This is very timely (as usual) as I have been messing around with doubler this morning. It is funny because my first thoughts this morning were where to put it in the chain. I originally had it between the amp and the cab, but I also agree that it sounds better listening to your testing putting it after the cab. Going to go try that now. Thanks again for all of your efforts. You make my life a lot easier!
I wonder where NDSP puts the doubler in their chain in the plugins? Since we can't see the order of the block components, we can't tell for sure, but the doubler sounds pretty good in their plugins. It would be interesting to find out the answer to that question for sure.
It feels as if the cab is mono and collapses everything before it, making the doubler feel like a subtle chorus rather than widening the stereo field as it does once it's after the cab. Still, having used the effect extensively on my Helix, this is something that works best on a dual amp stereo setup. Haven't yet tried it on the QC since I've been quite busy since the update came out, but while trying out some of the plug in patches I feel it tracks better that the Helix one and even the Mimiq, I'm sure it'll do wonders on a proper stereo setup
You're right. Not just the cab, but the drive/amp/cab are all mono blocks and would negate the spread of the doubler effect. Sorry, should have mentioned that in the video - thanks for pointing it out.
Thanks for doing this. On the preset I was using to follow along, it sounded better being first in the chain. I left the FX Level at 0 and bumped dry to +1.6dB.
@@davlavmusic7070 I don’t know if I was running stereo or mono. I now use a special cable to turn the two XLR outputs on the QC into one mono output going into the mixer. I play live fairly often and it’s much easier to just use one cable to FOH.
@@tonepilot Why don’t you sum to mono inside the QC and just use one output? Or why even create stereo processing in the first place, when you eventually sum it down to mono again anyway?
Nice comparison! I agree with your findings. I would be interested to see the same thing in a full stereo preset with a dual parallel amp setup. Now the difference is quite large between start of chain or before the cab and after the cab because the one is mono processing (causing phase warble) and the other is stereo.
Great video as usual! I’d love to know your overall opinion of the Plini plug-in clean and gain sounds compared to pulling up stock amp models like the Lonestar (my favorite go to as well). I noticed that it is really easy to get useable sounds without putting much effort into them (while using the Plini Plug in amps and cabs). I really haven’t done a deep dive but was thinking maybe it has something to do with their independent algorithms? Or maybe I’m just stoked to have something new-lol I do know that I found myself inspired and playing for hours demoing all of the Plini Presets. Some great usable sounds for sure.
Can you do a demo of the doubler placed before and/or after a stereo cab? Also might be worth a shot to place it before two hardpanned amps (look up how Petrucci uses the tc Mimiq pedal).
I actually want to use it through two different heads and cabs panned hard left and right to emphasize the "two guitarists with their own set-up" sound for chuggy rhythm guitarparts. Wasn't able to do it without splitting the signal first and inserting a doubler on the second path and only using the wet output. I actually felt this sounded slightly better with another doubler on the first path using only the dry signal, but that might have been in my head... I was expecting a left and right output out of the doubler block, like with a mimiq...
So you didn’t change the source, I’m not really familiar with the mechanics of the side chain. What is the difference between having no source selected and setting that to input 1? I couldn’t hear much of a difference on my end.
Adjective the source says off, the input for the effect is simply the signal coming into the block. If you select an input source then it uses the output of that block. So, for example, if you pick input 1 and the doubler is after the amps the signal used would be the direct signal from the input. You wouldn't likely hear much since that signal is pretty weak compared to the signal coming from the amp and cab blocks.
@@davlavmusic7070 great info. So I have the doubler placed after my cab block. Would you suggest then not selecting any source and around 12ms for high gain rhythm tones? I’m using the Gojira plugin now for my main amp
@@jasonbenjaminmusic9939 I think that would work well, but in my testing I was really liking using a longer delay (20ms) but pulling back the mix of the FX level. I think either would work well.
Too much in the left channel. it needs to be spread evenly and this example seems heavy on one channel imo. I haven't tried it yet so I'll see how it sounds with a stereo rig setup.
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This is very timely (as usual) as I have been messing around with doubler this morning. It is funny because my first thoughts this morning were where to put it in the chain. I originally had it between the amp and the cab, but I also agree that it sounds better listening to your testing putting it after the cab. Going to go try that now. Thanks again for all of your efforts. You make my life a lot easier!
I wonder where NDSP puts the doubler in their chain in the plugins? Since we can't see the order of the block components, we can't tell for sure, but the doubler sounds pretty good in their plugins. It would be interesting to find out the answer to that question for sure.
oh, sorry, i was impatient :) I will check back later, appreciate your reviews :)
It feels as if the cab is mono and collapses everything before it, making the doubler feel like a subtle chorus rather than widening the stereo field as it does once it's after the cab. Still, having used the effect extensively on my Helix, this is something that works best on a dual amp stereo setup. Haven't yet tried it on the QC since I've been quite busy since the update came out, but while trying out some of the plug in patches I feel it tracks better that the Helix one and even the Mimiq, I'm sure it'll do wonders on a proper stereo setup
You're right. Not just the cab, but the drive/amp/cab are all mono blocks and would negate the spread of the doubler effect. Sorry, should have mentioned that in the video - thanks for pointing it out.
Thanks for doing this. On the preset I was using to follow along, it sounded better being first in the chain. I left the FX Level at 0 and bumped dry to +1.6dB.
I think part of it may be that I was running this effect into mono blocks (drive, amp, cab). Needed to try in running a stereo rig...
@@davlavmusic7070 I don’t know if I was running stereo or mono. I now use a special cable to turn the two XLR outputs on the QC into one mono output going into the mixer. I play live fairly often and it’s much easier to just use one cable to FOH.
@@tonepilot is that then still stereo or does the cable sum both outputs to mono?
@@josuastangl7140 Sums both outputs to mono. It's a special cable with capacitors in it.
@@tonepilot Why don’t you sum to mono inside the QC and just use one output?
Or why even create stereo processing in the first place, when you eventually sum it down to mono again anyway?
Nice comparison! I agree with your findings. I would be interested to see the same thing in a full stereo preset with a dual parallel amp setup. Now the difference is quite large between start of chain or before the cab and after the cab because the one is mono processing (causing phase warble) and the other is stereo.
I tried this and only got it to work by using the doubler after a split.
@@dissonantstyle set the split to stereo, by default it is dual mono.
Great video as usual!
I’d love to know your overall opinion of the Plini plug-in clean and gain sounds compared to pulling up stock amp models like the Lonestar (my favorite go to as well). I noticed that it is really easy to get useable sounds without putting much effort into them (while using the Plini Plug in amps and cabs). I really haven’t done a deep dive but was thinking maybe it has something to do with their independent algorithms? Or maybe I’m just stoked to have something new-lol
I do know that I found myself inspired and playing for hours demoing all of the Plini Presets. Some great usable sounds for sure.
the doubler sounds great on leads
Can you do a demo of the doubler placed before and/or after a stereo cab? Also might be worth a shot to place it before two hardpanned amps (look up how Petrucci uses the tc Mimiq pedal).
Already done: ruclips.net/video/7n93hQBx0Ys/видео.html
@@davlavmusic7070 just watched it. Thanks, great demo!
I actually want to use it through two different heads and cabs panned hard left and right to emphasize the "two guitarists with their own set-up" sound for chuggy rhythm guitarparts. Wasn't able to do it without splitting the signal first and inserting a doubler on the second path and only using the wet output.
I actually felt this sounded slightly better with another doubler on the first path using only the dry signal, but that might have been in my head... I was expecting a left and right output out of the doubler block, like with a mimiq...
It'll collapse into mono if you use it before any mono block. Try adding a stereo cab and putting between that and the amp.
Thanks. I realized that after making the video. Live and learn, I guess.
cool :) what did you name this preset on the cloud? i cant find it on your account. cheers
I haven't made it public yet. Still working on it. I'll release it soon.
So you didn’t change the source, I’m not really familiar with the mechanics of the side chain. What is the difference between having no source selected and setting that to input 1? I couldn’t hear much of a difference on my end.
Adjective the source says off, the input for the effect is simply the signal coming into the block. If you select an input source then it uses the output of that block. So, for example, if you pick input 1 and the doubler is after the amps the signal used would be the direct signal from the input. You wouldn't likely hear much since that signal is pretty weak compared to the signal coming from the amp and cab blocks.
@@davlavmusic7070 great info. So I have the doubler placed after my cab block. Would you suggest then not selecting any source and around 12ms for high gain rhythm tones? I’m using the Gojira plugin now for my main amp
@@jasonbenjaminmusic9939 I think that would work well, but in my testing I was really liking using a longer delay (20ms) but pulling back the mix of the FX level. I think either would work well.
@@davlavmusic7070 excellent thanks!
@@davlavmusic7070 what did you set the mix of the the FX level?
Too much in the left channel. it needs to be spread evenly and this example seems heavy on one channel imo. I haven't tried it yet so I'll see how it sounds with a stereo rig setup.