79] Our Chainplates Rip Out, OFFSHORE & We Have NO IDEA
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- Опубликовано: 30 июл 2024
- We Rip Our Chainplates Out, OFFSHORE & We Have NO IDEA. Join us for a great sail from Greece to Malta.
This video was filmed in August 2019.
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![80] Our Sailboat's Broken. Discovering Our Ripped Out Chainplates: A Shockingly BAD DIY Install](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/VM9fQpyRYHo/mqdefault.jpg)
![80] Our Sailboat's Broken. Discovering Our Ripped Out Chainplates: A Shockingly BAD DIY Install](/img/tr.png)
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![ABANDONED CATAMARAN SAILBOAT, Found In Paradise [Sailing Kittiwake Ep. 111]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/MjSmiG0wMS4/mqdefault.jpg)
I am rather amazed that the chain-plates were not thru-bolted to the hull!! That bit of fiberglass, that your video shows as being torn away from the inside of the hull that covers the chain-plates, was certainly not enough to take the huge loading of your mast? Confused!? I am really happy for you that you did not lose the stick. Enjoy your ongoing story.
Old boat builder living in the mountains of western Montana.
Hi Mike, those chainplates had apparently taken the previous owner across Biscay in a force 9, but the heeling force of the big gust and too much canvas managed to rip them off. In a way, it's a blessing that it happened there and not mid ocean.
@@SailingKittiwake Gosh, any offshore boat should be able to take a complete knock down with no chain-plate failure...not even close. I cannot tell from the still images how the chain-plate bolts and the back-up plates are strong enough to do that. Did they rip out a section of the hull itself or just some glass applied after to the inside of the hull. Do the bolt heads appear on the outside of the hull?
I remember you posting something about the chain plates a while ago and now seeing the damage. Horrendous and could have been so much worse. Just shows the horrors that can hide in an old boat, survey or not. Fair winds. Andy UK
Cheers Andy, yes indeed! Could have caused a lot more damage, and it could have happened at a much worse time.
Cant say i did not warn you about those chainplates. Cause i did. On mine i built new pods and then i drilled through the hull. I through bolted them with a heavy stainless backing plate on the exterior. Strong and never comming out.
Anticipate on accelerating winds near islands.. they could spoil the game .
But those plates .. your very lucky.
Now if you drill true the hull .. make sure you do something about grounding that plate..
A thick cable or strip to the mast foot will prevent lightning burning true the hull.
What a relaxing sail with moderate seas and beautiful sunsets unbeknownst to have the starboard chain plates separate and create a dire situation. So fortunate to not have to worry about it and yet how terrifying to think a sudden squall of the starboard side could have been a really exciting experience no sailor wants to get go through. Glad you both came out alright. A great video. Thanks for sharing!
Thanks so much David! 😊
Sometimes it’s better to be lucky then good thank god she held together for you guys
I know you are glad you found it before starting your Atlantic crossing!
Many congratulations you two make a lovely couple.Keep on being understated and unaffected!haha much love to you both
Chain plates - ouch. But thank the good Lord he kept you both safe. A dismasting an also sink a yacht without the means to tie everything on board or cutting loose.
Glad you had sufficient diesel. Although my yacht was better at sailing, I always had enough spare fuel to complete the required crossing plus spare.
Look forward to next issue. Wishing you both a happy wedding.
Cheers Nigel! Yes, when we found out we immediately thought we could haven gotten dismasted... 😰 We were so lucky!
So much for surveyors. Everything that can be said about the repair as been said and obviously you have had the repairs. I think I would liked to know they were failing on passage just so I could have relieved some of the stress on the rig. But I get where your coming from. Looking forward to the repair video.
I'm sure thankful that chainplate problem didn't dismast you and cause one heck of a mess! you guys have some luck on your side there. I'm so glad you made it, would hate to see you both have to spring into super-ultra-uber emergency mode to save the boat.
Very nice, blue sky, safe journey, good and calm sail, all de best
Thanks Ravi!
Oh my, congratulations to still having a rigg on Skua.
Empirically, it is even a difficult undertaking to save a complete, formerly deckstepped mast with full sails openly floating in the drink in 30 knots in bright daylight when You are a crew of seven keen male regatta sailors ...
Although it’s a different boat, SV Prism (an HC33) added external chain plates to their internally factory embed chainplates using the embedded plates as backing plates. Since yours are the result of a poor previous repair, perhaps going to external plates and “new” backing plates inside. Good luck on the repairs - the boat is worth repairing!
Indeed, they're a great channel and Prism is an incredible boat, hopefully they'll be doing videos again soon!
It's actually not a major repair. They'll be fine, way worse has happened to many sailors
The problem with switching to external chainplates is you're changing the location of the attachment point for the standing rigging so you may have to put in new standing rigging or find some way to make the existing wire work, which is a new expense I expect they're trying to avoid. Starting from scratch it can make sense. When you have an existing rig that's otherwise good, maybe not.
@@johnhutchins1470 I agree - but you know what they say in Britain? - "In for a penny - in for a pound."
@@SailingKittiwake They have revamped their website and have started doing podcasts. I listened to their latest podcast on what to look out for when buying an HC33 (since I'm in the boat market, it was a good bit of info). With your experience you might consider something similar for the Tayana 37 - its also a boat I've looked at and many potential cruisers have them on their radars (they are fairly inexpensive).
It's always better to be safe than lucky, but sometimes you can really feel lucky that you were safe.
enjoyed the trip with you ,great colours ,good job on the video and music thanks
Cheers Ned! 😊
Wow, chainplates, they’re sort of essential
Wow, amazed they didn't pop out the deck sooner!
Yep, we were super lucky that the knees + fiberglass were wider than the hole in the deck!
Unlikely with that horrible blob of laminate below deck, just goes to show how well Tayanas are built, good solid old boat, I can guarantee you that if that had happened to a more modern mass production boat with inboard shrouds the chain plates would have pulled through the deck and the rig would have come down. There is a reason why the GGR's rules are long keel 36' and under, no newer than 1988 unmodified and wind vane, that race is 80% southern ocean high latitude sailing. These old boats are well built and reliable. Pretty simple fix really, no majors
Yes that is a scary chain plate issue, and something for you to watch about your rigging more often, just does go to show you how well your boat is built also!
True!
That shows that God is answering our prayers keeping you kids safe. And blessing you kids beyond measure...
So with much love and many more prayers you kids be blessed in Jesus name.... BBE...
Thanks so much Bobby!
Hello, sorry for your damage, I hope you will be able to repair quickly !! Good luck. Olivier.
Omg I’m really glad you found the problem before the worst I know you will do a proper repair but that’s a little frightening maybe you need to add a daily inspection while sailing just for extra safety learning and growing from what life gives us is a on going thing anyway agin congratulations you two newly weds👍👍
Thanks a lot Chad. It was indeed scary!
beautiful video and music combinations :)
Unstayed rigs never pull out their chainplates. I sailed across the Pacific in a boat with an unstayed rig, the next owners circumnavigated, and the third owners sailed to S. America, from Washington state. Over 40 years later, the rig is STILL standing. The boat has a huge sail area - 740 square feet on a 34 foot boat.
Could have brought the rig down😱😱😱 but it didn't, you're sure right in ignorance being bliss, lucky escape, but they were unlikely to pull through the deck, nevertheless not a great situation with them both being on the same side of the boat, I'm guessing with the cutter rig you have runners??
It's actually quite amazing how much load and various forces a rig can absorb without breaking, but broach the boat downwind with running backstays and you'll bring the rig down, hence my preferred rig setup now being a Solent as opposed to the traditional cutter. This happened 3 weeks ago while racing and it cost the owner of the boat his 20 metre triple spreader carbon fibre spar and the luff tape on the triaxial carbon kevlar main had to be cut away to save the boom and remaining sails. You're very fortunate Tayanas are good strong boats and the chain plates didn't pull through, if you'd discovered the problem before you did you could have jury rigged temporary shrouds with your spinnaker and staysail halyards, of course this would entail removing the staysail from the foil, and sailing with just the Yankee, no problem downwind.
Thankfully the rig is still standing, but I'd definitely be looking to through bolt the chain plates and put some SS plates on the outside of the hull. Shouldn't be a major repair. All the very best for your wedding, God Bless, and keep you safe, Fair winds and safe sailing.
I love your sailing channel! The only channel i have seen so far that details the cruising life as it really is, a lot of the time is really demanding and we know it, because we just cruised the western med and atlantic europe for six months with our two small children. We have also experienced mistrals in Villasimius but in early october (2019), we had also around 50 knots outside Porto Giunco, then the next day we almost had 60 knots but from the north, so we moved up a mile to Punta molentis which is also more protected by mountains than the low lying Porto Giunco. We are now overwintering our boat on the hard in Marina Del Sole, I am pretty sure we saw Kittiwake in the water there? I hope our paths will cross in the future...
So many coincidences! Yes, we stayed at Marina del Sole on Kittiwake. Say hi to Max from us 😊
Oh guys, this was so scary to watch. Really glad it all worked out ok! AND YOU MADE IT TO YOUR WEDDING!!!!! Xxx
Thanks so much guys ❤️ Yes, it was horrible to find out 🙁
Cor blimey that's a lucky escape. Glad you're all ok. Good job that happened when and where it did. Looking forward to next week now. It looks like your staysail is disrupting the airflow around your Genoa and the slot between that and the main. Although I'm not sure it might just be the angle you filmed it. Still realest and best sailing channel out there. I'm waiting to get a boat surveyed but it's storm alley up here in Britain so I'll have to wait another week.
That was a good video.
They're getting hitched, woo-hoo. The water looks amazing. Bet you're going to check all those chainplates before you do any long distances.
Thanks Steve! Haha you bet.
Beautiful, as always. X
Aw thanks Hanne 😊❤️
So glad you guys (and Skua) survived the voyage unfazed as this was potentially serious stuff.
Given the fastenings appear to have been athwart (ie towards the hull) rather than the more common location through a bulkhead (ie fore-aft), its not clear how it passed survey but maybe there were factors as its always difficult to assess glass over SS in this situation.
Nonetheless, its always worth going though the list and being prepared to grind out the odd area (eg one chain plate out of 4 or 6 etc or part of another critical component) to see what's inside.
Going thru the critical list:
Hull-watertight, Keel - integral, Rudder - strong and moves freely, Mast base - solid to the structure, Chain plates- strong to the hull (vertical) and supported laterally (horizontal), Mast, Spreaders and Standing rigging -matched to the heeling moment and the sail size ... Easy to say after the event I know, but that's why we have surveys by those more experienced and knowledgeable!
All the very best for the nuptials and ongoing nautical escapades. FWAFS
Well we paid €850 for a professional survey and the surveyor said the chainplates looked very good and that it was great that they had been replaced. Sometimes not even a professional can tell.
So lucky they didn't pull through, but at least you know you have a strong deck. :) You may want to check any other "structural work" the former owner did though... I vaguely remember them having to do other work before you received the boat? Bulkheads?
I think you guys owe Poseidon a drink! I've heard that chainplates can be an issue on Tayanas.
Like the music guys, smooth sailin
Thanks very much, and thanks for watching and commenting :)
Sorry to see about the chain-plates. The glasswork isn't the underlying issue. Your deck leaked down in between the chain-plates and the hull and corroded the stainless bolts that are the actual structural part of what holds them in place. Wet stainless in an anaerobic environment will rust stainless. I'm sure by now you've made to repairs but please make sure to keep that chain-plate entry point sealed. I'd be tempted to move the chain-plates to outside the hull. It would be much easier to keep an eye on them.
Hi Rich, while that can be an issue on Tayanas, that's not what happened to ours. There was no corrosion. Yep we've done the repair in real time and know exactly what happened.
Exciting times eh? Shows how good her decks are to hold the stress of the mast. God send having light winds for most of the time. Can the chain plates be bolted through the Hull like most traditional yachts?
True! Yes, that’s what we’re going for 😊
Very Nice
I bet when all is said and done, you will have some of the strongest chainplates on the planet.
You bet! 😊
Yeah you got lucky with the chain plates that is normally very expensive repair when normaly the mast falls down . Bon Voyage
True, we were really lucky in a way.
She's beautiful ❤
Terrifying! I hope the repair is not too costly!
A very solid boat if you did not feel any slop in the mast.
Yes, we were horrified when we found out! Well, the cheapest quote for the six chainplates was £350 but a DIY re-rig so we can swap to external chainplates is about £2K 😬
@@SailingKittiwake If you do go for a re-rig would you look at Dyneema stays?
Nope, way too expensive and not tested well enough for our taste - we can’t afford to be guinea pigs for new technology.
@@SailingKittiwake LoL rope rigging = new technology...okaaaaaay.... sorry to see your troubles with poorly glassed in knees, good opportunity to rebuilt it right.
Akathe Squid dyneema rigging is new technology. That rope degrades faster than steel has already been proven since the ancient times 😉
Good job you didn’t know!
Beautiful anchorage you stayed in /// Just keep sailing Don't get ( Married ) Just kidding Congratulations you guys////// Sorry about the boat. I'll be watching the next episode to see how the fix goes / take care . If this was recorded in Aug /// how is married life ///
Cheers Neil! 😊
Wow.. I would have a conversation with that surveyor..
He’d only say that he wouldn’t have been able to establish the thickness of the glass without taking them out 🙁
@@SailingKittiwake You can clearly see couple layer of fresh woven roving covering it - a red flag.. even that patch is too short.. glad you ok guys! You would think that this is something that cat would have lol
There is an interesting story about that area of shallow waters: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graham_Island_(Mediterranean_Sea)
pretty difficult for the surveyor to determine condition of chainplates, if not impossible without removing fiberglass
Very true, I guess that's why ours didn't mention it.
@@SailingKittiwake It was (from the two fotos I saw here), visibly redone once earlier. Epo is good stuff, a complicated high tech material You need to "know" in it's properties and constraints and workmanship required, though, and the dreaded "owner quality" when it comes to more advanced technologies can not even be completely overrode by even the best Epo brands.
Whaw, you are really lucky. More boat work nevertheless. With a wedding coming you don't want this.
Better now than when we’re in the middle of an ocean 😊
That sounds like a hint. :) 👍👍👍 Your solution looks robust. ✌️✌️
Clay Farnet wink wink! 😉
First again South Australia
🎉😁 nice to “see” you again 😊
That's the second one that broke out of it's bedding time to redo all of them
Indeed, couldn't trust the others now!
Through bolt with shaped external 316 SS straps/backing plates. The hull takes all the forces as opposed to bulkheads/internal knees/gussets, personally I'd move them all to the outside of the hull and put my backing plates on the inside of the hull, with some thickened epoxy, laminate knees/gussets internally and plug the slots on the deck. There should be sufficient travel on the stalok/Norseman fittings to accommodate the different position. The staysail sheets are inboard so it shouldn't affect upwind performance even though you have a slightly wider genoa sheet angle, that will be nominal.
You've summed up the perfect repair! Although that's the long term bombproof solution, the temporary fix is less drastic but quicker to implement :)
I'm sure we all could tell stories about the stuff surveyors miss ..!!! But yet aren't responsible for nothing but without them insurance companies won't even talk to ya.. here in the United States anyway..
That’s scary. Especially since the engineer cleared the rig.
Yeah, we did not expect it!
Congradulations.
I would like to say that you both have good choice of music. I hope the wedding gose well. are you still sailing through your honeymoon ?.
Gerard.
Q.L.D AUSTTRALIA
Wow , those chain plates were shockingly badly built . I race and we take knock downs all the time - part of the fun being on the edge . Did a sustained 11 knot run for 5 hours one day on my 28 foot displacement hull , took I think 4 wipe outs while hanging right on the edge the whole time . Never worried about the chain plates . I would not move them but I wold make the fiberglass brackets solid, glass them in with multiple layers and then through bolt the hull for good measure .
Funny fact: we use the words “shockingly bad” to describe the install in the next episode’s title 😁 so yes, totally agree! 40kn and a gybe should be no problem. We were lucky to find out this way.
@@SailingKittiwake Really lucky .
sv ramble on has some good vids on tayana 37 external bronze chainplates. i think i mentioned it before.
Yep, I've been in touch with Rich
just wondering if you guys miss your catamaran?
How do we wrap “Chain Plates” as a wedding gift
Bronze or titanium?
Why don’t you gift $2000 for repairs?
@@frankd2301 you 1st.....
I'm not sure I'm seeing this right from the footage you have but isnt it more that the chainplates were attached to grossly inadequate knees (if they can even fairly be called knees) than that the chainplates failed? They seem to be intact you just need to find a better system to attach them to the boat?
The chainplates were attached with a very thin layer of fiberglass to the hull. Behind some of them there was... no knee... unreal. We show it better in the next episode.
Awesome. So they were more or less glued on. I expect you've already fixed it but if you haven't -- or even really if you have -- you could ask Bob Perry the best way to proceed (or whether what you've done already is good enough). He's still active and good about answering email. He designed the boat so he probably know better than anyone how to make it as it should be.
That sucks! Have to figure out a new design with huge backplates and thru bolts.
Are you able to motor the rest of the way?
We can thankfully make it to our wedding 😊👍
@@SailingKittiwake Hooray! Congratulations to both of you.
What do you mean you rip your chain plates out offshore? D: that sounds like an emergency!
Reef down and start the engine
@@MrRourk if it were me, I would be out of gas LOL
@@SailingSarah Time to bust out the paddles. If the hull is sturdy enough. Possible to lash ropes underneath the boat to the mast. Better than nothing.
Definition of mariage. Given to me years ago by a wise friend just when I was getting married.
It goes like this:
Mariage is the art of being two to decide about things you wouldn't even worry about when you are single.
😁😁😁
Can’t relate at all to be honest and we’ve lived together for nearly 5 years 😁
9:45 Depth 1.4 meter in the middle of the journey?
The depth sounder doesn’t display depth over 100m 😊 He likes to display 1.4m offshore.
Did this not happen a while ago, I'm sure I saw this before?
The video was filmed in August. You would have seen a picture of it, not a video :)
didn't you fix the chainplates when you got the boat?
]
The previous owner said they were new and the surveyor said they looked really good, so it didn’t sound like there was anything to fix.
You know that warm fuzzy feeling when you're falling in love? Well, that's common sense leaving the body.
Why it's called FALLING in love. Your thought process fall from your brain to other parts of the body. Including your heart and other organs lower on the anatomy!
I noticed that "he" has a bit of a red nose, while the bill of his baseball cap points to the sky. If you don't like having a red nose then wear your cap properly. Pull the bill down so you can see the front of it when looking straight ahead. The front part of the sweat band should be about an inch above your eyebrows. This will better protect your nose and keep you from looking like a girl with a bonnet!
lucky ,,,,, nothing to do with age of boat or anything like that , just very bad construction ,,, seeing from the trailer for nxt episode he has it well in hand ..
No, nothing to do with the boat herself, it’s just a very bad DIY chainplate replacement 🙁
@@SailingKittiwake so not original ,,very strange repair !!??
roderick mchardy indeed. An unbelievably bad one.
I Can’t see any reason to plaster chainplates on with fibre glass or any excuse for a surveyor to accept a structural component that is subject to metal fatigue and corrosion being hidden from visual inspection .. Their incompetence and negligence put you at risk .I would expect the vendor and surveyor to pay for the repairs . .speak to your insurers. Fair winds .
The original chainplates were installed in the same way by professionals, except they were done way better and with much thicker glass.
The chainplates detaching was nothing to do with you being over-canvassed, if anything, your cautious approach has kept them going for as long as they did. Whoever fitted them like that? I hope you sleep well at night - it's shameful. Boatbuilders traditionally lived by a code of making the boat you're building fit for anything it's role may throw at it. If in doubt, I used to think - " would I want my daughter out in a storm in this boat?" Then I'd add a bit more bracing...
Nice approach. The previous owner did the installation of the failed chainplates, the 40+ year old Tayana installed chain plate on that side was undamaged.
@@SailingKittiwake As much as I am a fan of doing things for yourself and learning as you go, when it comes to something as fundamental as chainplates, I would be wanting to talk to a shipwright or similar beforehand, and asking for them to inspect post installation. What Ryan and you have done so far for yourselves has been both impressive and pleasing to my eyes as someone who worked in the industry, so this isn't in any way a negative on you two.