Cultish: Answering Claims Of Hebrew Roots, Part 1
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
- Welcome to this exciting series where Jeremiah Roberts and Andrew Soncrant dive deep into the claims of the Hebrew Roots movement.
The two are joined by husband and wife, Andrew and Nikki Schumacher who have in-depth knowledge of the diverse Hebrew Roots theology.
What do Hebrew Roots followers believe?
How can we have an answer for the many claims of the Hebrew Roots movement?
Join us for this exciting series to find out!
Be sure to like, share, and comment on this video.
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And the dragon (Satan) and most Sunday Christians were enraged with the woman and who keep the commandments of YAH and have the testimony of Yeshua Messiah. Revelation 12:17
Jesus was only a human being, Backed up by Scripture., 20 minutes unless you're too scared to learn this truth. ruclips.net/video/8EGxaO7ZeWg/видео.html
David Wilber made an excellent video correcting Andrew Schumacher with biblical honesty and clarity. Feel free to check him out if you haven't already. I figured you all would want to have a balanced approach.
Jesus is the messiah,,, We can not be saved by our works. That is clear. Paul states to watch out for those that state you must be circumcised to be saved. So now we have a Christian religion that claims we are saved by grace but has a list of made up sins that the Bible does not call sins but you must follow. Then will turn around and claim we don’t need to follow the law of God.
This video proves the religion of Christianity is a false religion.
Christmas and Easter are not biblical holidays. So why would you defend them but defame actual biblical days. Most Christian leaders are modern day Pharisees
It’s amusing them calling out the Hebrew roots movement
If you want to celebrate Christmas and Easter for cultural reasons no one should tell you otherwise. But they are not biblical
In addition if you want to go to church on Sunday or any day of the week who cares. But the doctrine of the “lords day” is completely man made and completely catholic.
While I do not categorize myself as Hebrew Roots, I am sure many would lump me in with them. I do my best to keep all of God's commands that apply to me. You can call them the laws of Moses if you like, but the reality is that they were God's commands given through Moses because the people were afraid. Moses didn't come up with any of the commands on his own. I wear tzitzit, and eat according to the commands. Kosher is not a Biblical diet, my friends. Kosher has added laws, and stuff like not eating meat and cheese together. I believe that we are saved by Yeshua's/Jesus' blood alone, but also recognize that He said we would keep His commands if we love Him. I believe He is God, and therefore gave all of the commands. I keep the feasts, and Sabbath. I do not subscribe to the number of laws being 613. There are two that branch out into ten that branch out into a multitude. It was said in the OT, do not remove your neighbor's land marker. Does it mean that I can dump trash on his property because it doesn't specifically mention that? Would that be loving your neighbor as yourself? I do not believe that any of us can be perfect in keeping the law, but in keeping the law we can be a perfect work. Grace is given for mistakes, but none will be afforded for rebellion. I do not mean to say that a rebellious person won't be given grace, but that a person living in rebellion isn't seeking repentance. I believe that we are supposed to be Israel, and not professing gentiles. Words mean things, and countless times the body is called things that refer to Israel alone. Kings and Priests. A Holy Nation. An Olive Tree. Sheep. His people. We cannot take these titles in the NT to mean something totally different than they did in the OT. Ephesians 2 tells us straight up that we WERE gentiles when we were heathens, but now we are part of Israel. Romans 11 says we are grafted into the olive tree. The phrase cut off from among your people is equivalent to branches broken off. My presupposition is that the Word of God is Truth, no matter what men teach. I didn't learn any of this through RUclips or teachers, but through the reading of the Word. Which topic do we want to explore first?
@@crazyalarmstudios2012 I think most people that do things like this are misguided. They have heard a man or woman that they respect say Yah's name is pronounced this way or that way, and that has become part of their doctrine. In trying to pronounce God's name correctly, they have failed to love their neighbor. Jesus told the Pharisees that they should tithe as they have been doing, but do not neglect the weightier matters. I believe it's Yahweh and Yeshua, but He was my help even when I called Him Jesus.
Please don't misunderstand. I do think His name is important, and we should be searching it out. I just don't think we should be dogmatic or dividing over it. Most people don't want to consider that the Messiah's name wasn't Jesus because that's what it says right there in their Bible. I want to know my Bridegroom's name though. Again, I'm not saying it's a sin to use Jesus though. To use God's name in vain would be different than mispronouncing it. Perhaps they are using His name in vain when they mix it with hatred.
@@crazyalarmstudios2012 I'm not sure where they would get that understanding from. The Word says that there will be some that come to Jesus proclaiming that they cast out demons in His name, and He doesn't call them liars. He says that they were workers of iniquity, or lawlessness and that He never knew them. This isn't about misunderstanding His name. The same verse I mentioned earlier comes to mind here, where Jesus spoke to the Pharisees.
Matthew 23:23
[23]Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
These pharisees held tithing above other things that were just as important. I would be careful about saying they have done the unpardonable sin, as we aren't the judge of that. Grace has been given to us, so we should extend that grace to them. If they have done this, they will answer for it in judgement. I'm not saying you shouldn't reprove them or caution them for their words, but if we condemn them then we may be doing the same thing they are.
@@crazyalarmstudios2012 Please understand that I am not a teacher. I didn't even graduate from school, much less a bible college. I am only answering from my own perspective as to what I clearly see in the Word of God. I'm not here to change people's mind, but to answer questions about my perspective. I started this comment because there were alot of misconceptions about people that keep God's Word from front to back. There were some extreme examples of "Hebrew Roots" given, and I would probably be classified as HR by this panel of speakers. Do not respect anything I say. Test everything to the Word of God alone. I think this is the major difference in what I believe, and what they believe. I am no respecter of persons, and I hold to the Word of God above any man's word. I am not saying that pastors are useless, but we shouldn't be getting our doctrine from men. Pastors are supposed to guide us, but not indoctrinate us. God is who we should turn to for our doctrine. I stand ready to give an answer for the hope that is within me, but the Word of God alone supplies that hope through the knowledge of the Messiah and His love for us.
I guess the logical place to start is with "Who are we?" Are we gentiles? Are we something new called the Church? Or are we Israel? Gentiles means Nations, and it's often used in the context of pagan or heathen nations. Abraham was a gentile, but was called out by God to be the father of many nations (gentiles). Does this mean that those physically descendant from him are God's people? Is there some other requirement? The Pharisees claimed Abraham was their father, but Jesus said their father was the adversary. They were doing the works of the devil, not the works of God. Abraham had a son of promise in Isaac, and Abraham was told that God would establish His covenant with Isaac and his seed. Isaac had two sons, and God said two nations come from Rebekah and the elder will serve the younger. Jacob was the younger, and God later changed his name to Israel. From Israel came the twelve tribes. These were known as the children of Israel. Fast forward to Solomon, and because of Solomon's sin the twelve tribes became two houses. The House of Judah, and the House of Israel aka Ephraim. Ephraim was one of Joseph's sons, and he and his brother became as tribes. Israel gave Ephraim a blessing saying that he would be the fullness of the nations. Melo ha'Goyim or something like that. After the split of houses, the House of Israel went after other Gods and was divorced by God. The House of Judah was worse, but a promise had been made that the Messiah would come through Judah. The divorce is covered in Jeremiah 3, and the whole book of Hosea is about this topic. God divorced the House of Israel, but would some day take her back. Jeremiah 3 follows Deuteronomy 24 in understanding that the House of Israel can't return according to God's law. Spoiler alert: If you skip ahead to Romans 7, Paul figured it out. Anyways, after the divorce the House of Israel is scattered to the four corners of the earth. They go into captivity by Samaria at first, but at some point just became part of the nations. There are many prophecies that they will return; such as the two sticks in Ezekiel, the book of Hosea, Deuteronomy 30 talks about this, and it's scattered throughout the NT as well. Will you restore Israel at this time? Letters to the strangers scattered. Jesus saying He came for the lost sheep of the House of Israel. It is all over the place if you just actually look. I mean who is the New Covenant established with? The House of Judah, and the House of Israel. There is so much language that witnesses to this. 1 Peter is written to the strangers scattered, and one place named is Galatia. In chapter 2, he says this.
1 Peter 2:5-12
[5]Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.
[6]Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.
[7]Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,
[8]And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.
[9]But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
[10]Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.
[11]Dearly beloved, I beseech you as strangers and pilgrims, abstain from fleshly lusts, which war against the soul;
[12]Having your conversation honest among the Gentiles: that, whereas they speak against you as evildoers, they may by your good works, which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation.
Verses 9 and 10 are littered with titles given to Israel. A Holy Nation. Chosen. Kings and Priests. Not a people that have become His people. Etc. Read Hosea. Ephesians 2 says that we WERE gentiles when we didn't have God. We WERE heathens. By Christ's blood we have come into the commonwealth (tribes, maybe?) of Israel. Romans 11 says that we are grafted into an olive tree, and God has already called Israel a green olive tree. It says that unbeliever's branches are broken off (cut off from among your people), but those believing are grafted in. What does church mean? An assembly? There has to be an assembly OF something. God's people? Guess what Israel has already been called. Tell Pharaoh to let my people go.
Exodus 19:4-8
[4]Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and how I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto myself.
[5]Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine:
[6]And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.
[7]And Moses came and called for the elders of the people, and laid before their faces all these words which the LORD commanded him.
[8]And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD.
There is much much more to this, but you need to search it out for yourselves.
This is an edit to clarify. We are not part of Israel by our own bloodline, but by who our Father is, and what His Son did when He gave His blood for us.
Ephesians 2:11-13
[11]Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
[12]That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
[13]But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
I just wanted that to be understood better. It doesn't matter who we are physically descendants of.
Isaiah 56:1-8
[1]Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.
[2]Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.
[3]Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree.
[4]For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;
[5]Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.
[6]Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
[7]Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.
[8]The Lord GOD which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, Yet will I gather others to him, beside those that are gathered unto him.
The stranger that joins himself to the LORD. The Bible is interconnected, and His Word never returns void.
According to Romans 14 you’re a brother in Christ, but would you consider me a brother in Christ if I didn’t feel compelled to follow dietary restrictions and feasts?
I see Acts 15 as the only dietary laws which transferred over to gentile believers; laws from the Noahide covenant. No mention of Sabbath or anything else.
Sad thing is, all this could be said of mainstream Christian Churches, as well. This is so sad that defensive individuals are pointing the finger at something our Father is doing...which is 'calling out' people from Laodicea. Yes, there are immature believers, there are hypocritical believers, there are people that are a bad witness, even people teaching untruths. But, sin and human nature being what it is, this is to be expected. If the Father is 'calling out' a people unto Himself, then it stands to reason that the enemy would be planting 'tares' among the wheat. We have seen this ourselves, and must determine what to do....Is it a problem with the leadership and false teaching...where we would exit the assembly, or is the problem with immature believers or other that our presence might help to lead to the Truth of Scripture and living out our faith in sincerity and truth.
We DID NOT even know there was a thing called Hebrew Roots when our Father began pointing out the Truth of His Word. It started with WHO do we worship. Do we worship the God of creation and 'remember' Him and His work on The 7th Day...not a day of our choosing? Then, how do we OBEY EVERY WORD THAT PROCEEDS FROM THE MOUTH OF GOD (Matthew 4:4) without actual 'obeying' His stated will as He already told us? How about Acts 15, when we are told that new converts were to begin their journey with basic turning away from pagan worship...and the reason given that that was all at that time....was that they were going to 'HEAR MOSES READ EACH SABBATH.' This means that new converts were worshipping each Sabbath...and the day was not Sunday or the first day, it was the Sabbath as understood in Scripture. Then, we have the SAINTS SINGING THE SONG OF MOSES and the SONG OF THE LAMB. This is indicative of the law AND our Messiah.
Our Messiah had much to say about hypocrisy. He also told a man who asked how he might be saved....to keep the commandments. He also said that those that would be rejected as those He doesn't know are those that are 'lawless.'
This is dangerous ground that the Church is standing on. Jesus said that He spoke the Father's Words, not His own.
We are told in the Book of Daniel that the enemy of God seeks to 'change' His law. The prophetic picture given in the Book of Daniel is that we should OBEY OUR FATHER AND MESSIAH even when the whole world says we shouldn't or that there will be grave consequences.
I have much more to say. Unfortunately, even Scripture speaks of those who will not hear until chastisement comes and ears are opened.
As for me and my house, we will serve YHWH. Say all that you will. All this has been prophesied about in our Father's Word.
By the way, we belong to no Hebrew Roots group. But, we do believe that we are 'Hebrews' and sojourners in this present land and 'crossing over' to our Father's kingdom and our Messiah's kingdom.
Mankind began with eating food prohibited. They must have 'rationalized' about why it was o.k. to do so. But, Daddy said not to.
Today, mankind is still desiring prohibited food, prohibited conduct, and also seeking to be THEIR OWN GOD by 'assuming' they can make all the rules. Jesus was QUOTING SCRIPTURE when He said that all the Torah/law HUNG ON loving God and loving our neighbor. That was a DIRECT QUOTE from the written law of God in Leviticus 19 and Deuteronomy 6.
The New Covenant is a soft heart that obeys because our body truly is the Body of Christ. Jeremiah 31.
Amein!!
Well said. Thank you.😊
Food is prohibited? What do you make of Peter’s vision in acts then?
@@jacobwhitus3715 Looking at what 'Peter' said, "...But God has shown me that I should not call any man common or unclean." Why? Because the Jewish leadership 'added to' God's law and insisted that anyone other than a Jew was unclean and they were taught to keep their distance. How could Peter 'feed Jesus' sheep' if he didn't understand this?
Noah understood clean and unclean. He also had a sacrifice after the flood....i.e. the law.
Genesis 7:2
You shall take with you seven (7) each of every CLEAN ANIMAL, a male and his female; two (2) each of animals that are UNCLEAN, a male and his female;
Amein. Our family was called out of "Egypt" over 15 years ago. It's so wonderful to see more people waking up.
The critiques you used against the lady who "put a burden on herself" by trying to keep Passover could very easily be turned around on all of the christian mother's who kill themselves getting everything perfect for Easter and Christmas.
Yes our eyes should be on Christ but we are human and sometimes things go wrong and we get frustrated. If you were getting ready for Easter and everything went wrong you would probably be feeling the same way. Are people putting unnecessary yolks on them with Easter?
Do you live in America?
Shalom brothers and sisters.
First off this panel is super biased, and taking the worst parts of immature Torah messianics and exploiting it like it's all of us. A debate with equal parts would make this whole discussion line up with The truth and love of the Word. Bring on Adam Fink and Sean Griffin ,or even David Wilbur
Secondly. We are just Hebrews grafted into the family by salvation in Yeshua . Former gentiles who have crossed over. Titles of Hebrew roots are not even taken by the majority of this return to the ancient way.
I agree many are way too extreme with the pagan ties stuff, but the truth is we just Rather celebrate Yeshua (birth, life,death,Ressurection and ascension in the midst of All the biblical feasts and they are just way more fun and more celebration . it's awesome to keep the feasts .
The name stuff is part of the process. I was even way to harsh about it at first as are many, but then maturity comes as the Spirit brings discipline and wisdom. Jesus is ok and so is Yeshua or Yahusha.....there is no harm in this.
It's all about The Messiah and his Way. Not works for salvation, no one in the movement believes works are for salvation. Those are super false claims .
There is no false religion or teaching here....We are brothers and sisters in Messiah....hebrews because of Him
Shalom and much love
This response nestled up right next my heart. Thank you for providing clarification and bringing awareness to extremities!
@@skylarlysaker9321 HalleluYAH . This return to the ancient ways was prophesied long ago. It's a beautiful thing. No burdens here
Only genetic Jews are Hebrew.
This is such a needed conversation. Thank you. I was sucked into this in part and it took me a long time to come out. I still find myself having to remind myself of the truth of God’s word vs the views of this movement. When I look back, it scares me how I was traveling down this road. I’m thankful to have escaped out of this. To God be the glory alone. Thank you for Cultish.
I love this show. But this series is a wash. I don't find any in the Hebrew roots movement , cultish. The people that are your guests don't represent the movement at all.
Hebrew roots is really just an umbrella term for everyone making an exodus from the unscriptural western church.
1. Give me a scriptural basis for ignoring the Sabbath.
2. Give me a scriptural basis for why Christians don't celebrate God's feasts even though the apostles did...
3. Give me a scriptural basis for why we instead have bunnies with eggs and Santa? But people who celebrate God's feasts are seen as "legalistic"?
4. Give me a reason why we are looking so much like the laodecian church that God will spit us out of His mouth??
We are spiritually poor blind and naked and we think we are rich and have need of nothing. God's laws are good and given as protection. Jesus said not one jot or tiddle would pass away until heaven and earth do, that hasn't happened yet!!
And so called pastors aren't helping their sheep sort through all of these really serious questions! Which is why you have people calling themselves Hebrew roots now and even going to rabbis and the Talmud!! What a tragedy.
Myself I just call a Christian because I follow my Lord to the best of my ability. I fail all the time but I just want to follow Him and not make Him sad.
Oh, you're Torah observant 😀 it is written, "Torah shall depart from Zion" this was to accomplish the spreading of the one true G-d of Israel to the nations who would come to acknowledge the Divine Constitution.
@@shlomicohen2341 I wish I was. I was called to it when I got baptized I just felt a call from the Holy Spirit. But I became discouraged by fellow christians who were scared I was becoming "legalistic" because I started dressing modestly and eating differently and was interested in the Sabbath and God's feasts. I tried to get other believers to engage in God's feasts with me because... Well I can't very well do them all by myself. Not that they had to in order to be saved, I just pointed out that Gods feasts are good and a gift for us and I wanted to partake.
I stopped following the laws and have just felt so dead in my spirit since. Crying out to God for why and He always leads me back to the commandments. Not because they are what saves me but because disobedience is a hindrance to any relationship.
I know that whoever loves people more than God is not worthy of Him. I don't want to be disobedient anymore. But how can I find fellowship (which is also commanded of us) if I can't find believers who will walk with me?
I know sometimes God calls us to walk roads alone, but how do I observe His Holy days that way??
@@charitybrook6279
How is observing a Mitzvah legalistic? It's act of worship and a profession of faith. Why do the Christian's partake in a Mikveh Immersion (Baptism) this is also a Mitzvah 🤔
@@charitybrook6279
Ps: You can still observe the Moedim alone for now.
Also, what is wrong with The Talmud?
I am a Jewish believer in Jesus (or Yehoshua as I would call Him) and this charge has been put to me previously by the Christian people they've told me I am a member of this "Hebrew Roots movement" and I genuinely have no idea what it is but what I do know is the Holy One, blessed be He, in Megillah Devarim warns me against those who try and teach me to forsake His Torah. HaShem defines a false Prophet as one who abrogates His Torah. How would you guys balance this in light of your current position?
There is nothing and I mean literally nothing in the Brit'Chadasha that teaches followers of Messiah to abrogate Torah. I believe the Christian people need to read "Jesus" through Jewish eyes rather than a tradition that's been handed on..
@bboatman422
Hello. I hope you're well. Thank you for your reply.
You have written and I quote, "Jesus fulfilled all the Law and the prophecies"
But, this isn't true is it? Infact, there are several important prophecies the Scion is yet to bring to fruition. Here are some examples.
HaMegillah Devarim (The Scroll of Deuteronomy) 30:3-4
"the -ord thy G-d will turn thy captivity, and have compassion upon thee, and will return and gather thee from all the nations, whither the L-rd thy G-d hath scattered thee. If any of thine be driven out unto the outmost parts of Heaven, from thence will the L-rd thy G-d gather thee, and from thence will He fetch thee"
This WASN'T fulfilled during the Babylonian exile. This, like other prophecies in Isaiah is a reference to Messiah ingathering the lost Tribes of Israel.
HaMegillah Yechezkel (The Scroll of Ezekiel) 37:26-27
"My Tabernacle also shall be with them yea, I will be their G-d, and they shall be my people. And the heathen shall know that I the L-rd do sanctify Israel, when my Sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore"
Jesus hasn't restored the Beit-HaMikdash (Temple) in Jerusalem. Instead, the Temple Mount has been given over for a time until the second apperance of King Messiah.
HaMegillah Yeshayahu (The Scroll of Isaiah) 11:6
"The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together and a little child shall lead them"
We can both agree that Jesus hasn't ushered in the Olam Ha-Ba (the world to come) you may know this as The Messianic Era.
This is just three of several prophecies Messiah is yet to fulfil. Therefore, He hasn't fulfilled the role of Messiah as spoke of by the Jewish canon which means Torah is still active and binding on the conscience of all believers. If you understood the Moedim (Biblical celebrations) you would already know He hasn't brought all to fruition.
Please don't be confused I am not by any means trying to tell you observance of the Divine Constitution is what brings us into a right standing with HaShem, this is complete nonsense. Rather, observance of Torah is an act of worship, love and obedience. Ony through G-ds appointed Messiah can we be brought into right standing and have our sins atoned for 🙂
Read Yehoshua through Jewish eyes and world you didn't know existed will be seen. I love you. May HaShem bring you to an acknowledgement of His Torah.
@bboatman422 If this is true, then the apostles all missed the memo.
@@t.scottmajor1316
HaShem bless and keep you ❤
@bboatman422 fullfilled the curse. Didn't nullify or destroy the actual law....just the curse
The best "Jewish eyes" to understand Christ through are his disciples and mother, i.e. the saints, Scriptures, and the (Orthodox) Church
The sabbath is not ceremonial law. It is moral law given at creation and written in tablets of stone, therefore perpetual also.
A shadow rest culminating in Christ, our permanent rest.
There is still future fulfillment of our rest in the millennial reign and our rest with him in the forever after. Christ is the substance and the shadow picture still points to him in a remberance. If we are going to say we shouldn't keep the Sabbath because Jesus came then why would we celebrate Christmas and Easter? We claim they are days of remembrance. So is the Sabbath; to remember what God did at creation, to remember what Jesus did on the cross, to look forward to what he'll do in the future. That's why the command says to remember the Sabbath! Perhaps he knew we'd forget. This isn't some "new revelation or secret knowledge" as you're claiming we claim. It's what has already been said and has always been said, we as the church have just forgotten.
@Simple Christianity thats between you and God. Is Jesus your Lord?
Sabbath says it was sign, how is it not ceremonial
@@brothabrian6004 its a perpetual agreement as a sign between God and His people. Are you not a people of God.
Become as an infant in understanding, as if knowing or being taught nothing, forgetting all bias, prejudice and doctrines of men, then read from Genesis to Revelation with actual exegesis. Blessings! 💙
Amen 😊
Man, I'm kind of torn on this one.
I have recently come out of the Torah observant movement and I can agree with a lot of what this couple says here, but the wife definitely has the type of attitude that would discourage me from sending this to my friends in Torah that I am trying to coax out of the movement by careful reading of the Word.
If there are people reading this who are Torah observant and want to hear the objections to their practice in order to test it, I would suggest a channel called "Defending the Biblical Roots of Christianity" because the gentleman who runs it, R.L. Solberg doesn't muddy the waters by accusing people who are trying to keep the Mosaic covenant as ignorant or heretical. God bless.
Thanks for judging my heart. 🥴 I’m glad to hear you have the gift of prophecy to “definitely” know someone’s “attitude”. I really agree with you about Solberg. He’s awesome. 😊
Thanks for the recommendation. I watched the debate Solberg had with Sean griffin and feel even more confident in the Hebraic roots of our scriptures. Solberg got it wrong on this topic. He’s kind, but i think he’ll come around to Gods ways.
@KyleHamrickSr Not sure how he got it wrong. The roots, the natural tree, is Hebrew through and through. But the new covenant, represented in the fulfillment of the Mosiac covenant with the bloodline of Israel in the life of the Messiah Yeshua, wasn't a Levitical covenant with the gentiles, it was a Melchezidekian covenant. "For when there is a change in the priesthood, there is necessarily a change in the law as well." Hebrews 7:12
We're are under the law of the Spirit, which *is* reflected in the Law of Moses but not entirely contained therein. So if you're telling people they need to keep the Mosaic Law to follow the Messiah, you're wrong. It's literally in Acts, I know you know where. 4 rules were given as a basis so that people wouldn't error needlessly against one another despite not being under the Law.
@NikkiSchumacherOfficial I didn't see this at the time, but honestly if it rubbed me wrong it would have been a realization that any Torah observant person I tried to share this with would also have felt that way. Because it's a bit of a legalist and kind of gnostic vibe and a lot of them can't handle any push back, especially if they sense a flippantness.
Really it's not like I'm not capable of the same thing, so I'd like to repent of how that probably came off. I wish you grace on your journey with God. 🤍
@@alleadonairespectfully I’d go back and watch the discussion with Solberg and Griffin one more time.
You should probably actually have a Messianic on. It’s exhausting seeing people who are fully convinced in their minds against “Hebrew Roots” telling non “Hebrew Roots” people who “Hebrew Roots” people are and what they believe. I’ve noticed people like this ignore every single fair, honest, and loving Messianic they’ve met and just allude to these obscure bad eggs which, interestingly enough, nobody ever meets. It’s a bogeyman tactic.
Respectfully, these conversations are dishonest when they’re never properly “heard out.” The fact that almost every “typical Christian” immediately rejects “Hebrew Roots” without actually knowing anything they believe is concerning and shows bias.
If we’re going to have this conversation, let’s do it honestly and fairly.
Rick
Yes, I thought the whole concept of the show was to talk to people who had personal experience being in the “cults”. I haven’t seen them take this approach with any other group I’ve seen them talk about.
Well said, Rick. What a low-effort debacle this show is. It starts out being insulting just by the name of the show and gets worse from there.
Well said. They should invite Zach Bauer on. That would be the episode to watch.
For a ministry that prides itself on solid logic and reasoning they fail to present any real arguments that couldn’t also be used against believers in their own groups.
My experience was the opposite. It’s because I do read my Bible in context that led me to a more Hebrew Roots belief. I think a better name for the movement should be Whole Bible In Context, actually.
I’m not sure Zach would be best for the show. His demeanor isn’t quite appropriate at times and he botches a lot of stuff like Galatians. Honestly, the need two people since “Hebrew Roots” is growing so fast; one person who is balanced and wise, like Greg Hershberg, and then someone who is a textual interpreter / exegete to clear up the truly biblical aspect of things. Zach is kind of neither.
Wilber isn’t bad and is *kind of* both, but doesn’t fully service either one in his member.
I agree, Hebrew Roots is just a silly term altogether. “Hebrew Roots.” Well, of course. It doesn’t really either a) encompass what it is we actually believe, and b) misrepresents us by false groups such as BHIs and Yeshua denying NT “Jews.” Ironically we keep telling people we’re not “Hebrew Roots” 😂 and they just keep calling us that. And then label us as all one thing. It’s the same as me labeling them all antisemites who wished Jews to be burnt, killed, and thrown off a bridge while being “baptized in the name of Abraham,” because they’re reformed and follow Martin Luther. (These are literal statements by him, in his layer life, not early - it’s interesting watching people justify his words).
“Whole Bible believer,” “follower of the Way,” etc. There’s really no “term.” I consider myself a Messianic. I’m a Messianic Jew since I’m a Jew, but I “identify” as Messianic. Basically same etymology as “Christian,” just using the Hebrew Messiah instead.
Shalom!
This is spot on. The only way to have a winning argument is to not have an opponent..
Where is the defense for the other side of the case?? You are sharing your side where is the defense for the other side do you think it so low that they don't deserve a fair trial? I know someone else that didn't get a fair trial and he turned into a corner stone.
Make the debate fair....
Many of the Hebrew roots groups are small family home churches with varying beliefs/opinions. But the large ones like 12 tribes are definitely a cult
The belief that people who are not Jews by their heritage can replace the Jewish People by obeying the Torah is fundamentally a cult belief which is not only unsupported by scripture, but actually refuted by the New Testament as well as various OT prophets including Isaiah and Jeremiah.
@@taxat10n1sth3ft
They become spiritual Jews - you should actually read the bible sometimes - no one can actually prove their Jewish by bloodline anyways
@@taxat10n1sth3ft who said they were replacing the Jewish people? Those who place their faith in Messiah are grafted into the commonwealth of Israel. Doesn’t make someone a Jew. Galatians 3 is clear on this along with Romans 11. We are all one in Messiah.
The Bible says God prefers for people to be in LGBT relationships.
Anyone that teaches the LIE of monetary tithing, sells anything using the gospel, or teaches that same-sex marriage is a sin CHOOSES to die with the wicked.
Luke 10:7 states the only wages for ministering are eating and drinking whatever you are given.
Also, know that rich people will all die. You can't be a Christian, sit on all kinds of money, watch your fellow brothers and sisters starve, suffer, or be homeless, choose to do nothing about it, and think that it's ok. Those are all wolves.
Mathew 19:12 Eunuchs that are born that way are transgender. Eunuchs made that way by others were abused in some way and something inside of them blocks off a certain type of body but it doesn't happen to everyone that is abused. Those that choose to live like Eunuchs FOR THE SAKE OF THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN are bisexual people that choose partners of the same sex-characteristics but opposite in regards to gender. Notice, it states God PREFERS for people to be in LGBT relationships.
Leviticus, Corinthians, and Timothy were translated wrong by Billy Graham. Those verses are actually referring to pedophilia. Romans 1:27 All of the men were male in regards to gender, all of the women were female in gender. It is not referring to Eunuchs (where one partner is transgender). Also, it had nothing to do with marriage of any kind. They were trying to procreate during orgies so God did it on purpose. Anyone that continues to teach same sex marriage is a sin when the Bible says God prefers for people to be in LGBT relationships will also die by their own choice.
Sodom and Gem. was about rape, nothing to do with marriage of any kind.
God made them male and female, determined by gender, located in the brain.
In order to be a church building, the place must house people inside of it. Otherwise it is just another private money-making business part of Babylon that furthers satan's agenda. Stay out of the fake churches.
I am Elijah of Malachi 4:5-6 and Acts 3:22-23 says it will come to pass that anyone that fails to listen to me will be UTTERLY destroyed from among the people. Again, everyone has a choice.
And anyone that deletes my messages CHOOSES to reject Jesus Christ Himself and that means they also CHOOSE to die with the wicked.
I am Elijah so that means any discrepancies in the holy books are ultimately decided by me. I am also to usher in the Messiah! Be ready: Jesus is coming back!
WORLD PEACE IS COMING!!
By the way, anything based on gender norms no longer applies. In fact, the last will be first and the first will be last. It's women that will be ruling the kingdom of heaven.
And rapture is not what most people think. Its when God's true people shine with the glory of God and are miraculously healed. Read Malachi 4:2-4 and the verses surrounding it...........Jesus comes back to rule earth and being taken is not good!
Malachi 2 proves Malachi 3:8-11 is talking to the thieving church leaders. Every single major church and fake preacher on television knew since Augst of 2020 if they brought the money back they were never supposed to take for ministering then God would end Covid but they love money so much they intentionally chose to kill everyone instead of repenting.
Seriously, do you really comprehend that? The church leaders LOVE MONEY SO MUCH that they INTENTIONALLY CHOSE TO KILL PEOPLE instead of repenting. Every time they collect money for ministering they know they are killing people with Covid and they still do it! Could you imagine for almost 2 years walking into your "church" on Sunday and knowing every single time you asked people to take that piece of paper in the back of the pew and pay tithes you knew more people would die from Covid and you did it anyhow? 😭😭😭😭
And you knew monetary tithing was a lie on top of it! So you also wilfully committed fraud.
That is SICK. All these people need prison time for murder and fraud.
WW3 will come if the church fakes dont repent and anyone working for a church will be raped, tortured, and slaughtered.
At some point, fireballs will hit all unrepentant wicked people..
@@Ancientpathsfellowship they're not placing their faith in the Messiah who redeemed His people. They're rejecting Him and placing their faith in their works until such a time as a messiah fitting their idea of him appears.
As for becoming spiritual Jews, there is no such thing. According to Ezra and Nehemiah, one had to be able to PROVE THEIR BLOODLINE to participate in worship. Read your Bible, @John 8:31-32 .
The first question should be in my opinion when Jesus said 'Think not that I came to abolish the law'.. is why people would think that in the first place. Jesus was the One who kept the law perfectly. So why would people think he came to abolish the law? Because He came to re-instate the law how it was intended, the end resulting in loving God and our neighbors. Not the way the spiritual leaders were making the law into a total burden. If you understand the question, you can also understand the answer I would think.
Amen 😊
^^^ This
Your discussion of the Passover seemed confused to say the least. We can all agree that prior to the incarnation Israelites were commanded by God to keep that feast, right? Was their observance in that period "burdensome" or "sad"? Christ identified the "last supper" as Passover (Luke 22:15). Doesn't your criticism here apply to any Christian who sees the Eucharist/Communion/Lord's Supper as a required participation in the observance that night? My point is that any good work can seem burdensome, but this is no proof that the work is not inherently good. It may simply be that we are approaching it wrong.
Wellll said. No burdens in doing the feasts, just fun and deeper connection
It's not just that mainstream Christianity are taking the wrong approach towards the Passover, it's that mainstream Christianity has a satanic attitude towards the Passover.
@@decepticonxhunter4850 I think I understand what you're saying, but I also recognize that many in mainstream Christianity have simply unthoughtfully swallowed the doctrine they were fed. Most are not rubbing their hand together caclking diabolically as they mastermind a plot to undermine one of our LORD'S commands while poisoning our witness to our Jewish would-be-brothers. I suppose my goal is to encourage them to consider these errors critically and scripturally.
Thanks for having me on for this important conversation. It's always impossible to get to every issue on everyone's mind, but I am very open to questions, and have addressed these things in much more detail on my channel. Please reach out if you have encountered an argument you think unassailable. I'd love to hear it and test it.
The Bible says God prefers for people to be in LGBT relationships.
Anyone that teaches the LIE of monetary tithing, sells anything using the gospel, or teaches that same-sex marriage is a sin CHOOSES to die with the wicked.
Luke 10:7 states the only wages for ministering are eating and drinking whatever you are given.
Also, know that rich people will all die. You can't be a Christian, sit on all kinds of money, watch your fellow brothers and sisters starve, suffer, or be homeless, choose to do nothing about it, and think that it's ok. Those are all wolves.
Mathew 19:12 Eunuchs that are born that way are transgender. Eunuchs made that way by others were abused in some way and something inside of them blocks off a certain type of body but it doesn't happen to everyone that is abused. Those that choose to live like Eunuchs FOR THE SAKE OF THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN are bisexual people that choose partners of the same sex-characteristics but opposite in regards to gender. Notice, it states God PREFERS for people to be in LGBT relationships.
Leviticus, Corinthians, and Timothy were translated wrong by Billy Graham. Those verses are actually referring to pedophilia. Romans 1:27 All of the men were male in regards to gender, all of the women were female in gender. It is not referring to Eunuchs (where one partner is transgender). Also, it had nothing to do with marriage of any kind. They were trying to procreate during orgies so God did it on purpose. Anyone that continues to teach same sex marriage is a sin when the Bible says God prefers for people to be in LGBT relationships will also die by their own choice.
Sodom and Gem. was about rape, nothing to do with marriage of any kind.
God made them male and female, determined by gender, located in the brain.
In order to be a church building, the place must house people inside of it. Otherwise it is just another private money-making business part of Babylon that furthers satan's agenda. Stay out of the fake churches.
I am Elijah of Malachi 4:5-6 and Acts 3:22-23 says it will come to pass that anyone that fails to listen to me will be UTTERLY destroyed from among the people. Again, everyone has a choice.
And anyone that deletes my messages CHOOSES to reject Jesus Christ Himself and that means they also CHOOSE to die with the wicked.
I am Elijah so that means any discrepancies in the holy books are ultimately decided by me. I am also to usher in the Messiah! Be ready: Jesus is coming back!
WORLD PEACE IS COMING!!
By the way, anything based on gender norms no longer applies. In fact, the last will be first and the first will be last. It's women that will be ruling the kingdom of heaven.
And rapture is not what most people think. Its when God's true people shine with the glory of God and are miraculously healed. Read Malachi 4:2-4 and the verses surrounding it...........Jesus comes back to rule earth and being taken is not good!
Malachi 2 proves Malachi 3:8-11 is talking to the thieving church leaders. Every single major church and fake preacher on television knew since Augst of 2020 if they brought the money back they were never supposed to take for ministering then God would end Covid but they love money so much they intentionally chose to kill everyone instead of repenting.
Seriously, do you really comprehend that? The church leaders LOVE MONEY SO MUCH that they INTENTIONALLY CHOSE TO KILL PEOPLE instead of repenting. Every time they collect money for ministering they know they are killing people with Covid and they still do it! Could you imagine for almost 2 years walking into your "church" on Sunday and knowing every single time you asked people to take that piece of paper in the back of the pew and pay tithes you knew more people would die from Covid and you did it anyhow? 😭😭😭😭
And you knew monetary tithing was a lie on top of it! So you also wilfully committed fraud.
That is SICK. All these people need prison time for murder and fraud.
WW3 will come if the church fakes dont repent and anyone working for a church will be raped, tortured, and slaughtered.
At some point, fireballs will hit all unrepentant wicked people..
@@elijahthemessengermalachi3105 Management regrets to inform you the position has been filled Matthew 17:12-13.
May God bless your future employment aspirations.
Do you believe in Lordship salvation?
@@TheBeginningOfWisdom ?
@@willwarren8519 you mean having to confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord to be saved (Romans 10:9)? Don’t know why anyone wouldn’t believe that.
Yes it’s so cultish to want to walk like our Messiah walked. 1 John 2:6. Paul kept the Torah. Acts 21. He even went to perform sacrifices. Jesus kept the Torah perfectly. He came do His fathers business. He taught His Fathers doctrine. John 7:16. Read Psalms 119 and tell me we shouldn’t want to obey the Torah. Look at the things David said about it. Brothers and sisters please go to the scriptures and look at things yourself. Don’t believe me. Don’t believe men. Read it yourself. The Messiah said He came not to abolish it until heaven and earth pass away not one jot or tittle would pass. Heaven and earth have not passed away. Jesus kept it. Paul kept it. The apostles kept it. We should be keeping it. Not because it saves us. But because it’s what the scriptures command from us. It’s how we please our Father. It’s His holy and righteous law. To subject ourselves to it is to walk in the spirit. Romans 8. Love you all and even if you disagree I still consider you a brother and sister in Christ if you’ve given your life to Him. I just wish people would see the truth of the word.
I choose not to put unnecessary weight on myself. It is not necessary for salvation, so then It's just religion plain and simple, but you are free to chain yourself down with whatever tedious laws you desire. Good luck out there.
@@thisguy2604 the only problem with what you’re saying is the Torah is never described as tedious in the scriptures. It doesn’t chain us down. It’s described as follows:
Perfect (Psalm 19:7)
Just (Nehemiah 9:13)
Good (Proverbs 4:2)
Life (Proverbs 6:23)
Truth (Psalm 119:142)
Light (Isaiah 8:20)
Way (Malachi 2:8)
Freedom (Psalm 119:45)
Holy (Romans 7:12)
Why would I separate myself from something described in the scriptures like this? The only think that was burdensome was the way religious leaders applied the law to the people around them. This is what Jesus came and changed. He showed how to worship in spirit and truth. The religious leaders used it for control and were hypocrites. Someone following the law to be obedient is not a religious person. They are someone who wants to be obedient to their Father and His word.
@@Ancientpathsfellowship I've been really struggling with this lately, Torah observance that is. One of the biggest throw offs I see is that Torah observant christians do not follow all the laws, even the ones they can. With the exception of the dietary law and feast days and shabbat they don't follow much at all actually.
They don't follow the garment laws, head coverings, tzitzit, mixed linens, the social laws or marital laws i.e marrying your brother's widow etc.
I hear what you are saying and I believe you when you say you don’t believe keeping commandments saves you. Unfortunately, as they discuss in this episode, many people end up believing that later when they go down this path and sadly many even end up denying Yeshua as Messiah. My wife and I had friends that did exactly that, which is heartbreaking.
My first encounter with some of the questions about Torah observance was in college. I had a lot of positive experience with some friends who were messianic Jews that lived similar to Orthodox Jews. that. Participation in Shabbat was a highlight. I even helped one of them study to become a Rabbi (ordained by orthodox), which was very interesting. Most of the focus was on kosher, which is just so sad, knowing and serving God is so much more than
I’ve gone back and forth with what I think about a lot of this stuff, but I think this sums it up. God did not establish Israel as a nation to make the rest of the world Israelites, he set them apart in unique ways at a certain period in time to demonstrate that He is the one true God (in contrast to the idols and fallen spirit creatures at work in the other nations), to begin to reveal truth and holiness to the world, and in particular to create the lineage of David through which the Messiah would come. Regarding laws, keep in mind that not even all Israel followed all of the Torah because some of it was on for the Levites, and even then only certain parts of that law were for particular priests. Continuing on to the New Covenant, Jesus did not come to make the whole world speak Hebrew and wear tzitzit. In fact Revelation gives us lots of pictures of the nations, tribes, peoples coming to worship the Lamb. I think that the diversity of people groups and cultures brings glory to God (obviously not any of their idolatrous or immoral practices, but how they look and speak and make music and celebrate). My biggest concern is not if someone remembers Passover or chooses not to eat pork, it has more to do with the very specific ceremonial and cultural things that people adopt. If you aren’t an Israelite you don’t need to wear things that were commanded specifically to identify an Israelite. Many of the commands don’t even work unless you are in the land and even then the Temple was required for much of it.
Side note, both my kids have Hebrew names, not because I’m
Jewish (not to my knowledge), but because I appreciate the language and because those particular names were beautiful and meaningful. Also, our family and sometimes some other people in our church celebrate Passover and Chanukah in simple ways. I say that just to give a little background to show that I am not against followers of Jesus embracing aspects of old covenant commands or Jewish culture is a healthy way. On the other hand, I’ve seen many people get sucked into the sub culture and become enamored with using Hebrew terms all the time, focusing all Bible study on the festival or minutia related to Jewish customs or things that God was doing specifically with Israel at certain points in their history.
@@thisguy2604 Yeshua is salvation not Torah, there is no chains.
Yahs words isn't chains.
Huge misinterpretation about this whole thing is that Torah is kept for salvation and this just isn't true
@25:11 you cannot do the Law?! I wonder if these people have ever even looked at the Law! What is so hard about wearing tzitzit!? NOTHING! My personal tzitzit are tied in such a way as to be able to tell the gospel. Here are some of those Laws that are just so hard (🙄) to do:
Do not lie with animals (Ex. 22:19)
Do not follow a multitude to do evil (Ex 23:2)
Do not be swayed by a crowd to pervert justice (Ex. 23:2)
Return lost property to it's owner (ex 23:4)
Do not do as pagans do (ex 23:24) , [guess that is a hard one for mainstream Christianity]
Do not slander your neighbor (lev 19:16) [hmmm...exactly what this video is doing]
Emulate God's ways (Deut. 28:9)
Love thy neighbor as thyself (Lev 19:18)
Do not have relations with your mother, father, niece, nephew, aunt, uncle, in-laws (Lev 18)
So since following these laws makes me a false-teaching, biblically illiterate HRM guess I'll start breaking them cause they are too hard. (Yes that IS dripping with sarcasm)
Clearly Jesus was under a terrible burden as he obeyed his Father perfectly, right? We've been set free from imitating Jesus now, and to do so is actually WRONG now. (what a load of nonsense)
@@YTCelt yes it's wrong to do what our KING of kings asks of us. Lol. Matthew 5:10-12--I thank them for their blessing.
[[[[ Love thy neighbor as thyself (Lev 19:18) ]]]]
That's interesting because according to the HRM, their neighbors are only other members of the HRM and not the Christian who they say is their pagan enemy that they have no love for. Or as Zach Bauer has stated that the messiah hates Christians and when he returns he will execute them all for a number of offenses one of which is the death sentence for not being circumcised in the flesh and shaving their beards.
Heidi
I have some questions for you.
1. Do you reject the name Jesus as pagan?
2. Do you reject the name Christ as pagan?
3. Do you believe the name Jesus means pig and hail Zeus?
4. Do you believe the new testament is pagan and filled with errors?
5. Do you accept or reject the writings of Paul?
6. Do you believe as others in the HRM that Paul is a false prophet and the Antichrist?
7. Do you believe the church is Mystery Babylon?
8. Do you believe that Matthew 16:18 was a lie and invented by Pagan Christians to trick people into joining the church?
9. Do you reject the cross and believe the cross is pagan?
10. Do you reject the death, burial, and resurrection as the gospel?
11. Do you reject the virgin birth as pagan?
12. Do you believe the messiah is the physical son of Joseph who had relations with Mary?
13. Do you reject the messiah as the only begotten son of God?
14. Do you believe the messiah was not God but a prophet only?
15. Do you reject that the Holy Spirit is God?
16. Do you believe that Christians will all be cast into the lake of fire or executed by the messiah for being physically uncircumcised, eating pork, and shaving off their beards?
@@Power88987 Heh! Wow! You made up a bunch of things there. Nice work! =)
Are you really justifying the modern holiday celebrated as Easter and trying to say its NOT pagan?
Its funny because Paul himself was actually accused of being in a cult and this is what he said....
Acts 24:14 (NLT)
“But I admit that I follow the Way, which they call a cult. I worship the God(TMH) of our ancestors, and I firmly believe the Jewish law and everything written in the prophets."
Paul himself was accused of being in a cult and he said himself he firmly believes in everything written in the Torah and the prophets. Nothing new under the sun. These people really need to study.
Amen you are awake! 😊
Ha! Excellent. This scripture is a PERFECT response to this dumb video.
This was tough to watch.
“I was trying to make Christmas cookies for Santa and I spilt the cookie mix all on the floor. The kids were screaming and it was the worst Christmas ever. Santa didn’t come and eat the cookies and my husband got sick and couldn’t put the toys together. He had a headache. The kids woke up and there were no toys under the tree. Santa didn’t leave a note. This has been the worst Christmas and I just feel like I let my family and Santa down.”
Imagine mocking people following God’s ways for right living. Sheesh. A bunch of word salad and talking in circles using terrible excuses and bad faith evidence that walking in Gods commands are bad. Scripture says the exact opposite. Philosophy and Catholic doctrine is the problem.
Throughout Scripture we find that God's desire is that we live in His *grace/favor* (Grace being an attribute the Father has displayed toward His people from the beginning).
Exo 34:6-7 'The Lord, the Lord God, merciful and gracious, long suffering, and abounding in goodness and truth, keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin.
Deu 7:9 'Therefore know that the Lord your God, He is God, the faithful God who keeps covenant and mercy for a thousand generations with those who love Him and keep His commandments”
He also stresses that His people walk in obedience in their newly found life in Jesus. Paul, and all the other writers of the NT used the concept of law from its previously understood usage. The use or misuse of this idea was so misconstrued that Paul spent a good deal of time showing that the two, *grace and Law* weren't in conflict. The phrase 'under the law' is found many times in the NT. The writers would have used this word as it had always been defined. Simply put, if law was evil or bad in the Hebrew Scriptures then it would continue 2b understood as evil or bad in the NT. In the same way, if God's laws were understood as righteous n set apart in the Hebrew Scriptures, then they would continue 2b defined as righteous and set apart in the NT. *If God was constantly changing the meaning of these words, then there is no solid rock on which to stand. God is the same yesterday, today, & forever (Hebrews 13) God does not change (Malachi 3:6). There is no explanation of the phrase 'under the law' b/c it was already understood.
When we read the book of Acts, we see that Jesus disciples‘ didn't swallow whatever new teaching came down the pike. They couldn't have tested established revelation - The Hebrew Scriptures, which they knew 2b true, by a new revelation which they did not know. The three sections of the Tanakh were already accepted as YHVH's set apart, everlasting word. God had already commanded, and Jesus‘ confirmed, that a new claim of Messiahship was to be tested against what YHVH had already revealed, not the other way around.
As James points out, (the English word law is translated from the Greek word, nomos). The translation from Greek to English has already changed the meaning of law. In Greek society, the concept of law held a positive place When we read the Hebrew Scriptures, we notice right away that the law was held in high regard. As this word traveled the translation process, it took on a negative connotation. As early as the 3rd century A.D. the so-called early church fathers had begun to denigrate this word. Law was already being taught as a legacy of 'the Jews. Marcion of Sinope for example, a figure in early Christianity, was well-known for preaching that the God who sent Jesus into the world was a different, higher deity than the Creator himself. He also taught that the entire Tanakh should be removed from the pulpits as well as many sections of the NT which put the law and 'the Jews' into a more positive light, (such as the book of Luke n the book of Acts).
As the culture moved
the concept of law grew more n more negative. The whole concept of law n bondage was reversed. Law was taught as bondage, not sin. What began in God's word as Light, Life, Right, the Way, The Walk, Truth, Goodness, and Holiness, became disdained. The law has become the enemy. Iniquity is portrayed as good and the law as bad! Law is no longer seen as good and righteous but is seen as nothing but fear n punishment. This is b/c the concept of law has been so twisted n redefined that it is virtually unrecognizable.
We make a horrible mistake by 🍒 picking Scriptures out of context. Paul obeyed Torah (Acts 21) and was in fact forced to prove it so. Paul faithfully taught believers to obey it. "So my brothers, you also were put to death to the Torah through the body of Messiah, for u to become another, the One who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to Elohim. For when we were in the flesh, the passions of sins, through the Torah, were working in our members to bear fruit to death. But now we have been released from the Torah, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in newness of Spirit and not in oldness of letter.
*'What, then, shall we say? Is the Torah sin? Let it not be! However, I did not know sin except through the Torah. For also the covetousness I knew not if the Torah had not said, “You shall not covet'* (Ex. 20:17; Deu. 5:21)
'But sin, having taken the occasion through the command, did work in me all sorts of covetousness. For apart from Torah sin is dead. And I was alive apart from the Torah once, but when the command came, the sin revived, and I died.
And the command which was to result in life, this I found to result in death.
For sin, having taken the occasion through the command, deceived me, and through it killed me.
*So that the Torah truly is set-apart, n the command set-apart, and righteous, and good. Therefore, has that which is good become death to me? Let it not be* But the sin, that sin might be manifest, was working death in me through what is good, so that sin through the command might become an exceedin great sinner' 'For we know that the Torah is Spiritual, but I am fleshly, sold under sin. For what I work, I know not. For what I wish, that I do not practice, but what I hate, that I do. But if I do what I do not wish, I agree with the Torah that it is good. And now, it is no longer I that work it, but the sin dwelling in me. For I know that in me, that is in my flesh, dwells no good. For to wish is present with me, but to work the good I do not find. For the good that I wish to do, I do not do; but the evil I do not wish to do, this I practice.
And if I do that which I do not wish, it is no longer I who work it, but the sin dwelling in me. I find therefore this law, that when I wish to do the good, that the evil is present with me. For I delight in the Torah of Elohim a according to the inward man, but I see another torah in my members, battling against the torah of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the torah of sin which is in my members. Wretched man that I am! Who shall deliver me from this body of death? Thanks to Elohim, through Jesus the Master! So then, with the mind I myself truly serve the Torah of Elohim, but with the flesh the torah of sin.' Romans 7 ~
@CharlesPezoop, I have read numerous times. I will say this, study the Word in context and without preconceived ideas. If you are not inclined to do that, then don't. Vaya con Dios!
Sorry, but this episode was less edifying than the first two episodes. Y'all would really get a lot more "building up of the body" if you just hosted a few believing Hebrew Rooters and Messianic Jews on your show to give more clarity to what they actually believe. Shalom.
They've already pre-determined that it's "cultish". They have no need to be fair, I guess.
@@YTCelt Good point.
I grew up Catholic and came out of Catholicism a while after i started studying the Bible trying to prove that it supported Catholic doctrine and practice. After going to a Baptist Church for a few years my wife and i eventually came to the conclusion that we should as Christians keep the Sabbath. We realized that in gathering for worship on Sunday in stead of keeping the Sabbath as God commands we were doing the same thing as the Pharisees, who Christ chastised for making God's commandments of none affect in order to keep traditions of men(because, regardless of Christ rising on the first day of the week, we're not actually instructed anywhere in Scripture to gather that day and ignore the Sabbath command). Shortly after that, though we still understood Peters vision in Acts 10 as doing away with old testament dietary laws, we decided to start eating biblically clean under the mindset that God, Who created us and all the animals, probably knows what diet is healthiest for humans and was probably prescribing a fairly healthy diet for His people so it might be a good idea to follow it. Eventually we did somehow come across some Hebrew roots stuff, i think on RUclips or something initially, and ended up joining some Facebook groups and going down that rabbit hole of new age Pharisees. Now, i don't support the notion of trying to keep the whole law to establish your own righteousness, which is why we eventually distanced ourselves from that movement. However, i do believe Paul is widely misunderstood among Christendom and wrongfully used to support lawlessness (just like Peter warned us not to do in 2 Peter 3:16-17), which was never Paul's intention. My wife, my children and i still strive and do our best to understand and keep the Sabbath and dietary laws and and any other laws we understand to be applicable to us, not in order to establish our own righteousness, but because of the righteousness of Christ that we hope will be imputed on us. Christ told us "if you love me, keep my commandments". John also told us to walk even as He(Christ) walked, who kept the law perfectly. Like i said, we've distanced ourselves from the Hebrew roots movement because we saw in it a lot of self righteousness and unloving hypocrites. But i think it's funny how people accuse those who come to these conclusions of inserting their preconceived notions into the text when that's exactly what they're doing. Again, i started studying the Bible with a very strong assertion that the Catholic Church is THE ONE TRUE CHURCH OF CHRIST and determined to prove that nothing in the Bible contradicts that. I obviously can't speak for anyone else, but i came to these conclusions despite my preconceived notions because i decided that, no matter how much i wanted to be right, i was going to be honest and follow whatever truth i discovered. I encourage anyone who reads this to look into corner fringe ministries and also a man named David Wilber who I've found to be very intellectually honest with the text. Shalom brothers and sisters.
I am so glad Nikki mentioned the aesthetics because they definitely lured me in. Also, what is the difference between Messianic Judaism vs The Hebrew Roots movement?
Messianic Jews are jews who come to believe in Jesus.
Hebrew Roots is a broad term with many different beliefs, but at the heart, it is Chrostians who come yo realize that we ARE Israel and that God's Law is eternal and loving instructions from our father, so they enjoy the sabbath, dietary guidelines, and biblical feasts.
@@mr.sherrill9137 adding this comment to my collection of kookiest things xtians believe. Replacement theology at its worst right here
@@mr.sherrill9137 The church is NOT Israel.
Unfortunately, this panel is steeped in religious tradition. If you were not a believer and picked up the Scriptures with no religious background and took it at face value, you would land somewhere in the Torah-observing Yeshua follower understanding.
That's for sure! Well said. Torah runs through scripture from beginning to end. It's only the traditions of men that would give you any clue at all about the very dumb idea that God doesn't want us to obey his commandments anymore.
@@YTCelt it’s crazy cause the Old Testament literally predicts the curse of not obeying in the book of Malachi. It’s right in front of our faces.
Christians ✝️ don’t have to love Jesus, BUT if you do he said this.. 🤔 John 14:15
If ye love me, keep my commandments.
Thanks for having us on. It was a pleasure.
Almost got sucked into the Hebrew roots movement/SDA as a baby believer 2 years ago. They seem to work heavily online. Thank God for protecting me from these movements
SDA is not Hebrew Roots. Don't confuse the two. The only thing they have in common is their Sabbath observance.
@@ginette6110 they both have the Galatian heresy in common
@@cameronstolhand7149 the heresy that Paul confronted in the book of Galatians
@@Josh-he7ty I say this with love. For clarity, I follow the Bible, my loyalty is to my King Yeshua. You need to know your Torah to know who our King is. He is the WORD made flesh. Read it again.
2 Peter 3:15-17 warns us "Paul also wrote to you according to the widsom given to him, as he does in all his letters when he speaks....There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant (unlearned) and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do other scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of LAWLESS people and lose your own stability". Ask yourself, who are the lawless? It is those without Torah. Christians claim the law has been done away with.
Psalm 119:05 "Your WORD is a lamp unto my feet and a light to my path" With that in mind, go read the parable of the bridesmaids. The wise and the foolish had lanterns ( The word) but only the wise had oil... how do you produce oil? By honoring his appointed feast and doing his commandments.
Follow Yeshua, not the Romanized/Babylon/Secular version of him. Believers are to be set apart... how can the world identify you as a believer of Yah if you do what the pagans do? How can you be a light?
@@ginette6110 the world can identify me as a believer based on the morally holy life I attempt to live, and the biblical worldview I present them with in conversation, and the gospel message I proclaim to those I converse with about a christian worldview.
They don’t identify me as a believer for my abstinence of pork, my refusal to wear 2 fabrics woven together, my observance of religious festivals, or any other thing regarding food or drink or festival or new moon or sabbath - things which are a mere shadow of what is to come, but the substance of which belongs to Christ.
EUSIBIUS, court bishop of Constantine - 338 AD
“All things whatsoever that it was the duty to do on the Sabbath (the seventh day of the week) we (Constantine, Eusebius, and other bishops) have transferred to the Lord's Day (the first day of the week) as more appropriately belonging to it.”
And the dragon (Satan) and most Sunday Christians were enraged with the woman and who keep the commandments of YAH and have the testimony of Yeshua Messiah. Revelation 12:17
That's not what the text says stop bearing false witness. The term "Sunday Christians" does not appear in the text.
Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Satan went to make war [physically kill in battle] with the remnant of her offspring which keep the commandments of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. The seed is not the Hebrew Roots Movement because the HRM reject Jesus Christ as a pagan man/deity of Christianity and teach the messiah is the biological son of Joseph, this disqualifies the HRM from being the offspring of the woman since they reject her son Jesus.
@@Power88987 Sunday Christianity are her thousands of denominations is the daughter of the roman catholic church and one of Satan's greatest masterpieces.
@@Power88987 IF you're not Israel you're not saved..... ruclips.net/video/5RL2hZSpKEE/видео.html
@@Jeffmacaroni1542 You say there are thousands of denominations then prove it, name 500 denominations which would be only a small token of the thousands you said existed.
Oh the irony. Most people came out of the church precisely because they did read their Bible in context. In fact, I think we should change Hebrew Roots to Whole Bible In Context. When people ask what I am, I already say I’m a whole Bible believer…period.
Oof. Cultish really missed the mark with this one. The first ten minutes already have my blood boiling, characterizing those who observe Torah as biblically illterate and even abusive right off the bat. I am someone who very much understands context, history AND scripture and I choose to keep Sabbath, eat biblically clean, and keep Yahweh's appointed feast days. I do not believe they are salvific and I do so after many years of prayer and careful study.
Perhaps it's a crude term, but "biblical illiteracy" would be applicable here because, as Nikki briefly states, the entire book of Galatians speaks to why we do not need to keep these laws/traditions as new covenant believers. Furthermore, the Apostle Paul debates this very issue with believers who used to belong the party of the Pharisees. He tells them, "Now, therefore, why are you putting God to the test by placing a yoke on the neck of the disciples that neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear? But we believe that we will be saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, just as they will.”
There may be nothing inherently wrong with adhering to the Mosaic laws, but telling people they NEED to observe these things is the mistake of the Hebrew roots movement, and it definitely shows that they do not understand what Jesus and Paul taught. Moreover, these groups can be abusive, which I have seen firsthand as two of my loved ones have joined the Hebrew roots movement and I have seen how their church's leadership has influenced their lives in abusive and cult-like ways.
@@ridiculousgames365 you are completely misreading galatians and all of Paul.
Jesus said not 1 jot or tittle will pass away until all is fulfilled...not until heaven and earth pass away.
Has heaven and earth passed away?
Gentiles don’t observe Torah. They follow the noahide laws
@@mr.sherrill9137Christ fulfilled the law and accomplished all those things. It was not about the physical earth or heavens. It was about surpassing the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees. There is none perfect but Christ. And it truly is finished. He has accomplished what the blood of goats and sheep and bulls and doves could not.
#25:44 You cannot do the law ... Just a thought: in a marriage can you always please your spouse or would you fail sometimes? If you do fail, will you stop trying to please your spouse or is it pointless and you can start doing whatever you want?
If you fail trying to keep the law, you are catched by Gods grace .. but do you stop trying? No, because you love Jesus..
The example of the woman's FB post having a horrible Passover is really inappropriate and misplaced for the point they are trying to make. Has anyone had a horrible easter before? Felt overwhelmed, ruined the dinner, been overly burdened? Dare anyone say yes? A holiday gone wrong does not illustrate that biblical feast are some how different and ought not be practiced. As yall stated not everyone practices the Torah the same. We do not kill any lambs or goats and we certainly don't think a "sacrifice" is required. It's possible, and likely, that the burdens that woman experienced were from a personal expectation and not from the instructive Word of God. Passover is possibly my favorite feast. I enjoy the preparation and reflection of Christ during that time
That first quote is so true, this isn’t sexist, at all, but it usually starts with the women, deceived by little lies that escalate
The Bible says God prefers for people to be in LGBT relationships.
Anyone that teaches the LIE of monetary tithing, sells anything using the gospel, or teaches that same-sex marriage is a sin CHOOSES to die with the wicked.
Luke 10:7 states the only wages for ministering are eating and drinking whatever you are given.
Also, know that rich people will all die. You can't be a Christian, sit on all kinds of money, watch your fellow brothers and sisters starve, suffer, or be homeless, choose to do nothing about it, and think that it's ok. Those are all wolves.
Mathew 19:12 Eunuchs that are born that way are transgender. Eunuchs made that way by others were abused in some way and something inside of them blocks off a certain type of body but it doesn't happen to everyone that is abused. Those that choose to live like Eunuchs FOR THE SAKE OF THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN are bisexual people that choose partners of the same sex-characteristics but opposite in regards to gender. Notice, it states God PREFERS for people to be in LGBT relationships.
Leviticus, Corinthians, and Timothy were translated wrong by Billy Graham. Those verses are actually referring to pedophilia. Romans 1:27 All of the men were male in regards to gender, all of the women were female in gender. It is not referring to Eunuchs (where one partner is transgender). Also, it had nothing to do with marriage of any kind. They were trying to procreate during orgies so God did it on purpose. Anyone that continues to teach same sex marriage is a sin when the Bible says God prefers for people to be in LGBT relationships will also die by their own choice.
Sodom and Gem. was about rape, nothing to do with marriage of any kind.
God made them male and female, determined by gender, located in the brain.
In order to be a church building, the place must house people inside of it. Otherwise it is just another private money-making business part of Babylon that furthers satan's agenda. Stay out of the fake churches.
I am Elijah of Malachi 4:5-6 and Acts 3:22-23 says it will come to pass that anyone that fails to listen to me will be UTTERLY destroyed from among the people. Again, everyone has a choice.
And anyone that deletes my messages CHOOSES to reject Jesus Christ Himself and that means they also CHOOSE to die with the wicked.
I am Elijah so that means any discrepancies in the holy books are ultimately decided by me. I am also to usher in the Messiah! Be ready: Jesus is coming back!
WORLD PEACE IS COMING!!
By the way, anything based on gender norms no longer applies. In fact, the last will be first and the first will be last. It's women that will be ruling the kingdom of heaven.
And rapture is not what most people think. Its when God's true people shine with the glory of God and are miraculously healed. Read Malachi 4:2-4 and the verses surrounding it...........Jesus comes back to rule earth and being taken is not good!
Malachi 2 proves Malachi 3:8-11 is talking to the thieving church leaders. Every single major church and fake preacher on television knew since Augst of 2020 if they brought the money back they were never supposed to take for ministering then God would end Covid but they love money so much they intentionally chose to kill everyone instead of repenting.
Seriously, do you really comprehend that? The church leaders LOVE MONEY SO MUCH that they INTENTIONALLY CHOSE TO KILL PEOPLE instead of repenting. Every time they collect money for ministering they know they are killing people with Covid and they still do it! Could you imagine for almost 2 years walking into your "church" on Sunday and knowing every single time you asked people to take that piece of paper in the back of the pew and pay tithes you knew more people would die from Covid and you did it anyhow? 😭😭😭😭
And you knew monetary tithing was a lie on top of it! So you also wilfully committed fraud.
That is SICK. All these people need prison time for murder and fraud.
WW3 will come if the church fakes dont repent and anyone working for a church will be raped, tortured, and slaughtered.
At some point, fireballs will hit all unrepentant wicked people..
@@elijahthemessengermalachi3105 Everyone will ignore your comment because a) they have read the Bible where not only same sex relations but fornication in general is condemned multiple times in both the Old and New Testaments.
God loves people. He created us. He doesn't want us to die (which those involved in same sex relationships do in greater numbers and earlier than single and married people) and b) SATAN ("the father of lies" as Jesus calls him in John 8:44) wants as many people as possible in same sex relationships because 1/ it's outright rebellion against God and it hastens drug-taking, depression and death to its practitioners and 2/ it's a surefire way for the human race to end.
Satan loves darkness, death and depression.
God loves light, life and joy.
"The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly" (John 10:10)
@@leenieledejo6849 brilliant response. It also goes against God’s command to be fruitful and multiply - if everyone were to change to LGBTQ that would be the end of the human race. So it’s good to think and pray carefully before putting God’s name behind a cause
@@cameronstolhand7149 it’s literally not sexist what I’m saying, these groups target women so of course it starts with women
@@cameronstolhand7149 never said women have bad discernment either. I also trust her judgement because women are just as capable at discernment as men. You apparently don’t think so, what a shame
It would be nice to have the camera focus on Nikki as well as everyone else when she was talking. I really like watching the podcast on you tube and seeing people speaking. It was distracting to see everyone else up close (I feel really helpful) but not her.
The Bible says God prefers for people to be in LGBT relationships.
Anyone that teaches the LIE of monetary tithing, sells anything using the gospel, or teaches that same-sex marriage is a sin CHOOSES to die with the wicked.
Luke 10:7 states the only wages for ministering are eating and drinking whatever you are given.
Also, know that rich people will all die. You can't be a Christian, sit on all kinds of money, watch your fellow brothers and sisters starve, suffer, or be homeless, choose to do nothing about it, and think that it's ok. Those are all wolves.
Mathew 19:12 Eunuchs that are born that way are transgender. Eunuchs made that way by others were abused in some way and something inside of them blocks off a certain type of body but it doesn't happen to everyone that is abused. Those that choose to live like Eunuchs FOR THE SAKE OF THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN are bisexual people that choose partners of the same sex-characteristics but opposite in regards to gender. Notice, it states God PREFERS for people to be in LGBT relationships.
Leviticus, Corinthians, and Timothy were translated wrong by Billy Graham. Those verses are actually referring to pedophilia. Romans 1:27 All of the men were male in regards to gender, all of the women were female in gender. It is not referring to Eunuchs (where one partner is transgender). Also, it had nothing to do with marriage of any kind. They were trying to procreate during orgies so God did it on purpose. Anyone that continues to teach same sex marriage is a sin when the Bible says God prefers for people to be in LGBT relationships will also die by their own choice.
Sodom and Gem. was about rape, nothing to do with marriage of any kind.
God made them male and female, determined by gender, located in the brain.
In order to be a church building, the place must house people inside of it. Otherwise it is just another private money-making business part of Babylon that furthers satan's agenda. Stay out of the fake churches.
I am Elijah of Malachi 4:5-6 and Acts 3:22-23 says it will come to pass that anyone that fails to listen to me will be UTTERLY destroyed from among the people. Again, everyone has a choice.
And anyone that deletes my messages CHOOSES to reject Jesus Christ Himself and that means they also CHOOSE to die with the wicked.
I am Elijah so that means any discrepancies in the holy books are ultimately decided by me. I am also to usher in the Messiah! Be ready: Jesus is coming back!
WORLD PEACE IS COMING!!
By the way, anything based on gender norms no longer applies. In fact, the last will be first and the first will be last. It's women that will be ruling the kingdom of heaven.
And rapture is not what most people think. Its when God's true people shine with the glory of God and are miraculously healed. Read Malachi 4:2-4 and the verses surrounding it...........Jesus comes back to rule earth and being taken is not good!
Malachi 2 proves Malachi 3:8-11 is talking to the thieving church leaders. Every single major church and fake preacher on television knew since Augst of 2020 if they brought the money back they were never supposed to take for ministering then God would end Covid but they love money so much they intentionally chose to kill everyone instead of repenting.
Seriously, do you really comprehend that? The church leaders LOVE MONEY SO MUCH that they INTENTIONALLY CHOSE TO KILL PEOPLE instead of repenting. Every time they collect money for ministering they know they are killing people with Covid and they still do it! Could you imagine for almost 2 years walking into your "church" on Sunday and knowing every single time you asked people to take that piece of paper in the back of the pew and pay tithes you knew more people would die from Covid and you did it anyhow? 😭😭😭😭
And you knew monetary tithing was a lie on top of it! So you also wilfully committed fraud.
That is SICK. All these people need prison time for murder and fraud.
WW3 will come if the church fakes dont repent and anyone working for a church will be raped, tortured, and slaughtered.
At some point, fireballs will hit all unrepentant wicked people..
I was probably being way too weird to have the camera up close. 🤣 I had a baby recently and could barely sit in those chairs. 🤪
I was hoping to get true clarification on this subject. But, I'm sorry to say the information wasn't presented in an organized or coherent way as to be clear, helpful or compelling.
Check beginning of wisdoms channel for specific content on almost any question about this subject. Cant cover it all in a two hour podcast. This is just an intro.
I agree.
Yep super biased and actually contains many false claims about the movement
I agree, nobody here cares about some random person sharing vulnerable struggles on a private Facebook group. That was odd. As if nobody gets stressed when preparing a Christmas or Easter meal
My Mother asked a lady who follows these teachings if missionaries to places like Papua New Guinea where their only source of protein is pork should have to follow dietary laws. She said yes.
How destructive is that?
That’s not how the law works.
Hopefully next episode you will have people who actually keep these things on.
Yeah exactly. Don’t shy away from it. Bring them on and have the discussion to see what they actually believe rather then you telling us what they believe. I can’t believe the amount of untrue things I heard on this episode about people who keep the Torah. I bet they wouldn’t like someone boxing them in with Calvinism into the extreme groups that come from it. It’s unreal how little they actually know about people who believe in keeping the Torah for obedience and trying to walk like their Messiah walked.
@@Ancientpathsfellowship the Cultish guys can’t be and don’t need to be experts on every perspective they invite someone on to discuss. It isn’t their goal to platform every false teacher or belief they talk about to get into debates on their show.
I have interviewed people who disagree with me, such as Caleb Hegg and Dale Tuggy. I would do so even more but Hebrew Roots teachers aren’t exactly tripping over each other to deal with serious challenges to their arguments. Some do, but not many.
It’s funny really. Zach Bauer did some responses to the previous episodes I did with Cultish, but only wanted to respond to Andrew Soncrant, who has not spent as much time learning and engaging with the arguments.
It’s always been my goal to deal with the best the Hebrew Roots movement has to offer. I’m looking forward to being more settled (my family is moving across the country) so I can begin doing more live interactions with these folks.
@@TheBeginningOfWisdom David Wilber has put out a response to you and is more than happy to respond to challenges.
What is Hebrew roots movement I've never heard of it
The Bible says God prefers for people to be in LGBT relationships.
Anyone that teaches the LIE of monetary tithing, sells anything using the gospel, or teaches that same-sex marriage is a sin CHOOSES to die with the wicked.
Luke 10:7 states the only wages for ministering are eating and drinking whatever you are given.
Also, know that rich people will all die. You can't be a Christian, sit on all kinds of money, watch your fellow brothers and sisters starve, suffer, or be homeless, choose to do nothing about it, and think that it's ok. Those are all wolves.
Mathew 19:12 Eunuchs that are born that way are transgender. Eunuchs made that way by others were abused in some way and something inside of them blocks off a certain type of body but it doesn't happen to everyone that is abused. Those that choose to live like Eunuchs FOR THE SAKE OF THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN are bisexual people that choose partners of the same sex-characteristics but opposite in regards to gender. Notice, it states God PREFERS for people to be in LGBT relationships.
Leviticus, Corinthians, and Timothy were translated wrong by Billy Graham. Those verses are actually referring to pedophilia. Romans 1:27 All of the men were male in regards to gender, all of the women were female in gender. It is not referring to Eunuchs (where one partner is transgender). Also, it had nothing to do with marriage of any kind. They were trying to procreate during orgies so God did it on purpose. Anyone that continues to teach same sex marriage is a sin when the Bible says God prefers for people to be in LGBT relationships will also die by their own choice.
Sodom and Gem. was about rape, nothing to do with marriage of any kind.
God made them male and female, determined by gender, located in the brain.
In order to be a church building, the place must house people inside of it. Otherwise it is just another private money-making business part of Babylon that furthers satan's agenda. Stay out of the fake churches.
I am Elijah of Malachi 4:5-6 and Acts 3:22-23 says it will come to pass that anyone that fails to listen to me will be UTTERLY destroyed from among the people. Again, everyone has a choice.
And anyone that deletes my messages CHOOSES to reject Jesus Christ Himself and that means they also CHOOSE to die with the wicked.
I am Elijah so that means any discrepancies in the holy books are ultimately decided by me. I am also to usher in the Messiah! Be ready: Jesus is coming back!
WORLD PEACE IS COMING!!
By the way, anything based on gender norms no longer applies. In fact, the last will be first and the first will be last. It's women that will be ruling the kingdom of heaven.
And rapture is not what most people think. Its when God's true people shine with the glory of God and are miraculously healed. Read Malachi 4:2-4 and the verses surrounding it...........Jesus comes back to rule earth and being taken is not good!
Malachi 2 proves Malachi 3:8-11 is talking to the thieving church leaders. Every single major church and fake preacher on television knew since Augst of 2020 if they brought the money back they were never supposed to take for ministering then God would end Covid but they love money so much they intentionally chose to kill everyone instead of repenting.
Seriously, do you really comprehend that? The church leaders LOVE MONEY SO MUCH that they INTENTIONALLY CHOSE TO KILL PEOPLE instead of repenting. Every time they collect money for ministering they know they are killing people with Covid and they still do it! Could you imagine for almost 2 years walking into your "church" on Sunday and knowing every single time you asked people to take that piece of paper in the back of the pew and pay tithes you knew more people would die from Covid and you did it anyhow? 😭😭😭😭
And you knew monetary tithing was a lie on top of it! So you also wilfully committed fraud.
That is SICK. All these people need prison time for murder and fraud.
WW3 will come if the church fakes dont repent and anyone working for a church will be raped, tortured, and slaughtered.
At some point, fireballs will hit all unrepentant wicked people..
This ended up being a pretty good promotion of the HRM. The gal relates a forum confession of a woman who had a bad Passover & her conclusion is "Trying to keep the Law is dangerous - so dangerous!" Yikes. I don't see how a lot of the statements of the speakers in this video even pass muster in the reformed community.
I think it's pretty disingenuous for you guys to not actually bring one on and allow them to present their case but then you'd have to rebutt their claims using scripture instead of strawmanning.
Was hoping to hear some good rebuttals of common Hebrew Roots doctrine, but was disappointed. I hope some others join that can dig deeper. Most people watching this channel probably don't care about random anecdotes from a private Facebook group. Maybe pull up a video from 119 Ministries or Unlearn the Lies and rebuttal it. It would be much more beneficial to both perspectives.
The interviewee does that for thousands of hours on his channel. Beginning of Wisdom. Check it out. 😉 Many people who have been through the abuse of these false teachers have messaged us that this was edifying to them personally. Sorry it wasn't what you wanted. 🥴
I am not forming a rebuttal, as there wasn't much in any of these videos to answer. I don't think that they really want an answer to why people are going into HR. If they wanted an answer, they would actually know some of the doctrine and test it to the Word. Most of what I see are personal experiences or hearsay that many people in the HRM would not tolerate either. The examples they give are either people that are hate filled, or babies in the faith. I am not in the HRM, as I turned back to the narrow path before I had ever even heard of HRM. They associate it with people of the past that may have been cult leaders, but they don't realize that what they believe was also associated with like people. Most Christianity today came out of Catholicism, but it wouldn't be fair to put Calvinists on the same level as Catholics. I have a comment on the main thread that I will use to lay out my doctrine and why I see it that way. This doesn't mean I am HR, but that alot of my beliefs line up with them. Many HR may disagree, and that is fine. I am simply laying out my own walk. It may take some time to finish.
Why not include people like David Wilber or Sean Griffin when having these discussions vs using fringe level ideas that most of us who appreciate the Hebraic roots of our scriptures?
Matthew 7:22-23 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work INIQUITY
STRONG'S NUMBER 458:
WITHOUT LAW
because of ignorance of the law or violation of the law or contempt of the law!
Thanks guys, I got it of this movement due to their radical beliefs. Thank you for dealing with this one
I just assume you guys already know that Zach Bauer is crucifying you guys. His 7 videos make your arguments look extremely weak, juvenile, unbiblical, unresearched etc .. Do better?
The comment section is informative as always . Thank you God for sending your Son to free us from the law of sin and death!
I just found your video and I have a question. Did Paul keep the Sabbath? Did Paul quit keeping the feasts? CAN YOU SEND ME SCRIPTURE PROOFS FOR YOUR ANSWERS? Thank you.
Paul wrote the following -
Collosians 2:16-23
16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ. 18 Let no one cheat you of your reward, taking delight in false humility and worship of angels, intruding into those things which he has not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind, 19 and not holding fast to the Head, from whom all the body, nourished and knit together by joints and ligaments, grows with the increase that is from God.
20 Therefore, if you died with Christ from the basic principles of the world, why, as though living in the world, do you subject yourselves to regulations- 21 “Do not touch, do not taste, do not handle,” 22 which all concern things which perish with the using-according to the commandments and doctrines of men? 23 These things indeed have an appearance of wisdom in self-imposed religion, false humility, and neglect of the body, but are of no value against the indulgence of the flesh.
Seems pretty clear to me. Paul unequivocally states that Sabbath or feast days are not obligatory for believers, regardless of whether he himself chose to continue observing them.
I’m very sorry lost your child but I also lost a child. You must not have seen the added comments to the post . This experience of my Passover was something that helped me. It made me feel what Yahusha felt when he died a sinless death and was perfect and no one cares just like they didn’t care how hard it was to keep a biblically kept feast y’all are deceiving people because your pain. You should go read the added comments this helped me feel my messiahs pain. Y’all will never know the emotional depth to this because your to Domesticated to know how to keep the beast and think that it’s awful to kill an animal when you get meat at the grocery store. Glad I was shown this but you got only half of it not how I felt fully.
I'm not Hebrew roots but I am pronomian. Meaning I keep the Sabbath, the feasts, eat biblically clean and any other laws that apply to me. I'm also a reformed, calvinist and would say my beliefs line up with reformed Presbyterian. The only difference between me and a mainline reformed Presbyterian is that I keep the Sabbath and the feasts. And don't eat pork. I still go to church on Sunday but I also rest on Saturday. There really isn't much of a difference.
I believe you can operate in Christian liberty this way, but the issue arises in "What ought we do?"
That's the sticking point.
@@toddcote4904 I see it as a part of my sanctification as a Christian. I would never tell another Christian that they have to do the same as me. I would be happy to teach them all about why I do it and even encourage them to research and test what I say. But at the end of the day I do not believe It is a salvation issue. There are many traditions in the church that people keep and do so in a dogmatic way and that's fine. I see keeping the law in a similar light. I do it because I love God and want to keep His laws. Just like celebrating Christmas because you love Christ and want to remember His birth. I wouldn't say someone is sinning because they didn't have Christmas one year, or easter for that matter.
@John S. Biblically clean and unclean is different from kosher. For example kosher is a Jewish tradition and not biblically based, it comes from the Talmudic tradition, which has very little to do with the clean and unclean laws in the Torah. Leviticus lays out what is clean and unclean to eat, for example an animal must have a cloven hoof and chew the cud to be clean and a fish must have both fina and scales to be clean. Where kosher is different is that it has to meet the requirements of rabbinic tradition.
@John S. In western nations, it's the law that a butcher has to drain the blood from the animals. So the likelihood of you buying meat with blood in it is extremely low. A lot of people believe that the red stuff you see in your medium rare steak is blood but in fact it is not. It is myoglobin.
@John S. Western civilization was built on common law which was based on biblical law. So a lot of laws we have today trace their lineage back to the Torah. Unfortunately we have drifted further and further away from biblical law and we have taken for granted the many gifts our ancestors gave us by implementing biblical principles in our laws. But yes, western animals are killed then drained of blood. They actually use the blood for other byproducts like fertilizer.
Maybe people are looking for more of what the Bible says rather than modern tattoo, beer and jeans churches.
Actually many of these groups deny the whole book of Galatians.
@@NikkiSchumacherOfficial Many of these modern groups deny the whole Old Testament.
@@onemindonespirit two wrongs don't make a right. 😉
Don't forget beard oil. We gotta have that beard oil.
@@YTCelt Beard oil?????
Great conversation! Loved seeing Drew and Nikki on here 😊
I still think you should keep the Sabbath it is one of the 10 commandments so what's the arguement for ditching that one and nit the others??? As fie the other laws I agree
You're definitely free to but it is not repeated as a command in the New Testament so you are also free to not 🤍
POPE SYLVESTER - 325 AD
Officially named Sunday “the Lord's Day”
So the pope can change what God ordained?
@@ellenhinklehearthome7567 I wrote that because it is so absurd. Protestants think that the disciples called it that, but it was the Catholics that did that. So, you are right, Catholics can't change what God ordained. :)
I have been recently watching videos on this topic as I am stepping away from a fellow Hebrew Roots movement and was expecting to come to a video like this.
While I truly appreciate the discussion of this movement I just wish to say that it is not the lack of “male spiritual leadership”..
Telling the audience to come out of the Hebrew Roots movement to Complementarianism (the belief that men and women have different gender roles, headship over women, male spiritual leadership) is just going from one jail to another if you ask me. (This coming from a Christian Egalitarian like me we believe in full equality in home, church, and ministry)
We women have always taken the blame, starting with Adam back in the Garden.. and while many women may have been spiritual leaders it that movement, it doesn’t make it wrong, the movement is wrong, not the spiritual leadership of women.
From the start we have equality between the sexes, made in God´s image and given dominion over the earth ( Genesis 1:27,) it is only after the fall that we have patriarchy, aka male headship over women (Genesis 3:16). It is very disheartening to see women teaching this stuff, but unfortunately not surprising…look for the meaning of “head” as used in Ephesians 5 to see the TRUE meaning of that word, not to mention the man is never called the head of the home, or the spiritual leader of the home, neither in Torah or the New Testament…
I will not make this post longer but look into books like God´s word to Women by Katherine Bushnell, The Making of Biblical Womanhood by Beth Allison Barr or even visit the websites www. Godswordtowomen.org , or www.cbeinternational.org/ to find good resources and overall GOOD THEOLOGY ..And no is not about feminist deception or however some may call it, is the call to FULL EQUALITY in ministry and home that we believe, based on what I think is very well-researched scholarship from multiple historians, theologians, pastors (men and women ) .
I know the video is about the dangers of the HRM but I just felt this needed to be said. Hope you get to read this and hopefully open your eyes, the last thing this world needs is more women under subjugation or even the poor men taking the blame for supposedly not “leading”. Patriarchy, (even supposedly “Biblical patriarchy” which is the same thing) is plain wrong and a result of the Fall, not mandated. I think it is time we follow Christ and HIS treatment of women as our first example and as it was mentioned in the video, look for good scholarship.
God bless.
"make not my Father's house a house of merchandise" John 2:16
Hi everyone. First of all, I don’t know anything about this channel as it just came across my feed. I don’t watch it or know anything about these people. Mainly got sucked into the comments section. I’ve been born again for 10 years (you can watch my testimony on my channel), and I can honestly say, I’ve had A LOT of convictions, mainly to leave sin and convictions about my hearts motives and a desire to continually crucify my flesh and to love God and people better. This includes not walking in sin. I’ve also left the modern day institutionalized Christian churches almost 4 years ago and fully believe the majority of them are following another Jesus and promoting a lot of false doctrines. My family and I also don’t celebrate the holidays simply because I think they are carnal and all the traditions involved with them don’t really glorify God in my conviction. I am continually speaking out about the modern days Christian churches and exposing their lies and hypocrisy. I don’t have many friends because of it. It’s all dead religion and man made traditions and a lot of paganism adopted into “the church.” With all that being said, the Holy Spirit has led me to do a lot of things to help me to continue to transform more into Christ likeness, but I have NEVER felt the slightest conviction to go back to Torah or observe the feasts. I didn’t even look into it until I had a friend pushing this teaching online. I didn’t even know this was a thing. It felt very weird and foreign to me since I love the scriptures and love to study them. She denies being Hebrew roots and claims the Holy Spirit and the Bible led her there. Yet, when I go to her profile around the time of her conversion to following Torah, I see posts and traces of what? Hebrew Roots pages, teachings, and videos. Showing me she did get her influences from somewhere other than alone time with God and her Bible. I decided to dig into this doctrine and have found this comes down to one basic thing. This misunderstanding of the biblical covenants. It’s not about the proof texts many of you bring. The foundation of this error comes from not properly understanding the biblical covenants. Also a lack of knowing the letter of the law and the spirit of the law in full. I have read through Galatians with an open mind and I do not see how anybody could ever come to the conclusion that non- Torah observant people are the ones twisting Paul’s words. It is very clear that Paul is rebuking Judaizers like yourselves. I will attach a video that I believe it one of the best I have seen explaining the biblical covenants and also a teaching on law and grace. I am not promoting the ministry of the man in the video. I don’t even believe in denominations and this man claims one. However, I’ve watched this teaching 3 times and he does a wonderful job of explaining the biblical covenants. God bless. May we find the truth.
The biblical covenants:
ruclips.net/video/7VOb9gt_Ud0/видео.html&feature=shares
Understanding the new covenant. Law & Grace:
ruclips.net/video/H5_-0NxdRqQ/видео.html&feature=shares
Christmas is not in December.
Luke 1:5-6- Zachariah is a priest. This means he would have used YHVH'S calendar not the Gregorian calendar that wasn't even in existence yet. They were righteous before God. Why?
Luke 1:26 in the 6th month, which using YHVH'S calendar would've been the month of Elul, the angel visited Mary
Luke 1:36 in Elul, Elizabeth was six months pregnant and Mary conceived.
This put John's birth in the 10th biblical month of chislev six months later Yeshua is born in the 3rd biblical month of Sivan-more than likely on Shavuot (Pentacost/Feast of Weeks).
Well there goes our biblical illiteracy again 🙄
The name Yeshua is never mentioned in the Bible in regards to Jesus Christ, only Iēsous in the Greek, when someone says Yeshua Ha'mashiach they are saying "Joshua the savior" in relation to the Bible
Yeshua is in the Hebrew Matthew 🤗
Yehoshua is in hebrew...YEshua in arameic ..so people have been miss understanding..becaus ejust some one...told Yeshua is jesus in hebrew..and now everyone even the converted in Israel..says Yeshua is Jesus..but its wrong ..its in aramaic..
@@InfoArtistJKatTheGoodInfoCafe where's the manuscript evidence
And not a single shred of evidence of a Hebrew NT, Matthew or otherwise.
The Holy Spirit inspired the Greek. Iēsous - Jesus Christ- is declared the name above every name. That is the name I bow to, and in which has power.
@@ExNihiloComesNothing Amen
Have you guys done any research on " Cern" and cult worshippers following this
CONSTANTINE - Council of Nicea: 325 AD
“First of all, it appeared an unworthy thing that in the celebration of this most holy feast we should follow the practice of the Jews, who have impiously defiled their hands with enormous sin, and are, therefore, deservedly afflicted with blindness of soul. For we have it in our power, if we abandon their custom, to prolong the due observance of this ordinance to future ages, by a truer order, which we have preserved from the very day of the passion until the present time. Let us then have nothing in common with the detestable Jewish crowd; for we have received from our Saviour a different way.” (Constantine’s words at the council of Nicaea concerning the celebration of a new Spring Holy Day.)
Perhaps you got to a place in the vids where you taught from scripture rather than mischaracterizing so many with your broad-brush and deriding these people, some of which are surely brothers and sisters. I've subscribed with notifications should you post a multi-series on the lack of scriptural depth of evangelicals and their susceptibility to cultish doctrine, cultish ecumenical movements permeating Yeshua's ekklésia and of course the Babylonian cult AKA Catholicism. BTW I'm not of The Hebrew Roots Movement but those I know of bring much better understanding of history, the life of the Messiah in the gospels and depth to scripture beyond the Tanak.
Exodus 31:14 “Therefore you are to keep the Sabbath, for it is holy to you. Everyone who profanes it must be put to death; for whoever does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from among his people. 15 For six days work may be done, but on the seventh day there is a Sabbath of complete rest [Exodus 20:8-11; Leviticus 23:1-3], holy to the Lord; whoever does any work on the Sabbath day must be put to death.“ (NASB)
Exodus 35:1 Then Moses assembled all the congregation of the sons of Israel, and said to them, “These are the things that the Lord has commanded you to do: 2 “For six days work may be done, but on the seventh day you shall have a holy day, a Sabbath of complete rest to the Lord [Exodus 20:8-11; Leviticus 23:1-3]; whoever does any work on it shall be put to death.“ (NASB)
Numbers 15:32 Now while the sons of Israel were in the wilderness [Heb. midbar], they found a man gathering wood on the Sabbath day [Exodus 20:8-11; Leviticus 23:1-3]. 33 And those who found him gathering wood brought him to Moses and Aaron, and to all the congregation; 34 and they placed him in custody, because it had not been decided what should be done to him. 35 Then the Lord said to Moses, “The man must be put to death [Exodus 31:14-15; Exodus 35:1-2; Deuteronomy 27:26; Matthew 5:18]; all the congregation shall stone him with stones outside the camp.” 36 So all the congregation [Heb. edah] brought him outside the camp and stoned him to death with stones, just as the Lord had commanded Moses. (NASB)
Hebrews 3:17 And with whom was He angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose dead bodies fell in the wilderness [Heb. midbar]? 18 And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest [Psalm 95:11], but to those who were disobedient? (NASB)
Deuteronomy 27:26 “ ‘Cursed is anyone who does not fulfill the words of this Law by doing them.’ And all the people shall say, ‘Amen.’ “ (NASB)
Matthew 5:18 “For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away [Revelation 21], not the smallest letter or stroke of a letter shall pass from the Law, until all is accomplished!“ (NASB)
It's the ministry of death (Exodus 31:14-15; Exodus 35:1-2; Numbers 15:32-36; Deuteronomy 27:26; Matthew 5:18), engraved in letters on stones (2 Corinthians 3).
The one who has ears, let him hear.
The three lawless stooges.
Yep, helping to bring about the Lawless One and increase the number of people that will someday hear, "Away from me, you workers of Lawlessness". Stooges indeed.
The lengths and circles christians go through to try and keep and defend the pagan holidays is outstanding 😆 Whenever I preach the truth to christians about christmas, easter, valentines day, thanksgiving, etc, the demons of paganism fly out.
These days have nothing to do with Messiah or our faith. Just because you put a christian twist on a pagan holiday doesn’t magically make it unpagan. These holy days have been around since Babylon, Christians really need to study. There is no reason why any christian should partake in these pagan holidays and idol worship.
Oh, for God's sake - Jesus himself would have celebrated Hanukkah whose ultimate roots go back to a pagan fire festival celebrated at the winter solstice.
@@kavikv.d.hexenholtz3474 When did Jesus celebrate that..? He celebrated the festivals of Yah.
@@kavikv.d.hexenholtz3474 also don’t take His name in vain 🙏
@@AMKmusic96
He was a first century Jew. Hanukkah became established as a festival in Judaism about 200 years before his birth. It was (and still is)known as the Feast of the Dedication/the Festival of Lights. As a first century observant Jew, he would have celebrated it. See John 10:22-24.
[[[[ Jesus himself would have celebrated Hanukkah whose ultimate roots go back to a pagan fire festival celebrated at the winter solstice. ]]]]]
Hanukkah had nothing to do with a pagan fire festival or winter solstice.
The eight-day Jewish celebration known as Hanukkah or Chanukah commemorates the rededication during the second century B.C. of the Second Temple in Jerusalem, where the Jews had risen up against their Greek-Syrian oppressors in the Maccabean Revolt. It's the commemoration of the victory of the Maccabees over the army of Antiochus Epiphanes. That is what Hanukkah is.
And yes Jesus celebrated Hanukkah in John 10:22-24, so claiming it's pagan fire worship and winter solstice is calling the sinless son of God a sinner, when you keyboard warriors meet Jesus there will be hell to pay for all your comments you've left over the internet, mark my words Kavik HELL TO PAY.
Dangers of Hebrew roots, They teach we must obey Scripture, how dare they!! LOL
Exactly. And to imitate and live the way that Jesus did too? Are they crazy? It's obviously a cult! How dare these people value scripture and the example of Jesus over the traditions of men!
Look into when this takes place. God doesn't change.. Obey His Commands.
Isaiah 66:17
[17]They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the midst, eating swine's flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, saith the LORD.
😮 “Gluten” remove gluten for Passover 🤣 🤣 😂 you lost all credibility
Ok ima go find in the Bible where the apostles celebrated Halloween
Where they celebrated Xmas 🤣
Right after I find the egg laying rabbit 🐇 in the book of acts 😝
Much love and respect, but you all need to read your Bible in context
May God bless you and open your eyes
@12:35... Jesus had His final PASSOVER meal with His disciples: Mark 14:12 And the FIRST DAY OF UNLEAVENED BREAD, when they killed the PASSOVER, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the PASSOVER?
This Passover question by disciples is actually the first night AFTER Passover, which is the first night of Unleavened Bread. Since Jesus was crucified the next day(a friday-the preparation day) (Mark 15:42). the feast of unleavened bread would have started on a Thursday evening because the first and last days of unleavened bread are rest days (Leviticus 23:7-8). Jesus was buried on friday before sundown because sundown starts the Sabbath (Mark 15:42). He was in the tomb the whole of Sabbath.
The resurrection, which happened to fall on a sunday, was actually the Feast of First Fruits (Leviticus 23:10-11). It was the first sunday after the Sabbath during unleavened bread. Which is why Paul states the He is the FIRST FRUITS of the resurrection (1 Corinthians 15:20)
But being biblically illiterate guess we don't know what we're talking about.
“He’s giving law”? You really think Christ brought a new law? He taught His father’s law.
In my suggested videos I’ve been getting videos of these beautiful young women reading the Old Testament pronouncing the names in what they say is correct. I thought they were Jewish woman who found Jesus. But the more I started watching I felt they were more of a “hook”. I was curious to understand what they were into and now this video explains it! There was just something about these videos that felt off yet intriguing.
This video explains nothing but a mischaracterization of those of us who want to Obey God.
Don't you guys find it interesting that most of the text you're dealing with, you need to inject some kind of contrived lens to make it fit your theology, because the plain meaning seemed to agree too much with a more consistent and cohesive view of the 66 books of The Bible?
Yes, nobody ever gets stressed out when preparing a Christmas or Easter meal.
Yeah- cause that's what I was saying. 🙄 Love it when y'all put words in my mouth.
Let me clarify for the rare passersby who cares what I think.
If a believer gets stressed because they think they HAVE to prepare the meal to be lawful, they don't have their eyes on Christ- no matter what denomination they are.
You're telling a woman with a freshly dead child that holidays are supposed to be stressful? 🤣 Oh the irony. I can't think of any holiday that has ever been stressful to me- because I don't have to observe them
If I don't want to. They are a celebration but not a requirement. If I was stressed from trying to earn my righteousness on a holiday, (not saying it couldn't happen because I have sin just like the next person) I would repent.
@@exeshesis751 You are missing my point.
Someone being upset or stressed about preparing a meal they were looking forward to, and it not turning out how they wanted is not legalism. And I'm sure it happens to everyone, regardless of the occasion. I don't know who you are talking about in that message, but the majority of people I know keeping passover don't do so to earn salvation, they are just following in the footsteps of Jesus, as he kept the passover, and desire to worship God the way He asked His people to.
@@tylerrowland5354 listen to the story again. I actually saw the woman’s post she was talking about. She wasn’t just stressed about making a holiday meal. She was stressed thinking she had disappointed God because she didn’t get it perfect as prescribed in the Torah. To think you can “let God down” in the new covenant because your obedience to the law was less than perfect is heaping a burden on oneself and proves our point. It is making for a works based righteousness rather than Jesus imputing his righteousness to us making us right withGod based on Jesus righteousness alone and taking the focus off of our attempts to please God
Every year on average 160 houses burn down from Christmas tree fires 🔥 😳 but they were all okay because it's all about Jesus. No stress there at all.
@@Anamericanhomestead thats a really dumb comment sorry.
I dont get it. How are you going to try and separate the10 commandments from the rest of the Torah?
This makes me so sad. You do not understand scripture or the context within which it was written. God have mercy on you for what you are saying.
Jesus was not of the tribe of Levi but he is of the tribe of Judah. But yet he is a high priest, which means the law from necessity has changed.
Hebrew 7:12
Not Hebrew Roots, but it’s ridiculous to come at it from a “what are they trying to read into the text” when you are literally the ones reading a “the law is irrelevant” perspective into every NT scripture
Hebrew Roots is crazy but there's no effing way Jesus died on a Friday. I mean just the one verse where it says after the Sabbaths plural should be enough.
Thank you for this a year later
This “came about” because people actully read the bible. Jesus was the sacrifice that did away with OT animal sacrifices. Not one bit of the law will be removed until ALL is accomplished, ie revelation and the second coming of Christ. It is not that difficult to understand.
Hebrews 4:9 says there remains a sabbath keeping for God’s people.
“So then, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God,”
Hebrews 4:9 ESV
“So there remains a Shabbat-keeping for God’s people.”
Messianic Jews (Heb) 4:9 CJB
“So there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God.”
Hebrews 4:9 NASB
I really enjoy Cultish..It is a reference of other's experience and understanding; however, Sometimes, there are ppl that come on who are not entirely knowledgeable, so make sure you do your own research. Easter is a pagan holiday, and for them to defend it as a "Christian" thing is absurd... often many Christians do not want to change traditions they have always done, let alone question things such as the Easter Bunny. This has nothing to do with Christ, obviously. 1 Timothy 4:7.. see other verses instructing us to refrain from such things.
Why does Deuteronomy 13 mention the false prophet leading others to go after other gods? That's not an exhaustive list. It's the first commandment; meaning, once you go after other gods, you're going to continue to break the other commands of the Father. It starts with changing your allegiance. Who you worship is what you do. That's why the Father starts with a false prophet teaching others to pursue some other way than the way of the Father.
And, what does he command in that chapter? To love him and to keep his commandments because he would bring a false teacher along to test their hearts.
If we cannot soundly teach the first bit of the scriptures, should we even proceed to try to teach the rest? No. If we can't get the test for the false prophet correct, why move any further in the name of Christ?
To teach a law-abolishing Messiah is to teach a false Messiah. When you follow after a false Messiah, you will disobey the Father, and pursue another god from the idolatrous imaginations of men.
COUNCIL OF LAODICEA - 361 AD
CANON 29
Christians must not judaize by resting on the Sabbath, but must work on that day, rather honouring the Lord's Day; and, if they can, resting then as Christians. But if any shall be found to be judaizers, let them be anathema from Christ.
CANON 37
It is not lawful to receive portions sent from the feasts of Jews or heretics, nor to feast together with them.
CANON 38
It is not lawful to receive unleavened bread from the Jews, nor to be partakers of their impiety.
Sheesh, I’m not Hebrew roots but denying that Easter isn’t pagan is ridiculous. Maybe you should do some research. Talk about denial.
" Tell me, you who want ( desire) to be under law, do you not listen ( hear) the law?
22 For it is written Abraham had Two sons, One by the Bondwoman and One by the free woman.
23 But the son (Ishmael) by the bond woman( Hager) was born according to the flesh, And the Son by the free woman ( Sarah) through the promise.
24 This is allegorically speaking, for these women are two covenants: one proceeding from Mount Sinai ( the Torah) bearing children who are to be slaves; she is Hagar
25 Now this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present, for she is in slavery with her children.
26 But the Jerusalem above is free; she is our mother. ( The law of Christ)
27 For it is written,
" Rejoice, barren women who does not bear;
Break forth and shout, you who are not in labor;
For more numerous are the children of the desolate.
Than of the one who has a husband."
28 And you bretheren, like Isaac are children of the promise.
29 But as at that time he who was born according to the flesh (Ishmael) persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, (Isaac) So it is now also.
30 But what does the scripture say?
"Cast out the bond woman and her son,
For the son of the bondwoman so not being fair with the son of the free woman."
31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman,( torah-covenant) but of the free woman woman ( the New covenant/ the law of the spirit of life in Christ)" Galatians 4:21-31 ( emphasis mine, added for clarity)
So when i first came to Christ i really got into the Hebrew roots And even to this day i don't eat pork or shellfish lol but as i read the new testement in full i realized i was under the Torah of Christ not the torah of Moses.that Adonai wrote his law on my heart for i was made new in Christ Yeshua. Something i don't like is the sacred name cults who obcess over names not knowing how things are transliterated. Iesuos Yeshua and Jesus(joshua) are the same name.it means salvation and it fits him perfect. I love his name in all language.
Amen
The Bible says God prefers for people to be in LGBT relationships.
Anyone that teaches the LIE of monetary tithing, sells anything using the gospel, or teaches that same-sex marriage is a sin CHOOSES to die with the wicked.
Luke 10:7 states the only wages for ministering are eating and drinking whatever you are given.
Also, know that rich people will all die. You can't be a Christian, sit on all kinds of money, watch your fellow brothers and sisters starve, suffer, or be homeless, choose to do nothing about it, and think that it's ok. Those are all wolves.
Mathew 19:12 Eunuchs that are born that way are transgender. Eunuchs made that way by others were abused in some way and something inside of them blocks off a certain type of body but it doesn't happen to everyone that is abused. Those that choose to live like Eunuchs FOR THE SAKE OF THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN are bisexual people that choose partners of the same sex-characteristics but opposite in regards to gender. Notice, it states God PREFERS for people to be in LGBT relationships.
Leviticus, Corinthians, and Timothy were translated wrong by Billy Graham. Those verses are actually referring to pedophilia. Romans 1:27 All of the men were male in regards to gender, all of the women were female in gender. It is not referring to Eunuchs (where one partner is transgender). Also, it had nothing to do with marriage of any kind. They were trying to procreate during orgies so God did it on purpose. Anyone that continues to teach same sex marriage is a sin when the Bible says God prefers for people to be in LGBT relationships will also die by their own choice.
Sodom and Gem. was about rape, nothing to do with marriage of any kind.
God made them male and female, determined by gender, located in the brain.
In order to be a church building, the place must house people inside of it. Otherwise it is just another private money-making business part of Babylon that furthers satan's agenda. Stay out of the fake churches.
I am Elijah of Malachi 4:5-6 and Acts 3:22-23 says it will come to pass that anyone that fails to listen to me will be UTTERLY destroyed from among the people. Again, everyone has a choice.
And anyone that deletes my messages CHOOSES to reject Jesus Christ Himself and that means they also CHOOSE to die with the wicked.
I am Elijah so that means any discrepancies in the holy books are ultimately decided by me. I am also to usher in the Messiah! Be ready: Jesus is coming back!
WORLD PEACE IS COMING!!
By the way, anything based on gender norms no longer applies. In fact, the last will be first and the first will be last. It's women that will be ruling the kingdom of heaven.
And rapture is not what most people think. Its when God's true people shine with the glory of God and are miraculously healed. Read Malachi 4:2-4 and the verses surrounding it...........Jesus comes back to rule earth and being taken is not good!
Malachi 2 proves Malachi 3:8-11 is talking to the thieving church leaders. Every single major church and fake preacher on television knew since Augst of 2020 if they brought the money back they were never supposed to take for ministering then God would end Covid but they love money so much they intentionally chose to kill everyone instead of repenting.
Seriously, do you really comprehend that? The church leaders LOVE MONEY SO MUCH that they INTENTIONALLY CHOSE TO KILL PEOPLE instead of repenting. Every time they collect money for ministering they know they are killing people with Covid and they still do it! Could you imagine for almost 2 years walking into your "church" on Sunday and knowing every single time you asked people to take that piece of paper in the back of the pew and pay tithes you knew more people would die from Covid and you did it anyhow? 😭😭😭😭
And you knew monetary tithing was a lie on top of it! So you also wilfully committed fraud.
That is SICK. All these people need prison time for murder and fraud.
WW3 will come if the church fakes dont repent and anyone working for a church will be raped, tortured, and slaughtered.
At some point, fireballs will hit all unrepentant wicked people..
Christ was the God who gave Moses the Torah, so it's pretty ignorant to try to pass off the OT laws as something Moses invented. The laws he received was not invented by men. It was given by God. God said they are _His_ laws all throughout the Torah.
@@elijahthemessengermalachi3105 Read Romans 1
@@decepticonxhunter4850 Exactly.
It blows my mind how many Lukewarm Christians do not understand these simple concepts.
The Law is the morality of God given to man and is never changing.
Do you know why you attend church on Sundays?
Please watch a video called:
"WHO CHANGED THE SABBATH" by Hope Through Prophecy
Did Hebrew Roots movement flow out of dispensationalism?
There are 10 commandments, not 9. Observing the Sabbath day is a commandment.
Do you have any videos with a oneness believer? I searched and didn't see any. How do you approach their belief in Jesus? Is it the same way you do with an LDS?
Oneness is a cult.
You know, reading people’s private posts and stating that you have screenshots of everything is pretty terrible. Not to mention laughing while describing people who are trying to honor God with their lives. If Apologia studios had an ounce of integrity or respect for these people they would take these down.
Yeah, following the Bible… What a cult.
Is it your opinion that non torah observers are not following the whole of scriptures and that we are part of Babylon like so many Hebrew Rooters like to accuse us of?
@@angelcollector22 no you aren’t Babylon but you are missing out on something that is good for you. The law is good. It is not a burden. Jesus taught that those who set aside the least of the commandments will be least in the kingdom of heaven. Does that not concern you a little bit? When Jesus comes back will we be keeping the law in the kingdom? These are important questions. Not trying to spew hate and I’m sorry if someone has but if someone really follows torah and they have shown you hate then they aren’t following Torah. But these are important so I hope you at least look into it.
@@Ancientpathsfellowship I have done 5 years of study into Hebrew roots so I have looked into it. In fact, I pretty much study its claims daily for the last 5 years.
No, it does not concern me because I understand Jesus statement in the context of the Old versus New covenant. Hebrews, of course, sheds a lot of light on that.
I don't think anyone has spewed hate on me necessarily. Much of the Hebrew roots movement does indeed believe the churches are part of Babylon and that believers need to come out of the churches.
@@angelcollector22 Yes this belief is pervasive but not just in the Hebrew movement. Search “United states of Egypt” by Dante Fortson. He’s a Hebrew roots Christian but in that series talks about the symbolism between America and Egypt that many non-Hebrew Christians have surmised. Also, there’s an entire documentary called “From Babylon to America” that talks about how America is mystery Babylon spoken of in Jeremiah and Isaiah. It has millions of views on RUclips.
Jesus being murdered: “I DID NOT COME TO ABOLISH THE LAW.” Period.
Friday to Sunday. Count and see how you can get 3 days AND 3 nights. 3 days and 2 nights is all you get. Simple math.
Most of our holidays do have pagan roots because the Roman empire was transitioning to Christianity as the nationally accepted religion & to make it easier for those practicing paganism much of their pagan traditions were allowed to be carried over.
I'm not sure why the Easter-Eostre thing "cracks you up", Easter is full of Pagan symbolism & tradition, much of it directly correlated to the "goddess" Eostre, what does Christ's resurrection have to do with eggs & rabbits? 🤨 you say maybe it's about spring but we aren't celebrating spring, thats what the pagans do lol celebrating the creation rather than the creator.
Valentines Day is another one that is inherently pagan & yet we see Christians partaking & most have no idea of it's origins. There's extremists & people struggling with demon strongholds that latch on to certain truthes, using them to discredit people with Hebrew roots is like using judgmental Christians with religious spirits to discredit all of Christianity.
WHOSE MARK WILL YOU CHOOSE?
Daniel 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change TIMES and LAWS: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.
Catholic convert's catechism pg 50
Q. Which is the Sabbath day?
A. Saturday is the Sabbath day.
Q. Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?
A. We observe Sunday instead of Saturday be cause the Catholic Church, in the Council of Laodicea (A D. 336), transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday.
Q. Why did the Catholic Church substitute Sunday for Saturday?
A. The Church substituted Sunday for Saturday, because Christ rose from the dead on a Sunday, and the Holy Ghost descended upon the Apostles on a Sunday.
Q. By what authority did the Church substitute
Sunday for Saturday?"
A. The Church substituted Sunday for Saturday by the plenitude of that divine power which Jesus Christ bestowed upon her.
Q. What does the Third Commandment command?
A. The Third Commandment commands us to sanctify Sunday as the Lord's Day.
Q. What does the Third Commandment forbid?
A. The Third Commandment forbids (1) The omission of prayer and divine worship; (2) All unnecessary servile work; (3) Whatever hinders the keeping of the Lord's Day holy.
Q. Is the desecration of the Lord's Day a grievous matter?
A. The desecration of the Lord's Day is a grievous matter in itself, though it admits of light matter.
Catholic convert's catechism pgs 37/38
CHAPTER II
THE LAW OF GOD
Q. What is the Law of God?
A. The Law of God is the will of God, binding the liberty of man in conscience.
Q. Where is the Law of God summed up?
A. The Law of God is summed up principally in the Ten Commandments of God and in the Six Precepts of the Church.
Q. Which are the Ten Commandments?
A. The Ten Commandments are:
(1.) I am the Lord thy God; thou shalt not have strange gods before me.
(2.) Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord
thy God in vain.
(3.) Remember thou keep holy the Sabbath day
(4.) Honor thy father and thy mother.
(5.) Thou shalt not kill.
(6.) Thou shalt not commit adultery.
(7.) Thou shalt not steal.
(8.) Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
(9.) Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife.
(10.) Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's goods
Council of Laodicea canon 29:
CHRISTIANS must not judaize by resting on the Sabbath, but must work on that day rather honouring the Lord's Day, and if they can, resting then as Christians. But if any shall be found to be judaizers, let them be anathema from Christ.
Statements made by the Roman Catholic Church pg 2 & 3:
“Nothing can be more plain and easy to understand than all this; there is nobody who attempts to deny it. It is acknowledged by everybody that the day which Almighty God appointed to be kept holy was Saturday, not Sunday.
Why do you then keep holy Sunday and not Saturday?
“You will tell me that Saturday was the Jewish Sabbath, but that the Christian Sabbath has been changed to Sunday. Changed! But by whom? Who has the authority to change an express commandment of Almighty God?
When God has spoken and said, ‘Thou shalt keep holy the seventh day’, who shall dare to say, ‘Nay, thou mayest work and do all manner of worldly business on the seventh day: but thou shalt keep holy the first day in its stead?’
This is a most important question, which I know not how you answer...
“You are a Protestant, and you profess to go by the Bible and the Bible only; and yet, in so important a manner as the observance of one day in seven as the holy day, you go against the plain letter of the Bible, and put another day in the place of that day which the Bible has commanded. The command to keep holy the seventh day is one of the Ten
Commandments; you believe that the other nine are still binding. Who gave you authority to tamper with the fourth? If you are consistent with your own principles, if you really follow the Bible, and the Bible only you ought to be able to produce some portion of the New Testament in which this fourth commandment is expressly altered.” Excerpts
from “Why Don’t You Keep Holy Sabbath Day?”, pages 3-15 in The Clifton Tract, vol. 4, published by the Roman Catholic Church 1869.
“The arguments...are firmly grounded on the word of God, and having been closely studied with the Bible in hand, leave no escape for the conscientious Protestant except the abandonment of Sunday worship and the return to Saturday, commanded by their teacher, the Bible, or, unwilling to abandon the tradition of the Catholic Church, which
enjoins the keeping of Sunday, and which they have accepted in direct opposition to their teacher, the Bible, consistently accept her (the Catholic Church) in all her teachings. Reason and common sense demand the
acceptance of one or the other of these alternatives: either Protestantism and the keeping holy of Saturday, or Catholicism and the keeping holy of Sunday. Compromise is impossible.” - James Cardinal Gibbons, in Catholic Mirror, December 23, 1893
“It was the Catholic church which...has transferred this rest to Sunday in remembrance of the resurrection of our
Lord. Therefore the observance of Sunday by the Protestants is an homage they pay, in spite of themselves, to the authority of the (Catholic) church.” - Monsignor Louis Segur, Plain Talk About the Protestantism of Today, p. 213.
“Sunday is our mark or authority...the church is above the Bible, and this transference of Sabbath observance is proof of that fact.” - Catholic Record of London, Ontario, September 1, 1923.
“Of course the Catholic Church claims that the change (Saturday Sabbath to Sunday) was her act...And the act is a mark of her ecclesiastical authority in religious things.” - H.F. Thomas, Chancellor of Cardinal Gibbons.
Exodus 20:12; 20:20; 31:14-18!
Revelation 13:16-18 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.
Honest question about something i just realized. For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that whosoever believes MIGHT not perish but have eternal life....See? MIGHT is not a certainty but a chance. So just believing doesn't gaurantee salvation according to that logic. Once you believe and love Him, your life and actions should reflect that. For instance, I believed for over 10 years while I continued my wretched life of complete and utter selfishness. This is God's loophole, just like when Jesus said "Depart from me I never knew you". Jesus is the Son of God and would know everyone, so this taken out of context would be a lie. I believe what He meant was "I never knew you as true followers of my Word". Also, For God So lovED the world. That's past tense is it not? Maybe God can't love the world anymore after we killed His Son, which is why after the resurrection He gave all power and authority over all creation to His Son. Just interesting thoughts is all. Good thing for us that Yeshua is gauranteed to only do His Father's Will anyways. Yes I said Yeshua. That was His spoken name for 1500 years. Why Jesus now though? Not sayin it's nefarious but we are in a spiritual war so who knows. But my face and mouth can pronounce the name that an Angel told Joseph to name Him so methinks it might be important. It's these "little things" that kill right? Ponder it. Love everyone, peace!