Mr. Lachlan, your reviews are always amazing and I am grateful for your kind words. I would like to provide some additional information about my current TOTL XLR cables. The signal conductor is made of pure OCC silver and the shielding is composed of silver-plated copper. This wire was personally designed by me after testing and and is not a pre-made product. I am pleased to hear that my cables perform exceptionally well compared to more expensive options.
Thanks for the extra info, Antonio. Yes, for the price, they are doing an excellent job and can make it hard to justify spending the hundreds dollars more for higher spec cables
@@PassionforSound I'm extremely happy to hear that, that's exactly what my goal is to bring cables that perform at a very high level but without the extreme price tag
A lower impedance drive source can drive higher capacitance cables, it's just that simple. Every shielded cable has a "Capacitance Per Foot" (or Meter) measurement. Your system needs to have the ability to drive this capacitance. In short, long cables should be XLR types, RCA type cables are better used in short runs, unless a lower impedance drive source is used for those RCA cables. Have a great day.
Paul, If there was only one person to listen to about all things electronic - I'm in your camp for sure! If I had 10% of your knowledge, I'd be dangerous. Thanks for all you do.
I really do believe cable manufacturers are just charging lots of money for something that doesn't do much. I have a high end system, and everything is connected with made in China unbranded cables. These are all really well made, properly shielded, but they don't have a name on them. The sound is absolutely fantastic, and so it should be given the components involved. These cable company have been ripping people off for a long time. And yes, in my time I have heard cables from Chord, AP, Nordost, QED, Audioquest and others. I was gullible when younger. I believed their lies.
I like those copper colored cables with the Furutech ends. You should try the oil filled RCA’s. Possibly the best around. Silver purity plus openness in sound.
I recommend Mogami wire, Neutrik connectors, a soldering iron and silver bearing solder. If you're using generic cables or made in china cables it will be a big sound upgrade that costs almost nothing. This kind of cable is industry standard in recording studios as part of signal chains that cost more than a house. Cables make a difference, but I think it's a bad idea to spend on them.
No doubt there's a point at which spending more money makes no sense, but the idea that the industry standard is Mogami with Neutrik, etc. is a bit misleading. Just like with any industry, there are the cheap and basic setups, the average setups and the top tier setups. There are plenty of studios using higher end cables as well (like Analysis Plus who have a dedicated pro range)
@@PassionforSound It is industry standard. On the back of a Rupert Neve AD converter are Neutrik jacks. The most expensive cables at pro audio supply stores are Mogami Gold. A Mogami Gold XLR cable is a quadrupole braided shield cable made in Japan with OFC with Neutrik connectors that were made in Lichenstein with great engineering and materials that end up being plugged into gear with Neutrik connectors on it. It doesn't get more standard than that. There are different levels, but that is considered high end. The engineering that goes into them is legitimately advantageous vs. less expensive options. I've seen it, I've cut, stripped and soldered and heard it. Studios are often wired with Mogami wire between rooms and in the patch bay if someone really cares about quality. I won't say that is no difference between what is high end standard and those super expensive exotic audiophile cables, but the pro standard is the benchmark to compare everything else to and when the price exceeds a certain point it's time to get skeptical. I think perhaps some exotic audiophile configurations for marketing purposes may even be at disadvantage. When a small company has a more affordable option says their cable is OCC wire, there's no way to verify that. Real OCC copper is often more expensive than the entire cable that is being sold claiming to have it in there. For any audiophiles that want to know they have a good cable with legit materials without emptying their wallet, they should bypass the audiophile market completely.
@@PassionforSound no genelec uses cables no more than $40 per meter. None of the expensive cable you are listing are used in any of the most expensive studio suits. Not one. They use cables like the ones the OP mentioned. The reason is because the difference between cables is far smaller than your let on even in $100000+ interfaces.
@@BlackthorneSoundandCinema hes talking crap, no major studio installation uses cable like analysis plus. Maybe for a private client, but no big commercial mastering suit would ever use them.
You say "science" a lot, but they give no electrical data on what they actually do differently whatsoever. Just their topology. If the topology is based on science, then they would show *how* its based on science. What they did isn't science.
@@DaveJ6515 you just answered your own question. You can't have reproducible science without data. Data is what is used to compare what is reproducible. What a dunce. 😂
You are the standard by which all other reviews should be judged. Thank you for keeping the audiophile audience -- with real ears and real budgets in mind.
@@PassionforSound I guess what I was saying is that your objectivity -- your consideration of factors other than the product in your hand and it's potential to be promoted by what you say about it -- makes your channel stand out from others who *purport* to be doing that. In their case -- and I understand why you do not want to speak about them -- they are so entangled with the incentives of marketing (even sotto voce) that they fail to deliver knowledge. They deliver, instead, "infotainment." Infotainment, in my view, often can function to disinform for anyone seeking to learn. Not always, but often. You don't do that. Just my opinion.
I have a local pro audio store (Performance Audio in SLC, UT) that will make custom cables... Typically I will spend $50 - $80 on a pair of XLR cables 8-12 feet long. They use neutrik connectors and pretty great cables. It's not fancy high end cables nor is it the budget amazon basics bunch.
I think that's what it's about, Ace - finding the level that performs as you need and costs what you want to spend. This comparison confirmed for me where the value proposition starts to taper off
It is absolutely about Synergy and personal preference as you have said. I upgraded the Elite's cable to a Lavricable Grand Silver cable "hoping" it wouldn't make it too bright and it didn't. Details were extended nicely and I was very happy with the upgrade. Bass still full and meaty. When I bought my Feliks Envy the retailer had Siltech 650i Interconnects between the DAC (same DAC as mine) and the Amp. It sounded amazing but of course that is mostly down to the amp. The thing is when I asked how much the interconnect was and they said £1750 I said "there is no way I'm spending that on a cable - that's ridiculous". So; we tried some "cheaper" £600 and £1000 different chord cables. As long as it wasn't any worse I would go as cheap as possible. Thing is the £600 cable sounded so similar to the £1750 one I really couldn't tell the difference but the £1000 one sounded really off to me. It was almost muddy. So...I ended up spending £1750 on the more expensive one simply because "what if I get it home and think..it's not as good as in the store. I'll always be wondering - was it the cable?" lol True (and expensive) Story
What's great here is that you got to try it for yourself so you could know what you liked and what was worth spending the money on vs what wasn't. Thanks for sharing!
I’m not a cable guy but love grabbing a bag of popcorn and reading the comments on any cable video lol😂 I wish my ears were good enough to hear a difference, but I just honestly can’t unless the cables are absolutely crap with a dodgy connection lol. I can’t see how a cable can improve the sound of a converted signal that has spent most of its existence travelling through very small cross section solder .. and unfortunately I can’t hear it either!
It's a strange thing how they alter the sound (and quite subtle too). I think even more strange is the vitriol that goes along with the topic. Thanks for sharing your experiences and doubts in a respectful and gentle way, Ross! 🙂
About earring what "artist intend", note that 90% of the artist and producer works with "cheap" cables like Mogami gold. This idea of big professional studios with hundreds thousand dollars of equipment is not true anymore. They are some, but it's very probable that the recordings you like are not made in those... that is not contradicting what you are earring with those cables, but what artists do.
Contemporary artists rarely care about some qualities that audiophiles consider of primary importance in music reproduction. So "artist intend" is more or less the wrong way of putting it with modern music. Many classical music directors are very attentive to mixing, positioning, dynamics, sound color and so on. Others don't care too much. And you can hear it in the final product. An example of an artist who cares for audiophile qualities in his music tracks is David Gilmore. His Live Concert from Pompei is a joy to the ears.
@@DaveJ6515 I red once an article in a recording magazine that detailed the equipment used in some legendary recordings. I was amazed to discover that some of my favorite vocal performance was recorded during repetition with a 150$ mic (sm58). I wonder what was the cables used in Miles's Kind of blue recording and I would bet there was no 1200$ 1 meter cables ;)
@@guystpierrecomposer a good friend of mine played with Carlos Santana. He had a recording studio in his basement. No fancy cables at all. When he heard the sound of my setup he said that it was wonderful, totally enjoyable, but beyond what they were after when they recorded their tracks. He also told me that after recording together, Santana grabbed the dat cassette, and they drove to golden gate park. When they bridge was in sight, he pushed play, and after listening, he said that it was just right, and that he needed that test because he imagined that the average person who listened to their music would do that in a car, driving on a road along the ocean.
I think trying to capture "what the artist intended" is a fool's errand. There are many "artists" in the recording process so who exactly is the artist with the intent? I get that some people are seeking the most accurate and uncoloured system they can build, but even that is tricky because we have no actual reference for what is correct from an electrical point of view. Sure, silver conducts better than copper, but is that more accurate or is the "filtering" applied by a copper cable more "accurate" than the greater transparency of silver? You could argue the semantics and details forever.
I buy my cables from sonic art in Melbourne.. around $300 for high quality silver 1 meter xlr pair. Buy straight from the maker and by pass the retailer mark up…
That's an interesting question and one I haven't tested. I do know that the very basic and very short pair of interconnects I own aren't as good as the better, but longer ones I own. I can't say where the balance point is though.
@@PassionforSound Ok… that’s good to know… but you have to admit it would be ridiculous to install a full meter, and unfair to be charged by the meter #jussayin
Ah, I see what you're saying! If you go to a custom cable manufacturer (some of the big brands do this and many of the boutique brands) then they'll charge to length, not by metre. One challenge though is that the connectors and the labour component of wiring up the cables will remain consistent so it won't drop the price to exactly 15% of a 1m cable 🙂
IME it makes sense to spend a lot on interconnects when you have the rest of the cables in place like power, digital, and your hp cable. I've experienced multiple times when a single piece of cable can be a significant bottleneck for the rest of the cables. That being said, interconnects offer the least impact vs all the other types of cables IME but I think they do offer a much bigger impact than you'd think. So hopefully when you get a chance to review other cables from other manufacturers I suggest asking for a full loom instead. I'm confident your conclusions will change. Of course, it also depends on how resolving your gear is as well...
My whole chain is pretty well optimised without spending a fortune (many people commenting on this video would say that I had already spent way too much). I am definitely of the belief that all connections and devices in the chain matter. I also agree with you that the interconnects seem to reach a point where the value of spending a significant amount more money becomes questionable after something like the Supra and Curious cables.
@@PassionforSound hmm i don't know about that (for most people though you're probably right). I went from mogami xlr to basic supra xlr to supra sword xlr to allnic mu-7r xlr and ended up with allnic because they tied the system oh so well that it was worth the cost to me (granted i didn't pay full price 🫢 but still pricey). Then again I wouldn't say that applies to every system haha
As Andrea said, yes you can, depending on the cables and system. I've done this in the past with family and friends where they didn't know that anything had been changed and they asked what was different because the sound was suddenly better
I'm neutral on cables, but most prices are absolutely gouging. Look up Radiall RF interconnects that go up to 40GHz or even higher, they're cheaper than the majority of high end cables.
There's a lot to it I think so saying most are gouging isn't really fair. I absolutely feel that, for my needs and my systems, the Curious and Supra cables are about the best I need, but I'm yet to try a "better" cable from a reputable manufacturer that doesn't offer either improvements or differences. The question then is value. I personally don't see enough difference to warrant the jump in price, but the companies making those cables are honestly just trying to make an even better cable with better materials, construction, etc. The problem is the costs go up much faster than the performance.
I actually did a big write-up on them years ago on my written site passionforsound.lachlanfennen.com but I should see if they have new options to try these days. I did include the Yukon XLR and RCA in either my Curious XLR or Supra Sword XLR review (or was that one video? I forget)
Fortunately most headphone set ups have short runs. My best cables are .75 m. costing about $100 each. They are "very upper mid-fi" to me. Cables matter...! Best, D.
It seems to me that going much higher than that starts to bring very minimal improvements that might actually just be different rather than better. Enjoy the tunes, D!
Excellent analysis! Since reviews on Supra audio interconnects are rare, this is the first impressive in-depth review that I found useful and effective in making decisions. Interestingly, I also used Analysis Plus Oval RCA 2 meter interconnects (for unbalanced connection between AVR and power amp) before switching to Mogami XLR 2 meter balanced connection from upgraded Pre-Pro to power amp. Q: Since I place pre-pro very close to power amp, would upgrading to Supra EFF-IXLR 1 meter interconnects be adequate? The old philosophy seems to have been short interconnects and long speaker cable until recent inverse to longer interconnects and shorter speaker cables. Thanks.
I've tried all different lengths of interconnects and the quality of the wire matters at any length so I would recommend that upgrade - I think you'll be impressed
Really random. Did you ever encounter delay in sound to lip movent when using the denafrips or musician dacs ? I'm on the goldensound server where this was made apparent and I was wondering why its not mentioned
I believe this is more common on Denafrips dacs than Musician. I owned a Musician Pegasus for about a year, and I had no issues with delay. I think I would've noticed as I played games with it, including titles like Lost Judgment that has rhythm timing mini-games in it.
@@marcusloo767 Yes, I use my dac for all kinds of media, including movies, games, youtube, and of course music. It's difficult to find info on whether some dacs have more input delay than others, and whether that delay could be a problem for certain types of media. In my case the Pegasus was no problem, and neither am I having any issues with the Audio GD R8 Mk2 I'm using right now. But If I wanted to upgrade to something in the price range of the Denafrips Terminator, then I could certainly run into problems.
I normally use any DACs I'm testing for some editing work where audio sync is important so if I don't mention it in a video, there should be no problems.
cracks me up that all these esoteric cable manufacturers and their advocates think different must mean better. I use canare cable with nuetrix connections throughout my system these days, I used qed signature and reference digital cables and kimber analog cables for over 10 years there's no noticeable difference honestly even though I'd convinced myself there must be.
I don't completely agree that it's different and not better. To me, the AP cables (which I borrowed and have no affiliation with) have a marginally better degree of clarity and resolution compared to the Supras and Curious cables, but it's just such a tiny margin that it's hard to justify the approx. doubling of price
@@PassionforSound it's all good, your experiences are as valid as mine everyone hears differently. it's not my place to tell people where to spend their money either, I was just stating my subjective and anecdotal experiences. I view it as money better spent on more music or better gear, i enjoy your channel you showcase cool gear.
Personally, I would prefer you find us the best diy cable and best diy interconnects for the price :) .. and compare them to these cable.. we can solder ourselves
It does not matter if some guy used a studio with an overpriced unmeasured cable, its not industry reference so coloured. Just like most home audio equipment is. I remember Bose adverts with claims of Nasa engineering. There is no debate, hi end cables are a rip off, if there was a consumer right covering the majority of cable manufacturers would disappear, and most reviewers have no idea what they are claiming as it's placebo and bias crap, major manufacturers using RS component co-ax at pence per meter to create a "sheilded" proprietry new speaker cable, as was shown in a few forums decades ago. 6 awg ofc copper marine battery cable at 10 bucks per meter, with 20 bucks of banana plugs, going for 1200 bucks as an audiophool cable, silver plated 12awg copper resold as a branded cable with 19 bucks per meter mark up. The only cables to trust are the major models used by Studio's such as Klotz, Canare, Van Damme, Beldin etc, cables that cost the materials and construction, not with extra 0's added to cost for magic fluff. The best engineers and equipment is showing differences so small, human hearing cannot detect it, while foo manufacturers go on about cable measurents that have no place in audio cable, 10ghz testing equipment, 195khz phase anomalies creating a dry cable is absolute nonsense, dieletrics and skin effects so small they actually mean nothing, yet being used in colorful engineering terms to do with stuff cables cannot do, which is then paffed of with colourful terms of psuedo engineering while claiming psychoacoustic properties inherent due to the more transparent nature due to better signal propogation and such nonsense. All babble. There is no debate, if your buying high end cable your paying someone money for a lie, the materials and science are not in that cable to justify sound, as we seen when Audioquests £2500 cable turned out to make wild claims that could not be substantiated under measured and listening scrutiny. A cable that equaled a plastic RCA freebie, the the RCA freebie had better noise rejection, despite the fake technological claims by Audioquest falsely claiming to have superiour rejection of such. If multi million dollar mastering studio's making the best quality audio recordings for audiophile music and movie soundtracks use a reference standard such as Canare, Beldin, Mogami etc with Neutrik cables, in more hostile enviroments regarding noise and interference than domestic, and at far greater lengths than domestic, with no loss in data or sound quality. How can overpriced hifi made for masive mark ups and margins bring out more detail? If the studio cable isnt good enough, then it cant be recording the detail so called audiophool cable brings. Lets remember, anything those cables do, cannot be on the album, it's extra detail that could never have made it through the recording process as a different cable was used in the mastering process. Its also not behind the RCA plugs on that system, your pins are not silver, neither is the circuit board. There litterally isnt anything with that cable and construction but that cable conductor, and in audio at meaningless lengths. And the multiple jackets on that cable are usually just covering up cable bought from a third party. Nylon braid is a classic wtf case point. You used to be able to buy Silver RCA cable, I still have some somewhere terminated with Neutrik Proffi's, but here is the thing, no engineer is making identical recordings with two different cables and going feck me the difference, its audiophile recordings that from instrument to mixing desk to monitor that use basic cables that are properly engineered, silver cables simply were not worth the bother. Why do you think so many of the proffesional industry laugh and make audiophool jokes. Your litterally paying 2500 bucks for a bunch of parts that cost 25 bucks, due to colourful descriptions and false claims. And because of that cost your brain starts flatulating differences. A cable that can apparently do better than the cable that did the recording, which by common sense would infer the cable was adding something that wasnt there. How can a $30 cable make a recording and capture detail and timbre that it itself cannot later replay, while a $2500 cable is an improvement? Think of it this way, if I mastered an album with a specific filter on the cabling meaning detail is not recorded, then you playing that back on the highest quality system with the best cables cannot get any information that filter removed. You cannot record on a $30 cable, then claim that a hifi with a $2500 cable can resolve more detail than the $30 cable used in the recording, thats the hillarious joke on cables and audiophiles, from source to CD specific cables were used. So nothing better than those cables can produce will be on the recording, so your cable cannot do what it claims. So how can anyone believe a coloured inaccurate hifi using cables costong thousands of bucks can produce an aural experience above that of the recording? If your audiophile band are playing with mic's running to a desk via Klotz with Cannord XLR plugs, With Beldin and Neutrik from desk to mastering suit, where the best studio monitors available are wired up with Van damme. How the hell can a £2500 RCA cable get detail those apparently inferiour cables could not muster? I mean lets get it straight, the last time I seen PMC themselves install their BB5/XBD studio system running from racks of Bryston power amplifiers and active crossovers, it was Van Damme cablles throughout, and it produced sound Wilson Audio and Krell running 20k of cables could only dream of. Do you get the reality gap and mark up vs claims involved and why it need sto just be nailed to a cross? It was a joke in the 90's with so many shill cable manufacturers robbing consumers with blatant lies and overpriced cack no better than home made maplins, and early forums were going on about this, as were AES members. Here we are in 2024 and still we see fantasy claims and nonsense measurements with no real world bearing on cables costing thousands replaying albums mastered on longer runs of 30 buck cable yet more resolving than domestic hifi. Yet some guy in his bedroom with s few grand worth of hifi and his favorite music rips or CD's is using cable worth more than some dacs and hearing extra details in a music production that was using cable worth a few bucks per metre from instrument right through to final master in a multi million mastering suit. Absolute horse shite for the deranged with more money than guilable sense. Which is why I quit spending money on brand new cables from Chord, Transparent, XLO, Eccose and so many others. And in future will be going back to the basics from the likes of Mogami with Neutrik, as it actually is better measuring and sounding at $30 than cables costing $3000 bucks made by Bob the Builder out of a components catalogue apparently used by Nasa so clearly suited to the average UK living room and capable of finding extra terestial sounds that didnt exist with a $30 bucks cable that put the detail there in the 1st place. Demented. $30 cable in the mastering, yet when playing the recording on a hifi with less resolution than the studio, the $2500 cable is better than the $30 cable, despite the obvious fact that if the $30 cable did the recording, then you cant get anything more than what that $30 cable can produce from the recording. So where dis all this extra depth, bass, timbre, detail come from that the cheaper cable cannot produce, therefor could not exist on the recording?
I have wondered why it costs NASA so much money to boost each kilogram of payload into orbit. Now I know it must be the the price of the cables! SpaceX, on the other hand, probably gets their cables from Antonio. 🚀
Lachlan, I can tell by your descriptions of these cable performances you have well trained ears for this. Have you ever taken a grounded record brush and thoroughly brushed all traces of static build up along all your cables? If not, just try this. Listen carefully to your system for good while, music you know well. Stop and connect a grounded record brush to the ground of an outlet in your room. Then carefully brush all along the cables…signal, power, headphone cables, all of them should be brushed for their entire length to drain static buildup. Now listen again. A veil lifted? Should make the differences in these cables more noticeable.
That's an interesting one, Brian! I don't have vinyl so I don't own one of those brushes, but next time I visit a friend with vinyl and that type of brush I'll be keen to give it a go.
did the gladiator xlr affect the treble or detail in any way? im thinking of picking some xlrs but i want something with a thicker bass and some more soundstage without affecting the rest of the tuning much.
Different XLR cables shouldn’t even affect the sound at all. There is no change in frequency response with different cables unless they’re ultra low impedance like the Raal headphones. I suggest you do a double blind test yourself because 99.9% of people say they don’t hear a difference once you get past the $25 Amazon RCA cables. I’ve done a double blind test with the cheapest audio quest RCA vs a $350 set of XLR plugged into a McIntosh amp and neither me nor my dad who has much more experience than me could tell a difference, I love Lachlans videos but I think this is the one thing where you should listen to all of the comments instead of him, maybe his ear is just better than everyone else’s but chances are you will not hear any difference just from switching cables.
@@baccchi4425 regardless you shouldn't hear a difference in the treble or bass response purely from cables unless your cable currently is extremely low quality.
Bacc chi, you're completely right that it's not a frequency response thing and the Gladiator XLRs were very neutral to my ears. They improve resolution over a basic cable, but don't alter tonality. They're a little bit smoother sounding than the Analysis Plus, Curious or Supra Sword because they don't resolve quite as much detail and that is where they are able to sound slightly fuller in the bottom end I think
I actually do agree that a cable can make a difference. I tried and now still use the micca cable for no money at all - it does sound better than my other standard quality copper cable. But it did take me quite while to decide they actually do because the difference is so subtle. It's just ridiculous how much money people would spend to gain another miniscule upgrade. I guess when you have enough money to throw around it does not matter anymore.
@@kingstoler Sure, that's the easy answer. Have you ever tried yourself? Even my wife said spontaneously that it sounds different. I am not even saying that it would sound better for all ears, but the difference is there. I can't explain why, but there it is.
Yep, definitely there's an audible difference that can be heard in blind testing with friends, family, strangers, etc. I also agree that there's a point fairly low down in the price range where gains get very minimal as you spend more money
Neither @larsstecken or @PassionforSound analysis works. First off lasstecken didnt even do a double blind test, then got the most biased human that could ever exist in his life to confirm it. Shes your significant other, you neanderthal 🤣. As for you passion, ever heard of pavlovian conditioning? You switching those imputs conditions your brain to believe up is one thing and down is another. *It doesnt matter if you dont know the cables, you DO know if the switch is down or up* . Thats why your analysis is invalid, because you are still aware *which mode is ingaged regardless of what imput it was* . If you actually want to give informative consensus, then do an actual double blind ABX test recorded live. Why bother telling us about how you "didnt know the imputs" if it was still ultimately inflused by pavlovian conditioning? Because you *think* it isnt? Thats how conditioning can work. 😂
The budget for cables should not exceed 10% of the total cost of the system. Start with speaker/headphone cables, then interconnects and, if there is still some budget left, power cables.
@@DaveJ6515 Agreed. However, I can't see the price justification of 5 to 10 times for a 1 to 2 percent supposed sonic improvement, which for all intents and purposes could just be the brain doing the placebo thing.
@@chutgowdingo-loon3212 I know that sometimes it is a placebo effect. Example: a cable which promises to reduce jitter on an Ethernet connection is obviously a logical inconsistency: jitter is inconsequential in an asynchronous connection. And yet some people hear differences from jitter reducing contraptions. But some other times it isn’t. And at that point the question is: are you able and willing to pay a given amount for this improvement? Some will answer yes, others no. That’s all.
Thiis test really showed me that while you can get better performance by spending more, there are no guarantees that more $$$ equals more 🙂🙂🙂. There's also clearly a point at which the question of value declines, but as Andrea said, that point will be relative to a person's income and spending habits I expect.
futureshop have cables for £12k if anyone is interested 😂😂 Aslongas the cables are well made & of good materials is all that matter. Trouble is its a racket for conmen. ✌😎👍
Like anything in this world, there are products that are good value, products that are overpriced and a question of what each person prioritises too. It's all about finding a balance point that's right for each individual 🙂
@@PassionforSound I like fat cables; in case I accidentally tread on em 😂 I mostly get hand-made cables & therefore I value the persons time & effort above all. Cheers 🍻 🍻
Do not waste your money on cables, basic cables are perfectly adequate. Arm yourself with basic electronics and acoustics knowledge then you can dismiss videos like this as total BS and watch them just for their comedy value.
Ever heard of pavlovian conditioning? You switching those imputs conditions your brain to believe up is *one thing* and down is *one thing* . *It doesnt matter if you dont know the cables, you DO know if the switch is down or up* . Thats why your analysis is invalid, because you are still aware *which mode is ingaged regardless of what imput it was* . If you actually want to give informative consensus, then do an actual double blind ABX test recorded live. Why bother telling us about how you "didnt know the imputs" if it was still ultimately inflused by pavlovian conditioning? Because you *think* it isnt? Thats how conditioning can work. 😂
What really strikes me is that this "conditioning" works in one direction only. So, if I hear an improvement I am imagining it because I want to hear it. If you don't hear a difference you have it right. We are dismissing another possible explanation: that people who cannot afford, or (quite legitimately) prefer not to spend money in cables want to believe that there can be no difference, and they will not hear the difference even when it's there. Why? because they are happier in that way. If it works, it works both ways.
@@DaveJ6515 I have no problem with people giving their consensus on a product, I have a problem when they try to make an invalid excuse for why they believe it. Just state your opinion, then move on. He was trying to justify that his observations were not persuaded, when thats factually incorrect. If you want to make an opinion that is truly transformative of neurological factors, then you need to run a double blind ABX test. If you dont care that you're being neurologically conditioned, then don't. But you cant have neither.
@@williamsteven5613 I was trying to ask why the conditioning should explain everything in one direction, and not even be taken into consideration as a possible explanation in the opposite direction. I find it strange.
For some reason I can't reply to a specific comment asking why I am back when I said that I had more important things to do. My answer is: " Exactly. It was late and I had to go to sleep, which is important for your health. Which does not apply to this specific instant in time."
the idea that "measurement" guys don't listen to or have access to high end systems is hilarious. way to be tribally divisive about something so trivial.
Dude, genelec, a company who installs the most expensive pro audio suites on the entire planet use pro grade xlrs that are $60 for 3m. You can see their installation videos showing them. Professionals that work in $100000+ suits that MAKE YOUR MUSIC, don't use cables worth over $40 a meter. You are barking up an imaginary tree. 😂
We already know thats bogus from talking to professionals that use audio equipment that has absurd levels of performance. They never use expensive cable no matter the cost of the system of job it is accomplishing despite it actually having a job. It would be the best case scenario if they actually made a difference. Yet they still don't use them. You are are arguing against the people that literally make your music. 🤣
@@DaveJ6515 oh, I can see you're just salty little cable junky. Get back to me when you have data to back your claims like other principles in hifi do.
Hmmm, silly me bought 3 foot XLR cables for $16.49 per pair on Amazon. I must not be a real "audiophile" since they sound perfect to me. This makes me think of the "science" we've been subjected to over the last couple years concerning the pandemic.
The claim that the sound quality changes because of the audio cable is similar to the claim that the picture quality of the TV improves by changing the power strip. It's such an absurd, religious superstition.
I swear I noticed a sharper image when I changed my HDMI cable, but then again it could be because I was slightly more alert and had a drink or two. But it's definitely the cable.
that is correct, but certain things like detail and soundstage etc you cannot measure, these things in my opinion can be affected by the quality of the cable and how it is designed.
@@gladiatorcables9080 the way to prove that subjectively 1 cable is better than another is to run blind tests. It would be interesting if you posted the test results.
@@dangerzone007 that would def be interesting. i've personally done blind testing with friends when designing certain cables and it seems to actually be a difference as we all preferred different cables and heard differences with specific wires. Yes these things are really hard to prove but i think that cables can make an actual difference.
If you make your own, the mystery is very small. You know what you put into it. The science versus BS is the bain of audio I think. Been doing this since I was 5 years old. And the comedic science versus actual science is startling. Are you launching a space flight? Hmm, probably not. Properties needed, good quality terminations, good copper, good shielding and done. Everything else is purely conjecture. I use Mogami cables. Reasonable money, reasonable build. I know on the job it won't let me down. I have had so called exotic spendy cables that were total crap reliability wise, and to me not a value at all when it fails when I need it to work. It isn't just passive listening for me. It is creating and sharing for others, and failure is not an option. But I am not a fool with my money either. Do what you want, it is your money, and your reasoning. And I never ever ever use cables as a tone control. Your mileage may vary.
Mr. Lachlan, your reviews are always amazing and I am grateful for your kind words. I would like to provide some additional information about my current TOTL XLR cables. The signal conductor is made of pure OCC silver and the shielding is composed of silver-plated copper. This wire was personally designed by me after testing and and is not a pre-made product. I am pleased to hear that my cables perform exceptionally well compared to more expensive options.
Thanks for the extra info, Antonio. Yes, for the price, they are doing an excellent job and can make it hard to justify spending the hundreds dollars more for higher spec cables
@@PassionforSound I'm extremely happy to hear that, that's exactly what my goal is to bring cables that perform at a very high level but without the extreme price tag
A lower impedance drive source can drive higher capacitance cables, it's just that simple. Every shielded cable has a "Capacitance Per Foot" (or Meter) measurement. Your system needs to have the ability to drive this capacitance. In short, long cables should be XLR types, RCA type cables are better used in short runs, unless a lower impedance drive source is used for those RCA cables. Have a great day.
There is no reason whatsoever to use rca cables if xlr is a available to you. Have a nice day.
Paul, If there was only one person to listen to about all things electronic - I'm in your camp for sure! If I had 10% of your knowledge, I'd be dangerous. Thanks for all you do.
I really do believe cable manufacturers are just charging lots of money for something that doesn't do much. I have a high end system, and everything is connected with made in China unbranded cables. These are all really well made, properly shielded, but they don't have a name on them. The sound is absolutely fantastic, and so it should be given the components involved. These cable company have been ripping people off for a long time. And yes, in my time I have heard cables from Chord, AP, Nordost, QED, Audioquest and others. I was gullible when younger. I believed their lies.
What components are you using?
Don't reply to this guy. He'll just throw ad hominems at you. He's awfully salty about factual statments. 😆
So which cables are ya using friend? 😁
I like those copper colored cables with the Furutech ends.
You should try the oil filled RCA’s. Possibly the best around. Silver purity plus openness in sound.
I recommend Mogami wire, Neutrik connectors, a soldering iron and silver bearing solder. If you're using generic cables or made in china cables it will be a big sound upgrade that costs almost nothing. This kind of cable is industry standard in recording studios as part of signal chains that cost more than a house. Cables make a difference, but I think it's a bad idea to spend on them.
No doubt there's a point at which spending more money makes no sense, but the idea that the industry standard is Mogami with Neutrik, etc. is a bit misleading. Just like with any industry, there are the cheap and basic setups, the average setups and the top tier setups. There are plenty of studios using higher end cables as well (like Analysis Plus who have a dedicated pro range)
@@PassionforSound It is industry standard. On the back of a Rupert Neve AD converter are Neutrik jacks. The most expensive cables at pro audio supply stores are Mogami Gold. A Mogami Gold XLR cable is a quadrupole braided shield cable made in Japan with OFC with Neutrik connectors that were made in Lichenstein with great engineering and materials that end up being plugged into gear with Neutrik connectors on it. It doesn't get more standard than that. There are different levels, but that is considered high end. The engineering that goes into them is legitimately advantageous vs. less expensive options. I've seen it, I've cut, stripped and soldered and heard it. Studios are often wired with Mogami wire between rooms and in the patch bay if someone really cares about quality. I won't say that is no difference between what is high end standard and those super expensive exotic audiophile cables, but the pro standard is the benchmark to compare everything else to and when the price exceeds a certain point it's time to get skeptical. I think perhaps some exotic audiophile configurations for marketing purposes may even be at disadvantage. When a small company has a more affordable option says their cable is OCC wire, there's no way to verify that. Real OCC copper is often more expensive than the entire cable that is being sold claiming to have it in there. For any audiophiles that want to know they have a good cable with legit materials without emptying their wallet, they should bypass the audiophile market completely.
@@PassionforSound no genelec uses cables no more than $40 per meter. None of the expensive cable you are listing are used in any of the most expensive studio suits. Not one. They use cables like the ones the OP mentioned. The reason is because the difference between cables is far smaller than your let on even in $100000+ interfaces.
@@BlackthorneSoundandCinema hes talking crap, no major studio installation uses cable like analysis plus. Maybe for a private client, but no big commercial mastering suit would ever use them.
@@enjoshi-godrez8775 yep too expensive; cables don't last long in a lot of commercial uses.
You say "science" a lot, but they give no electrical data on what they actually do differently whatsoever. Just their topology. If the topology is based on science, then they would show *how* its based on science. What they did isn't science.
Science needs to be reproducible. It doesn’t need numbers to a certain extent.
@@DaveJ6515 I didnt ask for numerical data. Data does not denounce that it is numerical.
@@enjoshi-godrez8775Ok. So what non-numerical data are you looking for in order to say that this is indeed science?
@@DaveJ6515 you just answered your own question. You can't have reproducible science without data. Data is what is used to compare what is reproducible. What a dunce. 😂
@@DaveJ6515 electrical engineering principles that are based on data. Show how your topology is derived from those principles.
You are the standard by which all other reviews should be judged. Thank you for keeping the audiophile audience -- with real ears and real budgets in mind.
Thanks DH. No need to judge the others, but I'm glad to hear I'm bringing value! 😉🙂
@@PassionforSound I guess what I was saying is that your objectivity -- your consideration of factors other than the product in your hand and it's potential to be promoted by what you say about it -- makes your channel stand out from others who *purport* to be doing that. In their case -- and I understand why you do not want to speak about them -- they are so entangled with the incentives of marketing (even sotto voce) that they fail to deliver knowledge. They deliver, instead, "infotainment." Infotainment, in my view, often can function to disinform for anyone seeking to learn. Not always, but often. You don't do that. Just my opinion.
Thanks DH. It's nice to know that's how I come across because it's always my intention 🙂
I have a local pro audio store (Performance Audio in SLC, UT) that will make custom cables... Typically I will spend $50 - $80 on a pair of XLR cables 8-12 feet long. They use neutrik connectors and pretty great cables. It's not fancy high end cables nor is it the budget amazon basics bunch.
I think that's what it's about, Ace - finding the level that performs as you need and costs what you want to spend. This comparison confirmed for me where the value proposition starts to taper off
It is absolutely about Synergy and personal preference as you have said. I upgraded the Elite's cable to a Lavricable Grand Silver cable "hoping" it wouldn't make it too bright and it didn't. Details were extended nicely and I was very happy with the upgrade. Bass still full and meaty.
When I bought my Feliks Envy the retailer had Siltech 650i Interconnects between the DAC (same DAC as mine) and the Amp. It sounded amazing but of course that is mostly down to the amp.
The thing is when I asked how much the interconnect was and they said £1750 I said "there is no way I'm spending that on a cable - that's ridiculous".
So; we tried some "cheaper" £600 and £1000 different chord cables. As long as it wasn't any worse I would go as cheap as possible. Thing is the £600 cable sounded so similar to the £1750 one I really couldn't tell the difference but the £1000 one sounded really off to me. It was almost muddy.
So...I ended up spending £1750 on the more expensive one simply because "what if I get it home and think..it's not as good as in the store. I'll always be wondering - was it the cable?" lol
True (and expensive) Story
What's great here is that you got to try it for yourself so you could know what you liked and what was worth spending the money on vs what wasn't. Thanks for sharing!
I’m not a cable guy but love grabbing a bag of popcorn and reading the comments on any cable video lol😂
I wish my ears were good enough to hear a difference, but I just honestly can’t unless the cables are absolutely crap with a dodgy connection lol.
I can’t see how a cable can improve the sound of a converted signal that has spent most of its existence travelling through very small cross section solder .. and unfortunately I can’t hear it either!
It's a strange thing how they alter the sound (and quite subtle too). I think even more strange is the vitriol that goes along with the topic. Thanks for sharing your experiences and doubts in a respectful and gentle way, Ross! 🙂
About earring what "artist intend", note that 90% of the artist and producer works with "cheap" cables like Mogami gold. This idea of big professional studios with hundreds thousand dollars of equipment is not true anymore. They are some, but it's very probable that the recordings you like are not made in those... that is not contradicting what you are earring with those cables, but what artists do.
Contemporary artists rarely care about some qualities that audiophiles consider of primary importance in music reproduction. So "artist intend" is more or less the wrong way of putting it with modern music. Many classical music directors are very attentive to mixing, positioning, dynamics, sound color and so on. Others don't care too much. And you can hear it in the final product.
An example of an artist who cares for audiophile qualities in his music tracks is David Gilmore. His Live Concert from Pompei is a joy to the ears.
@@DaveJ6515 I red once an article in a recording magazine that detailed the equipment used in some legendary recordings. I was amazed to discover that some of my favorite vocal performance was recorded during repetition with a 150$ mic (sm58). I wonder what was the cables used in Miles's Kind of blue recording and I would bet there was no 1200$ 1 meter cables ;)
@@guystpierrecomposer a good friend of mine played with Carlos Santana. He had a recording studio in his basement. No fancy cables at all.
When he heard the sound of my setup he said that it was wonderful, totally enjoyable, but beyond what they were after when they recorded their tracks. He also told me that after recording together, Santana grabbed the dat cassette, and they drove to golden gate park.
When they bridge was in sight, he pushed play, and after listening, he said that it was just right, and that he needed that test because he imagined that the average person who listened to their music would do that in a car, driving on a road along the ocean.
I think trying to capture "what the artist intended" is a fool's errand. There are many "artists" in the recording process so who exactly is the artist with the intent? I get that some people are seeking the most accurate and uncoloured system they can build, but even that is tricky because we have no actual reference for what is correct from an electrical point of view. Sure, silver conducts better than copper, but is that more accurate or is the "filtering" applied by a copper cable more "accurate" than the greater transparency of silver? You could argue the semantics and details forever.
Oooooh, I'm excited to watch this one.
Hope you enjoy it!
man, I owe you a big thank you. I didn't believe that cables matter until I saw your last video talking about headphone cables.
Glad I could help, Gavin 🙂
I'm surprised on how many non cable people these cable videos attract
It is for the comedy.
I would like to see measurements.
I buy my cables from sonic art in Melbourne.. around $300 for high quality silver 1 meter xlr pair. Buy straight from the maker and by pass the retailer mark up…
Thanks for the tip. I hadn't heard of them
Are the silver cables plated or solid silver conductors. Makes a difference. You seem to be describing a plate silver cable,
I believe they are a pure silver
Where is the “balance point” if you don’t need a full meter length for your stack interconnects, but only need 15cm??
That's an interesting question and one I haven't tested. I do know that the very basic and very short pair of interconnects I own aren't as good as the better, but longer ones I own. I can't say where the balance point is though.
@@PassionforSound
Ok… that’s good to know… but you have to admit it would be ridiculous to install a full meter, and unfair to be charged by the meter
#jussayin
Ah, I see what you're saying! If you go to a custom cable manufacturer (some of the big brands do this and many of the boutique brands) then they'll charge to length, not by metre. One challenge though is that the connectors and the labour component of wiring up the cables will remain consistent so it won't drop the price to exactly 15% of a 1m cable 🙂
IME it makes sense to spend a lot on interconnects when you have the rest of the cables in place like power, digital, and your hp cable. I've experienced multiple times when a single piece of cable can be a significant bottleneck for the rest of the cables. That being said, interconnects offer the least impact vs all the other types of cables IME but I think they do offer a much bigger impact than you'd think. So hopefully when you get a chance to review other cables from other manufacturers I suggest asking for a full loom instead. I'm confident your conclusions will change. Of course, it also depends on how resolving your gear is as well...
My whole chain is pretty well optimised without spending a fortune (many people commenting on this video would say that I had already spent way too much). I am definitely of the belief that all connections and devices in the chain matter. I also agree with you that the interconnects seem to reach a point where the value of spending a significant amount more money becomes questionable after something like the Supra and Curious cables.
@@PassionforSound hmm i don't know about that (for most people though you're probably right). I went from mogami xlr to basic supra xlr to supra sword xlr to allnic mu-7r xlr and ended up with allnic because they tied the system oh so well that it was worth the cost to me (granted i didn't pay full price 🫢 but still pricey). Then again I wouldn't say that applies to every system haha
In my experience,, cables are system dependent, especially usb cables which are very DAC dependent.
Yes, system synergy definitely comes into play
But, can you hear the differences between the cables if you do a controlled ABX test?
With some cables in some setups you can. With low resolving setups and/or scamcables you can't (or shouldn't be able to)
As Andrea said, yes you can, depending on the cables and system. I've done this in the past with family and friends where they didn't know that anything had been changed and they asked what was different because the sound was suddenly better
try zenwave D4 /D5 silver gold alloy xlr ,you get the resolution of silver and the richness of copper. these are my favorite interconnects.
What "richness"? Cables don't affect the sound in any way unless they're faulty. That's a fact.
@@kingstoler Okay buddy 🤣
Thanks for the tip, Rich!
I'm neutral on cables, but most prices are absolutely gouging. Look up Radiall RF interconnects that go up to 40GHz or even higher, they're cheaper than the majority of high end cables.
There's a lot to it I think so saying most are gouging isn't really fair. I absolutely feel that, for my needs and my systems, the Curious and Supra cables are about the best I need, but I'm yet to try a "better" cable from a reputable manufacturer that doesn't offer either improvements or differences. The question then is value. I personally don't see enough difference to warrant the jump in price, but the companies making those cables are honestly just trying to make an even better cable with better materials, construction, etc. The problem is the costs go up much faster than the performance.
would be great if you could review audioquest cables too
I actually did a big write-up on them years ago on my written site passionforsound.lachlanfennen.com but I should see if they have new options to try these days. I did include the Yukon XLR and RCA in either my Curious XLR or Supra Sword XLR review (or was that one video? I forget)
bravo!
very clean and honest... bravo again!
Thanks, lupoal. That's always the goal 🙂
Fortunately most headphone set ups have short runs. My best cables are .75 m. costing about $100 each. They are "very upper mid-fi" to me. Cables matter...! Best, D.
It seems to me that going much higher than that starts to bring very minimal improvements that might actually just be different rather than better. Enjoy the tunes, D!
Excellent analysis! Since reviews on Supra audio interconnects are rare, this is the first impressive in-depth review that I found useful and effective in making decisions. Interestingly, I also used Analysis Plus Oval RCA 2 meter interconnects (for unbalanced connection between AVR and power amp) before switching to Mogami XLR 2 meter balanced connection from upgraded Pre-Pro to power amp. Q: Since I place pre-pro very close to power amp, would upgrading to Supra EFF-IXLR 1 meter interconnects be adequate? The old philosophy seems to have been short interconnects and long speaker cable until recent inverse to longer interconnects and shorter speaker cables. Thanks.
I've tried all different lengths of interconnects and the quality of the wire matters at any length so I would recommend that upgrade - I think you'll be impressed
I think you should take a look at DH labs Revelation cables.
Thanks for the tip, CL!
Really random. Did you ever encounter delay in sound to lip movent when using the denafrips or musician dacs ?
I'm on the goldensound server where this was made apparent and I was wondering why its not mentioned
I believe this is more common on Denafrips dacs than Musician. I owned a Musician Pegasus for about a year, and I had no issues with delay. I think I would've noticed as I played games with it, including titles like Lost Judgment that has rhythm timing mini-games in it.
@@PeterHas I wish it was just a thing that was mentioned in reviewsbc a lot people also use it for like games and such so it'd be nice
@@marcusloo767 Yes, I use my dac for all kinds of media, including movies, games, youtube, and of course music. It's difficult to find info on whether some dacs have more input delay than others, and whether that delay could be a problem for certain types of media. In my case the Pegasus was no problem, and neither am I having any issues with the Audio GD R8 Mk2 I'm using right now. But If I wanted to upgrade to something in the price range of the Denafrips Terminator, then I could certainly run into problems.
@@PeterHas yrha I was honestly interested in the Terminator but that put me off of getting one so I'm kustwtifkibg with my Yggdrasil
I normally use any DACs I'm testing for some editing work where audio sync is important so if I don't mention it in a video, there should be no problems.
cracks me up that all these esoteric cable manufacturers and their advocates think different must mean better. I use canare cable with nuetrix connections throughout my system these days, I used qed signature and reference digital cables and kimber analog cables for over 10 years there's no noticeable difference honestly even though I'd convinced myself there must be.
I don't completely agree that it's different and not better. To me, the AP cables (which I borrowed and have no affiliation with) have a marginally better degree of clarity and resolution compared to the Supras and Curious cables, but it's just such a tiny margin that it's hard to justify the approx. doubling of price
@@PassionforSound it's all good, your experiences are as valid as mine everyone hears differently. it's not my place to tell people where to spend their money either, I was just stating my subjective and anecdotal experiences. I view it as money better spent on more music or better gear, i enjoy your channel you showcase cool gear.
Thanks for discussing our different opinions with respect and acceptance! 🙂
Horror movie jump scares are more scary in a system with XLR cables. FACT
Haha. There's a new test for me to use 😁
Personally, I would prefer you find us the best diy cable and best diy interconnects for the price :) .. and compare them to these cable.. we can solder ourselves
Not everyone can solder confidently, lex, but that's an interesting idea for a video.
It does not matter if some guy used a studio with an overpriced unmeasured cable, its not industry reference so coloured. Just like most home audio equipment is.
I remember Bose adverts with claims of Nasa engineering.
There is no debate, hi end cables are a rip off, if there was a consumer right covering the majority of cable manufacturers would disappear, and most reviewers have no idea what they are claiming as it's placebo and bias crap, major manufacturers using RS component co-ax at pence per meter to create a "sheilded" proprietry new speaker cable, as was shown in a few forums decades ago.
6 awg ofc copper marine battery cable at 10 bucks per meter, with 20 bucks of banana plugs, going for 1200 bucks as an audiophool cable, silver plated 12awg copper resold as a branded cable with 19 bucks per meter mark up.
The only cables to trust are the major models used by Studio's such as Klotz, Canare, Van Damme, Beldin etc, cables that cost the materials and construction, not with extra 0's added to cost for magic fluff. The best engineers and equipment is showing differences so small, human hearing cannot detect it, while foo manufacturers go on about cable measurents that have no place in audio cable, 10ghz testing equipment, 195khz phase anomalies creating a dry cable is absolute nonsense, dieletrics and skin effects so small they actually mean nothing, yet being used in colorful engineering terms to do with stuff cables cannot do, which is then paffed of with colourful terms of psuedo engineering while claiming psychoacoustic properties inherent due to the more transparent nature due to better signal propogation and such nonsense. All babble.
There is no debate, if your buying high end cable your paying someone money for a lie, the materials and science are not in that cable to justify sound, as we seen when Audioquests £2500 cable turned out to make wild claims that could not be substantiated under measured and listening scrutiny. A cable that equaled a plastic RCA freebie, the the RCA freebie had better noise rejection, despite the fake technological claims by Audioquest falsely claiming to have superiour rejection of such.
If multi million dollar mastering studio's making the best quality audio recordings for audiophile music and movie soundtracks use a reference standard such as Canare, Beldin, Mogami etc with Neutrik cables, in more hostile enviroments regarding noise and interference than domestic, and at far greater lengths than domestic, with no loss in data or sound quality. How can overpriced hifi made for masive mark ups and margins bring out more detail? If the studio cable isnt good enough, then it cant be recording the detail so called audiophool cable brings.
Lets remember, anything those cables do, cannot be on the album, it's extra detail that could never have made it through the recording process as a different cable was used in the mastering process. Its also not behind the RCA plugs on that system, your pins are not silver, neither is the circuit board.
There litterally isnt anything with that cable and construction but that cable conductor, and in audio at meaningless lengths. And the multiple jackets on that cable are usually just covering up cable bought from a third party. Nylon braid is a classic wtf case point.
You used to be able to buy Silver RCA cable, I still have some somewhere terminated with Neutrik Proffi's, but here is the thing, no engineer is making identical recordings with two different cables and going feck me the difference, its audiophile recordings that from instrument to mixing desk to monitor that use basic cables that are properly engineered, silver cables simply were not worth the bother.
Why do you think so many of the proffesional industry laugh and make audiophool jokes. Your litterally paying 2500 bucks for a bunch of parts that cost 25 bucks, due to colourful descriptions and false claims. And because of that cost your brain starts flatulating differences.
A cable that can apparently do better than the cable that did the recording, which by common sense would infer the cable was adding something that wasnt there. How can a $30 cable make a recording and capture detail and timbre that it itself cannot later replay, while a $2500 cable is an improvement?
Think of it this way, if I mastered an album with a specific filter on the cabling meaning detail is not recorded, then you playing that back on the highest quality system with the best cables cannot get any information that filter removed. You cannot record on a $30 cable, then claim that a hifi with a $2500 cable can resolve more detail than the $30 cable used in the recording, thats the hillarious joke on cables and audiophiles, from source to CD specific cables were used. So nothing better than those cables can produce will be on the recording, so your cable cannot do what it claims.
So how can anyone believe a coloured inaccurate hifi using cables costong thousands of bucks can produce an aural experience above that of the recording? If your audiophile band are playing with mic's running to a desk via Klotz with Cannord XLR plugs, With Beldin and Neutrik from desk to mastering suit, where the best studio monitors available are wired up with Van damme.
How the hell can a £2500 RCA cable get detail those apparently inferiour cables could not muster?
I mean lets get it straight, the last time I seen PMC themselves install their BB5/XBD studio system running from racks of Bryston power amplifiers and active crossovers, it was Van Damme cablles throughout, and it produced sound Wilson Audio and Krell running 20k of cables could only dream of.
Do you get the reality gap and mark up vs claims involved and why it need sto just be nailed to a cross? It was a joke in the 90's with so many shill cable manufacturers robbing consumers with blatant lies and overpriced cack no better than home made maplins, and early forums were going on about this, as were AES members.
Here we are in 2024 and still we see fantasy claims and nonsense measurements with no real world bearing on cables costing thousands replaying albums mastered on longer runs of 30 buck cable yet more resolving than domestic hifi.
Yet some guy in his bedroom with s few grand worth of hifi and his favorite music rips or CD's is using cable worth more than some dacs and hearing extra details in a music production that was using cable worth a few bucks per metre from instrument right through to final master in a multi million mastering suit.
Absolute horse shite for the deranged with more money than guilable sense. Which is why I quit spending money on brand new cables from Chord, Transparent, XLO, Eccose and so many others. And in future will be going back to the basics from the likes of Mogami with Neutrik, as it actually is better measuring and sounding at $30 than cables costing $3000 bucks made by Bob the Builder out of a components catalogue apparently used by Nasa so clearly suited to the average UK living room and capable of finding extra terestial sounds that didnt exist with a $30 bucks cable that put the detail there in the 1st place.
Demented. $30 cable in the mastering, yet when playing the recording on a hifi with less resolution than the studio, the $2500 cable is better than the $30 cable, despite the obvious fact that if the $30 cable did the recording, then you cant get anything more than what that $30 cable can produce from the recording.
So where dis all this extra depth, bass, timbre, detail come from that the cheaper cable cannot produce, therefor could not exist on the recording?
I have wondered why it costs NASA so much money to boost each kilogram of payload into orbit. Now I know it must be the the price of the cables! SpaceX, on the other hand, probably gets their cables from Antonio. 🚀
😂
😂
Try a Audioquest evergreen and then try anything else there will be a difference
I've owned some other AQ cables (Yukon and Red River), but not the Evergreen
Lachlan, I can tell by your descriptions of these cable performances you have well trained ears for this. Have you ever taken a grounded record brush and thoroughly brushed all traces of static build up along all your cables? If not, just try this. Listen carefully to your system for good while, music you know well. Stop and connect a grounded record brush to the ground of an outlet in your room. Then carefully brush all along the cables…signal, power, headphone cables, all of them should be brushed for their entire length to drain static buildup. Now listen again. A veil lifted? Should make the differences in these cables more noticeable.
That's an interesting one, Brian! I don't have vinyl so I don't own one of those brushes, but next time I visit a friend with vinyl and that type of brush I'll be keen to give it a go.
did the gladiator xlr affect the treble or detail in any way? im thinking of picking some xlrs but i want something with a thicker bass and some more soundstage without affecting the rest of the tuning much.
Different XLR cables shouldn’t even affect the sound at all. There is no change in frequency response with different cables unless they’re ultra low impedance like the Raal headphones. I suggest you do a double blind test yourself because 99.9% of people say they don’t hear a difference once you get past the $25 Amazon RCA cables. I’ve done a double blind test with the cheapest audio quest RCA vs a $350 set of XLR plugged into a McIntosh amp and neither me nor my dad who has much more experience than me could tell a difference, I love Lachlans videos but I think this is the one thing where you should listen to all of the comments instead of him, maybe his ear is just better than everyone else’s but chances are you will not hear any difference just from switching cables.
@@StoneColdClassics I'm not referring to frequency response
@@baccchi4425 regardless you shouldn't hear a difference in the treble or bass response purely from cables unless your cable currently is extremely low quality.
@@StoneColdClassics it is not a response thing tho
Bacc chi, you're completely right that it's not a frequency response thing and the Gladiator XLRs were very neutral to my ears. They improve resolution over a basic cable, but don't alter tonality. They're a little bit smoother sounding than the Analysis Plus, Curious or Supra Sword because they don't resolve quite as much detail and that is where they are able to sound slightly fuller in the bottom end I think
SNAKE OIL LOL
I actually do agree that a cable can make a difference. I tried and now still use the micca cable for no money at all - it does sound better than my other standard quality copper cable. But it did take me quite while to decide they actually do because the difference is so subtle. It's just ridiculous how much money people would spend to gain another miniscule upgrade. I guess when you have enough money to throw around it does not matter anymore.
@@larsstecken then you're either suffering from cognitive bias, having a broken cable, or placebo.
@@kingstoler Sure, that's the easy answer. Have you ever tried yourself? Even my wife said spontaneously that it sounds different. I am not even saying that it would sound better for all ears, but the difference is there. I can't explain why, but there it is.
Yep, definitely there's an audible difference that can be heard in blind testing with friends, family, strangers, etc. I also agree that there's a point fairly low down in the price range where gains get very minimal as you spend more money
Neither @larsstecken or @PassionforSound analysis works. First off lasstecken didnt even do a double blind test, then got the most biased human that could ever exist in his life to confirm it. Shes your significant other, you neanderthal 🤣. As for you passion, ever heard of pavlovian conditioning? You switching those imputs conditions your brain to believe up is one thing and down is another. *It doesnt matter if you dont know the cables, you DO know if the switch is down or up* . Thats why your analysis is invalid, because you are still aware *which mode is ingaged regardless of what imput it was* . If you actually want to give informative consensus, then do an actual double blind ABX test recorded live. Why bother telling us about how you "didnt know the imputs" if it was still ultimately inflused by pavlovian conditioning? Because you *think* it isnt? Thats how conditioning can work. 😂
The budget for cables should not exceed 10% of the total cost of the system. Start with speaker/headphone cables, then interconnects and, if there is still some budget left, power cables.
1%
@@williamsteven5613 how about 5.5% 🤣🤣
Do I hear 6%? Anyone? Going once... going twice...
At those prices mate - from the sublime to the ridiculous.
Prices are subjective. What is a high price to me is small change to people I know. When you make 100K per week, it's another perspective.
@@DaveJ6515 Agreed. However, I can't see the price justification of 5 to 10 times for a 1 to 2 percent supposed sonic improvement, which for all intents and purposes could just be the brain doing the placebo thing.
@@chutgowdingo-loon3212 I know that sometimes it is a placebo effect. Example: a cable which promises to reduce jitter on an Ethernet connection is obviously a logical inconsistency: jitter is inconsequential in an asynchronous connection. And yet some people hear differences from jitter reducing contraptions. But some other times it isn’t. And at that point the question is: are you able and willing to pay a given amount for this improvement? Some will answer yes, others no. That’s all.
@@DaveJ6515 Agreed. Materr of taste, preference and choice. Different strokes for different folks.
Nice chatting with you. Cheers.
Thiis test really showed me that while you can get better performance by spending more, there are no guarantees that more $$$ equals more 🙂🙂🙂. There's also clearly a point at which the question of value declines, but as Andrea said, that point will be relative to a person's income and spending habits I expect.
futureshop have cables for £12k if anyone is interested 😂😂
Aslongas the cables are well made & of good materials is all that matter. Trouble is its a racket for conmen.
✌😎👍
Like anything in this world, there are products that are good value, products that are overpriced and a question of what each person prioritises too. It's all about finding a balance point that's right for each individual 🙂
@@PassionforSound I like fat cables; in case I accidentally tread on em 😂 I mostly get hand-made cables & therefore I value the persons time & effort above all. Cheers 🍻 🍻
Tasker, Klots, Mogami cables, Amphenol, Neutrik connectors and no need for all that BS.
Audioquest Cables works just fine.
Yes they do 🙂
The only good cables are those you pay $2000 for. Everything else is trash and harsh sound
Yeah I call bullshit on anyone that claims to hear a difference between cables. Snake oil.
if I use doorbell wire on speakers; I can hear a difference 🤣🤣😂😂
Do not waste your money on cables, basic cables are perfectly adequate. Arm yourself with basic electronics and acoustics knowledge then you can dismiss videos like this as total BS and watch them just for their comedy value.
Well, you are wrong.
Ever heard of pavlovian conditioning? You switching those imputs conditions your brain to believe up is *one thing* and down is *one thing* . *It doesnt matter if you dont know the cables, you DO know if the switch is down or up* . Thats why your analysis is invalid, because you are still aware *which mode is ingaged regardless of what imput it was* . If you actually want to give informative consensus, then do an actual double blind ABX test recorded live. Why bother telling us about how you "didnt know the imputs" if it was still ultimately inflused by pavlovian conditioning? Because you *think* it isnt? Thats how conditioning can work. 😂
What really strikes me is that this "conditioning" works in one direction only. So, if I hear an improvement I am imagining it because I want to hear it. If you don't hear a difference you have it right.
We are dismissing another possible explanation: that people who cannot afford, or (quite legitimately) prefer not to spend money in cables want to believe that there can be no difference, and they will not hear the difference even when it's there. Why? because they are happier in that way.
If it works, it works both ways.
@@DaveJ6515 I have no problem with people giving their consensus on a product, I have a problem when they try to make an invalid excuse for why they believe it. Just state your opinion, then move on. He was trying to justify that his observations were not persuaded, when thats factually incorrect. If you want to make an opinion that is truly transformative of neurological factors, then you need to run a double blind ABX test. If you dont care that you're being neurologically conditioned, then don't. But you cant have neither.
@@williamsteven5613 I was trying to ask why the conditioning should explain everything in one direction, and not even be taken into consideration as a possible explanation in the opposite direction. I find it strange.
For some reason I can't reply to a specific comment asking why I am back when I said that I had more important things to do.
My answer is: " Exactly. It was late and I had to go to sleep, which is important for your health. Which does not apply to this specific instant in time."
@@DaveJ6515 what do you mean "opposite direction"?
I always feel pitty for those “measurement”-guys that they never listened to a system that is good enough to hear the difference between cables.
the idea that "measurement" guys don't listen to or have access to high end systems is hilarious. way to be tribally divisive about something so trivial.
Dude, genelec, a company who installs the most expensive pro audio suites on the entire planet use pro grade xlrs that are $60 for 3m. You can see their installation videos showing them. Professionals that work in $100000+ suits that MAKE YOUR MUSIC, don't use cables worth over $40 a meter. You are barking up an imaginary tree. 😂
We already know thats bogus from talking to professionals that use audio equipment that has absurd levels of performance. They never use expensive cable no matter the cost of the system of job it is accomplishing despite it actually having a job. It would be the best case scenario if they actually made a difference. Yet they still don't use them. You are are arguing against the people that literally make your music. 🤣
@@enjoshi-godrez8775 Which proves nothing. You just increased your carbon footprint with no purpose.
@@DaveJ6515 oh, I can see you're just salty little cable junky. Get back to me when you have data to back your claims like other principles in hifi do.
Cables don’t make a difference unless they are poorly made. Anything else is just parting a fool from his money
Hmmm, silly me bought 3 foot XLR cables for $16.49 per pair on Amazon. I must not be a real "audiophile" since they sound perfect to me.
This makes me think of the "science" we've been subjected to over the last couple years concerning the pandemic.
The claim that the sound quality changes because of the audio cable is similar to the claim that the picture quality of the TV improves by changing the power strip.
It's such an absurd, religious superstition.
I swear I noticed a sharper image when I changed my HDMI cable, but then again it could be because I was slightly more alert and had a drink or two. But it's definitely the cable.
Cables should provide a flat frequency response. If they don't they're defective.
that is correct, but certain things like detail and soundstage etc you cannot measure, these things in my opinion can be affected by the quality of the cable and how it is designed.
@Gladiator Cables You couldn't have said it better.
@@gladiatorcables9080 the way to prove that subjectively 1 cable is better than another is to run blind tests. It would be interesting if you posted the test results.
@@dangerzone007 that would def be interesting. i've personally done blind testing with friends when designing certain cables and it seems to actually be a difference as we all preferred different cables and heard differences with specific wires. Yes these things are really hard to prove but i think that cables can make an actual difference.
@@gladiatorcables9080 what are the cables in your range?
If you make your own, the mystery is very small. You know what you put into it. The science versus BS is the bain of audio I think. Been doing this since I was 5 years old. And the comedic science versus actual science is startling. Are you launching a space flight? Hmm, probably not. Properties needed, good quality terminations, good copper, good shielding and done. Everything else is purely conjecture. I use Mogami cables. Reasonable money, reasonable build. I know on the job it won't let me down. I have had so called exotic spendy cables that were total crap reliability wise, and to me not a value at all when it fails when I need it to work. It isn't just passive listening for me. It is creating and sharing for others, and failure is not an option. But I am not a fool with my money either. Do what you want, it is your money, and your reasoning. And I never ever ever use cables as a tone control. Your mileage may vary.