*IMPORTANT UPDATES* - 1) Power Consumption Tests were removed from this video, as an update to the system services has changed the results and will be revisited in another video very soon. 2) PCIe Lane allocation is under re-investigation, as in post-production I noticed an 8GT/s x4 downgrade that I need to check was unrelated to the tested drive vs system lane allocation. 3) UGREEN states that system optimization is still ongoing and the 10GbE SMB performance will be better in the next large update.
I was about to say, saw the "downgraded" scroll by. Thanks for investigating lane allocation properly - this is a real bug bear of mine with the mini PC and NAS vendors hiding these fundamental bottlenecks.
I saw that you said high quality PSU is it sold separately what kind of psu is it I mean the conector 7:17 may be you can elaborate more if its interesting or add affiliate link for that psu in particular! Thanks in advance!
Novice here. I don't understand what optimization could possibly be done. If AJA is reporting ~600mbs, and the lanes are Gen4X4 something is seriously wrong .. no?
I think your videos are just mega. You help many users, including me, to make the right choice. Your diagnosis is precise and quite accurate and I want to thank you from the bottom of my heart. I have pre-ordered the DXP 4800 Plus and the DXP 480T Plus because of your videos which I find exciting to follow. I think it's great that Ugreen has eased up a bit so that you can install other operating systems such as Unraid or Truenas. Thanks for that and I think your work is just great. 👍👍👍👍👍
Just glad that we can install 3rd party OS if UGOS isn't up to the job. It's obvious that UGreen needs more experience building their own systems. Reminds me of all those mini pc vendors releasing their first/second gen products.
For an old man who doesn't speak English like me, it's not easy to follow but I'm trying hard. Thanks for his work on the channel.I ask you if you can tell me about good quality SSDs specifically for NAS with medium and medium/high prices. It would help me a lot. The content he makes on NAS is fantastic 👍🏻
This is so great! Love the videos you make about these Ugreen NAS. Really love this model with m2 SSD, and have backed for one on Kickstarter, so its nice to learn the products more and see what they change based on feedback in the close future close to release!
Robbie as always you show us all of the incredible new NAS devices. And this is the one small users have been waiting for, too. Great, great video. Cheers.
Great review. I would have preferred that they did PCI 4 x2 lanes for each of the 4 instead of using PCI 3 x 2 for 3&4. I'd probably buy if they had they done that. That said, they've done a better job than the others.
@@nascompares do u know any NAS brands vendors that do allow you to install any operating system on it on the host, not tin a VM or a docker container?
If it could do thunderbolt in client mode then that would be a complete game changer. Like this I dont see the advantage over their other boxes which also have 2 SSDs. Essentially it seems like you are getting 2 SSD slots but losing all the HDD slots. If you could use it as highspeed thunderbolt storage, then that would be really cool for people who edit photos and videos on a macbook or something. Did they indicate if they want to add both ways functionality to the thunderbolt?
They state that they are investigating this. But, realistically, it's a massive uphill battle! This is why only QNAP provide this feature (Promise and QSAN tried), as it's super complicated and requires alot of system reverse engineering to commit thunderbolt over ethernet connections. That said, never say never!
Very interesting product - I've been looking for something exactly like this. To be honest as a consumer user I'm not even that focused on getting top performance out of it. I'd be quite fine with a few hundred MB/s over ethernet via file shares. The main factor for me is the compact size, the quiet operation, the hopefully low idle power consumption, and the flexibility of it as a platform. But, I also have to say that at 800 euros it's getting pretty expensive for a regular consumer who wouldn't use it for work related tasks. And if someone is using it for work, then maybe they'd have a lot more options to look at from more established professional brands.
Google doesn't use pure SSD for data centers. Anyone could've used SSD drives for NAS if they want to, it's just a lot more expensive than regular spinning disks.
Personally due to the fact they did not include the UK in the kickstarter campaign, and since NASCompares is based in the UK and we can't buy it, I am going with the Asustor Flashstore 12 Pro, I recently bouhgt the Asustor Lockstore 4 Gen 2 and I added 4 x 18 Seagate Ironwolf Pro, all for file storage and plex server, and cloud storage, macbook air and macbook pro backups and more storage for my numerous Raspberry Pi setups., as well as home automation. Will use the Asustor Flashstore 12 Pro as a silent Plex server sitting under my wall mounted TV. So Asustor Lockstore 4 gen 2 will have duplicate copy of Plex files for back up.
@nascompares Are those test results using default 8GB RAM or full 64GB RAM? If it's the default 8GB RAM, can you please redo the tests using 64GB RAM? I'm just curious if it will make any difference. Thanks! 👍
I can't really publish tests with more member than what users are expecting recieve, as I have to show this system "as is" as much as possible. I get your point though and will try it in the test area when I get a minute next week
@@nascompares I might think the same if I had the product to test. One would think a single larger fan would be less audible but a nice fan hum can be downright cathartic for some.
Can you do a quick monthly "this is the one to buy today" video every month? Just a 5 minute blurb with whatever is the best NAS hardware and software to get at that moment (that can actually be purchased retail). That would be super helpful. For a stretch, maybe one consumer level pre-built device (qnap, etc) and one DIY or hack device.
Me and Ed @ NASCompares discussed this. The issue was always that different NAS are available in different regions, or are priced wildly different in different countries. Maybe we are over thinking this. Will knock my head together with Ed's and revisit this idea. Thanks man
@@nascompares Great thanks! My thinking is that everyone is always shopping for the next thing, but a monthly update will let the info simmer and when people are ready to pull the trigger and purchase, they'll have a current recommendation in addition to the string of previous recommendations to look at. Fewer regrets, less hesitancy to buy when the time is right.
cute, the asus flashstore comes out better pricewise though and is available with 12 m.2 storage slots, the favorite is still the QNAP TBS-h574TX, shiver down my spine if I just think of five 60 TB drives...that would nicely tidy up my hoarding issue......and ruin me financially as a side effect :-D
@@TimHunold is an issue, but is beaten by data density, some time ago there were ExaDrive-s from Nimbus, those were in 3,5" form factor having sata/ahci interface and up to 100TB capacity, for back than approx 40 000 USD/+tax/ upon asking /2016 ish/, currently there are 61.44TB drives with pcie/nvme interface in U.2/U3 15mm, E3.S 7.5mm, and E1.L 9.5 mm form factors, it is freely available in the US for some 4 600 usd /+tax/ and even here in europe for some 5 200 Euro /on 3 pricelists with VAT and free shipping/ so pricey.... that nas and five drives would be some 28 000 euro for 5*60=300 TB raw storage capacity sized like 4-5 DVD cases...... just to fantasize..... smart thing would be of course to use one 15TB drive for some 1200-1400 EUR internally in a workstation utilising the pcie speeds and build two independent nas-es with rotational drives with that capacity for redundancy.....speed would be comparable, and price wise there would be enough spare change to buy a car......
If only it was fanless, passively cooled. There's a missed opportunity not making it perfectly silent IMO. The most interesting option I've seen so far is the one LTT looked at recently, the Friendlyelec CM3588.
There are flash based nas from well known brands like QNAP SYNOLOGY AUSTOR or just diy in a system using adaptors for more m.2 that the typical motherboard has.
Struggling to see the practical benefits of these boxes. Storage size is still seriously limited compared to SATA drives and being quieter can’t be the biggest selling point
@@nascompares So I guess for small high speed purposes that don’t require much storage and for someone who has very very deep pockets ? 😀 Must be quite a tiny market
And with SATA drives you do mean HDDs I assume. What I want to see is something with SAS-4 so I could run PM7 Series Kioxia Drives. They go up to 30 TB per drive.
@@topgazza hmmm Consumer grade 4 x 8TB NVMe SSD is around € 5600 one Kioxia PM7-R 30.72TB is around € 5700. Wendell from level1techs had fun with PM7's here ruclips.net/video/YYZEPQxOGKk/видео.html
@@noth606 I am sorry for not making myself clear. The SSD and nvme will increase in price, only the box containing them will be lower in price, get it ?
There are a few extra steps for other OS', but for UnRAID it's just 2. Usual boot drive change, but also watchdog deactivation and maybe even deactivating slot #5 in bios, unless you want to pull the 2242 drive. Video coming Sunday on this
There are a few extra steps for other OS', but for UnRAID it's just 2. Usual boot drive change, but also watchdog deactivation and maybe even deactivating slot #5 in bios, unless you want to pull the 2242 drive. Video coming Sunday on this
I have no use for HDD even in a NAS, because of their far slower transfer speeds. Question is should I buy a NAS that has both 2.5inch SATA SSD bays & NVMe slots, or keep searching/waiting for an all NVMe NAS that isn't super wrongfully priced. I have no clue. I only have about 1Tb of data so I can buy very fairly priced 1Tb/2Tb NVMe SSD's. What should I do?
I would Iike a mini-PC version of this with 10GbE, HDMI 2.1, and Displayport 2.0 at the back and USBs, SD-card reader, and thunderbolt 4 connectivity at the front panel. 🥺
It looks like the SSD area would be better served by housing one single fan that takes up the whole area and can spin much slower for near complete silence with the same CFM. The engineering they chose looks slick to be sure, but I abhor tiny fans
Please show how to get into the memory module area. that piece is not coming out after removing all the screws for me. Almost all the reviewers wer simply skipping that part and just jump into that memory module area which tells me it is either painful or needs a special tool. I followed the manual to the letter and it is not coming out for me to upgrade the memory module.
Thanks for digging into the hardware and showing internal file transfers. Try unraid with zfs1 of 2 or 3 drives and see how fast it is, just to verify it's not OS/driver related. I think you are correct that the pcie and network are somehow connected to a pcie switch. That would explain the drop. Or that Aquantia nic has incorrect driver. I would pre order one, but can't as not being able to saturate 10Gb is a no go. I think you're beating them up too much on the security part. If account is local then let 3rd party do 2 factor, same with malware, etc.
I see you point, but they NEED to be pushed on the question of security. With approx 6K backers and over a month left to get more people on board, security and long term support is paramount!
Thunderbolt 40g is often thrown around like it's that speed per port. But it's often 40 total throughput. So your discovery of 20 per port is pretty typical to how most thunderbolt operates.
On the down side at this point the drives are going to cost you an organ, unless of course you’re happy going back to a tiny capacity NAS. On the plus side, by the time large drives are affordable we might be on version 10 and it will be much improved. Thanks for another nice review it’s good to see where things are going. Will look forward to it becoming mainstream.
If there is an ECC Ram and NFS I can't do it. Also that static noise when you're testing the fan noise is because the Nas is not well sealed from interference. I bet you it would fail FCC regulations for interference if it was scrutinized
I'm wondering about a NAS to put in a car as a media server. After I saw another channel do a video on the FriendlyElec CM3588. I wondered what you thought about something like that. obviously I don't want to use any spinning disks & that one sounded promising. In the car I was thinking videos wouldn't need to go above 720 p.
I feel like a nuub…. Help me understand the thunderbolt ports. If I hook my MacBook Pro via the thunderbolt 4 ports, will have a 10Gbps+ direct connection between my Mac and this as additional storage. I’m an amateur photographer using medium format photos (large). Looking to connect directly, import my photos into this NAS and editing from it. Basically looking for bi-directional SSD fast connectivity. Help please…
It still bugs me with mini PCs and this, that manufacturers are so wedded to the 4x4x2 (ish) form factor, that you can't just chuck a Noctua fan in them when if it were maybe an inch or so larger, there'd be more than enough room for it. Or just sell the base version, and an upgraded fancy case.
Very true, but that's not the default state. Also, the fact this intel 12th gen chip with NVMe at gen 4 internally needs more than 8GB to fully saturate 10G is....odd. I was able to hit 990MB/s with relative ease, using the TS-464 (CELERON, 4GB, 10G card) and the DS1522+ (emb.Ryzen, 8GB, 10G card) with the NVMe on each, as well getting 650-700MB/s with HDDs
it is time they start using qualcom/arm chips instead from android phones which are more than what is needed with high power efficiency & low temperatures.
Luckily, no! My video this Sunday will explain it better, but there are numerous ways to avoid this. Also, let's be honest, replacing a 2242 m.2 is a right pain in the arse!!!
I just watched another review of this, and the idle power consumption was insanely high, 30 watts. It's very disappointing if it will be that high... Arguably it should be around 5-6-8W idle for a device like this.
Looks like a great product, I would of bought one but seems they only let Germany and USA back it and get the discounts. Really disappointing that a massive company like Ugreen would use kickstarter, and on top of that making it impossible for other countries is ridiculous.
Bloody good question! I'd say yes (I tried a RAID 0 2 BAY on the 6 HDD NAS). But nothing that requires the OS to run the raid (pwc tends to use software raid software)
what they told you about the Thunderbolt ports being "host only" doesn't make any sense. *minimally* , support for Thunderbolt *networking* -- that is, point to point, peer to peer connections between two machines (I guess in "NDIS" mode) should be built into the kernel by default. I wouldn't be at all surprised if it can't just like, become a USB mass storage device, and never would have expected that to begin with. but the idea that it "just can't" make a Thunderbolt-Thunderbolt connection between itself and another host at ~40G for networking doesn't pass the smell test. I suspect someone mistranslated something in emails.
Unfortunately, they have definitely over promised on this as a "something we are working on" feature. And because it's Crowdfunding, those words need to carry weight to a degree. I hope they achieve it, but I'm pretty doubtful too
Why would I buy a turnkey NAS solution just to install a 3ed party OS on it? 🙄 I use Synology for their SW, not their HW. Had I wanted to use TrueNAS/UnRaid, I would have gone the DIY route and got better HW for less $
@@tehehe5929 the main problem is that you have usually only 2 ways of splitting the pci-e lanes in consumer cpu's (something like 2x8+1x4 or 1x16+1x4 etc). most devices end up having to use mux/bridge chips to make it work and create additional bottlenecks+cost. that's where xeons come to play, even if you don't need the extra lanes, they have much more combinations than 2. so, in other words, even if you have enough lanes it doesn't matter, 8x1 is not possible in a consumer cpu, because the cpu itself doesnot support it.
@@giornikitop5373 I'm sure hardware oem can manage to change this for a nas. Doesn't seem like something unsurmountable. Remamber that I'm talking about ugreen product here not self built nas.
r2784 used to be our fear was, "skating", where the driver pops out of the screw head and goes all over the motherboard destroying the silicone lines. This was early 2000 pc building. But what @nascompares says wasn't on my list.
@@nascompares there are small powered screwdrivers for these small screws with appropriate gears that will stop before breaking the screw. Similar to the big power tool counterparts with the swappable lithium cells that do it for big screws
Tbh, hardly any brand has successfully managed this but QNAP. A few brands (QSAN, Promise) have tried, but it rarely gets beyond the development stages.
It appears that the campaign isn't open for us to contribute from the United Kingdom, but for the United States and Germany only ....am I missing anything here?
No, I got clean full saturation of 10G in TrueNAS scale. I never got the chance to do the same in UnRAID, as I was connected over 1G and running different OS back to back, for a video this Sunday
Sorry about that bud. This was a heavy vid and one that was edited on/off for a month. I spotted the incorrect 'internal hardware/ ports' one. Can you send me a link to others. No worries if you've already watched etc and no time. Cheers for the heads up regardless man
This guy is a master of stretching a 5 minute video into 45 minutes. He must have repeated that the ssd and i5 fans are separate about 10 times and doesn’t even get into the technical stuff until 17 minutes in. If you like wasting your time then watch this. I guess he’s just trying to game the algorithm at our expense.
I'm new to the NAS home desktop servers. But not the concept. I ran my own Telecommunications Company for 12 years serving large corporations. (HPs International Headquarters, Met Life, Ingersoll-Rand, Burns & Roe, etc) basically 1000 employee workstations or more. Retired in 2010. I've been watching your channel nonstop trying to find what I consider "bare minimum" for an NAS setup. Which is 2000TB in a RAID2 configuration based on Blu-ray and 4k Blu-ray disc size. I'm not reducing quality when I rip. That's the point. I buy these formats for the quality. I do the same with music, when I rip CDs it's at 320 unlimited. My music collection is over 7TB alone. I don't care. I want the quality I'm paying for. Otherwise just get crappy streaming services. 3 years ago drive sizes were 22TB. 3 years later it's still the same? WTF is going on. According to Moores Law I should be looking at 96TB drives today? So let me just ask strait out. What's the best way right now to build a 2000TB desktop NAS server? Thanks for your help. Love the videos.
It just occurred to me that one could probably bang in four or five of those NVMe to SATA cards (each usually support 4 or 5 SATA ports) into one of these UGreen models and be able to support something like~25 SATA HDD or ~25 SATA SSDs.
really unfortunate that this system just seems like a solution searching for a problem. I'm really not sure I understand what niche role this actually fills. It just seems so half-baked as presented, with the seemingly alpha-state software (same as the other boxes) and the limited PCIe and Thunderbolt functionality, at the price bracket it's being sold at.
@35:53 - Wow, that is terrible. Might be OK for a single HDD but nobody is spending the money for a 10gbe NMVE NAS for that level of performance when writing large sequential files. If I got this and didn't see it writing/reading at 900MB/s+ I would assume something is very, very wrong. Until they resolved it, and have proven it isn't some hardware limitation/bad design that can't be fixed with software, I wouldn't fund/order this.
Optimization is apparently ongoing. Plus, there are like 4 different firmware's floating around at the minute with reviewers and I've seen users hit 1GB/1000MB/s. But only in RAID use. Not single drives (which tbh should massively hit 1000MB regardless. TBC!
@@nascompares Yeah, the fact that a single drive can't currently do it, where the NIC should always be the bottleneck, is where I'm wondering if the hardware is limited in the way they linked things like you mentioned. Hopefully it is just software bugs as review highlights it certainly has a ways to go.
Fine if you live in the US or Germany otherwise kind of pointless review "Ugreen NA Sync Series on Kickstarter will be available in the following countries: US, Germany"
@@nascompares Put yourself in the place of someone in the UK who can’t Kickstarter a promising product and will have to wait for a full priced retail unit.
@@johnroberts2905 Your point is what? Booooohoooooo, not getting special treatment you don't deserve, and getting the same deal as everyone else - how DARE they?!?!
I see this thing for €999,99 with 8GB of RAM and no SSDs and that's 500 bucks too much.The UGREEN Software sucks donkey balls. Maybe they should hire someone who actually knows how to tune Linux and SAMBA...
There seems to be a lot of negativity around the number of reviews for this here, and that it's a kickstarter. To be fair there are lots of reviews on this site for different manufacturers, so I don't see any special treatment of Ugreen. Also, as a video editor this is exactly what I've been looking for, and based on this review, and the fact it's Ugreen, if I could I'd be buying off the kickstarter, but sadly just Germany and US. I understand if you have large amounts of data this NAS would be limiting but as an editor it's perfect, I still have a Terramaster with 24gigs in it to offload completed jobs. I am currently editing off the Terramaster but even with 10Gbe it struggles editing 4K due to the Platter drives.
*IMPORTANT UPDATES* - 1) Power Consumption Tests were removed from this video, as an update to the system services has changed the results and will be revisited in another video very soon. 2) PCIe Lane allocation is under re-investigation, as in post-production I noticed an 8GT/s x4 downgrade that I need to check was unrelated to the tested drive vs system lane allocation. 3) UGREEN states that system optimization is still ongoing and the 10GbE SMB performance will be better in the next large update.
I was about to say, saw the "downgraded" scroll by. Thanks for investigating lane allocation properly - this is a real bug bear of mine with the mini PC and NAS vendors hiding these fundamental bottlenecks.
I saw that you said high quality PSU is it sold separately what kind of psu is it I mean the conector 7:17 may be you can elaborate more if its interesting or add affiliate link for that psu in particular! Thanks in advance!
I wonder if those are USB C, or barrel if Barrel they lost the chance to promote the charges 😮 or im am wrong?
4 slots: 1+2 are Gen4 with full speed and slot 3+4 are Gen3?! Well I’m disappointed.. I ordered one but hmm 😒
Novice here. I don't understand what optimization could possibly be done. If AJA is reporting ~600mbs, and the lanes are Gen4X4 something is seriously wrong .. no?
I think your videos are just mega. You help many users, including me, to make the right choice. Your diagnosis is precise and quite accurate and I want to thank you from the bottom of my heart. I have pre-ordered the DXP 4800 Plus and the DXP 480T Plus because of your videos which I find exciting to follow. I think it's great that Ugreen has eased up a bit so that you can install other operating systems such as Unraid or Truenas. Thanks for that and I think your work is just great. 👍👍👍👍👍
Thank you for your kind words. Sadly, I'm British and MASSIVELY REPRESSED, so I am unable to take compliments. Shame really...
@@nascompares But you should know. Thank you and please keep up the good work...👌
Just glad that we can install 3rd party OS if UGOS isn't up to the job. It's obvious that UGreen needs more experience building their own systems. Reminds me of all those mini pc vendors releasing their first/second gen products.
For an old man who doesn't speak English like me, it's not easy to follow but I'm trying hard. Thanks for his work on the channel.I ask you if you can tell me about good quality SSDs specifically for NAS with medium and medium/high prices. It would help me a lot. The content he makes on NAS is fantastic 👍🏻
Rob another great assessment! I have supported the 4800 plus and anxious to get it!~ Thanks for your honest, deliberate, and detailed video!
Thanks for the kind words bud
This is so great! Love the videos you make about these Ugreen NAS. Really love this model with m2 SSD, and have backed for one on Kickstarter, so its nice to learn the products more and see what they change based on feedback in the close future close to release!
I backed also the dxp480t plus but the face at 14:00 made me disappointed 😖
Robbie as always you show us all of the incredible new NAS devices. And this is the one small users have been waiting for, too. Great, great video. Cheers.
Great review. I would have preferred that they did PCI 4 x2 lanes for each of the 4 instead of using PCI 3 x 2 for 3&4. I'd probably buy if they had they done that. That said, they've done a better job than the others.
Good points all round man!
@@nascompares do u know any NAS brands vendors that do allow you to install any operating system on it on the host, not tin a VM or a docker container?
This channel is indispensable. Thank You!
Thank you reviewing my suggestions! You’re the best
great review, thanks for all the helpful info and updates on all the ugreen nas news. really excited to get my 480t 👍
Thanks man
If it could do thunderbolt in client mode then that would be a complete game changer. Like this I dont see the advantage over their other boxes which also have 2 SSDs. Essentially it seems like you are getting 2 SSD slots but losing all the HDD slots. If you could use it as highspeed thunderbolt storage, then that would be really cool for people who edit photos and videos on a macbook or something. Did they indicate if they want to add both ways functionality to the thunderbolt?
They state that they are investigating this. But, realistically, it's a massive uphill battle! This is why only QNAP provide this feature (Promise and QSAN tried), as it's super complicated and requires alot of system reverse engineering to commit thunderbolt over ethernet connections. That said, never say never!
What does "client mode" mean? This can currently use TB to connect to my computer and act like a DAS, right?
I've always had good experiences with UGreen products. So this should be promising.
A NAS with UGREEN hardware with Synology software would be amazing...
Very interesting product - I've been looking for something exactly like this. To be honest as a consumer user I'm not even that focused on getting top performance out of it. I'd be quite fine with a few hundred MB/s over ethernet via file shares. The main factor for me is the compact size, the quiet operation, the hopefully low idle power consumption, and the flexibility of it as a platform. But, I also have to say that at 800 euros it's getting pretty expensive for a regular consumer who wouldn't use it for work related tasks. And if someone is using it for work, then maybe they'd have a lot more options to look at from more established professional brands.
I wonder it the 10gbe performance is better on TrueNas, OMV, or Proxmox.
kickstarter is the dealbreaker. we’ll see after retail.
100% the opinion of like 50% of the audience 25% of the time!
Google doesn't use pure SSD for data centers. Anyone could've used SSD drives for NAS if they want to, it's just a lot more expensive than regular spinning disks.
All true. But also, they do use more and more SSD at data center level now, but for more PaaS and SaaS ent service use
Personally due to the fact they did not include the UK in the kickstarter campaign, and since NASCompares is based in the UK and we can't buy it, I am going with the Asustor Flashstore 12 Pro, I recently bouhgt the Asustor Lockstore 4 Gen 2 and I added 4 x 18 Seagate Ironwolf Pro, all for file storage and plex server, and cloud storage, macbook air and macbook pro backups and more storage for my numerous Raspberry Pi setups., as well as home automation. Will use the Asustor Flashstore 12 Pro as a silent Plex server sitting under my wall mounted TV. So Asustor Lockstore 4 gen 2 will have duplicate copy of Plex files for back up.
@nascompares Are those test results using default 8GB RAM or full 64GB RAM? If it's the default 8GB RAM, can you please redo the tests using 64GB RAM? I'm just curious if it will make any difference. Thanks! 👍
I can't really publish tests with more member than what users are expecting recieve, as I have to show this system "as is" as much as possible. I get your point though and will try it in the test area when I get a minute next week
@@nascompares Awesome! Thanks! 😁
Looks like UGreen could have opted for a single 120mm fan on that bottom cover to cool the NVMe drives.
I kinda like the 2 fans tbh, moni PCs tend to use just 1 and have noticed the noise more. Might just be in my head thouug
@@nascompares I might think the same if I had the product to test. One would think a single larger fan would be less audible but a nice fan hum can be downright cathartic for some.
Can you do a quick monthly "this is the one to buy today" video every month? Just a 5 minute blurb with whatever is the best NAS hardware and software to get at that moment (that can actually be purchased retail). That would be super helpful. For a stretch, maybe one consumer level pre-built device (qnap, etc) and one DIY or hack device.
Me and Ed @ NASCompares discussed this. The issue was always that different NAS are available in different regions, or are priced wildly different in different countries. Maybe we are over thinking this. Will knock my head together with Ed's and revisit this idea. Thanks man
@@nascompares Great thanks! My thinking is that everyone is always shopping for the next thing, but a monthly update will let the info simmer and when people are ready to pull the trigger and purchase, they'll have a current recommendation in addition to the string of previous recommendations to look at. Fewer regrets, less hesitancy to buy when the time is right.
cute, the asus flashstore comes out better pricewise though and is available with 12 m.2 storage slots, the favorite is still the QNAP TBS-h574TX, shiver down my spine if I just think of five 60 TB drives...that would nicely tidy up my hoarding issue......and ruin me financially as a side effect :-D
CPU bottle neck not an issue for you?
@@TimHunold is an issue, but is beaten by data density, some time ago there were ExaDrive-s from Nimbus, those were in 3,5" form factor having sata/ahci interface and up to 100TB capacity, for back than approx 40 000 USD/+tax/ upon asking /2016 ish/, currently there are 61.44TB drives with pcie/nvme interface in U.2/U3 15mm, E3.S 7.5mm, and E1.L 9.5 mm form factors, it is freely available in the US for some 4 600 usd /+tax/ and even here in europe for some 5 200 Euro /on 3 pricelists with VAT and free shipping/ so pricey.... that nas and five drives would be some 28 000 euro for 5*60=300 TB raw storage capacity sized like 4-5 DVD cases...... just to fantasize..... smart thing would be of course to use one 15TB drive for some 1200-1400 EUR internally in a workstation utilising the pcie speeds and build two independent nas-es with rotational drives with that capacity for redundancy.....speed would be comparable, and price wise there would be enough spare change to buy a car......
If only it was fanless, passively cooled. There's a missed opportunity not making it perfectly silent IMO. The most interesting option I've seen so far is the one LTT looked at recently, the Friendlyelec CM3588.
There are flash based nas from well known brands like QNAP SYNOLOGY AUSTOR or just diy in a system using adaptors for more m.2 that the typical motherboard has.
Struggling to see the practical benefits of these boxes. Storage size is still seriously limited compared to SATA drives and being quieter can’t be the biggest selling point
And speed!!!!
@@nascompares
So I guess for small high speed purposes that don’t require much storage and for someone who has very very deep pockets ? 😀
Must be quite a tiny market
And with SATA drives you do mean HDDs I assume.
What I want to see is something with SAS-4 so I could run PM7 Series Kioxia Drives. They go up to 30 TB per drive.
@@topgazza hmmm Consumer grade 4 x 8TB NVMe SSD is around € 5600 one Kioxia PM7-R 30.72TB is around € 5700. Wendell from level1techs had fun with PM7's here ruclips.net/video/YYZEPQxOGKk/видео.html
Thank you for your review. This kind of storage box, will get down in price, as the nvme and SSD will be more expensive.
Ehm, maybe read your comment before posting? You're not making sense, things going down in price while getting more expensive...
@@noth606 I am sorry for not making myself clear. The SSD and nvme will increase in price, only the box containing them will be lower in price, get it ?
Great video as usual, this unit can be converted to an unraid server simply by booting with an unraid USB or there are additional steps?
There are a few extra steps for other OS', but for UnRAID it's just 2. Usual boot drive change, but also watchdog deactivation and maybe even deactivating slot #5 in bios, unless you want to pull the 2242 drive. Video coming Sunday on this
There are a few extra steps for other OS', but for UnRAID it's just 2. Usual boot drive change, but also watchdog deactivation and maybe even deactivating slot #5 in bios, unless you want to pull the 2242 drive. Video coming Sunday on this
@@nascompares WOW! then I will be purchasing this unit if it comes to market, UnRAID server with 4x4TB NVME is more than enough for my travel bag.
Great Update and huge amount of Infos as always 👍 Is the Network Performance with other OS also poor or its only with UGOS?
I have no use for HDD even in a NAS, because of their far slower transfer speeds.
Question is should I buy a NAS that has both 2.5inch SATA SSD bays & NVMe slots, or keep searching/waiting for an all NVMe NAS that isn't super wrongfully priced.
I have no clue. I only have about 1Tb of data so I can buy very fairly priced 1Tb/2Tb NVMe SSD's.
What should I do?
What is the crackling popping sounds while you were doing the fan noise testing???
I'd love to see Synology just copy this device... cos you know DSM is BAE
But their price not so bae~ 😅 I could get a UGreen 8-bay and a 6-bay for the price I paid for my 6-bay Synology DS1621xs+ 🥲
I would Iike a mini-PC version of this with 10GbE, HDMI 2.1, and Displayport 2.0 at the back and USBs, SD-card reader, and thunderbolt 4 connectivity at the front panel. 🥺
Ok so this was three months ago... Any improvements in the ecosystem?
Short question: Can we install Debian with Proxmox on it? Or does it have some weird quriks that hinders that?
It looks like the SSD area would be better served by housing one single fan that takes up the whole area and can spin much slower for near complete silence with the same CFM. The engineering they chose looks slick to be sure, but I abhor tiny fans
Betteridge's law - no :) But thanks for the in-depth review.
Please show how to get into the memory module area. that piece is not coming out after removing all the screws for me. Almost all the reviewers wer simply skipping that part and just jump into that memory module area which tells me it is either painful or needs a special tool. I followed the manual to the letter and it is not coming out for me to upgrade the memory module.
Thanks for digging into the hardware and showing internal file transfers. Try unraid with zfs1 of 2 or 3 drives and see how fast it is, just to verify it's not OS/driver related. I think you are correct that the pcie and network are somehow connected to a pcie switch. That would explain the drop. Or that Aquantia nic has incorrect driver. I would pre order one, but can't as not being able to saturate 10Gb is a no go. I think you're beating them up too much on the security part. If account is local then let 3rd party do 2 factor, same with malware, etc.
I see you point, but they NEED to be pushed on the question of security. With approx 6K backers and over a month left to get more people on board, security and long term support is paramount!
Thunderbolt 40g is often thrown around like it's that speed per port. But it's often 40 total throughput. So your discovery of 20 per port is pretty typical to how most thunderbolt operates.
its depends on the device. all apple M Mac with 2 tb ports use a different bus. so you can get 40gbit over every port.
On the down side at this point the drives are going to cost you an organ, unless of course you’re happy going back to a tiny capacity NAS. On the plus side, by the time large drives are affordable we might be on version 10 and it will be much improved.
Thanks for another nice review it’s good to see where things are going. Will look forward to it becoming mainstream.
Great video update! Thank you! Feel a little more confident with the kickstarter
Thanks for the kind words bud
Yeah, I am saying no to crowdfunding projects.
If there is an ECC Ram and NFS I can't do it.
Also that static noise when you're testing the fan noise is because the Nas is not well sealed from interference. I bet you it would fail FCC regulations for interference if it was scrutinized
Consumer infail CPU so no ECC . NFS should be no problem when you put someting like OMS on this instead of there garbage.
@@DJDocsVideos I am so diehard zfs these days, after being down so many crappier roads. I’d love if unraid was zfs
I'm wondering about a NAS to put in a car as a media server. After I saw another channel do a video on the FriendlyElec CM3588. I wondered what you thought about something like that. obviously I don't want to use any spinning disks & that one sounded promising. In the car I was thinking videos wouldn't need to go above 720 p.
i would try a dual channel sodimm kit and see if that changes anything.
I feel like a nuub…. Help me understand the thunderbolt ports. If I hook my MacBook Pro via the thunderbolt 4 ports, will have a 10Gbps+ direct connection between my Mac and this as additional storage. I’m an amateur photographer using medium format photos (large). Looking to connect directly, import my photos into this NAS and editing from it. Basically looking for bi-directional SSD fast connectivity. Help please…
do you have any idea when the flash system is being re-stocked? Every time I look they are out of stock :/
It still bugs me with mini PCs and this, that manufacturers are so wedded to the 4x4x2 (ish) form factor, that you can't just chuck a Noctua fan in them when if it were maybe an inch or so larger, there'd be more than enough room for it. Or just sell the base version, and an upgraded fancy case.
Another of the channels that got the NAS was able to get higher network speed by increasing the RAM to the maximum
Very true, but that's not the default state. Also, the fact this intel 12th gen chip with NVMe at gen 4 internally needs more than 8GB to fully saturate 10G is....odd. I was able to hit 990MB/s with relative ease, using the TS-464 (CELERON, 4GB, 10G card) and the DS1522+ (emb.Ryzen, 8GB, 10G card) with the NVMe on each, as well getting 650-700MB/s with HDDs
This looks like a perfect replacement for my aging nas with spinning rust. Shame the kickstarter is US and Germany delivery only :(
Yep, bummer!
The ssd screws are so important, you have to mention it twice in a row 😂
*points vaguely at Peter pedantic*
*Realises it's a mirror*
This one is now selling for 999? That is ridiculous. Ehat does it think it is? A flashtor 12?
Any knowledge on being able to get the kickstarter discount prices with shipping to the UK?
Currently it only shows USA and Germany.
That is something I would like to know as well. I really like NASCompare's content, one big reason is because they are UK based.
it is time they start using qualcom/arm chips instead from android phones which are more than what is needed with high power efficiency & low temperatures.
What's different on the plus version
Do you need to still pull the m.2 to install 3rd party?
Luckily, no! My video this Sunday will explain it better, but there are numerous ways to avoid this. Also, let's be honest, replacing a 2242 m.2 is a right pain in the arse!!!
It would be interesting how the performance is using UNRAID. if it is better, then its a software problem, if not what a shame
I just watched another review of this, and the idle power consumption was insanely high, 30 watts. It's very disappointing if it will be that high... Arguably it should be around 5-6-8W idle for a device like this.
Looks like a great product, I would of bought one but seems they only let Germany and USA back it and get the discounts. Really disappointing that a massive company like Ugreen would use kickstarter, and on top of that making it impossible for other countries is ridiculous.
Yeah, this is really, REALLY odd/annoying
I would like to know, if I occupy all 4 bays and make a volume with all sdds, is the speed then bottlenecked but the 2 Gen3x2 bays?
What's the difference between the plus version and the regular one?
Will a Thunderbolt external multi-drive enclosure like the OWC Thunderbay 8 work with the UGreen DXP480T through the Thunderbolt connection
Bloody good question! I'd say yes (I tried a RAID 0 2 BAY on the 6 HDD NAS). But nothing that requires the OS to run the raid (pwc tends to use software raid software)
With ugreen nas lineup are you able in docker to change what storage pool the container lives in?
Yes (also, the location of the docker app install)
what they told you about the Thunderbolt ports being "host only" doesn't make any sense. *minimally* , support for Thunderbolt *networking* -- that is, point to point, peer to peer connections between two machines (I guess in "NDIS" mode) should be built into the kernel by default. I wouldn't be at all surprised if it can't just like, become a USB mass storage device, and never would have expected that to begin with. but the idea that it "just can't" make a Thunderbolt-Thunderbolt connection between itself and another host at ~40G for networking doesn't pass the smell test. I suspect someone mistranslated something in emails.
Unfortunately, they have definitely over promised on this as a "something we are working on" feature. And because it's Crowdfunding, those words need to carry weight to a degree. I hope they achieve it, but I'm pretty doubtful too
Why would I buy a turnkey NAS solution just to install a 3ed party OS on it? 🙄
I use Synology for their SW, not their HW. Had I wanted to use TrueNAS/UnRaid, I would have gone the DIY route and got better HW for less $
Convenience tbh. Plus single warranty point of call
It would be great to have 8 drive version even if only 1x or 2x lanes. 4 is a bit too low, nvmes don't have that much capacity.
Would need a Xeon at least, or else you won't just lose the lane speed, but also just the sheer overhead handling surely
@@nascompares Xeon for eight pcie4x1 drives? Performance wise it's the same as two pcie4x4 disks. Intel 8505 is too much for that.
@@tehehe5929 the main problem is that you have usually only 2 ways of splitting the pci-e lanes in consumer cpu's (something like 2x8+1x4 or 1x16+1x4 etc). most devices end up having to use mux/bridge chips to make it work and create additional bottlenecks+cost. that's where xeons come to play, even if you don't need the extra lanes, they have much more combinations than 2. so, in other words, even if you have enough lanes it doesn't matter, 8x1 is not possible in a consumer cpu, because the cpu itself doesnot support it.
@@giornikitop5373 I'm sure hardware oem can manage to change this for a nas. Doesn't seem like something unsurmountable. Remamber that I'm talking about ugreen product here not self built nas.
Quick tech question, why don't people use powered screwdrivers any more? Is there a technical reason?
Massively tears the threads to pieces! The screws in most of these devices are tiny cross heads and/or star screws
@nascompares your buying the wrong electric screwdrivers then, my technicians would strike without em, n we never stripped threads.
r2784 used to be our fear was, "skating", where the driver pops out of the screw head and goes all over the motherboard destroying the silicone lines. This was early 2000 pc building.
But what @nascompares says wasn't on my list.
they don't screw that many screws to need a powered tool
@@nascompares there are small powered screwdrivers for these small screws with appropriate gears that will stop before breaking the screw. Similar to the big power tool counterparts with the swappable lithium cells that do it for big screws
Sold until learning thunderbolt can't be used for networking. What a miss
Tbh, hardly any brand has successfully managed this but QNAP. A few brands (QSAN, Promise) have tried, but it rarely gets beyond the development stages.
i´ll stay on my Asustor FS6706T Flashstor 6
It appears that the campaign isn't open for us to contribute from the United Kingdom, but for the United States and Germany only ....am I missing anything here?
Could this be used to replace a Thunderbolt 3 10G Ethernet Adapter (and for storage as well of course)?
Sadly, not at the minute
Can this only be shipped to USA and Germany?
I don't like that it is maxed out at 16TB of storage.
Is the 10Gbps speed bad performance present in the other OS's (unraid truenas etc) ?
2 German techtubers did some testing. Unraid and truenas seem to be fine: ruclips.net/video/RFHQ6R8aMrc/видео.htmlsi=rtYNbZP9U8mOPv93
No, I got clean full saturation of 10G in TrueNAS scale. I never got the chance to do the same in UnRAID, as I was connected over 1G and running different OS back to back, for a video this Sunday
Shame it doesn't support more drives and the big 8TB drives.
Could it be possible to install a different OS (TrueNAS, UnRAID, Ubuntu...) on this UGreen device?
100%, video coming Sunday on this specifically
Does this NAS come with intel vPro AMT?
Did you hire a new video editor? This video had a few weird glitches in it :)
Sorry about that bud. This was a heavy vid and one that was edited on/off for a month. I spotted the incorrect 'internal hardware/ ports' one. Can you send me a link to others. No worries if you've already watched etc and no time. Cheers for the heads up regardless man
@@nascompares It's totally fine! I was just joking with you! Love your videos!
down here in New Zealand we have neither snakes nor UGREEN NAS's.
And oddly, both will kill you if you take them in the bath...
Does it have the capability to deploy a Virtual Machine?
Only containers currently in the beta
It's a shame it pnly does host based TB4. I would have loved to connect my Macs to it.
It's a big "if" if they can actually accommodate this
The seagull was not outside my window? 😂
How DARE YOU!
This guy is a master of stretching a 5 minute video into 45 minutes. He must have repeated that the ssd and i5 fans are separate about 10 times and doesn’t even get into the technical stuff until 17 minutes in. If you like wasting your time then watch this. I guess he’s just trying to game the algorithm at our expense.
Umm..who made you watch this?
@@nascompares ummm, who made you read and reply to my comment?
hi, which os for the NAS ?
UGOS
I'm new to the NAS home desktop servers. But not the concept. I ran my own Telecommunications Company for 12 years serving large corporations. (HPs International Headquarters, Met Life, Ingersoll-Rand, Burns & Roe, etc) basically 1000 employee workstations or more. Retired in 2010.
I've been watching your channel nonstop trying to find what I consider "bare minimum" for an NAS setup. Which is 2000TB in a RAID2 configuration based on Blu-ray and 4k Blu-ray disc size. I'm not reducing quality when I rip. That's the point. I buy these formats for the quality. I do the same with music, when I rip CDs it's at 320 unlimited. My music collection is over 7TB alone. I don't care. I want the quality I'm paying for. Otherwise just get crappy streaming services.
3 years ago drive sizes were 22TB. 3 years later it's still the same? WTF is going on. According to Moores Law I should be looking at 96TB drives today?
So let me just ask strait out.
What's the best way right now to build a 2000TB desktop NAS server?
Thanks for your help.
Love the videos.
This is a biggie. Would you be ok to ping me an email on Robbie at NASCompares?
The best and only way to build your NAS is the same as the rest of the stuff in your comment: make it up - aka: pull it out of your bum.
cwwk 7840hs followup video when?
When there is time! You might need a quick manners check there bud!
@@nascompares sorry, didn't mean to be rude. I appreciate your work, thanks.
At $999 without storage, you have to be joking.
It just occurred to me that one could probably bang in four or five of those NVMe to SATA cards (each usually support 4 or 5 SATA ports) into one of these UGreen models and be able to support something like~25 SATA HDD or ~25 SATA SSDs.
really unfortunate that this system just seems like a solution searching for a problem. I'm really not sure I understand what niche role this actually fills. It just seems so half-baked as presented, with the seemingly alpha-state software (same as the other boxes) and the limited PCIe and Thunderbolt functionality, at the price bracket it's being sold at.
(to be fair, I'm also very uneducated about this sort of tech, thus why I come to professionals like this channel for guidance, lol)
To be fair, the move towards flash is ramping up considerably. There will be a lot more units like this arriving in the autumn
@35:53 - Wow, that is terrible. Might be OK for a single HDD but nobody is spending the money for a 10gbe NMVE NAS for that level of performance when writing large sequential files. If I got this and didn't see it writing/reading at 900MB/s+ I would assume something is very, very wrong. Until they resolved it, and have proven it isn't some hardware limitation/bad design that can't be fixed with software, I wouldn't fund/order this.
Optimization is apparently ongoing. Plus, there are like 4 different firmware's floating around at the minute with reviewers and I've seen users hit 1GB/1000MB/s. But only in RAID use. Not single drives (which tbh should massively hit 1000MB regardless. TBC!
@@nascompares Yeah, the fact that a single drive can't currently do it, where the NIC should always be the bottleneck, is where I'm wondering if the hardware is limited in the way they linked things like you mentioned. Hopefully it is just software bugs as review highlights it certainly has a ways to go.
nice device, except front panel and power button :(
Fine if you live in the US or Germany otherwise kind of pointless review "Ugreen NA Sync Series on Kickstarter will be available in the following countries: US, Germany"
"kind of a pointless review", but strong there!
Software looks almost like a Synology copy
It is a bit, yeah
Why only shipping to US and Germany?
Pointless.
I keep having to say this...but.."pointless" is rather strong, right?
@@nascompares Put yourself in the place of someone in the UK who can’t Kickstarter a promising product and will have to wait for a full priced retail unit.
@@johnroberts2905 Your point is what? Booooohoooooo, not getting special treatment you don't deserve, and getting the same deal as everyone else - how DARE they?!?!
I see this thing for €999,99 with 8GB of RAM and no SSDs and that's 500 bucks too much.The UGREEN Software sucks donkey balls. Maybe they should hire someone who actually knows how to tune Linux and SAMBA...
Where is the plex testing lol
It was published 2 days ago!
@@nascompares I thought that was revieew of the 4 bay. I will check it out.
Too bad it can't utilize tb4 and have DAS functionality, big missed op
Obviously not, they are aiming to sell to more than the 20 or so ppl worldwide who'd be interested if it did have that. Price matters, ya know.
I wish it has sd card slot. What a miss 😢
I mean, it's not a massive deal breaker for many...but yeah, that would have been the cherry
There seems to be a lot of negativity around the number of reviews for this here, and that it's a kickstarter. To be fair there are lots of reviews on this site for different manufacturers, so I don't see any special treatment of Ugreen. Also, as a video editor this is exactly what I've been looking for, and based on this review, and the fact it's Ugreen, if I could I'd be buying off the kickstarter, but sadly just Germany and US. I understand if you have large amounts of data this NAS would be limiting but as an editor it's perfect, I still have a Terramaster with 24gigs in it to offload completed jobs. I am currently editing off the Terramaster but even with 10Gbe it struggles editing 4K due to the Platter drives.