Being an Anorexic myself I can understand the pain she would have been going through. She developed Anorexia and ultimately she passed from complications due to her eating disorder. Cardiac arrest I think. Eating disorders are the devil. It’s a constant battle in your head. One side knowing the disorder is irrational yet the other side is the total opposite.
So true. The critics were so very often WAY off the mark. I've read some of the critics who wrote around the time Linda Ronstadt was hitting it big that there were no good women country music singers until Linda. Not knocking Linda (love her!) but they were out to lunch. There were plenty of talented singers around country and every other genre of music at the time. Critics are often a bunch of a-holes who think their opinions count for something. Yeah--something to line your bird cage with and not much else...
Karen did indeed come to love being out front. She was an amazing live singer with a fantastic stage personality. To the last she asked Richard for new songs to sing and more audiences to sing to! People truly loved and adored Karen! She was magical!
@Papa B Karen loved interacting with her audience, watch her tv specials, she smiles like she used to when she was behind her drum kit! Karen was also looking forward to going back on tour just before her passing. Karen truly blossomed through the years.
Karen and I corresponded with each other when I was in Vietnam in 70/71 with the 1st Marine Div, I've always been in love with her. I have 30 letters that will be cremated with me, my wife of 35 years knows about them but I have never shared them with anyone. I was gravely wounded with shrapnel and she was the reason I survived.
Mike, Perhaps you might share them with Richard before taking them with you? I cannot imagine anyone that misses her with more regret that he does. Just a thought.
@@ehdeesign that would invade the privacy of both writers. They're nothing to do with Richard. And if you watched the full documentary Goodbye to Love ( which these clips are from) , Richard & her mother sabotaged her attempt to have a solo career, by persuading her not to put out the solo album she paid for herself , when he went to rehab. The last line of the documentary is: "Karen's career, like her Mother's love, belonged to Richard".
Really amazing that you have those letters to look upon it’s sort of like finding a meteorite from another planet that you can break out every now and then and it’s yours and hers only…she saved you
The insecurities had to already be there and the critics talking just validated how she likely already felt. And people forget how young she was during the peak years. The greatest successes were when she was between 19 and 25. Still a kid. She hadn't even figured out who she was when fame hit. And fame does indeed kill.
You're definitely a friend of Karen Carpenter now, she got to you. She could have used a friend like you back in the day. I know it;s all hindsight, but this is one of the most important reactions you have ever made. For real, esp today, some snarky critics need to STFU. they really have nothing of value to say but hurtful things from behind a coward's computer monitor. From a really old white guy lol
I just finished part 1 and I love that you're doing this! I have been a Carpenters fan since I was 9. My mom played their "Top of the World" 8 track in the car to and from school. I was DEVASTATED when she passed just before my 21rst birthday. It's so great to see your generation enjoying what I've known for DECADES! Keep up the good work! BTW, one of their songs I've always loved and haven't seen any reactions to: "Bless the Beasts and the Children" That would be great to see!
An angel who touched the hearts of many people and forever will be irreplaceable. Miss you so much rest in peace Karen carpenter. You left this world too soon but your lovely velvety contralto voice never will. Rest in peace angel
Quite possibly the most talented musical duo of all time! Supplied us with some incredibly wonderful and timeless music that I still enjoy tremendously today. Just hearing Karens voice can bring a tear to my eye.
This comment is like 1 year past its time but...gonna try! I listened to those who made comment on your broadcast and she " a woman" made comments on Karen singing and the depth of it. She made a statement that Karen may have been suffering Anorexia but how Karen sang with such emotion...It was much deeper than that. She Nailed it On The Head! Emotional Trauma can go back a long way in someones life. But whatever the case, Karen Carperter sang deep into our souls. And probably deeper because of what she may have endured. Behind close doors.....No ones knows what goes behind closed doors....Yeah, a song on that topic also. I really did appreciate your view on what was and what of might of been going on in their life. You had 30 minutes...... i reallly think you covered it very very well!
Companies will sign talent because they see possibilities. Then they start thinking about how to advertise and present. But, yes, you are right. The music should sell itself. The problem is that record companies are not as concerned with the popularity of the songs as much as the personalities of the talent. They are all about sales and they could care less about art. I will say that A & M was one of the best. I did many sessions for A&M and really enjoyed it. I also worked on the Carpenters 1978 Christmas special . Record companies are notorious for making weird choices. Fortunately Herb Alert is a fantastic musician himself with many hits behind his name. He gets it.
Thanks for your feedback, I would say record companies don't focus on those things now as they did in the past. A lot of artists get signed off of a popular song they release from their home studio while you have some artists getting signed today because they have 1 million Instagram followers it's ridiculous, but yea I guess the priorities were different back then.
I love your reaction to this tragedy and the loss of this beautiful and talented artist. I can see you have a good heart and I can see the love you have for Karen. Subscribed! ❤
You are spot on with the observation about forcing your art. I'm a visual artist, and when internally moved, I can produce excellent work. Suddenly, when it becomes a commissioned work, it's a job, and it just does not flow out. The muses can't be called on demand. I wanted to be a commercial artist, but it would never have worked. Inspiration only flows when you're free and enjoying what you're doing.
As a 13 year old boy in the early 70's it just wasn't cool to admit that you liked the Carpenters. It was like you were admitting that you weren't masculine. But the combination of Richard's arrangements and Karen's hypnotic voice couldn't be ignored. I've seen this documentary before, but your commentary is spot on. The industry just didn't know how to market or promote them. Fortunately for all of us their talent couldn't be denied or ignored. To this day listening to Karen is like sitting by a warm fire on a cold winter day.
Well, Richard was constantly trying to think of the "next" thing. You can imagine he had trouble getting to sleep. So that was the start of it, eventually putting him in the hospital for rehabilitation. This was the time Karen used to do a solo with Phil Ramone. Gee, I never saw that video with "A Kind of Hush." Gosh she was thin.
Between Richard and their mother demanding that Karen get out from behind her Drum Kit and to be in front more and more, is when her ED really kicked into high gear. They pushed her too much and made decisions about her, without her input. She is who people came to see but her family didn't want her to think she could leave Richard behind, so they acted like she wasn't the super-talented singer she was to keep her tied to him. She might still be HERE if they hadn't done that to her.
When I first heard her singing around the late 60s early 70s I was probably in elementary school or about to go to Jr HS. I had know idea who was singing but I remember thinking she sounds like an angel. This was long before the internet so there was no way to look her up or the song. All we had was the radio.
Forcing her out from behind the drums was really the start of her losing control of her life and the beginnings of her anorexia which was something she could control.
If you watch the more r c not Carpenters doc, Goodbye to Love, her ED was also a reaction to Richard & her mother's control. When he went to r rehab, she paid for her own solo album ( mainly disco) which they scuppered.
@sarahholland2600 her mother was horrible. She's the one that started Richard on his addiction and was constantly critical of Karen. She clearly favored Richard.
First problem, they did not know how to dress her. Second, she was scared of stepping up in front. Third, they didn't understand that she had serious mental problems. That's not a slam against her. She had a one in a trillion voice. But that longing that you hear in her voice was indescribable. We still to this day struggle to define it. There aren't words. This documentary did it's best to try to say it. Can you believe that it took that many people to describe her? She was the star though. It's simple.
JUST LIKE ABBA, IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO SINGLE OUT ONE FAVE SONG. IT CHANGES ALL THE TIME. HAVE A GO AT: SWEET SWEET SMILE AND: CALLING OCCUPANTS OF INTERPLANETARY CRAFT 🤗
I really like your insight and commentary. You saw deep into what was happening with marketing and labels, as opposed to today with social media and being independent. And just music🎵💗 You get it.💯 Loved the talk
Great words Dorothy, my memories of Karen when she became ill, she still had the courage to perform, her last recording of the song NOW is hard to listen to & to this day every time you here her voice come on the radio it stops you in your tracks.
To answer your question near the beginning, I believe the song Richard was singing was called "Piano Picker." He rewrote the lyrics for that performance. He shows his piano prowess on it!
I think Richard ad Karen just didn't know how to say "no" at times. Like, "no, we're too tired to do this" or "no, we don't want to do that." They didn't realize that THEY were the real bosses and could have taken the reigns at any time and set boundaries for themselves. It's sad that they were overworked and unfairly criticized. It took a toll on their health. They needed a break and positive, honest people around who truly cared about their well-being.
Well said! Great Observations! Loved the Carpenters! I hope we all are careful with criticisms of others! This includes being critical of Richard Carpenter not helping Karen very quickly! Remember this was roughly 50 years ago and eating disorders were not talked about and not known about by very many people! We have the internet to look everything up on now (it might not be true what we find) we can find info on almost anything in the world! In those days you had to go to a library or a book store and research stuff extensively to learn things!!
Back in the day a lot of Rock song writers started writing jingles for commercials. So getting a song off a commercial wasn't a big deal now they use old songs for their commercials
Oh Thank you for doin this on their video Documentary! enlightening. Appreciate your input & comments and Fun😍 Oh please do an Elvis Bio too, another amazing!!! but a heartbreak called "A boy from Tupelo " Iconic. Keep on Keepin on👍
Karen said out of her own mouth that she LOVED singing and performing and wanted to do it for the rest of her life, even though her musical foundation was definitely as a drummer.
So true what you said some people get pleasure about tearing people down I'm.49 RUclips can be toxic but I've learnt to deal with it. It dosnt happen often but if a troll comes at me I gotta brush it off X
A&M had a hard time marketing Karen and Richard due to them being siblings... How do you market a brother and sister that, for the most part, sing love songs. Years later, Karen was once asked by a radio DJ.. "Where did you two meet?" under the assumption that she and Richard were married to each other... So Karen jokingly said. "In college.." Fast forward to the late 80s when Selena started to make waves in the music industry.. her band included her brother and sister and boyfriend/husband.. Her father was her manager and had no problems marketing his daughters music and promoting her career... The only thing that held Selena back for a short time was her lack of spoken Spanish skills. She had no problem singing the language when she was young.. but couldn't hold a conversation without slipping into English.. Still by the time she tragically murdered.. she was fluent in Spanish..
Have been loving your insight and comments about Karen's career. You're absolutely spot on about how you can chase a dream and then when you get it, it can whirl you out of your orbit until the life you knew doesn't exist. The brutal touring schedules, the constant striving for the next hit, and all the while you're trying to maintain some kind of semblance of the regular life you used to have. I'm sure a lot of famous singers feel it. I know at least one did, and wrote about it. Neil Sedaka had a long and successful career with multiple hits. One of them was his song "The Hungry Years." ruclips.net/video/FF1D-wtpdf4/видео.html It captures beautifully (and hauntingly) the yearning for the "hungry" years when life might have meant more struggle to get by, but in so many other ways had more freedom. Keep up the great reactions and reviews! 🙂
yes I agree with you about this. They should make a program about "LIFE AT CARPENTER HOUSEHOLD". KIND OF LIKE CAPOTE VS THE SWANS. Her mother her mother. Wonder if Richard would agree: the favorite child.
It's bollocks, isn't it, because i'm in my late 30's... and she was absolutely GORGEOUS looking, but GENUINELY TALENTED, not the modern crap, where it's one or the other... OR NEITHER, A whole package, because she was a lovely person too. And here we are today with Nicki's Minge.... jesus christ almighty....
Love your insights. Your points on marketing is spot on. Check out Eva Cassidy. She suffered from the same marketing problem and didn't get air play until after she died.
She would have gotten airplay. No way would a talent like Eva's not get noticed or played. She just never had the chance to get there. Cancer took her too fast.
seems like everyone got to test ya....like one big test. and society is handing out the grades......you cant please everone....you hope that most people like yourself that can respect talent and nothing else ....we hope
They were so huge you'd never know this was going on behind the scenes. I never til recently 90% of their songs were covers that didn't make it until Richard re-arranged the songs. He only wrote 3 of their hits with John Bettis. Goodbye to Love is their saddest song along with Rainy Days and Monday's written by Paul Williams about his mother. The eating disorder was her need for control. She had none. Eating she could control. It goes much deeper then the mirror and remarks. She probably didn't think it would kill her.. She was hurting her whole life.
I am sorry but you are so damn wrong about saying 90% of their songs were cover songs arranged by Richard Carpenter. If youre a fan and has bought CDs or tapes of their albums you'd know thats a major mistake. You might want to check out WIKIPEDIA for a complete information about their discography. The cover songs they did was as little as 30% compared to their original songs many of them written by other songwriters besides Richard Carpenter.
Songs written By Richard Carpenter : Goodbye To Love, Yesterday Once More, Top Of The World, Rainy Days and Mondays, I need To Be In Love, Merry Christmas Darling, Only Yesterday, Those Good Old Dreams damn I can go on but you need to do your reseacrh yourself LOL!
@@henrymurphychronicles2488 I saw an interview with Paul Williams. He said he wrote Rainy Days and Monday's about his mother. Is he lying? Go Google it! You are so wrong about that song. I'm not arguing with you.
@@dana_brooke_27 Rainy Days and MOndays was indeed written by Roger Nichols and Paul Williams, sorry to include that in the list of songs co-written by Richard carpenter but to say he only wrote three songs is laughable.
@@henrymurphychronicles2488 The special I watched they only mentioned the three songs but said he was a genius at arrangements and made hits out of songs that no one else could. I'm not putting him down in any way. I'm just stating the facts of what he himself said. It was called the "The top 20 hits of the Carpenter's" they went through every song that ever charted.
It was horrible back then I was anorexic myself over weight was the last thing you wanted to be back then 70s was a hard time to live in I'm 57 I'm very unhealthy because of my lifestyle back then Dimash is extremely perfect in his craft
No internet cable and definitely no competition shows rock and roll coming up very fast I saw her carrier her mother was very bad for her her mother put him first I just ran into someone recently his name is Dimash please check him out songs SOS and Sinful Passion he's the best singer of all times not meaning to get you away from her because I loved her as well
We cannot forget about just how controlling Karen's mother was, and that Karen was always second to her mother's love, affection, and praise for her brother, Richard. Anorexia Nervosa (a newly researched and barely understood mental health condition at the time) is when a person suffering from the disease feels that eating, or not eating, is the one thing they can control. Most everyone else in Karen's life was controlling everything else: her daily and tour schedules, her music, her clothing/stage look, her finances, which included her manager and publicist, etc. Unfortunately, Anorexia and Bulimia had a deathly stronghold on Karen's life that she was never fully able to overcome. Ultimately, Karen Carpenter died from cardiac arrest due to the disease, laxative abuse, and drugs/medications weakening her heart. All of Karen's life, she only wanted to love and to be loved. I believe that along with her physical/psychological condition, Karen Carpenter died from a broken heart. I pray that she is now at peace in heaven, beholding the glorious presence of Jesus Christ, the Prince of Peace, the King of kings, and the Lord of lords. Amen.
The criticisms of the Carpenters was relentless during the late 70's & early 80's. Especially towards Karen, since she was out front. It is difficult to convey how constant it was from everyone.
Carpenters DID get control….Richard did. No different from now. Their first album with a cover Richard didn’t like was huge. After that, A&M gave them full control and created a brand…one of the first, with a logo and a sound. Ca-Ching…heres your receipt. Many artists did the same after thus…crested logos and branded….
Dude - that was the 1970s - marketing wasn't as sophisticated back then. Carpenters is Richard and Karen. Richard is Karen's older brother and her domineering mother clearly favored him, leaving little Karen hurt and confused. Karen had a rather rough childhood because of that and she was a little chubby child - but grew to be an average-sized young woman until some reporter offhandedly described her as Richard's chubby little sister after a concert (when they were still a Jazz trio named for Richard). That thoughtless comment is, reputedly, the trigger that started Karen on the path to what eventually claimed her life, Anorexia Nervosa. Karen was the drummer for the trio and they entered the Hollywood Bowl Battle of the Bands and won the competition with Karen singing "The Girl from Ipanema." They went through a couple other iterations of jazz bands until a demo tape was discovered by Herb Alpert. Karen always said she was a drummer who sang - and she was an EXCEPTIONAL drummer (search Karen Carpenter Drum Solo - 1976 First TV Special and FF to 1:33). Her insecurities about her physical appearance kept her rooted behind the drums until her voice was simply too glorious and public requests to see her to loud to keep her hidden behind them. Everyone pressured her until she finally gave in - but hated it! Alpert gave them artistic freedom in the recording studio and they stumbled along until Alpert asked them to record a Burt Bacharach and Hal David song called "(They Long to Be) Close to You". Richard wrote up the arrangement and it was an overnight hit. One night, Richard was watching TV and saw a commercial for Crocker National Bank. He recognized the voices of Paul Williams and Roger Nichols, two A&M songwriters on the commercial's theme song called "We've Only Just Begun." Richard got ahold of Williams and, fortunately, there was a full version of the song. Richard wrote the arrangements - and with Karen's vocals - a bank jingle was tuned into a Gold record! We’ve Only Just Begun is still a top Wedding song to this day! It also launched the careers for Paul and Roger who went on to write many of Carpenter's hit songs - and many other artists. As their career blossomed, Karen's obsession with her weight continued. She never saw herself as beautiful - always too fat - and unlucky in love. Her one marriage was to a handsome grifter who just used her as a checkbook and the marriage ended after 14 months. She went into treatment a few times - but it never took. The childhood issues and her body dysmorphia combined with her depression and insecurity just couldn't be overcome. On February 4, 1983, at just 32, her heart literally broke - and she was gone. This backstory might help those of you that didn't really know much about her to now hear something even deeper in her music. All of her pain was in the sad and melancholy songs. When she was feeling good - it shown through. Listen to "I'll say Goodbye to Love" or "Song for You" and try not to cry. At Christmas - "Merry Christmas, Darling" is breathtaking. She was a gift from God and I hope to meet her one day in heaven. Imagine her voice amongst the angels!
Recording 101: First you cut a record, not a hit recording, no serious money generated, no moula for promotion. Sign as many artists that might have potential as you possibly can, throw em all against the wall to increase your chances of one or some resonating with the general public, otherwise cut bait. That's why you don't have a complete blueprint when you first sign a group or person, capisce?
Read the book "Get Hot or Go Home: The Making of a Nashville Star" about the early career of Trisha Yearwood. It's an eye opener and quite revealing of the cutthroat music business. And this was the early 90s. It's even worse now. Music artists are meat in a grinder. It's a wonder any of them come out alive.
Are you clinically blind? She was super thin in that shot. Not even in the late 60s could Karen be described as even "chubby." A prime example of someone who is part of the problem.
First I must say, to me Karen was and still is the greatest singer ever, with God given talent. She was so natural and great singing while playing drums. But then the greedy juice got her and forced to stand front of stage, like a lead singer, to sell more records. That was the beginning of her demise.
Sir---------it's not mentioned here, but Karen, like too many girls from the 60's & 70's , was haunted ------------literally----------by Michelle Phillips of The Mama;s & Papa's ; Michelle was tall, skinny, no hips, no chest, no butt-----------she was willowy, with long legs, blonde hair, blue eyes---------------JUST LIKE black girls who saw Diana Ross or Naomi Campbell , & wanted to be tall, thin, leggy -----------but for Karen., that comparison was just so unfair. Today, it's less so, but in those days, skinny girls with long legs & no shape, were the " in " thing , & for Karen, it made her downfall, that much faster. Tragically.------------------It's easy for people to say now, " how could she have not seen her beauty? " but Karen struggled badly with her own self-worth. -------------She began to " BINGE-PURGE " in her eating, & that, + using Ipecac Syrup to make her vomit, eventually killed her heart muscle. When she collapsed, her heart literally was dead. --------------------------------MJL, 74 y/o
Explained perfectly. Unfortunately Karen had very low self esteem and received no backing from her family. If it was today she probably would have made it. Anorexia was not well known and she gave her life to save many others.
Anorexia is a far more complex condition than can be explained by simple explanations or hypotheses. We're ALL held to some kind of so-called "ideal standard" or other, but we don't all succumb to that pressure to a fatal extent. We will never know why Karen fell into that abyss - only that once she did, she couldn't find her way out. It's tragic and so sad, but the best we can do is to strive to try not to JUDGE so much, and understand and love and work towards a day when we can accept each other as we are.
@@sadee1287 I agree 💯. I'm a recovering anorexic. I say that because even though I'm at a healthy weight, I still have to be reminded to eat. I was at my lowest weight at 18, 78 pounds. That was 1986. It took until 2010 when I started dating and married my husband that I finally gained weight. In 2010, I weighed 95 pounds, today I'm between 115 & 125. I refuse to have a scale in the house and hate looking in the mirror still. My husband drives over the road, I rode with him for the first 4 years we were married. He calls every day to ask what I've eaten. Sometimes I still like and make up something but most of the time that's the reminder I need to get something to eat
I just have to say her downfall was the elites and the industry you look at her she was not overweight at all and yet they say she died at 32 from anorexia know I think a lot more went on and I blame her brother as well you know let's sacrifice for the greater good if you get my meaning
And critics still do this to female artists! They would look great if they lost weight. Adele, Jennifer Hudson are two examples that come to mind. You have no idea what you can set in motion with comments on weight or looks.
8:45 . I don't agree with stuggle and depression comment. Its more like love and missing someone terribly. Soul? there wasn't any soul, Mariah Carey is soul. it was an angelic beautiful young woman.
I thought this would play the song and respond to it, not complain about the record labels , a total of almost an hour to respond to a song.......very weird !
I'm sorry but I don't think you get it I grew up listening to them and we know the stories she I think and a lot of people agree was put out of it can't use certain words but at the age of 32 she's all of a sudden dead in a closet and they say anorexia know there is a lot more going on and we all know it just like Michael Jackson Elvis Presley the 27 Club a lot
CARPENTERS PLAYLIST: ruclips.net/p/PLe70UwDfhHBhOHpJ25BJSSrVuVKo7FSXd
That’s sucks so bad..I LOVE. Seeing her sing and drum
Being an Anorexic myself I can understand the pain she would have been going through. She developed Anorexia and ultimately she passed from complications due to her eating disorder. Cardiac arrest I think. Eating disorders are the devil. It’s a constant battle in your head. One side knowing the disorder is irrational yet the other side is the total opposite.
sadly her mom also fostered her bad image of her self
Best female voice ever. Clear and pure.
🙌 🙌
The Carpenters were too squeaky clean for the industry, not the fans, we loved everything they put out!
So true, you nailed it on the head!
People are still listening to The Carpenters many years after her death.
So true. The critics were so very often WAY off the mark. I've read some of the critics who wrote around the time Linda Ronstadt was hitting it big that there were no good women country music singers until Linda. Not knocking Linda (love her!) but they were out to lunch. There were plenty of talented singers around country and every other genre of music at the time.
Critics are often a bunch of a-holes who think their opinions count for something. Yeah--something to line your bird cage with and not much else...
Karen did indeed come to love being out front. She was an amazing live singer with a fantastic stage personality. To the last she asked Richard for new songs to sing and more audiences to sing to! People truly loved and adored Karen! She was magical!
Yes she was 🪄
@Papa B Karen loved interacting with her audience, watch her tv specials, she smiles like she used to when she was behind her drum kit! Karen was also looking forward to going back on tour just before her passing. Karen truly blossomed through the years.
Karen and I corresponded with each other when I was in Vietnam in 70/71 with the 1st Marine Div, I've always been in love with her. I have 30 letters that will be cremated with me, my wife of 35 years knows about them but I have never shared them with anyone. I was gravely wounded with shrapnel and she was the reason I survived.
God bless. Hope you helped each other.
Mike, Perhaps you might share them with Richard before taking them with you? I cannot imagine anyone that misses her with more regret that he does. Just a thought.
@@ehdeesign that would invade the privacy of both writers. They're nothing to do with Richard. And if you watched the full documentary Goodbye to Love ( which these clips are from) , Richard & her mother sabotaged her attempt to have a solo career, by persuading her not to put out the solo album she paid for herself , when he went to rehab. The last line of the documentary is: "Karen's career, like her Mother's love, belonged to Richard".
Really amazing that you have those letters to look upon it’s sort of like finding a meteorite from another planet that you can break out every now and then and it’s yours and hers only…she saved you
Wow..this is seriously amazing! TY for telling us this history … 😢😢😢
She was a beautiful woman with a beautiful soul and it is so sad she let what people said about her made her think differently about herself
The insecurities had to already be there and the critics talking just validated how she likely already felt. And people forget how young she was during the peak years. The greatest successes were when she was between 19 and 25. Still a kid. She hadn't even figured out who she was when fame hit. And fame does indeed kill.
We lost her because someone said she wasn't enough. A voice of an ANGEL was lost. RIP Karen.
that is sad
Tragic
Our Karen.. Gifted, Shy, Fragile...
Godspeed for one of the purest voices to ever live.
Omg! She had no idea how good she was! I feel very strong for her. We are lucky that her voice was recorded for the after world to enjoy.
You're definitely a friend of Karen Carpenter now, she got to you. She could have used a friend like you back in the day. I know it;s all hindsight, but this is one of the most important reactions you have ever made. For real, esp today, some snarky critics need to STFU. they really have nothing of value to say but hurtful things from behind a coward's computer monitor. From a really old white guy lol
☮️ ❤️
I just finished part 1 and I love that you're doing this! I have been a Carpenters fan since I was 9. My mom played their "Top of the World" 8 track in the car to and from school. I was DEVASTATED when she passed just before my 21rst birthday. It's so great to see your generation enjoying what I've known for DECADES! Keep up the good work! BTW, one of their songs I've always loved and haven't seen any reactions to:
"Bless the Beasts and the Children"
That would be great to see!
thanks for the support and your recommendation!
I saw Karen play and drum in 1972 and it blew my mind .The Burt Bacharach medley with her drumming and singing was incredible.
To this day her voice gives me chills.
What a voice.
Great job man really enjoyed your analysis. The most beautiful female voice in history has the saddest story behind it.
Karen Carpenter can bring tears to my eyes with her emotion and that voice... I seen her make girls cry
An angel who touched the hearts of many people and forever will be irreplaceable. Miss you so much rest in peace Karen carpenter. You left this world too soon but your lovely velvety contralto voice never will. Rest in peace angel
Quite possibly the most talented musical duo of all time! Supplied us with some incredibly wonderful and timeless music that I still enjoy tremendously today. Just hearing Karens voice can bring a tear to my eye.
We lost a legend.
She is the top 10 female drummer in the world.
You should check out that Christmas drum solo where I think she is the happiest.
🎼🎙🥰
This comment is like 1 year past its time but...gonna try! I listened to those who made comment on your broadcast and she " a woman" made comments on Karen singing and the depth of it. She made a statement that Karen may have been suffering Anorexia but how Karen sang with such emotion...It was much deeper than that. She Nailed it On The Head! Emotional Trauma can go back a long way in someones life. But whatever the case, Karen Carperter sang deep into our souls. And probably deeper because of what she may have endured. Behind close doors.....No ones knows what goes behind closed doors....Yeah, a song on that topic also. I really did appreciate your view on what was and what of might of been going on in their life. You had 30 minutes...... i reallly think you covered it very very well!
Companies will sign talent because they see possibilities. Then they start thinking about how to advertise and present. But, yes, you are right. The music should sell itself. The problem is that record companies are not as concerned with the popularity of the songs as much as the personalities of the talent. They are all about sales and they could care less about art. I will say that A & M was one of the best. I did many sessions for A&M and really enjoyed it. I also worked on the Carpenters 1978 Christmas special . Record companies are notorious for making weird choices. Fortunately Herb Alert is a fantastic musician himself with many hits behind his name. He gets it.
Should say Herb Alpert
Thanks for your feedback, I would say record companies don't focus on those things now as they did in the past. A lot of artists get signed off of a popular song they release from their home studio while you have some artists getting signed today because they have 1 million Instagram followers it's ridiculous, but yea I guess the priorities were different back then.
Imagine!!! The perfection of her voice...and they treated her as if she needed them.Smh
I love your reaction to this tragedy and the loss of this beautiful and talented artist. I can see you have a good heart and I can see the love you have for Karen. Subscribed! ❤
You are spot on with the observation about forcing your art. I'm a visual artist, and when internally moved, I can produce excellent work. Suddenly, when it becomes a commissioned work, it's a job, and it just does not flow out. The muses can't be called on demand. I wanted to be a commercial artist, but it would never have worked. Inspiration only flows when you're free and enjoying what you're doing.
The song Richard is singing is called PIANO PICKER, he changed the lyrics a little bit for concerts :)
thanks
Great song that we used to do in concert as a major change of pace.
As a 13 year old boy in the early 70's it just wasn't cool to admit that you liked the Carpenters. It was like you were admitting that you weren't masculine. But the combination of Richard's arrangements and Karen's hypnotic voice couldn't be ignored. I've seen this documentary before, but your commentary is spot on. The industry just didn't know how to market or promote them. Fortunately for all of us their talent couldn't be denied or ignored. To this day listening to Karen is like sitting by a warm fire on a cold winter day.
Well, Richard was constantly trying to think of the "next" thing. You can imagine he had trouble getting to sleep. So that was the start of it, eventually putting him in the hospital for rehabilitation. This was the time Karen used to do a solo with Phil Ramone. Gee, I never saw that video with "A Kind of Hush." Gosh she was thin.
Sad, sad it had to end this way with her, what a shame, what a shame!!
yepp
Between Richard and their mother demanding that Karen get out from behind her Drum Kit and to be in front more and more, is when her ED really kicked into high gear. They pushed her too much and made decisions about her, without her input. She is who people came to see but her family didn't want her to think she could leave Richard behind, so they acted like she wasn't the super-talented singer she was to keep her tied to him. She might still be HERE if they hadn't done that to her.
Her mom never told her she loved her and never told her good a singer she was.
When I first heard her singing around the late 60s early 70s I was probably in elementary school or about to go to Jr HS. I had know idea who was singing but I remember thinking she sounds like an angel. This was long before the internet so there was no way to look her up or the song. All we had was the radio.
2nd video in a row I’m really hoping to your analysis and comments (the marketing piece during the open was on point Fabian … great points )
Forcing her out from behind the drums was really the start of her losing control of her life and the beginnings of her anorexia which was something she could control.
If you watch the more r c not Carpenters doc, Goodbye to Love, her ED was also a reaction to Richard & her mother's control. When he went to r rehab, she paid for her own solo album ( mainly disco) which they scuppered.
@sarahholland2600 her mother was horrible. She's the one that started Richard on his addiction and was constantly critical of Karen. She clearly favored Richard.
Your a good man, love your style and insights. Karen is on of my favs all time.
Thank you Fortworth Fabian.....so very true. It was an era where 'thin was in'. It was a standard set by the excesses of the fashion industry.
First problem, they did not know how to dress her. Second, she was scared of stepping up in front. Third, they didn't understand that she had serious mental problems. That's not a slam against her. She had a one in a trillion voice. But that longing that you hear in her voice was indescribable. We still to this day struggle to define it. There aren't words. This documentary did it's best to try to say it. Can you believe that it took that many people to describe her? She was the star though. It's simple.
So sad. She suffered and died from anorexia. She'll never be topped as a female vocalist with such a pure tone.
The critics literally killed Karen with their words! Such a Loss
JUST LIKE ABBA, IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO SINGLE OUT ONE FAVE SONG. IT CHANGES ALL THE TIME. HAVE A GO AT: SWEET SWEET SMILE AND: CALLING OCCUPANTS OF INTERPLANETARY CRAFT 🤗
I really like your insight and commentary. You saw deep into what was happening with marketing and labels, as opposed to today with social media and being independent. And just music🎵💗 You get it.💯 Loved the talk
Great words Dorothy, my memories of Karen when she became ill, she still had the courage to perform, her last recording of the song NOW is hard to listen to & to this day every time you here her voice come on the radio it stops you in your tracks.
😇🤗@@chrisalldis3375
To answer your question near the beginning, I believe the song Richard was singing was called "Piano Picker." He rewrote the lyrics for that performance. He shows his piano prowess on it!
I think Richard ad Karen just didn't know how to say "no" at times.
Like, "no, we're too tired to do this" or "no, we don't want to do that."
They didn't realize that THEY were the real bosses and could have taken the reigns at any time and set boundaries for themselves. It's sad that they were overworked and unfairly criticized. It took a toll on their health. They needed a break and positive, honest people around who truly cared about their well-being.
Karen, in particular, seems like a real people pleaser. Like it would take A LOT for her to put people in their place.
Well said! Great Observations! Loved the Carpenters! I hope we all are careful with criticisms of others! This includes being critical of Richard Carpenter not helping Karen very quickly! Remember this was roughly 50 years ago and eating disorders were not talked about and not known about by very many people! We have the internet to look everything up on now (it might not be true what we find) we can find info on almost anything in the world! In those days you had to go to a library or a book store and research stuff extensively to learn things!!
Enjoyed your comments and your enjoyment of the Carpenters.
thank you sir for this review of the carpenters
You know how successful you are in the eyes of some folk when they start with their personal attacks to try and knock you back down.
Artists today only wish they had the talent Karen had.
Well said.
Back in the day a lot of Rock song writers started writing jingles for commercials. So getting a song off a commercial wasn't a big deal now they use old songs for their commercials
I've heard that Karen passed away at age 32, if she lived for one more month, she would of been 33. So sad! She was a very gifted woman!
Great comments. I felt your joy at 9:41.... made me want to subscribe! Peace to you and keep up the great channel!
I love your reacting to the documentary...great idea..and I love your deep appreciation of the Carpenter's music
wow every time i here her voice my troubles melt RIP Karen x
Oh Thank you for doin this on their video Documentary! enlightening. Appreciate your input & comments and Fun😍 Oh please do an Elvis Bio too, another amazing!!! but a heartbreak called "A boy from Tupelo " Iconic. Keep on Keepin on👍
Already did it check the Elvis playlist
@@FortWorthFabian Ah thanks so much! I had just found ya! Rock On! :)
God I love her voice ❤
I think the Close to You album cover is very nice. There's nothing wrong with it, but Richard hates it.
Thanks for the review and comments brother! Cheers!
She always said she was a drummer that sang, not a singer that drummed.
Karen said out of her own mouth that she LOVED singing and performing and wanted to do it for the rest of her life, even though her musical foundation was definitely as a drummer.
People don’t often know themselves
Really appreciate your vids...your reactions do the artists justice!
You have great appreciation and insite for who these people were.
The Carpenters made their label (A&M) a ton of money.
So true what you said some people get pleasure about tearing people down
I'm.49 RUclips can be toxic but I've learnt to deal with it. It dosnt happen often but if a troll comes at me I gotta brush it off X
Yea I’ve been learning to not read the comments
You have to understand the time. There was so much music coming out. And they were so soft. Us teenagers did not dig them. Well maybe secretly.
A&M had a hard time marketing Karen and Richard due to them being siblings... How do you market a brother and sister that, for the most part, sing love songs. Years later, Karen was once asked by a radio DJ.. "Where did you two meet?" under the assumption that she and Richard were married to each other... So Karen jokingly said. "In college.."
Fast forward to the late 80s when Selena started to make waves in the music industry.. her band included her brother and sister and boyfriend/husband.. Her father was her manager and had no problems marketing his daughters music and promoting her career... The only thing that held Selena back for a short time was her lack of spoken Spanish skills. She had no problem singing the language when she was young.. but couldn't hold a conversation without slipping into English.. Still by the time she tragically murdered.. she was fluent in Spanish..
Loving The Carpenters in the 70s was considered "square" very un-hip. I loved them, and rock, and Southern rock and R&B like mad.
Have been loving your insight and comments about Karen's career. You're absolutely spot on about how you can chase a dream and then when you get it, it can whirl you out of your orbit until the life you knew doesn't exist. The brutal touring schedules, the constant striving for the next hit, and all the while you're trying to maintain some kind of semblance of the regular life you used to have. I'm sure a lot of famous singers feel it. I know at least one did, and wrote about it. Neil Sedaka had a long and successful career with multiple hits. One of them was his song "The Hungry Years." ruclips.net/video/FF1D-wtpdf4/видео.html
It captures beautifully (and hauntingly) the yearning for the "hungry" years when life might have meant more struggle to get by, but in so many other ways had more freedom.
Keep up the great reactions and reviews! 🙂
Her mother was crazy mean to her, set her up for her demise
yes I agree with you about this. They should make a program about "LIFE AT CARPENTER HOUSEHOLD". KIND OF LIKE CAPOTE VS THE SWANS. Her mother her mother. Wonder if Richard would agree: the favorite child.
It's bollocks, isn't it, because i'm in my late 30's... and she was absolutely GORGEOUS looking, but GENUINELY TALENTED, not the modern crap, where it's one or the other... OR NEITHER, A whole package, because she was a lovely person too.
And here we are today with Nicki's Minge.... jesus christ almighty....
Looking at the Disney portion I could see she was hiding under layers of clothes how thin she was.
Karen was an old soul...there are many like her
Imagine how many more beautiful songs Karen could have came up with if she were alive the last 50 years.
I dont agree, Karen playing the drums and singing was impressive!
they were more than 50 years ago...a totally different time FortWorthFabian.
Love your insights. Your points on marketing is spot on. Check out Eva Cassidy. She suffered from the same marketing problem and didn't get air play until after she died.
awww
She would have gotten airplay. No way would a talent like Eva's not get noticed or played. She just never had the chance to get there. Cancer took her too fast.
You're a real smart head. Subscription done.
seems like everyone got to test ya....like one big test. and society is handing out the grades......you cant please everone....you hope that most people like yourself that can respect talent and nothing else
....we hope
They were so huge you'd never know this was going on behind the scenes. I never til recently 90% of their songs were covers that didn't make it until Richard re-arranged the songs. He only wrote 3 of their hits with John Bettis. Goodbye to Love is their saddest song along with Rainy Days and Monday's written by Paul Williams about his mother. The eating disorder was her need for control. She had none. Eating she could control. It goes much deeper then the mirror and remarks. She probably didn't think it would kill her.. She was hurting her whole life.
I am sorry but you are so damn wrong about saying 90% of their songs were cover songs arranged by Richard Carpenter. If youre a fan and has bought CDs or tapes of their albums you'd know thats a major mistake. You might want to check out WIKIPEDIA for a complete information about their discography. The cover songs they did was as little as 30% compared to their original songs many of them written by other songwriters besides Richard Carpenter.
Songs written By Richard Carpenter : Goodbye To Love, Yesterday Once More, Top Of The World, Rainy Days and Mondays, I need To Be In Love, Merry Christmas Darling, Only Yesterday, Those Good Old Dreams damn I can go on but you need to do your reseacrh yourself LOL!
@@henrymurphychronicles2488 I saw an interview with Paul Williams. He said he wrote Rainy Days and Monday's about his mother. Is he lying? Go Google it! You are so wrong about that song. I'm not arguing with you.
@@dana_brooke_27 Rainy Days and MOndays was indeed written by Roger Nichols and Paul Williams, sorry to include that in the list of songs co-written by Richard carpenter but to say he only wrote three songs is laughable.
@@henrymurphychronicles2488 The special I watched they only mentioned the three songs but said he was a genius at arrangements and made hits out of songs that no one else could. I'm not putting him down in any way. I'm just stating the facts of what he himself said. It was called the "The top 20 hits of the Carpenter's" they went through every song that ever charted.
Well done!
It was horrible back then I was anorexic myself over weight was the last thing you wanted to be back then 70s was a hard time to live in I'm 57 I'm very unhealthy because of my lifestyle back then Dimash is extremely perfect in his craft
Karen carpenter is the most beautiful of all the times
No internet cable and definitely no competition shows rock and roll coming up very fast I saw her carrier her mother was very bad for her her mother put him first I just ran into someone recently his name is Dimash please check him out songs SOS and Sinful Passion he's the best singer of all times not meaning to get you away from her because I loved her as well
We cannot forget about just how controlling Karen's mother was, and that Karen was always second to her mother's love, affection, and praise for her brother, Richard. Anorexia Nervosa (a newly researched and barely understood mental health condition at the time) is when a person suffering from the disease feels that eating, or not eating, is the one thing they can control.
Most everyone else in Karen's life was controlling everything else: her daily and tour schedules, her music, her clothing/stage look, her finances, which included her manager and publicist, etc. Unfortunately, Anorexia and Bulimia had a deathly stronghold on Karen's life that she was never fully able to overcome.
Ultimately, Karen Carpenter died from cardiac arrest due to the disease, laxative abuse, and drugs/medications weakening her heart. All of Karen's life, she only wanted to love and to be loved. I believe that along with her physical/psychological condition, Karen Carpenter died from a broken heart. I pray that she is now at peace in heaven, beholding the glorious presence of Jesus Christ, the Prince of Peace, the King of kings, and the Lord of lords. Amen.
🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟
🔥 🔥 🔥
The criticisms of the Carpenters was relentless during the late 70's & early 80's. Especially towards Karen, since she was out front. It is difficult to convey how constant it was from everyone.
Squeak clean? She had skeletons in her closet.
Carpenters DID get control….Richard did. No different from now. Their first album with a cover Richard didn’t like was huge. After that, A&M gave them full control and created a brand…one of the first, with a logo and a sound. Ca-Ching…heres your receipt. Many artists did the same after thus…crested logos and branded….
Dude - that was the 1970s - marketing wasn't as sophisticated back then. Carpenters is Richard and Karen. Richard is Karen's older brother and her domineering mother clearly favored him, leaving little Karen hurt and confused. Karen had a rather rough childhood because of that and she was a little chubby child - but grew to be an average-sized young woman until some reporter offhandedly described her as Richard's chubby little sister after a concert (when they were still a Jazz trio named for Richard). That thoughtless comment is, reputedly, the trigger that started Karen on the path to what eventually claimed her life, Anorexia Nervosa. Karen was the drummer for the trio and they entered the Hollywood Bowl Battle of the Bands and won the competition with Karen singing "The Girl from Ipanema." They went through a couple other iterations of jazz bands until a demo tape was discovered by Herb Alpert.
Karen always said she was a drummer who sang - and she was an EXCEPTIONAL drummer (search Karen Carpenter Drum Solo - 1976 First TV Special and FF to 1:33). Her insecurities about her physical appearance kept her rooted behind the drums until her voice was simply too glorious and public requests to see her to loud to keep her hidden behind them. Everyone pressured her until she finally gave in - but hated it! Alpert gave them artistic freedom in the recording studio and they stumbled along until Alpert asked them to record a Burt Bacharach and Hal David song called "(They Long to Be) Close to You". Richard wrote up the arrangement and it was an overnight hit.
One night, Richard was watching TV and saw a commercial for Crocker National Bank. He recognized the voices of Paul Williams and Roger Nichols, two A&M songwriters on the commercial's theme song called "We've Only Just Begun." Richard got ahold of Williams and, fortunately, there was a full version of the song. Richard wrote the arrangements - and with Karen's vocals - a bank jingle was tuned into a Gold record! We’ve Only Just Begun is still a top Wedding song to this day! It also launched the careers for Paul and Roger who went on to write many of Carpenter's hit songs - and many other artists.
As their career blossomed, Karen's obsession with her weight continued. She never saw herself as beautiful - always too fat - and unlucky in love. Her one marriage was to a handsome grifter who just used her as a checkbook and the marriage ended after 14 months.
She went into treatment a few times - but it never took. The childhood issues and her body dysmorphia combined with her depression and insecurity just couldn't be overcome. On February 4, 1983, at just 32, her heart literally broke - and she was gone.
This backstory might help those of you that didn't really know much about her to now hear something even deeper in her music. All of her pain was in the sad and melancholy songs. When she was feeling good - it shown through. Listen to "I'll say Goodbye to Love" or "Song for You" and try not to cry. At Christmas - "Merry Christmas, Darling" is breathtaking. She was a gift from God and I hope to meet her one day in heaven. Imagine her voice amongst the angels!
She herself shelved the album. It wasn't Karen Anne. The album is not her
Recording 101: First you cut a record, not a hit recording, no serious money generated, no moula for promotion. Sign as many artists that might have potential as you possibly can, throw em all against the wall to increase your chances of one or some resonating with the general public, otherwise cut bait.
That's why you don't have a complete blueprint when you first sign a group or person, capisce?
Read the book "Get Hot or Go Home: The Making of a Nashville Star" about the early career of Trisha Yearwood. It's an eye opener and quite revealing of the cutthroat music business. And this was the early 90s. It's even worse now.
Music artists are meat in a grinder. It's a wonder any of them come out alive.
28:11 Super thin? What he saw was Karen more than 20 pounds heavier than when she was super-thin.
Are you clinically blind? She was super thin in that shot. Not even in the late 60s could Karen be described as even "chubby."
A prime example of someone who is part of the problem.
jealousy is evil.
First I must say, to me Karen was and still is the greatest singer ever, with God given talent. She was so natural and great singing while playing drums. But then the greedy juice got her and forced to stand front of stage, like a lead singer, to sell more records. That was the beginning of her demise.
Aint Karen amazing -i love her -she like you alls Alliyah -i love her too -no joke -
Sir---------it's not mentioned here, but Karen, like too many girls from the 60's & 70's , was haunted ------------literally----------by Michelle Phillips of The Mama;s & Papa's ; Michelle was tall, skinny, no hips, no chest, no butt-----------she was willowy, with long legs, blonde hair, blue eyes---------------JUST LIKE black girls who saw Diana Ross or Naomi Campbell , & wanted to be tall, thin, leggy -----------but for Karen., that comparison was just so unfair. Today, it's less so, but in those days, skinny girls with long legs & no shape, were the " in " thing , & for Karen, it made her downfall, that much faster. Tragically.------------------It's easy for people to say now, " how could she have not seen her beauty? " but Karen struggled badly with her own self-worth. -------------She began to " BINGE-PURGE " in her eating, & that, + using Ipecac Syrup to make her vomit, eventually killed her heart muscle. When she collapsed, her heart literally was dead. --------------------------------MJL, 74 y/o
Explained perfectly. Unfortunately Karen had very low self esteem and received no backing from her family. If it was today she probably would have made it. Anorexia was not well known and she gave her life to save many others.
Anorexia is a far more complex condition than can be explained by simple explanations or hypotheses. We're ALL held to some kind of so-called "ideal standard" or other, but we don't all succumb to that pressure to a fatal extent. We will never know why Karen fell into that abyss - only that once she did, she couldn't find her way out. It's tragic and so sad, but the best we can do is to strive to try not to JUDGE so much, and understand and love and work towards a day when we can accept each other as we are.
@@sadee1287 I agree 💯. I'm a recovering anorexic. I say that because even though I'm at a healthy weight, I still have to be reminded to eat. I was at my lowest weight at 18, 78 pounds. That was 1986. It took until 2010 when I started dating and married my husband that I finally gained weight. In 2010, I weighed 95 pounds, today I'm between 115 & 125. I refuse to have a scale in the house and hate looking in the mirror still. My husband drives over the road, I rode with him for the first 4 years we were married. He calls every day to ask what I've eaten. Sometimes I still like and make up something but most of the time that's the reminder I need to get something to eat
I started losing weight because it was the only thing I could control. I had no support from my family and very few friends.
I just have to say her downfall was the elites and the industry you look at her she was not overweight at all and yet they say she died at 32 from anorexia know I think a lot more went on and I blame her brother as well you know let's sacrifice for the greater good if you get my meaning
When she died she weight 5 stone
The Carpenters sound like New Yorkers to me
😂
They were from Connecticut originally so yeah there is an accent.
@@melaniedotting6781 Connecticut borders New York state so it make sense.
They were originally from Downey
They were born in Connecticut but moved to California where they remained so Richard could pursue his musical aspirations
And critics still do this to female artists! They would look great if they lost weight. Adele, Jennifer Hudson are two examples that come to mind. You have no idea what you can set in motion with comments on weight or looks.
8:45 . I don't agree with stuggle and depression comment. Its more like love and missing someone terribly. Soul? there wasn't any soul, Mariah Carey is soul. it was an angelic beautiful young woman.
When they took her from behind the drums, that is when the Anorexia kicked in.
I thought this would play the song and respond to it, not complain about the record labels , a total of almost an hour to respond to a song.......very weird !
I'm sorry but I don't think you get it I grew up listening to them and we know the stories she I think and a lot of people agree was put out of it can't use certain words but at the age of 32 she's all of a sudden dead in a closet and they say anorexia know there is a lot more going on and we all know it just like Michael Jackson Elvis Presley the 27 Club a lot
PAUSE. Holy Cow.