I like to think that Bushnell and Dabney like to occasionally watch videos like this. They sit back and grin as you battle through the maze of logic and engineering they created. I wonder if they're rooting for you or laughing at your mistakes.
Great Video john. Takes me back to the year after I left school , I went to college to study Electrical engineering , we etched printed circuit boards, did measurement and testing and fault diagnosis and a whole lot of other stuff. sadly college was n`t like school they never took the register and you could come and go as you pleased so we used bunk off go to the pub and play soccer . 30 years later i still regret not studying but hey life happens when you have other plans.
I can't help but smile when John states, OH we gotta coin it up I don't have a quarter, Warren's like I do! Hey that sounded funny?! John says YEAH there is a empty metal can in there! I've tried this at my arcade, I get Nope I don't have a quarter either where's your keys! lmao! makes me smile! good times!
A really great video John - Was really interesting seeing all the details of Computer Space - its quite incredible how they got much much functionality in the game with such simple circuity - I had always thought Computer Space was Vector Graphics . . .not so . . .anyway thanks for all videos . . .
When restoring old electronics, a majority of problems can sometimes be solved by just cleaning contacts. You can use a pencil eraser to clean card terminal contacts. Next is electrolytic capacitors. If they are older than 25 -30 years old, they can physically leak and/or their microfarad values will drift causing all kinds of problems. Then check solder connections, and for broken wires.
Thanks, John, for having me back on the show. That game is cool! CORRECTION to viewer mail discussion: Discharging of the CRT of the standalone TV was fine, but was *not* correct for the TV in the game. (The metal bracket attaching the monitor to the cabinet is not grounded.)
I'm glad I have 2 Mortal Kombat machines, that I actually bought back in the 90s, right out of the arcade.. I bought MKII back in 1996 for 1k and UMK3 back in 1997 for the same price.. The neck board on the Wells gardener went up in smoke back in 1999, and they have been sitting in storage ever since 2000.. The UMK3 is in a Williams converted Smash TV cabinet and the MKII is in the original cabinet..
You realize that since you sit next to Tapper when you do the viewer mail you can never sell it right? It's practically the soundtrack to the end of your show. :D
I thought the issue when you discharged it was that you said you had unplugged the power cable. If the power cable is unplugged, no matter where you connected your discharge tool on the cabinet, you weren't grounded.
John, the chip is Bad correct. Just cut the legs off the top by the chip and throw it out. Then you can get to either side to remove the soldered pins.
Might I suggest if you work on games in the basement to have the arcade turned off lol that way you dont bump start buttons and the volume of the games won't make it hard to hear the video
Wow this video was amazin! Seriously was fun to have a guest mechanic. I always learn something watching your vids keep up the good work. My ten second spot light is im drinking Sierra Nevada Torpedo and im working on this 4 Slot Neo Geo and i think the monitor is Fuct Any suggestions ?
Warren was awesome. I didn't know that logic analyzer could be set to trigger when all three lines go high. BTW, it's the OpenBench Logic Sniffer ( dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Open_Bench_Logic_Sniffer ).
I'm a huge video game player love the classics but I'm really into modern games like witcher3 combined on steam and consoles I have millions in cheevs and trophies but this type of stuff really tickles the nostalgia nerve found your channel by accident awhile back and now hundreds of hours later I wanna see this damn thing working lol I have no life lol the funny thing is to the and gates etc ive made in redstone in mindcraft to make simple logic contaptions like slots or door codes love this stuff if you wanna learn some basic chip stuff build it in minecraft itll give you a new way to look at logic etc making it youreself
while i'm not familiar with Computer Space while the unit was displaying the triple and double it looks like it is one image but split into triple, if you look back at this video when the display was changing between the double/triple both the ship and the ufo are being drawn in two/three parts e.g. if you overlay all thee images it would form one ship/ufo with no pixels overlapping. I'm guessing the chip that draws the graphics may be at fault here, but thats a guess. I hope I have made sense, looking forward to the next instalment.
Hello John, I have two threads on KLOV on repairing my Computer Space. One is dealing with power, and I see now where you've discovered there is 12vt AC coming out of the transformer for the lights and sound circuits. Took me awhile to figure that out since it's not really shown on the 1 player schematics. Also, I really think the reason you're seeing multiple rocket ships is due to either dirty edge connectors in the card cage or your TV horiz and vert adjustmests are all of whack. It took about 15 mins of working with mine to get the picture straightened out. Have a look at both of my threads. Glad to see you got the saucers working. forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=255066 forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=255994
Have to ask after two hours + of working on this what video game music or sound was getting on your nerves. I think Pole position and frogger would get to me.
I don't understand how one could discharge a monitor to the ground strapping. Isn't the whole thing isolated? Where does the ground come from? I noticed the power plug has no grounding lug. I just can't wrap my head around this one.
+Dylan Harrod +MrTBoneSF You don't need "mains" ground to discharge it; you just need the local common ground within the monitor chassis. It's the same as shorting the leads of an electrolytic capacitor to remove the stored charge.
you guys are working next to a working TV set with its covers removed. Not only that, you are moving conductive stuff like cables, solder, etc over the live high voltage circuits. Watching this reminds me these circus acts where people balance themselves 30-40 feet in the air without a safety net. The suspense is great, but it kinda detracts from the electronics discussion part.
Hey John question. Is it possible to have 2 wireless lapel mics going to your one source? I only mention it because we could barely hear Warren half of the time. It would be awesome in cases like this where there are 2 people interacting with the vid. It would also come in handy for on site interviews you do sometimes as well for your on the road videos. *edit* i just noticed that the mic itself isnt wireless, and that it attaches to the base. That would mean you would need a whole 2nd setup huh? damn :(
I'd say I wouldnt blame you for gettin a Mortal Kombat. Tho the problem is, is that if you get one, it has the weird 5 button layout that might be hard to use with other Jamma games. almost wanna say you could just put an MK board in your SFII cab tho the harness is different i think. also would not recommend MKII for you John haha. that game is ridiculously hard unless you know how to cheat the computer. not the best 1 player game.
I just want to say, DO NOT Discharge the monitor to the frame ground OR the Strap ground. This is NOT a good idea. What you SHOULD do is discharge the monitor to the Earth Ground, That means IF you have the machine UNPLUGGED you are not grounded at all. You should always ground to an active ground. I recommend grounding to an outlet in your house. The center screw of MOST outlets is a ground, This is a good place to ground to. Another way to do it is to get an extension cord, cut off the common and live wires from the PLUG, plug the ground(earth) to the outlet and run the generally green wire around your screwdriver. Getting Bit by 10K/35K volts is not fun. It hurts like hell. Plus there is a risk of dying which is a thing apparently.
+DJAlup Really? I always thought that the charge is between the inside and outside of the tube, so shorting the anode to the tube frame was sufficient. Do you have a reference for this somewhere? I want to make sure I have this right...
I have personal experience as a refrence. The manaul on these monitor chassis say to discharge to the aquadag, I can tell you right now that doing so will produce a spark which does indeed release a ton of energy from the tube. BUT, what does noy get lost in the spark is then re-introduced back to the tube. IF you leave a wire between the AquaDAG and the Anode long enough YES it will discharge it. But do you really want to take a chance? I will put it this way. On batteries (I know this is diffrent) when you short the positive and negative together what happens? does all the energy get released at once? NO. If you leave it long enough most batteries will go thermal and explode. NOW lets say you take that same battery and put a really high load on it, it will drain that battery straight FLAT. Take it from someone who has been actually bitten by tube that had been "Discharged". Sanyo 20EZ's are REALLY bad about this. You can discharge that damn tube like 20 times and it will still hold a freaking charge. I belive that the best way to do this is to always discharge to a ground(Earth) PLUS wear a ground strap around the hand that is removing the Anode cup. JUST IN CASE you did not get it fully discharged the charge wont pass through your body it will just pass through your hand and out the strap. Yes it will hurt like hell but it might just save your life.
+John's Arcade Game Reviews & Tech the video on youtube --- I even tried a bunch of other and it was just those 2 BUT I did find a simple fix which was I dropped the video to 480p and that cured it instantly -- I love the videos you do and have had a blast watching them and was a kid back in the 80s so I have fond memories of the many arcades I used to haunt.
Warren is a great guest for the show! Ask him back more :-)
Great episode. Very entertaining and educational.
Nice Job!! Great video! Have Warren back for more. The logic probe stuff is cool. do more like that. I learned a lot. Thank you john!!
I like to think that Bushnell and Dabney like to occasionally watch videos like this. They sit back and grin as you battle through the maze of logic and engineering they created. I wonder if they're rooting for you or laughing at your mistakes.
Hey John! As an amateur arcade restaurer I especially enjoy your dedication and passion, thanks for all the great videos!
+MrOreo76 thanks!
always a great privilege to watch a smart guy at work. and john is entertaining as usual. ;)
+theorgandude ha. Thanks? ;)
Glad you gave those edge connectors another cleaning. ;-) Great video. Good luck and I hope you get it working soon!
This channel is endlessly fascinating.
+ZaireXIII thanks! Enjoy the vids. :)
That was a good idea you had your buddy come over. He was a lot of help. Good vid.
I'm so enjoying this video series! John... love the channel!
+Ludic Interface thanks!!
Well that was really, really interesting. Thanks John!
Great Video john. Takes me back to the year after I left school , I went to college to study Electrical engineering , we etched printed circuit boards, did measurement and testing and fault diagnosis and a whole lot of other stuff. sadly college was n`t like school they never took the register and you could come and go as you pleased so we used bunk off go to the pub and play soccer . 30 years later i still regret not studying but hey life happens when you have other plans.
Fabulous! watching you fix this old hardware fills me with the same feeling i get when i revive an old computer, great show John
Nice work!
BRING IN THE LOGIC PROBE!
You had the boards out, clean the contacts too!!! tooth brush works good with cleaner or contact cleaner.
this is great! Thanks John!
I can't help but smile when John states, OH we gotta coin it up I don't have a quarter, Warren's like I do! Hey that sounded funny?! John says YEAH there is a empty metal can in there!
I've tried this at my arcade, I get Nope I don't have a quarter either where's your keys! lmao!
makes me smile! good times!
Oh god, college is now coming back to me with all these logic gates.
24:20 - "Now you're totally thrusting" lol
A really great video John - Was really interesting seeing all the details of Computer Space - its quite incredible how they got much much functionality in the game with such simple circuity - I had always thought Computer Space was Vector Graphics . . .not so . . .anyway thanks for all videos . . .
When restoring old electronics, a majority of problems can sometimes be solved by just cleaning contacts. You can use a pencil eraser to clean card terminal contacts. Next is electrolytic capacitors. If they are older than 25 -30 years old, they can physically leak and/or their microfarad values will drift causing all kinds of problems. Then check solder connections, and for broken wires.
Do you need a boom mic operator for when you have guests John? Lol. Great vids as always. Looking forward to seeing a restored Computer Space soon....
Excellent stuff John, Warren is a great special guest star...
0:58 Man, that table got real wobbly
+420NMD Maybe 12 episode series to bolt that table into the floor and welding it to the ceiling with 12 iron bars.
1:20 OMG this far in and he FINALLY pulls out a can of Deoxit!
hahaha
Dr. Evil just called, he wants his laughter back 😁
Thanks, John, for having me back on the show. That game is cool!
CORRECTION to viewer mail discussion: Discharging of the CRT of the standalone TV was fine, but was *not* correct for the TV in the game. (The metal bracket attaching the monitor to the cabinet is not grounded.)
I'm glad I have 2 Mortal Kombat machines, that I actually bought back in the 90s, right out of the arcade.. I bought MKII back in 1996 for 1k and UMK3 back in 1997 for the same price.. The neck board on the Wells gardener went up in smoke back in 1999, and they have been sitting in storage ever since 2000.. The UMK3 is in a Williams converted Smash TV cabinet and the MKII is in the original cabinet..
Hell yeah next sound can't wait
we would love to get in touch with Warren to talk about the Highscore Kits for laserdisc games. :)
Wow...Computer Space sure sounds alot like Frogger. ;)
John you are the Man !! ( voçê é o cara )
You seriously need some cans of CAIG Deoxit man!
23,000 subs John!! nice work bro
Thanks Bobby!
+Bobby Jack your profile pic looks like your looking at the most amazing arcade game ever
+drifter848 haha I can't remember what I was doing when they took that, looking for my keys I think
lol to funny I thought maybe you were playing a game
+drifter848 it's was dark times drifter lol
I'd almost offer Warren a holiday to Spain to fix some of my boards :D
YAY new video! I need to wait for 1080p :(. Keep up the good work! :)
I'd clean all of the switches. Instant rotation like that could be multiple connections every time you press it.
You realize that since you sit next to Tapper when you do the viewer mail you can never sell it right? It's practically the soundtrack to the end of your show. :D
This is just awesome. I'm a dabbler in making audio gear, and I just love hearing you explain how the electronics works. What a cool project!
Computer Space was in the movie ''Soylent Green from1973''
+Joseph Atnip Yeah, placed in the rich peoples party block LOL
I thought the issue when you discharged it was that you said you had unplugged the power cable. If the power cable is unplugged, no matter where you connected your discharge tool on the cabinet, you weren't grounded.
john...have you tested the speaker yet??....man can't wait to see this thing 100%!!!!
+charlie brown we measured it only. Who knows... It could be bad. Not sure.
Much of that I was lost in all the Chinese but still, you gotta get that history piece going.
aah canibalising a nice S100 bus CPU board...
+Stuart George (Bloody Cactus)
I wondered if it was for S100... Are there people that need these things?
there is still a large following for S100 / SBUS computers and bits. Its a revision of the compupro z80 cpu board.
Adam is going to be mad, he has a whole video explaining logic gates lol
Adam is the logic master
John, the chip is Bad correct. Just cut the legs off the top by the chip and throw it out. Then you can get to either side to remove the soldered pins.
Posted comment before watching all of the video. You suggested this a couple minutes after I made my post.
Might I suggest if you work on games in the basement to have the arcade turned off lol that way you dont bump start buttons and the volume of the games won't make it hard to hear the video
29097 coins accepted going by the counter. That comes out to $7,274.00! Not bad for 1971 when the average auto was $3500, ha!
Getting batter at 720? I have the Game Boy Color version and it's surprisingly not bad!
*"HEEEEEYYYYY GUUUYYYYYSSS WE ARE IN THE BASEMENT AND TODAYYY YESSS TODDAAAYYY!!!!!!...."* haha lol
Not sure why people are bitching about Frogger. That Pole Position sound is killing me!!!
Well there was the spark in Pt2, that was the power on/off volume , might have fried that pot
+benmmaddog oh, that's interesting!
Wow this video was amazin! Seriously was fun to have a guest mechanic. I always learn something watching your vids keep up the good work. My ten second spot light is im drinking Sierra Nevada Torpedo and im working on this 4 Slot Neo Geo and i think the monitor is Fuct Any suggestions ?
+Luap Co cap kit. :)
did I just notice something weird with the score at 1.25.26 did the score for the alien go from 7 to 6
Man this is super cool and I can't wait to see and hear it all working! I may have to get one of those logic analyser boards, that's amazing.
Warren was awesome. I didn't know that logic analyzer could be set to trigger when all three lines go high. BTW, it's the OpenBench Logic Sniffer ( dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Open_Bench_Logic_Sniffer ).
You can clearly see at 36:27 B C D E below the key edge of the chips.
I'm a huge video game player love the classics but I'm really into modern games like witcher3 combined on steam and consoles I have millions in cheevs and trophies but this type of stuff really tickles the nostalgia nerve found your channel by accident awhile back and now hundreds of hours later I wanna see this damn thing working lol I have no life lol the funny thing is to the and gates etc ive made in redstone in mindcraft to make simple logic contaptions like slots or door codes love this stuff if you wanna learn some basic chip stuff build it in minecraft itll give you a new way to look at logic etc making it youreself
+drifter848 that's funny. I was going to mention Minecraft when we were talking about the logic gates.
+drifter848 that's funny. I was going to mention Minecraft when we were talking about the logic gates.
I'm sure your helper would've been interested in redstone etc
John you should have let Warren fix it completely..
Good vid and next time shut off the machine u keep bumping into.
while i'm not familiar with Computer Space while the unit was displaying the triple and double it looks like it is one image but split into triple, if you look back at this video when the display was changing between the double/triple both the ship and the ufo are being drawn in two/three parts e.g. if you overlay all thee images it would form one ship/ufo with no pixels overlapping.
I'm guessing the chip that draws the graphics may be at fault here, but thats a guess.
I hope I have made sense, looking forward to the next instalment.
Does Warren make house calls?? :)
TURN OFF THE DAMN FROGGER!! LOL
Jeenkz K I kinda like it.
i hope u compensated that man, cause ur just watchn that man do what he should be instructing u to do bro.
+john phillips think so, John? I got my hands dirty. :)
I saw....i saw. I stand corrected.
Great stuff John, The TV you got off Ebay was a good working tv. Can you not just change out the board and mod the tuner like they did? Thanks, Mike
I could. But it seems like this one is running ok now. Might just need a little tweaking.
Oh, I thought the sound was out on the tv. Cool , keep the videos coming.
taking a shot of rhum every time one of you bump into Frogger???? tell us the truth hehehe...
John !! Next time your working on Computer Space, TURN THE BLOODY FROGGER OFF !! LOL
there actully are 2 saucers by defult!
+gumball7839 Yep. This is true!
Hello John, I have two threads on KLOV on repairing my Computer Space. One is dealing with power, and I see now where you've discovered there is 12vt AC coming out of the transformer for the lights and sound circuits. Took me awhile to figure that out since it's not really shown on the 1 player schematics. Also, I really think the reason you're seeing multiple rocket ships is due to either dirty edge connectors in the card cage or your TV horiz and vert adjustmests are all of whack. It took about 15 mins of working with mine to get the picture straightened out. Have a look at both of my threads. Glad to see you got the saucers working.
forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=255066
forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=255994
Have to ask after two hours + of working on this what video game music or sound was getting on your nerves. I think Pole position and frogger would get to me.
No update on Franz?
John, have you ever owned an original Pong or want to own one? just asking because I think that would make a great video as well.
Yes, I want one. Been looking.
Are you ever going to get a Galaga arcade cabinet?
+Freckleslam I would like to get a galaga Cabaret. Some day!
I don't understand how one could discharge a monitor to the ground strapping. Isn't the whole thing isolated? Where does the ground come from? I noticed the power plug has no grounding lug. I just can't wrap my head around this one.
+Dylan Harrod +MrTBoneSF
You don't need "mains" ground to discharge it; you just need the local common ground within the monitor chassis. It's the same as shorting the leads of an electrolytic capacitor to remove the stored charge.
+wondras Perfect, that completely cleared it up for me! Thanks for the analogy.
Hi john I was wondering when are you going to do Donkey Kong JR quest to get 100,000 points attempt 4?
+Freckleslam I want to do this again and soon.
you guys are working next to a working TV set with its covers removed. Not only that, you are moving conductive stuff like cables, solder, etc over the live high voltage circuits. Watching this reminds me these circus acts where people balance themselves 30-40 feet in the air without a safety net. The suspense is great, but it kinda detracts from the electronics discussion part.
warren was cool but maybe get Adam in to help
Hey John question. Is it possible to have 2 wireless lapel mics going to your one source? I only mention it because we could barely hear Warren half of the time. It would be awesome in cases like this where there are 2 people interacting with the vid. It would also come in handy for on site interviews you do sometimes as well for your on the road videos.
*edit* i just noticed that the mic itself isnt wireless, and that it attaches to the base. That would mean you would need a whole 2nd setup huh? damn :(
+onji yes. I am looking into a second transmitter. I agree.
I'd say I wouldnt blame you for gettin a Mortal Kombat. Tho the problem is, is that if you get one, it has the weird 5 button layout that might be hard to use with other Jamma games. almost wanna say you could just put an MK board in your SFII cab tho the harness is different i think. also would not recommend MKII for you John haha. that game is ridiculously hard unless you know how to cheat the computer. not the best 1 player game.
I just want to say, DO NOT Discharge the monitor to the frame ground OR the Strap ground. This is NOT a good idea. What you SHOULD do is discharge the monitor to the Earth Ground, That means IF you have the machine UNPLUGGED you are not grounded at all. You should always ground to an active ground. I recommend grounding to an outlet in your house. The center screw of MOST outlets is a ground, This is a good place to ground to. Another way to do it is to get an extension cord, cut off the common and live wires from the PLUG, plug the ground(earth) to the outlet and run the generally green wire around your screwdriver.
Getting Bit by 10K/35K volts is not fun. It hurts like hell. Plus there is a risk of dying which is a thing apparently.
+DJAlup Really? I always thought that the charge is between the inside and outside of the tube, so shorting the anode to the tube frame was sufficient. Do you have a reference for this somewhere? I want to make sure I have this right...
I have personal experience as a refrence. The manaul on these monitor chassis say to discharge to the aquadag, I can tell you right now that doing so will produce a spark which does indeed release a ton of energy from the tube. BUT, what does noy get lost in the spark is then re-introduced back to the tube. IF you leave a wire between the AquaDAG and the Anode long enough YES it will discharge it. But do you really want to take a chance?
I will put it this way. On batteries (I know this is diffrent) when you short the positive and negative together what happens? does all the energy get released at once? NO. If you leave it long enough most batteries will go thermal and explode.
NOW lets say you take that same battery and put a really high load on it, it will drain that battery straight FLAT.
Take it from someone who has been actually bitten by tube that had been "Discharged". Sanyo 20EZ's are REALLY bad about this. You can discharge that damn tube like 20 times and it will still hold a freaking charge.
I belive that the best way to do this is to always discharge to a ground(Earth) PLUS wear a ground strap around the hand that is removing the Anode cup. JUST IN CASE you did not get it fully discharged the charge wont pass through your body it will just pass through your hand and out the strap. Yes it will hurt like hell but it might just save your life.
That laugh... Mwahahaha
wobble wobble
Getting rid of street fighter for mortal kombat! How dare you!
+Bob Marley Yes, make room for both if anything.
7
why was the picture breaking up so much?? --- was not happening on your other videos but part #3 and this one have been just awful!!!
+lockingfine what do you mean? The video quality of my video? Or the Computer Space TV?
+John's Arcade Game Reviews & Tech the video on youtube --- I even tried a bunch of other and it was just those 2 BUT I did find a simple fix which was I dropped the video to 480p and that cured it instantly -- I love the videos you do and have had a blast watching them and was a kid back in the 80s so I have fond memories of the many arcades I used to haunt.
+lockingfine that's weird. must have been a RUclips hiccup?
FIRST!
Yelling guy wants to learn electronic repair, with a shorting thumb ring and loads of snagging crap on both wrist...