Hey Leo. How about making a video about software companies harvesting your data and usage so they can advertise to you in an attempt to take more money from you. Or, they use your data to feed some other project they’re working on such as AI which financially benefits them in the long run. You pay money to be a product. Indeed. Who is the pirate, who is the thief?
I have paid THOUSANDS of dollars for software in my life. I have paid hundreds of dollars for Microsoft Office. Latest version I bought was Office 2010. And of course I can't use it now because it won't activate or run on Windows 11. Who is the bad guy here? We are the ones being ripped off. Also, I wonder if the garbage dump is filled with perfectly good electronics that have been made obsolete because of greed?
I would guess you're probably also starting to have a few problems keeping your fourteen year old car on the road? After all, it was the automobile industry that perfected the art of built-in obsolescence way before software companies jumped on the bandwagon. You can still use Office 2010 and you can still use WIN10, but you won't have the latest functionality and safety features as you will if you update. Going back to my car analogy, if you accept that limitation on a vehicle, why not with software?
@@davidf6326 You are right. My car is 19 years old and runs perfectly. No backup camera though. I just don't want to keep wasting money on things I have already purchased that do the job just fine.
@@alanglassman6473 It won't open my encrypted documents. It also keeps installing things over and over again. And it won't activate. Google docs to the rescue.
The problem with free alternatives - Linux and FOSS - is that they don't have the market share. So here in India even if someone learns by heart LibreOffice or something and goes for an interview they'll be asked why haven't you learnt MS Office? You don't know Windows? Sorry we can't take you. And that's why many people in third world countries pirate software. More importantly even if someone can afford it the prices are always set for US audience where average monthly income is very high compared to a country like India. However, I too don't encourage piracy but I'm not in a position to change the mind of employers and so on.
They might offer different prices in different counties then the United States, so check those. If not look for cheaper or free alterative software. They look and work just like the Microsoft Office but may be a missing some features
People at that point should actually look for someone who will just the person who can just do the job, it doesn't matter which software they use if they can do the job.
The requirement to know MS Office is ridiculous. If you know how to use one office, learning another is a matter of days if not hours. Most companies use MS Word in the most basic way possible. I have to deal with tons of documents where headings are centered or aligned to the right with multiple tabs or spaces. If you go to their hiring page, you'll find "MS Office required". Their docs are shit but they want you to know MS Office.
I paid good money in 2005 for my Quicken software. Until recently it was doing the job just fine. As part of a cleanup of my PC, I reinstalled Windows, and in turn Quicken. When I rang up to activate it, boof, "your version of Quicken is no longer supported". I can understand if I rang for support with an issue with the software, but for them to just not allow me to activate a product I paid full price for, that's more criminal that someone pirating software.
Leo, Please tell us you feel the same way about big tech pirating our computers without permission and compensation. How about their forced non opt out EULA's , or perhaps their changing of the definition of "purchase" Could you please do a video chastising them on their thievery and morality !!!
"Piracy" is copyright infringement. Copyright infringment is *not* stealing. Therefore, piracy is *not* theft. That said, while there are reasons *not* to use some software (cost being one), there are usually equally good if not better software alternatives out there licensed to protect your rights, which can often be legally obtained for free anyway, so pirating software is still not a very good idea. At the very least, you don't know what kind of malware is tagging along in the package.
For the other side of the story, look at Finale music notation software. This has been an industry standard for over 30 years, and they recently decided to end development and support for their many users who purchased their software - this was not a subscription. At the time they were going to maintain their authorization servers for only one year after the announcement. After that, long-term licensed users would no longer be able to install their software on new or upgraded machines. If I were a Finale user I would have to install it in a virtual machine to keep it running when hardware is upgraded. I have purchased (not a subscription) several packages that will only work if they can, at unknown (to me) intervals, contact an authorization server via the internet. If piracy is wrong then so are these other practices. All of the software on my machines is properly licensed.
I have paid thousands of dollars over 30 years for hundreds of programs that no longer work. You want customers to buy a product? Ensure it continues to exist like a good.
The crimes of the corporations are infinitely greater than piracy. Why focus on the insignificant instead of calling out the atrocities of the corporations and the rich.
Leo, I respect the knowledge and work you do for the greater software and IT community, but I have to strongly disagree with the point of the video. The "Theft is still theft" argument quickly falls apart when megacorporations like Microsoft and Google waste two dollars chasing ineffective anti-piracy methods and lobbying politicians to kill competition for every one dollar they could use to solve this problem outright. It is also simply not the same situation as a physical object (like the car) being taken away from a person and depriving them of the ability to use it; no material value is lost. There's a greater argument for the value of intellectual property, but it's frankly very difficult for me to muster sympathy when these companies have decades of experience throwing their legal weight around to abuse legal, legitimate use cases and destroy fair and legal consumer protections for those exact same products. "Wrong is still wrong," but there's a difference of substance between "illegal" because corporations said so and putting actual harm out into the world. I disagree, but thank you for your opinion.
@@davidf6326 No. I do believe people (and companies) have a right to make money off the products they make. I don't think that right is absolute. There's a lot of nuances that simply do not factor into a dogmatic, black and white viewpoint on this and there's only so much you can fit into a youtube comment. What about defunct companies or abandonware? Emulation of software that you own a legal (even hard) copy of? Fair use of material from software for things like educational or research purposes that companies like this actively fight tooth and nail. What I am arguing is that there is such a thing as a difference in degrees, please try to see the world in more than two colors.
From someone in Kashmir or other such improverished countries, unless you have connections with the ruling wealthy class, the only way you can get ahead is either by crime or corruption. Reference the book "Why Nations Fail" by Daron Acemoglu and James A. Robinson.
@@DEVAEGIR I don't recall mentioning any legal correlation. However, from a moral standpoint you could argue that copyright infringement is theft of intellectual property.
About 25 years ago, I used cracked software. I wasn't proud of it. But, once I was able to afford them, I bought all of my software and felt good about it. I liked that I was rewarding the developers for their efforts. And then, they started going to the subscription model with no owner alternatives available, and the cost went up. That spelled corporate greed. Unfortunately, the alternatives are sorely lacking. So, while I didn't go back to using cracked software, I just kept using the older versions. And, now that same company is trying to force us to buy the expensive subs, even if they have to break into our machines and disable the old versions.
Such Nuance opinions work in 1st world countries and not in 3rd world countries. When their skeleton system are not grown fully due to impoverishment, discussing about nuance of whether pirating softwares is right or wrong is not at all wise Also not all software have their free alternative and even those free alternatives may not be used in their job due to monopoly of big giant's softwares.
Bill Gates prides himself as being highly altruistic. He could make his software available to the severely poverty stricken with the wave of his hand. He has helped the needy, in foreign countries. I would think that offering Windows and Office to such needy people would be an easy project for him to accomplish.
Hello! Bill Gates left Microsoft completely in 2020, having resigned as CEO ten years prior - funnily enough, to concentrate on those very altruistic activities that you mention. His current shareholding is little more than 1%. While that no doubt contributes to his considerable wealth, it almost certainly means he has very little influence towards giving away 'his' software.
@@davidf6326 What prevented Bill Gates from doing so in 2020, 2019, 2018, etc? I imagine that he has enough influence, today, to make it happen. How about Satya Nadella? What is holding him back?
@@NoEgg4u We weren't talking about Satya Nadella. Incidentally, have you thought of it this way? Had everyone pirated Microsoft software, Bill Gates would never have made the money to fund his current altruistic work; nor to progress Microsoft, for that matter.
@davidf6326 You can only steal something that you can have. I can't have a game or other software nowadays, you only pay for a license for using that software. We don't own almost anything. In that case, the software itself is not for sale, so technically the pirates aren't stealing. Plus, we are talking about something that is not scarce, because pirating software does not result in deprivation of access. If I steal your car, you won't be able to drive to work, but if I pirate your software, you still have your copy of it.
Yeah I mean the lack of awareness to make this argument without pointing out that "buying" games and any other digital product when I don't actually own them. And making single player games online only.
I mean it's not theft. Theft is a different crime from piracy. It is facile too suggest they are the same. You can stay it's still criminal. But it's not theft. There are different laws in the books for piracy and with good reason. And it's especially Rich coming from a company like Microsoft that it's act "buy" this game but if you read the fine print we're allowed to take it away from you anytime we want. And they're allowed to literally conveniently borrow all of the work of everyone that's ever used or written anything on the internet to fund their dreadful co-pilot thing which is now causing a 32% increase in CO2 emissions.
Oh we're sorry but that $ 5.00 tail light won't work because data to run it is propitiatory and only they, the car company can re install it for $575.00.
If for whatever reason the FOSS alternatives won’t work, I would suggest using the time it took to copy hundreds of disks and writing a grant for a foundation or college to sponsor access to the legitimate software. That will also connect all those people with an educational institution, opening more opportunities to them.
Theft is taking something from somebody, and then "somebody" does not have the item any more ! Get your linguistics right Leo! You are more intelligent than calling piracy theft, although we can agree that it is immoral but stealing and theft it's not ! This subject apart I do like your stuff. :-))
Sorry, but in the context, that's semantics or legal speak (or both). In common parlance taking something and not paying for it is theft. In fact, I'm not altogether sure that digital piracy isn't considered theft in some countries' legal systems.
This is a small and narrow minded vision. If I pirate a software from a company that is no longer in business is it still stealing? If I buy a piece of software then I should own it not license it like all companies do these days so yea pirating does send a message.
This is absolutely ridiculous. You are calling impoverished people that are living on a couple bucks a day entitled? Lol. This is some of the most grotesque corporate apologia -- And just flat out poor shaming -- I have seen in some time.
I haven't watched the video yet, but in a generic sense, impoverished people certainly can (and do) act in an entitled manner. Feeling entitled to steal is often one such manifestation.
@@davidf6326 And yet at the time you'd posted this, you'd already gone out of your way to reply to almost every other comment on the video... that you hadn't watched. Why are you even here?
@@verboselamp1053 Well if you paid such attention to my comments, you'd also note that - like the one to which your replying - they weren't reliant on having watched the video.
@@davidf6326 Not the point. I've read every one of them because I'm actually interested in the discourse and community response to Leo's opinions here. Why are you even wasting your time trawling through random youtube comments if you have no interest in the content?
@@verboselamp1053 Because - and I thought this was blatantly obvious - I'm interested as to why so many people seem to think software piracy is perfectly acceptable and justifiable. One doesn't have to watch the video to have thoughts on the comments section. Anyway, I've now had an opportunity to watch the video too and I agree wholeheartedly with the content. So now you have my thoughts specifically on that, as well. Incidentally, there is a very subtle, yet important difference between saying someone has the misguided belief that they are entitled to something specific (as in the video) versus accusing someone of acting in an entitled fashion (which wasn't even suggested in the video, yet appears to be your bone of contention in your original comment).
Some people innocently buy hardware with OS and Apps that are not genuine or original. The end consumer isn't aware of this and only comes to know of it during a situation and by that time he has already paid for what he had budgeted and is trapped. This happens a lot in third world countries where PCs are bought from grey markets and sold to customers. There has to be regulations and education on this to protect consumers.
For older hardware a linux distro with all the included software, would probably be a much better option than a pirated copy of the latest microsoft offerings, given the much lower hardware requirements to use said software.
One of the core issues of advocating for FOSS is that it is predicated on selling support. People who cannot afford one off costs for software are not going to have money for a service contract. Depending on the on the state of the project, FOSS may not even be usable without support or the community may be unhelpful or worse, obnoxious (being told to RTFM wasn't unusual back in the 2000's newsgroups). I'll admit plenty of FOSS works just fine out of the box, but whether or not it meets the needs of the individual is another matter.
I personally rarely pay for software however I don't use pirated versions simply because I don't want the drama that can come with them such as back doors and other types of malware. I do however torrent videos quite often and it doesn't bother me in the least.
@@JamesHutton-l7s Research about digital security, be not afraid of the bad people out there. There are a lot of intelligent people sharing knowledge and content online. When you have learned enough, you will see that the bad actors can't hurt you anymore and you're free from the greed of the corporations as well.
Using an open source alternative is just not going to get these people any chances of herring a job because all the employers use the payed software so learning the open source stuff just won’t cut it
i use several different softwares but all are legal....office 365, ccleaner, system mechanic ult ed, mediahuman,iobit malware fighter, acronis true image, bitwarden, nero, launchbox just to name a few
Years ago I had a coworker who went on a missionary trip. He pirated software to use on this trip. I found it ironic that he was stealing to spread the 10 commandments; which teaches not to steal!!!
Sometimes there’s a distribution problem like when certain companies (such as Nintendo) ban use use of emulated games and not even making the games available through more official means to prevent the need for possible copyright infringement. If the software is subscription-model based, I’m not interested in using it unless it actually values user privacy. Otherwise it should be free with optional support for donations or a one-time payment.
Not all software, or even operating systems, cost money. If you don't have the money for Windows and whatever expensive third-party applications people tend to run on it these days, there are alternatives out there. Also, not all software takes away your rights through restrictive proprietary licensing. If you want the software to be licensed in such a way that it gives all of the rights back to you in such a way that you "own" in in a sense, there are licenses that will do that. Specifically, look for software that is released under a free and open source license. The GPL and the BSD license are the most common. Usually this software is not only free in cost, but is also licensed to respect your freedom. If you want your entire operating system to respect your freedoms, there are plenty of Linux distributions and BSDs to use. And nearly every single one of them (certainly all the ones that matter) are free.
If "Pirated software" is theft from the manufacture's perspective, then what do you call it when the software that I paid cash for 5 years ago suddenly does not work anymore because the manufacturer (that I paid the money to) suddenly will not activate my software over their server because they "decide" they do not support my version any longer and demand that I pony up more money to continue to use the software I paid dearly for 5 years ago? I can understand paying for the newest version of their software, but I consider they are stealing from me when they will not let me continue to use their software that I paid for initially 5 years ago.
@@askleonotenboom Only relevant for more recent software. Some of us (including you, I believe) are old enough to remember (and dearly love) things that were made before licencing was a thing.
When pirating software you are not subtracting something from someone but doing a copy. It is different from theft. You are in reality doing a copyright infringement
Copyright holders frequently refer to copyright infringement as theft, although such misuse has been rejected by legislatures and courts.[4] In copyright law, infringement does not refer to theft of physical objects that take away the owner's possession, but an instance where a person exercises one of the exclusive rights of the copyright holder without authorization.[5] Courts have distinguished between copyright infringement and theft.[4] For instance, the United States Supreme Court held in Dowling v. United States (1985) that bootleg phonorecords did not constitute stolen property. Instead, "interference with copyright does not easily equate with theft, conversion, or fraud. The Copyright Act even employs a separate term of art to define one who misappropriates a copyright: '[...] an infringer of the copyright.'" [4] Poon, Christopher. "'You wouldn't steal a car,' but I'd download one | Dot Comrade | Pique Newsmagazine | Whistler, CANADA". Pique Newsmagazine. Archived from the original on July 29, 2017. Retrieved July 6, 2017. [5] Gault, Matthew (August 2, 2022). "Widely Mocked Anti-Piracy Ads Made People Pirate More, Study Finds". Vice. Archived from the original on August 15, 2022. Retrieved August 20, 2022.
It is an interesting question, isn't it? And yes, I see both your points. The second is debatable on several grounds, and is a practical, rather than an ethical issue. So, on with the first, since this is touching on the ethical (and moral?) aspect. In isolation, it makes total sense. Theft is theft. However, in the world we live in, in a large part shaped by big companies (like Microsoft), arguments do not work 'in isolation' any more. What if we consider, that people in the poorest countries in the world are specifically targeted by corporations (including tech giants) as not just cheap, but virtually slave labour, from tea pickers for Lipton, to children mining for metals for the construction of microchips, to the kids that spend their day gathering crystal shards for the new-age techy to wear as a bracelet (and so on, and so forth). Most of them don't reach $200 per month, but are paid much, much less. And it is not just a random stroke of chance (or lack thereof); corporations like these specifically go there, not because labour is *relatively* cheaper (that is, cheaper, but with all the necessary protections), but because it is virtually free, and for that non-price you get the benefits of almost total exploitation. Not to mention that it is almost impossible to escape it for people like this, because such corporations are particularly interested for these workers to remain as deprived as possible, so that they continue to be exploited, and thy lobby (or strongarm) local and international authorities accordingly. So, it could very easily be argued that this is not just a case of Robin Hood stealing from a random wealthy merchant, is it? Nor is it just numbers. Context matters. Beyond that, even from a legal point of view, a crime is not always a crime. There are gradations. There are non-crimes. There is murder, but there is manslaughter, and there is also self-defence (among other). So, in a legal sense, murder is not always murder. There is r**e, and then there is "non-r**e": how many perpetrators walked because of the shameful (and moralistic) argument that the victim was promiscuous, and hence, supposedly complicit?). So, in this sense, theft is not always theft. In the real world, it really depends on who the perpetrator is, and how much lobbying power they have. P.S. And no, I am not anti-capitalist at all, nor am I of the so-called snowflake generation. I just don't like oversimplifications, legal or moral.
If your company has site license for microsoft office , talk to IT dept . They may already have home download agreement or can add one real cheap , which allows employees to download or get cd from microsoft for about 10 to 20 bucks to have your own legal copy of office or other microsft products
You are highly educated but you havent got a job ifrom your field after you graduaded. You are unemployed or you are working with the minimum wage. You will get an job offering, but you have to know how to use a certain software. Annual price for that software is 3000USD. Some times, the free alternative is not an option. And many companies require that you have the skills to use microsoft office. In couple of cases I didnt get the job, because I said I can use the Libreoffice, but I havent used the microsoft office. Some times, the free alternative is not an option.
If piracy bothers you don’t do it. But there’s a market for it. One who pirates never looked at alternative to buying that product. Even if they have the money.
they sell it to companies, they make their money out of companies, not individuals.. because if that didn't hold true they wouldn't be making budget out of software.
I don't pay for much software because so many programs I rely on are free. Many of those free programs I use replace programs I paid for in the past. The free replacements are mostly just as good or even better in a few cases.
This is where you are incorrect. Piracy is copyright infringement not theft. If you read the DMCA. Theft is me taking an item and depriving you of that item. So If I copied a song off your hard drive I didn't steal it as you still have the file with you. Please stop spreading misinformation.
Something tells me this guy doesn't think poor people are entitled to health care either... This is the kind of greed and callousness America often encourages.
Arguing back and forth about how bad the symptoms are is pointless. The problem isn't piracy, it's poverty. The system is rigged so badly that people in poverty feel it is necessary to resort to illegal activities to get out of poverty, only to join the corrupt system that hold people down in poverty in the first place. Not everyone is entitled to a copy of MS Office. Everyone IS entitled to not starve to death or die from simple diseases that have commonplace cures. But sure, go ahead and argue whether piracy is justified, because that's going to make a difference.
My respect for you just went up a thousand percent. I face the same issue with people getting upset when I refuse to install illegal copies of Windows or other pirated software. Many don’t understand the value of intellectual property or the time and money it takes to develop software. I once used an IDE that cost thousands to license, and I could only justify the expense because I knew I could recover the cost through the software I created. As you said, what gives someone else the right to just use the software I spent sometimes weeks or months of long hours, cold pizza and energy drinks developing without compensating me.
@@legoyodascream Can you imagine? No one would be allowed to build anything since they don't own the land. No more homes, or grocery stores or farmland. You can't even plant your own garden for food. Have you actually thought this through?
yes you can do it with torrents you just need to use a vpn for that but that could lead to malware so dont do it if you wanna be safe i dont do it i only pirate metal music and movies only but not software to riskey
I definitely agree with this being no longer necessary. Between Linux, Libre Office Suite, Blender/Bforartists, whatever free autocad alternatives there are that are actually AutoCad. Heck, even Adobe is seeing people switch to free alternatives after their ToS shitstorm. There are many free alternatives out there that will take away from the likes of Adobe and Autodesk in the future as well.
Don't pirate software to use it in a company. That's bad. At home, chances are, nobody will come knocking on your door. In some countries they might, but I don't know. If you like the software, try and buy it, even when you use it privately. It highly depends.
Most computers/all come with an OS. I upgraded to Windows 10 for free. I got a MS Office for $9.95 from my employer. Now since I have moved to Linux and FOSS software and am not looking back. Most foreign countries such as Germany are moving away from Windows and all it's chicanery and maybe is time most of us do also. Window 10 EOL is in just under a year and most of us all have computers that will not run Windows 11. Brother Leo I ask you start giving instruction on Linux, I will thank you.
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Hey Leo. How about making a video about software companies harvesting your data and usage so they can advertise to you in an attempt to take more money from you. Or, they use your data to feed some other project they’re working on such as AI which financially benefits them in the long run. You pay money to be a product.
Indeed. Who is the pirate, who is the thief?
I have paid THOUSANDS of dollars for software in my life. I have paid hundreds of dollars for Microsoft Office. Latest version I bought was Office 2010. And of course I can't use it now because it won't activate or run on Windows 11. Who is the bad guy here? We are the ones being ripped off. Also, I wonder if the garbage dump is filled with perfectly good electronics that have been made obsolete because of greed?
I would guess you're probably also starting to have a few problems keeping your fourteen year old car on the road? After all, it was the automobile industry that perfected the art of built-in obsolescence way before software companies jumped on the bandwagon.
You can still use Office 2010 and you can still use WIN10, but you won't have the latest functionality and safety features as you will if you update. Going back to my car analogy, if you accept that limitation on a vehicle, why not with software?
@@davidf6326 You are right. My car is 19 years old and runs perfectly. No backup camera though. I just don't want to keep wasting money on things I have already purchased that do the job just fine.
@@jeffwalther Then I don't see what your problem is - stick with Office 2010 on WIN10 .
I run Office 2010 on Win 11 just fine.
@@alanglassman6473 It won't open my encrypted documents. It also keeps installing things over and over again. And it won't activate. Google docs to the rescue.
The problem with free alternatives - Linux and FOSS - is that they don't have the market share. So here in India even if someone learns by heart LibreOffice or something and goes for an interview they'll be asked why haven't you learnt MS Office? You don't know Windows? Sorry we can't take you. And that's why many people in third world countries pirate software. More importantly even if someone can afford it the prices are always set for US audience where average monthly income is very high compared to a country like India.
However, I too don't encourage piracy but I'm not in a position to change the mind of employers and so on.
They might offer different prices in different counties then the United States, so check those. If not look for cheaper or free alterative software. They look and work just like the Microsoft Office but may be a missing some features
People at that point should actually look for someone who will just the person who can just do the job, it doesn't matter which software they use if they can do the job.
The West is full of greedy corporations -- no wonder.
The requirement to know MS Office is ridiculous. If you know how to use one office, learning another is a matter of days if not hours. Most companies use MS Word in the most basic way possible. I have to deal with tons of documents where headings are centered or aligned to the right with multiple tabs or spaces. If you go to their hiring page, you'll find "MS Office required". Their docs are shit but they want you to know MS Office.
I paid good money in 2005 for my Quicken software. Until recently it was doing the job just fine. As part of a cleanup of my PC, I reinstalled Windows, and in turn Quicken. When I rang up to activate it, boof, "your version of Quicken is no longer supported". I can understand if I rang for support with an issue with the software, but for them to just not allow me to activate a product I paid full price for, that's more criminal that someone pirating software.
Leo, Please tell us you feel the same way about big tech pirating our computers without permission and compensation.
How about their forced non opt out EULA's , or perhaps their changing of the definition of "purchase"
Could you please do a video chastising them on their thievery and morality !!!
"Piracy" is copyright infringement. Copyright infringment is *not* stealing. Therefore, piracy is *not* theft. That said, while there are reasons *not* to use some software (cost being one), there are usually equally good if not better software alternatives out there licensed to protect your rights, which can often be legally obtained for free anyway, so pirating software is still not a very good idea. At the very least, you don't know what kind of malware is tagging along in the package.
For the other side of the story, look at Finale music notation software. This has been an industry standard for over 30 years, and they recently decided to end development and support for their many users who purchased their software - this was not a subscription. At the time they were going to maintain their authorization servers for only one year after the announcement. After that, long-term licensed users would no longer be able to install their software on new or upgraded machines. If I were a Finale user I would have to install it in a virtual machine to keep it running when hardware is upgraded.
I have purchased (not a subscription) several packages that will only work if they can, at unknown (to me) intervals, contact an authorization server via the internet.
If piracy is wrong then so are these other practices.
All of the software on my machines is properly licensed.
I have paid thousands of dollars over 30 years for hundreds of programs that no longer work. You want customers to buy a product? Ensure it continues to exist like a good.
The crimes of the corporations are infinitely greater than piracy. Why focus on the insignificant instead of calling out the atrocities of the corporations and the rich.
Not the rich. The government and its monopolies.
Leo, I respect the knowledge and work you do for the greater software and IT community, but I have to strongly disagree with the point of the video. The "Theft is still theft" argument quickly falls apart when megacorporations like Microsoft and Google waste two dollars chasing ineffective anti-piracy methods and lobbying politicians to kill competition for every one dollar they could use to solve this problem outright. It is also simply not the same situation as a physical object (like the car) being taken away from a person and depriving them of the ability to use it; no material value is lost. There's a greater argument for the value of intellectual property, but it's frankly very difficult for me to muster sympathy when these companies have decades of experience throwing their legal weight around to abuse legal, legitimate use cases and destroy fair and legal consumer protections for those exact same products. "Wrong is still wrong," but there's a difference of substance between "illegal" because corporations said so and putting actual harm out into the world. I disagree, but thank you for your opinion.
So to coin another common phrase then, two wrongs DO make a right?
Sorry, but your arguments are fundamentally flawed in a number of areas.
@@davidf6326 No. I do believe people (and companies) have a right to make money off the products they make. I don't think that right is absolute. There's a lot of nuances that simply do not factor into a dogmatic, black and white viewpoint on this and there's only so much you can fit into a youtube comment. What about defunct companies or abandonware? Emulation of software that you own a legal (even hard) copy of? Fair use of material from software for things like educational or research purposes that companies like this actively fight tooth and nail. What I am arguing is that there is such a thing as a difference in degrees, please try to see the world in more than two colors.
From someone in Kashmir or other such improverished countries, unless you have connections with the ruling wealthy class, the only way you can get ahead is either by crime or corruption. Reference the book "Why Nations Fail" by Daron Acemoglu and James A. Robinson.
If I take a picture of Mona Lisa, did I steal it?
How did you take a picture without paying for a ticket to the museum? If you paid for the ticket, then you didn't steal anything, right?
Maybe not with the Mona Lisa, but with more modern works, quite possibly. It's called copyright.
@@azrobbins01, I Google "Mona Lisa" and voila: I have a free 4K copy. I don't even have to get up from my bed
@@davidf6326 Yes, and no law anywhere equates 'copyright infringement' to 'theft'.
@@DEVAEGIR I don't recall mentioning any legal correlation. However, from a moral standpoint you could argue that copyright infringement is theft of intellectual property.
About 25 years ago, I used cracked software. I wasn't proud of it. But, once I was able to afford them, I bought all of my software and felt good about it. I liked that I was rewarding the developers for their efforts. And then, they started going to the subscription model with no owner alternatives available, and the cost went up. That spelled corporate greed. Unfortunately, the alternatives are sorely lacking. So, while I didn't go back to using cracked software, I just kept using the older versions. And, now that same company is trying to force us to buy the expensive subs, even if they have to break into our machines and disable the old versions.
Such Nuance opinions work in 1st world countries and not in 3rd world countries.
When their skeleton system are not grown fully due to impoverishment, discussing about nuance of whether pirating softwares is right or wrong is not at all wise
Also not all software have their free alternative and even those free alternatives may not be used in their job due to monopoly of big giant's softwares.
Bill Gates prides himself as being highly altruistic.
He could make his software available to the severely poverty stricken with the wave of his hand.
He has helped the needy, in foreign countries. I would think that offering Windows and Office to such needy people would be an easy project for him to accomplish.
Hello! Bill Gates left Microsoft completely in 2020, having resigned as CEO ten years prior - funnily enough, to concentrate on those very altruistic activities that you mention.
His current shareholding is little more than 1%. While that no doubt contributes to his considerable wealth, it almost certainly means he has very little influence towards giving away 'his' software.
@@davidf6326 What prevented Bill Gates from doing so in 2020, 2019, 2018, etc?
I imagine that he has enough influence, today, to make it happen.
How about Satya Nadella? What is holding him back?
@@NoEgg4u We weren't talking about Satya Nadella.
Incidentally, have you thought of it this way? Had everyone pirated Microsoft software, Bill Gates would never have made the money to fund his current altruistic work; nor to progress Microsoft, for that matter.
Pirating is not theft if buying is not owning
By what twisted logic do you arrive at that conclusion?
@davidf6326 You can only steal something that you can have. I can't have a game or other software nowadays, you only pay for a license for using that software. We don't own almost anything. In that case, the software itself is not for sale, so technically the pirates aren't stealing. Plus, we are talking about something that is not scarce, because pirating software does not result in deprivation of access. If I steal your car, you won't be able to drive to work, but if I pirate your software, you still have your copy of it.
So you should steal a car, if the only alternative was to rent it?
@@GrandadTinkererWe're talking about non-scarce things here.
Yeah I mean the lack of awareness to make this argument without pointing out that "buying" games and any other digital product when I don't actually own them. And making single player games online only.
I mean it's not theft. Theft is a different crime from piracy. It is facile too suggest they are the same. You can stay it's still criminal. But it's not theft. There are different laws in the books for piracy and with good reason. And it's especially Rich coming from a company like Microsoft that it's act "buy" this game but if you read the fine print we're allowed to take it away from you anytime we want. And they're allowed to literally conveniently borrow all of the work of everyone that's ever used or written anything on the internet to fund their dreadful co-pilot thing which is now causing a 32% increase in CO2 emissions.
3:33
*YOU WOULDN"t DOWNLOAD A CAR*
If I could, I would!😜
Oh we're sorry but that $ 5.00 tail light won't work because data to run it is propitiatory and only they, the car company can re install it for $575.00.
If for whatever reason the FOSS alternatives won’t work, I would suggest using the time it took to copy hundreds of disks and writing a grant for a foundation or college to sponsor access to the legitimate software. That will also connect all those people with an educational institution, opening more opportunities to them.
Theft is taking something from somebody, and then "somebody" does not have the item any more ! Get your linguistics right Leo! You are more intelligent than calling piracy theft, although we can agree that it is immoral but stealing and theft it's not !
This subject apart I do like your stuff. :-))
Sorry, but in the context, that's semantics or legal speak (or both). In common parlance taking something and not paying for it is theft. In fact, I'm not altogether sure that digital piracy isn't considered theft in some countries' legal systems.
This is a small and narrow minded vision. If I pirate a software from a company that is no longer in business is it still stealing? If I buy a piece of software then I should own it not license it like all companies do these days so yea pirating does send a message.
This is absolutely ridiculous. You are calling impoverished people that are living on a couple bucks a day entitled? Lol. This is some of the most grotesque corporate apologia -- And just flat out poor shaming -- I have seen in some time.
I haven't watched the video yet, but in a generic sense, impoverished people certainly can (and do) act in an entitled manner. Feeling entitled to steal is often one such manifestation.
@@davidf6326 And yet at the time you'd posted this, you'd already gone out of your way to reply to almost every other comment on the video... that you hadn't watched. Why are you even here?
@@verboselamp1053 Well if you paid such attention to my comments, you'd also note that - like the one to which your replying - they weren't reliant on having watched the video.
@@davidf6326 Not the point. I've read every one of them because I'm actually interested in the discourse and community response to Leo's opinions here. Why are you even wasting your time trawling through random youtube comments if you have no interest in the content?
@@verboselamp1053 Because - and I thought this was blatantly obvious - I'm interested as to why so many people seem to think software piracy is perfectly acceptable and justifiable. One doesn't have to watch the video to have thoughts on the comments section.
Anyway, I've now had an opportunity to watch the video too and I agree wholeheartedly with the content. So now you have my thoughts specifically on that, as well. Incidentally, there is a very subtle, yet important difference between saying someone has the misguided belief that they are entitled to something specific (as in the video) versus accusing someone of acting in an entitled fashion (which wasn't even suggested in the video, yet appears to be your bone of contention in your original comment).
If buying isn't owning, piracy isn't stealing. I do get the reselling of pirated software/content is not a good thing.
Some people innocently buy hardware with OS and Apps that are not genuine or original. The end consumer isn't aware of this and only comes to know of it during a situation and by that time he has already paid for what he had budgeted and is trapped. This happens a lot in third world countries where PCs are bought from grey markets and sold to customers. There has to be regulations and education on this to protect consumers.
Congratulations on reaching 100 000 subscribers.
For older hardware a linux distro with all the included software, would probably be a much better option than a pirated copy of the latest microsoft offerings, given the much lower hardware requirements to use said software.
Ah, the self-righteousness of the privileged.
One of the core issues of advocating for FOSS is that it is predicated on selling support. People who cannot afford one off costs for software are not going to have money for a service contract. Depending on the on the state of the project, FOSS may not even be usable without support or the community may be unhelpful or worse, obnoxious (being told to RTFM wasn't unusual back in the 2000's newsgroups). I'll admit plenty of FOSS works just fine out of the box, but whether or not it meets the needs of the individual is another matter.
I personally rarely pay for software however I don't use pirated versions simply because I don't want the drama that can come with them such as back doors and other types of malware. I do however torrent videos quite often and it doesn't bother me in the least.
Well then I guess you're happy being a thief.
@@JamesHutton-l7s Research about digital security, be not afraid of the bad people out there. There are a lot of intelligent people sharing knowledge and content online. When you have learned enough, you will see that the bad actors can't hurt you anymore and you're free from the greed of the corporations as well.
@@davidf6326Doesn't bother me in the least if some overpaid actors lose a few bucks. And you shouldn't worry about what I do-worry about what you do.
Hmmm yes let me spend 7500$ PER YEAR for a license to a 1998 program that is somehow still industry standard and am expected to know how to use.
Not everything has free alternatives.
Using an open source alternative is just not going to get these people any chances of herring a job because all the employers use the payed software so learning the open source stuff just won’t cut it
II have been using Linux and free office for years and they are fine...
If these poor people in India are using some old computers, how could the latest software you pirated work on old machines?
Great advice and a sensible content as always Leo❤
i use several different softwares but all are legal....office 365, ccleaner, system mechanic ult ed, mediahuman,iobit malware fighter, acronis true image, bitwarden, nero, launchbox just to name a few
Years ago I had a coworker who went on a missionary trip. He pirated software to use on this trip. I found it ironic that he was stealing to spread the 10 commandments; which teaches not to steal!!!
Sometimes there’s a distribution problem like when certain companies (such as Nintendo) ban use use of emulated games and not even making the games available through more official means to prevent the need for possible copyright infringement.
If the software is subscription-model based, I’m not interested in using it unless it actually values user privacy. Otherwise it should be free with optional support for donations or a one-time payment.
Not all software, or even operating systems, cost money. If you don't have the money for Windows and whatever expensive third-party applications people tend to run on it these days, there are alternatives out there.
Also, not all software takes away your rights through restrictive proprietary licensing. If you want the software to be licensed in such a way that it gives all of the rights back to you in such a way that you "own" in in a sense, there are licenses that will do that.
Specifically, look for software that is released under a free and open source license. The GPL and the BSD license are the most common. Usually this software is not only free in cost, but is also licensed to respect your freedom. If you want your entire operating system to respect your freedoms, there are plenty of Linux distributions and BSDs to use. And nearly every single one of them (certainly all the ones that matter) are free.
If "Pirated software" is theft from the manufacture's perspective, then what do you call it when the software that I paid cash for 5 years ago suddenly does not work anymore because the manufacturer (that I paid the money to) suddenly will not activate my software over their server because they "decide" they do not support my version any longer and demand that I pony up more money to continue to use the software I paid dearly for 5 years ago? I can understand paying for the newest version of their software, but I consider they are stealing from me when they will not let me continue to use their software that I paid for initially 5 years ago.
Sadly it probably means you didn't "buy" the software, but rather "licensed" it. That's a whole 'nother mess that is frustrating for many reasons.
@@askleonotenboom Only relevant for more recent software. Some of us (including you, I believe) are old enough to remember (and dearly love) things that were made before licencing was a thing.
I think you'll find that the poor 'do' pirate software, as with many others who aren't poor.
When pirating software you are not subtracting something from someone but doing a copy. It is different from theft. You are in reality doing a copyright infringement
'doing a copyright infringement' - and that, my friend, is theft.
Copyright holders frequently refer to copyright infringement as theft, although such misuse has been rejected by legislatures and courts.[4] In copyright law, infringement does not refer to theft of physical objects that take away the owner's possession, but an instance where a person exercises one of the exclusive rights of the copyright holder without authorization.[5] Courts have distinguished between copyright infringement and theft.[4] For instance, the United States Supreme Court held in Dowling v. United States (1985) that bootleg phonorecords did not constitute stolen property. Instead,
"interference with copyright does not easily equate with theft, conversion, or fraud. The Copyright Act even employs a separate term of art to define one who misappropriates a copyright: '[...] an infringer of the copyright.'"
[4] Poon, Christopher. "'You wouldn't steal a car,' but I'd download one | Dot Comrade | Pique Newsmagazine | Whistler, CANADA". Pique Newsmagazine. Archived from the original on July 29, 2017. Retrieved July 6, 2017.
[5] Gault, Matthew (August 2, 2022). "Widely Mocked Anti-Piracy Ads Made People Pirate More, Study Finds". Vice. Archived from the original on August 15, 2022. Retrieved August 20, 2022.
@@davidf6326 No, friend, it is not. While it is an illegal act, it is not theft. And no laws anywhere equate the two.
@@DEVAEGIR Again, I never said anything about legality - morally, it is theft.
It is an interesting question, isn't it? And yes, I see both your points. The second is debatable on several grounds, and is a practical, rather than an ethical issue.
So, on with the first, since this is touching on the ethical (and moral?) aspect. In isolation, it makes total sense. Theft is theft. However, in the world we live in, in a large part shaped by big companies (like Microsoft), arguments do not work 'in isolation' any more. What if we consider, that people in the poorest countries in the world are specifically targeted by corporations (including tech giants) as not just cheap, but virtually slave labour, from tea pickers for Lipton, to children mining for metals for the construction of microchips, to the kids that spend their day gathering crystal shards for the new-age techy to wear as a bracelet (and so on, and so forth). Most of them don't reach $200 per month, but are paid much, much less. And it is not just a random stroke of chance (or lack thereof); corporations like these specifically go there, not because labour is *relatively* cheaper (that is, cheaper, but with all the necessary protections), but because it is virtually free, and for that non-price you get the benefits of almost total exploitation. Not to mention that it is almost impossible to escape it for people like this, because such corporations are particularly interested for these workers to remain as deprived as possible, so that they continue to be exploited, and thy lobby (or strongarm) local and international authorities accordingly. So, it could very easily be argued that this is not just a case of Robin Hood stealing from a random wealthy merchant, is it? Nor is it just numbers. Context matters.
Beyond that, even from a legal point of view, a crime is not always a crime. There are gradations. There are non-crimes. There is murder, but there is manslaughter, and there is also self-defence (among other). So, in a legal sense, murder is not always murder. There is r**e, and then there is "non-r**e": how many perpetrators walked because of the shameful (and moralistic) argument that the victim was promiscuous, and hence, supposedly complicit?). So, in this sense, theft is not always theft. In the real world, it really depends on who the perpetrator is, and how much lobbying power they have.
P.S. And no, I am not anti-capitalist at all, nor am I of the so-called snowflake generation. I just don't like oversimplifications, legal or moral.
If your company has site license for microsoft office , talk to IT dept . They may already have home download agreement or can add one real cheap , which allows employees to download or get cd from microsoft for about 10 to 20 bucks to have your own legal copy of office or other microsft products
You are highly educated but you havent got a job ifrom your field after you graduaded. You are unemployed or you are working with the minimum wage. You will get an job offering, but you have to know how to use a certain software. Annual price for that software is 3000USD.
Some times, the free alternative is not an option.
And many companies require that you have the skills to use microsoft office. In couple of cases I didnt get the job, because I said I can use the Libreoffice, but I havent used the microsoft office.
Some times, the free alternative is not an option.
If piracy bothers you don’t do it. But there’s a market for it. One who pirates never looked at alternative to buying that product. Even if they have the money.
they sell it to companies, they make their money out of companies, not individuals.. because if that didn't hold true they wouldn't be making budget out of software.
I don't pay for much software because so many programs I rely on are free. Many of those free programs I use replace programs I paid for in the past. The free replacements are mostly just as good or even better in a few cases.
This is where you are incorrect. Piracy is copyright infringement not theft. If you read the DMCA. Theft is me taking an item and depriving you of that item. So If I copied a song off your hard drive I didn't steal it as you still have the file with you. Please stop spreading misinformation.
Something tells me this guy doesn't think poor people are entitled to health care either... This is the kind of greed and callousness America often encourages.
this one was a bad take
Arguing back and forth about how bad the symptoms are is pointless. The problem isn't piracy, it's poverty. The system is rigged so badly that people in poverty feel it is necessary to resort to illegal activities to get out of poverty, only to join the corrupt system that hold people down in poverty in the first place. Not everyone is entitled to a copy of MS Office. Everyone IS entitled to not starve to death or die from simple diseases that have commonplace cures. But sure, go ahead and argue whether piracy is justified, because that's going to make a difference.
My respect for you just went up a thousand percent. I face the same issue with people getting upset when I refuse to install illegal copies of Windows or other pirated software. Many don’t understand the value of intellectual property or the time and money it takes to develop software. I once used an IDE that cost thousands to license, and I could only justify the expense because I knew I could recover the cost through the software I created. As you said, what gives someone else the right to just use the software I spent sometimes weeks or months of long hours, cold pizza and energy drinks developing without compensating me.
FOSS!
This planet belongs to everyone. I disagree with the lines we draw on the map and a single person owning more resources than they possibly need.
So if you have more land than your neighbor, you would just let them take some of yours?
How very John Lennon of you.
@@azrobbins01 Yeah, or you know. Humans shouldn't claim ownership of the earth at all. It actually used to be free to live on this planet.
@@legoyodascream Can you imagine? No one would be allowed to build anything since they don't own the land. No more homes, or grocery stores or farmland. You can't even plant your own garden for food.
Have you actually thought this through?
@@azrobbins01 If that is your conclusion to what I said, then you haven't thought it through.
i am using only office instead of ms office
yes you can do it with torrents you just need to use a vpn for that but that could lead to malware so dont do it if you wanna be safe i dont do it i only pirate metal music and movies only but not software to riskey
I agree wrong still wrong, as long there's alternative equivalent solutions,
I definitely agree with this being no longer necessary. Between Linux, Libre Office Suite, Blender/Bforartists, whatever free autocad alternatives there are that are actually AutoCad.
Heck, even Adobe is seeing people switch to free alternatives after their ToS shitstorm. There are many free alternatives out there that will take away from the likes of Adobe and Autodesk in the future as well.
Thank you, Leo. A firm, yet compassionate answer, with an intelligent, understandable, explanation of your views. You are so refreshing, young man!
Really..??
A lot of pirated software is very corrupt. It could end up doing more damage than good.
Don't pirate software to use it in a company. That's bad. At home, chances are, nobody will come knocking on your door. In some countries they might, but I don't know.
If you like the software, try and buy it, even when you use it privately.
It highly depends.
Password sharing and piracy are contributing factors that make products and services that other people do pay for more expensive for those people.
In a perfect world, nobody would share passwords or pirate software. But if you think the asking price would be reduced, YOU'RE DREAMING!
Most computers/all come with an OS. I upgraded to Windows 10 for free. I got a MS Office for $9.95 from my employer. Now since I have moved to Linux and FOSS software and am not looking back. Most foreign countries such as Germany are moving away from Windows and all it's chicanery and maybe is time most of us do also. Window 10 EOL is in just under a year and most of us all have computers that will not run Windows 11. Brother Leo I ask you start giving instruction on Linux, I will thank you.
I just use software at my job to do my school work. I greatly dislike my accounting class and I wasn't about to buy XL with my own money.
Tesco makes billions of pounds. So, does that make it ok to steal your shopping because you are a bit skint?
What about the rich? Lol
India has a democratic government if their people are poor it is up to the government to rectify this.