I dont know why but hearing these men go off in such an intellectual fashion is kind of addicting. Some of the passages by Agrippa in the recent invisibilia dei translation were so good.
Interesting perspectives. However, I can't simply take any ancient church writer at his word as no heretics or gnostics were ever given a chance to address any of these particular claims.
“This is a very complicated case, Maude. You know, a lotta ins, a lotta outs, a lotta what-have-yous. And, uh, a lotta strands to keep in my head, man. Lotta strands in old Duder's head."
I usually put my recordings on Patreon. It's not really a transactional arrangement, but I welcome the support and the recordings are just a little bonus for those who don't want to make their own copies.
Tartullian had a lot of chutzpah calling out against the Valentinians. Tartullian being a Montanist was himself a gnostic. His diatribe “Against the Valentinian Gnostics” is a clear case of _my_ _visions_ _are_ _better_ _than_ _yours_ , what Freud would have called the 'narcissism of small differences'.
Gnostic is vague term, I do not take sides in this debate, but He clearly criticize their secretive and initiatory rites as well as complicated cosmology, I do not think that was the case in Montanism/Tertulianism.
@@TheModernHermeticist Hello Dan sorry for crossed lines... the emanations of Mercury are always sphagettified here due to my 20th century computer/phone set-up.... so when I noticed my ally Robert Corless posting his comment I siezed the chance to connect. He lives in glorious isolation in a Spanish desert, and I live in a time-warp in England. Planning a colaborative project is like a ouijia-board consulation with St Antony of Egypt. Love your work, thanks again for all the information and education and inspiration! M X
What do you mean by open-minded? Eclectic? I do not take sides in this debate, but Tertulian clearly criticize Valentinians for being secretive and initiatory, which was always problematic for church, I do not think that it was the case in Montanism/Tertulianism.
@@M-i-k-a-e-l The original christianity was a Jewish sect of Talmudic influence. They had made up their suffering Torah mosiach, desecrated Roman statues by breaking their noses according to Talmudic principles. Gnosticism depends on the original gospels, because they base their lore on both the old and the new testament. The thing is, the original christians did not have a new testament, they were torah observant jews. The bible was created much later, by various anonymous authors who have never even met Jesus. The original christians were not gnostics at all, they were jews who worshipped Yahweh, the one the gnostics call the demiurge.
Please like, comment, and share or else you can't be a pneumatikos.
We wouldn't want that
how orthadox of you. lol.
“They have a knack of persuading men before instructing them, although truth pursdaues by teaching but does not teach by first persuading”
Burn
Thank you for all the work you do Dr. Dan Attrell
Thank you🌾🪔🌾
“From its many springs many errors may well emanate” nice
Tertullian did have some epic burns.
Many, many thanks for another key reading. Much appreciated Sir!
Thanks as always Mark
Although I might consider myself to be more "for" than against the Gnostics, I thoroughly enjoyed this excellent selection. Many thanks as always.
Wonderful ! Well read , many thanks 🤗
This is just what people did back then instead of playing RPGs and writing fantasy novels.
Epic rap battles of Theology
They should make a mod for Baldur's gate 3 where you get to argue with Tertullian for hours
I dont know why but hearing these men go off in such an intellectual fashion is kind of addicting. Some of the passages by Agrippa in the recent invisibilia dei translation were so good.
Thank you for your work in this work.
My pleasure, thanks for listening.
Let's be real, is there anything better than ancient catfights?
‘the kettle calling the pot black’
@@mazyar_ exactly
Yaaas. ❤ More heresiographies please!!! ❤
There will be more!
It is in the nature of heresy to spread. Thankfully!
I’m not the one to decide what makes one person’s beliefs heretical and another’s orthodox, but all the emanations and aeons do make my head spin.
Same. It's taking my literally years to get my head around it.
Interesting perspectives. However, I can't simply take any ancient church writer at his word as no heretics or gnostics were ever given a chance to address any of these particular claims.
bars 🔥🔥🔥
Heck ya dan
“This is a very complicated case, Maude. You know, a lotta ins, a lotta outs, a lotta what-have-yous. And, uh, a lotta strands to keep in my head, man. Lotta strands in old Duder's head."
You should sell your recordings. Altrusian Media channel is a great examp!e.
I usually put my recordings on Patreon. It's not really a transactional arrangement, but I welcome the support and the recordings are just a little bonus for those who don't want to make their own copies.
Yaldi Baldi Approves
The I ching answers alll his questions. With the numbering yin and yang.
Im starting to think trojan horse is mighty weapon of words amd stories
I see the sage laughing at all our damn stories. Laughing pooh bear sage
Tartullian had a lot of chutzpah calling out against the Valentinians.
Tartullian being a Montanist was himself a gnostic. His diatribe “Against the Valentinian Gnostics” is a clear case of _my_ _visions_ _are_ _better_ _than_ _yours_ , what Freud would have called the 'narcissism of small differences'.
Gnostic is vague term, I do not take sides in this debate, but He clearly criticize their secretive and initiatory rites as well as complicated cosmology, I do not think that was the case in Montanism/Tertulianism.
That is not true, montanists were not gnostics at all, but rather a sort of charismatics avant-la-lettre.
Ta Dan x
Cheers!
Just got your meessage thanks. We have contact!
Did someone message you MDP? Cuz I haven't messaged anyone in a while...
@@TheModernHermeticist Hello Dan sorry for crossed lines... the emanations of Mercury are always sphagettified here due to my 20th century computer/phone set-up.... so when I noticed my ally Robert Corless posting his comment I siezed the chance to connect. He lives in glorious isolation in a Spanish desert, and I live in a time-warp in England. Planning a colaborative project is like a ouijia-board consulation with St Antony of Egypt. Love your work, thanks again for all the information and education and inspiration! M X
Χαίρε Πνεύμα Σκοτεινό
Basic take away: valentianians were open minded, perhaps going to far with their Aeonic cosmology, and this is unacceptable to orthodoxy.
What do you mean by open-minded? Eclectic? I do not take sides in this debate, but Tertulian clearly criticize Valentinians for being secretive and initiatory, which was always problematic for church, I do not think that it was the case in Montanism/Tertulianism.
If there ever was an "original christianity", my man-guess is that the Valentinians are by far closest to it!
@@M-i-k-a-e-l The original christianity was a Jewish sect of Talmudic influence. They had made up their suffering Torah mosiach, desecrated Roman statues by breaking their noses according to Talmudic principles. Gnosticism depends on the original gospels, because they base their lore on both the old and the new testament. The thing is, the original christians did not have a new testament, they were torah observant jews. The bible was created much later, by various anonymous authors who have never even met Jesus. The original christians were not gnostics at all, they were jews who worshipped Yahweh, the one the gnostics call the demiurge.