Why Your LOUD Mixes Sound So Terrible (and how to fix them!)
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- Опубликовано: 18 янв 2023
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If you're anything like I was, you're probably obsessed with dialing in loud mixes.
Man, this was a tough one for me and I've been finding out that it's tough for a lot of other people as well.
The issue is that so many us go about making our mixes loud the wrong way:
The amateurish way. (i.e., Cramming a half-baked mix through a single limiter that causes the entire thing to sound like a blown out mess of razorblades and digital distortion).
The good news is that the professional way of making your mix loud really isn't that complicated.
It just takes a little bit of subtlety and attention to a few specific details.
In this video, I reveal my simple 4-step process for producing screaming loud mixes that still sound crisp and clean.
If you have any interest in having your mixes compete with pro mixes level-wise, I highly recommend learning these 4 simple steps.
Featured artist: Erciyes Fragment (erciyesfragmentnj.bandcamp.com/)
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Dude, one little suggestion: balance the volume levels of the DAW and the mic. Thx for the tips.
This is an awesome video! I was slamming everything through a limiter and took me quite awhile to figure out why my mixes sounded awful. Thanks again!
You are a BLESSING my man! This video really helped. I pretty much do the same with stock reaper plugins, but haven't used tape! Been watching your videos on how to get better at mixing for a while, and you have been so helpful. Grateful for you and your content brotha! 🤘
I used to SLAM the master bus limiter lol.
Recently, I am using 3 (free) plug-ins on my master bus.
1). SSL-style bus compressor, for 2-3dB of compression. (AO Buster)
2). Neve-style channel strip for some minimal EQing, 1-2dB of comp, 1-2dB of limiting, and 1-2dB of tape saturation (AO Channev)
3). Generic master bus limiter that just keeps everything from clipping.
I am not a pro but I have mixed a couple dozen records and learning how to not slam the master limiter was a huge step forward for me!
You're a smart man!
My first plugins in the master chain are always a Pro-Q3 to Low pass and High pass if needed and two Pro-C2 compressor. The first with instant attack and fast Time-Synced release with a value in milliseconds matched to the 16th of the current tempo (to catch the biggest transients/peaks, and the second comp, with a Time synced attack with a value in milliseconds matched to the 16th of the relative tempo, to preserve the transients of the drums, and a slower release, matched to the 8th of the current tempo, to preserve "the groove" (for me, setting attack and release values according with the tempo is fundamental, it really improve the quality of the song/track). After these 3 plugins i go by taste and needs with eq, saturator, tape emulator, harmonic exciter, widener or whatever, then 3 limiters, usually one with a certain color aiming to max 2 db of gain reduction, and the last two Pro-2L usually mirroring the behavior and the use of the 2 first compressor in some way, taking 2db of gain reduction each. (Sorry if my english is not so good i'm not native speaker)
Dude. This is one of the most helpful tuts on metal loudness!
Hi Bobby, really glad you put out that video cause that's a topic I REALLY struggle with. After watching this video it helped me quite a few but here's what I'm still unsure about:
1- How do you know you've got enough loudness? You compare to similar mix I suppose?
2- How do you feel about using LUFS values to evaluate the loudness? Do you prefer to go only by ear/feeling?
Thanks a lot for sharing all this !
Kick ass video , I’m super guilty of trying to cut corners with 1 tool instead of using your method ! Even though I know my way around tools now it’s always great to see other peoples techniques!
Nice video and thanks for showing us your process for the master bus! I would also recommend extending this concept to the other buses and even individual channels. More specifically, using compression and saturation in subtle amounts earlier in the chain can go a long way to keeping the overall mix dynamics under control prior to the mix bus and allow you even more perceived loudness without clipping at the end. As an added bonus, the individual channels also tend to gain some width and clarity. When you do this, however, there can easily be some buildup in the highs as the compression brings those "masked" harmonics into the audible range. Adjust as needed.
My mastering engineer would kill me if I'd send something like this to him. If you're mastering your own mixes then this is a pretty good advice.
Why do you say that?
Cool video. I do a similar chain to yours , just in a little bit different order. Tape Saturation , EQ , Comp , Multband Comp , Limiter. Sometimes I have to dip out about a db or two of 250-300hz depending on the song. But sometimes I don't. I don't see how people can think they can use just a single plug-in on the master buss and think it will sound good. But maybe some people can. IDK , I'm no pro. Thanks for the video.
Dude, this is great! I'm definitely guilty of the one limiter on master bus approach in the past. I've used the Ozone mastering plugin for years which has a few plugins built into it, but only one limiter so nonetheless I'm still guilty of it. I have gotten better at focusing on breaking out my compression on the mix buses into multiple smaller steps, and it has helped my mixes but I've never done it on the master bus. Well until recently I've backed off the Ozone limiter a touch and added the BSA Clipper to just add a little more punch and sizzle. I think that's given it a small boost, but I've noticed on cleaner/quieter sections the BSA has added some subtle but noticeable distortion. So I will have to try this tactic to get a little more oomph out of the final product!
Interesting way of doing it. I have compression, saturation, EQ moves etc on my 2 bus but I still print my mixes with a good amount of headroom (just have my monitors louder!). It allows me the headspace to think of the mastering as a separate act where I'm just working with/on the stereo wav. Then it's just the final polish and the loudness to factor in, without the temptation of it all being a part of the mix that could go on forever.
Good video I used to have a similar mastering chain I had just kinda figured out through trial and error but lately I’ve just been using JST Maximizer which lumps a lot of quality of life features together and never had cleaner/louder mixes than I’m getting now
Awesome bit of knowledge mate. Thinking I’m doing all right after watching your tutorial.
My chain:
BX Townhouse Compressor
Softube Tape
FF Pro Q3
FF Pro MB
Gullfoss
Flatline
Weiss MM-1
FF Pro L2
Great sounding mix dude!
Man this vintage warmer is really great, I use Slate and some Ik Multimedia, from time to time I like to use Waves Tape too, but this plugin is really awesome!
Another gem tutorial from Bobby. Thank you sir!!
I incorporate acoustics a lot of times into my songs so I do the ssl compression and ozone but saturate tracks in the mix selectively to keep things clear for acoustics, also have a "pre-master" parent track (in reaper) set to -7db that the rest of my tracks are children to and put the ssl compressor on that pre-master track leaving my master to just run ozone (eq, dynamic eq, maximizer)
That song is KILLER! I never would have found that band if it wasn't for your video, so thanks!
Key takeaway for me here is to have a fairly quiet mix and then raise it all up together with a limiter but without the limiter having to significantly reduce the gain. All the subtle compressor and saturation stuff just adds some glue, vibe and thickness.
Just one question: why the make-up gain on your bus compressor is cranked up to +15db? I use the Glue that emulates the same hardware compressor and I can see that your compressor is also set in analog mode: if it works as the Glue it should add a lot of dinamic distortion (assuming that your imput level is at least -12db).
Could you explain me why?
Thanks for your amazing video :)
I use a very similar mastering chain actually. Kind of shocked me how similar since I've been cherrypicking ideas from different videos!
I've been using the black salt audio clipper as well and getting great results. Was planning on sending in a mix soon for you to check out!
Dude, the Black Salt Audio Clipper is phenomenal! One of my favorite plugins.
Great video!! I have a quick question 🙋🏾♂️. So when it comes to your stems, I see you are looowww, like -32 .. would u say it’s key to keep those level low on the mix fadders, but loud enough to hit 0 on the master? Thanks again!
Definitely trying that when i get home! I use Plugin Alliance Masterdesk, i love that thing man… but i’ll try something before that in the chain, before my tape emulator 😉 thanks for the tip!
I'm learning as I go here but since I'm really new to this, why isn't any limiter or plugin for that matter better than another? So like a stock compressor to the waves compressor in this video, or a stock limiter to just an ozone limiter. I mean aside from the images I just wouldn't know where to begin because I'm taking mixes out to my car to hear what I think might be going on and it seems like it's getting better. I just purchased the two waves plugins I seen in this video that are in most youtube tutorials including all of yours. Am I going to have to get the ozone 10 as well. Will this really help with all of my frequency and volume issues. Is it really the stock plugins that are just not doing the job? I mean sorry for the 500 questions but I'm really just learning here
Saying that the gear has "next to nothing" to do with a sound is a huge overstatement, but having a grasp of the concepts simply cannot be stated strongly ENOUGH!
Wow I will definitely re-watch this video the next time I have to master a track of mine 😅
So far I always used a complicated chain of Plugins without knowing what I actually do. These days I just use Ozone 10 and nothing else
Awesome video. I'm curious to know, was your make up gain really all the way up on the SSL bus compressor? Lol making sure I saw that correctly. I def gotta check that out.
It was due to the gain-staging of this particular mix.
Could you just recreate your master chain in one instance of Ozone by addind all required elements? Eq, compressor, saturation, eq, compressor, limiter?
I often have trouble with mine. I have difficulty keeping the mix at a suggested -16 on tracks (I tend to exceed). After EQ I use an SSL style compressor only at 1-1.5 db but I makeup gain a db along the way to get closer (is that proper?). My multipressor is next with also a slight makeup gain. Sometimes a second compressor for peaks. Then slight saturation and finally limiter maybe 3db. My end result is about -10 or 11 or so. I can’t seem to tame the mix to sound blended.
Why not use fabfilter and native SSL plugins??? They are superior compared to others but ozone is very very good as well.
Hi Bobby, can you explain why your makeup gain is pinned and your only compressing 2-4 db. Thank you
I am on my first attempt at mixing and recording my own band with pro-tools. From watching this video and you other mixing/mastering video I am a bit confused on somethings. First going into your master bus I notice your meters are not jumping around as much as mine. By the time your in you 2nd plug in you meter is very steady (a separate issue that i will fix next time i do this as your videos have been a big help). My real question is, if you re-import that mix with the master bus as a separate mastering track, would you bypass the Ozone on the master buss, then apply it on that single stereo master track as i saw you do in an older video? You used the L1 on the master bus and the ozone 7 maximizer on the mastering track to give you a time reference) or on both tracks?
Excellent question, will answer it in my next VQA vid. Stay tuned!
it's funny because I was looking at my master buss the other day and was questioning my plugin placement choices and the amount... 2 EQs, 2 Compressors and 2 limiters and one clipper. I feel better now 😂
But back in the day, they didn’t have three limiters or two SSL bus compressors so if they emulate those things, why do you have to put so many limiter’s in compressors another limiter on top of another limiter that’s what kind of confuses me
You sound exactly like Steve Carell. I closed my eyes and it sounded as if I was listening to Michael Scott explain mixing and mastering. Good stuff👍
He uses A.I to make his voice sound like Steve Carell
there is a cleaner way to maximise your loudness. Instead of leaving the compressors as the very last element in the chain try adding a clipper to the last insert of each track and clipping the peaks down. That way the peaks are clipped down prior to being bussed out. Think about cascading clippers from the tracks to the busses and then out to the 2bus. Have a look for Baphometrix Clip to Zero strategy.
I've been using STL Tonehub with the Colin Richardson presets for 7 string, B tuned stuff. Heaviest...shit...ever!
Why was the output gain on your ssl compressor turned up to 11 *checks notes* I mean 15ish? I have been using a similar plug in but have only been setting the output gain to be equal to what is being compressed. Am I missing a loudness trick here?
It's just the way that this particular mix was gain-staged...luckily has nothing to do with loudness outside of turning the quiet track up.
have you ever tried Submission Audio Flatline for mastering? I see a lot of people say they like it
@@deepfriedscream7544 yea pretty much all the metal producers for bands i like are using it now. Same with the double tap compressor they made, people seem to love how it works. I want to get both soon.
Made a default starting chain for my master buss a while back that has pretty much everything you said with reaper stock plugins doing a little here, a little there, and it’s worked fantastic for me. Pretty sure I set it up after seeing some of your old vids about a similar subject!
You been taking me to school for a couple years, man!!
My free master bus: TDR Nova, OTT with 50% mix, Mojo (saturation), Loudmaxx, Youlean Loudness Meter
Fuck man, even the original mix by itself is so fkn good
I notice your makeup gain is all the way up on your ssl buss compressor does that effect the sound of the mix in anyway ?
Nope, it was just the way this particular mix happened to be gain-staged.
PS: C4 has more "explosion" 😂😂👌👌✌✌🤘🤘
😂
I chuckled :)
I use izotope alloy lol. They don’t even make it anymore but it’s a legit gift from the gods lol
I always try to get a louder mix by using Fabfilter Pro-L2 on my master track. I get the LUFS level where it should be (-14dB), the RMS level, and I put the true peak at -0.1. It doesn't clip, and I'm not slamming it. My mixes still sound quieter than the popular songs I play on RUclips. I'm going to try this & see if I can get my mixes up to the correct perceived loudness. It's been frustrating, because I didn't know what else to do. I thought what I was doing with the limiter was correct.
try mastering to -8 LUFS then
-14 lufs should really just be thought about as a minimum requirement. Most professional masters are much louder. Try not to look at the lufs meter and just push your track until it sounds like it’s got the right amount of glue. Use a reference to make sure you’re in the right track.
You could just mix it at a regular volume then compress a little eq then throw jst maximizer ! Best plugin of 2022 hands down !!!
This song sounds so fucking good. Mega pro mix.
Thanks man
My pleasure!
On ssl buss u'r having +15 make up gain ?
The thing that caught my attention was the -0.01 ceiling and also what lufs were you at?
looked like he was at -14 lufs.
I don't pay attention to lufs..just the perceived volume.
@@FrightboxRecording what's about your ceiling settings?
Great video. So what’s the goal…14 LUFS is the standard for all online streaming, Spotify Amazon music…what volume are you guys striving for? Thanks
@@nestatuffgong my last mix was -7 lufs
For me personally, if I want a loud mix, I mix it to be loud. So at track and bus level. Ideally it should even go down to sound selection and arrangement.
Completely agree!
Those things do help, but getting a quality recording comes down to every from the start like replacing bass strings ect at the very very beginning. We all know the saying "you can't polish a turd".
Do you mix songs for free at all?
Definitely not.
@@FrightboxRecording I thought so 😂
but how loud was it? - LUFS? RMS?
"And how to fix them.....just send them to me" lolol
Wow, 150$ for the psp vintage warmer
well, yes, you really have to know what you're doing, but, for example, an outboard setup will always sound better than lots of plugins, that mess up all your sound quality because of poor floating point precision... Theoretically, even touching a fader in the DAW messes up your sound quality... So, I guess, gear HAS some benefit (of course, only IF you really know what you're doing, as you said)
That's a myth. Watch this video in full: ruclips.net/video/BYTlN6wjcvQ/видео.html
@@FrightboxRecording That was a VERY interesting video, totally enjoyed it. Many thanks!! However, I was able to test the "mixing in the box" vs mixing outboard on an analog console (a Soundtracs Quarts), and the results were very different and also tested Lexicon native reverb plugin vs actual PCM96, There was huge difference in depth and stereo image in the outboard mix. Pan knobs were actually doing something significant on the mixer, rather than in Cubase. I also had a shock when comparing (96k to 192k), the cymbals were much more alive. And it was a blind test, but the difference was huge, anyone could hear it. Was it the interface (Motu192 i think it was), or I don't know?.. I wasn't expecting such a difference. And later on, when I got my Lynx Aurora converter, also tried 192k and yes, the drums sounded much better, more natural. Also the same with acoustic guitar and vocals. Not that much of a difference on distorted guitars and bass (i couldn't distinguish it). Also, real outboard stuff sounds to me much more natural than their simulations. Even cheap, DIY kit (hairball audio) 1076s sound better than any plugins I've ever encountered (including CLA waves pack). I built myself a Gssl compressor using Gyraf's schematic. Again, it's a totally different story than the Waves SSL plugin. I mean, yes, the plugins sound that way, but they don't have that "HiFi" natural sound, they make the sound "cardboardy", at least to my ears. And I find that difference quite big, not subtle to be subject of "placebo".. I know exactly what you are saying (and the guys in the video), but in this case there IS an actual difference. You should try it for yourself sometime, and possible also make a video about it (all channels on zero, in the box vs outboard console).
Why purposely try to reduce dynamic range by that much in order to make your mixes "loud" when virtually every band's music is released to Spotify, Apple Music, RUclips, etc., who reduce the loudness anyway? I thought the loudness war was pretty much over due to this, and the way to get your music "loud" on those music streaming services is to have a dynamic mix instead of a brick wall where every instrument is competing for the attention of your ears at the same time. Is there a dynamic range you aim for?
I think you have a missunderstanding of the word "loud" and "dynamic range", by compressing you add density which is needed for competing at low volumes
I agree with you 100%, but unfortunately, the reality is that most artists are still obsessed with their masters being loud.
@@FrightboxRecording Yeah, I used to be in the same boat. But then one day I made 2 mixes: one was -5 LUFS with DR6, and another around -9 LUFS and DR10. Then I would put both versions in Audacity, normalize the perceived loudness between both mixes, and the mix with more dynamics sounded "louder" when I A/B'd them. After that, I started prioritizing dynamics a bit more 👍
All that being said, I'm still a noob, and I very much appreciate your vids. Keep up the good work!
@dfasht You don't get your loudness reduced when you upload to spotify, you get your volume lowered which is different and that's why you need density.
I’m guilty of just about every audio sin you can do 😅
Same here!
Your mix sound kinda overloaded in the mids, but sounds like the orchestra (their tracks) isn't EQ'es properly.
That's how the band wanted it for this track. If they're happy, I'm happy.
@@FrightboxRecording Cool man.
Been there homie. It’s always a little painful when a band pushes for something that you know isn’t ideal on a technical level but I just try to remember that art is subjective and it’s my job to bring their vision to life
New intro is tits 🤘🏼
Smart limit is a real mix killer but having watched this I think I’m doing it very wrong
Honestly the mix sounds like shit on my phone
Thanks for taking the time to show us your process, but MY DUDE: enough preamble! Just get to the point. You don't get into the meat of the matter until 3 minutes in. Less talk more rock. Just some constructive feedback. Rock on!
GUILTY. AS. CHARGED! 😂 Many, many thanks for your continued excellent tutorials and to-the-point approach!
My pleasure, Justin..thanks for watching!
he sound like chael sonnen