Thank you! Thank you! Thank you Leon! As a FOH engineer I’m constantly fighting with guitar players and their modelers. Just because you have access to 1000 effects doesn’t mean you have to use them all at once. Less is sometimes more and using the same cabinet IR helps us out front so much. Thanks for posting.
@@LeonTodd absolutely! I’m finding that I’m often forced to talk to players about delay and reverb more than anything. It’s almost always way too much. I will ask them to dial them way down so they can sit in the mix better. I love those FX as much as anyone but when it’s stepping on other things in the mix there’s a problem. It’s funny because once I explain to them that it’s either dial them back so they can be more present in the mix or I turn them down they will inevitably fix it since no guitar player ever wants to be buried in the mix. Haha. Love your channel man. You’re the reason I’m a proud FM9 user today!
@toddbochenko963 so true! I just did this last Sunday at church! Lowered my reverbs mix to 10% made such a huge difference! Specially in the venue we meet at, there's enough Reverb in the room! So I was able to hear the guitar AC20 amp sound way better in the whole mix!
@@musicman4christjesus right? It made a ton of difference out front didn’t it? Made the guitar sit better in the mix without stepping on anything else.
@@toddbochenko963 Reverb and delay are the guitarists opium, and like opium addicts they are freaking annoying when spun up. I tend to use both at very low amounts, just to fill it out a bit and smooth it up. Same for chorus, I loved the 90's too but damn guys! So many Todds around here, hi from another one.
Well, a lot of us don't realize this one thing. People have successfully toured with one amp and one speaker for decades. Keeping the guitar sound uniform across the song actually benefited it according to my ears.
I once mixed a band live and the guy, really good player, was using some line 6 thing and changed patches for every song, and obviously spent a ton of time working the details out. It was a disaster to mix. It would take at least a minute into each song to get the guitar to fit again. It was an eye opener for me, and I think your pretty simple solution is a great idea. Great video, great tones, and really cool tune.
I'm a Helix user; with few exceptions, I use the same amp, cab, mic, and mic placement in a patch, then use snapshots to change amp settings. If there are multiple amp channel models, I'll use those in different snapshots, with the same cab, mic and mic placement. I dial in the sound for my main rhythm tone first; then use that same cab, mic and mic placement for clean, lead; and rarely other variation, by changing the settings on the amp block / changing the amp block to a different amp block usually representing a different amp channel. For example, I can use a jumpered plexi amp block, and just change the amp block settings in each snapshot or I can use the plexi jumpered, normal, bright amp models in three amp blocks and switch between them in snapshots.
Excellent video! This video needs to be stickied on the Fractal Forum. It could eliminate a lot of frustration from gigging musicians who are new to modeling.
Leon's got a great point. That's exactly the problem I've experienced due to lack of experience LOL. It took me a long time to realize that I should stick with one IR making things sound more consistent
Man, this is not talked about enough…..I was thinking about this years ago when I first got my AX8, FM9 obviously now. I typically stick to a 2203 hi and even just volume down for cleans….add drive for leads, same cab ir all night. If I use an additional ir, it’ll sound really close to the main one and I’m just “testing it out live in comparison” I honestly use 2 presets for a 4 hour gig. If a player has drastically different tones/ir’s throughout the night, they are being a little selfish and not thinking of the big picture. Great vid and great tip for people that don’t know 🤘🏼
The one thing I question about in this (not disagreeing at all) is guys like Bonamassa or Haynes who use multiple amps all having their own cabs they switch between them for sounds, yet it totally works. Can you shed some light on how that works? Thanks for great content Leon!
@@worldclassicguitarists excellent point! I believe Joe was using 4 amps for a while there, but it was always a Silver Jubilee plus another amp for texture (Carol Ann, Van Wheelden and another?). Interesting idea to try in the Axe...
When I first got into the modeling, I had a preset for every song in our set. Through the years I’ve decided to streamline everything to a couple different presets with a constant IR and it’s never been better. So consistent and even, much more pleasant listening experience. Instead of focusing on what amp model I am actually playing, I started focusing on the tone I really like, and that was life changing.
THANK YOU! As a live engineer, this pitfall comes up so so so often. Seconded by this: shared backline (let's say, a festival), guitarist runs modeler through the power section of the amp and doesn't turn the cab/IR section on the modeler off.
Agreed, I've come across the same issue. its especially difficult on a silent stage if the guitar player is using multiple amps and IR's. You are always trying to make the guitar sounds fit with each tonal change. I own and Axe FX 3 and am a live FOH/Monitor engineer and I understand all to well the pitfalls. It's too easy to want to make your rig sound perfect. When playing live I use a 5 scene preset with various drive levels using one amp and the same IR cabs. I saw Toto and Journey last fall and you had 2 different approaches to guitar tones. Steve Lukather was playing through his Bogner XTC's and 4x12 Bogner cabs that were miced up and Neil Schon using a fractal FM9 using a consistent amp and cab IR throughout the night. They both sounded great but the common thread was that their speaker cabs did not change. It makes a huge difference.
Great video! Never thought about this before. Makes good sense. It would definitely save time setting up presets and the sound guys will be very happy! Thanks for sharing.
Great tip! Man, all your videos are so well thought that its a pleasure to learn from you. I bought an Fm9 Turbo a year ago just because I watched all your videos. Needless to say, best modeller I have ever had. It is amazing. Thanks so much!!!!!
Great insight. Foundational. Often overlooked. Well produced and great playing as usual. I have a Helix XL Stomp. I'm going to grab your IR. And be just a little bit more aware of how & where I'm sitting in the mix, at the next gig.
Great video! An important and often overlooked topic and you describe and demonstrate it in a brilliant way. By far one of the easiest ways to get consistency in the tones! I also appreciate you mentioning that you should consider the guitar's place in the mix with all other instruments that needs their place. Bedroom tones that sounds massive and great on their own will most of the times need a lot of tweaking to sit in a mix, whereas if you consider this from the start you will sound greater out of the box. Good song arrangement is of essence as well!
Great info Leon. Thanks for sharing. I'm already doing this for my FM3 live but this is a great demo of the effects it has on the mix. I'll share this video with my friends! Rock on man!
This is a great vid Leon. I'm relatively new to digital and especially going direct to FOH and as you say, it's tempting to find the absolute best of every individual sound but it really does work against you in a live or rehearsal setting. Some things sound great and then others just go missing or sound really out of place.
Very good content. I'm kind of a nube with my Kemper using it for opening for national acts when we don't have room for my stacks. Great catch because it seems the whole point of modelers is that you can get multiple amps on stage, when I use real multiple amps on stage with different cabs, each one is miced and in its own channel and eq'd at the board separately. NOT so with a modeler. One channel for multiple amps. I've always balanced the volumes of my presets, but the idea of running them through the same cab simulator never occurred to me before. THANKS!, This will probably make the next sound guy happy and make my overall guitar tone on stage better. BTW, that Rag Doll song sounded killer! Off to listen to your other stuff from the link! Keep making great vids, been enjoying your stuff for a couple of years. Cheers!
This is great advice because at the end of the day, the way you want to use the modelers is like a REAL amp. Real amps don’t have different speakers for different songs etc… you’d be playing one amp w one speaker unless of course you always want an need a stereo sound w 2 amps or speakers. There are some great modelers out there, ( and I own some lol) I always revert back to the ones with the simple solutions. I get option paralysis w some of that stuff. Guitar players are gonna kille me when I admit to the fact that I own a HX Stomo XL AND an Ax 8 effects… still haven’t programmed those bad boys yet…have had both well over a year! I’m still having fun w all my other gear like the Iridium, American sound and Mooer preamp live. Don’t trash me you guys lol. Big fan of the channel sir. Ur a Great player as well 🫡💯✊🏾
The comparison is really amazing (der Hammer!!) I am not changing cabinets too much, but I do. I did not think that it has such a big impact! the second example sits so much better in the mix! THX!
I've been doing the common IR in my live presets since I switched to modeling live. I got the idea from watching a video from Kristian Kohle. The point of the video is that your cab has a bigger effect on your tone than the rest of your chain. So I carried that idea into my live presets
I would agree of course that as a rule its best not changing amp and cab sim in the same song; but that shouldn’t mean that when playing live you cannot be consistent with your artistic choice of tones and use the amp and cab that best fits each different song of yours 🎸
Leon gives the best advice. If I may, I'd also like to suggest Audio University's channel, run by Kyle, a recording engineer. Leon may be familiar with his work. The content is presented very clearly and in a straightforward manner, like a university course. If Leon helps you get a great tone out of your live rig, I'm sure Kyle will help you get that great tone to...a solid state drive? (I so wanted to say tape there.)
This is one of the most - if not the most important videos about modelers I came across. Thanks ! I already changed the live setup in my FM3 to basically two main amp sounds with variations but I did not particularly focus on the cab IR's. Nice Ragdoll song b.t.w.
this was an issue I was unaware of when I first started using the Axe-Fx III live.. most of the time we mixed from stage so I really had no critiques.. but over the years of watching your videos I got the message and wound up making a nice blend with Cab-Lab 4 that I could live with through the full gamut: very clean, edge of breakup, crunchy rhythm, or full out distortion.. excellent advice LT!
Great video! That totally makes sense. When I'm dialing in my tone for covers alot of times I will scroll through the 40 some IRs I have downloaded before I fiddle with eq and all that just to see if i can get close with just a different cab. Usually Ill have the jist of what amp ill use for the song but the difference cabs make is insande to me still. Like you can make an engl savage with a boost in front and gain half way up sound like its for classic rock with... I'm not going to say the right cab because everything about doing that is wrong but just giving an example.
I love these videos on set-up approach, you relate it a way we can use for all formats. Critical information as far as im concerned. Oh picked up a katana 50 today! Spending tomorrow deep diving with it hooked into my computer 👍🎸🙏🤘
MOOER GE250 with a TONEX in the FX send for the amps. Not something I really ever thought about, but as an old rocker who dragged around the same amp for years, it makes total sense. A lot of things changed over the years, but my Yamaha S412III (Closed-back) never did. It even got used as a bass cab with a V4B on top. But that 412 was always there. Definitely need to keep an eye open to the simplicity of it all in these days of "every amp you ever wanted to play through" madness. Thanks! 💯
FM3 user. I’ve tried different IR’s for different patches and also found it too radical of a change. So I guess this video just reinforces that thought. Ideally my philosophy is to do the sound engineers work for them by having a tone to feed to their desk that’s mix-ready. I mean, why not? The tools and dsp is there to get it done. This should sit in a mix perfectly (or at least as close to it) so they just need a minimal touch of EQ on there to make it right for their mix, or none at all. Of course that means the PA is tuned properly to the room and other things depending on the competency of the engineer, but there only so much you can control. If I can say: this is how I want my tone through the PA, and if there’s no problems with that sound that need EQ then they should be content with what you’ve sent to them. If all guitars and bass are direct with modellers, and set up this way, that takes a lot of work off of the FOH engineer if there’s a quick change over and being mixed on the fly. That allows them to focus on vocals and drums. Consistency. Great video. Somehow the modelling keeps just getting better. Fractal all the way
great point re:vocals and drums. Drums always require the most setup and singers need to be able to hear themselves and be comfortable to do what they do. The closer to pl;ug and play we can make the guitar the better for all.
Superb advice Leon, and something most folks might not think of. So true that with a 'real' setup, you're using the same preamp/amp/cab/mic so basic audio consistency is always maintained.
THANK YOU!!! Changing the cab IR is literally changing the frequency response FOH has to work with. Other issues include inconsistency in levels between presets and trying to have presets for each song. We don't expect to have a different singer every song (Or even parts of a song!), a different bassist with a bass setup for a drummer with a different kit. So guitarists need to calm it down. There's so much nonsense about what FOH want from bands, its far from "go get a digital modeller, FOH will love you". Mostly keeping things as simple as possible is what helps most. A single amp & a pedalboard is the quickest way to do things, the knobs are accessible, there's no menus or need to save things or go through a variety of presets to make similar changes. Had plenty of engineers love some of the bands I've been in because we've told them that we want nothing in the monitors except vocals. If we're struggling to hear acoustic drums & a variety of 50+W amplifiers, we're doing something wrong as a band. A live band changes throughout the set, even song to song and FOH are trying to react to a drummer hitting harder/softer, the singer singing softer/louder, someone playing acoustic guitar going from finger picking to heavily strumming chords... so trying to EQ, as well as keep a suitable level for electric guitar going through a collection of classic amps & cabs is just adding work and a lot of the time, FOH haven't heard your band or songs unless you're successful enough to employ your own.
This is very helpful info, thanks Leon! What made you choose this particular cab? Is there any rule of thumb to follow? And does it apply also when recording with the axe, or mainly for live use?
I literally had this issue trying to use the FM9 in a live band situation in my last band , and it was like the sound was just all over the map like having separate real amps and effects changing and screwing up the balance of the mix constantly, great on their own but sucking big time in the context of a live mix. I will try this technique out, thank you for your amazing insight and work you do on your channel for us fellow old school guitar people trying to change with the times, and it's always inspiring to hear your great playing chops too!
Funny you should say this, i was thinking this a few weeks back, what the mixer is going to get when changing the amps and IRs. Good advice , going to do this. And BlueAmps rock! Cheers :)
great points Leon, looking out for FOH engineers everywhere 😄I also use the same IR for all the tones, it's more consistent for live usage, and anything to help the FOH make his/her job easier the better , having your own FOH engineer potentially opens up more doors, but not at that level the other layer is perhaps also to choose similar voiced amps (be it in power tubes/heritage , british sounding, US sounding etc..) to better fit parts and sound strong and consistent within the live mix, the same IR/speaker cab can only do so much depending on the voicing of the amp
this is why I play an FM3 live (and in the studio) and keeping the cab always the same... 4x12 1960 with Ribbon and Dynamic 1 ... in the studio, it is of course a whole different story.... thx Leon for that video!
This is excellent advice! Question for you.... Does the multi IR setup work more in a recording? Or can the same cab for different guitar parts work just fine too? Thanks!
Totally agree! That was my solution to cope with the way too different sounds of patches on my first modeler (Boss GT-8) almost 20 years ago. Using one standard cab/mic significantly reduces EQ-ing, searching for annoying frequencies often coming along with different cab-IR combination. The GT-1000 meanwhile offers a 'live-mode' doing exactly that, but for all patches, great feature IMO
3:18 - The last scene is the one that sticks out the most to me. The others could be used in different sections of a song if the contrasting tones are appropriate to the song/lyrics.
Always cool to see a not to Billy when playing an AC30 tone. Really good advice here, I feel like my various tones are pretty much living in the same space but this might help to tighten that up further.
The other pivot point of consistency when you’re switching scenes is the guitar itself. It’s like a word. A long as the beginning and the ending letters are correct, you can jumble up the ones in the middle and it still makes sense. With modelers, if the guitar and more importantly the pickups aren’t changing, neither should the cab IR. Presets/scenes should always be designed for a particular guitar, or at least guitar type.
fyi...I came across your "Brown sound" preset and have used it to record mono guitar tracks. Very well done bro! You should repost that episode! I'd love to see it! Be well. ~ Paul
100% agree with you Leon. I can get away with justifying using clean crunch rock sound and then a way to boost them for solos we and a few effects and I can concentrate on playing instead adjusting sound so much. This was a revelation!
Месяц назад
Came here for the guitar sims tips and got out with an excellent band discovery. Shine, such a cool song, I'll be checking out more from Ragdoll fo sure!
Hey brother. I hope yohre well kind sir.. Ive been struggling so haven't even been able to play guitar lately which really sucks.. Have so many of your videos I need to catch up with.. Having some bad health. Great video as always. Such good info as always sir❤.. Be well and safe my friend and if I dont comment much think nothing of it. Just trying to get back my health. Man, that JCM 800 tone sounds so good!!!!❤ as well as the recto cab ! ❤
I think when sound guys complain about digital modelers I'm convinced it's because their first experience (or a lot of experiences with it) are people switching IRs between songs/in the middle of songs. Also when people say "modelers can't keep up with real amps" it's probably also the same experience where the modeler user is switching IRs. I've always used the same IR for a set of music, and sound guys love my tone haha.
Great video Leon! My question is if Im going from something like a nice clean deluxe verb coming out of a 2x12 and then I switch to my distortion channel which is something like a 6505+ which sounds best with a 4x12 recto slant, what are my options?
Thanks for sharing your Cab IR. I just checked it(with real tube amp) and it sounds greats. It seems like doing my post EQ moves already;) I just kept low and high cuts + C4 dip and that's it. What is the cab you made the IR from?
As someone who came to the modeling world long after my gigging days were past, I never considered this. On stage, I always just had an amp and single cab. But I should have. It's sort of along the same lines as mastering an album-- keep your levels and EQ in the same ballpark from song to song. I may not play live anymore, but I think this is great advice even for basement recording.
I couldn't help myself and use a dual IR setup, with one being my main go-to and blend in different IR's as boost and cuts for sections instead of drives and eq boosts. I do really think the cab sound is the sause that keeps every dish taste like you!
Hi Leon and the FOH's engineers here, great video and great explanations Leon. I still have a question: Does it always have to be one and the same IR, or does it matter if I use different microphone positions from this IR? As far as I know it's about the frequency spectrum of an IR, this doesn't change when you use the same IR with different microphones. Or am I wrong?🤔
I would say the Mic you choose the it's location should be consistant. I use 2 x 3ch heads with each running two cabs with diffrent speakers I blend them and don't really switch them. having run a few stereo rack rigs even back in the day I would run an EQ after. A "master" tone section that was always key for a DI.
I actually use a Zoom G1x Four (which I call my "budget HX Stomp"), and the best sounding cab on there is the Bogner 4x12, and I use it with every amp because it's the smoothest and fullest sounding. Totally agree with you about that consistency factor. It's like the final "mastering" stage before it leaves my board and goes to the DAW or FOH
Totally agree. I took IR's of my favourite cab & speaker and use that almost 100% of the time. However, I LOVE that track Leon. Came for the thoughts, stayed for the riffs.
Thanks Leon. This is such great advice. Makes a huge difference live. Question for you. I should know the answer but I am not sure. I gigged on Saturday with my Fractal on Saturday. I noticed my clean tone was so much more prominent in my in ears than my lead tone (FAS 5150 Blue) even though they were the same volumes. I know this can happen based on compression with gain and more transients with cleans. Do you have any quick remedies for this? Thanks for all you do.
Try the output compressor in the amp block - this can help level out the transients and bring the percieved volume in line with the dirty tone a bit more.
Vídeo excelente! Leon, vc é top 10! Muito obrigado por mais vídeos educativos como os seus, grande abraço meu brother! 👏🏻🤘🏻🤘🏻🤘🏻 Fortaleza te aguarda 😂😂
Always used this concept, works great! Another good idea for a video, how to get a great sound without fussing over the IR. I think you've done that before, but maybe just reinforce, pick out an IR and then how do you dial in your tones around that to just move forward and not revisit?
Earopening video. Choice paralysis is a real thing and I'm guilty as charged. I indeed have a tendency to overtweak my Boss GX-100. Revisiting the setup after this weekend. I have a gig to do first. ;-)
Excellent advice. I would also suggest using a neutral IR, not one deemed "mix ready" or heavily EQ'd for live purposes. An ideal IR for a heavy rhythm tone will probably have harsh highs and too much low end for a lead sound. The "mix ready" stuff IMO is optimized studio situations and will not sound right live, especially on a big festival PA.
My molder had an IR of the exact cab i use when i play it through a real amp, so i switched EVERY IR to that one and it fixed a lot of problems. Now what sounds good out of the amp also sounds good in headphones. I had to change the amp settings a lot to compensate, but it's totally worth it.
What modeller are you playing live? Also, you can listen to Ragdoll here - ruclips.net/video/dgn9Y6dPOgc/видео.html
HX Stomp!
Quad Cortex
One question if i may. I tried to use your IR on my QC but also on my AX8 and as soon as I load it, the volume drops. Why's that?
Thanks 🤘
Mooer prime p1
Just switched from Kemper to FM9 .... love it!
Ampero II stomp
Thank you! Thank you! Thank you Leon! As a FOH engineer I’m constantly fighting with guitar players and their modelers. Just because you have access to 1000 effects doesn’t mean you have to use them all at once. Less is sometimes more and using the same cabinet IR helps us out front so much. Thanks for posting.
Same with playing right? Just because you know 100 cool licks doesn't mean you need to play them all in Sweet Home Alabama :p
@@LeonTodd absolutely! I’m finding that I’m often forced to talk to players about delay and reverb more than anything. It’s almost always way too much. I will ask them to dial them way down so they can sit in the mix better. I love those FX as much as anyone but when it’s stepping on other things in the mix there’s a problem. It’s funny because once I explain to them that it’s either dial them back so they can be more present in the mix or I turn them down they will inevitably fix it since no guitar player ever wants to be buried in the mix. Haha. Love your channel man. You’re the reason I’m a proud FM9 user today!
@toddbochenko963 so true! I just did this last Sunday at church! Lowered my reverbs mix to 10% made such a huge difference! Specially in the venue we meet at, there's enough Reverb in the room! So I was able to hear the guitar AC20 amp sound way better in the whole mix!
@@musicman4christjesus right? It made a ton of difference out front didn’t it? Made the guitar sit better in the mix without stepping on anything else.
@@toddbochenko963 Reverb and delay are the guitarists opium, and like opium addicts they are freaking annoying when spun up.
I tend to use both at very low amounts, just to fill it out a bit and smooth it up.
Same for chorus, I loved the 90's too but damn guys!
So many Todds around here, hi from another one.
All along I thought I was just lazy in using same cab set across the board… turns out I was making allies with the sound team
The sound team always have the best snacks too
Not lazy…smart and practical
Well, a lot of us don't realize this one thing. People have successfully toured with one amp and one speaker for decades. Keeping the guitar sound uniform across the song actually benefited it according to my ears.
I once mixed a band live and the guy, really good player, was using some line 6 thing and changed patches for every song, and obviously spent a ton of time working the details out. It was a disaster to mix. It would take at least a minute into each song to get the guitar to fit again. It was an eye opener for me, and I think your pretty simple solution is a great idea.
Great video, great tones, and really cool tune.
I'm a Helix user; with few exceptions, I use the same amp, cab, mic, and mic placement in a patch, then use snapshots to change amp settings. If there are multiple amp channel models, I'll use those in different snapshots, with the same cab, mic and mic placement.
I dial in the sound for my main rhythm tone first; then use that same cab, mic and mic placement for clean, lead; and rarely other variation, by changing the settings on the amp block / changing the amp block to a different amp block usually representing a different amp channel.
For example, I can use a jumpered plexi amp block, and just change the amp block settings in each snapshot or I can use the plexi jumpered, normal, bright amp models in three amp blocks and switch between them in snapshots.
I’m still new to IRs and modeling so this is good to know
Excellent video! This video needs to be stickied on the Fractal Forum. It could eliminate a lot of frustration from gigging musicians who are new to modeling.
Leon's got a great point. That's exactly the problem I've experienced due to lack of experience LOL. It took me a long time to realize that I should stick with one IR making things sound more consistent
Yup totally agree, like getting a sound without a band and then playing with that tone with the band…where did my tone go 🤔
Man, this is not talked about enough…..I was thinking about this years ago when I first got my AX8, FM9 obviously now. I typically stick to a 2203 hi and even just volume down for cleans….add drive for leads, same cab ir all night. If I use an additional ir, it’ll sound really close to the main one and I’m just “testing it out live in comparison”
I honestly use 2 presets for a 4 hour gig. If a player has drastically different tones/ir’s throughout the night, they are being a little selfish and not thinking of the big picture. Great vid and great tip for people that don’t know 🤘🏼
Makes perfect sense.
Set the amp up for crunch - boost for leads, volume down for cleans. If it ain't broke, don't fix it!
The one thing I question about in this (not disagreeing at all) is guys like Bonamassa or Haynes who use multiple amps all having their own cabs they switch between them for sounds, yet it totally works. Can you shed some light on how that works? Thanks for great content Leon!
@@worldclassicguitarists excellent point! I believe Joe was using 4 amps for a while there, but it was always a Silver Jubilee plus another amp for texture (Carol Ann, Van Wheelden and another?). Interesting idea to try in the Axe...
Completely agree with you I use my two custom IR for all my patches and that solves that problem very well said here, my friend.
Can't be said enough. Pick and choose wisely. Because you can have it all doesn't mean you should each time. Great post as always Leon!
When I first got into the modeling, I had a preset for every song in our set. Through the years I’ve decided to streamline everything to a couple different presets with a constant IR and it’s never been better. So consistent and even, much more pleasant listening experience. Instead of focusing on what amp model I am actually playing, I started focusing on the tone I really like, and that was life changing.
THIS
THANK YOU! As a live engineer, this pitfall comes up so so so often.
Seconded by this: shared backline (let's say, a festival), guitarist runs modeler through the power section of the amp and doesn't turn the cab/IR section on the modeler off.
"I know you've got the IR on - I've cranked the high shelf and it's still too dark bro!" 🤣
Agreed, I've come across the same issue. its especially difficult on a silent stage if the guitar player is using multiple amps and IR's. You are always trying to make the guitar sounds fit with each tonal change. I own and Axe FX 3 and am a live FOH/Monitor engineer and I understand all to well the pitfalls. It's too easy to want to make your rig sound perfect. When playing live I use a 5 scene preset with various drive levels using one amp and the same IR cabs.
I saw Toto and Journey last fall and you had 2 different approaches to guitar tones. Steve Lukather was playing through his Bogner XTC's and 4x12 Bogner cabs that were miced up and Neil Schon using a fractal FM9 using a consistent amp and cab IR throughout the night. They both sounded great but the common thread was that their speaker cabs did not change. It makes a huge difference.
@@LeonTodd"I, too, love low mids, but damn!"
Great video! Never thought about this before. Makes good sense. It would definitely save time setting up presets and the sound guys will be very happy! Thanks for sharing.
Great tip! Man, all your videos are so well thought that its a pleasure to learn from you. I bought an Fm9 Turbo a year ago just because I watched all your videos. Needless to say, best modeller I have ever had. It is amazing. Thanks so much!!!!!
Cheers mate, so happy to hear that!
What a difference! Much preferred the second mix when the chunky sound kicked in!
Great insight. Foundational. Often overlooked. Well produced and great playing as usual.
I have a Helix XL Stomp. I'm going to grab your IR. And be just a little bit more aware of how & where I'm sitting in the mix, at the next gig.
This advice was so important and well demonstrated but I was so distracted by the absolutely beautiful top on that guitar. my word!
Great video! An important and often overlooked topic and you describe and demonstrate it in a brilliant way. By far one of the easiest ways to get consistency in the tones! I also appreciate you mentioning that you should consider the guitar's place in the mix with all other instruments that needs their place. Bedroom tones that sounds massive and great on their own will most of the times need a lot of tweaking to sit in a mix, whereas if you consider this from the start you will sound greater out of the box. Good song arrangement is of essence as well!
Great info Leon. Thanks for sharing. I'm already doing this for my FM3 live but this is a great demo of the effects it has on the mix. I'll share this video with my friends! Rock on man!
100%
As a FOH engineer, I deal with this stuff a lot. Thanks for putting it out there!
Thanks for putting up with people like me over the years. i feel like all the best tone tips i've ever picked up were from FOH folk \M/
Thank you! Fantastic video to happen upon while i continue to explore patch designs!
Great to hear!
One of the best videos I have seen in a while! Outstanding Leon!
🙌
This is a great vid Leon. I'm relatively new to digital and especially going direct to FOH and as you say, it's tempting to find the absolute best of every individual sound but it really does work against you in a live or rehearsal setting. Some things sound great and then others just go missing or sound really out of place.
Very good content. I'm kind of a nube with my Kemper using it for opening for national acts when we don't have room for my stacks. Great catch because it seems the whole point of modelers is that you can get multiple amps on stage, when I use real multiple amps on stage with different cabs, each one is miced and in its own channel and eq'd at the board separately. NOT so with a modeler. One channel for multiple amps. I've always balanced the volumes of my presets, but the idea of running them through the same cab simulator never occurred to me before. THANKS!, This will probably make the next sound guy happy and make my overall guitar tone on stage better. BTW, that Rag Doll song sounded killer! Off to listen to your other stuff from the link! Keep making great vids, been enjoying your stuff for a couple of years. Cheers!
Much appreciated mate, hope you enjoy the rest of the tunes
This is great advice because at the end of the day, the way you want to use the modelers is like a REAL amp. Real amps don’t have different speakers for different songs etc… you’d be playing one amp w one speaker unless of course you always want an need a stereo sound w 2 amps or speakers. There are some great modelers out there, ( and I own some lol) I always revert back to the ones with the simple solutions. I get option paralysis w some of that stuff. Guitar players are gonna kille me when I admit to the fact that I own a HX Stomo XL AND an Ax 8 effects… still haven’t programmed those bad boys yet…have had both well over a year! I’m still having fun w all my other gear like the Iridium, American sound and Mooer preamp live. Don’t trash me you guys lol. Big fan of the channel sir. Ur a Great player as well 🫡💯✊🏾
I'm using a fractal AX8 live. Gotta say I never really checked my cabs between my presets but I'll need to look that up tonight!
The comparison is really amazing (der Hammer!!) I am not changing cabinets too much, but I do. I did not think that it has such a big impact! the second example sits so much better in the mix! THX!
I've been doing the common IR in my live presets since I switched to modeling live. I got the idea from watching a video from Kristian Kohle. The point of the video is that your cab has a bigger effect on your tone than the rest of your chain. So I carried that idea into my live presets
I would agree of course that as a rule its best not changing amp and cab sim in the same song; but that shouldn’t mean that when playing live you cannot be consistent with your artistic choice of tones and use the amp and cab that best fits each different song of yours 🎸
Brilliant vid demo & point man, I’ve been thinking about this for a while & defo gonna give it a go after seeing this. Hope you’re well & thanks 😎👍🔥
As always Leon, great video!! very informative! I follow you since the ax8 and I still with her :D. Cheers from Chile!
Awesome, thank you!
Leon gives the best advice.
If I may, I'd also like to suggest Audio University's channel, run by Kyle, a recording engineer. Leon may be familiar with his work. The content is presented very clearly and in a straightforward manner, like a university course.
If Leon helps you get a great tone out of your live rig, I'm sure Kyle will help you get that great tone to...a solid state drive? (I so wanted to say tape there.)
I use the same cab for all my scenes and even try to make the amp models complement each other with nothing drastically different.
For a live performance setting, this makes total sense 👏 Thank you 👍
This is one of the most - if not the most important videos about modelers I came across. Thanks ! I already changed the live setup in my FM3 to basically two main amp sounds with variations but I did not particularly focus on the cab IR's. Nice Ragdoll song b.t.w.
Cheers mate!
oh my godddddd this makes so much sense, thank you so much!
this was an issue I was unaware of when I first started using the Axe-Fx III live.. most of the time we mixed from stage so I really had no critiques.. but over the years of watching your videos I got the message and wound up making a nice blend with Cab-Lab 4 that I could live with through the full gamut: very clean, edge of breakup, crunchy rhythm, or full out distortion.. excellent advice LT!
Excellent demonstration, thanks!
Glad it was helpful!
Priceless advice as always!
Thanks for the info I’m a newb when it comes to this kind of stuff but I can definitely notice a much more consistent tone when using same cab IR
This is such an obvious idea but one that had totally escaped me. Thanks Leon, great vid man.
Ive been using the same 2 irs blended for all my cleans and high gain stuff to keep it consistent for a while now.
OMG 😲 I forgot we could blend IRs! That will save me lot's of CPU in my AX8!
Great video! That totally makes sense. When I'm dialing in my tone for covers alot of times I will scroll through the 40 some IRs I have downloaded before I fiddle with eq and all that just to see if i can get close with just a different cab. Usually Ill have the jist of what amp ill use for the song but the difference cabs make is insande to me still. Like you can make an engl savage with a boost in front and gain half way up sound like its for classic rock with... I'm not going to say the right cab because everything about doing that is wrong but just giving an example.
I love these videos on set-up approach, you relate it a way we can use for all formats. Critical information as far as im concerned. Oh picked up a katana 50 today! Spending tomorrow deep diving with it hooked into my computer 👍🎸🙏🤘
MOOER GE250 with a TONEX in the FX send for the amps. Not something I really ever thought about, but as an old rocker who dragged around the same amp for years, it makes total sense. A lot of things changed over the years, but my Yamaha S412III (Closed-back) never did. It even got used as a bass cab with a V4B on top. But that 412 was always there. Definitely need to keep an eye open to the simplicity of it all in these days of "every amp you ever wanted to play through" madness. Thanks! 💯
FM3 user. I’ve tried different IR’s for different patches and also found it too radical of a change. So I guess this video just reinforces that thought.
Ideally my philosophy is to do the sound engineers work for them by having a tone to feed to their desk that’s mix-ready. I mean, why not? The tools and dsp is there to get it done.
This should sit in a mix perfectly (or at least as close to it) so they just need a minimal touch of EQ on there to make it right for their mix, or none at all.
Of course that means the PA is tuned properly to the room and other things depending on the competency of the engineer, but there only so much you can control.
If I can say: this is how I want my tone through the PA, and if there’s no problems with that sound that need EQ then they should be content with what you’ve sent to them.
If all guitars and bass are direct with modellers, and set up this way, that takes a lot of work off of the FOH engineer if there’s a quick change over and being mixed on the fly. That allows them to focus on vocals and drums.
Consistency.
Great video. Somehow the modelling keeps just getting better. Fractal all the way
great point re:vocals and drums. Drums always require the most setup and singers need to be able to hear themselves and be comfortable to do what they do. The closer to pl;ug and play we can make the guitar the better for all.
Great video covering a very interesting point
Superb advice Leon, and something most folks might not think of. So true that with a 'real' setup, you're using the same preamp/amp/cab/mic so basic audio consistency is always maintained.
Love that Cult riff :)
That song NEVER gets skipped or turned down if I'm listening
THANK YOU!!!
Changing the cab IR is literally changing the frequency response FOH has to work with. Other issues include inconsistency in levels between presets and trying to have presets for each song.
We don't expect to have a different singer every song (Or even parts of a song!), a different bassist with a bass setup for a drummer with a different kit. So guitarists need to calm it down.
There's so much nonsense about what FOH want from bands, its far from "go get a digital modeller, FOH will love you". Mostly keeping things as simple as possible is what helps most. A single amp & a pedalboard is the quickest way to do things, the knobs are accessible, there's no menus or need to save things or go through a variety of presets to make similar changes.
Had plenty of engineers love some of the bands I've been in because we've told them that we want nothing in the monitors except vocals. If we're struggling to hear acoustic drums & a variety of 50+W amplifiers, we're doing something wrong as a band.
A live band changes throughout the set, even song to song and FOH are trying to react to a drummer hitting harder/softer, the singer singing softer/louder, someone playing acoustic guitar going from finger picking to heavily strumming chords... so trying to EQ, as well as keep a suitable level for electric guitar going through a collection of classic amps & cabs is just adding work and a lot of the time, FOH haven't heard your band or songs unless you're successful enough to employ your own.
astute observation, I'll have to keep this one in mind!
Great advice, mate. Many thanks.
2 of the best things I’ve done these past few years… buying an Axe Fx3 and finding this channel. Thank you Leon.
That's awesome to hear. Glad I can help!
This is very helpful info, thanks Leon!
What made you choose this particular cab? Is there any rule of thumb to follow?
And does it apply also when recording with the axe, or mainly for live use?
I literally had this issue trying to use the FM9 in a live band situation in my last band , and it was like the sound was just all over the map like having separate real amps and effects changing and screwing up the balance of the mix constantly, great on their own but sucking big time in the context of a live mix. I will try this technique out, thank you for your amazing insight and work you do on your channel for us fellow old school guitar people trying to change with the times, and it's always inspiring to hear your great playing chops too!
"Just because you can doesn't mean you should" definitely applies in this world.
Funny you should say this, i was thinking this a few weeks back, what the mixer is going to get when changing the amps and IRs. Good advice , going to do this. And BlueAmps rock! Cheers :)
great points Leon, looking out for FOH engineers everywhere 😄I also use the same IR for all the tones, it's more consistent for live usage, and anything to help the FOH make his/her job easier the better , having your own FOH engineer potentially opens up more doors, but not at that level
the other layer is perhaps also to choose similar voiced amps (be it in power tubes/heritage , british sounding, US sounding etc..) to better fit parts and sound strong and consistent within the live mix, the same IR/speaker cab can only do so much depending on the voicing of the amp
Yeah i'll just make the FOH fix all my awful choices once per gig rather than 4 or 5 times :p
this is why I play an FM3 live (and in the studio) and keeping the cab always the same... 4x12 1960 with Ribbon and Dynamic 1 ... in the studio, it is of course a whole different story.... thx Leon for that video!
This is excellent advice! Question for you.... Does the multi IR setup work more in a recording? Or can the same cab for different guitar parts work just fine too? Thanks!
Sage advice LT!i am super guilty of modelling option abuse (cab IRs especially :P)
Totally agree! That was my solution to cope with the way too different sounds of patches on my first modeler (Boss GT-8) almost 20 years ago. Using one standard cab/mic significantly reduces EQ-ing, searching for annoying frequencies often coming along with different cab-IR combination. The GT-1000 meanwhile offers a 'live-mode' doing exactly that, but for all patches, great feature IMO
3:18 - The last scene is the one that sticks out the most to me. The others could be used in different sections of a song if the contrasting tones are appropriate to the song/lyrics.
Always cool to see a not to Billy when playing an AC30 tone. Really good advice here, I feel like my various tones are pretty much living in the same space but this might help to tighten that up further.
The other pivot point of consistency when you’re switching scenes is the guitar itself. It’s like a word. A long as the beginning and the ending letters are correct, you can jumble up the ones in the middle and it still makes sense. With modelers, if the guitar and more importantly the pickups aren’t changing, neither should the cab IR. Presets/scenes should always be designed for a particular guitar, or at least guitar type.
fyi...I came across your "Brown sound" preset and have used it to record mono guitar tracks. Very well done bro! You should repost that episode! I'd love to see it! Be well. ~ Paul
100% agree with you Leon. I can get away with justifying using clean crunch rock sound and then a way to boost them for solos we and a few effects and I can concentrate on playing instead adjusting sound so much. This was a revelation!
Came here for the guitar sims tips and got out with an excellent band discovery. Shine, such a cool song, I'll be checking out more from Ragdoll fo sure!
Cheers!
Hey brother. I hope yohre well kind sir.. Ive been struggling so haven't even been able to play guitar lately which really sucks..
Have so many of your videos I need to catch up with.. Having some bad health.
Great video as always. Such good info as always sir❤..
Be well and safe my friend and if I dont comment much think nothing of it. Just trying to get back my health.
Man, that JCM 800 tone sounds so good!!!!❤ as well as the recto cab ! ❤
health is all we have brother, the rest is gravy! Wishing you well in your recovery.
I think when sound guys complain about digital modelers I'm convinced it's because their first experience (or a lot of experiences with it) are people switching IRs between songs/in the middle of songs. Also when people say "modelers can't keep up with real amps" it's probably also the same experience where the modeler user is switching IRs. I've always used the same IR for a set of music, and sound guys love my tone haha.
This is a great point!
GREAT video! Thank you!!!
Man this is very interesting. I'm going to give this a shot!
Great video Leon! My question is if Im going from something like a nice clean deluxe verb coming out of a 2x12 and then I switch to my distortion channel which is something like a 6505+ which sounds best with a 4x12 recto slant, what are my options?
Thanks for sharing your Cab IR. I just checked it(with real tube amp) and it sounds greats. It seems like doing my post EQ moves already;) I just kept low and high cuts + C4 dip and that's it.
What is the cab you made the IR from?
Cheers! A marshall 1960TV from the 90s with 25W greenbacks. Shure SM7b, Royer 121 and Senn MD421 mics mixed.
As someone who came to the modeling world long after my gigging days were past, I never considered this. On stage, I always just had an amp and single cab. But I should have. It's sort of along the same lines as mastering an album-- keep your levels and EQ in the same ballpark from song to song. I may not play live anymore, but I think this is great advice even for basement recording.
I couldn't help myself and use a dual IR setup, with one being my main go-to and blend in different IR's as boost and cuts for sections instead of drives and eq boosts.
I do really think the cab sound is the sause that keeps every dish taste like you!
Hi Leon and the FOH's engineers here,
great video and great explanations Leon. I still have a question: Does it always have to be one and the same IR, or does it matter if I use different microphone positions from this IR? As far as I know it's about the frequency spectrum of an IR, this doesn't change when you use the same IR with different microphones. Or am I wrong?🤔
I would say the Mic you choose the it's location should be consistant. I use 2 x 3ch heads with each running two cabs with diffrent speakers I blend them and don't really switch them. having run a few stereo rack rigs even back in the day I would run an EQ after. A "master" tone section that was always key for a DI.
Great video, great point.
I actually use a Zoom G1x Four (which I call my "budget HX Stomp"), and the best sounding cab on there is the Bogner 4x12, and I use it with every amp because it's the smoothest and fullest sounding. Totally agree with you about that consistency factor. It's like the final "mastering" stage before it leaves my board and goes to the DAW or FOH
Sage advice. Whether I am running my Axefx or my synergy, I pick one IR for all and it blends better from tone to tone.
Totally agree. I took IR's of my favourite cab & speaker and use that almost 100% of the time. However, I LOVE that track Leon. Came for the thoughts, stayed for the riffs.
Thanks mate! I'm lucky to play with killer musos
Thanks Leon. This is such great advice. Makes a huge difference live. Question for you. I should know the answer but I am not sure. I gigged on Saturday with my Fractal on Saturday. I noticed my clean tone was so much more prominent in my in ears than my lead tone (FAS 5150 Blue) even though they were the same volumes. I know this can happen based on compression with gain and more transients with cleans. Do you have any quick remedies for this? Thanks for all you do.
Try the output compressor in the amp block - this can help level out the transients and bring the percieved volume in line with the dirty tone a bit more.
Vídeo excelente! Leon, vc é top 10! Muito obrigado por mais vídeos educativos como os seus, grande abraço meu brother! 👏🏻🤘🏻🤘🏻🤘🏻 Fortaleza te aguarda 😂😂
:D
Thank you for the IR
Always used this concept, works great! Another good idea for a video, how to get a great sound without fussing over the IR. I think you've done that before, but maybe just reinforce, pick out an IR and then how do you dial in your tones around that to just move forward and not revisit?
Ooooh great idea!
She sells sanctuary and seashells by the seashore in the Seychelles.
Morning comrade. Fully back from Henriksen’s fabulous Rocky Mountain Archtop Guitar Festival, just needed my expert modeling geek fix. 😂
Todorovich knows!!! 🤙🏻
Down with mixing faffery! 😂
Love the inclusion of She Sells Sanctuary in there.
Earopening video. Choice paralysis is a real thing and I'm guilty as charged. I indeed have a tendency to overtweak my Boss GX-100. Revisiting the setup after this weekend. I have a gig to do first. ;-)
Anytime there's a video about the mistake people always make it's always the thing I do.
Very useful information. Thank you. I use a POD Express.
Excellent advice. I would also suggest using a neutral IR, not one deemed "mix ready" or heavily EQ'd for live purposes. An ideal IR for a heavy rhythm tone will probably have harsh highs and too much low end for a lead sound. The "mix ready" stuff IMO is optimized studio situations and will not sound right live, especially on a big festival PA.
Yeah you need some fizz and stank to find you some space amongst the cymbals and bass live.
Beautiful technique Leon , is the Fm3 still good to buy in 2024 ?
Absolutely! I gig mine weekly.
Makes good sense. Consistency in the ears is also very desirable.
I do agree with you on this subject. I do the same thing with my Helix and also my Two-Notes OPUS.
Brutal tones man...... crushing. I'm really happy w Helix- in 2024, there's no excuse to have bad tone- we are spoiled for options.
Exactly!
My molder had an IR of the exact cab i use when i play it through a real amp, so i switched EVERY IR to that one and it fixed a lot of problems. Now what sounds good out of the amp also sounds good in headphones. I had to change the amp settings a lot to compensate, but it's totally worth it.
cool tip, never tried this idea. i don't play live, but this will help.