The heart wakes up the next morning like... "I had the worst nightmare! This ghost lady came into my room and quietly just _organized her backpack at me_ until I died!"
"How can you be so sure this can survive indefinitely? Great question, that's the kind of thing that would be easier to demonstrate!" Rest of chat: "NO! NOT AGAIN!"
Loved seeing how much fun Baalorlord was having. He made me laugh so much during the Heart fight. "This is our kill card." *Points to Prepared.* "Don't forget the potions? You're right." *Discards them both.* "This is the dumbest thing you've ever seen? You're welcome."
It makes it so much cooler that this run almost didnt even make it past ACT 1. Such a bummer that the video ends so soon after the run is over, def as always, but especially for this run, want more breakdown synopsis celebration lap.
20% chance to die to Gremlin Nob in act 1, leaves with 1 health turns into: 10 minute triple Jaw Worm fight in act 3 to heal 11 health. 1 hour long Awakened One fight in act 3. 40 minute Heart fight. 10/10 run for me. Necronomicurse run is still best of the best, but this is in the running for #2 easy.
I'm just imagining the enemies trying to figure out what their opponent is doing is they watch her chug and throw Potion after Potion on the ground yet they can't hit her 😂😂
I liked the part where baalor talked about each card being part of a bigger picture for the character when talking about pommel strike vs quick slash. I think a great example to demonstrate that point is prismatic shard. Cards like hyper beam and reprogram are bonkers for the characters who are not Defect because they are not affected by the focus down.
It wasn't until seeing both Cultist and Awakened One at 999 strength that I realized that the multi-attack and Cultist's attack have the same base. That's really cool thematically.
Timestamps for when Baalor picks up the cards in the thumbnail (so many After Images): After Image #1: (28:06) For the rest, you'll be seeing them a couple times at least... (1:48:04 for the first Act 3 boss) (3:07:20 for Heart) I did _not_ notice the time when I clicked into this video until I saw just how long the first Act 3 boss was in the timeline. What an absolutely incredible, and absurdly ridiculous, run!
I can't play Slay the Spire anymore, because I burnt out HARD on both it and roguelikes, but it's fun to come back to runs like this occasionally. Imagine if he had that Neutral card, Panache, and how much faster this could have gone. ;)
Another case for pommel strike could be the availability, silent doesn't lack draw in the slightest in the common slot whereas ironclads main draw engine is usually uncommon and quick slash is a cycle whereas pommel upgraded is draw positive
So your comments on the complexity of the game and the difficulty of calculating an optimal path reminded me of an idea I'd had once--post only the heart fight from a run, the final score, and the seed. The challenge is for other people to beat the heart with a higher score.
I'm glad to have somethin to listen to buy could we please put how many runs on streak there is in the description even if it's a zero it still comforts me to have the information
Just imagine the perspective of the Heart in this run tho Some weird lady wearing a skull hat and a cloak full of _so_ many knives walks in, believing she's conquered the Spire. So the Heart does what it's done countless times before: it reaches out, wielding an unknowable, otherworldly power, and crushes the trespasser. But the strike seems to merely pass through her... "Ah, indeed; a clever trick. No doubt borrowed from the wandering denizens of my Spire. But you are no true ghost, little challenger. Not yet." And so the Heart unleashes a barrage of strikes, and feels as some of them make contact with the lingering fraction of the trespasser that still exists on this plane. Given that she's made little attempt to retaliate and is now failing to adequately defend, the Heart becomes only more assured in its inevitable victory. Until it notices a shift... The Heart can't perceive visually, as it lacks eyes, but it can still detect the presence of another in its chamber keenly enough to target them with its attacks. Yet now the presence before it is... indeterminate. The Heart continues to lash out at where it believes the enemy to be, yet it no longer makes contact. The presence is spreading. In growing fury, the Heart attacks indiscriminately, attempting to project its overwhelming power throughout every open space within the chamber. Nothing. The presence is there... the presence is _everywhere,_ but it can't be touched. Seemingly not even light can catch it, as its visage lingers on the still air. Soon the Heart is surrounded by countless, silent shadows. And now the terror begins to set in. The Heart recognizes its own incredible vulnerability; an attack could come from anywhere, and its own attacks have been reduced to hapless, frustrated flailing against the omnipresent invader. Yet an attack doesn't come. Instead, there's finally a break in the silence. _Ting_ The ringing of a small cymbal seems to emanate from everywhere. _Ting_ It's slight, but it reverberates through the Heart in a way that deeply unsettles it. _Ting Ting Ting_ Almost as though it's being lulled into stillness... The Heart thrashes about at the sound. It thrashes at the silence; it thrashes at the stillness. The chime seems to multiply itself across the countless shades roving throughout the chamber. It cuts through the Heart more cleanly than any blade. The quivering mass of unearthly flesh almost yearns to be struck by something tangible as it unleashes every power it possesses upon the nothing that pervades it. In the hours that follow, even the beating of the Heart of the Spire comes to be consumed be the relentless thrum of two small chimes. When eventually the thrumming finally ceases, no sound yet stirs within the chamber. Thus, it would seem that the Silent is named not for her methods, but for her results.
Surely at some point during the heart fight the roles changed here and Baalor became the villain? I dont think I've ever walked away from a run feeling SORRY for the heart before 💀
You could use a "perfect path" strategy to design your rogue like levels. The path starts with a winning strategy against the final boss, and generates a path back to the start where each of the required pieces are available, and combats that win with the missing pieces along the way. You would branch backwards from the winning path to create the actual experience the player is presented with. Is one way to display and "calculate" it with minimal complexity. There might be other winning strategies emergent from the other options, even "more winning" strategies, but there's some merit in your game always having a possibility of success, even if the thread is super tricky to find in practice.
Pommel Strike (or rather, two upgraded Pommel Strikes) was part of the deck that got me my first Ironclad win. It cycled through Rage, Body Slam and Pommel Strikes (as well as *something* else that I don't remember) with Barricade and Juggernaut active to just obliterate stuff by building up block and hitting like a truck every turn - something like 15 cards per turn. Getting Decu and Dono was just icing.
I never noticed this before. In the early floor 2 shop, you bought a card, closed the shop, then opened the shop again -- and the cards were rearranged.
This got to be the longest video I've ever watched on RUclips. And it was hilarious! A tense beginning transitioning to one of the most, if not the most, broken run ever.
I think Baalor knows this, but the supercomputer needed to brute force slay the spire would probably need an unimaginably larger number of transistors than particles than exist in the observable universe, and an ungodly amount of processing time to solve it.
Quick Slash is just a worse Dagger Throw 38:32 Also, interesting note about smooth stone’s value in act 2 I just noticed, the increase in block is not removed by frail on unupgraded defends. In other words, even in Act 2’s frail environment, 1 dex is still worth 1 additional block under a significant number of circumstances And the same can be said about 3 dex based on the potion baalor drinks just a moment later
You have convinced me of the value of Setup/Nightmare! I’ve always been afraid of attempting that combo. But this was so silly powerful, I now feel empowered!
Im genuinly so confounded by how the game bugged out and allowed you to get over 999 block at 2:50:30. It's my first time seeing that interaction after all this time. I wonder what triggered for it to bypass that limitation.
The only way to get a perfect path is to have a computer play through every single floor, in every possible variation. Which isn't even just encounter decisions, it's also combats. Maybe taking a campfire for an upgrade when you're at 55/66 HP is worth it, but if you don't heal when you're at 54/66 HP you die by one HP at a boss. When you start thinking about every little micro decision, you both get a new appreciation for the best players in the world who can win 10+ runs in a row, but also a dwarfing sense of hopelessness at how inconsequential your decisions might seem, yet how impactful they can be 10 floors later. A true encapsulation of "if I didn't take that 2 damage by mistake I would've lived here." and then you realize making a computer powerful enough to do that, in a timeframe that's actually relevant enough for you to care, as in immediately after your run ends, is genuinely impossible. Even if a computer COULD play every variation possible of a given seed, it would take at minimum hours, likely even days and possibly even months of letting it sit there. Even the best chess computers (if I'm to believe Baalor that STS's decision tree is larger than chess's) can take hours to solve a prearranged puzzle that has a determined solution, STS has no solution and thus creating one from scratch is... bonkers. Sorry this is an essay, it was just a really interesting question.
If someone could make a superhuman STS engine, it would still be a nice tool for it to analyze a game and tell you afterward what it thought the best path is. Superhuman STS engines are possible with current RL approaches, they just haven’t been built yet.
The decision matrix is extremely deep. Over an entire run of StS, it's actually orders of magnitude higher than the total decisions in Chess. Every hand drawn, every card played, and then every card choice changes all of these outcomes for every single fight, etc. The game is insanely deep, too deep to fathom. We haven't solved chess yet, and this game is magnitudes harder to solve than chess is.
@@ShadyNetworker imo necronomicurse was better than this one. In the end of day this run boil down to nightmare a free nightmare. While there are certain crazyness here and we get to see some stupid things, iirc baalor even made a nightmare into nightmare that even incorporated wish before. Meanwhile i think even if someone try for years they probably wont make a run like necro-potence-nomicon again.
recipe for a blade dance at home: turn 1: acquire a shiv by playing cloak and dagger, also setup nightmare and end turn turn 2: nightmare the shiv and end turn turn 3: play the three shivs *for absolutely free* !!
These "Oho, can a computer solve this game?" questions are never going away I guess xD A friend once asked me if chess will be solved. And the point came up up chess having more possible lines than atoms in the universe. And then this "What if. Maybe in the future.". The conversation ended with "Okay. Lets assume, you could compute this. The possibilities are larger than the number of atoms. How would you even store the solution?"
AIs are not beating human beings in chess and go (a much harder feat tbh) because they could store all the outcomes nowadays. It's basically an algorithm designed to "learn" a better move, by both studying all chess games and by simulating outcomes with different moves. Then it "knows" the almost correct move (meaning it's not necessarily always the optimal move, but close enough) for each move. It still requires a large memory, but not for elucidating outcomes, but for running billions and billions of simulation fast enough. If google decides to develop an algorithm to beat StS it would be fine pretty quick imo. If you want to know more about this I'd recommend watching a video on an AI dog learning how to walk or AI learning to play games. There are plenty of those on RUclips.
there are different types of solving games. You have ultra weak solution, weak solution and strong solution. You could solve chess in all three ways because you don't necessarily need to store the information for each individual position, you can just have an algorithm that solves any given position perfectly.
Imagine a game where you take turns and at each turn you have to choose between two options, one slightly smaller than 1 and another slightly larger. You start with 1 and each time you make a pick you multiply your current value by the option you picked. You win when you reach infinity. There are infinite pathways and you need infinite storage to store them. But in fact you only need to store "1" and a simple function to "solve" this game.
To be fair, the proposed feature here doesn't necessarily need to "solve" Slay the Spire. It just needs to find *a* working solution that would have allowed you to win. I would imagine it's quite possible to train a deep learning model to do that especially if you can rewind actions with knowledge of the RNG results.
@@BrotherCheng I don't think so, because there are such a huge number of actions you have to rewind. You may die on floor 35 from a decision made on floor 10, so you have to go back and brute-force through every choice you made at every point in the game to find the winning combination.
@@congobongoproductions5476 I don't think anyone has made a video about it, and it's hard to say wether a seed is unwinnable or not from an in-game persepctive without testing every single options given. That said, there are several blog posts about the theory behind it and they tend to give some examples if you want to try for yourself.
I am still cant believe this game has so many options. some of the combinations are only for genius. and you sir, a genius. you are opening my mind with every video I watched.
LONG TIME VIEWER FIRST TIME COMMENTER 😅. ID TOTALLY BE DOWN TO WATCH YOU REPLAY SEEDS AND TAKE DIFFERENT PATHS/CHOICES THEN COMPARE THEM! SOUNDS FUN, SEEDED SUNDAY OR SOMETHING
I'm so glad this game has an amazing soundtrack so I didn't have to speed through the run. Unironically the best run in STS history as far as I'm concerned
I love your content, observing the way you think about the game has definitely improved my runs a lot, I used to struggle to get past act 2 boss, now most of the time getting to the heart, although I'm on a1. I really think you should play a game called breach wanderers, it's very similar to slay the spire, and I'd love to see how you play that so you can help me improve there too!
For the discussion around 11:45 on whether or not a computer could show the best path in a run: I think what could be a fun feature in StS 2 is if the game showed you the best paths from other players on the same seed! That idea excites me a lot, actually
I'd love to use that map marking mod you've got it's very nice looking. This is a sick run. I really appreciate how much you explain everything. I just got into the game a week ago
As for the possibility of brute-forcing Slay the Spire with a computer, a distributed computing network like Folding@Home would probably be the best bet.
The setup being the bottom card and then getting the kill on the last turn of vulnerable is just an incredible way to end this saga. There was a moment during the heart fight when Baalor was playing prepareds and he had this look of pure delight, it makes it all worth it.
Heart wishes it scaled by increasing number of hits each multi-attack turn up from 15. Then might have a chance. Or if it could eventually take multiple turns each time player hits end turn.
![Lp. Точка Невозврата #7 КИСЛОРОДНОЕ ГОЛОДАНИЕ [Запертый Подвал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LxtUUcTnwnE/mqdefault.jpg)
![Lp. Точка Невозврата #7 КИСЛОРОДНОЕ ГОЛОДАНИЕ [Запертый Подвал] • Майнкрафт](/img/tr.png)
The heart wakes up the next morning like... "I had the worst nightmare! This ghost lady came into my room and quietly just _organized her backpack at me_ until I died!"
underrated comment
Don't forget her little cymbals. Hahaha
@@theprofessor4534and the feats of acrobatics
It was terrifying.
So unbelievably true xD
"How can you be so sure this can survive indefinitely? Great question, that's the kind of thing that would be easier to demonstrate!"
Rest of chat: "NO! NOT AGAIN!"
I fell asleep when Awakend one had 500 strengh, woke up to see 750. It was a good nap.
I am in for a show wth
I just got to 500 strength, might nap also
and im back 849 strength
Same haha
"Huh, I wonder why this video is so long, they reach act 3 around the 1 hour mark"
"...oh no"
Lmao I had the same reaction, I was like "Huh, think it's time to check out the comments"
I thought maybe he'd run it back on the same seed to see what the starting rare card would have been.
Quote of the run: "If the game didn't want me to do this, it shouldn't have given me the tingsha."
1:06 “If this turns into a Nightmare seed…”
oh boy does it
different context, but still the same outcome :D
*checks the time*
Yeah sounds about right...
The use of words expressing something other than their literal intention. Now that. Is. Irony.
No refunds
Loved seeing how much fun Baalorlord was having. He made me laugh so much during the Heart fight. "This is our kill card." *Points to Prepared.* "Don't forget the potions? You're right." *Discards them both.* "This is the dumbest thing you've ever seen? You're welcome."
IT'S MY PARTY AND I GET TO PICK THE MOVIE
This is a really good movie though haha
my partner accidentally put on a spire lets play instead of the OTS and now I'm sitting here an hour deep into the most fun content I've seen in ages
An hour in, he's in the third act-I check the time and there's still the majority of three hours left. Gotta love an absurd run.
It makes it so much cooler that this run almost didnt even make it past ACT 1. Such a bummer that the video ends so soon after the run is over, def as always, but especially for this run, want more breakdown synopsis celebration lap.
I assumed the thumbnail was hyperbole, but it somehow grossly underrepresented the number of afterimages I would see in this run.
Imagined being the reptomancer. Having a nightmare of hundreds of Silents; mixing, drinking and throwing around potions.
I've been WAITING for this run to drop on the RUclips. I watched this live and was cackling the whole time.
20% chance to die to Gremlin Nob in act 1, leaves with 1 health turns into:
10 minute triple Jaw Worm fight in act 3 to heal 11 health.
1 hour long Awakened One fight in act 3.
40 minute Heart fight.
10/10 run for me.
Necronomicurse run is still best of the best, but this is in the running for #2 easy.
"these are the situations that couls lead to a very short run" yeah sure Mr. Lord, tell that to the 4 hour video i have in front of me 😂
"Mr. Lord" is hilarious lmao
@@nahuelmatBaalo R. Lord, at your service
I'm just imagining the enemies trying to figure out what their opponent is doing is they watch her chug and throw Potion after Potion on the ground yet they can't hit her 😂😂
nightmare nightmare nightmare
Can't wait for the thumbnail guy to add in every After Image that Baalor duplicates
Honestly, I kind of wish the thumbnail was just the screenshot of the 1005x4 Awakened One.
@@chjabr0010 no spoilers :)
There aren't enough pixels in the world for that
I liked the part where baalor talked about each card being part of a bigger picture for the character when talking about pommel strike vs quick slash. I think a great example to demonstrate that point is prismatic shard. Cards like hyper beam and reprogram are bonkers for the characters who are not Defect because they are not affected by the focus down.
Hyperbeam Blasphemy is just gross
It wasn't until seeing both Cultist and Awakened One at 999 strength that I realized that the multi-attack and Cultist's attack have the same base. That's really cool thematically.
I wonder if there's any deep lore reason for that?
@@avitaltagarperhaps that a cultist is worth only a quarter of it’s deity
@@itsleo5697 that aint a bad ratio
@@avitaltagar Awakened One is just 4 Cultists in a trench coat.
Timestamps for when Baalor picks up the cards in the thumbnail (so many After Images):
After Image #1: (28:06)
For the rest, you'll be seeing them a couple times at least... (1:48:04 for the first Act 3 boss) (3:07:20 for Heart)
I did _not_ notice the time when I clicked into this video until I saw just how long the first Act 3 boss was in the timeline. What an absolutely incredible, and absurdly ridiculous, run!
I can't play Slay the Spire anymore, because I burnt out HARD on both it and roguelikes, but it's fun to come back to runs like this occasionally.
Imagine if he had that Neutral card, Panache, and how much faster this could have gone. ;)
@@hariman7727 the point wasn't to go fast, it was to get the awakened one to 999 strength
The part that hammers home how off the rails this run went: you forgot that ending the turn is supposed to draw new cards into your hand
Another case for pommel strike could be the availability, silent doesn't lack draw in the slightest in the common slot whereas ironclads main draw engine is usually uncommon and quick slash is a cycle whereas pommel upgraded is draw positive
Watching you is very helpful for improving my game. Thank you for thoughtfully explaining your reasoning behind card choices and other decisions
"No sweetie, we have blade dance at home."
Cue set-up on nightmares to nightmares a shiv.
1 hp floor 8 with slime boss at the end is where im pausing to say, yup never give up!
Baalor could even challenge Illidan with how prepared he is.
1:44:30 war paint being the goat by ALWAYS upgrading 2 defends will never not be funny
Runs like this make me glad for my extension that allows for up to 16x speed. Lol. XD
how do you even comprehend what's happening at that speed?
@@beric_ailey2330 i guess they dont even listen to what hes saying?
@@beric_ailey2330 I watch at 4x speed
@@qb4428 4x is still wild LOL i watch at 1.25x at most
@@-book My brain is weird I guess. 1.25x is torture for me.
This is going to be the perfect video to play in the background for my 3.5hr drive from Michigan to Ohio. 😂😂
Join us in the 2x speed watcher club
Are you a trucker 😊?
Doing the same except Ohio to Michigan!
@@michaelcimino7435 Perhaps they will stop at TA in Monroe
ONLY IN OHIO
The eyebrow raise at 3:06:20 killed me lmfao
So your comments on the complexity of the game and the difficulty of calculating an optimal path reminded me of an idea I'd had once--post only the heart fight from a run, the final score, and the seed. The challenge is for other people to beat the heart with a higher score.
On the same seed I assume?
@@ARatherDapperTapir That would be the idea, yes.
Could be a cool "tournament" or challenge set up. Everyone plays the same seed, highest score wins.
@@hugoboss3689... Thats just daily challenge.
@@gengarisnotinsmash... fuuuuuuuuck true
But i meant organized as an event between the best spire slayers.
I finished three entire heart runs during this video, and one of the runs fit entirely within the awakened one fight... I love this so much
I hope when the devs are making StS2, they take a look at this video to ensure something like this is possible in the next game
Beating the heart with tingsha only....good God man
It's at 1:43:47 when you learn why you're going to be watching this for the next two hours .... can't wait!
The classic, after you've watched the movie, you'll understand why it was needed for the sequel.
the funniest thing was the terror vulnerability eventually fading lol
I'm glad to have somethin to listen to buy could we please put how many runs on streak there is in the description even if it's a zero it still comforts me to have the information
This video didnt have the usual streak counter because it was an out of sequence one, but the streak was 0 here. I've added it to the description
Just imagine the perspective of the Heart in this run tho
Some weird lady wearing a skull hat and a cloak full of _so_ many knives walks in, believing she's conquered the Spire. So the Heart does what it's done countless times before: it reaches out, wielding an unknowable, otherworldly power, and crushes the trespasser.
But the strike seems to merely pass through her... "Ah, indeed; a clever trick. No doubt borrowed from the wandering denizens of my Spire. But you are no true ghost, little challenger. Not yet." And so the Heart unleashes a barrage of strikes, and feels as some of them make contact with the lingering fraction of the trespasser that still exists on this plane. Given that she's made little attempt to retaliate and is now failing to adequately defend, the Heart becomes only more assured in its inevitable victory.
Until it notices a shift... The Heart can't perceive visually, as it lacks eyes, but it can still detect the presence of another in its chamber keenly enough to target them with its attacks. Yet now the presence before it is... indeterminate. The Heart continues to lash out at where it believes the enemy to be, yet it no longer makes contact. The presence is spreading. In growing fury, the Heart attacks indiscriminately, attempting to project its overwhelming power throughout every open space within the chamber.
Nothing. The presence is there... the presence is _everywhere,_ but it can't be touched. Seemingly not even light can catch it, as its visage lingers on the still air. Soon the Heart is surrounded by countless, silent shadows.
And now the terror begins to set in. The Heart recognizes its own incredible vulnerability; an attack could come from anywhere, and its own attacks have been reduced to hapless, frustrated flailing against the omnipresent invader. Yet an attack doesn't come. Instead, there's finally a break in the silence.
_Ting_
The ringing of a small cymbal seems to emanate from everywhere.
_Ting_
It's slight, but it reverberates through the Heart in a way that deeply unsettles it.
_Ting Ting Ting_
Almost as though it's being lulled into stillness...
The Heart thrashes about at the sound. It thrashes at the silence; it thrashes at the stillness. The chime seems to multiply itself across the countless shades roving throughout the chamber. It cuts through the Heart more cleanly than any blade. The quivering mass of unearthly flesh almost yearns to be struck by something tangible as it unleashes every power it possesses upon the nothing that pervades it.
In the hours that follow, even the beating of the Heart of the Spire comes to be consumed be the relentless thrum of two small chimes. When eventually the thrumming finally ceases, no sound yet stirs within the chamber.
Thus, it would seem that the Silent is named not for her methods, but for her results.
Surely at some point during the heart fight the roles changed here and Baalor became the villain? I dont think I've ever walked away from a run feeling SORRY for the heart before 💀
You could use a "perfect path" strategy to design your rogue like levels. The path starts with a winning strategy against the final boss, and generates a path back to the start where each of the required pieces are available, and combats that win with the missing pieces along the way. You would branch backwards from the winning path to create the actual experience the player is presented with. Is one way to display and "calculate" it with minimal complexity. There might be other winning strategies emergent from the other options, even "more winning" strategies, but there's some merit in your game always having a possibility of success, even if the thread is super tricky to find in practice.
A very symbolic White Statue
White Statue is always a little adorable with Alchemize but this is beyond next level.
Pommel Strike (or rather, two upgraded Pommel Strikes) was part of the deck that got me my first Ironclad win. It cycled through Rage, Body Slam and Pommel Strikes (as well as *something* else that I don't remember) with Barricade and Juggernaut active to just obliterate stuff by building up block and hitting like a truck every turn - something like 15 cards per turn. Getting Decu and Dono was just icing.
I'm only at the beginning but I gotta say as a low player (A2 currently) I love hearing your thought process!!
I never noticed this before. In the early floor 2 shop, you bought a card, closed the shop, then opened the shop again -- and the cards were rearranged.
This got to be the longest video I've ever watched on RUclips. And it was hilarious!
A tense beginning transitioning to one of the most, if not the most, broken run ever.
I think Baalor knows this, but the supercomputer needed to brute force slay the spire would probably need an unimaginably larger number of transistors than particles than exist in the observable universe, and an ungodly amount of processing time to solve it.
Been a while since I watched you. I forgot how good the commentary is for watching in the background while I work.
Seeing the video length, i assumed it was a frozen eye run. I've never been so wrong in my life. That was awesome! (On x1.5 speed)
when he says sneaky strike it sound like stinky strike
Quick Slash is just a worse Dagger Throw
38:32 Also, interesting note about smooth stone’s value in act 2 I just noticed, the increase in block is not removed by frail on unupgraded defends. In other words, even in Act 2’s frail environment, 1 dex is still worth 1 additional block under a significant number of circumstances
And the same can be said about 3 dex based on the potion baalor drinks just a moment later
You have convinced me of the value of Setup/Nightmare! I’ve always been afraid of attempting that combo. But this was so silly powerful, I now feel empowered!
alright what kind of decisions are to be made in a 3.5 hour long run???
Double nightmare apparitions. Infinite stalling to get 999 strength on cultist, awakened one, and heart. Just cuz.
Ok I now see why, brilliant!
I’ve always been a heavy blade believer, brings me joy to hear baalor come around to it
Im genuinly so confounded by how the game bugged out and allowed you to get over 999 block at 2:50:30. It's my first time seeing that interaction after all this time. I wonder what triggered for it to bypass that limitation.
funnily enough he trashes quick strike during the one run it could have been used to set up infinite damage
50:00 love the DIY blade dance
The only way to get a perfect path is to have a computer play through every single floor, in every possible variation. Which isn't even just encounter decisions, it's also combats. Maybe taking a campfire for an upgrade when you're at 55/66 HP is worth it, but if you don't heal when you're at 54/66 HP you die by one HP at a boss. When you start thinking about every little micro decision, you both get a new appreciation for the best players in the world who can win 10+ runs in a row, but also a dwarfing sense of hopelessness at how inconsequential your decisions might seem, yet how impactful they can be 10 floors later. A true encapsulation of "if I didn't take that 2 damage by mistake I would've lived here." and then you realize making a computer powerful enough to do that, in a timeframe that's actually relevant enough for you to care, as in immediately after your run ends, is genuinely impossible. Even if a computer COULD play every variation possible of a given seed, it would take at minimum hours, likely even days and possibly even months of letting it sit there.
Even the best chess computers (if I'm to believe Baalor that STS's decision tree is larger than chess's) can take hours to solve a prearranged puzzle that has a determined solution, STS has no solution and thus creating one from scratch is... bonkers.
Sorry this is an essay, it was just a really interesting question.
If someone could make a superhuman STS engine, it would still be a nice tool for it to analyze a game and tell you afterward what it thought the best path is. Superhuman STS engines are possible with current RL approaches, they just haven’t been built yet.
The decision matrix is extremely deep. Over an entire run of StS, it's actually orders of magnitude higher than the total decisions in Chess. Every hand drawn, every card played, and then every card choice changes all of these outcomes for every single fight, etc. The game is insanely deep, too deep to fathom. We haven't solved chess yet, and this game is magnitudes harder to solve than chess is.
End of act 2 and a quarter of the way through thr video...
To hear Baalor say this is his “stupidest run” is so wild, he has had so many crazy, bonkers runs
The Necronomicurse mastery was pretty bonkers too
@@ShadyNetworker imo necronomicurse was better than this one. In the end of day this run boil down to nightmare a free nightmare.
While there are certain crazyness here and we get to see some stupid things, iirc baalor even made a nightmare into nightmare that even incorporated wish before.
Meanwhile i think even if someone try for years they probably wont make a run like necro-potence-nomicon again.
Your beat of death, kept by tiny cymbals, proved stronger than the heart.
Lmao that confused chatter asking if you were soft locked really brought into perspective for me what this grind looked like.
recipe for a blade dance at home:
turn 1: acquire a shiv by playing cloak and dagger, also setup nightmare and end turn
turn 2: nightmare the shiv and end turn
turn 3: play the three shivs *for absolutely free* !!
Seeing proper use of setup is crazy
thanks for talking through your thoughts
Double nightmare is just too insane. Incredible run as always!
Runic Pyramid, 2 nightmares, and Setup is blatantly broken.
And that's why we love Slay the Spire.
That 6012 block though
I can't believe you've done this.
And I watched the whole thing. Except for the banger of a nap I had.
These "Oho, can a computer solve this game?" questions are never going away I guess xD
A friend once asked me if chess will be solved. And the point came up up chess having more possible lines than atoms in the universe. And then this "What if. Maybe in the future.". The conversation ended with "Okay. Lets assume, you could compute this. The possibilities are larger than the number of atoms. How would you even store the solution?"
AIs are not beating human beings in chess and go (a much harder feat tbh) because they could store all the outcomes nowadays. It's basically an algorithm designed to "learn" a better move, by both studying all chess games and by simulating outcomes with different moves. Then it "knows" the almost correct move (meaning it's not necessarily always the optimal move, but close enough) for each move.
It still requires a large memory, but not for elucidating outcomes, but for running billions and billions of simulation fast enough.
If google decides to develop an algorithm to beat StS it would be fine pretty quick imo.
If you want to know more about this I'd recommend watching a video on an AI dog learning how to walk or AI learning to play games. There are plenty of those on RUclips.
there are different types of solving games. You have ultra weak solution, weak solution and strong solution. You could solve chess in all three ways because you don't necessarily need to store the information for each individual position, you can just have an algorithm that solves any given position perfectly.
Imagine a game where you take turns and at each turn you have to choose between two options, one slightly smaller than 1 and another slightly larger. You start with 1 and each time you make a pick you multiply your current value by the option you picked. You win when you reach infinity. There are infinite pathways and you need infinite storage to store them. But in fact you only need to store "1" and a simple function to "solve" this game.
To be fair, the proposed feature here doesn't necessarily need to "solve" Slay the Spire. It just needs to find *a* working solution that would have allowed you to win. I would imagine it's quite possible to train a deep learning model to do that especially if you can rewind actions with knowledge of the RNG results.
@@BrotherCheng I don't think so, because there are such a huge number of actions you have to rewind. You may die on floor 35 from a decision made on floor 10, so you have to go back and brute-force through every choice you made at every point in the game to find the winning combination.
11:50 I've read that even a single fight has more variations than a chess match. In the same article that proved there was, in fact, unwinnable seeds.
has somebody made a video on an example of an unwinnable seed? cause the ramifications are so vast I guess it would need a lot of work to showcase
@@congobongoproductions5476 I don't think anyone has made a video about it, and it's hard to say wether a seed is unwinnable or not from an in-game persepctive without testing every single options given.
That said, there are several blog posts about the theory behind it and they tend to give some examples if you want to try for yourself.
The fact that this is up so soon after the speed run seed you did 😂
You're the hero we need, Baalor. Thank you.
That funeral joke made me overjoyed
So your block can go past 999.
One would think it was a long game but it was just a series of long pauses thinking which card to add
I am watching the Awakened One fight and the video has 2 hours left lmao. Who let this man cook
Baalor (finishing battle at 1 hp): Whatever
Baalor (finishing battle at 26 hp): What a terrifying fight!
😂
I am still cant believe this game has so many options. some of the combinations are only for genius. and you sir, a genius. you are opening my mind with every video I watched.
LONG TIME VIEWER FIRST TIME COMMENTER 😅. ID TOTALLY BE DOWN TO WATCH YOU REPLAY SEEDS AND TAKE DIFFERENT PATHS/CHOICES THEN COMPARE THEM! SOUNDS FUN, SEEDED SUNDAY OR SOMETHING
I'm so glad this game has an amazing soundtrack so I didn't have to speed through the run. Unironically the best run in STS history as far as I'm concerned
The meme run waa predicted early on. "If this becomes a nightmare run..."
Well played. Sickest deck I have EVER SEEN in SoS
You know it's a good one when the Heart Fight ALONE is over 30 minutes.
I love your content, observing the way you think about the game has definitely improved my runs a lot, I used to struggle to get past act 2 boss, now most of the time getting to the heart, although I'm on a1. I really think you should play a game called breach wanderers, it's very similar to slay the spire, and I'd love to see how you play that so you can help me improve there too!
When you thought you have seen it all baalorlord says " strap in and hold my beer"(screen shot of awakened one doing 1005x4 damage)😂😂😂😂
potion?how many you want
the silent:yes
For the discussion around 11:45 on whether or not a computer could show the best path in a run: I think what could be a fun feature in StS 2 is if the game showed you the best paths from other players on the same seed! That idea excites me a lot, actually
so there's a 1 hour awakened fight, that's gonna be interesting
This run is a perfect example of how the devs intended this game to be played
Silent is the weakest among 4, especially in act 1, so it's always satified to get ultra lucky in a run and end up a broken build with Silent.
I feel like Silent is my second best character behind Watcher. Ironclad and Defect feel the least consistent.
Based on historical win streaks, Silent is the second best character
Now thats a good background to clean the whole house 😂
I'd love to use that map marking mod you've got it's very nice looking. This is a sick run. I really appreciate how much you explain everything. I just got into the game a week ago
As for the possibility of brute-forcing Slay the Spire with a computer, a distributed computing network like Folding@Home would probably be the best bet.
The setup being the bottom card and then getting the kill on the last turn of vulnerable is just an incredible way to end this saga. There was a moment during the heart fight when Baalor was playing prepareds and he had this look of pure delight, it makes it all worth it.
Dont forget pommel strike also deals more damage baseline than quick strike
Heart wishes it scaled by increasing number of hits each multi-attack turn up from 15. Then might have a chance. Or if it could eventually take multiple turns each time player hits end turn.
It aint after image anymore, its a fricking alternate realm
I guess there's a soft lock if you have too many Nightmares in your hand at once with Pyramid.
> "What kind of music do astronauts listen to?"
The music of the spheres!
I've been waiting for this to get on youtube since the run
Every couple of months I have an unhealthy addiction to this game