Post Direct, Steam Is Shittier Than Ever (The Jimquisition)
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- Опубликовано: 21 сен 2024
- / jimquisition
www.thejimquisi...
sharkrobot.com/...
We've had much of 2017 to see what Steam Direct has done for Steam.
Since Steam Direct turned out to be a complete farce, it's safe to say it ain't done a lot. You need not take my word for it either.
Also, Sterdust accepts a challenge from Pro Wrestling Ego.
It still amazes me how Steam just lost itself. The only reason I go to Steam anymore is either to play a game I already own or look to buy a game I already know exists. I don't even look at the store page anymore.
A Physics Professor Same. I just buy in sales. The Store can go fuck itself with an asset-flipped spiky dildo.
A Physics Professor I pretty much go there to download games that have been marketed or advertised somewhere else. I go through my “recommendations” and all I see are mediocre games from 2009 or overpriced games I’ve never heard of.
No wonder Scott Cawthon is deciding whether or not he wants to put his next game coming in December (he intentionally left it vague), on Steam or Gamejolt! Steam has turned into RUclips 2.0, even down to the faulty algorithms! STOP USING ALGORITHMS! IT’S NOT 2237!
Yup, I think this sales period is the first time I've browsed the steam store since the last sale lol. Usually I browse on official reseller site like green man,etc because I know they're only buying keys they can actually sell, so it's a kind of curation.
I very rarely buy from unofficial resellers like cdkeys.. that's usually only if I'm pissed at the developer - no mans sky comes to mind lol
A Physics Professor agree with you dude. I have ~1000 games in my steam collection. I haven't bought one from steam in about a year. Dont even browse the storefront anymore. The storefront used to be a great place to find out what was happening in gaming.
What's games are just out? What games are popular? Why are they popular (pre-standalone DayZ comes to mind when Arma 2 suddenly started appearing everywhere). Now it just seems like you go into this land where time doesn't exist and they are pushing some mediocre shooter with mixed reviews from 2011 because you played Left 4 Dead about 5 years ago.
The steam store sucks. They don't realise that they are driving people away.
You're right, "shovelware" sounds much too energetic for these games. Shovelling suggests some kind of effort.
I'd suggest "dribbleware". You know, they just kind of...come out. They're cultural seepage, the artistic equivalent of bin juice.
Yes, these games are just what was in heads of many, many single developers, at least I think most of them were "developed" by single person.
A+ comment
Or SpitWare. A shorter option.
*ShitWare more like
Dribbleware. I like that. It works. "Shitware" still requires some kind of pushing, so yeah, "dribbleware" is just about right. Imma start using that word.
I lost it at "Ken why are you drinking pencils!?"
I was the same as you.
Funny thing is, I and a few people I know actually use coffee mugs to store pencils.
I hope it becomes a meme for jim.
I now want it used in a legit game.
One of my favourites of Jim's.
So........I wonder if the next time Randy Pitchford tries to reference Jim Sterling while pretending he doesn't know his name if he will mention Sterdust. Randy:"Yah that large english guy who dresses up in purple spandex, you know the one" Reporter: "Uh........no I don't."
Randy: "Really? He talks about me all the time while touching himself. "
I think you misspelled Randy's surname.
I wonder if that will be worked into a storyline.
Sterdust will actually step up as a wrestler. His first opponent: a masked man who seems to hate him with a passion. Once Sterdust wins, he unmasks him to reveal Randy.
Those "games" wouldn't cut it on Newgrounds, and that's 100% FREE
I felt like going on a nostalgia trip and checked ng out, sure no AAA titles and there's always some crap, but all in all the standard is DEFINITELY higher than steam
From what I remember it's the same over at itch.io too. How is it possible these sites beat Steam in good curation? I don't even think Steam should try to copy their model, but it could atleast try to copy their storefront system.
Got some good stuff there like Rebuild 1 &2, as well as Sonny 1&2, there's good stuff there if you know where to look.
Hell, newgrounds spawned Super Meat Boy, Time Fcuk, Gretel and Hansel, Binding of Isaac, and countless other incredible games (I know most of the ones in my list are McMillen games but that's just off the top of my head)-- it seems almost like half these games would be blammed right off NG if they were submit there.
Heck yeah, i've always thought the mobile games scene should be exactly like Newgrounds and Armor games. There's some really good stuff on there that's ideal for a toilet break or a train journey!
Seriously Jim? You threw out your back and made several trips to the hospital for almost a year CLEANING YOUR CLOSET and you want to go tussle with some bois on the mat?
I guess we should just expect to watch the next 6 months of Jimquisition being broadcast from the hospital until you're allowed to leave your body cast?
Jim is only managing Sterdust, unless you've heard word of Jim starring as his tag partner.
I think he'll just Paul Bearer someone in the ring as support rather than break his spine jumping from the ropes.
Jim Sterling and Sterdust, though (apparently) different personae, are both portrayed by the same individual.
Jim is Mr. Stanton's main persona. "Sterdust" is the Jim-flavoured wrestling gimmick he devised. They're also a thinly-veiled parody of Stardust (or possibly Goldust), as they said-but-didn't-say in their debut.
Pretty sure it's a parody of Goldust. I remember that face well..
@@rhorybader4054 the running joke is Jim got flagged for showing like 15-30secs of some WWE (might have even been the golddust theme) so he created this charicter and then made sure to trademark/copyright it out of spite.
The fact they actually called you out like that amazes me
Thank god for Jim Fucking Sterdust Son
They're southern boys that wrestle on weekends, they're not going to hold a PHD.
JCB 136 I like to think they took it in good humor
Wait, how did you learn Sterdust's first, middle, and second last names? That's a really weird coincidence.
They clearly took it in good humor. I hope the sweeping generalization about Americans was also sarcasm, but hey you know, Poe's Law and all.
JCB 136 Got to have that generic swing at Americans don't you? "Some Americans don't understand Sarcasm, this represents all Americans! Stupid Americans and their culture!" Its not Americans, a lot of people don't get sarcasm sometimes, it isn't an American thing, its a people thing. Besides, they could be in on the joke and they also could've been sarcastic.
Is this some kind of dream? IS JIM STERLING JOINING PROFESSIONAL WRESTLING!? I'm so happy...
Endyo I want to be there when he explains to the actual wrestlers how the Jim Sterling persona works.
I'll say this - for a pro wrestling promoter to literally call me "disturbing" when he's a PRO WRESTLING PROMOTER makes me very, very proud. Just when somebody thinks they could see it all, Jim Sterling puts on spandex.
Same here, I'd love to see how this develops. Thank god for Jim and his spandex!
Sterdust*.... not Jim.
@JimSterling Don't you mean disteeeerbing? :D
"...improve their algorithms..."
Well there's your problem right there, Valve. As long as you continue to minimize human professional input and simply rely on cold calculating machines, you will never get this issue resolved anytime soon.
In that regard, they are very similar to RUclips - using algorithms to do a job that requires human intelligence. And in both cases, the little guys suffer - indie developers get buried under shit, small channels lose ad revenue.
Ulf Liller Jim has also been quite outspoken with RUclips's love for algorithms to the point of inventing the Copyright Deadlock, just so he could spite RUclips and the cretins who took advantage of the takedown systems.
@Ulf Liller I'm sorry but how do you expect people to sort the millions of videos uploaded every day...... Of course you're going to need an algorithm. Just not a shitty one that only caters to the big media networks.
Dirk: Well they could review all the flags before removing/reducing the monetization level. Since everybody who gets hit requests a manual review anyway (and like 99% of them come back as approved) this would be as much work for them as it is now, just without the screwing people over part. Using algorithms as help is fine but decisions need to be made by actual people.
Because there is no backlash, ppl will do it wihout hesitation. Ppl affraid to do crimes because there are actual consequences involve, if there are consquences in doing false take down or copy right strike, ppl will hesistant before doing it. A software is still a bunch of codes of presets that calculate things in advance and decide what to do base on those numbers, it will never reach the level of actual intelligence.
Ster-dust...
Ster-ling...
wait, what if Jim Sterling is... nah, that's stupid.
What if Sterdust is Actually Duke Amiel Du H’ardcore? they're both flamboyant, overly arrogant, and they both wear white grease paint with blush... it's possible.
I think the issues with Valve and RUclips both stem from the same mindset. In their eyes, they've won. The internet is a competition, and they've both already won.
That's why RUclips doesn't change anything drastic anymore outside of making companies more comfy with putting ads on videos. That's why Valve doesn't focus on making games anymore. That's why they both rely almost entirely on algorithms!
They think they've 'won', so they don't need to do work anymore.
Robert Fancyman except youtube is a money pit for google
That's what IBM thought in 1982.
Monopolies will almost always screw the consumer.
IBM had same mine set and look at them now, you might be top for good period but things don't last forever
Hi :)
Valve, with their piles of money, could easily solve this problem. Greenlight was a good idea, but it failed because there was no quality control after a point and literally anything with a few upvotes got released. Just hire a small department to handle quality control, bring back Greenlight with a few tweaks, then have a real-life person from said department check out games with enough upvotes and give them the go-ahead if the game isn't pure trash.
The problem with today's industry is that when you get as big as Valve, you can't be bothered to do anything besides rake in money. A very real and damaging problem is happening to Steam yet Valve can't be bothered to spend money on a few new hires to deal with the problem for good. They found a way to be the gatekeeper for PC games and happily take their cut for next to no effort on their part, but now they need to step up and get hands-on or this will mean their undoing.
good idea
There's also the irrational faith tech culture puts in automation, and the refusal to hold responsibility for the eventual decisions of human curators.
Freaking hell, let me do it for minimum wage.
RUclips suffers from a similar affliction.
Between services like Steam, RUclips and Facebook, we're seeing big companies completely fail to manage the massive user-bases they've been gleefully hoovering up over the past decade.
When you open up a service to everyone, expect moderation of that service to run out of control, and completely beyond the grasp of human oversight.
Steam's problems originated with Greenlight and Direct. RUclips's problems started escalating when they scrapped Partnership requirements - allowing anyone to monetize their videos. Facebook's issues stemmed from vastly underestimating how many people absorb and regurgitate misleading information through their "friends", and how damaging that can be for wider society.
And the solution for all of these companies is to rely on a magical "algorithm". The great mathematical arbitrator. The all-powerful overseeing eye that will filter out the bad and surface the good. Only that in all three cases their designated maintenance robot struggles to do its job. Steam is still an over-cluttered mess, RUclips is still a monetizable hive of scum and villainy that seems penalize legitimate creators as much as bad, and Facebook is still a platform for bad actors to proliferate false narratives on an industrial scale.
Human oversight can greatly help many of these issues - especially in the case of editorial curation for Steam's front page and the RUclips Kids app, for example - but these companies also need to accept the fact that having a 'come one and come all' approach to your platform isn't going to work anymore. All of these services resemble an out of control, free-for-all in their current state and the only way to reign them back in is to start enforcing hard restrictions, even if that diverts from the strategy of "user growth" that they have been pursuing until now.
I'm no expert, but I reckon Steam needs greater entry barriers for publication, RUclips needs much tougher monetization standards & greater parental controls, while Facebook needs more verification for the people using their platform to run advertisements, as well as the ads themselves (ad content, who is being targeted etc).
The age of "everything is open and great and will moderate itself" is over. When creators, advertisers and - eventually - users, start moving away, these companies will start to realise why.
This is what happens when laws®ulations can't keep up with technology. If Steam was a physical store they'd get sued to pieces for selling this kind of non-functional shit.
JCB 136 I know, right? When I clicked "Show more" I was like "Oh, great. A wall of text - Here we go", but by the end I was very pleasantly surprised.
I thought the problem was with the enforcement of the guidelines, not that they need to be stricter. As they are, they're so vague that they're virtually all encompassing, so I'm not sure how they could get any stricter.
JCB 136: Cheers mate! :)
Luke: Haha, I guess Jim's video inspired me to let loose. Thanks for reading :)
Steam, literally hire me for minimum wage and let me go to town. I will play 30 minutes OR less and give a yes or no for 7 hours a day and a one hour lunch. Imagine what literally one person could get done in just a year. Imagine what 2 people could get done in a year. Jim, tell Steam my offer. I have a stable internet connection and nothing to do. I have a resume ready. Help a veteran out!
I'd be willing to do it for ten hours. Twelve even. Easiest job ever.
I’m disabled my anxiety won’t allow me to hold a proper job. But this I could totally do.
Very much the same my dude, very much the same.
Just wanted to say thank you for your service. Your worth far more than some stupid minimum wage.
The real sad thing is Valve gets paid stupid amounts of money for doing next to nothing, just being the middle man of everything and yet won't spend a dime to make the service work. Though I'm sure they are paying some one way to much money to develop these algorithms when it would be cheaper to just hire some staff. Even something simple as 100 people working minimum wage would make a huge cut into the crap if they removed say 10 games a day each. While it would suck trying to over come the back log of existing games that kind of staff could keep up with the games as they come out at least.
Split the store up into 2 different stores, one curated and one that isnt.
Get enough sales and your game will be reviewed to be put on the curated store.
Put the power in the content creators hands to bring forth the good games and let the rest fade of in to the obscurity.
I love how random youtube commenters have better ideas than a multi-billion dollar company
Microsoft already made that with their creator's program. For just a low low payment of around $19 you can develop Xbox One games, even integrates super easily into Unity3D. They make it as easy as possible for you. And the caveat is that you're games won't have achievements, no multiplayer, and they can never take up space on the front page of microsoft's stores. All of that is reserved for the ID@Xbox folks...that actually get curated. So all Steam has to do is mimic that...but apparently that's "hard".
That was kind of the point of Steam Greenlight.
Primarina Queen Its similar, but the idea is that the people would first have to vote with their wallets and then valve would have a look at the game to make sure its not a broken mess, then that would hopefully ensure better quality control.
Its just an idea on how they could siphon out the bullshit from the good shit while still giving everybody a fair shot.
Even if they wouldn't make it to the curated store, their game would still be sold.
Yes, but my point is Steam tried something similar, and failed spectacularly. Them retrying again wouldn't solve the main issue, in that Valve doesn't seem interested in making sure stuff are properly curated.
5:10 Holy shit, that's not a still image, that's a game...
Topin what a time to be alive
When in Russia, make games like the russians do.
No is not, and yet it is. :(
No, it's a still image masquerading as a game.
umbaupause We don't deserve Steam when it was in its prime.
Whenever somebody tells you "The market will regulate itself", remind them about Steam Greenlight.
Eh, they'll just claim steam's few remaining submission rules were the problem.
But it's magic and magic always has exceptions. AND the exceptions are what makes the magic even more true.
Muh invisible hand will fix all the problems
Glenn グレン The invisible hand is giving us all the finger.
The market never does. It always gets out of controll. Always. Humans are greedy.
Y'all remember when Valve was the golden standard of the industry? When we all looked at the EAs and Activisions of the world and say, "Gee, why can't they be more like Valve"?
Yeah, I miss those times.
So instead of cleaning up their garbage dump, Valve decided to rename it and open it to the public. Why is Valve still held in high praise by some of the people I know?
rcblazer Nostalgia? Steam is fucking horrible to buy games from now. Finding anything takes for bloody ever because of all the crap you have to sift through.
Because you have dumb communists like Sterling who go to Valve and say "anything over 100 USD is too expensive for the poor starving indie devs!"
yeah, that's right, ol'fatty here RECOMMEND the mere $100 fee to Valve when they met, thank HIM.
Because upping the fee and giving Valve even _more_ money in exchange for doing jack shit is _totally_ going to fix a system that relies on horrifically flawed automation and be a _good thing_ for struggling indie developers in a market that is oversaturated even _without_ asset flips clogging the pipelines. Fuck off.
"Why is Valve still held in high praise by some "
I have a feeling it may have to do with stockholm syndrome
I hold it in high regard because its easy to use, downloads fast etc. A lot of people dont search for new games on steam. I only open the store tab when i know what i want to buy and just use the search bar.
The sad part is for a good chunk of users, this barely affects them. They see this shit, and roll their eyes, and go about their business, because they know what they want to buy, they know what they're saving for, and anything that isn't somewhat notable, or a good port of a console game isn't even going to catch their attention.
Which means that to people like that, people like me... much of Steam is a blurred white void that we wouldn't click on for anything.
You know, having a small team to sort through about 6000 games per year is actually quite manageable. There's no need to rely on algorithms to do the sorting for them. Valve is just being lazy
I was just doing some math and having ~6000 games submitted in a year, a team of two should be able to handle it if they review 10 games for at most 45 mins a day. Now that isn't unreasonable as that would at most put them at 7.5 hours of work a day. So yeah, valve is being lazy here..
Edit: Re-reading my comment I see I goofed and may need to clarify that it is 10 games in a day and each game gets at most 45 mins to review..
Nice you did the math but yeah steam does have a small team reviewing to games and steam makes money from each app that makes it to the steam store. So shitty free games go through you wasted you time with working out the man-hours involved.
Thats twenty per day. I could probably do that in my free time, and I'm attending fucking medical university.
psychologist. I'm supposed to visit a psychologist. I can't afford it... so i'll enjoy my madness until they haul me off in a straightjacket.
Wait. Hurt my sister?
What sister? Ohhh, you mean the one in my head?
yesss... i miss her. She lands a mean punch. Have you ever tried to fight an imaginary person who punches like a mule kicks?
hmmm... sister, eh? so... what have YOU got against YOUR sister, buddy?
ps, every word i stated there is TRUTH. I kid you not! Why in hades would i make that shit up? for every 5 decent hardworking medical students i knew, i knew about 1 or 2 who cheated their way thru medical training. Not just muslims. This is not about racism or 'islamophobia'. It's about MY personal experiences with some medical students i knocked around with. Not that big a deal to me though, perhaps, i did imagine it all.. eh?
Don't take the ramblings of a nutjob so personally. There's nothing personal about the statement.
well done on reading it though. Seriously.
The consequence of a monopoly: spending the extra money makes no economic sense for them, no marginal benefit.
I ran some quick numbers and with 6000 games released on Steam in a year, it comes out to about ~22 - ~23 games a day. All Valve needs to do is assign a team to review each game for less than 20 minutes and almost all the current steam games flood by the store can be easily kept out. Saying that it’s a small team (let’s say 5 people) and they get payed $10 an hour, and they work an 8 hour day, that’s only $400 a day or about $100,000 a year. In Valve money, that’s pretty cheap, all things considered.
Yeah trust me, we've all known those articles talking about how it's "impossible" to do proper house keeping for a company so big as Valve is complete and utter bullshit.
If most big retailers can do it with PHYSICAL products, them Steam can do it with digital.
And they already have the $100 submission fee for games, that should mostly cover the quality control team...
well, to be honest, if you include taxes, overheads managers, it at least doubles if not triples
still it's less than half a million, a year
and nobody says that a submission, without guarantee of acceptance, needs to be free...
Hire independent contractors to review steam games. Ill do it from my house if Valve paid me 10 bucks an hour.
Hell, I'm willing to bet a ton of people would do this for free. Valve just needs to give them an unpaid internship on their resume.
You know something is wrong when you're wishing for Green light to come back because there we (the users) at least had the Illusion of voting for something to be accepted... It's now worse than ever.
Well actually, Steam Greenlight HAD some filtering capabilities (close to nil, but that's still more than Steam Direct). The issue was that is was way too easy to abuse, as dirty devs could either simply bribe people into giving them their vote or using bots to get enough upvotes to be released. The only way to fix this is to reduce the amount of users to a fairly small group of players with some real credibility, which could be earned by participating in non-binding votes about whether a game should be released or not (for example). There are enough critics on YT and steam who would qualify for that, so getting a group together for this job would be a walk in the park.
That could work Like the algorithm would Choose what game FOR YOU and you chose to accept or not. And use some kind of captcha login to be able to vote in the first place. This Should Keep bots out and Stop Bribing since the venal has no choice on what they choose to vote on.
Except studies in comp sci have shown us that, at this point, the only way to make a bot-proof captcha is to make it human-proof as well.
"KEN! Why are you drinking pencils?!" omg that made me laugh so hard. what game was that?
ruclips.net/video/IwJ6aGbclGo/видео.html link to the video
Valve saved PC gaming and now is actively killing it, well done Valve
Pretty much this...
Sad isn't it?
what do you mean by "saved"? it needed saving?
Valve in a nutshell.
@Moth Tolias: Yes, PC gaming absolutely needed saving before Valve came to the rescue. Granted, Steam was somewhat terrible at first, the fact remains that its introduction made HUGE strides in PC gaming convenience. When Steam really got momentum in its early days, PC gamers like myself were amazed at how convenient and hassle-free it was compared to the preceding mess of dependency installations, missing DLLs, bad filename references, and GOD-AWFUL DRM. So yes, Steam (Valve) most assuredly did save PC gaming, and as Quixotic says, they are now actively killing it.
Wow, Pro Wrestling Ego actually responded. This is probably the best publicity they've ever gotten.
Hunter Ellis Jim can't walk up stairs without getting out of breath. Even with the acting of wrestling those guys would fucking wreck him.
Jim should stick to sumo wrestling. He just needs s giant spandex nappy/diaper.
I'll just leave you with that mental image.
Weird now how ppl keep saying its Jim's fault for go looking for them. Did any of them perhaps remember that was originally his job? To look for Indie's gems? How do you suppose he do his work if he don't go mining? Because he keep hitting shit and turds, ppl seemed to forget his original mission. Let the Sterdust bring back the glory!
These ppl dont see the problems with this that has been addressed over and over again.
Also. fuck "looking for them". I just wanna browse the store and there they are! 5 pages of nothing but garbage everyday. I tried to go with the flow. Tried to go digging for gold, yet came out of it all with just a single keeper (A game called "Kill the Superweapon" if you were curious. A quite decent twin-stick shooter in all honesty).
If simply trying to browse the new releases is unusable and broken, I think the problem is a bit too big to ignore and brush off as "Asking for it" or whatever the fuck. The recommendations Steam gives me can only go so far and they're games I didn't need Steam to recommend me to know about more than half of the time.
@@AlluMan96 why if youre going to release a game that has no connection to a previous ip, isnt crowd funded, or you just dont have public sway, see if epic will take it. If epic doesnt take it, pay to make a website since the whole point of store fronts is to make things browsable.
"After 9 years in development, hopefully it would have been worth the wait."
There's a starman waiting in the sky HOLY FUCK
STOP
AAAAAAAA
A
A
A
A
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w-e-i-g-h-t
This guy uses like bots.
Timothy Hilditch it's just that clever
It's weight, not wait. But I'm not sure if it was weight because of GabeN or weight because Team Fortress 2 turns available gigabytes in your PC into virtual hats.
It's a fucking shame to be true, they earn 100 million dollars from the Dota2 TI alone, they could easily hire 2-3 people to curate... They'd only have to look through like 5 games each a day and most games are easily judged within 10 seconds.
BOI you just had back surgery! Don't get yourself injured!!
It's so tedious to sift through all the shit on Steam to find the GOOD new releases. It's a shame to see quality titles never get to their full sales potentials.
This. No matter how much someone defends it, Steam is now a place I don't visit with anything like an excited air of curiosity. I can't browse it, I can't trust its recommendations. If I were making games, I wouldn't want my game to be associated with that.
Problem there is that Steam is the leading place for indie games. Another option (perhaps far better) is GOG, since they do handle every game submission with real person.
GOG is my go to place now. I hardly ever look at steam anymore TBH :\
@Martin, but at least the stores I go to don't allow people to put a a bag of literal shit and call it Coco Flake's to sell, the way Steam does. I feel bad for devs like Arcen Games (who i love) or other small teams who deserve the notice.
Feel the same way about the Android market. I'm scared to download anything that I haven't looked into big time, because i know it's gonna be some pay to win bullshit
It really is baffling to me that Steam won't just hire some people to take care of this. Do a little math with me. Let's say Steam does hit 5,000 games released this year, we'll assume an 8 hour work day, a 250 day work year, that it takes 1 hour to determine if a game is an asset flip or something else that doesn't belong on the Steam storefront (which is likely an overestimation), and that you want each game to be checked by two different people.
5000 games
÷
250 days
÷
8 hours per day
x
2 people need to check each game
=
5 people to hire
5. 5 is the number of people Valve would have to hire to do this job. They wouldn't need special skills or a lot of training. Pay them each 50k a year and Steam will have cleared out its storefront for one quarter million out of hundreds of millions in profit.
After all the bullshit with your back a few months ago, are you sure getting into wrestling is a good idea?
That's part of the joke, methinks.
"And in the left corner
, sweating profusely from standing...."
The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Its time to add Steam Direct to the cobblestones.
"The road to hell is paved with good intentions." No, no it isn't
Maybe not, but it has to be paved with something, and Steam Direct fits the bill.
I don't see any good intentions, just profit motive.
I don't get it. Would curating those 6000 games be that hard? Let's take 10 people, for instance. If those people went through 100 games a day, that's 1000 games a day. Five more days later and you have yourself those 6000 games successfully curated. That's less than a bloody week. Even doing fifty games a day would take less than half a month. Hell, one person could possibly pull off going through those games given the whole year. 6000/365 is less than twenty games a day. Of course, this is all assuming that deciding if a game is worth being on steam takes less than ten minutes. Even then, though, would it take so many people to go through it all?
This. So much this!
Martin Johnson id do it for fucking peanuts, not free games, i wouldnt even want to keep the games, id do it for say $30 a day
Thats nothing, id be doing around six hours a day of game checking for less than minimum wage easy
Just because itd be something to do and i want to see steam not be a big pile of cold shit
Maybe narrowing or structuring the problem would make it more appealing to Valve. I was thinking of quality control flags where aspiring developers would request a quality review by Valve to gain a determination if their game meets at least a base-level of acceptance.
Where games that just need a little more tweaking for eligibility could be given direction and games/aspiring developers who outright abuse the quality control teams time would almost entirely if not entirely forfeit future consideration.
But as Jim has said (and I am likely paraphrasing), it maybe just that steam does not want its hands directly involved.
@Martin Kasakov Is this what it's like to be completely insane?
@Chosen One 41 - No, he's right. Business is shitty and you have to account for all possibilities like that when you make a proposal for a new system. You can't just try something and see if it works, you need to have pretty much everything figured out in advance for anyone to consider your idea.
I've now found upwards of four unashamed hentai games on Steam. Of course, they have the R-18 included only in a separate patch, but still. These are not games like Nekopara and the Sakura games, which can stand on their own without R-18 content, but games that are entirely centered around such content. As much as I hate to give Steam Greenlight credit, this never happened while it was active.
Dunno what the problem is there, necessarily. If they're shit games, that's a problem. If they're perfectly average ecchi VNs, there's a huge market already.
What are the four hentai games?
It's for research...
I mean, as long as they're R-18 why not. Its like criticizing porn for showing sex instead of having a good story.
yes these games are disgusting. what are they called so i can leave a scathing review
Sakuragames is a terrible company. They still majority of their designs and their games are horribly translated. You can just save your money and go watch hentai or play a real game.
My suggestion is for you to never interview valve ever again. What they told you was obviously just damage control while they secretly planned to double down on their shitty practices.
Valve is seriously no better than EA or Activision.
anonymous6705 too bad there are way too many people stuck with it,because all the price drop in the steam,and not many people admit valve is suck
I'm no apologist for valve, theyre shit and there's no doubt but they arent on the level of EA or Activision at all. EA and Activision are almnost malicious in their practices, they actively deceive, manipulate and fuck over their audience. Valve are just negligent and lazy, they always take the path of least effort, sitting back and doing nothing is easier than curation, so thats what they do.
anonymous6705 Exactly.
Shots fired!!!
Valve should start a new program calling Steam Redlight, wherein the community votes on which games should be removed from Steam.
A game becomes nominated for Redlight if it's review scores fall beneath a certain standard. Once a game is nominated, everyone who owns the game is asked two simple questions: "Do you believe this game is worth the money you spent on it? Yes or No?" and "Why do you feel this way? *Insert various reasons with checkboxes here". If the game receives enough "No" votes, it will be removed from Steam permanently, but all who bought it keep the game in their library.
I feel like this could work because Valve barely has to put any effort forth in order for this work (which is typical of the systems they tend to implement) and it relies on the opinions of those that have bought the game rather than those who have no investment.
Edit 1: Also the creator doesn't get their $100 back. >:]
Edit 2: Thank you for being constructive with your critiques. >>:]
Please feel free to criticize this solution as I haven't completely thought it through.
I feel like that would be too open to abuse, say a group (subreddit etc.) dislike a developer because of something unrelated to the game, like political opinions etc. they could just vote all there games off steam even if the games themselves are good.
You would again need humans checking this stuff to watch out for stuff like and if steam wont do that for the stuff coming onto the store they probably wouldn't bother with the stuff coming off it either and instead require creators to send in a dispute like youtube does and then your just putting game developers in the same bad position youtube creators are constantly put in.
Von Skeleman What's your solution to the very real possibility of a SDirect developer buying enough copies of his own game to tip the Redlight scale in his favor?
Why not just make the entry amount 3000 instead of 100.
Would be way less clutter I believe
Ugore
They would have to buy enough copies of the game to tank the review scores AND every single owner of the game would be asked to vote. I can maybe see it being a problem for Indie devs, so you do raise a good point.
Bersilus
While that's a valid idea, I'm talking about how to cull all of the bad games from Steam. Unless you're suggesting retroactively asking $3000 for every game that came through Direct and Greenlight, your solution is only a gatekeeper for future releases. It's not a bad idea, just not exactly relevant to what I'm suggesting.
Oh man, you have to do a 'Three Faces of Mankind' deal at the wrestling show and appear as Ster Dust, Jim Sterling and Duke Amiel.
Quijiboh what about the Corn Flakes Homunculus?
Alex Snitzer - Not many things that can be done with that character in a pro-wrestling setting.
What about the Steam Cleaner?
Merged Zamasu The Steam Cleaner would be an excellent gimmick villain.
The problem with Steam at this point is that you no longer can browse the store without getting flooded with constant crap. The filters and settings are too blunt and feel bare minimum, even during a good sale the number of steps/clicks to put a game in your shopping cart are too many (take any other online shop and compare, Steam is at least 10 years behind regarding usability). Most of the time I don't even bother with checking stuff out via Steam, I just buy the stuff from Green Man Gaming because it's a nicer store front and easier to browse. I hardly ever look at the Steam store anymore, if I need to look something up on Steam I just do a direct search.
This dawned on me just during the autumn sale, I couldn't be bothered with looking up any great deals. I just checked my wishlist to see if anything I already knew about was sporting a good deal. Couldn't be bothered with anything else, don't have the patience anymore since there is so much crap to wade through.
To be honest, you can't even browse your discovery queue without the crap getting in nowadays. Just last night I got recommened two games "because they're new" that looked like ass, had no reviews at all and were from devs that had very questionable other content.
On the other hand, after a few months of not watching Jim Sterling videos but still very actively using Steam, I legitimately forgot that Steam had bad games on it. The algorithm is working perfectly for me.
How!? How is it worse!? Steam called you and other people over to explain to them what the problem is... How did they manage to make it worse!?
Tayvin4042
Because they never intended to fix it; only hide it. They failed at even that.
You ever have anyone ask you for advice then not take it? It's like that, except 6000 times in one year
Tayvin4042 because they fucking did not listen obviously.
No wonder Scott Cawthon is deciding whether or not he wants to put his next game coming in December (he intentionally left it vague), on Steam or Gamejolt! Steam has turned into RUclips 2.0, even down to the faulty algorithms! STOP USING ALGORITHMS! IT’S NOT 2237!
I get my PC games on GOG whenever I can. GOG has quality control actively handled by real people, Steam has reactions to outrage as its only quality control. GOG provides DRM free installers so you can back up your games, Steam is DRM. If I had a choice I would never get games through Steam.
Old GOG user here. Quality control is still a thing there, yes.
And DRM-free installers, even it their client is being pushed in increasingly annoying ways is also still an (important) thing.
But I find myself only buying old releases on GOG these days since there is a reasonable chance of games only getting updates on steam and being abandoned by the developers on other platforms.
Nyx
Yeah. That happened to PDX games.
Offtopic:
Germans appearently didn't learn about the EA Lootbox fiasco because Battlefront 2 is the number one sold game in germany right now, on consoles atleast. On PC the number one sold game there is Farming Simulator, go figure.
The divide between consoles and PC is more extreme here than anywhere else. On console, the 15yo angry kids reign supreme, on PC it's just their dads, wishing for a simpler life on a farm. We did make Spec Ops: The Line though, so that's something?
Probably just the AfD getting together to roleplay as the First Order
Spec
Also based in Germany, are Crytek (made Crysis, Far Cry 1), as well as Shin'en (responsible for the Nano Assault and FAST Racing series). Both known for very technically impressive (and also fun) games.
And there's Piranha Bytes, who made Gothic, Risen, and recently, Elex; games that may not be perfect, but are evidently made with passion. They're also against microtransactions/lootboxes, so that's nice.
The german market doesn't care about things like that. Only few people might have heared about the controversy. Germany is basically a mainstream gaming country where Fifa, CoD and commercially hyped up AAA-titles reign supreme no matter how shitty they are.
tl;dr pc gaming is dead
Are you sure about accepting the Sterdust invitation? Jim you're gonna slip a fuckin disc again.
this, even if it's choreographed it's still pretty brutal. I thought the plan was to aim for the sters rather than a wheelcher.
aaronbill3 He's joining the sumo event.
Jim - I am in Wisconsin, and have trained with Matt Winchester (Beer City Bruiser - ROH) and Frankie DeFalco - Will be returning after the holidays to continue training as a manager.
If you have never bumped before - I'm a dude of large size. Your first day in the ring taking any number of bumps beyond, say, two - is going to feel like being in a hundred car accidents. (This is normal, but I'd slam an Aleve on the way to bed that first night - as if you were prepping for one hell of a hangover.)
Go back and immediately continue training on the day they want you back. Don't hesitate - your body has to adapt. And man, being heavy means you're going to KILL at bumping -- the sound you'll get out of a hip toss will probably be the only spot you'll do as a manager - and folks will go apeshit.
If you're wrestling - I hope you're already training. If you're ever up near Milwaukee or Madison - ping me. I can introduce you to some of the local indy guys - I design shirts for them as well. :D
If you want a sweet ass SterDust shirt - I can do it for you for the lowest price you've ever heard of.
Will jim get into an hospital because of this sterdust business?
Find out next on Jimquisition!
Dammit Jim be careful
Gabe needs to get out of his house of knives and fix his fucking product.
spam mcspam
Or atleast announce Half life 3.
Why the hell would you ever need anywhere near 5,000 achievements in a game? Valve is fucking asking for abuse with that. What legit game would even need 100 achievements?
Matt Skora Why do we even need achievements, they are completely useless.
I think the better question is why do people care about achievements. I could perhaps understand if there was sort of cash back program, but Valve does not have one
Thus the work of the Steam Cleaner will never be done.
Imagine the day someone has to clean the steam store... they could make a horror survival game about it, tie to some novels sell some merchandise and release a movie.
Legion12Centurion I’d be better then most stuff on Steam these days.
Jim, are you really going to let sterdust go all the way out there and actually wrestle those poor guys?
I just hope he doesn't injure his back further...otherwise I would love to see him wrestle.
I mean, it wouldn't be the craziest thing pro wrestling has ever pulled.
I would watch this. I don't watch wrestling, but I would watch this.
It always brings a smile to my face when Jim uses Drill Queen to start his video
STEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERDUSTTTTTTTTTTT!!!!!!!!!!!!!
*inhale*
*chomp*
You should mention GOG, they actually curate games over them and give them a window even if they tend to push "retro-styled" stuff over anything else.
I only just found out about you fairly recently, but I've been binge watching your Jimquisition episodes and Steam Greenlight trailers and I have to say I really love your content and manor of speaking. You have such great comedic timing! And by the Gods you're so damn creative, so much content and so much stuff to watch, I really do love it. And you're so smart and sassy too. I hope this makes you feel nice if you read it. c: Kind of want to try to be a YT personality one day, and you're a bit of an inspiration for me, if that isn't obvious haha..
I'll be there. Get em Sterrrrrrdust. Reach for those Sterrs.
Jim has your next episode already - Bungie quietly DOUBLED the exp required to level up, without telling anyone beforehand. This is fucking hilarious! DE2 players getting screwed left and right at this point
We need footage of Sterdust in the ring Jim! WE. NEED. THIS! I want to witness what a winner looks like!
This is why I said that Direct has to be at least 300-500 dollars.
100 dollars is way too cheap to get a game onto Steam.
I simply cannot understand how a company as big as Valve can allow their reputation to be rammed into the dirt like this for so long. What are they thinking? Do they actually believe this will lead to something "positive" in the future?
Steam is well known as the gate keeper to gaming on PC. No matter how shitty it gets, nothing can compare. They will milk it for as long and as much as they can at this point.
I guess you don't need the reputation if you've got the money. EA and Activision certainly seem to think that way.
A clear case of hubris. As long as they have no real competition, why should they put in the extra effort to clean up their mess?
That's a monopoly for you. When there is no practical way around Steam, you can afford to mistreat your customers.
They just dont think about the future.
Cleaning up that garbage on steam would be profitable in long run, but they think only about immediate income.
when jim said "atleast with greenlight, alot of shitty games tried to be creatively shitty", did anyone else immediately think of candice de'bebe
Someone should make a fighting game where the roster is made-up entirely of Jim's alternative personas, with Jim himself as the ringmaster.
Edit: And post it on GoG
But then nobody would see it.
holy shit SterDust is gonna wrastle?! GET HYPE!
"British Man Seen Beating Horse-Shaped Greasy Spot In Middle Of Giant Field."
*Overwatch cancelled you precious Firefly*
LMAO I stopped the video just to comment on this and your comment was the at the top!
Made me laugh.
Fuck Blizzard
Explain this joke please?
is this memes?
Alexander Castro-Vera it was in the opening credit sequence. found amusing!
Is he talking about the show?
HOW DID THE FLY GET IN?!?!?!
-Jim Sterling, 2017
Melo Dotty Oh for fuck sake...
The fly got in thanks to Steam Direct!
I know it's just wishful thinking, but I fucking hope their holiday sales tank this year. That's the only thing I can imagine that would make Valve act.
We've been saying as soon as it was announced that steam direct would change nothing. I guess we're wrong since things have actually gotten WORSE. No longer do games need to swindle greenlight votes, now they just pay the tab and walk right in. There's even less human oversight than there was before, as in, NO human oversight.
...Are we sure Valve and RUclips aren't run by the same people? It kinda sounds like they're run by the same people. Thank god...FOR STERDUST.
Melo Dotty more like same bots and algorithms, not people
Mr. Sterdust....was one of the people who suggested the low low low entry fee of $100 USD when he spoke to Valve..something he conveniently leaves out of this video.
Our fat little communist helped to create this problem, as he thinks that "poor indie devs" can't afford a 4-$5,000 USD entry free. you know, like an adult could.
Everybody can make youtube videos and everybody can release game on steam. We need better bots. Or people watching wtf bots are doing
Publicly traded tech companies will automate anything that is reasonable to automate with algorithms or AI, because by lowering the money invested in a product without altering the sale of those products the amount of profit made will increase.
The only issue with this strategy for a company is if it is sustainable in the long term.
It's run by greed, like the rest of the world.
just came back here in time to remind myself of how good this channel was!
You don't think the channel is good anymore?
@@gamerinatrance3618 how latest jimquisition was ok, but overall no I don't think it's as good as it was!
Jim, don't do the wrestling thing, your back will not thank you. You are going to end up on the mat with gallstones pouring out of your mouth wishing you had never heard the name Ster-Dust.
How dare you speak such HERESY of Ster-Dust! God itself created Ster-Dust as the ultimate wrestling machine, imbued with the essence of pure wrestling and powered by supernovas, The sun will never set on Ster-Dust and his glorious wrestling prowess!
You don't think he knows what kind of brutality to expect? They wouldn't even agree to do this with Jim if they weren't sure he could handle it. But yeah your back will hate you in the morning, Jim.
I think he knows, but I suspect that the day after or as he's hurried to a nearby medical centre on the day, he may at that moment really know. I appreciate his enthusiasm, but given his long term health issues, this is a bit reckless... even for ster-dust.
they could also be planning a fakeout (as pro wrestling goes) and just have some silly thing they organize together. whatever they're doing, there's no stopping jim's crazy ass when his mind is set on something, so all we can do is hope that said something isn't too crazy.
IAMSTRINDOM They end up playing videogames in the ring. :D
It's upsetting to hear about the state of Steam Direct. I've been making games for years, and I've been wanting one of my next games to go on Steam. But if that ever happens, I wonder how much attention it would even get, no matter how much I tried to campaign and promote it there. Or if it'd just get buried under all the asset-flips. :(
+Snarbalax That's true! XD Luckily, my game, once it's made, will not blow (if my past games are anything to go by), so I'll at least have that on my side. That's actually a bit of a confidence boost, thinking like that.
Still... it makes me wonder what good games I've missed on Steam. I ended up loving The Sexy Brutale, but the only reason I discovered it was from Jim's video of it. :)
Katy133 well if/when you make a game you feel is good enough, maybe its worth sending to jim instead? Who knows, he might really enjoy it and throw in an offer of voice acting. Or a video about it.
Dragongelf I'll definitely consider it. Jim may not cover it, but there's no harm in politely sending him a copy. :)
Snarbalax well we made a pretty good game even with a publisher attached. Though nobody bought it. Crookz: The Big Heist. Its a tactic puzzle heist game that is reminiscent of Commandos and the Sting. Our reviews are pretty good. But well the sales numbers arent there...
Same... Gamemaker hobby aint no more. :(
Hey, Peter Jackson’s King Kong is a badass game. You can’t hate on romping through the jungle with a tommy gun, blasting ten foot centipedes and poking t-rexes with a broken stick. 10/10, totally no nostalgia.
It's shitty for us devs too. Those of us who put real work into a game as an indie are just drowned out by the total shit on Steam.
I just don't get it. Valve makes INSANE amounts of money through Steam and their own online games. They can't afford to hire a couple of people to make sure this crap doesn't happen? It wouldn't take much!
Well Jim even saod that valve gets a portion of ALL sales. Maybe all these asset flips make steam stuipid rich compared to just being rich?
Nick Piers but that would require them to do actual work and spend money, then they would have some money and not all the money.
It doesn't make sense to me either.
Nick Piers Not if they want ALL THE MONEY, and not just SOME of the money. Besides, they're still the biggest platform on PC (for now), and until someone begins outselling them, they couldn't care less. And by then, it'll be too little, too late.
The can afford it. They just don't want to because they're basically a monopoly.
It's getting even worse, the shittiest "companies" are even exploiting the Early Access new releases and coming soon pages, making it even harder for the regular/good devs to get their fair share of visibility, like you say, the time they get is already small enough. There's 1 game, Wild Buster, that has "released" in EA 8 times in the past 2 weeks. Waiting until they have gone on to page 2 before putting the release date back by 3 days, to get straight back on page 1 on the coming soon page and then new back on to the new releases again 2 days later, just to try and get people to click through to their website to buy the game their instead. What's even worse, the publisher, the one pulling these tricks, find failed f2p asian games that were abandoned 4-5 years ago, put up an indiegogo to pretend it's new, then release it in EA and pretend its an alpha/beta while hold back 4yr old content until it's localised. Disgraceful.
And this is why I barely use Steam anymore.
That and my gaming laptop is so outdated it can't run any modern games.
Saaaame.
Intro sponsored by Darth Sterling
They can always hire you as leader of this editorial team. You are pretty much doing that already
Fun fact Jim... There were Nazi Muslims... Their Divisions name was, 13th Waffen Mountain Division of the SS Handschar.
The More You Know.
AFAIK, Nazi Germany had a good relationship with muslim countries, as several of them were anti-semitists and/or had hatred towards Allied nations.
I wouldn't actually mind that much if steam's pseudo monopoly got overthrown cause that might force valve to actually make some fucking games.
Fargoth Ur They announced a Dota Card Game a while back
History will remember November 27th, 2017 as the beginning of the Sterdust Era
What monstrosities hath Valve wrought?
All I know is boycotting won’t work. Cause the Steam sales here, and I’m planning to buy everything on the Jimquisition Awards.
Boycott only works if the target has something to lose. Steam is just a Retailer. The Conmen run the show and they dont give a shit what you do.
Support the GoG (of The WItcher fame) store as an alternative to Steam instead? They have sales too, you know.
Morgan The Skald GoG of witcher fame? Lolwtf.
+Blue Yeah.
Yup, GoG is a division by CD Projekt, just like CD Projekt RED (The ones who made The Witcher) is also one.
Do algorithms ever work? I've rarely ever found anything I liked because it was suggested to me on Steam, and RUclips constantly tells me I would be interested in things I have absolutely no interest in whatsoever.
Same. As an example, not trying to start anything, but I speak out a lot against alternative medicine and Facebook is constantly showing me ads for alternative medicine groups. Like seriously, fuck off.
In a pure programmer sense, they work constantly. Every game you've ever enjoyed likely employs a dozen or so common ones.
Lord Kuraba The only algorithm that mostly works is Google Search. Apart from that they pretty much all suck.
The thing is that it's working perfectly. It's giving you ads based on that because it knows you interact a lot with that topic. If you interact with a topic, you might also interact with a product. If you interact with a product, you are spreading awareness of it even if it's negative. The more people aware of a product, the more likely more people will interact with it and hopefully buy it.
+ Matthias Forelli
This comment makes my inner computer scientist angry. Seems like the word algorithm is going to start being meaningless from common usage.
That Metal Gear Solid 1 Psycho Mantis Hymn intro is always a good choice of music.
Steam is not a browse for me, it's a destination. I have to have interest on the game first to buy it and then it can come from Steam. Other then that, forget it.
It's like going to walmart and complaining about the shitty products they sell.
RUclipsrs like us will help spereate the shit from the great games, but it's still hard for great games to get attention when they don't have a large publisher.
I think that's true, but doesn't that provide an opportunity for developers and reviewers? Instead of Steam, the Devs have to either develop a genuine good game for review or, of course, try pay off reviewers to turn to the dark side?
Jim be careful and make sure your heart is healthy enough to be rolling around with a bunch of sweaty dudes in spandex costumes
Greg Burrow I mean his back too, he kinda just fucked that up and got it fixed recently
Tripleat omg yea how could I forget I had a herniated disc that shit doesn't just go away
"Ken! Why are you drinking pencils!?" That whole bit had me dying.
Hello there Mr. Sterling, I just wanted to let you know you've been a great inspiration to me. I hope you keep doing what you're doing for a very long time and I hope your future holds a bit more possitivity, which you can talk about in your show. I wish you and your family the best. I hope I get to meet you one day and thank you in person, but if for some reason I can't - Thank you for everything.
- Nik
I've said it before, and I'll say it again - I actually now MISS Greenlight.
And isn't that fucking depressing.
I remember when you were pushing for this and you where responsible for the state of steam and you were just a hot shit sitting in front of Valve staff at the conference with you and the other two youtubers and how all the suggestions came from you and you where to be praised for saving steam and guiding in it times to come.
Good job Jim. Good job.
For anyone who hasn't noticed it, there's always a different message next to the cornflakes homunculi in the intro every episode.
You're welcome. :)
Eventually, another platform or way of distribution will end up rising above the din as a direct result of real, actual indie developers realizing that Steam just isn't a viable place to sell their games on anymore. The sheer amount of crap getting pushed on Steam is going to choke it to death eventually, because a platform that offers no support and no visibility to people who actually give a shit about making a good product will eventually lose the support of those very devs that a storefront fucking depend on.
I'm not saying Steam will die soon, and I'm not saying it won't still be raking in a ton of cash if and when indie devs put their foot down and their heads together to find an alternative, because fuck knows I'm not that naive, but eventually, I predict (and hope) to see the indie games that are worth a damn find a platform that actually cares about quality control over making bank on card farmers and asset flip schlock.
I sure as fuck hold no hope for Steam realizing that having actual humans overlook what goes on their storefront would make their brand and platform more valuable to the average consumer in the long run. That'd be the smart long-term move and show some semblance of integrity. That seems to be a forreign concept to big gaming companies these days. :/
Well if Steam keeps this shit up, everyone else will have no choice but to go to GOG. And praise the day that happens. No-DRM for every game? Yes fucking please and thank you very much.
I don't know why I never realized before that the Jim Sterling character would make a great heel wrestling manager.
I forget why we all thought Steam Direct was a good idea. It’s like when my eye hurts and I want to solve it by removing said eye.
Because Valve promised to employ actual human oversight when they were interviewing Jim, TB and others.
Artemiy Solopov yep, which turned out to be "some algorithm" instead.
I believe it had to do with a belief that people who make asset flips wouldn't want to risk spending about 500 on trying to put their game up and loss money. Ends up nope they don't mind
It got worse because instead of going through a period of scrutiny it's now just a matter of giving Steam a little money and you're in. Valve just wanted to profit off trash games while looking like the good guy who's trying to fix the problem.
Before we thought steam direct would be steam taking direct control over what does and does not go on the platform. What it really meant was that anything is now allowed directly on steam.
Valve: Quality control? What the fuck is that?
Its Sad to see Steam going down the shitter!
It's time or another Steam cleaning.
I guess this is another reason so many Indie developers are putting their games on the Switch instead.
Well, another instance of non-regulated systems going to shit. Contrary to what some apologists would say, a more regulated Steam would be a higher quality steam.