Programmer here. Just wanted to add a slight correction to the explanation at 6:31 of how the paddles are read by the game. The program must first manually discharge the capacitors for the paddles, and then consistently check at intervals for each paddle to see if its respective capacitor is full. This takes time during the picture-drawing stage of the program (kernel), which is why paddle games tend to be a bit limited in graphics.
Hey Jeremiah, thanks for commenting! I thought perhaps it was inferred a bit in the explanation that it needed to be done at certain intervals, but maybe I should have expanded on it just a bit more.
Yep. The same design was used for the Sound Blaster style "game port". This is not too difficult with h-blank interrupts, but in PCs, which don't have those, the CPU was just put in a counted spinlock, which is why most PC games required a "calibration" before using the joysticks. Modern variable axis joysticks just give a numeric digital position, but they have to be centered whem they are powered on.
One thing I really appreciate about the Paddle controller is the knob size. You usually don't think about it but when you use a smaller knob, such as the Sears Video Arcade II hybird paddle joystick, a pinch like grip is required which is harder on the fingers & wrist. But the paddle controllers feel the perfect diameter
I agree! I have that Sears Video Arcade II controller as well as the NES Arkanoid controller, and I prefer the larger paddle of the 2600 standard paddle controller. It will be fun to use it with the Arkanoid homebrew for the Atari 7800 when it gets its release.
The quality of the paddle is also interesting in light of how awful the 2600 joystick is. It’s super durable for sure, but the ratio of force needed to the level of grip required on the base to keep it from flipping out of your hands....I’m sure there is a whole generation of adults who developed carpal tunnel prematurely as a result of playing Pac Man, Asteroids, and Combat for long periods of time. I was so excited when I realized my Master System and Genesis controllers worked on the 2600 (I actually had the Sears version), because it meant I could play Yars’ Revenge without killing my hands!
The resistance on the dial also makes precision easier. I have a Hyperkin Ranger, and the smoothness and small size make precision extremely difficult.
@@nathandaniels4823 they say the wico stick was better than the default cx-40 by atari. I just found an article indicating that the guy who designed the cx-40 originally designed it for an unreleased tank game before atari launched the 2600/vcs. he said he'd had made more ergonomic if he knew they were gonna utilize for something other than the tank game...pretty ironic imho.
No mention of the identical-looking Atari Driving controllers that were available since launch? They were rotary encoders bundled with Indy 500. That means they spin infinitely in either direction.
I would like to do a separate video for the driving controller. I didn't want to mention it here since the internal function of it is quite different than the paddle (as you pointed out), but I suppose I could have mentioned it in passing just to say something along the lines of "not to be confused with the driving controller (etc.)."
Awesome video as always! My favorite paddle game to play on the Atari 2600 was Warlords, especially when I could get 3 other people to play it with me.
There's something about a 2600 and a paddle controller with that sub-frame lag-free control that was always magical. There's not a single piece of hardware since that has felt so instantaneous and lag-free... you have to experience it on real hardware on a CRT to really appreciate it.
The oddest and most interesting thing about the paddles, to me, was that unlike the Atari joystick controllers, they came in pairs which plugged into a single controller jack with a Y connector. This had a number of consequences. Unlike joystick games, paddle games for the Atari 2600 could have up to four players (and I wonder if the whole motivation for this was originally so they could put Quadrapong on the Video Olympics cartridge). The early Atari 8-bit computers had four of these jacks, so they could in principle support *eight* players, and I think Super Breakout for the computers actually allowed that. The Atari Touch Tablet was a nifty peripheral for the 8-bit computers that just registered internally as a pair of paddle controllers representing the X and Y coordinates. That made it easy to program for--Atari BASIC's paddle functions, which automated the involved business of reading the pots, could read it. Since there were two paddle inputs to a controller jack, it just needed a single plug. The Atari 2800, a restyled 2600 intended for the Japanese market (and sold in the US as the Sears Video Arcade II), had hybrid joystick/paddle controllers--but since there was now only one paddle per jack instead of two, they had to put in four controller jacks just for the purpose of supporting four-player paddle games, and have a physical switch that indicated whether you were using the paddle or joystick function on the controllers.
Circus Atari always makes me laugh. Grab a 2600 (or 7800) and give it a go! There is also a homebrew 7800 game "Super Circus Atari Age" that takes things to the next level.
I think this game concept started life as an Exidy arcade game just called Circus. But just about everyone in the industry (Midway, Sega, Universal, Taito, etc.) had a nearly exact clone of it with a different name, much like Pong itself. In the 70s nobody seemed to have any inhibitions about this at all!
How is it even possible that you don't have a VCS/2600?! I keep giving them away since I end up getting more and more unintentionally (comes with other game stuff I buy). Somehow I still have a pile of extra Juniors, 7800s, and woody 4-switchers. Circus, with the seesaw acrobats, was one of the first games I played at home when I found a 4-switch woody in the hallway closet back in the '80s... left behind after my older sister and brother had flown the coop. I liked it, but I had my eyes on the prize and used the Atari as a bargaining chip to get my stingy friend to let me play his NES... "You can't play my Atari unless you let me play your Nintendo." ;)
The paddle controlers are also the secret to how the Atari 7800 added a second button to a one button controller port without breaking backward compatibility. Basically, the buttons are tried to the "button" pin, and then either the left or right paddle pin with a resistor. 2600 joystick games would ignore the paddle inputs where as 7800 games would check these values when the buttons were pressed, allowing it to distinguish one from the other.
Warlords is one of my favorite Atari games! Whenever anyone talks about games you can't play or hardware/controllers you can't find anymore, this is the game that I bring up. Because these paddles, and the game, were so much fun
The paddle controller was my fav for the 2600. I just enjoy the "smooth" movement of the on-screen paddle in games like Breakout/Super Breakout and of course the Activision classic Kaboom. When I was in middle school Pong was re released for the Playstation and while I loved it (still do) it wasn't as much fun to control using a d-pad because it took what was supposed to be an analogue input and made it into a more modern digital experience. It was hard to move the paddle in small increments.
Just discovered your excellent channel today. I really miss Paddle controllers. I tell people that all the time. I used to have a Commodore Vic 20/64 and they used the same joystick/paddle controllers as the Atari 2600. I used to always love the paddle games more than anything else. My favourites were a game called Clowns (an Circus Atari clone), and The Sky is Falling (a Kaboom clone). I wish there were modern paddle controllers and games for PC today :-)
Many hours spent playing Circus Atari with those paddles. Button flips the side of the man on the seesaw during play. I'm a lefty and used the double finger (index middle) to push the button.
Gotta love the nostalgia... I didnt use them to much, as a kid many games I just could not understand what to do to start play so I just moved along...I had the older wolder real wood atari and tbe plastic one
The paddle made me think about how modern games put movement in the left hand. I bring this up because I use my right hand for games like Pac-Man or when playing the 2600 using the standard controller.
It took a remarkably long time for the industry to settle on standards that are now nearly universal. With Atari shooter games a right-hander would typically move with the right hand and shoot with the left thumb, holding the base of the joystick controller with the left hand. Most modern videogames put primary firing control on the right hand. I suppose the modern schemes ultimately evolved from the NES gamepad, with a D-pad on the left and action buttons on the right.
Interesting controller: SEGA Dreamcast controller. The stick is a magnet Hall sensor assembly, as are the triggers. Very easy to disassemble and see how they tick, just make sure to not confuse steel and brass screws when reassembling. :D Oh also same on Saturn 3D pad. One difference between Dreamcast and Saturn pad is the spring preload plate, which on the Dreamcast shifts depending on on the angle of the stick, and tries to nudge you towards 8 principle directions. Because i wasn't used to analogue sticks, and couldn't quite figure out where exactly "forward" is, this weird trait helped me immensely to get used to it. I had a very well made DualShock style controller for PC before that and could never quite hit the direction i was thinking of, but nowadays i play with Xbox360 pad and no longer find it difficult. Interesting topic: SEGA MegaDrive/Genesis pads come in 3 or 4 different versions, which have all different design of D-pad pivot. The pivot is the key feature of the D-pad that allows it to work and feel right, without actuating opposite directions and also decides how likely inadvertent diagonal actuation is, or how difficult it is to hit them on purpose. In some controllers, the D-pad stem goes all the way through the PCB and pivots on the back shell if i remember right, in others the inner surface of the front shell guides the D-pad. Lots of experimentation, not all of it good. The stem length is also extremely sensitive to manufacturing quality, tiniest difference between perfect and unusable.
I myself tried adding a 3btn Genesis d-pad to an older one (launch black and red coloring) which was stiffer and harsher on the thumbs, but couldn't figure how to do either as it seemed to be destructive to both so I didn't risk it...Would be nice to see a 3btn released with a smoother dpad like the 6btn genesis or saturn pads had.
I started out gaming on an Atari 800XL, but I don't think we owned paddle controllers. I feel like I missed out what seems like a pretty fun gameplay experience. To my knowledge, classic gaming is pretty popular nowadays and a lot of people use either emulation, or more recently, FPGA systems like MiSTer/Analogue NT/Mega SG etc. I'm surprised at the lack of USB controller options for anything even slightly specialised. For example, I tried searching for Atari style paddles, spinners, four way leaf spring joysticks and trackballs. You can find components to be fitted in arcade cabinets, but nobody seems to make stand-alone controllers (handheld or to be placed in the lap/on a tabletop). Even something as simple as retro style gamepads that aren't noticeably inferior to the originals seem to be few and far between. What really gets me is the fact that it's already become difficult to find good quality PS3 controllers despite the console being discontinued relatively recently. Brand new first party ones are stupidly expensive, you're never sure of the condition used ones will be in, a lot of the ones advertised as official are knock-offs and third party ones are almost universally awful and/or don't have all the features of the first party controllers (some functions being required for particular games).
I remember the paddle. I used to play Kaboom! with it too, along with Star Wars: Jedi Arena. Good times. I had a bizarre (at least, to my friends) one-handed grip, using my right thumb to rotate the paddle and right index finger for the button. My paddle controller was extremely sensitive to even slight movements. I'd gotten it used and I think the wheel itself was modified by the previous owner to be a bit smoother to rotate than typical paddles, so one thumb on the wheel was enough. I definitely couldn't do this with other paddles, they all felt stiff and 'rusty' compared to mine.
Talkin’ outta turn, that’s a paddlin’. Lookin’ out the window, that’s a paddlin’. Staring at my sandals, that’s a paddlin’. Paddlin’ the school canoe? Oh you better believe that’s a paddlin’.
There's this other RUclips channel of a guy building controllers with Arduino. Could be worth trying to make a collab because if you find controller-design and/or game-programming fascinating, then Arduino should be like LEGO to you.
One of the greatest controllers ever. To this day the Atari paddle games allow a type of gameplay not duplicated by other systems outside of the Nes Arkanoid box.
Awesome. Each time I talk about controllers, it falls into a deaf ear. Everyone seems to be interested in "Megaflop", "exclusives" and "fps counter", even if you play 80% of the time at PS4 exclusives, you still have your controller in your hands 100% of the time. I find it very weird that people don't seem to care about controllers. I know that I won't buy a Sony machine so long as their controller remains the same. I went for Xbox and NGC back in the early 2000's not because of graphics but controllers. @Displaced Gamers, check out Xbox one controller with Forza 6 or 7. Pay attention to the rpm counter and press the trigger... Then go from 5999 rpm to 6001 rpm... go back and forth between 5999 and 6001 rpm... Then hold 6000 rpm for a while... then pick a number and use the trigger to go there as accurately and as fast as possible... I absolutely love the accuracy of these things, it's a shame most games don't take advantage of that. (I haven't tried the Elite controller yet but the Xbox one controller is already a beast of precision. Too bad Xbox has no games...)
This is why I would often buy adapters for controllers. Often a game for one system would be easier for me to play when using a PS2 controller. Other times, the XBOX style controller was best for me.
The current version of the Xbox controller is the best controller I have ever used. It's still annoyingly imprecise in the triggers, and requires quite a bit of deadzone for the sticks, but it's not nearly as bad as other controllers. I wonder why noone had made a mainstream controller that doesn't have these kinds of issues.
I agree with you a few of your points here, but I think most players are just satisfied w/a new console & automatically equate new with "progress" , or better b/c it is newer. This is sad to see as I have friends like this as well. The joycon's have arguably the worst and cheapest feeling analog sticks of ANY controller in history imho. Not to forget, also probably having the single worst dpad of their history.
As a lefty who grew up with this stuff, I never had problems with any controllers or felt that they were "backwards", including paddles. I just used them like everyone else did. Trying to use anything backwards/lefty feels weird, even stuff designed that way like the SMS joystick.
I’m also a lefty, but I just learned to do it “right-handed”. Just like using a mouse or playing the drums. As you can see by my avatar, Kaboom holds a special place in my heart as well. It’s also worth noting that there is a well-made yet unplayable version on iOS. You use finger swipes to control the water containers. Not only is it hard to see the action with your finger covering the containers, but the controls just aren’t responsive enough to keep up. It amuses me that 40 years on, we’re unable to precisely replicate this game on modern hardware. Lastly, for those who are looking to pick up this hardware, it’s important to note there is a driving controller for the 2600 that looks the same but IS NOT. I haven’t taken it apart but it doesn’t have the minimum and maximum travel distances. this leads me to believe it doesn’t have a potentiometer, therefore it won’t work with standard paddle games.
anecdotally speaking, I think the difference is one is analog (due to the pots as you referenced) and the driving was digital w/up to a certain degree of movement (can't recall if 180/270 or 360)
I feel like Kaboom and Circus Atari are two games that prove the significance and importance of period-specific hardware to these games. Just seeing them again makes me want to go find a 2600 and a CRT right now just because there's NO way to replicate these experiences on modern technology. Sometimes older technology has unexpected advantages over modern technology... it's just that the modern tech outweighs the older tech. Don't get me wrong, I'll take a 10-pound slim HD 50" TV over a 100-pound behemoth SD 36" TV most any day, but modern displays have yet to match CRTs in responsiveness. I wish someone would come up with a cathode-ray filament display.
The very first video game that I have a memory of playing is Kaboom, using the paddle controller. I think I was 4 years old. I spent countless hours playing that and Pitfall.
Would it be worth making a video on what’s happening when you turn a 2600 on half way and get different graphics and sounds? I used to do this all the time.
I'm left handed, learned to play as if I were right handed. Kaboom! was always my favorite Atari game. I have 3 crts cluttering up the house just to make sure I can play it for the rest of my life
I know there have been plug and play devices with the paddles but I'm not entirely sure why there isn't a USB or Bluetooth paddle for sale now for multiple devices, or for that matter, a retro emulator handheld with a dedicated paddle controller
The 7800's controller accommodated southpaws by having a button on both sides, but they performed the same function (and the knob rotates and looks like a paddle but, sadly, wasn't).
Just imagine unexpectedly waking up in one of these fun worlds. It would be a nightmare of utter confusion as you're bounced around into odd blocks against a solid single color endless void.
That's a pretty good idea the side grip posture, not unlike an RC car controller grip, comfy. :) My main critiques are that I wish I could snap them together like you could with brackets like other Atari controllers, in that approach at least one paddle would be left handed. ;) Other than that from looking at the pinout there are two other major omissions, the paddles could have had some more buttons as joystick commands are left over there, and the joystick itself could have had two additional buttons using the Omega Race approach turning paddle pins into buttons as in "full left turn", Fire1,Fire2, and Start/Pause would be my layout choice.
I have been playing Osu!Catch a rithm game that is basically an evolved version of Kaboom and never ever occurred to me how naturally looks to play that sort of game with a paddle
Am I the only one who mostly knew the Atari 2600 controllers without the black covers? Like most of my consoles, I got my Atari used, and none of controllers had their covers. So, in my memory, the joystick has that black base but is a clear white plastic on top. And the paddles just have this small plastic stick you turn, as shown at around 6:04. Except I'm pretty sure those were that white, translucent plastic as well--the same plastic used for the button. So my main complaint was just how easy it was to remove those covers or the knob. They should have been secured better.
My original Atari joysticks lost their boots early in life. I actually remember going to Toys R Us to buy replacements. I can't remember if they were out of Atari-branded ones, but I ended up with a pair made by Kraft. I sadly don't know the Kraft sticks are these days, although I don't remember them feeling that comfortable.
When the N64 came out, they were bragging about having an analog controller. My dad asked "What is so great about an analog signal? digital signals work better." I didn't know the answer back then, but maybe that was because I was 12 years old at the time. Have you ever looked at sensors used in car engines and other car components? You might find it interesting. I once read an article about getting 450 horsepower from a Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbo, and learned about the MAF (Mass Air Flow sensor). At that point, I knew I would be able to work on computerized cars.
It really depends. A fair number of early videogame consoles and computers actually had analog joystick controllers, but they were often fiddly, fragile and subject to drift--Atari's simple switch-based digital joystick was less trouble, and it rapidly became a quasi-industry standard. So I can kind of see where your dad was coming from. It took a long time for console makers to really get analog sticks right. Paddles, on the other hand, were simpler to do. And sometimes I'm a little sad that they've disappeared as game controllers in the modern era; for a while in the 1970s, they were the dominant game controller.
I'm a lefty, but when it comes to gaming, I don't adapt to play a right-handed controller left-handed. I never really gave it another thought. I played Kaboom! with right hand on the wheel and thumb on the button. I also don't use a left-handed mouse. But fast forward to Wii, I couldn't get into games that used the wiimote with analog stick. Mirror swapping the entirety of Twilight Princess to appeal to righties felt like a personal slight :P Using a controller right-handed I can do, but right-handed with motion control is too far for me. I'm glad standard controllers are still the norm, and motion is just a niche.
Just got some Commodore VIC-20 paddle controllers on Sunday and boy do they suck! Makes me appreciate Atari's even more. Weird that Commodore later made nearly exact copies of the Atari paddles with the same shape but different color/logo. IIRC, they were sued for that and had to stop selling paddles.
I've never held this controller or at least not to my recollection, but I imagine I'd still hold this the way a right handed person would for this controller. After all the mouse was designed with right handed people in mind, but as a lefty I adapted to it all the same. I only knew of one left handed person who used the mouse in left-handed fashion and I found it absolutely bizarre. I think the misconception is because it's our dominant hand therefore we must use all tools with it. From a family of left dominant people, no one used left handed scissors. That said, I think my right hand could handle turning a knob in this instance. Just don't ask it to write or make art.
I once cleaned my paddle controllers to get rid of the jitter, but the top knob of one of the controllers won't stay put. Should I use some kind of crazy glue?
awsome design for a left handed, very comfortable. right hand under, middle finger to trig. a real left handed controller. at the opposite, the original joystick is very designed for right handed people, being left handed i hate it.
Wow! just the expert I was looking for. I am going to make a Tabletop arcade out of a homemade cabinet, 1/4 inch glass and an old 13 inch tv. The game will be WARLORDS for atari 2600 system for a head to head four person game. The TV is facing up. From your expertise, HOW CAN I KEEP THE TWO SETS OF PADDLES IN AND HAVE TWO JOYSTICKS PLUGGED IN AT THE SAME TIME? Some of the earliest atari 2600 systems have 4 Jack's in the back. Is this the solution? Or is splitting wires the answer and how please?
Hmm, as a rightie, I think I held it in my right hand and used my left hand to turn the paddle, but I can't be sure. Maybe I just wasn't very good at playing Atari, as I didn't own one.
I never had an Atari, but this is a rare instance of an early "good" controller. Almost all pre-SNES/Genesis controllers are garbage. Hold the NES controller as an adult, sharp edges and way too small. Also hooray metric system.
Ha! I actually put some "subtitles" in with conversion to inches/ounces in the measurements section, but I found them distracting. Nevertheless, I strayed a little bit when I used that 9/16" socket to take apart the controller.
M.U.L.E. for the Atari 8-bit homecomputers. Though this (absolutely awesome) game doesn't actually make much use of the paddles' analog control scheme; the knob was only used to indicate either "up", "stay put" or "down" during an (often quite frantic) segment of the game where all players simultanously try to either buy or sell goods from and to each other in an auction (where the button can be used to collude with a willing co-player to the detriment of the other two. This is actually where I learned the term "collusion" from... Educational value of gaming: proven!). The paddles just served as a somewhat limited substitude / alternative in case you had more players than joysticks available. Probably more relvant to your question: Star Wars Jedi Arena for the 2600?
I play left handed (although I'm technically ambidextrous). I use my right hand's middle finger to trigger the button. How else do you think I use my fingerprint reader power button on my Sony Xperia 1 and now Moto Edge 2021? My middle finger is my thumbprint in this anti-Lefty world. XD Now I use a Hyperkin Ranger instead of Atari controllers. I can just press that button with my right thumb like normal.
I've just found my Dad's old Atari 2600 (6 switches on the front, not 4) and the paddles need a good clean. I've got a can of Servisol Super 10 which is a cleaner and lubricator. Do you think this would be ok to use? www.crcind.com/csp/web/ProdDisp.csp?lng=3&idx=6095486&country=GB&product=SOL%20SUPER%2010&brand=SERVISOL
Hello, really fantastic work, congratulations. I wanted to know, if possible, if you could sell me the Atari 2600 Paddles in USB version, so I can finally use them on my computer, on my Mac. P.s. I live in Italy :)
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Lefty here. I just learned to use the paddle right handed. Spinning an Atari paddle wheel with your left hand…that’s a paddlin’.
Same here, but I did not learn to to it righty
Programmer here.
Just wanted to add a slight correction to the explanation at 6:31 of how the paddles are read by the game. The program must first manually discharge the capacitors for the paddles, and then consistently check at intervals for each paddle to see if its respective capacitor is full. This takes time during the picture-drawing stage of the program (kernel), which is why paddle games tend to be a bit limited in graphics.
Hey Jeremiah, thanks for commenting! I thought perhaps it was inferred a bit in the explanation that it needed to be done at certain intervals, but maybe I should have expanded on it just a bit more.
Yep. The same design was used for the Sound Blaster style "game port". This is not too difficult with h-blank interrupts, but in PCs, which don't have those, the CPU was just put in a counted spinlock, which is why most PC games required a "calibration" before using the joysticks. Modern variable axis joysticks just give a numeric digital position, but they have to be centered whem they are powered on.
One thing I really appreciate about the Paddle controller is the knob size. You usually don't think about it but when you use a smaller knob, such as the Sears Video Arcade II hybird paddle joystick, a pinch like grip is required which is harder on the fingers & wrist. But the paddle controllers feel the perfect diameter
I agree! I have that Sears Video Arcade II controller as well as the NES Arkanoid controller, and I prefer the larger paddle of the 2600 standard paddle controller. It will be fun to use it with the Arkanoid homebrew for the Atari 7800 when it gets its release.
The quality of the paddle is also interesting in light of how awful the 2600 joystick is. It’s super durable for sure, but the ratio of force needed to the level of grip required on the base to keep it from flipping out of your hands....I’m sure there is a whole generation of adults who developed carpal tunnel prematurely as a result of playing Pac Man, Asteroids, and Combat for long periods of time.
I was so excited when I realized my Master System and Genesis controllers worked on the 2600 (I actually had the Sears version), because it meant I could play Yars’ Revenge without killing my hands!
The resistance on the dial also makes precision easier.
I have a Hyperkin Ranger, and the smoothness and small size make precision extremely difficult.
@@nathandaniels4823 they say the wico stick was better than the default cx-40 by atari. I just found an article indicating that the guy who designed the cx-40 originally designed it for an unreleased tank game before atari launched the 2600/vcs. he said he'd had made more ergonomic if he knew they were gonna utilize for something other than the tank game...pretty ironic imho.
No mention of the identical-looking Atari Driving controllers that were available since launch? They were rotary encoders bundled with Indy 500. That means they spin infinitely in either direction.
I would like to do a separate video for the driving controller. I didn't want to mention it here since the internal function of it is quite different than the paddle (as you pointed out), but I suppose I could have mentioned it in passing just to say something along the lines of "not to be confused with the driving controller (etc.)."
Awesome video as always! My favorite paddle game to play on the Atari 2600 was Warlords, especially when I could get 3 other people to play it with me.
There's something about a 2600 and a paddle controller with that sub-frame lag-free control that was always magical. There's not a single piece of hardware since that has felt so instantaneous and lag-free... you have to experience it on real hardware on a CRT to really appreciate it.
The oddest and most interesting thing about the paddles, to me, was that unlike the Atari joystick controllers, they came in pairs which plugged into a single controller jack with a Y connector. This had a number of consequences. Unlike joystick games, paddle games for the Atari 2600 could have up to four players (and I wonder if the whole motivation for this was originally so they could put Quadrapong on the Video Olympics cartridge). The early Atari 8-bit computers had four of these jacks, so they could in principle support *eight* players, and I think Super Breakout for the computers actually allowed that.
The Atari Touch Tablet was a nifty peripheral for the 8-bit computers that just registered internally as a pair of paddle controllers representing the X and Y coordinates. That made it easy to program for--Atari BASIC's paddle functions, which automated the involved business of reading the pots, could read it. Since there were two paddle inputs to a controller jack, it just needed a single plug.
The Atari 2800, a restyled 2600 intended for the Japanese market (and sold in the US as the Sears Video Arcade II), had hybrid joystick/paddle controllers--but since there was now only one paddle per jack instead of two, they had to put in four controller jacks just for the purpose of supporting four-player paddle games, and have a physical switch that indicated whether you were using the paddle or joystick function on the controllers.
That seesaw game at the end looks like a lot of fun. Regrettably I don't currently have an Atari 2600.
Circus Atari always makes me laugh. Grab a 2600 (or 7800) and give it a go! There is also a homebrew 7800 game "Super Circus Atari Age" that takes things to the next level.
I think this game concept started life as an Exidy arcade game just called Circus. But just about everyone in the industry (Midway, Sega, Universal, Taito, etc.) had a nearly exact clone of it with a different name, much like Pong itself. In the 70s nobody seemed to have any inhibitions about this at all!
How is it even possible that you don't have a VCS/2600?! I keep giving them away since I end up getting more and more unintentionally (comes with other game stuff I buy). Somehow I still have a pile of extra Juniors, 7800s, and woody 4-switchers.
Circus, with the seesaw acrobats, was one of the first games I played at home when I found a 4-switch woody in the hallway closet back in the '80s... left behind after my older sister and brother had flown the coop. I liked it, but I had my eyes on the prize and used the Atari as a bargaining chip to get my stingy friend to let me play his NES... "You can't play my Atari unless you let me play your Nintendo." ;)
I do, but I don't have a video adapter.
The paddle controlers are also the secret to how the Atari 7800 added a second button to a one button controller port without breaking backward compatibility. Basically, the buttons are tried to the "button" pin, and then either the left or right paddle pin with a resistor. 2600 joystick games would ignore the paddle inputs where as 7800 games would check these values when the buttons were pressed, allowing it to distinguish one from the other.
Warlords is one of my favorite Atari games! Whenever anyone talks about games you can't play or hardware/controllers you can't find anymore, this is the game that I bring up. Because these paddles, and the game, were so much fun
The paddle controller was my fav for the 2600. I just enjoy the "smooth" movement of the on-screen paddle in games like Breakout/Super Breakout and of course the Activision classic Kaboom. When I was in middle school Pong was re released for the Playstation and while I loved it (still do) it wasn't as much fun to control using a d-pad because it took what was supposed to be an analogue input and made it into a more modern digital experience. It was hard to move the paddle in small increments.
Just discovered your excellent channel today. I really miss Paddle controllers. I tell people that all the time. I used to have a Commodore Vic 20/64 and they used the same joystick/paddle controllers as the Atari 2600. I used to always love the paddle games more than anything else. My favourites were a game called Clowns (an Circus Atari clone), and The Sky is Falling (a Kaboom clone). I wish there were modern paddle controllers and games for PC today :-)
Many hours spent playing Circus Atari with those paddles. Button flips the side of the man on the seesaw during play. I'm a lefty and used the double finger (index middle) to push the button.
Gotta love the nostalgia... I didnt use them to much, as a kid many games I just could not understand what to do to start play so I just moved along...I had the older wolder real wood atari and tbe plastic one
I remember being a kid playing Warlords until early morning when the sun started to come up.
This channel never ceases to amaze me.
As soon as I saw this video come up I knew I was going to learn something I didn't know I wanted to learn.
The paddle made me think about how modern games put movement in the left hand. I bring this up because I use my right hand for games like Pac-Man or when playing the 2600 using the standard controller.
It took a remarkably long time for the industry to settle on standards that are now nearly universal. With Atari shooter games a right-hander would typically move with the right hand and shoot with the left thumb, holding the base of the joystick controller with the left hand. Most modern videogames put primary firing control on the right hand. I suppose the modern schemes ultimately evolved from the NES gamepad, with a D-pad on the left and action buttons on the right.
Interesting controller: SEGA Dreamcast controller. The stick is a magnet Hall sensor assembly, as are the triggers. Very easy to disassemble and see how they tick, just make sure to not confuse steel and brass screws when reassembling. :D Oh also same on Saturn 3D pad. One difference between Dreamcast and Saturn pad is the spring preload plate, which on the Dreamcast shifts depending on on the angle of the stick, and tries to nudge you towards 8 principle directions. Because i wasn't used to analogue sticks, and couldn't quite figure out where exactly "forward" is, this weird trait helped me immensely to get used to it. I had a very well made DualShock style controller for PC before that and could never quite hit the direction i was thinking of, but nowadays i play with Xbox360 pad and no longer find it difficult.
Interesting topic: SEGA MegaDrive/Genesis pads come in 3 or 4 different versions, which have all different design of D-pad pivot. The pivot is the key feature of the D-pad that allows it to work and feel right, without actuating opposite directions and also decides how likely inadvertent diagonal actuation is, or how difficult it is to hit them on purpose. In some controllers, the D-pad stem goes all the way through the PCB and pivots on the back shell if i remember right, in others the inner surface of the front shell guides the D-pad. Lots of experimentation, not all of it good. The stem length is also extremely sensitive to manufacturing quality, tiniest difference between perfect and unusable.
I myself tried adding a 3btn Genesis d-pad to an older one (launch black and red coloring) which was stiffer and harsher on the thumbs, but couldn't figure how to do either as it seemed to be destructive to both so I didn't risk it...Would be nice to see a 3btn released with a smoother dpad like the 6btn genesis or saturn pads had.
I started out gaming on an Atari 800XL, but I don't think we owned paddle controllers. I feel like I missed out what seems like a pretty fun gameplay experience.
To my knowledge, classic gaming is pretty popular nowadays and a lot of people use either emulation, or more recently, FPGA systems like MiSTer/Analogue NT/Mega SG etc. I'm surprised at the lack of USB controller options for anything even slightly specialised. For example, I tried searching for Atari style paddles, spinners, four way leaf spring joysticks and trackballs. You can find components to be fitted in arcade cabinets, but nobody seems to make stand-alone controllers (handheld or to be placed in the lap/on a tabletop).
Even something as simple as retro style gamepads that aren't noticeably inferior to the originals seem to be few and far between. What really gets me is the fact that it's already become difficult to find good quality PS3 controllers despite the console being discontinued relatively recently. Brand new first party ones are stupidly expensive, you're never sure of the condition used ones will be in, a lot of the ones advertised as official are knock-offs and third party ones are almost universally awful and/or don't have all the features of the first party controllers (some functions being required for particular games).
Really loved your approach. This is the kind of content I've always searched for. Thank you!
I remember the paddle. I used to play Kaboom! with it too, along with Star Wars: Jedi Arena. Good times.
I had a bizarre (at least, to my friends) one-handed grip, using my right thumb to rotate the paddle and right index finger for the button. My paddle controller was extremely sensitive to even slight movements. I'd gotten it used and I think the wheel itself was modified by the previous owner to be a bit smoother to rotate than typical paddles, so one thumb on the wheel was enough.
I definitely couldn't do this with other paddles, they all felt stiff and 'rusty' compared to mine.
Talkin’ outta turn, that’s a paddlin’. Lookin’ out the window, that’s a paddlin’. Staring at my sandals, that’s a paddlin’. Paddlin’ the school canoe? Oh you better believe that’s a paddlin’.
There's this other RUclips channel of a guy building controllers with Arduino.
Could be worth trying to make a collab because if you find controller-design and/or game-programming fascinating, then Arduino should be like LEGO to you.
One of the greatest controllers ever. To this day the Atari paddle games allow a type of gameplay not duplicated by other systems outside of the Nes Arkanoid box.
I love this. Please continue
Awesome. Each time I talk about controllers, it falls into a deaf ear. Everyone seems to be interested in "Megaflop", "exclusives" and "fps counter", even if you play 80% of the time at PS4 exclusives, you still have your controller in your hands 100% of the time. I find it very weird that people don't seem to care about controllers. I know that I won't buy a Sony machine so long as their controller remains the same. I went for Xbox and NGC back in the early 2000's not because of graphics but controllers. @Displaced Gamers, check out Xbox one controller with Forza 6 or 7. Pay attention to the rpm counter and press the trigger... Then go from 5999 rpm to 6001 rpm... go back and forth between 5999 and 6001 rpm... Then hold 6000 rpm for a while... then pick a number and use the trigger to go there as accurately and as fast as possible... I absolutely love the accuracy of these things, it's a shame most games don't take advantage of that. (I haven't tried the Elite controller yet but the Xbox one controller is already a beast of precision. Too bad Xbox has no games...)
This is why I would often buy adapters for controllers. Often a game for one system would be easier for me to play when using a PS2 controller. Other times, the XBOX style controller was best for me.
The current version of the Xbox controller is the best controller I have ever used. It's still annoyingly imprecise in the triggers, and requires quite a bit of deadzone for the sticks, but it's not nearly as bad as other controllers. I wonder why noone had made a mainstream controller that doesn't have these kinds of issues.
I agree with you a few of your points here, but I think most players are just satisfied w/a new console & automatically equate new with "progress" , or better b/c it is newer. This is sad to see as I have friends like this as well. The joycon's have arguably the worst and cheapest feeling analog sticks of ANY controller in history imho. Not to forget, also probably having the single worst dpad of their history.
@6:35 timing capacitor charge, the basis for almost all modern ADCs.
As a lefty who grew up with this stuff, I never had problems with any controllers or felt that they were "backwards", including paddles. I just used them like everyone else did. Trying to use anything backwards/lefty feels weird, even stuff designed that way like the SMS joystick.
6:30 wow that's an ADC right there!! Amazing! I'll make sure to remember that next time I need a quick one for a micro-controller :)
I’m also a lefty, but I just learned to do it “right-handed”. Just like using a mouse or playing the drums.
As you can see by my avatar, Kaboom holds a special place in my heart as well. It’s also worth noting that there is a well-made yet unplayable version on iOS. You use finger swipes to control the water containers. Not only is it hard to see the action with your finger covering the containers, but the controls just aren’t responsive enough to keep up. It amuses me that 40 years on, we’re unable to precisely replicate this game on modern hardware.
Lastly, for those who are looking to pick up this hardware, it’s important to note there is a driving controller for the 2600 that looks the same but IS NOT. I haven’t taken it apart but it doesn’t have the minimum and maximum travel distances. this leads me to believe it doesn’t have a potentiometer, therefore it won’t work with standard paddle games.
anecdotally speaking, I think the difference is one is analog (due to the pots as you referenced) and the driving was digital w/up to a certain degree of movement (can't recall if 180/270 or 360)
I love paddle controllers and games. I have famicom, sms, ps and atari paddles as well as some old school pong devices
I feel like Kaboom and Circus Atari are two games that prove the significance and importance of period-specific hardware to these games. Just seeing them again makes me want to go find a 2600 and a CRT right now just because there's NO way to replicate these experiences on modern technology. Sometimes older technology has unexpected advantages over modern technology... it's just that the modern tech outweighs the older tech. Don't get me wrong, I'll take a 10-pound slim HD 50" TV over a 100-pound behemoth SD 36" TV most any day, but modern displays have yet to match CRTs in responsiveness. I wish someone would come up with a cathode-ray filament display.
The very first video game that I have a memory of playing is Kaboom, using the paddle controller. I think I was 4 years old. I spent countless hours playing that and Pitfall.
Would it be worth making a video on what’s happening when you turn a 2600 on half way and get different graphics and sounds? I used to do this all the time.
I'm left handed, learned to play as if I were right handed. Kaboom! was always my favorite Atari game. I have 3 crts cluttering up the house just to make sure I can play it for the rest of my life
I know there have been plug and play devices with the paddles but I'm not entirely sure why there isn't a USB or Bluetooth paddle for sale now for multiple devices, or for that matter, a retro emulator handheld with a dedicated paddle controller
+1 Subscriber, I like these kind of old technology videos
The 7800's controller accommodated southpaws by having a button on both sides, but they performed the same function (and the knob rotates and looks like a paddle but, sadly, wasn't).
Great video! I have 3 of those controls, almost none of my friends know them 😅
Warlords, baby!!!
Great video! I didn't know anything about this controller, but it's so interesting
Damn, we need a paddle controller and paddle controller based games for new consoles and pcs.
I write left handed, it has always felt natural to me to hold the paddles in my left hand and control with my right.
Just imagine unexpectedly waking up in one of these fun worlds. It would be a nightmare of utter confusion as you're bounced around into odd blocks against a solid single color endless void.
That's a pretty good idea the side grip posture, not unlike an RC car controller grip, comfy. :) My main critiques are that I wish I could snap them together like you could with brackets like other Atari controllers, in that approach at least one paddle would be left handed. ;)
Other than that from looking at the pinout there are two other major omissions, the paddles could have had some more buttons as joystick commands are left over there, and the joystick itself could have had two additional buttons using the Omega Race approach turning paddle pins into buttons as in "full left turn", Fire1,Fire2, and Start/Pause would be my layout choice.
I have been playing Osu!Catch a rithm game that is basically an evolved version of Kaboom and never ever occurred to me how naturally looks to play that sort of game with a paddle
Same goes for certain microswitch controllers: some of them just 'feel right' to your liking. Be it a short or long throw and/or light or stiff.
Am I the only one who mostly knew the Atari 2600 controllers without the black covers? Like most of my consoles, I got my Atari used, and none of controllers had their covers.
So, in my memory, the joystick has that black base but is a clear white plastic on top. And the paddles just have this small plastic stick you turn, as shown at around 6:04. Except I'm pretty sure those were that white, translucent plastic as well--the same plastic used for the button.
So my main complaint was just how easy it was to remove those covers or the knob. They should have been secured better.
My original Atari joysticks lost their boots early in life. I actually remember going to Toys R Us to buy replacements. I can't remember if they were out of Atari-branded ones, but I ended up with a pair made by Kraft. I sadly don't know the Kraft sticks are these days, although I don't remember them feeling that comfortable.
It allowed you to play Mule on Atari with 3 players. Lovely times.
The most important function of the paddles :-)
Bought too pairs decades ago for exactly that reason.
When the N64 came out, they were bragging about having an analog controller. My dad asked "What is so great about an analog signal? digital signals work better." I didn't know the answer back then, but maybe that was because I was 12 years old at the time.
Have you ever looked at sensors used in car engines and other car components? You might find it interesting. I once read an article about getting 450 horsepower from a Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbo, and learned about the MAF (Mass Air Flow sensor). At that point, I knew I would be able to work on computerized cars.
It really depends. A fair number of early videogame consoles and computers actually had analog joystick controllers, but they were often fiddly, fragile and subject to drift--Atari's simple switch-based digital joystick was less trouble, and it rapidly became a quasi-industry standard. So I can kind of see where your dad was coming from. It took a long time for console makers to really get analog sticks right. Paddles, on the other hand, were simpler to do. And sometimes I'm a little sad that they've disappeared as game controllers in the modern era; for a while in the 1970s, they were the dominant game controller.
That button looks like a switch for a keyboard. Does it have a brand name or number on it?
can you show the scheme , I want to make a paddle control :)
Atari screwed over so many people on so many systems for so long when they chose to put just one button on their joystick.
Had these as a kid. Only used them for 1 game. Tennis.
I'm a lefty, but when it comes to gaming, I don't adapt to play a right-handed controller left-handed. I never really gave it another thought. I played Kaboom! with right hand on the wheel and thumb on the button. I also don't use a left-handed mouse.
But fast forward to Wii, I couldn't get into games that used the wiimote with analog stick. Mirror swapping the entirety of Twilight Princess to appeal to righties felt like a personal slight :P Using a controller right-handed I can do, but right-handed with motion control is too far for me. I'm glad standard controllers are still the norm, and motion is just a niche.
Thank you for using the metric system. Great content as always.
He used the metric system! Yay!
I remember having a paddle controller but it had two buttons.
I use a namco volume controller to play this sort of game. Getting it to work on the PC without a dead zone wasn't much fun, though...
When the calipers came out I squealed like a child.
I wonder if the button on the paddle controllers could be replaced with a Cherry MX Switch. It looks really similar.
Have you ever tried playing Arkanoid (Arcade, NES, SNES) or Puchi Carat (Arcade, Playstation 1) with a trackball or spinner? Feels AMAZING
Just got some Commodore VIC-20 paddle controllers on Sunday and boy do they suck! Makes me appreciate Atari's even more. Weird that Commodore later made nearly exact copies of the Atari paddles with the same shape but different color/logo. IIRC, they were sued for that and had to stop selling paddles.
I've never held this controller or at least not to my recollection, but I imagine I'd still hold this the way a right handed person would for this controller. After all the mouse was designed with right handed people in mind, but as a lefty I adapted to it all the same. I only knew of one left handed person who used the mouse in left-handed fashion and I found it absolutely bizarre. I think the misconception is because it's our dominant hand therefore we must use all tools with it. From a family of left dominant people, no one used left handed scissors. That said, I think my right hand could handle turning a knob in this instance. Just don't ask it to write or make art.
I once cleaned my paddle controllers to get rid of the jitter, but the top knob of one of the controllers won't stay put. Should I use some kind of crazy glue?
is it somewhat fractured? I saw some sellers on etsy sell replacement top knobs that might take care of the problem...might be worth looking into
I'm left handed, but I always use my controllers, interfaces, etc, like a right-handed person.
awsome design for a left handed, very comfortable. right hand under, middle finger to trig. a real left handed controller. at the opposite, the original joystick is very designed for right handed people, being left handed i hate it.
Awesome stuff dude!
Also #knob
I have a 2paddle controller.
The paddle-non-gemini variant. (PNG?)
Why don’t modern consoles include paddle controllers?
Wow! just the expert I was looking for. I am going to make a Tabletop arcade out of a homemade cabinet, 1/4 inch glass and an old 13 inch tv. The game will be WARLORDS for atari 2600 system for a head to head four person game. The TV is facing up. From your expertise, HOW CAN I KEEP THE TWO SETS OF PADDLES IN AND HAVE TWO JOYSTICKS PLUGGED IN AT THE SAME TIME? Some of the earliest atari 2600 systems have 4 Jack's in the back. Is this the solution? Or is splitting wires the answer and how please?
Hmm, as a rightie, I think I held it in my right hand and used my left hand to turn the paddle, but I can't be sure. Maybe I just wasn't very good at playing Atari, as I didn't own one.
They could have used the same wire protocol and made a 2-axis analog joystick with 2 buttons. I'm not sure why that wasn't done.
I come seeking a good controller for Kaboom / Warlords. It seems that manufacturers seem to cheap out on paddles on the flashbacks.
No connector pinout? Small detail missed.
I never had an Atari, but this is a rare instance of an early "good" controller. Almost all pre-SNES/Genesis controllers are garbage. Hold the NES controller as an adult, sharp edges and way too small. Also hooray metric system.
Ha! I actually put some "subtitles" in with conversion to inches/ounces in the measurements section, but I found them distracting. Nevertheless, I strayed a little bit when I used that 9/16" socket to take apart the controller.
I actually said to myself "Ah, I see he's using the good old 14.2875mm socket for this one" :P
Which paddle games use the button actively?
M.U.L.E. for the Atari 8-bit homecomputers. Though this (absolutely awesome) game doesn't actually make much use of the paddles' analog control scheme; the knob was only used to indicate either "up", "stay put" or "down" during an (often quite frantic) segment of the game where all players simultanously try to either buy or sell goods from and to each other in an auction (where the button can be used to collude with a willing co-player to the detriment of the other two. This is actually where I learned the term "collusion" from... Educational value of gaming: proven!). The paddles just served as a somewhat limited substitude / alternative in case you had more players than joysticks available.
Probably more relvant to your question:
Star Wars Jedi Arena for the 2600?
@@TVBirger Wow, thanks for the elaborate answer!
@@dbnpoldermans4120 Thanks for calling it "elaborate". I call it "Still haven't learned to keep it brief on Social Media" ;-)
@@TVBirger Hahaha, please always keep doing what you want instead of trying to fit in or comply to socially accepted rules.
@@dbnpoldermans4120 BTW, the short "Dishing Out" on my "channel" was inspired by a game controller....
some years later bmw stole that idea with the i- drive selector
And yet today, rotary dials are pretty much impossible to find on their own and expensive
So the takeaway here is, girls, find yourself a left handed gamer.
my firend got his dads old atari, were trying to find a ac adapter to play pong
I play left handed (although I'm technically ambidextrous). I use my right hand's middle finger to trigger the button.
How else do you think I use my fingerprint reader power button on my Sony Xperia 1 and now Moto Edge 2021?
My middle finger is my thumbprint in this anti-Lefty world. XD
Now I use a Hyperkin Ranger instead of Atari controllers. I can just press that button with my right thumb like normal.
I've just found my Dad's old Atari 2600 (6 switches on the front, not 4) and the paddles need a good clean. I've got a can of Servisol Super 10 which is a cleaner and lubricator. Do you think this would be ok to use? www.crcind.com/csp/web/ProdDisp.csp?lng=3&idx=6095486&country=GB&product=SOL%20SUPER%2010&brand=SERVISOL
Someone with a 3d printer could make a left handed paddle pretty easy. Sounds like eazy money.
Congratulations on using metric measurements 😀
Thats also how knobs on a guitar are
Hello, really fantastic work, congratulations.
I wanted to know, if possible, if you could sell me the Atari 2600 Paddles in USB version, so I can finally use them on my computer, on my Mac.
P.s. I live in Italy :)
Why is it called "paddle"?.
Because _Pong._