Please note: at 2:15 Dr. Erickson misspoke and generally recommends placing the arm at the level of the heart (to manage local swelling but not encourage systemic absorption). That said, in settings where neurotoxicity from envenomation is likely (and local tissue swelling is of secondary concern), keeping the bite below the level of the heart may slow lymphatic venom absorption. See Dr. Erickson speak at the upcoming National CME Conference on Wilderness Medicine: wilderness-medicine.com/cme-conferences/santa-fe/
MedWild - Wilderness Medicine, Survival, Rescue don't know about everyone else when I got bit it felt like knifes where tearing my muscles apart. Sucked was in the hospital for a week.
MedWild - Wilderness Medicine, Survival, Rescue.... As great of a video as this is, I’m actually recommending that you remove the video on the account of this important misspeak. After hearing this, I looked at other sources to confirm my gut feeling that this was wrong information. Not everyone is going to know to look here in the comments. This error could cause issues for someone who is bit or advises someone who has been bitten in the future. Please ask this nice gentleman for a new interview! All other information was invaluable.
I want to know what to do when there is no hospital and no one is coming to help, the places you would go and worry about getting bit do not have a hospital on the corner. No cell service, no land lines, radios to weak to reach and your with your young son unable to drive you out.
Well if you really cant walk your way out there, lay on the ground and well hope you dont die on the next days, so its for the best to do a try, our ancestors well just die when they got bite
Years ago I carried a snakebite kit. It had a short razor blade, iodine for disinfection and string for a tourniquet wrapped inside of a two piece thick green rubber holder. Each half of the rubber holder could be used for suction to draw out the venom.
I am Australian and was bitten by a Death Adder, I was in the bush 500klm from nearest medical help. Restrictive bandage was applied over entire leg. It took 7hrs to get to medical help. Doctors slowly released bandage over 1 hr and let my body cope with the venom. No anti venom was needed. Went home after 24hrs all ok.
@@btakesa I was bitten on my foot by a copperhead in Albany Louisiana 3 days ago the first 14 hours my whole body is on fire in my face is numb the second day I sweat so bad I was just drenched smelt terrible today is a third day thank you Jesus that I am alive I thank God for his boldness power healing power in Jesus name amen
Finally some real advice. I have watched videos with crazy advice and techniques. Obviously this guy has credentials beyond refute and I can trust his advice. Thanks for the data and the video.
Serving in the middle east theatre of war, I was bitten by a HUGH "Palestinian Viper" known as the "Vipera xanthina palestinae" and taken immediately to an Israeli hospital where I was treated with anti-venom over 15 vials of it. Within one hour of being bitten, I was basically paralyzed. I was in extreme pain for one hour and then the paralyzation. I felt HOT and my muscles were cramping, It was horrible! I couldn't breathe. And felt as if I was dying. The Israeli doctors were excellent, very knowledgeable, the nursing staff gave me wonderful treatment and the hospital did not charge our military a cent. it was all on the house. I was tranferred to our hospital in Germany but the treatment in israel was the best!
I've been doing some research and I've found two sources that say you should keep the bitten area below the heart, not above. This makes more sense to me since you are trying to keep the poison away from your heart.
Thanks for the comment, please see our annotation: Please note: at 2:15 Dr. Erickson misspoke and generally recommends placing the arm at the level of the heart (to manage local swelling but not encourage systemic absorption). That said, in settings where neurotoxicity from envenomation is likely (and local tissue swelling is of secondary concern), keeping the bite below the level of the heart may slow lymphatic venom absorption.
Finally, a decent resource on this topic. Sooo many people just throwing their opinions around on the Internet about snake/insect bites with nothing to back them up. Is there anything in specific to put into a first aid/emergency kit for snake bites? Or is the only thing that will work until you get to a hospital the usual bandages, gauze, etc.?
A well done and very informative video. I was also taught to lightly wrap an Ace bandage around the bite area if "doing something" will help to calm the patient. Knowing where the closest ER is and how to get there is just about the most important snakebite "treatment". Thanks for posting. Peace.
Several years ago I was doing an 8 day hike in the middle or nowhere. Not a single person on the trail other than me. I knelt down next to a water source. I reached over to my left to place my hand on a rock for support. Just prior to planting my hand I looked over that way. There was a timber rattler resting on the rock, just looking at me. Needless to say I withdrew my hand. If I had been bitten that day I wouldn't be here now, as I was alone and many miles from a road or civilization. My situation was a worst-case event. None of what Dr Erickson mentions here would have saved me. I'm still frightened now just thinking about the potential outcome. Luckly the rattler wasn't too upset.
That’s terrifying m8. I similarly enjoy going deep into the wilderness, and none of this info really helps for a situation like that. Honestly it seems like you need to have antivenom with you while you hike or you are toast. I guess if you were bitten, your best choice would’ve been to tie the wound off as tightly as you possibly could and accept amputation if you make it.
It would really suck if you tied it off and high tailed it out of there and lost your limb from lack of circulation but you didn’t wait long enough to realize you weren’t envenomated. I’m not sure that’s possible though, either it would soon hurt like hell or you’d realize it’s just two pin pricks and you’re fine.
Thanks for the clarification. As a youth leader that occasionally runs into stingy, bitey critters in the great outdoors, I caught the elevation advice right away and checked the comments hoping to find a clarification. Great video. Thank you.
As an intern 4 years ago in south India we used to see a farmer come to ER on a daily basis. We used to see if blood clot in a vial by 20 min (means a hemotoxic snake) and give anti venom. Observe pt for 8 hrs and discharge pt if kidney function test and PT, INR reports, 2 ECGs are normal. Very few pts are serious enough to get admitted (like 1 in 100)
what about applying 20,000 Volts DC at less than 1 milli-amp to the venomous snakebite wound to detoxify the effects? Lancet, the famous British medical journal published an article about it.
There is no reason for CroFab to be as expensive as it is. Antibodies are easy to make, the Fab fragments are easy to purify, and the final product is very stable. Antibodies can sit in a refrigerator for years and not lose effectiveness. (the expiration date on antibodies is arbitrary.) I have antibody stored in my fridge at work that is still good after 20 years. Why is it so expensive? Because you need it to save your life, and hospitals are in business to profit. Also, you have to help cover the cost if the snake keeper gets bitten. But it is much cheaper in Mexico ($100 per vial). So if you gonna get bit, get bit in Mexico.
Medications and treatment for pain was not discussed. Is that something that could be addressed in a video. Realistically, on extended backpacking trips, a bite may not receive definitive treatment for at least 24 hours. Although pain never killed anyone, it does make patient treatment cumbersome and sometimes very difficult. As a trauma nurse, experienced paramedic and wilderness guide I must say that these videos are outstanding!!!! Thank you for everything that you are doing and sharing.
Dr. Erickson is a wealth of knowledge and thanks for the education. I have never had to deal with a snake bite but, I guess making sure you and those in your team know where the closest care facility is would be your best measure of protection. I usally map out ER's when working in a new area which includes knowing where the closest Level 4 is at. Having alterantive routes to get there is also a good idea. Great video... Thank you!
If you are bit by a rattlesnake and invenomated you will know it immediately, it will feel like you got hit with a baseball bat. A rattle snake bite hurts like hell. He never mentions the pain aspect at all. Also the extractors do work well if the strike is on the bone area. The venom will pool on the bone and you can extract it. If you get bit above the shoulder close to your heart, you got about an hour. The most useful advice is this, know your environment, you are strangers in their home is a good way to look at it, wear protection, high cowboy style boots and if not chaps. Step on top of things and not over them, such as rocks and logs. Snakes are more active in late spring and early summer than cold fall and winter weather.
1:56 well may ask you which spiders specifically ? In case of which species it is discouraged? He said ice therapy is applicable in bee stings and SOME spider bites. Could anyone clear up pls? What if it is a scorpion sting?
@@breesechick yes the key is dosage. people use tiny amount and expect results. Dr Andrew Saul is another big mega vitamin person. He is a fighter against cruel and corrupt medical cartels.
That price probably included all the technicians and all they did for the guy but according to his bill, all 80 thousand was related to administering that anti venom. If this is incorrect, whats the true cost and what do you do if you live off the grid and cant get to a doctor?
Being out in the boondocks is not the only place to get bitten. I found a Rattlesnake in my dog kennel 30 feet from my back door. It was a black night and I was putting the pups away for the night, I am also hard of hearing, it took awhile for me to recognize that the pups were not going near their dog box, I finally heard the buzzing, The pups and I got out of the kennel and I went for a flashlight, found that little sucker behind the dog box, he was about 18" . I normally leave all snakes alone but with my gkids, dogs and other relatives around I dispatched this one. The next week I found a calif King snake in my living room, this one was about 30", I released this one out near my pond.
Very good advice! I would only advise not to use an Ace Bandage with Pit Viper/Rattlesnake bites. This can restrict the venom from spreading, but it does so at the cost of the limb suffering the damage. Tissue loss and muscle damage can be aggressive when you use any kind of constriction on the bitten limb. Please just get the victim to medical treatment as quickly and calmly as possible. Remember, when you are calm, you calm those around you in a crisis. Reassure the victim, stay calm, and get help as safely and quickly as possible.
I am a girl scout camp nurse. I am gearing up for camp this year and thought I would do some review, on my own as the camp does not provide this (insert sad face here). I found this video to be very helpful and informative. What about brown recluse bites? And scorpion stings? Thanks again.
Best thing to do is have the victim rest in a comfortable position with their head and shoulders raised and the bitten area below the level of the heart. Also remove any constricting items before the bitten area swells
So I guess if I'm way out in the middle of the Smoky Mountains by myself and get bitten it would be a good reason to use my Inreach ( emergency device) to call for help instead of trying to walk out, correct?
Very instructive video, thank you! One question: Why should the bitten arm be elevated above the heart? (video at 2.13). It might only move the venom into the circulation quicker in a situation (waiting for help) where you would want the opposite. For that reason Dutch first aid protocols advise to let the bitten limb hang down below the heart and move it as little as possible.
I contacted Dr. Erickson who said that he misspoke and recommends placing the arm at the cardiac level (not above) as he demonstrates in this video. Thank you for catching this detail.
@@MedWild I'm a former American EMT - I and our protocol was to keep the extremity BELOW the heart. I'm glad this error was rectified. I'm partial to the Australian St John's Ambulance protocol with pressure bandage.
My dad was bitten by rattle snake twice in his life. He is dead now of old age. He lived 90 years. He slit and sucked and spit and drunk whisky. He poured whiskey on the bite too. Old way of doing things. But it worked. May not have enough time to get to hospital. Peace!
Great answers from Dr Tim! As for the Sawyer extractor, I found it is great for insect bites such as bees and wasps and helps to alleviate the swelling although it would be great to carry an Epipen injector or similar.
He doesn't know much about the Sawyer extraction device. He said you pull and extract; no you push and extract. I have used the device on everything that has bit me in the last twenty years. It works on all kinds of bites and most times there is much less sting. I even use them on fire ant bites and they don't leave nearly as much sting if I use the Sawyer device. I am assuming a snake bite will be a little less toxic if the device is used, right away. They cost nothing and as long as you don't linger to use it, what would it hurt to try, on the way to the hospital.
I did consider myself a Sawyer pump guru but as a Veteran and Eagle Scout I've preached & taught the value of using this device in the 1st ten minutes. I catch rattlers for anti-venom purposes and now can lighten my pack. To all my students, Scouts and soldiers, please accept my apologies for my lack of up to date info. Thank you Dr. Erickson. Jamie
sir yo talking about the advanced country.my question is that if you are in a country like india where medical and Ambulance facilities are not much available some of the rural areas dont have cell phone facilities in that case what we can do if someone bitten by snake???about a week age one of a guy from my village died because of snake bite.....
Researchers are now trying to get funding for a nanoparticle Epi Pen you can stick into the snake wound as soon as it happens. This will greatly delay injury until you can get help. All hikers, all soldiers should have one.
What researchers? For which snakes? What type of venom? I have been bitten by a snake (I didn't realise it at first) and the effects only manifested itself half an hour later (swelling, pain and twin puncture wound). So what does "as soon as it happens" mean?
@@luckystriker7489 It’s the nanoparticle EpiPen, developed by UCI chemistry professor Ken Shea and doctoral student Jeffrey O’Brien. It’s filled with nanoparticles that can absorb toxic venom of snakes--including coral snakes, cobras, mambas, sea snakes, and kraits--before it can spread and do damage to the rest of your body. I found it in Science Daily.
i didn't see any 'wilderness medicine' to cure snake bite in this video? do u? all i get is get your car key and quickly drive to the nearest doctor...in the wilderness...shaman doctor i guess.
That's why hiking solo is high risk and not recommended for the inexperienced. Crap happens. Carry an ace bandage in your first aid kit and practice applying it one handed. There are also tourniquets intended for use by military medics that can be applied one handed. You may have to make some hard decisions about losing a limb to save your life.
That's when you run around in a circle,waving your arms over your head, screaming, "Oh shit, Oh shit, Now I'm going to die." Helps to speed the venom, and kill you quickly.
@@lindsayrooney381 I heard peeing on the snake bite will help. Some people have said vitamin c which makes it’s way directly into the blood stream and heart
Be smart and carry a way to communicate in an emergency. Consider an emergency beacon, satellite phone....but if you think you're likely to have snakebite issues or other emergencies, don't go alone in the first place.
What's the best thing to do if you get bit by a rattlesnake an your on a rough dirt road? Is it better to just drive to the ER or not risk the movements from a rough road an ask for a care flight? And same question but with a small child? Thank you
Finally good calm advice on wilderness snake bites. Pit viper bites need be treated by relaxing the victim and evacuation. Relaxing the victim begins with the rescuer not overreacting to the the event. Coral snake bites do benefit from compression bandaging but not too tightly. Thanks for the video. The more the responder cam model the voice and the affect of the Doctor the better.
After a rattlesnake bite, how long do you have to get to the hospital? Some say 30-minutes, others say 2-hours. Which is it? We all know the sooner the better, but in managing the situation a more exact time is helpful.
The treatment with antivenin also requires something to prevent kidney damage and blood thinning and or bleeding. The antivenin is an infusion with and IV drip. Over hours. It needs to be monitored. The victim going into shock or cardiac arrest is a possibility. You can carry a high fever from the venom or the antivenin. It's a hard ride you don't want to take. My dog got bit a few weeks ago and I've learned a lot from the experience. She's doing fine now. Almost too good.. lol.
Not to mention on the Turner kit, I would assume that you want the toxin that has mixed in with the blood from the arm to dilute itself by going through the body. If a toxin is sitting in one limb, but I’m sure that would cause a pretty potent amount of damage. Versus getting overall sickness.
What about using SAM splints to immobilize the limbs or apply pressure to them? Are they effective with snake bites? Worth taking a SAM splint into the wilderness for them? I am talking on a global level in terms of the snakes you could use them for.
I don't know how much snake bites bleed, but should you compress the wound to stop the bleeding similar to other wounds, or maybe it's okay to let it bleed? Any sterilization and bandaging of snake bite area recommended? If the victim can walk out on his own, let him? Or if there are enough people to do the rocking chair or other carrying method, is that beneficial for delaying the effects of the venom? What I gather from the video is that if walking out on his own is faster, then do that so that he is at the hospital sooner. I will dig into this more. Thanks if you have any input.
Can a person buy antivenom and give himself very very very small amounts maybe twice a month for like a year or two to build up your immune system to snake venom?
_Above_ the heart?? My uneducated thought would be to get the bite _BELOW_ the heart to slow the spread. Seems contradictory to both apply a light tourniquet AND allow gravity to get the blood to the heart sooner than later. What am I missing? (Just a drummer.😉)
dr Tim, thanks for your educational videos,i have a question for you... do you think inject antivenon can help for gain immunity against snake venom? i ask this because here in thailand is so easy find snake in bangkok too, can imagine go inside a forest how could be dangerous...pratically i ask....if i start to inject antivenom, both tipes, neurotoxic and emotoxic, for 5 times each type, my body start to produce antivenom and could be safe in case of real bite? Thx for your reply
We were hiking in the canyons of Utah and I was wondering “what if” one of us (2) got bit by rattler.. no cell service and impossible to get out without climbing and hiking and elevating the heart rate. Plus it is very remote out there, many miles of driving to the nearest hospital. Wondering what one would do in this situation or heaven forbid if someone is alone in the wilderness & gets bit by a poisonous snake?
Great video but I hear him say “keep your arm above your heart, head to the ER”, what if it’s (more likely) your ankle? Foot on the dashboard, your handlebars?
Where I live and "play" phone service is very spotty, especially by provider types. One provider works here, not there, others, there and not here....I carry a personal location beacon on my hikes and I plan and map hikes giving family my trail location and time line. Unless you're on a public park trail within city limits you can be a good hour from help and treatment.
thank god. I was reading a boy scout pamphlet and it said to not use a tourniquet. I'm very sorry, but I would certainly use the tourniquet if I could I usually always have a cat tourniquet on my person and I know that according to tccc (tactical combat casualty care) rules that using a tourniquet is not sacrificing the arm at all. if you stop blood flow in the case of an arterial bleed you would have to release it every 2 hours and let the blood circulate for about 1-2 minutes and re tighten the tourniquet. and, I figured that by that point rescue would have arrived because I would be very hesitant to let the blood flow when there is a possibility for venom to travel through the body.
then again the first step is prevention i would not mess with a snake, but i do see your point. i could imagine that tissue damage is a threat but personally, i would be somewhat okay with that.
The snake's venom is going to cause an infection worse than your mouth and elevating the arm above the heart? Doesn't that increase blood flow to the heart?
When I was a kid in the 80s, we would have snakebite kits with anti-venom and we would test on ourselves, for allergic reaction , ( cost way less back then ) so we would know if we could use it out in the middle of nowhere
No benadryl is not recommended for snake bite. Thankfully CRO FAB antivenin is available for all species of North American pit vipers Copperheads, Cottonmouths and Rattlesnakes.
To remain calm after snakebite, chew one or more qualudes and swallow. Next drool on wound to clean bite site and, if phone is working, attempt to contact emergency services and/or pizza and beverage delivery. If still conscious, place mental bet of who might arrive first, then sit back and embrace situation as experiment into understanding ancient man's spiritual trials.....hot and delicious pizza not withstanding. If affairs not already in order, using finger dipped in tomato sauce, scratch out last will and testament on inside cover of pizza box. Yeah, that about covers it.
I would think that evidence of envenomation by a snake with cytotoxic venom (most rattlesnakes) would be clear after a much shorter time than he suggests. While antivenom carries risks, the longer treatment is delayed, the worse will be the outcome in terms of local tissue damage and possible necrosis: a difficult balancing act.
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
Please note: at 2:15 Dr. Erickson misspoke and generally recommends placing the arm at the level of the heart (to manage local swelling but not encourage systemic absorption).
That said, in settings where neurotoxicity from envenomation is likely (and local tissue swelling is of secondary concern), keeping the bite below the level of the heart may slow lymphatic venom absorption. See Dr. Erickson speak at the upcoming National CME Conference on Wilderness Medicine: wilderness-medicine.com/cme-conferences/santa-fe/
MedWild - Wilderness Medicine, Survival, Rescue don't know about everyone else when I got bit it felt like knifes where tearing my muscles apart. Sucked was in the hospital for a week.
I caught that...
MedWild - Wilderness Medicine, Survival, Rescue.... As great of a video as this is, I’m actually recommending that you remove the video on the account of this important misspeak. After hearing this, I looked at other sources to confirm my gut feeling that this was wrong information. Not everyone is going to know to look here in the comments. This error could cause issues for someone who is bit or advises someone who has been bitten in the future. Please ask this nice gentleman for a new interview! All other information was invaluable.
This is not enough. The video is misleading. Not everyone reads the comments.
I would advise a video edit.
Jim Carrey doing his Jack Nicholson impression while playing a doctor.
Nice one
OMG so true
i cannot unsee this now
Made my day
Fr fr!
This doctor has very good communication skills. He paid attention not only in biology class but also in English.
I want to know what to do when there is no hospital and no one is coming to help, the places you would go and worry about getting bit do not have a hospital on the corner. No cell service, no land lines, radios to weak to reach and your with your young son unable to drive you out.
Well if you really cant walk your way out there, lay on the ground and well hope you dont die on the next days, so its for the best to do a try, our ancestors well just die when they got bite
@@Literallyryangosling777 Not really our ancestors if they got bitten and died. We are the descendants of those who didn't die.
@appsenence9244 they could have had 8 kids then got bit or any other number including 0 yes
Years ago I carried a snakebite kit. It had a short razor blade, iodine for disinfection and string for a tourniquet wrapped inside of a two piece thick green rubber holder. Each half of the rubber holder could be used for suction to draw out the venom.
I am Australian and was bitten by a Death Adder, I was in the bush 500klm from nearest medical help. Restrictive bandage was applied over entire leg. It took 7hrs to get to medical help. Doctors slowly released bandage over 1 hr and let my body cope with the venom. No anti venom was needed. Went home after 24hrs all ok.
Praise Jesus
@@angelalopinto478 Thank you. I can assure you that I was a very frightened man.
@@btakesa I was bitten on my foot by a copperhead in Albany Louisiana 3 days ago the first 14 hours my whole body is on fire in my face is numb the second day I sweat so bad I was just drenched smelt terrible today is a third day thank you Jesus that I am alive I thank God for his boldness power healing power in Jesus name amen
Just wondering because I’m American. Is a restrictive bandage more similar to an Israeli bandage or a tourniquet?
@@angelalopinto478 Praise Jesus and God above. Hope you're well, Angela.
Finally some real advice. I have watched videos with crazy advice and techniques. Obviously this guy has credentials beyond refute and I can trust his advice. Thanks for the data and the video.
I saw them crazy advice videos; I can't believe some of the b s they being saying.
Serving in the middle east theatre of war, I was bitten by a HUGH "Palestinian Viper" known as the "Vipera xanthina palestinae" and taken immediately to an Israeli hospital where I was treated with anti-venom over 15 vials of it.
Within one hour of being bitten, I was basically paralyzed. I was in extreme pain for one hour and then the paralyzation. I felt HOT and my muscles were cramping, It was horrible! I couldn't breathe. And felt as if I was dying.
The Israeli doctors were excellent, very knowledgeable, the nursing staff gave me wonderful treatment and the hospital did not charge our military a cent. it was all on the house.
I was tranferred to our hospital in Germany but the treatment in israel was the best!
Could you explain more? What do you mean by paralyzation? This doesn't sound like a typical crotalinae bite. Were you having an anaphylactic reaction?
@@TyShep06 I don't know any better than you do probably, but most likely it was an anaphylactic reaction.
@Frog shit is real please leave the planet. Thanks 👍
Still doesn't make up for the USS Liberty incident.
@@dearred2923 what did he replied? He deleted it lol
I've been doing some research and I've found two sources that say you should keep the bitten area below the heart, not above. This makes more sense to me since you are trying to keep the poison away from your heart.
Thanks for the comment, please see our annotation: Please note: at 2:15 Dr. Erickson misspoke and generally recommends placing the arm at the level of the heart (to manage local swelling but not encourage systemic absorption).
That said, in settings where neurotoxicity from envenomation is likely (and local tissue swelling is of secondary concern), keeping the bite below the level of the heart may slow lymphatic venom absorption.
Above the heart is best because swelling is the issue with snake bite.
So basically wilderness treatment for snake bite is drive to the hospital?
Vitamin C will neutralize any venom
Mark Lee omg... I was just going to say, vitamin c... and lo and behold! I recommend liposomal vitamin c ... goes directly into the blood stream
Right?
@@mkl126 while vitamin c do help they do not neutralize venom
@@oddapricot4077 It does.
Finally, a decent resource on this topic. Sooo many people just throwing their opinions around on the Internet about snake/insect bites with nothing to back them up.
Is there anything in specific to put into a first aid/emergency kit for snake bites? Or is the only thing that will work until you get to a hospital the usual bandages, gauze, etc.?
A well done and very informative video. I was also taught to lightly wrap an Ace bandage around the bite area if "doing something" will help to calm the patient. Knowing where the closest ER is and how to get there is just about the most important snakebite "treatment". Thanks for posting. Peace.
Several years ago I was doing an 8 day hike in the middle or nowhere. Not a single person on the trail other than me. I knelt down next to a water source. I reached over to my left to place my hand on a rock for support. Just prior to planting my hand I looked over that way. There was a timber rattler resting on the rock, just looking at me. Needless to say I withdrew my hand. If I had been bitten that day I wouldn't be here now, as I was alone and many miles from a road or civilization. My situation was a worst-case event. None of what Dr Erickson mentions here would have saved me. I'm still frightened now just thinking about the potential outcome. Luckly the rattler wasn't too upset.
That’s terrifying m8. I similarly enjoy going deep into the wilderness, and none of this info really helps for a situation like that. Honestly it seems like you need to have antivenom with you while you hike or you are toast. I guess if you were bitten, your best choice would’ve been to tie the wound off as tightly as you possibly could and accept amputation if you make it.
It would really suck if you tied it off and high tailed it out of there and lost your limb from lack of circulation but you didn’t wait long enough to realize you weren’t envenomated. I’m not sure that’s possible though, either it would soon hurt like hell or you’d realize it’s just two pin pricks and you’re fine.
Exactly NOT very real world advice!!
Thanks for the clarification. As a youth leader that occasionally runs into stingy, bitey critters in the great outdoors, I caught the elevation advice right away and checked the comments hoping to find a clarification. Great video. Thank you.
As an intern 4 years ago in south India we used to see a farmer come to ER on a daily basis. We used to see if blood clot in a vial by 20 min (means a hemotoxic snake) and give anti venom. Observe pt for 8 hrs and discharge pt if kidney function test and PT, INR reports, 2 ECGs are normal. Very few pts are serious enough to get admitted (like 1 in 100)
what about applying 20,000 Volts DC at less than 1 milli-amp to the venomous snakebite wound to detoxify the effects? Lancet, the famous British medical journal published an article about it.
So the question for me has always been when I’m solo, am I better off “hiking strenuously” to get out or just staying where I’m at?
The answer is good coms. Get a satellite communicator (like a Spot X) and use it if you're out of cellphone range to get help.
The guy in green kind of looks like Jim Carey. Lol. Specially the eyebrows
jessed310 I like the new Jim Carrey too.
If it bites your butt how do you elevate above heart?
That’s actually his part time job. Jim Carey impersonator.
TOTALLY
you say “eyebrows” I only see one eyebrow though😂
So in the Event you were unable to get to anti venom at all what could you do to help survive a snake bite
Particularly a rattle snake bite
Exactly this is a city dude to use an old term
There is no reason for CroFab to be as expensive as it is. Antibodies are easy to make, the Fab fragments are easy to purify, and the final product is very stable. Antibodies can sit in a refrigerator for years and not lose effectiveness. (the expiration date on antibodies is arbitrary.) I have antibody stored in my fridge at work that is still good after 20 years. Why is it so expensive? Because you need it to save your life, and hospitals are in business to profit. Also, you have to help cover the cost if the snake keeper gets bitten. But it is much cheaper in Mexico ($100 per vial). So if you gonna get bit, get bit in Mexico.
Hospitals don't set the price for pharmaceuticals but the company that manufactures it does. The hospital is a middle man just like the pharmacy.
Medications and treatment for pain was not discussed. Is that something that could be addressed in a video. Realistically, on extended backpacking trips, a bite may not receive definitive treatment for at least 24 hours. Although pain never killed anyone, it does make patient treatment cumbersome and sometimes very difficult. As a trauma nurse, experienced paramedic and wilderness guide I must say that these videos are outstanding!!!! Thank you for everything that you are doing and sharing.
So what are you saying? You want a script of oxy's for your trip?🤔😁
Dr. Erickson is a wealth of knowledge and thanks for the education. I have never had to deal with a snake bite but, I guess making sure you and those in your team know where the closest care facility is would be your best measure of protection. I usally map out ER's when working in a new area which includes knowing where the closest Level 4 is at. Having alterantive routes to get there is also a good idea. Great video... Thank you!
mackmcnasty27 Thanks for the feedback- we're working on more videos to post soon
If you are bit by a rattlesnake and invenomated you will know it immediately, it will feel like you got hit with a baseball bat. A rattle snake bite hurts like hell. He never mentions the pain aspect at all. Also the extractors do work well if the strike is on the bone area. The venom will pool on the bone and you can extract it. If you get bit above the shoulder close to your heart, you got about an hour. The most useful advice is this, know your environment, you are strangers in their home is a good way to look at it, wear protection, high cowboy style boots and if not chaps. Step on top of things and not over them, such as rocks and logs. Snakes are more active in late spring and early summer than cold fall and winter weather.
Brian Sullivan This was really helpful!
Thanks for this video. Awesome video! Filled with great advice and information. I also love the sense of humor that goes on throughout the video.
1:56 well may ask you which spiders specifically ? In case of which species it is discouraged? He said ice therapy is applicable in bee stings and SOME spider bites. Could anyone clear up pls? What if it is a scorpion sting?
Vitamin C will neutralize any poison. Must use high amount.
Bee scorpion snake chemical etc.
Google Dr Levy on this subject.
@@mkl126 I just looked him up, amazing research! Thanks for sharing. Might use his knowledge for my health presently. ❤️👍😊🔑
@@breesechick yes the key is dosage. people use tiny amount and expect results. Dr Andrew Saul is another big mega vitamin person. He is a fighter against cruel and corrupt medical cartels.
That price probably included all the technicians and all they did for the guy but according to his bill, all 80 thousand was related to administering that anti venom. If this is incorrect, whats the true cost and what do you do if you live off the grid and cant get to a doctor?
Being out in the boondocks is not the only place to get bitten. I found a Rattlesnake in my dog kennel 30 feet from my back door. It was a black night and I was putting the pups away for the night, I am also hard of hearing, it took awhile for me to recognize that the pups were not going near their dog box, I finally heard the buzzing, The pups and I got out of the kennel and I went for a flashlight, found that little sucker behind the dog box, he was about 18" . I normally leave all snakes alone but with my gkids, dogs and other relatives around I dispatched this one. The next week I found a calif King snake in my living room, this one was about 30", I released this one out near my pond.
Napashah Lahat : in the 35 years I have been here, I have seen 6 Rattlesnakes and 30 or so other types, kings, garter, bull or Gopher snake.
This sounded like very sound/logical information. Good to know!
Very good advice! I would only advise not to use an Ace Bandage with Pit Viper/Rattlesnake bites. This can restrict the venom from spreading, but it does so at the cost of the limb suffering the damage. Tissue loss and muscle damage can be aggressive when you use any kind of constriction on the bitten limb.
Please just get the victim to medical treatment as quickly and calmly as possible.
Remember, when you are calm, you calm those around you in a crisis. Reassure the victim, stay calm, and get help as safely and quickly as possible.
I am a girl scout camp nurse. I am gearing up for camp this year and thought I would do some review, on my own as the camp does not provide this (insert sad face here). I found this video to be very helpful and informative. What about brown recluse bites? And scorpion stings? Thanks again.
Liposomal vitamin c.
I love this. Professional and to the point.
Best thing to do is have the victim rest in a comfortable position with their head and shoulders raised and the bitten area below the level of the heart. Also remove any constricting items before the bitten area swells
So I guess if I'm way out in the middle of the Smoky Mountains by myself and get bitten it would be a good reason to use my Inreach ( emergency device) to call for help instead of trying to walk out, correct?
snake venom immobilizes you and prevents blood clotting so moving more will just make you bleed more
Absolutely. You want to keep your heart rate as low as possible so it doesn't move the venom through your body faster.
Very instructive video, thank you!
One question: Why should the bitten arm be elevated above the heart? (video at 2.13). It might only move the venom into the circulation quicker in a situation (waiting for help) where you would want the opposite. For that reason Dutch first aid protocols advise to let the bitten limb hang down below the heart and move it as little as possible.
Exactly what I was thinking. Everything I've heard/read is to keep the bite below the heart if it is in a location that allows.
I contacted Dr. Erickson who said that he misspoke and recommends placing the arm at the cardiac level (not above) as he demonstrates in this video. Thank you for catching this detail.
@@MedWild I'm a former American EMT - I and our protocol was to keep the extremity BELOW the heart. I'm glad this error was rectified. I'm partial to the Australian St John's Ambulance protocol with pressure bandage.
My dad was bitten by rattle snake twice in his life. He is dead now of old age. He lived 90 years. He slit and sucked and spit and drunk whisky. He poured whiskey on the bite too. Old way of doing things. But it worked. May not have enough time to get to hospital. Peace!
👍. But if one does it old ways, medical business will loss a good money?
Great answers from Dr Tim!
As for the Sawyer extractor, I found it is great for insect bites such as bees and wasps and helps to alleviate the swelling although it would be great to carry an Epipen injector or similar.
He doesn't know much about the Sawyer extraction device. He said you pull and extract; no you push and extract. I have used the device on everything that has bit me in the last twenty years. It works on all kinds of bites and most times there is much less sting. I even use them on fire ant bites and they don't leave nearly as much sting if I use the Sawyer device. I am assuming a snake bite will be a little less toxic if the device is used, right away. They cost nothing and as long as you don't linger to use it, what would it hurt to try, on the way to the hospital.
Wow, I really got some fun facts from Dr. Carey
I did consider myself a Sawyer pump guru but as a Veteran and Eagle Scout I've preached & taught the value of using this device in the 1st ten minutes. I catch rattlers for anti-venom purposes and now can lighten my pack. To all my students, Scouts and soldiers, please accept my apologies for my lack of up to date info. Thank you Dr. Erickson. Jamie
sir yo talking about the advanced country.my question is that if you are in a country like india where medical and Ambulance facilities are not much available some of the rural areas dont have cell phone facilities in that case what we can do if someone bitten by snake???about a week age one of a guy from my village died because of snake bite.....
How long do people have with numbers to survive?
Researchers are now trying to get funding for a nanoparticle Epi Pen you can stick into the snake wound as soon as it happens.
This will greatly delay injury until you can get help. All hikers, all soldiers should have one.
What they need is liposomal vitamin c.
@@OfftoShambala Please elaborate.
What researchers? For which snakes? What type of venom? I have been bitten by a snake (I didn't realise it at first) and the effects only manifested itself half an hour later (swelling, pain and twin puncture wound). So what does "as soon as it happens" mean?
@@luckystriker7489 It’s the nanoparticle EpiPen, developed by UCI chemistry professor Ken Shea and doctoral student Jeffrey O’Brien. It’s filled with nanoparticles that can absorb toxic venom of snakes--including coral snakes, cobras, mambas, sea snakes, and kraits--before it can spread and do damage to the rest of your body. I found it in Science Daily.
The next video literally says to keep it below your heart! I don’t know what the hell to believe anymore
Read the pinned comment at the top. It states that he misspoke and the limb should be kept below the heart.
Great video, well spoken and well informed Doc 👍🏽
Great information.... A nice reality of the real care for a snake bite :-)
Laura Elkins Thank you for the comment
Gotta say this is pretty helpfull,and explicative something that can save lifes
Excellent info! Thank you so much!
Awesome Doctor and Interview thanks
i didn't see any 'wilderness medicine' to cure snake bite in this video? do u? all i get is get your car key and quickly drive to the nearest doctor...in the wilderness...shaman doctor i guess.
What about us hikers 5 miles in the wilderness, where there ain't no car or anyone around alone and by yourself ?
That's why hiking solo is high risk and not recommended for the inexperienced. Crap happens. Carry an ace bandage in your first aid kit and practice applying it one handed. There are also tourniquets intended for use by military medics that can be applied one handed. You may have to make some hard decisions about losing a limb to save your life.
Do NOT apply tourniquets to pit viper bites! I repeat do not!
What is the best thing to do if you are alone
But what about being in the wilderness, miles away from a car or cell phone?
This is exactly what I am wondering too. I am always hiking in rattle snake country. Sometimes 5-10 miles from civilization.
That's when you run around in a circle,waving your arms over your head, screaming, "Oh shit, Oh shit, Now I'm going to die." Helps to speed the venom, and kill you quickly.
@@lindsayrooney381 I heard peeing on the snake bite will help. Some people have said vitamin c which makes it’s way directly into the blood stream and heart
@@Withlola_ox Nope to both.
Be smart and carry a way to communicate in an emergency. Consider an emergency beacon, satellite phone....but if you think you're likely to have snakebite issues or other emergencies, don't go alone in the first place.
What's the best thing to do if you get bit by a rattlesnake an your on a rough dirt road? Is it better to just drive to the ER or not risk the movements from a rough road an ask for a care flight? And same question but with a small child? Thank you
Dear All, for ARIZONA snakes I did not get how much life time a person has after the bite to get the antivenom ?? Thank you for your answer.
I agree. They say get to a hospital quickly but what does that mean? 1/2 hr, 1 hr, 2hrs?
Finally good calm advice on wilderness snake bites. Pit viper bites need be treated by relaxing the victim and evacuation. Relaxing the victim begins with the rescuer not overreacting to the the event. Coral snake bites do benefit from compression bandaging but not too tightly. Thanks for the video. The more the responder cam model the voice and the affect of the Doctor the better.
After a rattlesnake bite, how long do you have to get to the hospital? Some say 30-minutes, others say 2-hours. Which is it? We all know the sooner the better, but in managing the situation a more exact time is helpful.
Some people say the bulk of it wore off in like 12 hours
The treatment with antivenin also requires something to prevent kidney damage and blood thinning and or bleeding. The antivenin is an infusion with and IV drip. Over hours. It needs to be monitored. The victim going into shock or cardiac arrest is a possibility.
You can carry a high fever from the venom or the antivenin.
It's a hard ride you don't want to take.
My dog got bit a few weeks ago and I've learned a lot from the experience. She's doing fine now. Almost too good.. lol.
If I get bit on the ankle by rattlesnake and a full days hike over mountains to the road, can I hike out?
WHAT ABOUT A VENOM VAC ? I'VE HEARD IT HAS WORKED ON BLACK MAMBA BITES
Not to mention on the Turner kit, I would assume that you want the toxin that has mixed in with the blood from the arm to dilute itself by going through the body. If a toxin is sitting in one limb, but I’m sure that would cause a pretty potent amount of damage. Versus getting overall sickness.
Tourniquet 😂
Good Information Sir
Great knowledge..thank you sir
If one is not hear help, what is the best way to "treat" or disinfect a bite if you believe it to be a dry bite?
What about using SAM splints to immobilize the limbs or apply pressure to them? Are they effective with snake bites? Worth taking a SAM splint into the wilderness for them? I am talking on a global level in terms of the snakes you could use them for.
I don't know how much snake bites bleed, but should you compress the wound to stop the bleeding similar to other wounds, or maybe it's okay to let it bleed? Any sterilization and bandaging of snake bite area recommended? If the victim can walk out on his own, let him? Or if there are enough people to do the rocking chair or other carrying method, is that beneficial for delaying the effects of the venom? What I gather from the video is that if walking out on his own is faster, then do that so that he is at the hospital sooner. I will dig into this more. Thanks if you have any input.
Can a person buy antivenom and give himself very very very small amounts maybe twice a month for like a year or two to build up your immune system to snake venom?
_Above_ the heart?? My uneducated thought would be to get the bite _BELOW_ the heart to slow the spread. Seems contradictory to both apply a light tourniquet AND allow gravity to get the blood to the heart sooner than later. What am I missing? (Just a drummer.😉)
dr Tim, thanks for your educational videos,i have a question for you...
do you think inject antivenon can help for gain immunity against snake venom? i ask this because here in thailand is so easy find snake in bangkok too, can imagine go inside a forest how could be dangerous...pratically i ask....if i start to inject antivenom, both tipes, neurotoxic and emotoxic, for 5 times each type, my body start to produce antivenom and could be safe in case of real bite?
Thx for your reply
Good way to make antibodies TO the antivenom. So no, don't do that!
We were hiking in the canyons of Utah and I was wondering “what if” one of us (2) got bit by rattler.. no cell service and impossible to get out without climbing and hiking and elevating the heart rate. Plus it is very remote out there, many miles of driving to the nearest hospital. Wondering what one would do in this situation or heaven forbid if someone is alone in the wilderness & gets bit by a poisonous snake?
Great video but I hear him say “keep your arm above your heart, head to the ER”, what if it’s (more likely) your ankle? Foot on the dashboard, your handlebars?
Thanks man I work outside alot
VERY helpful. Thanks.
What about charcoal supplement ?
No no, do not elevate bite area above heart, period. I think he meant to say below!! That way it's harder to travel to vital organ.. think about it..
Where I live and "play" phone service is very spotty, especially by provider types. One provider works here, not there, others, there and not here....I carry a personal location beacon on my hikes and I plan and map hikes giving family my trail location and time line. Unless you're on a public park trail within city limits you can be a good hour from help and treatment.
how can we identify the amount of venum? the problem is the patient doesnt know what kind of snake that bite her. so what antivenum we might inject?
thank god. I was reading a boy scout pamphlet and it said to not use a tourniquet. I'm very sorry, but I would certainly use the tourniquet if I could I usually always have a cat tourniquet on my person and I know that according to tccc (tactical combat casualty care) rules that using a tourniquet is not sacrificing the arm at all. if you stop blood flow in the case of an arterial bleed you would have to release it every 2 hours and let the blood circulate for about 1-2 minutes and re tighten the tourniquet. and, I figured that by that point rescue would have arrived because I would be very hesitant to let the blood flow when there is a possibility for venom to travel through the body.
Nicholas Fernandez And your dumbass would lose an arm or a leg. You are probably dumb enough to mess with the snake and get bit as well.
then again the first step is prevention i would not mess with a snake, but i do see your point. i could imagine that tissue damage is a threat but personally, i would be somewhat okay with that.
The body can't naturally fight the venom if you trap the blood in the arm, you'll defiantly lose an arm
If ppl live in the woods ( grid's out)No Hospital, what does one do to save self?
Is there anti-venom for Scorpion bytes?
Great info to know! TY
Thanks for all advices 😉
What about wrapping above the wound so it cant travel?
Destiny, wrapping is a bad idea because it traps the venom in small area and will make the bite area worse.
The snake's venom is going to cause an infection worse than your mouth and elevating the arm above the heart? Doesn't that increase blood flow to the heart?
Above the heart? I thought the best is to keep wound lower then heart is that wrong?
what pretell is a dry bite
Thank you!
When I was a kid in the 80s, we would have snakebite kits with anti-venom and we would test on ourselves, for allergic reaction , ( cost way less back then ) so we would know if we could use it out in the middle of nowhere
What is about "heat"? Something like a "bite away stick" ? Can it destroy the poison?
What If im alone ? I often fish alone and was curious what I would do If I was bitten in the woods alone and I don’t have cell service
Use your feet and walk
I heard that in the amazon they use electrical shock to neutralize the venom. Like from a stun gun. Any truth in that?
How about benedryl?
No benadryl is not recommended for snake bite. Thankfully CRO FAB antivenin is available for all species of North American pit vipers Copperheads, Cottonmouths and Rattlesnakes.
self inflicted snakebite-
does said snake consent or is this a resource violation?
To remain calm after snakebite, chew one or more qualudes and swallow. Next drool on wound to clean bite site and, if phone is working, attempt to contact emergency services and/or pizza and beverage delivery. If still conscious, place mental bet of who might arrive first, then sit back and embrace situation as experiment into understanding ancient man's spiritual trials.....hot and delicious pizza not withstanding. If affairs not already in order, using finger dipped in tomato sauce, scratch out last will and testament on inside cover of pizza box. Yeah, that about covers it.
I love how Mister smarty-pants automatically assumes that there's going to be others with you.......
Informative and up-to-date ... Thanx
Ahmad Salem Thanks for the comment
He looks and sounds like a young Jack Nicholson
I was gonna say the exact same thing. Lol. Beat me to it
That's him
What if you have none of the above just you in the wilderness
Didn’t someone else say to immobilize the site of the bite BELOW the heart?
I would think that evidence of envenomation by a snake with cytotoxic venom (most rattlesnakes) would be clear after a much shorter time than he suggests. While antivenom carries risks, the longer treatment is delayed, the worse will be the outcome in terms of local tissue damage and possible necrosis: a difficult balancing act.
Did this guy say the bacteria in the human mouth is worse than a snake bite?