Understanding The Immigrant Song
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- Опубликовано: 24 июл 2024
- When you come from the land of the ice and snow, you're gonna need some good battle music, and one of the best out there is Led Zeppelin's The Immigrant Song. It's short, sweet, and heavy, but it manages to mix in a lot of really cool compositional techniques with its viking imagery. It's one of my favorite Zeppelin tunes, and it contains some hidden easter eggs that seem almost designed to confuse theorists like me, which is why this video is literally four times longer than the actual song. There's a lot to talk about!
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Script: docs.google.com/document/d/1K...
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Also, thanks to Jareth Arnold and Jade Tan-Holmes for proofreading the script to make sure this all makes sense hopefully!
Some additional thoughts:
1) On the bass run thing, yes, I am aware that sometimes artists just do things 'cause they sound good, and there's not necessarily a specific motivation to them. But when they do that, usually they wind up doing fairly predictable things because what sounds good to us is heavily influenced by the other music we listen to, so even if the artist doesn't know why they're doing something, you can still explain the decision structurally. My point here is that I can't find a way to do that: If they were just "playing what sounded good", they'd most likely have just played a B under the B chord and then moved to C on the downbeat, so the fact that they intentionally didn't do that means that, for some reason, that sounded worse to them than doing it this way. What I'm struggling to ascertain is _why_ it sounded worse to them.
2) If I'm being honest, I think this song is better notated in cut time 'cause most of the patterns repeat in two-beat chunks, but I didn't want to get into that in the video and the backbeat explanation is a little easier to get if you're using 4/4 so I went with that. But if I was just trying to transcribe it, 2/2 is the time signature I'd use.
3) If you wanted to, you could probably analyze the chorus in F# dorian as well, in which case the C major is borrowed from locrian. Same basic explanation, just a different reference point.
4) Some folks are saying that apparently some "official" transcription out there has the last note of the riff as an E instead of an F#. I encountered that transcription (or some variation of it) while researching this video, but playing it along with the track felt incorrect. To be sure, though, I ran the same isolation process on a random bar of the riff, and it's definitely playing an F# there, at least in that one bar. It's Zeppelin, so it's very possible they slipped an E in there occasionally to mess with me, but I think generally incorporating other notes, even in passing, would really disrupt the drum-pattern feel of the riff so in addition to not matching what I hear when I listen to it, it would make very little compositional sense.
5) On that note, some folks are also saying that the C9 at the end is incorrect, and that Page is actually playing a weird voicing of a G minor. This one I think is actually probably correct, as it comes from interviews with Page himself. I'm not convinced I got the name wrong, though: From an analytical perspective, the full "chord" is a combination of all notes sounded simultaneously, in this case counting both the bass and the guitar, so while it's true that if you isolate the guitar part it's a G minor, I think once you factor in the bass, which is playing a C, the full voicing is still probably best read as C9 voiced without a 3rd, which admittedly reduces its dominant, directional power significantly, but I still think that C9(no 3) is the most accurate name for the full collection of notes. You could also call it Gmi/C, but that doesn't really convey the dissonance of it as well, and I'm personally not a huge fan of using inversion notation for notes outside the chord.
While we're on that, could you please quickly explain the difference between 2/2 and cut time, if there's any? Same thing goes for 4/4 and common time? Why do these weird C times exist???
@@vitormelomedeiros 2/2, 'alla breve' IS cut time. It's more of a polka feel, uhm-tsa-uhm-tsa, rather than the "four on the flour". The difference with 4/4 is an arrangement of strong beats, to underline the shape of the overall pulse.
Torilovem Interwebs Cut time is just a quicker way to refer to 2/2, common time is just another way to refer to 4/4.
@@mentalitydesignvideo Thanks for the explanation! I think I get it now.
About the c in the B chord... My opinion is that maybe instead of an anticipation it's just a way to keep musical interests. I mean, which sounds more interesting: a b note in a B chord or a c note in a B chord?
Not a drummer, but I suggest calling the hi-hat thing a splooshy wooshy.
I'm a guitarist. I agree with this notion.
I agree with this.
As a drummer, I support this
Mister Apple i am a drummer, and i agree
This name is so much better than its technical name. A hihat bark.
I've always called those a "hi-hat choke".
Choke was definitely the first word to come to mind for me, too
Choke is how I've always heard it referred also.
Choke is best thing I would call it
I believe it's called a bark
Pea soup is what I called it when I wanted the drummer to do that.
Mystery solved: it’s because a song about Vikings needs the C (sea)
ruclips.net/video/tUGCQXLq9wk/видео.html
This comment could have been pure gold
Sick Boy is onto something...It is most likely something along those lines, something fleeting between Page and Jones, ..a joke?...an accident the first time then made deliberate? That's certainly a possible move between people so tight and personal. But because it's probably inside something no one but those involved can know, I'd rather just enjoy a bit of mystery...which, by the way, is what Jimmy always wanted anyway.
Lol
HAR HAR !
The mysterious C note IS the immigrant.
the real immigrant was the friends we made along the way
Lesson learned: John Paul Jones doesn’t make mistakes
(except for the solo in Trampled Under Foot)
The only mistake was dying.
@@brettnicholson1540 I'm pretty sure JPJ ain't dead.
Bonham the drummer is moved on, Jones the bass player is still around.
@@brettnicholson1540 Guess he hasnt made that mistake yet.
Number one reason as to why it's not a mistake in the bass: It's John Paul Jones.
Thanks dad! Honestly lost it 😂
That was literally exactly my first thought when he said that. And I'm not even a bass player.
Well, JPJ actually did make mistakes. One of his most known mistakes is at the end of the guitar solo in Good Times Bad Times. The band goes into the chorus, but JPJ continues to briefly play the bass line to the solo. Since the solo is in E, and the chorus in A, you're unlikely to notice it unless you're a bass player learning the song by ear.
I'm a drummer and I've always heard the high hat technique being called a high hat "bark"
Also, a 'choke'--sort of ...
When i marched cymbals, we called them Splash Hats because they sounded like splash cymbal hits. Also, Splash Hat sounds fun.
I call it that, or a rasp.
I always heard it referred to as a bark also
Scrolled down to say bark
C'mon let's be honest. Drummers don't name shit. They just do it. source: bass player
They just like to make a lot of noise
@@samcrawford7516 it doesn't seem like he's talking shit. He's just saying Drummers just do cool shit without feeling the NEED to name the cool shit
@@samcrawford7516 Sam was your family killed by a bassist?
I'd make a bass player joke but that's kinda right
@@OlanKenny Well.. I'm talking a little shit :-) That's because drummers and bass players do that. We do have common ground though... we talk shit about lead guitar players together. Especially when they're fiddling around with their pedal farms. :-P
I cant believe you said "hammer" and didnt draw a Mjolnir.
...Whoops.
mjølner
ᛉᛁᛅᛚᛀᛁᛦ
@@SylviusTheMad It seems all of Norse history is in runes....
@@FarrellMcGovern
Meat smacker
I really wish that the music industry would allow the use of the original tracks of music for this type of video without claiming it.
I wish fair use was easier for algorithms to detect. This would absolutely count as both educational and scholarly fair use. And using the original would enhance at least the part of this analyzing that C; I'd love to hear the low pass filtered 50% speed play, and that wouldn't just be entertaining: it would be like citing his sources.
@@anthonywestbrook2155 it seems ridiculous that copyright law would be a problem for a video like this that will probably make much less than $50 for the maker from any advertising, and is mostly his talking and drawing for educational use.
Rick Beato often has this problem
@Know One Labels usually have more power than artists when those contracts are signed :/
I don't understand why they don't, it's free advertising
The one note is the immagrant - a foreigner that no one would notice until examined.
Hah. Good one
Won't someone build a wall to keep out those immigrant notes. They're ruining everything.
@@ohyeah6729 👍
Oh Yeah? Well the note isn’t an illegal and a financial burden.
immigrant
12tone: *exists*
C: “im about to end this mans whole career”
John Paul Jones was, in the 1960's, considered to be an excellent arranger in the studio. It was his calling card and why he was hired for many sessions. I doubt hightly that C anticipation was an accident or that it servred no purpose. I bet if JPJ could be asked he would remember why he and Jimmy did it. I don't have any contacts (and JPJ is somewhat reclusive) but if he is contacted is usually happy to answer serious questions about the music.
From previous interviews regarding the same sort of thing Zeppelin did in other songs. They basically wanted to craft songs that others could not cover unless the band had the musicianship approaching that of Page and JPJ
@@glenchapman3899 On the "Whole Lotta Love" riff, Page doubles the 5th string/5th fret D note with the open D string and slightly bends the 5th string out of unison to give it a little bit of a chorus effect. This went pretty much unnoticed by transcribers until Page revealed the trick in an early 90s Guitar World interview.
LOL - yes and there are whole articles out there of what they did to Black Dog so scrubbers like me could never sound like we knew what we were doing :)
We must find JPJ!
@@glenchapman3899 ironic that a band accused of stealing so many songs would do something like that. It's like they have experience with that or something...
I think he just added that C to screw with people analyzing his music.
Obviously the members of Led Zepplin are talented musicions but I wonder if they analized this as deeply as you did. I can imagine them sitting aroung jamming and just saying that sounds cool.
Music theory is about why it sounds like it does, but not why it sounds good. Thank God ears do that for us.
While there's always the possibility of a song or sound simply being intuitive, don't be so sure that John Paul Jones and Jimmy Page didn't know exactly what they were doing: Both of them were experienced studio musicians and arrangers. Whether they could explain in music theory language, I don't know, but they likely could at least explain in their own words..
It might be second hand knowledge. Lets say they are playing in Lydian. They might not know that its lydian, they might not know what a mode is (unlikely, but possible). Instead, they've heard songs in lydian, like the way it sounded, copied it or at least got inspiration from it, and wrote their own song with lydian influences. They wouldn't need to know music theory directly, but they've subtly learned it from other musicians before them.
Its the same reason most metal musicians are self taught and yet still managed to play in minor scales and phrygian modes without learning them formally or intentionally learning the scales, they've learnt a minor second sounds cool with distortion.
Reverse-engineering it after the fact and assuming they engineered it that way is just silly.
It's not like they sat down and said "hey guys, let's write something in Hypophrygian, BUT...have a tritone above the tonic"
And THEN... more cowbells.
I am sure all great riffs/songs are from noodling around with the instrument. I doubt they ever think about theory at all just what sounds rights
7:08 Repetition legitimizes Repetition legitimizes Repetition legitimizes Repetition legitimizes Repetition legitimizes
Adam Neely reference? :D
@@2357y1113 Oh yeah lol
First time I heard the concept was reading an interview with Jimmy Page: "If I made a mistake on stage, I'd just repeat two or three times so everyone thought it was intentional."
"I repeat myself when under stress. I repeat myself when under stress. I repeat myself when under stress."
@@kennethdean4349 Indiscipline is the working title to my autobiography. If I could only make myself sit down and work on it. Oh well, it's not like any one would read it.
I interpret that "c" note as an anticipation of the C9 chord that shows up in the final riff. It introduces a little of the conflict that later on explodes in the ending. I'd call that note "foreshadowing" to borrow from literature.
Personally I can't really hear what he is talking about, but that being said I also came to the same sort of conclusion based on the last high note in that section. I'd be interested to know what 12tone thinks of this explanation.
I love how there's so many comments about the hi-hat thing but pretty much all the names are different. 'Choke', 'bark', 'pea soup', 'sizzle', 'wash' and 'slam' are some of them...
Hey 12tone, drummer here.
The most likely reason why the open-closed hi-hat sound doesn't have a name is because drummers in general communicate their sounds and rythms by onomatopoeia, and instead of giving names to sounds, they give names to rythmic patterns, like a four-on-the-floor or a bossa nova. That's much more useful to them than having a name for only a single sound.
So, quick drummer dictionnary:
Bass drum: kick / "tum"
Snare: snare / "ta-"
Hi-hat (closed): "ts-"
Hi-hat (open): "tsss"
Hi-hat (open-closed): "tst"
Crash cymbal: "tshhh" / "kshhh" / "pshhh"
Ride cymbal: "ting"
Tuned toms: "tom" (voiced with the pitch of the tom they are referring to)
Now you can communicate in the drummer's language!
tldr: drummer dumb only understand boom boom noise with mouth
My school had a marching band show and no joke part of it was four of our drummers talking like this for 16 measures. My favorite part.
Wow! I'm a non musician and barely understand 2% of what you are saying but I found your video extremely interesting and entertaining. I watched it three times in a row! Thank you
Usually cutting off cymbals is called a "choke". I guess the same apllies for the Hi-Hat, even though instead of using his hands, he closed it with the foot-pedal.
1) I really like that C9. There’s something satisfyingly muddy in the arrangement, like they also played whole chord on the bass or something, and it really helps give it that jarring alien sound.
2) I think that last 16th note in the main riff does have a ghost note on the snare as well.
3) It me!
I'm just hearing hats on the last 16th, but it's possible I missed something.
12tone Yeah if it’s there it’s almost not there
acapellascience you're rly cool!
Didn't JP Jones say in interview that nobody plays the riff correctly? Did you just find the reason why? All the tab is wrong? Lol
Aaron Fraley Ooh, source?
I absolutely love Zeppelin's contradiction: despite being insanely popular (to this day!), they're vastly underrated. No one really treats them as people normally do with the Beatles: virtually no one does this kind of detailed descriptions about not so known Zep tunes. That is a shame... while most musicians know the chords of "Glass Onion", almost everyone takes Zep for Stairway or plagiarism. I couldn't care less about those, their later work is much more interesting: In The Light, Achilles Last Stand, Carouselambra, In The Evening, The Rover, For Your Life, Nobody's Fault But Mine, Bron Yr Aur, Friends, Four Sticks, The Battle of Evermore.
PS: I love the Beatles and I don't care who you think it's better.
Well said sir, specially when it comes to the songs you mentioned: Achilles Last Stand is a blast of a song both in writing AND production, and always surprises me how it's rarely mentioned as one of Zep's classics. Friends is insane with Page's use of open tuning and eastern flavored scales and Bron Yr Aur, well, basically it's THE song that made me learn acoustic guitar and alternate tunings. Sure they are vastly underrated and so worthy of musical analysis as The Beatles, they were both phenomenal.
Zeppelin and the Beatles were both insanely popular, very talented, broke up before fans were ready to let them go, and lost a band member far too young. That said, I think at least part of why The Beatles are revered in a way that Led Zeppelin is not is largely because of which band member died and what it meant for the future.
When John Lennon died, anyone who still missed The Beatles had to take a double dose of grief. Once for the loss of the man, and again for the now irretrievable loss of the band. Even though the Beatles had been broken up for 10 years, Lennon's death meant they never would reunite. His loss was a death of potential as much as it was a death of a person (to people who didn't personally know him, of course) and that is always hard to get over.
Jon Bonham's death and the subsequent breakup of Led Zeppelin, while extremely tragic, is a little different from the perspective of your Average Joe fan (i.e. I am explicitly NOT talking about megafans). Fair or not, drummers are rarely (with some notable exceptions) the focus of a band from the perspective of the average fan. The face and focus of a band is usually the lead vocalist and/or the lead guitarist. Jimmy Page and Robert Plant are still quite alive, meaning there was always hope they would reunite and create something like Led Zeppelin, even if Bonham's loss meant it would never be exactly the same again. Since that has actually happened a number of times, all those traumatized Zeppelin fans got a chance at some closure that Beatles fans never had. Even if Page and Plant had never played together again, having all these years to hope they would reunite would have given Zeppelin fans more time to accept the loss.
Personally, I think the Beatles became as famous as they are for a lot of reasons- sure, they had some of the best songwriters in the world in that band, and made some incredible songs, but I think what really did it is that their career lined up so well with the progression of music technology. Sgt Pepper was recorded over a long time, and used a bunch of techniques in the studio that nobody else was really doing back then, as far as I know. The Beatles pushed what was possible in music. Led Zeppelin started a bit later and missed the chance to be at the cutting edge quite that much.
I think any attempt to compare them just turns into personal preference, and arguing about them is just wasting time you could spend listening to them
Soo you like boy bands😄😄😄😄 how cute
@@jasonadkins8894 As opposed to what, classical music? Orchestras maybe? Or are you just here to mock people's taste without any real purpose?
Exits this video to go play Immigrant Song.
It is impressive how you can sync a time lapse of illustrations with a voice-over at normal speed. This vid made me appreciate more the war-like effect Zeppelin was conveying sonically.
Absolutely love this channel. Never was one for music theory or details about what I was listening to/playing, but after religiously watching videos on this channel, my curiosity for music theory is at an all time high
Your channel and its idea is BEYOND pure gold. You explain so well, that you made me think I can still be a musician after trying and losing hope!
The third choice for the high hat is called the openy closey
😄😄😄
Lucky Luis 🤣
As a drummer, my drum teacher always referred to the hi-hat technique as a "sizzle."
In drum corps, I believe the cymbals call this a sizzle as well.
Is your drum teacher Snoop Dogg?
Semi-drummer, but I've always heard "sizzle" to mean a slightly-opened hi-hat (so the cymbals rattle and "sizzle" against each other).
Wait ... the sizzle has always been referred to a ride cymbal with rivets.
@@bitodd I thought sizzlers were cymbles with rivits in them. Sounds like a squash to me.
I am not a musician, I don't understand a single thing about this video, but I am immensely entertained!
Loved the analysis on the bass run, I've always loved that part. Nice work!!
Bro... I'm about to nerd out harder than you on the Bass part - listen close and also compare with a few live performances. You're right about ending the B Maj scale on a C - but there's a bit more to it than that.
He plays a different scale each time. First is A mixolydian, then A Major, B Major, B Major ending on C, C Major twice, then C, D, E, F, G, A, A#, B, C for the last scale. The rising one-note higher change from one scale to the next is what gives that eeiry sense of build up.
Additionally, after the full stop at :50, when the drums reenter, Bonham hits a cymbal on the down beat of 1, as well as a 16th note off-beat on the "e" of 2 in the first measure, to play off Jimmy's iconic guitar riff - on the 16th note that Page ISN'T playing in that part of the riff. Check the beautiful decay on the cymbals too - sounds like it was recorded faster and the tape slowed down. This also foreshadows the rhythm of the final vocal Plant sings on the "ooooo oooo oooo" outro. Either they telepathically played off eachother so magically well, or did much of the original recording live and immediately listened and responded to each others ideas in small, subtle ways that enhance the song without boiling over the surface.
Dude I hope buddy responds, that was a worthy comment :)
So JPJ was building a literal wave of music to come crashing down on the shore. Vikings!
@@PeterTea pretty much that!
I think there's always a ghost note on the e of 2. I think i can hear the drums just playing the guitar rhythm between the bass and snare.
Nerd! 😐
I never played the bass on this song before but I just tried out the two versions of the scale runs and the one with the c at the end strongly feels to me like the correct one. I am incredibly familiar with the song after listening to it for years so I might be biaised, but still, I think it's a fairly important detail and you can most definitely hear it.
Now for what I think of it in terms of analysis, I would agree that it is an anticipation, but would like to elaborate. To me another purpose of that note is to break up the melody of the bass line, because he just played the full A major scale straight from begining to end twice and is starting to follow the same pattern with B, and us being so familiar with the major scale, there is no way we could predict that the last note of the bar, after a major seventh, would not be the root but instead a note that is not even in the scale. I'm sure that had it been slower it would have been quite jarring actually. So yeah, to me it is definitely a rythmic device (i.e. an anticipation), but I think that's how it works and why it's so effective.
Anyway that was a great video, I absolutely love your song analysis(es?), especially the deceptively simple ones like this one. I hope you do a lot more :)
Agreed, I think he's just adding a bit of extra tension & development by augmenting that final octave. In another comment, I mentioned that makes sense if you think of it like voice leading, with the "octave" voice leading A A B C into the C chord.
this is probably my favourite analysis of yours. i never realised quite how interesting this song is, but you've done a fantastic job with this one. thank you and well done :)
Absolutely spectacular work man fantastic video love the channel
Another thing about the baseline that I thought was really cool, when Jonesey is playing those fast scales through the A B & C chords... On the very last ascending run on the C chord, he adds a major 7 note to the scale So that each beat will have a Note right before the band abruptly stops on that last C chord....I always thought that was very clever of him to do
Hey 12tone, drummer here. Just wanted to say that most transcriptions of the drum part do play the final sixteenth note of "the riff" on the snare, but it's usually a pseudo-ghost note.
This is AMAZING for me. THANK YOU! I'm primarily a Bassist and that run JPJ does on the scales has always confused me. My ears have told me one thing and MANY Bass tabs have told me another. This finally explains it. Thank You for this!
Growing up, my grandfather introduced me to Zeppelin and this song. It's really cool hearing your breakdown of how it all works together!
I've heard for the high hat "Hat Choking" and "Hat Clap" though both are slightly different things from my experience with different sounds.
I don't know that I would have noticed that C anticipation in the bass if you hadn't pointed it out, but now that you did I do notice it, and I wonder if I'd subconsciously heard it before. Now that I'm aware of it, I feel like it adds even a little more momentum to what's already a really driven sound, which matches nicely with the lyrics in that section: "On we sweep with, with threshing oar, Our only goal will be the western shore." It's like it takes the vikings' motivation and ratchets it up a little more, as if to say that no matter how hard they're striving, they're always going to strive even a little harder because the gods are pushing them to move.
"Just because it's simple, doesn't mean it's easy and it doesn't mean it doesn't sound great".
Best line I've heard this year about music
You are absolutely amazing at what you do. I couldn't be more impressed with the knowledge bomb you just dropped. Keep em coming!
I'm sad you didn't comment the weird white noise "stairs" in the opening
I'm pretty sure I know what that is. In the old days of recording the pots on old processers clicked when they were turned rather than being smooth like nowadays. So in the beginning of the song there is a little white noise in the background of one of the tracks and you can hear the producer turning the volume pot up on the processor. This could have been completely by accident or they could have used it as a creative effect. I'm pretty sure that's what it is but I could be wrong.
Zantrop64 That is the sound of old-school analog mixers having channels (or pairs of channels) being sequentially un-muted by the engineer(s) instead of a master fade-in. You’re hearing each tape channel’s hiss being layered on top as it is opened up. Modern digital mixing is automated (and usually less hissy in the first place), so you can go from dead silence in to full blast without ramping/fading up.
I always thought that was Page un- muting the tracks....
Both explanations are interesting, I love how this really quiet thing defines the song. A cover without this sounds pretty blank to me
You can hear him re muting them before the beginning of Friends
Another weird note is at the end of the chorus. After the pause, if you isolate the guitar, the one sixteenth note played is actually a C. But I think it's an A on bass.
Awesome! Very probably my first favorite Zeppelin song. That note giving you nightmares is also very probably what they were trying to do. Blackmore riffs give me nightmares...and I love em.
This analysis is so really good. I melted with nerdness thank you so much
Obligatory “Viking Kittens” reference...
i have always heard it referred to as a "sizzle" on the hi-hat.
Yup, or "choke"
I received a bass a few weeks ago and wanted to learn this song
So I searched up an analysis and of course there was a video of yours, thank you for the very instructive and helpful content!
Brilliant video. Great depth and explanation. Liked subscribed and looking forward to more of your content
The hi-hat technique has several names depending on which part of your foot you use (heel or toe) and how long the hat stays open before being closed. So in short there is no easy answer but if you called it a hi-hat splash or hi-hat bark either would have been acceptable. Then again this is the internet so I'm certain someone would complain or try and correct you.
Great video. Do you think you could have a look at 'God only knows' by the Beach Boys next? Everything about that song is really interesting.
if you haven't listened to the song "surf's up"... one of the beach boys' most beautiful and interesting (harmonically) songs, and one of my favorite pieces of music ever.
God Only Knows is a mess of a song with incomplete lyrics - but it works. This is why it has been voted the UK's favourite song. But why does it work?
Luke Pitts Brian Wilson: genius.
@@zhou_sei Met too. It is THE ONE, most beautiful, harmonically complex, masterpiece of vocal overdubbing and harmony. I wonder why more people are not aware of this song - maybe it's the title.
@@Will-Max i know when i first saw the name, i thought it was gonna be another surf pop top 40 hit style song, with the lead sung by mike love... boy was i way off base...
Duuuude
I just started this video randomly popping on my RUclips
I love the drawings, the concept of your videos, keep on!
Super impressive analysis and interesting to watch even for someone without your deep musical background. Well done!
On that bass line shift to the C instead of B... just guessing of course, but seems likely to me that the riff would have started out as straight scales matching each chord. From that starting point, perhaps JPJ listened to how it was tracking and figured the transition into the C - which is a pretty jarring one - felt a bit too rough, and decided to try anticipating the shift by a 16th just to take the sting out of it?
Also possible that it may have initially happened by accident. It's a pretty fast run and an educated player's likely to be anticipating the next scale's notes even as they play though the one before, so maybe not an unlikely slip to make in the first place. Perhaps JPJ hit the note early by accident on one run through, and decided he liked it better that way so stuck with it thereafter?
Why did he play a C instead of a B? Uh, to support Plant's vocal?
Loved this analysis and love the animation.
Incredibly fascinating breakdown of the music. You just gained a fan.
I was hoping for a lyrical analysis and know nothing about music, but I love this. You are the Mr Wizard of music bringing the technical side of something home for the rest of us.
5:20 by the feeling of the chord progression, it seems like rather than a C it should be a B#.
I could buy that. If not this, then the C when the melody begins is definitely B#
I think the anticipatory C natural sixteenth note is more to prevent the overshooting of the bar by both guitar and bass! It is far harder to stop - exactly on a First beat if the preceding note is only a sixteenth duration. It also prevents the bass sliding into the terminal note too. Imagine if Led Zeppelin had decided that they would finish the bar with the final sixteenth note on B - and thereafter transition on the first beat of the next bar to C natural - try it - it sounds quite odd!? The lack of anticipation disturbs the natural rhythm and forces attention too much on the exactness of the sixteenth notes and (bizarrely) begins to sound quantised- a electromechanical concept not yet born - whereas anticipatory sixteenth notes keep the flow of rhythm and timing much more naturally. I don’t know John-Paul Jones personally - but it would be nice to find out the real reason behind this!? 😁👍
I almost did not view this vid being 10 minutes long. But I was intrigued none the less being that it was an Zep song & also one of my favs. You are definitely an music major & are sweet talking lad with the babes too, I bet!
I’ve had this song stuck in my head for a few weeks now, I’m not upset because I love it
9:13 that bit sounded like the windows error sound.
I've read remarks of Jimmy Page's on the C9 chord at the end: he refers to it as a G minor. Obviously Jones is playing a C beneath it, but I'm not sure there's an E note in there anywhere. Perhaps there is. (Side note: This song is vastly improved with the addition of a doo-wop vocal bass part. Try it. You'll be convinced immediately.)
Guitar Player did an article about it and found a Page-approved transcription, and according to them you're right on. Low string to high, it's G-Bb-x-Bb-D-x (3-1-x-3-3-x), with Jones playing a C.
I just learned this song on guitar and your video helped me understand it a bit better so thanks
I am sooooo glad I got sent to this channel!
Not sure what mode it would be, but you could imagine a less creative musician taking the A section in steps back to F#m, viz A /// B/// C/// D/ E/. Zep just stay on the C to give a particularly f*** you version of what an expected cadence might be; and that seems in keeping with the vocal intro AND the C9 stabs in the outro. Certainly martial in intent, like Holst's Mars and parts of Yes's Gates of Delirium, tritone-heavy.
what a complete waste of time...analyzing something to this point wile trying to "understand" the song? they played what hey did because they were in a room jamming.."hey , this is a cool riff....yeah tust play along with this...sure that sounds like its going to be really allright....AHHHHAHHHAAAAAAHHAA AAHH....oh is that what you're gonna do over this part??? sure... sounds awesome....you gotta match?....hey, can we just roll the tape? yeah...it needs something else right here....what about this?......Ok , so...when you sing 'now you better stop.." we should all maybe stop?..that would be cool.....no..?/ yes that's almost too stupid and cliche....better just keep playing right through...yeah that's better....you want a glass of wine?/...who's got a match?....so, let's just get a bit of a bed down before we forget that other part...can we roll the tape again?.... what's that line you're singing?..something about Odin's throne?? i don't know.....maybe try another line ...sure that western shore thing works better...can we roll the tape again....is that note you're going to play over that part?...no, nothing really wrong with it...it should work...at least it's not boring or predictable ...no need to fix it....ok, let's take a short break...we've been at this for almost 2 hrs now....sure sounds good so far...that's how you write a song....analysis complete....everything else is not rock and roll and complete bull.
sorry, but in my own defense, I have had a career as a professional musician (not just guitar) for several decades and have done thousands of gigs, bars, major international rock festivals with platinum selling recording artists...I don't need to tell you more about myself other than what you seem to want to do theoretically I have actually done in real life with more than an average knowledge of music /production / recording and performing. My posting was quite simply a reflection of reality as it pertains to the songwriting process I have personally witnessed in major recording studios as well as pretty much anywhere else a cohesive band is jamming and creating what sometimes are hit songs. In fact, MANY of the "classic' hit songs you might want to analyze were written by artists who A: actually do know more than 3 chords B: spent more time developing the song idea in practice than jotting down a load of irrelevant data about which beat goes where.....and finally did so without much actual knowledge of "THEORY", but rather played the stuff from the heart.Not that Theory isn't important to some, but it does NOT represent the foundation from which great music is created, it is simply an analytical tool....this is easily illustrated by the fact that even an incredibly creative influential and musically sophisticated band like YES at their outset did not have any members that wrote music or understood "theory". they created from their own musical abilities Rick Wakeman (not a founding member technically) was the only one who actually had any musical training....it's safe to say these guys probably knew/know more than 3 chords as well....you seem to be of the impression that people who don't create from something other than some mathematical formula are not "real" musicians and are therefore delegated to some form of primitive 3 chord regurgitation...nothing is further from the truth and you appear to be a student of your own ignorance. I have spent more time actually playing great music than I wanted to sit and analyze what it is that i CAN do....and seriously...I might be wrong, but I suspect that iit's unlikely that John Bonham ever had a "drum lesson" in theory apart from watching some of his peers.
GW you're not wrong about anything. I like to analyse music, but I'm a rank amateur compared to 12tone here. I was just engaging on a nerd level. If Bonham could summon The Crunge out of thin air without ever having had a musical theory lesson, that only goes to show that he was a greater musician than I can ever hope to be.
I'm no good at analyzing songs, but as a longtime blues fan, I can perhaps contribute a little to your brilliant analysis by mentioning that Plant's dissonant, tritonal "war cry" at the beginning of the song is just a blues harp line he "borrowed" from Billy Boy Arnold's 1955 "I Wish You Would". The riff occurs about halfway through the song, during a harmonica interlude. You can check it out if you like and tell me if I'm right or wrong.
Sounds like you're probably right, a fascinating discovery. How about a link right to it for everybody to check out: ruclips.net/video/f9aSRIJf3S0/видео.html
Also Plant himself plays something pretty similar in the opening harmonica riff of Bring It On Home
Maybe but it’s not like that was an iconic part of that song... plants cry happens in music a lot
@@latortugapicante719 yes, I'm not saying it's one of the key elements of the song, of course, but it's probably more than just a coincidence. Given that Jimmy Page was a member of the Yardbirds before he started Led Zeppelin, and since the Yardbirds had covered the Billy Boy Arnold hit for their debut single in 1964, it seems safe to assume that both Page and Plant were familiar with the song. Anyway, it was just my small contribution, albeit trivial...
I only knew how to play the main riff on guitar and learned the rest of the song by hearing you talk about it. Also, great analysis, so thanks a lot!!!
What a great analysis. Thank you.
0:37 Black Sabbath- Black Sabbath anyone?
I was looking for this comment and I'm not disappointed.
Rush La Villa Strangiato Please.
I would love to see that, but I am sure it would take an hour or two for the usual depth of explanation! LOL!
@@FarrellMcGovern and we would watch every secomd
@@benselectionforcasting4172 True enough!
IMHO, the anticipated C in the "bass run thing" breaks the symmetry between the A and B chords as a way to both reduce the "monotony" of doing the exact same bass run, and at the same time anticipates the change to the C in an unexpected way that gives more emphasis to the C. It is subtle, but when noticed, it really makes the motion into the C, which of course leads to the "way out" tritone motion back to F#, much more powerful. I don't know if that adds anything to what you said, but I think their choice to anticipate the C is utter genius. Thanks for another great analysis 12tone.
It's called a hi hat bark. Great video! I never thought that this simple song had so much thought put into it. And also, when you said that the drums don't play on that last note, I believe that Bonham played a grace note on the snare.
I call a pedal hi hat a 'pea soup.'
TheDruidKing tf?😂
RoastedWaffle its an onomatopoeia pea soup, heh.
@@jotamono You've just beat me to responding, while I checked my spelling ;-)
Yep, onomatopoeia. It helps if you say it quickly.
Dumb bassist joke:
How did John Paul Jones get to the gig?
He followed John Bonham!
I'll just see myself out now....lol
booking vacation ASAP to watch all your videos!
Never noticed that before. I think the anticipation of C emphasizes the C-major chord which is a tritone from F#. Perfect for this song.
haha miss steak.
So do I.... dearly ☹
Brexit intensifies
But this time they are brexiting from the scandinavians AY
@@lazergurka-smerlin6561 Norwexit!
we're taking all the proto norse influence from your language on the way out have fun speaking Latin xD
When I was a freshman in H.S. there was a senior, who sat at the berry back of the school bus everyday, and always gave the "war-cry" from this song. Every day.
Watching Them crooked vultures interview, i can tell that John Paul Johnes actually seems to be the person who can tell the reason for playing that C. He's such a gifted musician
9:01 - that you would spend 3 minutes on a single 16th note is one of the reasons I love you, 12tone. ❤
Definitely was not aware of that Bass thing that you talked about that was really cool thank you
6:54 “but I am nothing if not thorough”
And that’s why I subscribe, and probably need to get over to patreon to support you
This is fantastic. As a lefty who planned on being a cartoonist, but then sort of switched to guitar, it's like meeting some sort of weird relative from across the world.
The way you hold that pen though totally freaks me out. POV of another left-hander is something I've never seen before and wow, that looks weird.
Anyways, great stuff. You're very talented.
Great Video dude!!!
This one of my favorite songs. Thanks for revealing its secrets. 😀
I think it's worth mentioning that when the guitar plays to higher octave F# in the main riff, the bass doesn't follow suit and instead plays an open E. So you have the guitar and bass both playing the same F# and then going separate ways for that one 16th note which is pretty cool.
This first time I heard this song is something I can still remember distinctly ., . Never before had I heard such raucous driven tyranny . .. And thank you, thank you, 12Tone . . . Last year I was playing over it (on bass)for fun and stopped to question the chorus bass runs. .. . . . I started to draw your conclusion and dismissed it as a side track and moved on . . . . somebody, for Pete's sake ask JPJ, 'coz this is no accident . . this song defines the moment that Led Zeppelin appeared in my universe with a bang . . and for me, as a 15 y.o. kid, mad keen on music, things were never the same again . . . . favourite LZ song by a mile.
GREAT VIDEO!!! here's some drum slang, those hi hat thingies are usually called ''barks''
I laughed for a while after you asked someone who knows jpj to ask him about a note from 49 years ago. Great video as always man.
I would also like to point some different appreciation towards the sustained guitar parts in the verse. The kinetic motion of the guitar drops down to those sustained bits where the vocals come in and it's like it's passing the ball to the vocals to keep the motion going, staying out of their way, then catches it again as soon as the vocals stop, and honestly that is just some masterfully simple yet beautiful dynamics work.
You are so passionate about what you do that you get nightmares for haven't understood a single note, you're great.
If you ask me, that C is just an anticipation of the C on guitar, due to the extreme speediness of the bass lines (for those times it was ridiculous speediness), and that's so, It is a tool I used in old songs of old bands of mine researching this same kind of anticipation
as a queen fan I always called that drum technique "the Roger Taylor Thing" since he does it quite a lot (I am a drummer)
cool video ... and i really like the paintings ;-)
You could call that drum move (hitting the open cymbals and immediately closing them) something like "snuffing" since you're snuffing out the ringing of the cymbals.
@1:49 Hi-Hat hit open then closed is a "Choke", done on other cymbals by grabbing with hand to stop ringing.
-- Hi-Hat Hits
Closed (Accented) - Hit closed (Stick middle hits cymbal edge)
Ping (Unaccented) - Stick tip hits top of closed cymbal
Open - Hit open
Loose - Hit open hard aimed away from center so top cymbal wobbles
Choke - Hit open, then close
Bark - Hit almost closed, open to keep ringing
Cook - Hit closed, immediately hit again while opening, then close
-- Without hitting with stick
Chick (Pedal Close, Snap, Click) - Pedal to closed
Clash (Pedal Open) - Pedal to closed, immediately open to keep ringing
Foot - Closed, Pedal open must ring, then close. (Difficult to setup so releasing pedal makes sound)
- Not definitive list or even complete. Others specify whether cymbals are closed, 25%, 50%, 75%, or completely open at each hit, and define "hitting cymbal top with stick tip" as Unaccented vs normal "stick middle to edge" as Accented.
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