I love to see an army get crushed and thus would love it if the all players would hang out just a little longer so the fans could see it when it happens...
Oh boy the balance whine has to be everywhere. Except for the highest level of competition Protoss dominates since it's way easier to excute. Only the absolute top Zergs and Terrans are able to squeeze out the full potential of their races. Basically only Clem, Serral, Reynor and often times Maru are able to do that. Even great players like Cure don't play Terran to it's highest potential, since Terran Glass Cannon units need so much attention. Zerg Macro and defending multi prong attacks is the same thing, while they also have to read the game correctly to build the right units. That being said, it seems that lately most Zergs just bridge mid game with Roach/Ravager to late game units. Terran has basically no skill limit since you can NEVER micro multiple map locations perfectly, you can only try to do it better. Protoss doesn't have the potential to scale individual player skill as hard as the above mentioned players do with their races. And that's why it's imo even legit to argue that Protoss has the disadvantage when it comes to competing with the few very best players in the world, but ONLY in this super elite circumstance.
God please fix Terran. Walks directly into 3 bane bombs, gets whole army fungled, drops 3 full medivacs on top of a spore and 3 queens, wins the fight. It's disgustingly broken.
bane bombs rend clem's army a few times (losing 5-10 marines at once) but if one is macroing, rally can replace that in 5 seconds. fungal'd sure, but it's slow damage, where's the rest of the army to finish off fungal'd army? clem's at 3-3 upgrades. 3 full medivacs all got damaged, reynor didn't focus spore+queen shots properly. oh, and 97 fucking drones bro. maxpax always shuts down clem's medivacs by focusing his stalkers on medivacs before the marines. don't forget SHIN (Ragnarok) 2-0 Clem AFTER clem won EWC. do you even listen to the casts when you watch this or are you just listening to your own voice in your head? just accept that clem is better, and reynor was too cocky not practicing as much as clem.
To be fair, this comment is undeniably true. Zerg has been nerfed in every patch since 2019. Ghosts counter every single Zerg unit except lings and banes, and are strong against them too after sniping the overseers with a couple of clicks. I think we all know that Terran will be winning many tournaments until there is a balance adjustment. Time will tell.
Nukes. Terran is already going to make ghosts because it's Zerg and snipe is broken against them, trading 200 resources of nukes for like 500+ resources of buildings (remember that each spore also costs a drone) is usually a good plan. You can move the spores, but that's a drain on APM and it's giving up a position that you were wanting to hold. Flooding static D can work against zerg and protoss but it's usually not a good plan vs terran because they can always just throw nukes at you and it's hard to beat them in efficiency there (nukes are only 100/100 each.) I guess it could work in ultra late game when gas is actually a serious constraint, but Terran tends to be advantaged there too because of how good hellbats and marines are vs zerg mineral dump units and how efficient ghosts are at trading...
Yeah and clem doesn't do 18231238 apm, triple splits, 3 front attacks but then.... 2 BURROWED BANELINGS but not gg because that stuff isn't game ending?
@@yawgmoth6568lol are you actually comparing 2 single use banelings that have to be microed to unborrow and detonate to deal 35 damage to 2 window mines that auto attack and deal 125 damage and 40 splash damage on a 29 second cool down for 25 more minerals per unit. Thanks for reminding me how silly this community is.
Is Reynor allergic to dropping a spire? Clem's style is so centered around medivac-based multi-prong and hot pick ups/healing to minimize casualties, and we saw him struggle in the game where the medivac count was too low. It seems like a handful of corrupters to chase down the medivacs would be very effective, but Reynor doesn't even drop spire when he's maxed, building bank, and Clem has started building liberators... no spire early is one thing, but I just don't understand the thinking in late game
With all due respect that is like asking "Why didn't you just headbutt him?" to someone who was in a chokehold from behind trying to not black out. Trust me, given even 15 seconds of breathing room Reynor would have transitioned to late-game tech. But Reynor built exactly TWO Tier-3 (Hive-tech) units in the 17-minute game: 2 infestors at the very end (when it was too late to make any difference). He was doing Hydra-Ling-Bane with no ranged upgrades because he didn't have any other choice. At what point Reynor have the ~1000 minerals AND gas to pursue a new, zero-upgrade tech path? He couldn't even make Lurkers. He couldn't make Ultras or Vipers; in any event, Vipers would have been much better to shut down drops and Reynor still couldn't make those. PiG said it accurately: Reynor built too many drones, and put too many eggs in the burrowed Baneling basket. Clem is just obscenely good at TvZ, dismantling "set piece" Zergs like Serral and Reynor. He gets in their face and never lets them out of the chokehold.
@@snealbli I agree Clem is insanely good, but disagree that reynor did not have leeway to drop a spire. That is definitely true at times, but it clearly wasn't in game 4 for example. If anything, it seemed he was trying to force hydra-ling-bane past when it was effective to avoid late game rather than transition. Keeping the medivac count low limits Clem's mobility and healing (corrupters also tank widow mines, a Clem staple). Maybe spire is bad or Reynor hasn't practiced it, but waiting too long on better anti-air (be it corrupters, infestor/hydra, or vipers) is clearly costing him, as the inability of queens and hydras to chase drops limits their effectiveness.
@@rockandrolljew89 Reynor also beat Clem 2 or three time with mass muta, but it seems to be very dangerous and tiring games... as it takes a long time to dismantle Clem and also making an error and losing all your muta in a split second. But it could be also stubbornness, ego, or just simply like mentioned earlier, being overwhelmed.
@@rockandrolljew89 My answer was specific to game 5, so it may have made more sense in the previous games. Personally, I believe that because SC2 has gotten so fast-paced in LotV, that it has become easier just to go Vipers. Hive around 10 minutes is common now. And unlike sky zerg, Vipers never become obsolete or stop paying dividends, unlike air tech which will eventually require upgrades to remain useful supply. And Vipers are never wasted supply, unlike Corruptors during a frontal push.
Zerg has no chance after the mid-game. If Zerg has the time and money for corruptors, then Terran has the time and money for Ghosts. A player as good as Clem will never lose a TvZ in this patch with Ghosts. A player as good as Reynor will never win a ZvT vs a Clem with late-game Ghosts.
Never change, balance whiners 😂 someone doesn't remember when the finals were always ZvZ for like 2 years in a row, and one of those two was Reynor like, two-thirds of the time
![[ENG] 2024 SSL AUTUMN | Ro.16 Group B (Tastosis)](/img/1.gif)
🛡Spoiler shield! 🛡
Amazing cast, PiG! 💯 Game 5 was a masterclass in Zerg, Terran, and casting!
Stop it. I need to know if Zerg wins cause I will never watch them win. Ever.
😊@@snealbli
4th game was one of the best sc2 games I've watched. I play zerg but I admired how Clem defended all those nydus. Very impressive play.
Many of us already know who wins but it's still worth watching PiG cast it
I haven’t watch the match and I know who wins lol
Surely, this is better than Serral vs Clem.
Don't know about balance but Clem is something to watch playing.. attacking 3 front at the same time is a show
It's tricky to balance for because a lot of the problems we're seeing in ZvT when Clem is the T only happen because Clem has that sheer, insane speed.
Since Reynor was the only one taking maps of Clem. This could have very well been the best series of the Tournament.
I choose to believe the thing about the keyboard techniques is correct. Also I choose to believe that Reynor's keyboard is smeared with snack residue
These two again...
Love seeing them play.
That first game was wild.
Awesome game and great cast !
Was fun to watch
“Clem, you unreasonable freak!” lol
Thanks for uploading, Pig. Top notch casting, as always.
Great video and commenting)
I love to see an army get crushed and thus would love it if the all players would hang out just a little longer so the fans could see it when it happens...
What a barn burner
zergs are the bullies. clem is the cool kid standing up to them
nice match
1:16:19 lol that's fucked up
Oh boy the balance whine has to be everywhere. Except for the highest level of competition Protoss dominates since it's way easier to excute. Only the absolute top Zergs and Terrans are able to squeeze out the full potential of their races. Basically only Clem, Serral, Reynor and often times Maru are able to do that. Even great players like Cure don't play Terran to it's highest potential, since Terran Glass Cannon units need so much attention. Zerg Macro and defending multi prong attacks is the same thing, while they also have to read the game correctly to build the right units. That being said, it seems that lately most Zergs just bridge mid game with Roach/Ravager to late game units. Terran has basically no skill limit since you can NEVER micro multiple map locations perfectly, you can only try to do it better. Protoss doesn't have the potential to scale individual player skill as hard as the above mentioned players do with their races. And that's why it's imo even legit to argue that Protoss has the disadvantage when it comes to competing with the few very best players in the world, but ONLY in this super elite circumstance.
God please fix Terran. Walks directly into 3 bane bombs, gets whole army fungled, drops 3 full medivacs on top of a spore and 3 queens, wins the fight. It's disgustingly broken.
Crybaby when only one Terran can beat the top Zerg players
You forgot the upgrades..
@@CamRednax yeah literally only one. 🤣
bane bombs rend clem's army a few times (losing 5-10 marines at once) but if one is macroing, rally can replace that in 5 seconds. fungal'd sure, but it's slow damage, where's the rest of the army to finish off fungal'd army? clem's at 3-3 upgrades. 3 full medivacs all got damaged, reynor didn't focus spore+queen shots properly. oh, and 97 fucking drones bro. maxpax always shuts down clem's medivacs by focusing his stalkers on medivacs before the marines. don't forget SHIN (Ragnarok) 2-0 Clem AFTER clem won EWC. do you even listen to the casts when you watch this or are you just listening to your own voice in your head? just accept that clem is better, and reynor was too cocky not practicing as much as clem.
Way too good
Hey look, another video of the race that got nerfed non stop for 5 years vs the race whose endgame unit counters every other endgame unit
@@BukovTervicz So play it, and be a grandmaster. You can be rich with this talent !
True, Terran did get nerfed a lot, mad how Clem still made it work in spite of all that.
To be fair, this comment is undeniably true. Zerg has been nerfed in every patch since 2019. Ghosts counter every single Zerg unit except lings and banes, and are strong against them too after sniping the overseers with a couple of clicks.
I think we all know that Terran will be winning many tournaments until there is a balance adjustment. Time will tell.
@@nickcole6682 So why is Serral winning almost everything, even against maru, or byun ? Why did reynor kick clem's ass on the world team tournament ?
@@clement.234 STOP THINKING ABOUT THINGS FOR MORE THAN 1 SECOND! WHY CAN'T YOU JUST BE ANGRY
Terran: good race.
Why not cover all with spores? We are doing it in silver :)
Nukes. Terran is already going to make ghosts because it's Zerg and snipe is broken against them, trading 200 resources of nukes for like 500+ resources of buildings (remember that each spore also costs a drone) is usually a good plan. You can move the spores, but that's a drain on APM and it's giving up a position that you were wanting to hold. Flooding static D can work against zerg and protoss but it's usually not a good plan vs terran because they can always just throw nukes at you and it's hard to beat them in efficiency there (nukes are only 100/100 each.) I guess it could work in ultra late game when gas is actually a serious constraint, but Terran tends to be advantaged there too because of how good hellbats and marines are vs zerg mineral dump units and how efficient ghosts are at trading...
“Alright Alright Alright” is the cringiest opening on YT for some reason. IDK why it creeps me out. 😅
Reynor plays like an artist, defending perfectly 2000 apm, splits, double splits, he faze his units to other dimensions but then.....2 WIDOW MINES GG
maybe try not building 100 drones next time when you have yet to secure a fifth? xD
Yeah and clem doesn't do 18231238 apm, triple splits, 3 front attacks but then.... 2 BURROWED BANELINGS but not gg because that stuff isn't game ending?
@@yawgmoth6568lol are you actually comparing 2 single use banelings that have to be microed to unborrow and detonate to deal 35 damage to 2 window mines that auto attack and deal 125 damage and 40 splash damage on a 29 second cool down for 25 more minerals per unit. Thanks for reminding me how silly this community is.
Fastest Players
Is Reynor allergic to dropping a spire? Clem's style is so centered around medivac-based multi-prong and hot pick ups/healing to minimize casualties, and we saw him struggle in the game where the medivac count was too low. It seems like a handful of corrupters to chase down the medivacs would be very effective, but Reynor doesn't even drop spire when he's maxed, building bank, and Clem has started building liberators... no spire early is one thing, but I just don't understand the thinking in late game
With all due respect that is like asking "Why didn't you just headbutt him?" to someone who was in a chokehold from behind trying to not black out. Trust me, given even 15 seconds of breathing room Reynor would have transitioned to late-game tech.
But Reynor built exactly TWO Tier-3 (Hive-tech) units in the 17-minute game: 2 infestors at the very end (when it was too late to make any difference). He was doing Hydra-Ling-Bane with no ranged upgrades because he didn't have any other choice. At what point Reynor have the ~1000 minerals AND gas to pursue a new, zero-upgrade tech path? He couldn't even make Lurkers. He couldn't make Ultras or Vipers; in any event, Vipers would have been much better to shut down drops and Reynor still couldn't make those.
PiG said it accurately: Reynor built too many drones, and put too many eggs in the burrowed Baneling basket.
Clem is just obscenely good at TvZ, dismantling "set piece" Zergs like Serral and Reynor. He gets in their face and never lets them out of the chokehold.
@@snealbli I agree Clem is insanely good, but disagree that reynor did not have leeway to drop a spire. That is definitely true at times, but it clearly wasn't in game 4 for example. If anything, it seemed he was trying to force hydra-ling-bane past when it was effective to avoid late game rather than transition.
Keeping the medivac count low limits Clem's mobility and healing (corrupters also tank widow mines, a Clem staple). Maybe spire is bad or Reynor hasn't practiced it, but waiting too long on better anti-air (be it corrupters, infestor/hydra, or vipers) is clearly costing him, as the inability of queens and hydras to chase drops limits their effectiveness.
@@rockandrolljew89 Reynor also beat Clem 2 or three time with mass muta, but it seems to be very dangerous and tiring games... as it takes a long time to dismantle Clem and also making an error and losing all your muta in a split second. But it could be also stubbornness, ego, or just simply like mentioned earlier, being overwhelmed.
@@rockandrolljew89 My answer was specific to game 5, so it may have made more sense in the previous games.
Personally, I believe that because SC2 has gotten so fast-paced in LotV, that it has become easier just to go Vipers. Hive around 10 minutes is common now. And unlike sky zerg, Vipers never become obsolete or stop paying dividends, unlike air tech which will eventually require upgrades to remain useful supply. And Vipers are never wasted supply, unlike Corruptors during a frontal push.
Zerg has no chance after the mid-game. If Zerg has the time and money for corruptors, then Terran has the time and money for Ghosts. A player as good as Clem will never lose a TvZ in this patch with Ghosts. A player as good as Reynor will never win a ZvT vs a Clem with late-game Ghosts.
It seems that 80% of the zerg players just whine nonstop. They really should spend their time improving their skills. Very sad.
anyone else watch on mute
First
hmmm first 4 minutes of every game is boring
some zerg propaganda here from pig -.- ill take libs over nidus everyday of the week
Balance is so bad you can almost tell who is going to win before even watching the games.
If your SC2 skill is anywhere close to your whining, you'd easily beat Clem already.
I think you are in bronze league 😂
Or balance is fine and Clem just has the best micro and multi-tasking of any player in the game right now
Never change, balance whiners 😂 someone doesn't remember when the finals were always ZvZ for like 2 years in a row, and one of those two was Reynor like, two-thirds of the time
only terran players actually watch this mess of a game