Why do I feel like this is a pre-show for Secrets of Thameslink? Always been fascinated by Blackfriars because of the fact the station's a bridge and the platforms span the Thames. Interesting to learn more about it
The river Fleet flows underground all the way from Hapstead Heath and joins the Thames at Blackfriars bridge. You can hear it running through a drain just off Farringdon road too
Much the opposite to some videos on RUclips that are long, boring, rambling and actually contain very little information once the original text is distilled, much like this very comment that I am writing now!
The abuttments look both sturdy and aesthetically appealing. Were they left in place speculatively for future use, which, as you point out, has been achieved by one, to save the cost of demolition, some other reason, or a combination of these?
Great video as ever Geoff. The reason they left the old bridge supports in place was to protect the supports of the bridge upon which Blackfriars Thameslink Station now stands. If you look, you'll see that the upstream supports are squared-off, whilst the downstream ones are streamlined. The original builders made the downstream side streamlined to stop the supports from being worn away by the incoming tide and to "encourage" river traffic to bounce off if necessary. Because the old bridge had rounded supports, the normal river current is neatly diverted around both bridges (along with any poorly piloted river traffic). If they'd demolished the old bridge supports, that would have exposed the squared-off upstream supports for the newer bridge to the river current and to river traffic. I might be wrong, but I think at one point the proposals for extending and enlarging Blackfriars Station also included building the concourse out over the river using the old LC&DR bridge supports. Apart from it being cheaper to leave the old bridge supports in place, they also serve to protect the current bridge from being worn away.
Thanks for this! This was exactly the answer I was looking for in the video - Why they didn't knock down the old pillars along with the bridge. Makes perfect sense now!
The bridge, having been widened, now bears longer 12-carriage platforms that straddle the river, giving fabulous views up and down the Thames. Fascinating video, Geoff. What a complex history!
Unfortunately in the process the station wnt down from five platforms to four. When Victoria is closed for work less trains can be diverted there and lwhen there is work on the core more trains are cancelled or terminated at London Bridge cutting connections
Last time I went back to Spain to visit my family (in February, before the Covid) I had the chance to take pictures of London's sunrise from my train at Blackfriars, in the middle of the Thames, before heading to Gatwick airport. What a view!
This video really highlights just how long it's been since i have been to London, Holborn Viaduct station and the old bridge were still in use the last time i was there! Being from south London i used to spend a lot of time in and around London back in the 70's and 80's, but i doubt i would recognise i lot of it today.
I left London for California in 1981. I had a very thorough knowledge of the roads and one way systems at the time. When I go back now I can hardly get around and wonder where landmarks I used to know have gone. This fantastic and dense video explains it to me. Great effort!
I worked in the old post office tower block for Sainsburys behind Doggett's Coat And Badge in the 1990s and I don't recognise half of the buildings there anymore.
I used to live in Victoria and I visited it ten years ago. It was unrecognisable and most of the shops I used regularly were either changed or gone completely.
Another excellent video Geoff. As a railroad bridge engineer I appreciate the mention of the “feat of engineering” associated with the removal one viaduct and excavation of the new underground crossing in two weeks. Swapping out critical structures in relatively short periods of time is one of the most interesting challenges of the profession.
Interesting stuff. Near where I live in Minneapolis there's some former bridge remains too. It took me a while to figure it out, but there's one pier still in the river and one on the east bank. I found out that it was called the lower bridge, connecting 6th Ave SE to 10th Ave S, built in 1874, it was a lightweight iron deck truss bridge, and it proved not to be strong enough for motor vehicle and rail traffic and was closed in 1937, and then demolished for scrap during WWII.
I have fond memories of standing on the bridge waiting for the train home to Brighton after a long day at work, looking eastward towards the London bridge and the tower. The view makes it (for me) the best station in London. It's also very easy to get from national rail platform to underground platform even during rush hour
I love Blackfriars station. It's so impressive and has an incredible view that's better than any other station in London. My top 5 London Termini 1- St Pancras 2- Kings Cross 3- London Bridge 4- Blackfriars 5- Paddington
@@JeSuisRene 6th place. I like it but I don't love it. It's just decent on all fronts without excelling anywhere. It's good but I can't put it any higher Euston is my least favourite
Just like to point out that blackfriars maybe one of the best looking stations to be at on your list, and i agree.. but during the winter months its one of the coldest... especially during cancellations!
Marylebone is my favourite London terminus. It has so much charm and feels like stepping back in time. The mezzanine section of Liverpool Street is a great vantage point, especially during rush hour. Moorgate Station, on the Great Northern line, prior to being redecorated was like being in a modern history museum. The NSE-branded tiles were fantastic. I'd be a bit concerned if Euston was anywhere higher than the bottom two of anyone's list.
Would be interesting if they reused the pillars for a footbridge. The loading would be a fraction of what it used to be, but it would add another river crossing for cyclists and pedestrians
Luigi de Guzman But the existing Blackfriars road bridge has plenty of space for pedestrians already, and is just next to it. Would a dedicated foot bridge be nicer? Sure, but that’s a lot of money to spend for a small improvement in utility/safety - hard to imagine that it would be the most cost-effective project. I could only see it happening if they wanted to give the road bridge over to cars entirely, but I suspect the surface streets feeding the bridge don’t have enough spare capacity to take good advantage of that.
@A.L They don't look unsightly. They're interesting, intriguing, and a talking point for visitors. People like having little mysteries in life. I love seeing holdovers of previous things. Clues of a once was.
Recently Ive been trying to find out what happened to Holborn Viaduct station and got some conflicting information but your video cleared it all up and was fantastic and full of useful history. Thanks Geoff
There's a wealth of information out there. The history of London's railways(above *and* below ground) fascinates me and I've read a good bit about the subject. If I may make a suggestion: use *books* rather than the internet, at least to start with. Once you get a basic understanding of the bits that interest you, then use the internet to try and fill in the gaps. There is some absolute rubbish on the internet but some pure gold too, including the superb "Disused Stations" website ( www.disused-stations.org.uk ) and, maybe best of all - maps.nls.uk The NLS site is waist-deep in old maps of various ages, scales, types which give *so much* information about old railways, stations, bridges etc. It takes a wee while to figure out all the features on the site, such as overlays and side-by-side maps but it's a fantastic resource. Hope something here is of some help in your research.😁
I am absolutely fascinated by the way rail is shaped in London. Lines open and close, tunnels are dug closed then reopened. It's just bizarre, to think someone who worked on the undergone as a driver 50 years ago would find so much familiar yet so much new in the same city. Can't say the same for Wellington though, one central city station, 3 main commuter lines going out. Always has been. The only real changes are the tunnels, but they have never been boarded up. Once the line is opened, it stays open it seems. Well, except for the Rimutaka Incline, that got replaced by the tunnel... but still.
I was only there yesterday! Was telling my partner about the old Holborn Viaduct station, as I had to sign it as a guard in the early 80's but never did work a service into there. Needless to say, she was not impressed or interested.......oh well .... I enjoyed the video!
Yes Geoff!! I knew in one of your old videos you told us this would be a talking point for the future! It's going to sound cliched now as a few people have commented this, but I never knew! Thank you.
I always wondered what they were and why they were just left in the middle of the Thames. Really appreciate all the time and work that goes into these videos.
This is a good report as your´s usually are. If fact I would say this is probably one of the better ones. However, there is a persistance to talk non-stop, when some of us would like the occasional pause so that we can catch up with you. Keep up the good work.
I used to use the Thameslink line a lot. When I first started using it, I would arrive at King's Cross from out of town and then have to cross the road and walk a bit to get to King's Cross Thameslink. How wonderful then, when the Thameslink platforms in the basement of St Pancras were opened and it was no longer necessary to risk my life crossing Pentonville Road. Even better when I could get a train direct from Stevenage to St Pancras and onwards to Blackfriars. The extended Blackfriars station is a marvel - a great improvement on how it used to be. I have often looked at the redundant pillars and wondered what had happened to the London Chatham and Dover Railway bridge that they used to support. Now I know!
Thanks, Geoff. You've provided the clue to a mystery I've been trying to solve on and off for years. Back in the 1960s, my grandmother pointed out the brick wall of the old St Paul's Station to me. What I couldn't remember is why. But as she was working for Ward, Lock and Co. in Salisbury Square, the light has dawned the she must have commuted up from her home in Charlton, got out of the train at St Paul's and walked to Salisbury Square. This would have been in the early 1920s, so almost a century ago.
When I began working in the City, mid-60s, one colleague commuted by steam-hauled train from Hemel Hempstead to Broad Street. It was inconvenient for him when the service was re-routed to Euston.
Another great an informative video by Geoff. In the mid to late 1960's I traveled from Wimbledon to Holborn Viaduct every day. One day we were stuck on the south side of Blackfriars station. After about 20 minutes the train went over the bridge avoiding Blackfriars station and straight into Holborn Viaduct. A rare treat! A train had broken down in what was then Platform 5!
I was at Blackfriars station just 3 hours ago and wondered why there was massive red supports, get back to Brighton and Geoff answers my question 😂 thanking you
Hey Geoff Great video. Just thought I’d comment as I actually worked on the 2012 upgrade. I was part of the team that developed and carried out the method of deconstructing the existing red columns and extending the adjacent bridge to sit on top of it. Great project to be a part of. Some of the things we encountered during the works (old newspapers, spy glasses etc) made you really appreciate the history. Keep the videos coming.
Hey Geoff, been there 8 times in the last few years and everytime I was wondering what these red pillars are about. Thank you for this wonderful short video. Really interesting und well done! Cheers from Vienna
Thank you, Geoff. A very good video story, and a good explanation of why the bridge piers are still there. Thank you. I hope you don't mind some comments from someone who is an historian, and believes that accuracy with detail matters. There are a couple of things in the commentary that are potentially misleading. At around 1.52 you say "After the Snow Hill station renaming the tunnels through to Farringdon were no longer used and closed up"; and the way this is presented makes it appear as if all that happened in or around 1929. The passenger service through Snow Hill tunnel to Farringdon and Moorgate ceased in 1916; but the tunnel remained in use for freight until the late 1960s. Indeed, I remember standing on the South Bank in 1966, while the Queen Elizabeth Hall was being built, and seeing a freight train cross Blackfriars Bridge to enter the Snow Hill tunnel. The tunnel was completely abandoned in the early 1970s and only then was it "closed up". The main station called Holborn Viaduct was always a terminal station. The through station called Holborn Viaduct was the low-level station, formerly called Snow Hill; and it was through that station that the through trains from the south to Moorgate, Farringdon and wherever north of there ran. The high and low level stations of Holborn Viaduct were connected by stairs. So when the through services ceased, Holborn Viaduct did not "become a terminus station" - the terminal station was the only part of the two-level station still open. I'm pretty confident that I have the above details correct. If I don't, I apologise. It's all very complicated; and I well remember when it was announced that Snow Hill Tunnel would be reopened and the line used for long-distance through services. At last, some 120 years after the tunnel line was built, it would see the use that the London, Chatham and Dover Railway had envisaged. I remember thinking "At last!". But it's easy to think like that - much harder to implement. I hope you think, as I do, that the Thameslink service is a great success. And thanks for a very engaging style of presentation.
Martin Adams I have read (how true it is I do not know) that a number of Luftwaffe raids were attempts to breach/damage/destroy this tunnel because it was considered strategically importanf
@@ianmoseley9910 I don't know if that is true. But I can well believe it. Although there were plenty of alternative routes from the north to the south of the Thames, this was the most central and direct one. So it would have showed up as such on maps, which I imagine the Germans would have had in abundance. Thank you. An interesting idea. Maybe someone here on RUclips, better at the history of the Blitz, would be able to confirm or deny the truth of the story?
Martin, hello! i don't at all mind - thank you for a great comment and taking the time to expand on the info, most welcome! did they removed the tracks in the early 70's when the tunnel was closed i wonder, or did they literally just brick it up and abandon it? it is super complicated isn't it! and there's only so much info on the internet (e.g i couldn't find any pictures of the old Snow Hill at all), which was why i tried to make it uncomplicated, but it's hard to do! now to do Part 2, explain the CIty Widened lines, and the the Hotel and York Road Curve. which i think it even more complicated! aaaaaggh! thank you hugely for taking the time to leave a helpful and informative comment - not many people on RUclips bother to do that. Geoff.
@@geofftech2 Thank you, Geoff. I appreciate the way you look at the subject as bigger than we are. You are right about the history of the Widened Lines and the two curves you mention - even more complicated. All best wishes for your forthcoming efforts on that video. The tracks were removed through the Snow Hill Tunnel in the early 1970s, some three or four years after the line was closed. I remember seeing the old Blackfriars Railway Bridge (the upstream one, with the columns you are talking about in this video) with no tracks on it, and being able to see the northern exit/entrance to the Snow Hill from the Underground trains on the Circle and Metropolitan routes. As far as I can remember the northern entrance was not bricked up. I cannot remember if the southern entrance was bricked up. There are loads of photos of the line available on three sites that I am aware of. The largest quantity, with the most detailed information, is this one: www.disused-stations.org.uk/s/snow_hill/ Notice that there are many links on that page, especially towards the bottom, and that these lead to multiple photos of the lines across many years. Also this one, similar but with different emphases: www.abandonedstations.org.uk/Thameslink.html The other site, less specifically railway oriented but interesting for all kinds of reasons is this one: www.subbrit.org.uk/sites/snow-hill-station/ In all cases, there are many links to photos - lot of them! Best wishes!
Great video. The old viaduct to Holborn Viaduct was widely considered an eyesore as it blocked the view up the hill to St Paul's cathedral, so that second stage of the Thameslink programme where they demolished it and sent the line underground was very beneficial, creating a station on the through line to Farringdon (City Thameslink), removing an eyesore AND making BR lot of money from the land released!
The Thameslink core section has a state of the art signalling system which puts trains on a virtual conveyor belt and shifts them en bloc through the section. After a station stop, the train automatically accelerates away (without having to wait for any lights to change).
I won tickets in 1988 from the local radio station in Luton to travel on thameslink when it 1st opened right through to Brighton. It was an excellent day and had a posh lunch and trip around the pavilion. I have a photograph somewhere of St Pauls that I took as we crossed the Thames.
I was asking on uk.railway only the other day about the history of the Snow Hill Tunnel, Holborn Viaduct, Ludgate Hill and removed bridge - what a coincidence that you do a report about it. I was surprised that the bridge was removed as recently as 1985 - I'd always thought that it had gone when Ludgate Hill station closed.
Funny you mentioning this; I've just last night finished a chapter in a book (Commuter City: by David Wragg) about this route and the former stations.😁
The view over the Thames from the platforms is just mindblowing :) I was going to Luton from Elephant and Castle back in February and changed at Blackfriars.
Really nice video - great work getting so much in under five minutes! I have quite the fascination with the old Holborn Viaduct station, ever since I first saw some old pictures and VHS footage of it from the late 80s. Oh, and thank you for the link to my video! ^_^
As always, Geoff, a fascinating vlog, but there was something you didn't mention that I thought was either part of the story or, at least, relevant. The old, so called; 'Metropolitan Widened Lines'. I worked with a history/railway buff (fifty years ago!) and I remember being on a glass walled staircase, in an office building on the north side of the river and slightly east of the old Blackfriars Bridge station. He pointed out the ramp that came up out of the ground (west side of the station?) and on to the bridge. He told me that came through 'The Metropolitan Widened Lines' that you could see from the car park under Smithfield Market. I remember being astonished when he told me it was actually possible - in the early seventies - to run trains from places like Bedford and Milton Keynes, to Brighton! Who would have thought?
Great Video. When you looked down the tracks towards Blackfriars, my office is to the left on the ground floor. I wonder how many other people can say they have trains running above their office?
When I visited London in summer 2019 I noticed them and wondered what their purpose was. I took a few pictures, I figured they were provisions from back in the day if a second bridge was needed. It’s interesting to know that it actually was a bridge. Thanks for this bit of info Geoff
Interesting. I was a Borough Polytechnic in 1969 (Became South Bank Polytechnic then University). At the time we were having lectures in buildings next to the line to Holborn Viaduct. The problem was the trains travelling to and from the station drowned out the lecturers.
When the new Thames link tunnel was built the road surface of Ludgate Hill had to be raised, this in turn meant that the Traffic light controlled cross junction had to be raised, but the pavement and the shops on the junction remained at their original level. That is why there are steps up to the road level.
Geoff's knowledge of Londons railways is mind blowing! there is so much info and he knows it all! and i thought Livepool's railways with them being older would be more hard work.
Nice video. Don't forget although the passenger service through Snow Hill tunnel finished in 1929, the tracks remained in use for cross London freight trains until the early 70s I think.
In the nature of disused tube stations, it would be amazing to see a disused railways video! It's fascinating to have leftover parts of London like this!
I have commutes to Blackfriars for over three years and this is the best video. My boyfriend was getting so annoyed at all the ‘ohhhhh that’s what that was!’
I assume the proximity of the station and road bridge would negate the old pillars as supports for a Blackfriars City Heliport? Just an 'If there was no HSE' thought. Class video, Geoff,
I love your videos Paul so interesting I was walking around that area yesterday I'm going to have to follow this video again and do the walk again myself
The platforms at Blackfriars should be a huge tourist attraction really, pretty stunning views of London from on top of the Thames, I love waiting there for a train.
My son was project manager for the New Blackfriars station, so proud of his achievements. 👌💖
It fell down though
Bro...
@@dylannnnnnnnn ummm is this a reference to watch dogs leigon
Why do I feel like this is a pre-show for Secrets of Thameslink? Always been fascinated by Blackfriars because of the fact the station's a bridge and the platforms span the Thames. Interesting to learn more about it
exactly, it should be.
We all want this when the covid restrictions are lifted
Yeseses
I really want that. And secrets of the northern city line
The river Fleet flows underground all the way from Hapstead Heath and joins the Thames at Blackfriars bridge. You can hear it running through a drain just off Farringdon road too
That was an incredible amount of information in such a short video. Really interesting!
Much the opposite to some videos on RUclips that are long, boring, rambling and actually contain very little information once the original text is distilled, much like this very comment that I am writing now!
@@jonathancook4022 😂 very true.
The abuttments look both sturdy and aesthetically appealing. Were they left in place speculatively for future use, which, as you point out, has been achieved by one, to save the cost of demolition, some other reason, or a combination of these?
Post office was a good name for the underground station since there is only one in London.
He he - it was near St Martins le Grand former Post Office HQ and the famous 'Postmans' Park'
Especially if you were a tourist and looking for Post office tower
As with Borough
🤣🤣🤣🤣
It was *the* Post Office. The others were other post offices.
Great video as ever Geoff. The reason they left the old bridge supports in place was to protect the supports of the bridge upon which Blackfriars Thameslink Station now stands. If you look, you'll see that the upstream supports are squared-off, whilst the downstream ones are streamlined. The original builders made the downstream side streamlined to stop the supports from being worn away by the incoming tide and to "encourage" river traffic to bounce off if necessary.
Because the old bridge had rounded supports, the normal river current is neatly diverted around both bridges (along with any poorly piloted river traffic). If they'd demolished the old bridge supports, that would have exposed the squared-off upstream supports for the newer bridge to the river current and to river traffic.
I might be wrong, but I think at one point the proposals for extending and enlarging Blackfriars Station also included building the concourse out over the river using the old LC&DR bridge supports.
Apart from it being cheaper to leave the old bridge supports in place, they also serve to protect the current bridge from being worn away.
Interesting stuff, and all perfectly logical.👍
Thanks for this! This was exactly the answer I was looking for in the video - Why they didn't knock down the old pillars along with the bridge. Makes perfect sense now!
The bridge, having been widened, now bears longer 12-carriage platforms that straddle the river, giving fabulous views up and down the Thames. Fascinating video, Geoff. What a complex history!
Unfortunately in the process the station wnt down from five platforms to four. When Victoria is closed for work less trains can be diverted there and lwhen there is work on the core more trains are cancelled or terminated at London Bridge cutting connections
Traveled from Blackfriers last year. Without a doubt one of the best views of London from any railway station.
Last time I went back to Spain to visit my family (in February, before the Covid) I had the chance to take pictures of London's sunrise from my train at Blackfriars, in the middle of the Thames, before heading to Gatwick airport. What a view!
This video really highlights just how long it's been since i have been to London, Holborn Viaduct station and the old bridge were still in use the last time i was there! Being from south London i used to spend a lot of time in and around London back in the 70's and 80's, but i doubt i would recognise i lot of it today.
I left London for California in 1981. I had a very thorough knowledge of the roads and one way systems at the time. When I go back now I can hardly get around and wonder where landmarks I used to know have gone. This fantastic and dense video explains it to me. Great effort!
I worked in the old post office tower block for Sainsburys behind Doggett's Coat And Badge in the 1990s and I don't recognise half of the buildings there anymore.
I used to live in Victoria and I visited it ten years ago. It was unrecognisable and most of the shops I used regularly were either changed or gone completely.
Another excellent video Geoff. As a railroad bridge engineer I appreciate the mention of the “feat of engineering” associated with the removal one viaduct and excavation of the new underground crossing in two weeks. Swapping out critical structures in relatively short periods of time is one of the most interesting challenges of the profession.
Interesting stuff. Near where I live in Minneapolis there's some former bridge remains too. It took me a while to figure it out, but there's one pier still in the river and one on the east bank. I found out that it was called the lower bridge, connecting 6th Ave SE to 10th Ave S, built in 1874, it was a lightweight iron deck truss bridge, and it proved not to be strong enough for motor vehicle and rail traffic and was closed in 1937, and then demolished for scrap during WWII.
I have fond memories of standing on the bridge waiting for the train home to Brighton after a long day at work, looking eastward towards the London bridge and the tower.
The view makes it (for me) the best station in London.
It's also very easy to get from national rail platform to underground platform even during rush hour
Blackfriars is one of my favourite stations just for that astonishing view especially during sunset
And then there's Waterloo Sunset.
I love Blackfriars station. It's so impressive and has an incredible view that's better than any other station in London.
My top 5 London Termini
1- St Pancras
2- Kings Cross
3- London Bridge
4- Blackfriars
5- Paddington
Where would Liverpool Street - my personal favourite - fall on your list?
@@JeSuisRene 6th place. I like it but I don't love it. It's just decent on all fronts without excelling anywhere. It's good but I can't put it any higher
Euston is my least favourite
Just like to point out that blackfriars maybe one of the best looking stations to be at on your list, and i agree.. but during the winter months its one of the coldest... especially during cancellations!
St Pancras would be number 1 if it weren’t for the lack of toilets. The fact that there’s always a queue for the gents says it all
Marylebone is my favourite London terminus. It has so much charm and feels like stepping back in time.
The mezzanine section of Liverpool Street is a great vantage point, especially during rush hour.
Moorgate Station, on the Great Northern line, prior to being redecorated was like being in a modern history museum. The NSE-branded tiles were fantastic.
I'd be a bit concerned if Euston was anywhere higher than the bottom two of anyone's list.
I think I heard once that they didn't want to remove the old pillars as doing so might disrupt the foundations of the bridges in use
Would be interesting if they reused the pillars for a footbridge. The loading would be a fraction of what it used to be, but it would add another river crossing for cyclists and pedestrians
Luigi de Guzman But the existing Blackfriars road bridge has plenty of space for pedestrians already, and is just next to it. Would a dedicated foot bridge be nicer? Sure, but that’s a lot of money to spend for a small improvement in utility/safety - hard to imagine that it would be the most cost-effective project. I could only see it happening if they wanted to give the road bridge over to cars entirely, but I suspect the surface streets feeding the bridge don’t have enough spare capacity to take good advantage of that.
@A.L Luigi de Guzman Garden Bridge v2? :D
@A.L I was just thinking that they were begging to be turned into plinths as well, they just look like they should have *something* on top of them.
@A.L They don't look unsightly. They're interesting, intriguing, and a talking point for visitors. People like having little mysteries in life. I love seeing holdovers of previous things. Clues of a once was.
Recently Ive been trying to find out what happened to Holborn Viaduct station and got some conflicting information but your video cleared it all up and was fantastic and full of useful history. Thanks Geoff
There's a wealth of information out there. The history of London's railways(above *and* below ground) fascinates me and I've read a good bit about the subject. If I may make a suggestion: use *books* rather than the internet, at least to start with. Once you get a basic understanding of the bits that interest you, then use the internet to try and fill in the gaps. There is some absolute rubbish on the internet but some pure gold too, including the superb "Disused Stations" website ( www.disused-stations.org.uk ) and, maybe best of all - maps.nls.uk
The NLS site is waist-deep in old maps of various ages, scales, types which give *so much* information about old railways, stations, bridges etc. It takes a wee while to figure out all the features on the site, such as overlays and side-by-side maps but it's a fantastic resource. Hope something here is of some help in your research.😁
I am absolutely fascinated by the way rail is shaped in London. Lines open and close, tunnels are dug closed then reopened. It's just bizarre, to think someone who worked on the undergone as a driver 50 years ago would find so much familiar yet so much new in the same city.
Can't say the same for Wellington though, one central city station, 3 main commuter lines going out. Always has been. The only real changes are the tunnels, but they have never been boarded up. Once the line is opened, it stays open it seems. Well, except for the Rimutaka Incline, that got replaced by the tunnel... but still.
I was only there yesterday! Was telling my partner about the old Holborn Viaduct station, as I had to sign it as a guard in the early 80's but never did work a service into there. Needless to say, she was not impressed or interested.......oh well .... I enjoyed the video!
Yes Geoff!! I knew in one of your old videos you told us this would be a talking point for the future! It's going to sound cliched now as a few people have commented this, but I never knew! Thank you.
The high production value of all your videos is epic 👍🏻👍🏻🙂
I always wondered what they were and why they were just left in the middle of the Thames. Really appreciate all the time and work that goes into these videos.
Wow - that’s 7 stations in less than a mile’s stretch of railway.
shows how busy they were
It's on my morning commute and I've ALWAYS wondered - thanks Geoff
Geoff you're entertaining and informative. Please do keep these videos coming 😁
OK, my head is still spinning from information overload, but THANK YOU SO MUCH for talking about railway stations and not train stations.
This is a good report as your´s usually are. If fact I would say this is probably one of the better ones. However, there is a persistance to talk non-stop, when some of us would like the occasional pause so that we can catch up with you. Keep up the good work.
I used to use the Thameslink line a lot. When I first started using it, I would arrive at King's Cross from out of town and then have to cross the road and walk a bit to get to King's Cross Thameslink. How wonderful then, when the Thameslink platforms in the basement of St Pancras were opened and it was no longer necessary to risk my life crossing Pentonville Road. Even better when I could get a train direct from Stevenage to St Pancras and onwards to Blackfriars. The extended Blackfriars station is a marvel - a great improvement on how it used to be. I have often looked at the redundant pillars and wondered what had happened to the London Chatham and Dover Railway bridge that they used to support. Now I know!
Thanks, Geoff. You've provided the clue to a mystery I've been trying to solve on and off for years. Back in the 1960s, my grandmother pointed out the brick wall of the old St Paul's Station to me. What I couldn't remember is why. But as she was working for Ward, Lock and Co. in Salisbury Square, the light has dawned the she must have commuted up from her home in Charlton, got out of the train at St Paul's and walked to Salisbury Square. This would have been in the early 1920s, so almost a century ago.
The views down the Thames from the new Blackfriars station platforms on the bridge are spectacular - its the best station that I’ve ever used.
Please more history videos!! Maybe one on broad street to Watford?
When I began working in the City, mid-60s, one colleague commuted by steam-hauled train from Hemel Hempstead to Broad Street. It was inconvenient for him when the service was re-routed to Euston.
Barry Gower yeah it must’ve been that’s so inconvenient
Please do more of these railway history things
I got a river bus past the old supports yesterday and wondered why they were there. Now I know! Thanks for an informative video.
If you want to see what the old bridge looked like here's a link from Thames News ruclips.net/video/cF76mon6V78/видео.html
Such a different image to even 40 years ago... Extremely interesting.
Please do Secrets of Thameslink!
Another great an informative video by Geoff. In the mid to late 1960's I traveled from Wimbledon to Holborn Viaduct every day. One day we were stuck on the south side of Blackfriars station. After about 20 minutes the train went over the bridge avoiding Blackfriars station and straight into Holborn Viaduct. A rare treat! A train had broken down in what was then Platform 5!
I’ve been there and have always wondered that. Thanks for doing this. :)
I was at Blackfriars station just 3 hours ago and wondered why there was massive red supports, get back to Brighton and Geoff answers my question 😂 thanking you
Hey Geoff
Great video. Just thought I’d comment as I actually worked on the 2012 upgrade. I was part of the team that developed and carried out the method of deconstructing the existing red columns and extending the adjacent bridge to sit on top of it. Great project to be a part of.
Some of the things we encountered during the works (old newspapers, spy glasses etc) made you really appreciate the history.
Keep the videos coming.
Excellent. Quite a lot of complex transport history covered and showing where the old stations were built is an eye opener.
Please keep safe and healthy, Geoff. We cannot afford to lose you. Nice video which i enjoyed.
Love the amount of history packed into this one stretch of railway!
Hey Geoff,
been there 8 times in the last few years and everytime I was wondering what these red pillars are about.
Thank you for this wonderful short video. Really interesting und well done!
Cheers from Vienna
Excellent video. You’re well-informed, articulate and interesting to listen to.
Thank you, Geoff. A very good video story, and a good explanation of why the bridge piers are still there. Thank you.
I hope you don't mind some comments from someone who is an historian, and believes that accuracy with detail matters. There are a couple of things in the commentary that are potentially misleading. At around 1.52 you say "After the Snow Hill station renaming the tunnels through to Farringdon were no longer used and closed up"; and the way this is presented makes it appear as if all that happened in or around 1929. The passenger service through Snow Hill tunnel to Farringdon and Moorgate ceased in 1916; but the tunnel remained in use for freight until the late 1960s. Indeed, I remember standing on the South Bank in 1966, while the Queen Elizabeth Hall was being built, and seeing a freight train cross Blackfriars Bridge to enter the Snow Hill tunnel.
The tunnel was completely abandoned in the early 1970s and only then was it "closed up".
The main station called Holborn Viaduct was always a terminal station. The through station called Holborn Viaduct was the low-level station, formerly called Snow Hill; and it was through that station that the through trains from the south to Moorgate, Farringdon and wherever north of there ran. The high and low level stations of Holborn Viaduct were connected by stairs. So when the through services ceased, Holborn Viaduct did not "become a terminus station" - the terminal station was the only part of the two-level station still open.
I'm pretty confident that I have the above details correct. If I don't, I apologise.
It's all very complicated; and I well remember when it was announced that Snow Hill Tunnel would be reopened and the line used for long-distance through services. At last, some 120 years after the tunnel line was built, it would see the use that the London, Chatham and Dover Railway had envisaged. I remember thinking "At last!". But it's easy to think like that - much harder to implement. I hope you think, as I do, that the Thameslink service is a great success.
And thanks for a very engaging style of presentation.
Martin Adams I have read (how true it is I do not know) that a number of Luftwaffe raids were attempts to breach/damage/destroy this tunnel because it was considered strategically importanf
@@ianmoseley9910 I don't know if that is true. But I can well believe it. Although there were plenty of alternative routes from the north to the south of the Thames, this was the most central and direct one. So it would have showed up as such on maps, which I imagine the Germans would have had in abundance.
Thank you. An interesting idea.
Maybe someone here on RUclips, better at the history of the Blitz, would be able to confirm or deny the truth of the story?
Martin,
hello! i don't at all mind - thank you for a great comment and taking the time to expand on the info, most welcome! did they removed the tracks in the early 70's when the tunnel was closed i wonder, or did they literally just brick it up and abandon it?
it is super complicated isn't it! and there's only so much info on the internet (e.g i couldn't find any pictures of the old Snow Hill at all), which was why i tried to make it uncomplicated, but it's hard to do!
now to do Part 2, explain the CIty Widened lines, and the the Hotel and York Road Curve. which i think it even more complicated! aaaaaggh!
thank you hugely for taking the time to leave a helpful and informative comment - not many people on RUclips bother to do that.
Geoff.
@@geofftech2 Thank you, Geoff. I appreciate the way you look at the subject as bigger than we are. You are right about the history of the Widened Lines and the two curves you mention - even more complicated. All best wishes for your forthcoming efforts on that video.
The tracks were removed through the Snow Hill Tunnel in the early 1970s, some three or four years after the line was closed. I remember seeing the old Blackfriars Railway Bridge (the upstream one, with the columns you are talking about in this video) with no tracks on it, and being able to see the northern exit/entrance to the Snow Hill from the Underground trains on the Circle and Metropolitan routes. As far as I can remember the northern entrance was not bricked up. I cannot remember if the southern entrance was bricked up.
There are loads of photos of the line available on three sites that I am aware of. The largest quantity, with the most detailed information, is this one: www.disused-stations.org.uk/s/snow_hill/ Notice that there are many links on that page, especially towards the bottom, and that these lead to multiple photos of the lines across many years.
Also this one, similar but with different emphases: www.abandonedstations.org.uk/Thameslink.html
The other site, less specifically railway oriented but interesting for all kinds of reasons is this one: www.subbrit.org.uk/sites/snow-hill-station/
In all cases, there are many links to photos - lot of them!
Best wishes!
Great video. The old viaduct to Holborn Viaduct was widely considered an eyesore as it blocked the view up the hill to St Paul's cathedral, so that second stage of the Thameslink programme where they demolished it and sent the line underground was very beneficial, creating a station on the through line to Farringdon (City Thameslink), removing an eyesore AND making BR lot of money from the land released!
Great video! Thanks for making videos for all these years. I find the tube fascinating
Watched lots of your videos Geoff. Always so interesting. Thanks and keep it up
I moved to Kent in 1984 and vaguely remember the work being done when commuting but never knew the history. Well explained.
Fascinating documentary you must have put a lot of research into it. Many thanks really enjoyed it.
The Thameslink core section has a state of the art signalling system which puts trains on a virtual conveyor belt and shifts them en bloc through the section. After a station stop, the train automatically accelerates away (without having to wait for any lights to change).
Brilliant video! I knew a little about the old bridge but now I’ve got all the info!
Fascinating info! Tx for posting.
I love this channel because it gives so much information about Britain's railways
Why does "Black friars street" have a space in it and "blackfriars station" doesn't?
Legend mate. Hope to see your videos again soon.
@@davidstockwell7874 thanks mate
@@Bungle2010 Black Friars Lane - runs alongside the railway north of the station on the east side.
Similar reasons to the South Mimms / North Mymms quandary? (a guess... I have nothing to back that up).
@@norbitonflyer5625 thanks, I used to work in Central London and forgot the suffix of the name
I won tickets in 1988 from the local radio station in Luton to travel on thameslink when it 1st opened right through to Brighton. It was an excellent day and had a posh lunch and trip around the pavilion.
I have a photograph somewhere of St Pauls that I took as we crossed the Thames.
Have tried to research this topic before, but this was a good watch
I was asking on uk.railway only the other day about the history of the Snow Hill Tunnel, Holborn Viaduct, Ludgate Hill and removed bridge - what a coincidence that you do a report about it. I was surprised that the bridge was removed as recently as 1985 - I'd always thought that it had gone when Ludgate Hill station closed.
Funny you mentioning this; I've just last night finished a chapter in a book (Commuter City: by David Wragg) about this route and the former stations.😁
The view over the Thames from the platforms is just mindblowing :) I was going to Luton from Elephant and Castle back in February and changed at Blackfriars.
Really nice video - great work getting so much in under five minutes! I have quite the fascination with the old Holborn Viaduct station, ever since I first saw some old pictures and VHS footage of it from the late 80s.
Oh, and thank you for the link to my video! ^_^
AJ, hello mate! aah, you're welcome. you've got a whole bunch of good stuff on your channel, love what you do. happy to send some clicks your way!
As always, Geoff, a fascinating vlog, but there was something you didn't mention that I thought was either part of the story or, at least, relevant. The old, so called; 'Metropolitan Widened Lines'. I worked with a history/railway buff (fifty years ago!) and I remember being on a glass walled staircase, in an office building on the north side of the river and slightly east of the old Blackfriars Bridge station. He pointed out the ramp that came up out of the ground (west side of the station?) and on to the bridge.
He told me that came through 'The Metropolitan Widened Lines' that you could see from the car park under Smithfield Market. I remember being astonished when he told me it was actually possible - in the early seventies - to run trains from places like Bedford and Milton Keynes, to Brighton! Who would have thought?
that's coming up in a separate (Part 2?) video, Roger! oh yes ...
I love it when you make videos like this
Complex history is such a short video...👍
Great work as ever.
Cheers John B
Do a secrets of Thameslink video
Great Video. When you looked down the tracks towards Blackfriars, my office is to the left on the ground floor. I wonder how many other people can say they have trains running above their office?
1:48 Anyone else sees the security camera dangling above the sign?
I came here looking to see if anyone else had made this comment. Winning =)
Brilliant. I love when you do histories like this. More of them please. Stay safe and healthy
Excellent..thanks Geoff, love your videos
Really enjoyed this, thanks Geoff. Would love more videos on closed or modified London railway stations.
I travelled to City Thameslink for 8 years. Nice to see it again and have a bit of history behind it.
Short and sweet and very informative as usual Geoff
I don't live in London and I don't particularly care much about trains ... but heck do I love watching your videos!
Thanks Geoff always look forward to your informative videos. Cheers. 👍👍
Didn’t realise the old bridge was removed so recently! Really interesting stuff, given how often I use or pass through Blackfriars.
Brilliant video packed with information.
Thanks again Geoff for yet another well-made, informative video. Well done!
Superb insight, thanks Geoff!
Excellent history video! Thanks!
Thanks Geoff. I commute between Flitwick and City Thameslink and/or Blackfriars and this information was very interesting.
Geoff your a font of knowledge on our railways 👍🏻 Always enjoy your videos cheers Stevie 😎
When I visited London in summer 2019 I noticed them and wondered what their purpose was. I took a few pictures, I figured they were provisions from back in the day if a second bridge was needed. It’s interesting to know that it actually was a bridge. Thanks for this bit of info Geoff
Nice stuff as always!!
Interesting. I was a Borough Polytechnic in 1969 (Became South Bank Polytechnic then University). At the time we were having lectures in buildings next to the line to Holborn Viaduct. The problem was the trains travelling to and from the station drowned out the lecturers.
I think people who make such esoteric history interesting, to be quite incredible really.
I have always wondered what the red pilliars were, thank you!
When the new Thames link tunnel was built the road surface of Ludgate Hill had to be raised, this in turn meant that the Traffic light controlled cross junction had to be raised, but the pavement and the shops on the junction remained at their original level. That is why there are steps up to the road level.
Brilliant Video Geoff
Geoff's knowledge of Londons railways is mind blowing! there is so much info and he knows it all! and i thought Livepool's railways with them being older would be more hard work.
Nice video. Don't forget although the passenger service through Snow Hill tunnel finished in 1929, the tracks remained in use for cross London freight trains until the early 70s I think.
That's a lot of glass & steel - looks really clean and modern!
In the nature of disused tube stations, it would be amazing to see a disused railways video! It's fascinating to have leftover parts of London like this!
I have commutes to Blackfriars for over three years and this is the best video. My boyfriend was getting so annoyed at all the ‘ohhhhh that’s what that was!’
Such an excellent explanation. Wonderful. Aarre Peltomaa
LOVE YOUR VIDS!!! makes me miss London so much.
Thanks Geoff. I have oft walked past these columns and wondered what their history was....
I assume the proximity of the station and road bridge would negate the old pillars as supports for a Blackfriars City Heliport? Just an 'If there was no HSE' thought. Class video, Geoff,
Great one!
Very great information about the railway and stations
I love your videos Paul so interesting I was walking around that area yesterday I'm going to have to follow this video again and do the walk again myself
1:46 love the dangling security cam :D
The platforms at Blackfriars should be a huge tourist attraction really, pretty stunning views of London from on top of the Thames, I love waiting there for a train.