Because unlike most people who try Marth, Leo actually loves Marth and knows he has potential. 12+ top players can tell Leo Marth sucks, but he's still going to play him and push the meta. I find it funny how when Leo said Marth sucked, everyone was on board. When Leo changed his mind and said Marth got potential, nobody's with him. I have a strong feeling that as soon as Leo wins a major going dominantly Marth, he will pull another Ludwig Invitational speach about why he is the best player XD. And yes, I say "as soon as" because I know for a fact Leo can win a major with literally anyone he likes. He already got a major win for Corrin (Delfino Raza 2022), even though he dropped her later.
When did Leo suddenly say Marth has potential? "I have a strong feeling that as soon as Leo wins a major going dominantly Marth" This is never going to happen unless little to 0 top players attend.
@@JonathanFingers Yeah… I’m just gonna drop in and say that you’re honestly just being a hater. Yeah, the character isn’t as consistent as others, but that’s ludicrous to say he would only win if “0 top players entered”. Well, if Riddles was there in that situation he’d be doing pretty good right? Man just let people play with who they want without talking smack. Neither of us are in the top 10-15 best players so no one cares. Jesus, this is why no one likes this community..
@@zenassinclair3243 "but that’s ludicrous to say he would only win if “0 top players entered”." Ok please explain to me why that's ludicrous. Leo has repeatedly lost games against top players with his Marth, even lower level players at locals. Just because he got 1 notable win for the first time in years doesn't suddenly mean the character is amazing and worthy of winning tournaments. "Well, if Riddles was there in that situation he’d be doing pretty good right?" You mean if Riddles were to vs Leo's Marth in bracket AGAIN not accounting for the fact that Riddles could adapt to his Marth? I never said people can't play Marth lmao and how am I talking smack? Me being objective and giving the reality of the situation isn't talking smack, stop getting upset over something so unimportant. "Neither of us are in the top 10-15 best players so no one cares." What? I was directly responding to someone who was wrong about what the number 1 player said, and I then corrected him. Nobody likes this community because there are whiners and crybaby's such as yourself.
@@JonathanFingers You’re calling me a whiner when you literally just wrote your dissertation on why *insert character* is bad, yet you have the audacity to brand me as a whiner? Excuse me, did you not do this same exact thing in another conversation string, or am I delusional? And you’re right, that is precisely why players tend to deviate from smash, myself included, has has played in the scene for over a decade. It’s complaining, groupthink mentality, sexual harassment fiascos, players utilizing match up stats to make up for their lack of experience, everyone worshiping the ground a top player walks on, and quite frankly some a lot of the interactions I’ve had as of late aren’t the most pleasant. Including this one. If you are just going to go by and limiting yourself you aren’t gonna get far in any competitive game, sport, what have you. Straight up. And even if that’s just 1 win it will always be 1 more than you or I have had. Check yourself.
A lot of the kills Leo got with Marth here are kills Lucina would not have gotten. I'm not saying Marth is *BETTER* than Lucina, but there's clearly potential in Marth that people just dismiss. I think your close friend and teammate said this too, Marss.
Lucina is more consistent, but Marth has more potential. for the vast majority of players, consistency will be more valuable, but if you're as cracked as Leo and you can play the spacing right Marth is better
@@jasonwalker4003 But Leo himself thinks Lucina is better and has historically had pretty poor results with Marth whilst having much better results with Lucina.
He is better tho. He on average kills earlier then Lucina, he’s just a character you need to learn rather then Pick up and go with Lucina. Marth is like pika where you gotta learn the combos and they are technically demanding but they are definitely worth it once you lead them. Also Marth has a X factor ( tipper )unlike Lucina which is better in a game like ult
@@zacheyea If he killed earlier than Lucina on average then he wouldn't be widely considered a mid tier to low high tier with Lucina being a certain top tier. People have been labbing and learning Marth since the game came out and no one has done anything with him, even the best player in the world who albeit wouldn't have played him nearly as much. Having an 'x factor' in Ult isn't as good as it was in Smash 4, consistency is much more highly valued in Ultimate.
@@JonathanFingers also it’s cuz why put in the work for Marth and you can get easy results. I will say Marth wasn’t all that good before the 8.0 buffs. After that patch he got a lot of his tippers buffed. Again people call Marth bad cuz 1. No one plays him and 2. They know nothing about the character. Like example Marths Dancing blade kills earlier then Roy’s.
I'm just so tired of people writing Marth off, lest we forget ESAM put him in bottom 6 in a recent tier list, like I know he said "he isn't bottom 6" but he still put him there and didn't really explain why he didn't put him somewhere else. It's like one person said "tipper inconsistent" and now everyone thinks Marth is complete trash. It's not some arcane ritual, being good with Marth, it is humanly possible to land a tipper despite what people say.
i've long thought that marth is way better than lucina at corner pressure, partially because tippers are oppressive as heck, and partially because getting tipper in the corner is easier + the reward from sourspots is still really high since they put the opponent in a horrible position. i also kinda feel this way about juggling, although i dont think the gap is as big.
nah lucina is definitely a lot better still. he kills so late unless you can perfectly space while also not dying to an opponent's rage-powered move. she's consistent which is pretty key in high level play. lucina is also just strong enough to make it not even worth the sour spot trade off. marth is a lot sicker tho
Leo has been the 1# player for over 3 years. He has beaten and bodied everyone you can think of. The most recent one was acola, who eeeeveryone was saying he was the one to dethrone leo. Then Scola got 6-0 by leo. I feel Leo threw this tournament to let Spargo win.
@@kava3957 He referred to him as a goat in the same sentence, "masher" and "camper" have bad connotations, sure, but he was clearly acknowledging that he's the best in the world, he just also said he was high and mashing his ass off
Marth is not a low tier. Dont be a clown like esam marth has the same frame data as lucina... which is very very good and marth is a swordi.... which is broken in this game. Now compare marth to the "low tiers" ... ah yeah now compare marth to the "mid tiers" aha now put marth next to lucina and stfu
Disregarding someones Skill on one of the more difficult characters just because you don't know how to play against Kazyua and your Name fits my point perfectly. You don't have to like fighting against Kazuya but first Riddles is close or might as well be a Top 10 Player at this Point and he explained why he was a bit upset about that and some were problems like not going Terry or dropping some stuff he usually doesnt. Well and the fact he actually lost a Low Tier was also a Point
@@imnotgonnasugarcoatit First off I never insulted his skill or brought up that I didn't like Kazuya. (In fact I beat most Kazuyas I play in bracket.) How does my username even tie into your point? I just thought he made a funny face. I was not trying to insult your favorite streamer or downplay his skill, although you do not seem very intelligent so I could see how you might misunderstand. (If you end end up replying to this you might want to have a parent proof read it because your last comment was barely readable.)
@@themuffinbrothers1012 Yours wasnt readable and nor is he my favorite streamer, i don't even have time for that lmao Sorry but if you couldnt read it... Skill Issue. "Seeing a Kazuya Player Lose heheehehe" Why even bring that up then? Because Kazuya is SOOO broken and carries that its funny seeing them lose? Thats Steve. Not Kazuya.
Why does everyone keep talking about Leo being zooted like y’all tryna snitch on this man who cares sometimes your better at smash when your messed up 😂
I really don't like the fact that when people say "meta" it actually means only continuosly repeating the same moves over and over, and using less than half the moves Nintendo has created for that character. The meta today means jumping and attacking at the same time, Leo is the first in the world because he mastered this abusive technique. I have nothing against Leo of course, it's a competitive game and he does what its going to get him a win. It's just sad that we see using only about 30% of the attacks that the game offers, and we just get to see repetitive jump aerials over and over.
This is a depressing way to look at competitive games. The most effective tactics available are constantly changing and evolving, and just because those tactics involve lots of aerials, everything that makes competitive 1v1 games fun is still there. Also, it’s human nature to find things that work, and keep doing them until they stop working, so the idea that top players are being uninteresting by only using smart, powerful tactics to win presents a fundamental misunderstanding of what makes esports and competitive games in general interesting.
Bro I’m honestly disappointed in the amount dumb mistakes riddles made I mean I would’ve gotten bodied but he was literally making the most obvious mistakes
Leo did not have adavntage Riddles was at an advantage why did Riddles go in especially against Marth. That backa ir was just a roll read into a jump read lterally Marth's special ability. You cannot play iknto Marth's rhythm you WILL Lose
Leo wasn’t playing on his back foot nearly as much as he should have, he was overextending with way too many aerials when he really should have played it more defensively
But are we gonna acknowledge that Leo was zooted during this set?
Zooted?
@@hoovybeast0594 High
kite flying
@@hoovybeast0594 Dude was high af during this set (and prob most of the bracket too)
I didn't watch any part of the tournament, but where does this claim come from?
I love how after this game he went to commentary and after being told "you're different man" he just answered "I am"
Then proceeded to get deleted by tweaks Diddy kang
@@jahnellbroomfield7172 average tweek enjoyer, mkleo hater
I don't know how many variations of this match-up I've seen in youtube videos but I keep watching them because Marth
Marth is the GOAT
Same. You might have seen me comment on most of them too lol.
How is esam gonna tell us Riddles "went to town" on Leo in the beginning of the video when they are clearly on smashville?!
7:42 Leo definitely was 😂
Your comment just went over everyone’s head and I feel for you
Because unlike most people who try Marth, Leo actually loves Marth and knows he has potential. 12+ top players can tell Leo Marth sucks, but he's still going to play him and push the meta.
I find it funny how when Leo said Marth sucked, everyone was on board. When Leo changed his mind and said Marth got potential, nobody's with him. I have a strong feeling that as soon as Leo wins a major going dominantly Marth, he will pull another Ludwig Invitational speach about why he is the best player XD.
And yes, I say "as soon as" because I know for a fact Leo can win a major with literally anyone he likes. He already got a major win for Corrin (Delfino Raza 2022), even though he dropped her later.
I hope it happens or at least pull out marth for matchups like this
When did Leo suddenly say Marth has potential? "I have a strong feeling that as soon as Leo wins a major going dominantly Marth" This is never going to happen unless little to 0 top players attend.
@@JonathanFingers Yeah… I’m just gonna drop in and say that you’re honestly just being a hater. Yeah, the character isn’t as consistent as others, but that’s ludicrous to say he would only win if “0 top players entered”. Well, if Riddles was there in that situation he’d be doing pretty good right?
Man just let people play with who they want without talking smack. Neither of us are in the top 10-15 best players so no one cares.
Jesus, this is why no one likes this community..
@@zenassinclair3243 "but that’s ludicrous to say he would only win if “0 top players entered”." Ok please explain to me why that's ludicrous. Leo has repeatedly lost games against top players with his Marth, even lower level players at locals. Just because he got 1 notable win for the first time in years doesn't suddenly mean the character is amazing and worthy of winning tournaments.
"Well, if Riddles was there in that situation he’d be doing pretty good right?" You mean if Riddles were to vs Leo's Marth in bracket AGAIN not accounting for the fact that Riddles could adapt to his Marth? I never said people can't play Marth lmao and how am I talking smack? Me being objective and giving the reality of the situation isn't talking smack, stop getting upset over something so unimportant.
"Neither of us are in the top 10-15 best players so no one cares." What? I was directly responding to someone who was wrong about what the number 1 player said, and I then corrected him. Nobody likes this community because there are whiners and crybaby's such as yourself.
@@JonathanFingers You’re calling me a whiner when you literally just wrote your dissertation on why *insert character* is bad, yet you have the audacity to brand me as a whiner? Excuse me, did you not do this same exact thing in another conversation string, or am I delusional?
And you’re right, that is precisely why players tend to deviate from smash, myself included, has has played in the scene for over a decade.
It’s complaining, groupthink mentality, sexual harassment fiascos, players utilizing match up stats to make up for their lack of experience, everyone worshiping the ground a top player walks on, and quite frankly some a lot of the interactions I’ve had as of late aren’t the most pleasant. Including this one.
If you are just going to go by and limiting yourself you aren’t gonna get far in any competitive game, sport, what have you. Straight up.
And even if that’s just 1 win it will always be 1 more than you or I have had. Check yourself.
A lot of the kills Leo got with Marth here are kills Lucina would not have gotten.
I'm not saying Marth is *BETTER* than Lucina, but there's clearly potential in Marth that people just dismiss.
I think your close friend and teammate said this too, Marss.
Lucina is more consistent, but Marth has more potential. for the vast majority of players, consistency will be more valuable, but if you're as cracked as Leo and you can play the spacing right Marth is better
@@jasonwalker4003 But Leo himself thinks Lucina is better and has historically had pretty poor results with Marth whilst having much better results with Lucina.
He is better tho. He on average kills earlier then Lucina, he’s just a character you need to learn rather then Pick up and go with Lucina. Marth is like pika where you gotta learn the combos and they are technically demanding but they are definitely worth it once you lead them. Also Marth has a X factor ( tipper )unlike Lucina which is better in a game like ult
@@zacheyea If he killed earlier than Lucina on average then he wouldn't be widely considered a mid tier to low high tier with Lucina being a certain top tier. People have been labbing and learning Marth since the game came out and no one has done anything with him, even the best player in the world who albeit wouldn't have played him nearly as much. Having an 'x factor' in Ult isn't as good as it was in Smash 4, consistency is much more highly valued in Ultimate.
@@JonathanFingers also it’s cuz why put in the work for Marth and you can get easy results. I will say Marth wasn’t all that good before the 8.0 buffs. After that patch he got a lot of his tippers buffed. Again people call Marth bad cuz 1. No one plays him and 2. They know nothing about the character. Like example Marths Dancing blade kills earlier then Roy’s.
Riddles went to town against Leo games 1 and 2, then went to Town against Leo games 4 and 5.
lmao
That Kazuya set was a reminder of why Game 4 MKLeo was a huge saying for a while. He managed to get a game 4, and the set was won at that point.
I savor any time Leo goes Marth. It's beautiful.
leo marth would be so sick to see in more tournaments. obviously he isn't going to but it'd be nice.
Yes bro the reason I picked up Marth in the first place aside from wanting to feel like m2k
Were you going out of your way to wear larger glasses than Leo was in the thumbnail?
I'm just so tired of people writing Marth off, lest we forget ESAM put him in bottom 6 in a recent tier list, like I know he said "he isn't bottom 6" but he still put him there and didn't really explain why he didn't put him somewhere else. It's like one person said "tipper inconsistent" and now everyone thinks Marth is complete trash. It's not some arcane ritual, being good with Marth, it is humanly possible to land a tipper despite what people say.
i've long thought that marth is way better than lucina at corner pressure, partially because tippers are oppressive as heck, and partially because getting tipper in the corner is easier + the reward from sourspots is still really high since they put the opponent in a horrible position. i also kinda feel this way about juggling, although i dont think the gap is as big.
nah lucina is definitely a lot better still. he kills so late unless you can perfectly space while also not dying to an opponent's rage-powered move. she's consistent which is pretty key in high level play. lucina is also just strong enough to make it not even worth the sour spot trade off. marth is a lot sicker tho
Leo literally mashed his ass off the whole tournament. Probably cause he was high. I never thought I'd be calling the GOAT a masher 😲
Just another hater
Dude leo has already proved himself to be a great player. What more do you smashers want? He’s won more than any of you will win.
Leo has been the 1# player for over 3 years. He has beaten and bodied everyone you can think of. The most recent one was acola, who eeeeveryone was saying he was the one to dethrone leo. Then Scola got 6-0 by leo. I feel Leo threw this tournament to let Spargo win.
@@kava3957 He referred to him as a goat in the same sentence, "masher" and "camper" have bad connotations, sure, but he was clearly acknowledging that he's the best in the world, he just also said he was high and mashing his ass off
Your comment is very laughable.
Slingshot Marth is just wild
watching a kazuya player losing to a low tier is hilarious, riddles face at the end is priceless
Marth is not a low tier. Dont be a clown like esam marth has the same frame data as lucina... which is very very good and marth is a swordi.... which is broken in this game. Now compare marth to the "low tiers" ... ah yeah now compare marth to the "mid tiers" aha now put marth next to lucina and stfu
@@Pkey995 No😃
Disregarding someones Skill on one of the more difficult characters just because you don't know how to play against Kazyua and your Name fits my point perfectly.
You don't have to like fighting against Kazuya but first Riddles is close or might as well be a Top 10 Player at this Point and he explained why he was a bit upset about that and some were problems like not going Terry or dropping some stuff he usually doesnt.
Well and the fact he actually lost a Low Tier was also a Point
@@imnotgonnasugarcoatit First off I never insulted his skill or brought up that I didn't like Kazuya. (In fact I beat most Kazuyas I play in bracket.) How does my username even tie into your point? I just thought he made a funny face. I was not trying to insult your favorite streamer or downplay his skill, although you do not seem very intelligent so I could see how you might misunderstand.
(If you end end up replying to this you might want to have a parent proof read it because your last comment was barely readable.)
@@themuffinbrothers1012 Yours wasnt readable and nor is he my favorite streamer, i don't even have time for that lmao
Sorry but if you couldnt read it... Skill Issue.
"Seeing a Kazuya Player Lose heheehehe"
Why even bring that up then? Because Kazuya is SOOO broken and carries that its funny seeing them lose? Thats Steve. Not Kazuya.
MARTH MAINS UNITE!
Why does everyone keep talking about Leo being zooted like y’all tryna snitch on this man who cares sometimes your better at smash when your messed up 😂
Because it's hilarious, I don't think anyone has a problem with it
How is Marth Up B a Frame 1 escape option? I thought it has a startup of 5 frames or sth
Invul frame 1 in the air
Love your analysis videos Esam
Esamthony Fantano?
Let’s make a highlight video of all the time ESAM has gotten wrecked by nobodies and talk about that.
5:10 "We no longer wish to give the pressure a platform after their inflammatory and bigotted remarks".
told you Marth isn't bottom tier lol
Hello entertainment Sampson
No, that's my buddy energized Samantha
@@louiscorona8465no way bro that’s my homie electronic samuel
@7:00 what was that movement from marth???
I’ve been waiting for this
"Layo"
0:23 No, you silly! He went to smashville, not town!
. nod marth is fun n fast.prfct spacing grt t play^
Literlaly the cap falcon vs Marth
Riddles kinda threw
I really don't like the fact that when people say "meta" it actually means only continuosly repeating the same moves over and over, and using less than half the moves Nintendo has created for that character. The meta today means jumping and attacking at the same time, Leo is the first in the world because he mastered this abusive technique. I have nothing against Leo of course, it's a competitive game and he does what its going to get him a win. It's just sad that we see using only about 30% of the attacks that the game offers, and we just get to see repetitive jump aerials over and over.
This is a depressing way to look at competitive games. The most effective tactics available are constantly changing and evolving, and just because those tactics involve lots of aerials, everything that makes competitive 1v1 games fun is still there. Also, it’s human nature to find things that work, and keep doing them until they stop working, so the idea that top players are being uninteresting by only using smart, powerful tactics to win presents a fundamental misunderstanding of what makes esports and competitive games in general interesting.
Bro I’m honestly disappointed in the amount dumb mistakes riddles made I mean I would’ve gotten bodied but he was literally making the most obvious mistakes
Leo did not have adavntage Riddles was at an advantage why did Riddles go in especially against Marth. That backa ir was just a roll read into a jump read lterally Marth's special ability. You cannot play iknto Marth's rhythm you WILL Lose
Bro did you go gym or did you always have these broad shoulders???
I have not worked out LMAO i have broad shoulders
Leo wasn’t playing on his back foot nearly as much as he should have, he was overextending with way too many aerials when he really should have played it more defensively
Yo
2nd?
Kazuya mains 🏳️🌈🏳️⚧️
Why does Caillou think people need to hear his opinion?
This is what happens when your uncle crawls into your bed when youre young
More respect to Mr. Clean, please.
Cause we do