Procon Pump Rebuild - TIG Cooler Project Part 1.5
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- Опубликовано: 11 сен 2024
- Here is a detailed video on rebuilding the typical Procon Carbonator pump. This is used in coffee, soda and of all places TIG coolers. The takes you step by step to disassemble the pump and rebuild it with a refresh kit. More of my stuff at www.gtsparkplug...
Run time is about 45 minutes.
Great Vid! Thank you Hank. I usually hate these types of vids, takes too much time... yours, I followed all to the end!
***A little trick I found useful:
If you find it difficult to slide in the parts, or if you don't even want to risk it, you can soak your pump body in hot water, 55C more or less so you don't burn yourself, before assembling the carbon parts back in.
Great video brother !! Ive been servicing espresso units for many years and every time I had to swap out a procon pump, I couldn't find myself scrapping it. I always thought one day I'd come across a rebuild kit and figure out how to rebuild them. Thanks to you, I can begin.
Thanks for the detailed video, which I used to rebuild a Series 1. I'd like to add that a little silicone grease on the rubber parts makes the assembly ever so much easier. I didn't have much luck with the "clamp" method of squeezing down the big o-ring to seat the c clip. But after it got lubed, I didn't even need the clamp. Just some light taps with a screwdriver/hammer and the c clip popped into its groove. I also lubed the wear surface of the pump seal so it would have some lube during startup until water contacted it. There are "food-rated" grades of silicone grease for installations which need that. Also the pump seal slid in much easier with a little grease on it. And a fun fact: the pump seal in the diagram that came with the Edco rebuild kit did not exactly match the actual pump seal in the kit. And a slinger in the diagram was missing from the kit. But after everything was assembled, the shaft turned very smoothly by hand, neither too loose, nor too tight. Testing showed it met spec for pressure and flow and the seal held tight.
Brilliant effort. with this kind of detailed explanation, even the cobbler could rebuild this vane pump like a pro. I wonder why those 12 idiots disliked this.
Who knows... People often have no people skills here on The Interwebs 😀
Yes the section with the spring loaded seal - definitely backwards.
Thanks for a great tutorial on rebuild of Procon pumps. I've been in the beverage business for 40+ years and rebuilding Procon pumps have always been a challenge, really the most that I'm comfortable with is just replacing the nameplate O-ring on the front of the pump. Edco or Procon will not give you the size but I have found that a food grade o-ring (size R-28 37.69 X 3.53) seems to be an an accurate replacement. That is a round o-ring that will look square or rectangle when removed. I Typically use a special food grade lube to reassemble the plate and o-ring with a simple c clamp to push it into place.
Yep it's McCann's- the company was run by Jerry McCann and very successful in the beverage industry...I knew him. Also on the subject of lubrication for the seals I would use the Danco Silicone Grease (88693) available at Home Depot. it's better than the keg lube available at home-brew shops.
Just rebuilt my series 2 with the help of this vid, works great!
justin mendonca Glad it helped!
Great video man
All of your video is clearly understood.thank you very much sir.
Interesting. Glad you posted this. My best guess is that a tube of food grade silicon grease would help dramatically on the rebuild. Had no idea there were as many small parts in that pump. Cheers.
The white washer is ceramic! Make sure the polished side runs against the rotating carbon seal.
You saved the pump of my town cafeteria in 🇩🇿🙏🙏🙏
Glad to help!
Great Video, it was just what i was looking for
Great video, I think that you might have had the mechanical seal not right.
The ceramic needs to run on the face of the carbon graffite service.
This is how the water seal works.
If you run the pump run dry, then this gets to hot and breaks, leading to water to the bearings.
It breaks also eazely when you knok the axil.
Yeah, I think the spring seal may be backwards as others mentioned. Important to note parts direction when taking it apart as the sheet of parts does not show it. Thanks!
I have nothing but good things to say about Edco Distributing. Their charge for rebuilding your pump is not much more than the parts kit alone. In my case, they replaced my entire SS housing for an extra $5 and (at my request) returned the old one to me. If you have a 100 GPH pump and would like it converted to 15 or 25 for your TIG cooler, they can do that for free.
I just ordered a new OEM pump for my Miller Coolmate 3X.
Edco does offer a kit, but it was $65 and the new pump was only $105 vs hundreds from a welder parts store. Edco said the kits do come with all internal parts except the rotor.
The OEM pump is 100 gph and relief is set at 55 psi, well I believe my old pump to be the original. I will call Miller to check what the relief pressure should be.
@@stephensarkany3577 - This comment may not apply to your situation, but I thought I would share the thought anyway. While most of these positive displacement pumps do have an internal pressure relief valve, their purpose is mainly to protect the pump from damage rather than to regulate normal system operating pressure. Procon is pretty clear about this in their documentation. In the torch cooler I built, I used an external "bypass" regulator (slightly modified TeeJet 23120 relief valve) to control the pressure and make it easily adjustable. If your pump's rated flow is well matched to the needs of your torch, perhaps the external regulator is not required. Just sharing thoughts... Good Luck.
@@ralphwaters8905 always interested to listen to a well reasoned opinion. I am slightly aware of teejet as I do a lot of farm repairs. They do make good stuff. I ran the label numbers on my old pump past Edco and I am hoping it was the original one, not a replacement. I also have a coolmate3 that I know is original, think I will go out right away and check spec on that one incase I need to mod my order.
@@stephensarkany3577I highly recommend EDCO! They are very knowledgeable and amazing to work with. Depending on the part number, Millers pumps are always set at 55 or 60 PSI. Based on the info you provided, the part number is more than likely 10597? If so then yes, the pump is set at 55psi.
Regardless of the part number, the psi setting should be noted on the white label, located on the bottom of the pump
Veri beautiful vidio
very helpful video, thanks
Great video! Thanks! I need to call you on one crucial part though. I believe you show the spring loaded part of the shaft seal inserted the wrong way. The end with the hard smooth thin ring goes against the white plastic piece. The surfaces that contact while spinning at high speed need to be smooth with minimal friction. If you insert it so the rubber end spins against the stationary white plastic disk, you'll melt the rubber and lose your seal in short order I would think. I know this because I have rebuilt centrifugal fluid pumps which use the same type of seal & the parts diagram for those pumps illustrate that orientation better. Also, a small amount of clear silicone grease should be used without introducing oils from your hands to the contact surfaces. Refurbished procon pumps that I've received are snug to turn by hand, but it should feel smooth to turn & you should not need a wrench. I really appreciate the video though. Very helpful! It is very easy to break those phenolic end bearings, dang it.
Thanks Paul! I was unsure of the direction of the pump spring. Even the diagram is a bit unclear. I should crack open a new one and see. I think I mention to follow the rebuild sheet and make sure you watch as you take things apart as I was a bit careless and too the pump apart. My thinking was the white disk was the friction reducer but I totally could have it backwards. I have a new pump and should just bit the bullet and crack it open and see :)
Hank Kimball Yeah, I hate to have you risk breaking those phenolic parts opening it up, but if you're like me, you'll want to verify the info. I wonder if applying some kind of lube to the back end will help the pump cartridge slide out without damage. I like Molykote 44 Medium. I believe it is safe for rubber & plastic.
Yep, not a big deal except finding the time. I have some spare parts, but more a time thing... have to squeeze it in between engine pulling and chores :) One thing I would be careful with is grease especially if using in food processing. I think you can get specific NSF approved lubes for food machinery, but honestly I don't think these pumps need much. They seem to run for a long time in crappy conditions without much of anything other than tap water. I think the one I had was from the 1990's and other than the leaking seal, was OK.
Excellent tutorial, covers a lot of gotchas. Thx and keep em coming..
Thank you so much sir
I pulled the rotor of an Australian built 1995 pump, the rotor came out in 2 parts.they slipped into each other. Obviously was machined separately. Not sure it was welded after machined or had some kind of join, but the motor end does not spin the vane holder part.
Look at another rotor. Look like 2 parts of rotor were pressed fit. No mechanical locking.
Where can I get the spare parts for that water pump?
Hola donde puedo adquirir un kit de repuesto para mi bomba,soy de Mexico,Saludos.
thanks boss
Hola donde puedo conseguir los kit?
On my series 2, the ball bearing is a little special: 30mm OD and 7/16" ID. The only place I know to get them is through an electric motor repair shop or a bearing supply house. I tried looking them up on the internet and didn't find anything.
Try McMaster for odd stuff like that or just get the rebuild kit with all the goodies
@@GarageProfessor yes, I know McMaster very well. I didn't see the special bearings there. I have refurbished lots of fractional hp motors that use bearings with a oddball ID. Most of them are a 6203 and I can get them from Bearing Distributors, or from my rewinder.
I just ordered a pump because it was like only $40 more. I will probably get a kit & fix the old pump for spares. If I can get the bearing Cheap enough I might just slide a bearing in and check for leaks as the seal looks good. I have a few old Bernard coolers that might need a pump.
If I used one of these motors for beverages, what would I need to use to grease/lubricate the motor itself?
Not sure. Most motors have sealed bearings. Should have a model and brand on it. That can get you more info on it and if it can be lubricated
@@GarageProfessor Thanks for the response! So I've been digging around and basically found that I am supposed to use a 3 in one product that is motor oil for electric motors. I guess I'm supposed to avoid using regular oil cause of the detergents in it.
32:00 crescent pins for the veins
Thanks for the video is completely useful, what after assembling all parts is not possible to rotate the shaft with the hand? is their a problem or is normal dur to the load of the new orings?
Yeah will need something to turn it.
Our factory makes all the internal parts in this except the stainless steel rotor
Hi Hank, thanks for your answer,
are you in California?
I have an espresso machine with a leaking pump, I am looking for a rebuild kit but I can't find it on ebay
could you provide the place you got it if you could.
Thanks
Yeah, in CA, here is the place where I got the kit from - check out Edco at - www.edcodistributing.com/pcpumps.php they have the kits. You might still be better off looking on Ebay for a deal, or a new pump depending on your budget. Ebay has some brand new sometimes for a bit more. Just depends when you catch the auction, but Edco should have the kits you need.
What is the average or expected runtime life on these?
I think the are designed to run for years. Every soda fountain has these or similar and the seem to last. In the welder tig cooler I have had mine for a couple of years and while I done use it that often still ok no leaks and good pressure.
IDK, but I have a tig cooler that is 20 years old and still going, and another that leaking seal rusted the bearing tight. I think it depends on the fluid being pumped.
Hello great Vid. Noticed you are in SFV. I have about 30 used pumps that I collected when I use to work for a beverage company. Do you know anyone that would be interested in buying all the used procon pumps I have?
No, cat say I do. You might try ebay
What did you do with the carbonator tank? Looking for a small one if you still have it.
I used the tank for the TIG cooler project. Look around on ebay you can find used ones not too pricey.
my brand new pump looks like its putting out black shavings into the water tank, idk if it from the vanes or bushings but i dont want to drink that, My old one was doing the same thing and thats why i bought a new one. Any input on this issue, im thinking of putting a filtration system post pump, but dont know if this is a good idea for the life span on the pump and what filters can handle post 150 psi pressures.
Odd that the new pump would have the same issue. Is it possible that the shavings are from the old pump and in the lines and tank? Or possibly coming in from the source into the pump? I would try flushing everything if you already didn't.
most common cause of this is the inlet line itself.
Hello good time I wanted to know where to get the internal parts of the pump
Look in the older comments. The company name is called Edco they have a website too.
Do you know if these can handle picking up liquid chocolate? I want to move 35 degree chocolate from one spot to the next. the Pump would have to lift the chocolate about 10 inches. and direct it 15 inches. do these pumps have any lift when attached to motor? do they require priming?
Don't know if they would be good for pumping something that thick. They are generally pressure fed a bit in Soda applications by the water line. In my TIG cooler they are not. I think the main issue would be thickness of the chocolate goo, and remember these pumps put out a lot of pressure too. Also don't know how all the guts would react to the chocolate but I don't know if it would be a good fit for this type of pump. Funny thing is sounds like an automotive oil pump might be something to look at but that is not generally a self contained pump and also if for food not sure it's sanitary safe.
Much better to buy new
Do you know where I can find out how to hook up this setup, I have a complete all In one unit, but I want to use it as a carbonator
Jamie Rhault I found this, not sure if enough detail
www.google.com/amp/www.instructables.com/id/How-to-Install-a-soda-fountain/%3famp_page=true
But do some searching on Google on carbonator install you should find more
Hola, soy Claudio de Argentina, mi bomba PROCON pierde por el agujero que tiene abajo en la parte trasera, me podrias decir cual puede ser la causa y como puedo repararla? muchas gracias.
19:15 **
I see a lot a guys on the wrong side of the globe use these to move lp. Are they really strong enough to move high pressure reliably.
Tiersmoke92555 I think these will pump most anything provided the have the right seals. I saw some old pics of them (variant) pumping fuel for race cars. It's a nice simple pump, durable and easy to fix. Lots of different options for seals, and other materials.
Does anyone know if the shaft dictates how many GPH these move. Wondering what the difference is from a 240 GPH pump to a 330.
Not sure but I would see if you can find a parts list or dimensions on the two different GPH pumps. Also the GPH may be based on pressure.
Hi there. It is the diameter offset that does it. Look at your inner circle where the vanes go compared to the diameter of the shaft. Said a different way, it is the distance between the stainless steel shaft OD and the outmost vane outer point. This varies, and the larger it is the more it moves!
My procon pump is leaking water should I just seal it with m seal or buy new one?
If it's leaking it will only get worse if a seal is going bad. Time for a rebuild or new. Double check fittings and hoses to make sure not them.
@@GarageProfessor thank you
where do you buy the baring puller?
I think I got it from Amazon. I think it was something for automotive use.
Please how do I get the repair kits
The only place I found was Edco. Look in the comments I think their is a link
Where can we find its spare parts like carbon, seal????
Sujit Mishra try these guys www.edcodistributing.com
Do you know where I can faind this kit? I were looking on ebay and I couldnt find it. Thanks for you help.
check out Edco at - www.edcodistributing.com/pcpumps.php they have the kits. You might still be better off looking on Ebay for a deal, or a new pump depending on your budget.
Thanks for your help.
Thanks for your help.
Hey if the piston dosent spin freely if you try to turn it does that mean its jammed or is that just how it works. I figure it is but I had to ask
Grandad Certified
They don't spin freely at all, they are a bit hard to turn by hand. You can use a small wrench to spin it, and should not be rough or something is likely wrong. Also look at the weep holes and if rusty, likely the bearing and seal are shot.
It dosent spin smoothly when turned with a wrench. Although the weep holes dont seem to have rust. I initially tried running my system and the motor slightly smoked up after making a noise as if somethng was blocking it from turning motor inlet turns just fine guessing its the pump since it turns with a squeak when forced. Thanks for the reply
Grandad Certified
If the motor let the smoke out, pull the pump and run the motor to make sure it not a bad bearing or burnt motor. Otherwise pump is bad, Open it up and take a look.
I have a hard time believing the motor will be able to turn the pump I turn it with difficulty, every turn it stop at a point where I need to put more pressure to get it past there and keep turning. Also how do I run the motor without the water running through the pump? Isnt that what activates it?
I just dunked the whole pump in vinegar no more of that resistance still can turn it with my fingers but when I use a clamp/wrench wtv its called it turns pretty nicely. Only other problem to check out should be the motor bearing. How do I open the thng it seems impossible to get the metal casing off
Sucks all I need is a new o ring for the relief valve, but I don't wanna buy the whole kit just for one part
Just see if you can find the size at a hardware store or auto parts store. You should also be able to find them online but shipping will kill you. Local parts place should have them.
@@GarageProfessor thanks I'll look around
can it pump liquid propane
I don't think so.
Assembly neo kitt available in market dealer where
Sorry for the delayed reply. The site where I purchased the kit was - www.edcodistributing.com/pcpumps.php
where can i buy the rebuild kit???
I got my kit from Edco at - www.edcodistributing.com/pcpumps.php they have the kits. You might still be better off looking on Ebay for a deal on a new pump depending on your budget. I think the price for the kit and shipping was very close to picking up a pump on EBay. If you do get a rebuild kit they will need the part number off the pump to find out which kit you will need. They were pretty helpful when I got the kit and made sure I had the right one.
HTH
Sandy
As a service tech this is a waste of time most of the time, when they go out they're calcified and rusted together making it time consuming to repair, it's more cost effective to just change them out completely, takes 5 minutes vs 30 minutes plus
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