I was considering upgrading my Warden to the Guardian but I have learned my lesson with CIG. I will wait until the new wears off and they have then nurfed the Guardian to the point its near useless before I make a choice to upgrade. If in fact it turns out to be an upgrade at all!
To me it seems well balanced within the heavy fighter category, so I don't think it's going to get nerfed. The biggest advantage it seems to have is it strafes better than the others, but is still relatively slow compared to medium and light tuned fighters.
@@kentyannayon3741 "To me it seems well balanced within the heavy fighter category, so I don't think it's going to get nerfed" LOL yeah tell that to CIG, by now it should be obvious they're not doing this whole "release it and sell it then nerf it later" for balance reasons, the question is not whether it will get nerfed but what nerf will it receive ? I bet a nerf to its hp up to 30% is what will happen, with perhaps a bigger nerf to the QI compared to the base so as to make the QI less of an "obvious choice" (officially)
gotta ask, why do you upgrade the Guardian dps wise and not the vangaurd ??? When i look at both upgraded i look at an vangaurd with 2964dps 736 burst missile 96941dmg shield 12340hp 251hps VS the guardian 2714dps 674burst missile 26542dmg shield 6170hp 251hps... Points you did not really adress. So when making flybys the 12k shield vs 6k will be importent both are using energy weapons. The missile payload is like 3,5 times bigger on the vangaurd allso so there is that too the vangaurd got a turret which can provide 1086dps and 270 burst more... this might become relevent if it can be slaved to pilot in furture, but its allways nice if you got an nps crew or friend with you. the vanguard allso supports 2 crew the vanguard will get a pass/fix to gold standard. and when fights in atmosphere it will have the advantage (if CIG does not fuck that up) i do like the guardian too, but please be fair in your comparison.
100% agree. With this ship i started thinking about utility with "heavy fighters": heavies are not maneuverables when fighting compare to lights or mediums. So heavies seem more oriented about targeting big ships (or against fighters with manned turret for heavy with turrets). Thinking about the guardian, I am lost because it does not fit any good point well except for solo pve. About fighting big shipe Ares, or bomber are a better choice. When fighting others fighters a two man heavy ship with turret seem better. The guardian could fit if fighting other heavy ? Except a really nice looking ship with interior for solo...I am not convinced about this ship. Let's wait to see how meta will change with future gameplay and balance changes.
Consider that the Vanguard series has a large rear area. If you take it out and discover cargo loot, you can stuff 1 and 2 SCU containers for up to 4 SCU into the back.
not really as it blocks the pilot access since there's only one way in, on that note you can completely fill the guardian and still use it, what you said is the exact opposite of what realistically happens
11:59 Hydrogen fuel also depends a lot on the burn rate of the thrusters, keep that in mind. Just saying number A is bigger than number B this number A is better, does not have to be true.
I've been chaining faction missions in Pyro with the Sentinel, it's solid. The lower signature from default stealth gear has been nice for avoiding base defenses and hostile players. That guardian 30% sig penalty worries me, a 70k EM signature in nav is higher than a polaris. I'm waiting to hear detailed pvp reviews of the QI before considering that option.
You said Harbringer is better because of 2 entrances and external storage and weapons locker. The Guardian has the same - storage and rack in the wing interiors and you can exit out the cockpit directly.
How easy are those Guardian arms to shoot off? I know it has a lot of hull HP but is a decent amount distributed to the arms. The reason I ask this is because the external storage is located there and with its low shielding I want to know that my stuff is going to be reasonably safe.
@@ZyvhurStudios Thanks. Good to hear. I'm seriously considering buying one and just trying to get as much info as I can before committing the money. Cheers and Merry Christmas !!
I mainly play solo and my dream is to see a Drake heavy long range solo fighter, with an interior on the level of a Cutter Rambler and room for a 2 scu cargo box or a small hoverbike. That would be the only ship I need.
FYI, the Vanguard series is yet to add the nacelles, flight controls. Important to elliptical fighting circles, and vectoring. The two ships will be quite equal on their own terms. IMO
I don't think the vanguard main engines will ever move like the guardians, Its designed differently... but that's ok because I think CIG wants to give us the power to configure things like that with crafting higher tier ships parts
I am contemplating getting guardian. I am mostly a bunker fps person. That's why I have starlancer tac and max. My next loop is pve ship bounty. Guardian kinda fills both loop. I can have a reliable fighter that can carry some loot for quick bunker raids then hunt pve enemy ships. I rarely do pvp but when I do I'd rather take sabre/firebird or eclipse.
I just don't understand why the Guardian has so much more heath than the Vanguard, Considering it's reputation and larger size shouldn't it have superior hull hp?
Honestly, I wouldn't read into it too much. CIG is doing a lot of tweaking and we don't have armor in yet. Based on its description of ruggedness, the Vanguard should be the more durable craft in the end - particularly where it isn't as maneuverable.
It's such a toss up, both ships are great! I feel like if I were you, the crew size of 1 would put it over the top compared to the Vanguard. Even if it doesn't have the range of the Vanguard at the end of the day, you can take it with you in your Polaris, so that is less of a factor.
The Qi to the Sentinel should be good, The Vanguard size 2s can be changed out for any combo you might want from 4 size2 distortion repeaters, to laser repeaters that do 402 each so 1608 damage and pop a attrition5 for the size 5 mount and in the harbinger you also have size 5 torpedoes and a size 3 top gun turret. The warden and sentinel gun to it are size 2. The harbinger has more armor, but less handling than all the other vanguards. The warden is next in handling and the sentinel handles the best, but has the least hit points. Two size 2 shields double the amount of shield HP for the Vanguard and allow your shields to come back twice as fast. Due to two versus one. Plus a redundancy feature in case one shield generator is destroyed. The Vanguard line allows you to stay on the pulse and ride right up the ramp and into the ship where you can disembark the pulse quite easily. Both the guardian and the Vanguard can take SCU boxes. 1 to 2 comfortably. People in other videos have been saying you can put a pulse in the guardian. Technically you can, but it doesn’t fit very well it arcs and sparks. Sometimes flops around. So in my book, I don’t really count the guardian as being able to take a pulse cleanly. I feel my choice may just end up being both the warden or harbinger for the Vanguard line and the QI guardian due to its electronic warfare. On the Vanguard pick It’s really your preference. Haul HP, torpedoes and size 3, Turret Gunner. Or a bit cheaper, better handling, a little quicker but not faster. Size 2 turret. And this is just aesthetics, but I really don’t like the red lights in the guardian. I enjoy the interior more in the Vanguard. Guardians side, I like the external compartments and two exit points. I could’ve done with one to two less doors in the guardian. Maybe just drop the cockpit door. But the lightning does suck. They both look awesome.
The vanguard harbinger i perfer over the guardian, throw an ominsky 5 and laser cannons for the 2s (they really do damage compared to 3s) with almost equal projectile speed. Vs a m7a making have a 2nd pip lead.. the guardian i feel is missing out in having 1 shield and 2 small power plants. The guardian needs 2 shields, 1 size 2 power plant and prob a 2nd cooler to atleast be closer on par with other heavy fighters..
An important difference I noticed is the superior strafing capabilities of the Guardian. It has a very powerful and fast strafe compared to the Vanguard and most other ships.
Yes so in the Q and A CIG said it has a spherical thrust pattern because it has gimbaled main thrusters while the vanguard had fixed main thrusters so it has the egg shaped thrust pattern
I as well would be interested in an heavy fighter. Since i an only interesting in escorting orgmates the Mirai Guardian is more then sufficient and more futuristic then the vanguard series. As always nice video!
I honestly cant pick one over the other, i had my Warden/Harbinger since concept and its my most used fighter, on the other hand i love the Guardian, im just going to keep them all.
good video, tho i think these are two different ship uses, were the Vangard harbinger is mainly a balistic multi able ship were the guardian is a more single living on board heavy fighter, its kind of between the Ares and Vangard ships as far as what they were going for, but the cutty blue vs the guardian QI the QI has 500 m more but now they need to ad a emp to it to make compete with the Scorpius variant.
Yeah, another ship didn't think about was the MR, it won't be nearly as maneuverable but I think a lot of people who want a QED ship will go for that when it comes out since its cheaper
It's pretty fragile. I tested out the QI in a few missions and love a lot about it, but having my engines and QT drive disabled after taking some turret fire was ridiculous.
Different warfare functions. The Guardian series is localised heavy defence fighters, whereas the Vanguard series are long-range heavy strike fighters with dual redundancies built-in. The Vanguards were always meant to be less manoeuvrable and more boom and zoom with the capacity to limp home when damaged
yup thats def what i'd put in my localized fighter is a full high rise apartment, full kitchen, a bathroom and extended mission deep space interdiction capability....................................................
@artsolano6762 but you are missing the point.while you shoot down the bounty , the other 2 or 3 ships may attack you . A couple of hits here and there is enough to back off to station for repairs . I don't think the size difference will compensate the durability
@@paranikumarlpk It will depend on situational awareness and skill. The Guardiian has way more Gs for strafing, making it easier to avoid fire IF you regularly change your vector. That combined with being smaller, it should be a lot more survivable, and should have a much easier time disengaging when shields run out. But this is theory, I have not flown either ship yet, so I can only go off of on-paper stats.
For the part of the video where you get to Erkul dark mode is your friend. Totally flashbanging my eyes lol.
Oh yeah great reminder! lol
I was considering upgrading my Warden to the Guardian but I have learned my lesson with CIG. I will wait until the new wears off and they have then nurfed the Guardian to the point its near useless before I make a choice to upgrade. If in fact it turns out to be an upgrade at all!
To me it seems well balanced within the heavy fighter category, so I don't think it's going to get nerfed. The biggest advantage it seems to have is it strafes better than the others, but is still relatively slow compared to medium and light tuned fighters.
@@kentyannayon3741 "To me it seems well balanced within the heavy fighter category, so I don't think it's going to get nerfed"
LOL yeah tell that to CIG, by now it should be obvious they're not doing this whole "release it and sell it then nerf it later" for balance reasons, the question is not whether it will get nerfed but what nerf will it receive ? I bet a nerf to its hp up to 30% is what will happen, with perhaps a bigger nerf to the QI compared to the base so as to make the QI less of an "obvious choice" (officially)
i usually just buy the upgrade token and hold on to it or melt it for buy back later. but yeah i definitely see this getting jacked up on nerfs
i cant really see a reason for it to be nerfed, Def not hp, its hull is only like 8k hp and the other like 60k is in the wings.
@@liamseven1604 wings will get nerfed then
gotta ask, why do you upgrade the Guardian dps wise and not the vangaurd ??? When i look at both upgraded i look at an vangaurd with 2964dps 736 burst missile 96941dmg shield 12340hp 251hps VS the guardian 2714dps 674burst missile 26542dmg shield 6170hp 251hps...
Points you did not really adress.
So when making flybys the 12k shield vs 6k will be importent both are using energy weapons.
The missile payload is like 3,5 times bigger on the vangaurd allso so there is that too
the vangaurd got a turret which can provide 1086dps and 270 burst more... this might become relevent if it can be slaved to pilot in furture, but its allways nice if you got an nps crew or friend with you.
the vanguard allso supports 2 crew
the vanguard will get a pass/fix to gold standard.
and when fights in atmosphere it will have the advantage (if CIG does not fuck that up)
i do like the guardian too, but please be fair in your comparison.
but I did go over shields, missiles, the turret, crew, and gold standard differences
100% agree. With this ship i started thinking about utility with "heavy fighters": heavies are not maneuverables when fighting compare to lights or mediums. So heavies seem more oriented about targeting big ships (or against fighters with manned turret for heavy with turrets). Thinking about the guardian, I am lost because it does not fit any good point well except for solo pve. About fighting big shipe Ares, or bomber are a better choice. When fighting others fighters a two man heavy ship with turret seem better. The guardian could fit if fighting other heavy ? Except a really nice looking ship with interior for solo...I am not convinced about this ship. Let's wait to see how meta will change with future gameplay and balance changes.
I just upgraded my mantis to the Guardian QI. Always wanted to be a bounty hunter. :D
Thanks for the vid!
But you know that the jammer range is a lot smaller in the qi compared to the mantis?
1:03 I see. You want us to buy both! Smart, very smart! :D
LOL
Strange no one is talking about how they halved the number of Vangard components just before the Guardian came out isn’t it?
That's why I'm so glad DPS calc has version control so we can see what it is in the last patch and compare
FeelsRedeemerMan, they just did the same with the Paladin.
No they didn't they took away 1 power plant because it was redundant.
I was surprised they didn't save that default QI paint for the Concierges paint, but glad they didn't. It's a good looking ship!
Me too, it looks so aggressive in all black
Consider that the Vanguard series has a large rear area. If you take it out and discover cargo loot, you can stuff 1 and 2 SCU containers for up to 4 SCU into the back.
not really as it blocks the pilot access since there's only one way in, on that note you can completely fill the guardian and still use it, what you said is the exact opposite of what realistically happens
You can do the same in the Guardian, but easier because it has a front entrance.
@Stormyy6310 Not familiar with the Guardian however if you place the SCU containers to the side yes you can easily place 4 SCU into the Vanguard.
I just saw a captain foxy vid where he puts a 2 scu box and a pulse in there lol his vids are so good!
@@ZyvhurStudios I just did a bounty in pyro, looted 2 S2 and 2S3 repeaters and put them in the harbinger with no problem
got both. the concierge deal was pretty good; just not sure on the interdictor version, with its 3x shorter range than the Mantis (4k vs 12k).
11:59
Hydrogen fuel also depends a lot on the burn rate of the thrusters, keep that in mind. Just saying number A is bigger than number B this number A is better, does not have to be true.
Why aren’t you comparing to the Warden? It has different stats.
yeah that would have been a good comparison
I've been chaining faction missions in Pyro with the Sentinel, it's solid. The lower signature from default stealth gear has been nice for avoiding base defenses and hostile players. That guardian 30% sig penalty worries me, a 70k EM signature in nav is higher than a polaris. I'm waiting to hear detailed pvp reviews of the QI before considering that option.
I would worry about it too much I think there will still be some balance changes with a ton of things in 4.0
They should make a police interceptor variant of the guardian like the cutlass blue that would be awesome
Yeah that would be awsome!
You said Harbringer is better because of 2 entrances and external storage and weapons locker. The Guardian has the same - storage and rack in the wing interiors and you can exit out the cockpit directly.
Re-listen to the video. It is the Guardian that he thinks is better due to 2nd exit and external storage rack.
How easy are those Guardian arms to shoot off? I know it has a lot of hull HP but is a decent amount distributed to the arms. The reason I ask this is because the external storage is located there and with its low shielding I want to know that my stuff is going to be reasonably safe.
Its pretty sturdy I would say as I've bumped into stuff at low speeds without taking physical damage
@@ZyvhurStudios Thanks. Good to hear. I'm seriously considering buying one and just trying to get as much info as I can before committing the money. Cheers and Merry Christmas !!
I mainly play solo and my dream is to see a Drake heavy long range solo fighter, with an interior on the level of a Cutter Rambler and room for a 2 scu cargo box or a small hoverbike. That would be the only ship I need.
Yes Drake needs a heavy fighter like that!
where do they sell the guardian? I would like to test fly that ship and hurston and area 18 do not have it for sale.
Pledge store, won't be in game for purchase for about 3 months
@@christophercurtis9392 ah ok, thanks
@@christophercurtis9392 6 months* but yeah that's about right
I will most likely be added to in game shops in the next patch cycle
FYI, the Vanguard series is yet to add the nacelles, flight controls. Important to elliptical fighting circles, and vectoring. The two ships will be quite equal on their own terms. IMO
I don't think the vanguard main engines will ever move like the guardians, Its designed differently... but that's ok because I think CIG wants to give us the power to configure things like that with crafting higher tier ships parts
I am contemplating getting guardian. I am mostly a bunker fps person. That's why I have starlancer tac and max. My next loop is pve ship bounty. Guardian kinda fills both loop. I can have a reliable fighter that can carry some loot for quick bunker raids then hunt pve enemy ships. I rarely do pvp but when I do I'd rather take sabre/firebird or eclipse.
We need a post guardian nerf video too, we know CIG will do it 😢
Where are the racks and storage on the exterior?
The lower wings on the guardian, portside is the rack, starboard side is the storage
@CatalystDestiny That's Awesome.
I just don't understand why the Guardian has so much more heath than the Vanguard, Considering it's reputation and larger size shouldn't it have superior hull hp?
Honestly, I wouldn't read into it too much. CIG is doing a lot of tweaking and we don't have armor in yet. Based on its description of ruggedness, the Vanguard should be the more durable craft in the end - particularly where it isn't as maneuverable.
Most if those HP goes in the panels on the side, so are quite useless.
The fact that the Guardian ha a single shield also matters, until the nerf
Thanks for the comparison.
It's such a toss up, both ships are great! I feel like if I were you, the crew size of 1 would put it over the top compared to the Vanguard. Even if it doesn't have the range of the Vanguard at the end of the day, you can take it with you in your Polaris, so that is less of a factor.
Yeah, the Polaris combo extends the usability, it will be interesting to see when CIG tells us more about how refueling works from these ship hangers
@@ZyvhurStudios Yeah, I'm really curious how they plan on handing that. Polaris is really set up well with those cargo elevators for spare parts, etc.
The Qi to the Sentinel should be good, The Vanguard size 2s can be changed out for any combo you might want from 4 size2 distortion repeaters, to laser repeaters that do 402 each so 1608 damage and pop a attrition5 for the size 5 mount and in the harbinger you also have size 5 torpedoes and a size 3 top gun turret. The warden and sentinel gun to it are size 2. The harbinger has more armor, but less handling than all the other vanguards. The warden is next in handling and the sentinel handles the best, but has the least hit points. Two size 2 shields double the amount of shield HP for the Vanguard and allow your shields to come back twice as fast. Due to two versus one. Plus a redundancy feature in case one shield generator is destroyed. The Vanguard line allows you to stay on the pulse and ride right up the ramp and into the ship where you can disembark the pulse quite easily. Both the guardian and the Vanguard can take SCU boxes. 1 to 2 comfortably. People in other videos have been saying you can put a pulse in the guardian. Technically you can, but it doesn’t fit very well it arcs and sparks. Sometimes flops around. So in my book, I don’t really count the guardian as being able to take a pulse cleanly.
I feel my choice may just end up being both the warden or harbinger for the Vanguard line and the QI guardian due to its electronic warfare. On the Vanguard pick It’s really your preference. Haul HP, torpedoes and size 3, Turret Gunner. Or a bit cheaper, better handling, a little quicker but not faster. Size 2 turret. And this is just aesthetics, but I really don’t like the red lights in the guardian. I enjoy the interior more in the Vanguard. Guardians side, I like the external compartments and two exit points. I could’ve done with one to two less doors in the guardian. Maybe just drop the cockpit door. But the lightning does suck. They both look awesome.
The vanguard harbinger i perfer over the guardian, throw an ominsky 5 and laser cannons for the 2s (they really do damage compared to 3s) with almost equal projectile speed. Vs a m7a making have a 2nd pip lead.. the guardian i feel is missing out in having 1 shield and 2 small power plants. The guardian needs 2 shields, 1 size 2 power plant and prob a 2nd cooler to atleast be closer on par with other heavy fighters..
An important difference I noticed is the superior strafing capabilities of the Guardian. It has a very powerful and fast strafe compared to the Vanguard and most other ships.
Yes so in the Q and A CIG said it has a spherical thrust pattern because it has gimbaled main thrusters while the vanguard had fixed main thrusters so it has the egg shaped thrust pattern
@@ZyvhurStudios Sounds about right ;)
This will replace my vanguard. I’ll get the base and a CCU to the QI. I might earn the QI in game.
I as well would be interested in an heavy fighter. Since i an only interesting in escorting orgmates the Mirai Guardian is more then sufficient and more futuristic then the vanguard series.
As always nice video!
I honestly cant pick one over the other, i had my Warden/Harbinger since concept and its my most used fighter, on the other hand i love the Guardian, im just going to keep them all.
On the insides of the front lower arms, captin foxy and olli show it in their videos
good video, tho i think these are two different ship uses, were the Vangard harbinger is mainly a balistic multi able ship were the guardian is a more single living on board heavy fighter, its kind of between the Ares and Vangard ships as far as what they were going for, but the cutty blue vs the guardian QI the QI has 500 m more but now they need to ad a emp to it to make compete with the Scorpius variant.
Yeah, another ship didn't think about was the MR, it won't be nearly as maneuverable but I think a lot of people who want a QED ship will go for that when it comes out since its cheaper
Vanguard is just awesome...nothin else to say
It's pretty fragile. I tested out the QI in a few missions and love a lot about it, but having my engines and QT drive disabled after taking some turret fire was ridiculous.
For PVE Vang Harbinger is miles better than Guardian. I have both.
Different warfare functions. The Guardian series is localised heavy defence fighters, whereas the Vanguard series are long-range heavy strike fighters with dual redundancies built-in. The Vanguards were always meant to be less manoeuvrable and more boom and zoom with the capacity to limp home when damaged
That's a great way to put it, with the guardian fitting in the Polaris that play style makes a lot of sense
yup thats def what i'd put in my localized fighter is a full high rise apartment, full kitchen, a bathroom and extended mission deep space interdiction capability....................................................
Its too fragile to handle hrts/vhrts where it needs to excel . So its not a best option comparing the vanguards tbh
It looks like it wont be as durable as the Vanguard but your smaller and more agile.
@artsolano6762 but you are missing the point.while you shoot down the bounty , the other 2 or 3 ships may attack you . A couple of hits here and there is enough to back off to station for repairs . I don't think the size difference will compensate the durability
@@paranikumarlpk It will depend on situational awareness and skill. The Guardiian has way more Gs for strafing, making it easier to avoid fire IF you regularly change your vector. That combined with being smaller, it should be a lot more survivable, and should have a much easier time disengaging when shields run out. But this is theory, I have not flown either ship yet, so I can only go off of on-paper stats.
@@paranikumarlpk But doesn't the guardian have more hp? How is it more fragile? *genuine question btw*
You should train an AI to voiceover your script so that we don't have to listen to your lisp 😒