistic missiles, Iron Dome is not designed to intercept them, that's the job of David Sling or arrow 2\3.
First saw the Vikings 104's at mildenhll when i was a kid , one went past so fast i jumed out of my skin, they were a great display team :)
It’s really pretty simple system. It computes only ballistic paths. That’s why it’s shooting behind. Its going toward possible impact point and half way up missile goes pitbull with optical sensors in the mid of the rocket. That’s why it’s nimble.
You are right. Anything going really fast … messes the fire sequence. Command vehicle can’t compute that.
So is the Iron SAM system an in game system or a MOD?
An Arc Light B-52 raid would be fun......
The Iron Dome missiles are afraid of the scary American missiles, so they are evacuating in the opposite direction
What they need is Iron Beam for the very fast stuff. Short range,but intercepts at the speed of light.
I think the Jewish Space Laser is still classified mate. Shhhhh
Seems like there was a bug in ya the iron dome isn’t designed to destroy very high speed missiles ! That’s what the arrow 3 and David sling is for
Reports that IDF has a laser in final testing.
21:45 you mean project Nautilus? (Nautilus laser system),develp in 1998 by THEL,they called the Demonstrator, which would utilize deuterium fluoride chemical laser technologies. In 2000 and 2001, THEL shot down 28 Katyusha artillery rockets and five artillery shells. On November 4, 2002, THEL shot down an incoming artillery shell. The prototype weapon was roughly the size of six city buses, made up of modules that held a command center, radar and a telescope for tracking targets, the chemical laser itself, fuel and reagent tanks, and a rotating mirror to reflect its beam toward speeding targets. It was discontinued in 2005
Now we have more modern system,same fanctional but more compacty (Not in size of building like Nautilus was ) and its in final aprouch ,its call Iron Beam
Cap, i have been personally witness to it firing down an Iranian drone. It happened in 2017.
Amazing! I want to see it now.
@Grim Reapers The Israeli military shot down a Saegheh drone during the February 2018 Israel-Syria incident. Israeli media reported that the UAV's design was indeed largely based on the RQ-170, IAF Brigadier General Tomer Bar said that the drone was quite advanced and emulated western technology.[41]
From Wikipedia
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_RQ-170_Sentinel
This is the event, if you can find more information. It was also shadowed by at least one Apache, since the drone was actually seen far, far in advance. It was shot down the moment it slid too far in to israeli air space.
I think the problem may be with the radar of the iron dome mod itself. It something is moving too quickly then radar speed and direction calculations can be reversed through velocity aliasing
The problem is that the iron dome launcher is not a 360 degree launcher, which means you have to place launchers in the direction of the launch.
Watch until the end. They tested it and it had no effect.
probably finish the video before commenting, they tested it in the end and it didn't make a difference what way the launchers faced.
We tried that in the last few minutes of the vid but it made no difference.
@@grimreapers Ditto.
That's not true. Iron Dome can launch 360 degrees. The problem is they are trying to intercept targets that Iron Dome is not designed to intercept. that's why the interceptor calculates a lot of lead and hits the ground. anything else then rockets and UAVs David Sling will be used to intercept. just misleading and wrong information in the video.
And they never gave up on the Star Wars program, its now called the Star beam.and its a USAP.
You might figure this out or not, but after it took down a plane in 96 , the R&D base was closed, but the National Lab nearby who has it, is still open and its still there.
I think that with the harm missiles there must be some sort of electronic warfare going on confusing iron dome making them fire the wrong way.
We made the interception path to much real life rockets interceptions. the interceptor calculates a lot of lead and because the interception path is not tested on Harms it calculates a lot of lead and the result are flying away from the target. in terms of ballistic missiles, Iron Dome is not designed to intercept them, that's the job of David Sling or arrow 2\3.
David's sling and arrow are used for aircraft and ballistic missiles
Israel actually have different defense system against supersonic missile and it could in theory even intercept satellites. The active defense system is based on intercepting missiles and rockets launched towards the State of Israel. The array includes four defense systems:
The "Hats 2" system - a medium and long-term (upper layer) interception system.
The "Arrow 3" system - a system for long-term interception (upper layer).
The "Iron Dome" system - a system for intercepting surface-to-surface rockets for short range (lower layer).
The "Magic Wand" system - a medium and short-range surface-to-surface missile interception system and a medium- and long-range anti-missile interception system (lower layer)
Have you tried to reenact chrome dome?
Have B-52's fly their pattern and have a nuclear launch from the Soviet's.
I forgot what it was called when the u.s. thought the Russians actually launched a nuclear strike, at least for a moment.
So, basically use both scenarios. To find out how effective chrome dome would or would not have been.
Then try it with the B-1, then the B-2. Or at least different era's to see the difference.
@Grim Reapers Fun video, just a couple small corrections. All ballistic missiles achieve hypersonic speeds, but not all ballistic missiles are hypersonic weapons. A true hypersonic weapon needs to have a highly maneuverable final stage, so that it's harder to intercept. A Scud achieves hypersonic speeds, but doesn't have that maneuverable final stage. The Iskander is more similar to a Scud than it is to a true hypersonic weapon like China's DF-21. It has limited manuverability in its final stage. Which brings me to my second correction, the model for the Iskander M in game is not correct. All due respect to CH, but the Iskander is actually a two stage missile. I know that because the Kinzhal is basically a modified upper stage of the Iskander. Which is my third correction, the Kinzhal is a modified Iskander, not the other way around like you said in the video. The Kinzhal does achieve hypersonic speeds, but like the Iskander, has limited manuverability, so it also is not a true hypersonic weapon.
Question.. Can DCS simulate failures? What I mean is, if you go into the setting, can you set it up that random failures and emergencies happen during flight?
Maybe you can set this up as a competition and see who can make it to a friendly runway? Or, maybe see who can figure out how to stabilize a plane during an emergency?
I dunno, I'm just spit balling here.. I'm just getting a little bored with the more recent videos.
Earlier version of game did but as far as I can see it has been removed.
Thank you Cap for not using the Lord’s name in vain, seriously I love you guys, but can’t watch when that starts up.
You guys are incredibly talented!!
Riyadh, Saudi Arabia...is where the Patriots shot down the Scuds and the warheads immediately fell and detonated within the city....Desert Shield/Desert Storm 1991
It's like Tamir missiles are running away from supersonic missiles or they're just like "ok, we can't beat these guys so let us be with them destroying our own cities" lol
I think when the missle moves to fast it tries to intercept it in the distance, Iron Dome wants to incept on the other side (in the ground), It doesn't know the ground is there.
I agree. I think this just a bug in the mod with how it’s calculating the intercept. Probably calculating too soon after the launch and too much lead. If its realistic the. It just shouldn’t fire. But I suspect it’s not realistic and will be fixed
@@joshuaanderson4090 We made the interception path to much real life rockets trajectory. the interceptor calculates a lot of lead and when the target is so fast the impact point is in the ground. anyway for this type of targets David sling or arrow 2\3 will used
@@idfmodsproject first the mod looks great and obviously works fabulous when it can calculate an intercept. IRL id guess that the system just wouldn't fire if it couldn't calculate a solution. Rather than wasting ammo. But I know grok experience mods sometimes have to take shortcuts to deal with various limitations. Overalls the team should be proud
For intercepting +Mach-2 missiles israel has the Jericho missile that works in sync with the Iron dome , The Iron dome will not fire if the computer detects a +Mach-2 , In this case the Jericho missile will be activated to intercept it
Cap, the service ceiling on Iron Dome is classified, but it’s a lot higher than 30,000’ in order to intercept long range rockets being fired from Lebanon & Gaza, and the “going the wrong way” is a glitch in CCS and something ID is not known to do…
Roger, I wonder if he meant that the B-17 ceiling was 30,000ft? I should have asked.
The balloon is brilliant
The grad example looked just like any of the real footage I’ve seen of Iron Dome in action.
Grad rockets fired into Israel these days aren’t coming out of a Soviet era launcher. As I understand it - many of the grad rockets are home built for the most part and fire from rails set up on the ground. It’s barely above the level of level of high power model rocketry.
Regarding the debris - there’s also videos of some of that online from attacks on Israel. That debris can be dangerous in its own right - albeit far less than a rocket with a warhead hitting.
Possible theory: At very high speeds, the lead calculation the Iron Dome uses to intercept is bugged and it calculates excessive lead?
We made the interception path to much real life rockets interceptions. the interceptor calculates a lot of lead and because the interception path is not tested on Harms it calculates a lot of lead and the result are flying away from the target. in terms of ballistic missiles, Iron Dome is not designed to intercept them, that's the job of David Sling or arrow 2\3.
@@idfmodsproject Fair enough. Thank you for clarifying.
"Sacre bleu! You bought the french missiles again!?!"
Hmmmm,...Diesel fighter lays down 'smoke screen' upwind of installation, blinds Iron Dome human operators, aggressors can fly in unimpeded?
Iron Dome is killing Godzilla @33:11 helping out Kim 🇰🇵
My theory is that you faced the launchers all in one direction. Perhaps if you’re going to attack from different angles set up 40 of these in a circle
Actually, Iron dome is doing exactly what it is supposed to do. When a missile is detected without a possible solution, the system activates all ordinance to fire in the opposite direction in an attempt to remove the chance of secondary explosions on site. Most fire at inhabited areas, specifically, people that are taking too long of breaks in their car. I mean, someone is at least going to get part way into this comment before realizing it''s total BS.