It’s safe to say that there are no pilots commenting on this story. What we don’t see on the news is the thousands and thousands of uneventful, boring, safe flights that occur every day in the US in single engine aircraft. Just as we don’t see the millions of uneventful car trips that happen everyday. At the same time, car accidents and fatalities have become so common that mostly they don’t make the news unless there are 20 cars involved or somebody burned to death. Our perceptions are based on what we see on TV or social media; the worst of the worst, otherwise there would be no story.
well there's thousands of small plane crashes, you aren't paying attention and they're on the rise, there's way too many people becoming CFI's and way too many people passing their exams because the airline industry blew planning for babyboomers retiring and now they're scrambling, this has happened several times where an "instructor" allowed someone to take off or land when they weren't ready, and that looks like what happened, this gent covers many crashes, almost all small plane crashes are due to arrogance, he has a list of causes he calls the 5 hazardous attitudes, anti authority, impulsivity, invincibility, macho, resignation, I see dangerous pilots ALL the time watch this is several cases very much like this ruclips.net/video/dippioTyxP8/видео.html
I have flown with that 180 hp Arrow with 4 on board with fuel at the tabs. They had a turf 3000’ runway. I would have not taken off with a 3000 grass which may have been a soft field. It’s kinda doggie even with a paved runway. You can land that plane under those conditions but not takeoff with 4 on board. You can expect the gear to drop automatically if you get to a low speed.
I agree, an arrow with 180 HP sounds underpowered for those conditions, did they do a weight and balance, a worst-case estimate for takeoff and climb out? Sounds like a little bit of get- home itis as well.
Flew my PA- 28 for 25 years. You can’t safely take 4 passengers with full fuel (50 gallons) and not exceed gross weight. It was a 2 hour flight so you needed at least 25 gallons minimum for the trip (10 gallon per hour plus 30 minute VFR reserve). I would never recommend that trip with minimum fuel on board because you wouldn’t have enough to divert if conditions or events came up ( like a headwind which would increase trip time). There will be a record of how much fuel he got before departure so that should give an indication if he was overweight.
One of the two pilots on board was 88 years old. Then there was the student pilot high school girl. Finally the flying 51 year old high school teacher. It will be interesting to learn which was at the controls when they crashed.
Small planes are very problematic. They are more likely to have issues and crash than a commercial airliner jet. So many other factors such as weather and flight experience are contributors to small plane crashes.
@@Tryp-j9dha. Driving your car to work will always be way more dangerous. Chances of dying in a car crash: 1 in 103 Chance of dying in a plane crash: 1 in 11,000 Source: National Transportation Safety Council
The accident is caused "by the aircraft" in maybe one in a million flights. The problem comes with people not maintaining control of the plane...i.e., good piloting.
I have quite a bit of time in the PA28 series both as student and instructor. If the aircraft is well maintained, it is a solid and reliable vehicle. It is very tolerant of new pilots and it is a modest aircraft for intermediate pilots.
@@arthouston7361 the millions of uneventful hours of flying every year doesn't get reported on. Falling down the stairs is exponentially more frequent. No fatality is inconsequential, however, it's statisticaly insignificant.
You shouldn’t have any distrust in piper, you should have distrust in the FAA, lawmakers, and FAA employees, they are are the folks who caused the issues, this crash is their fault.
@@wjatube: That’s because this is a general public newscast and the tail number is completely meaningless to 99% of the public. They did give the make and model which is of interest to a few more people who want to know if it was a Boeing because that’s the only airplane they’ve ever heard of. When there are small boat crashes they never give you the ID number or even the make and model because frankly nobody cares.
@@wjatube: Thank you! Just trying to be helpful!! Also I’m sorry it took you 10 minutes to read my explanation - I re-read it twice and it took 25 seconds each time, but I’ll admit it probably took 90 seconds to write. Anyway, all the best in your future quest for knowledge!! Dare to think outside the Tube!! 😊
@@mmayes9466 Pilots, in the United States and most other places, are required by Federal law to have medical authorization to legally fly (like most things you can build a hypothetical scenario where there may be an exception to what I just stated, but in general that is the law). The FAA authorizes certain physicians (Medical Doctors) who have completed the additional FAA mandated specific training to be designated as FAA authorized AMEs (Aviation Medical Examiners). These AMEs are then authorized to conduct/offer FAA pilot medical examinations and upon successful completion of the physical examination then issue the appropriate FAA medical certificates to the "airman" (pilot) who is applying for the medical. There are different "classes" of medicals: each with different standards (strictness) ; intended for different levels of flying; commercial aviation has different requirements from personal/private flying. And the different classes of FAA Medical Certificates (1st Class, 2nd Class, 3rd Class) have different time limits before they expire (months/years). In the United States these are called "Medical Certificates" not "health certificate". As a current airline Captain flying domestically in the United States I apply for (online questionnaire {FAA Form 8500-9} and then schedule an appointment with my AME) and sit through a physical examination, twice a year, to renew my FAA 1st Class medical. If my medical lapses, or I develop any disqualifying medical events/symptoms I am prohibited from flying. If I do not physically have my copy of my current (not expired) medical with me I am also prohibited from flying. The specifics of the medical exam, especially the background medical history review are interesting, but that's a deeper dive into the subject and this reply is too long as it is .....
Everytime I hear "single engine 4 people on board" it makes me scared. I do not believe ANY single engine plane should carry a full load regardless of the fact its "rated" for 4 people it really is a common cause, weight and imbalance. I'm NOT saying that that was the cause "a stall" but it is a common cause. Regardless so so sad for these 4 beautiful souls.
@@davidmann4533 In fairness to the original poster (OP) they sail "full load" which is of course open to interpretation. But the OP's observation that many single engine airplanes are not really able to fill every available seat with passengers plus their personal items, and carry a full/reasonable load of fuel while remaining under the manufacturer's maximum gross takeoff weight and/or center of gravity limitations is valid. What you say is true as well, that many single engine airplanes are able to carry six people. One can fill up all the seats provided all the other limitations are adhered to-both statements are true. In many accidents, I believe the OP was summarizing; all the seats on the accident flight are occupied, the aircraft is overweight and out of center of gravity limits. Unfortunately, that scenario it is a common element/error in numerous aviation accidents. I'm with the OP on this one, when I hear single engine (four seat) four people on board" I automatically see red flags. -Respectfully
It's sad as hell but an average of 115 people every day of the year in car crashes in the US - that's 3450 people a month. Flying strikes many people as risky because every time a plane goes down (and they're almost always general aviation accidents - small, non commercial aircraft) - there's a media frenzy over the crash. Commercial flight is insanely safe.
With an experienced pilot on the *other* set of controls, not much. I've flown easily over 100 kids, and most of them ended up taking controls. Sometimes you need to override their inputs and it is trivial to do. It's not like a car with only 1 steering wheel and set of pedals, there are dual controls in just about every plane.
I received my private pilots license on my sixteenth birthday, I had been flying beside my Uncle since I was nine years old. I'm sure she wasn't the cause of the accident.
A crash happened about a year ago in a Piper. It was a discovery fright from what I'm hearing and the controls were given to the student pilot on landing.
Multi-engine planes are not safer. You have a very small window to take corrective action when 1 engine fails. If you don't do it right, you will crash. I fly single engine all the time, and practice engine out landings regularly. Far safer than driving.
It's not a matter of "unsafe little planes". You are aware that some people cannot parallel park their cars, or make a safe left turn out of an intersection? Some of them become lousy pilots. That's what is unsafe.
It’s safe to say that there are no pilots commenting on this story. What we don’t see on the news is the thousands and thousands of uneventful, boring, safe flights that occur every day in the US in single engine aircraft. Just as we don’t see the millions of uneventful car trips that happen everyday. At the same time, car accidents and fatalities have become so common that mostly they don’t make the news unless there are 20 cars involved or somebody burned to death. Our perceptions are based on what we see on TV or social media; the worst of the worst, otherwise there would be no story.
well there's thousands of small plane crashes, you aren't paying attention and they're on the rise, there's way too many people becoming CFI's and way too many people passing their exams because the airline industry blew planning for babyboomers retiring and now they're scrambling, this has happened several times where an "instructor" allowed someone to take off or land when they weren't ready, and that looks like what happened, this gent covers many crashes, almost all small plane crashes are due to arrogance, he has a list of causes he calls the 5 hazardous attitudes, anti authority, impulsivity, invincibility, macho, resignation, I see dangerous pilots ALL the time watch this is several cases very much like this ruclips.net/video/dippioTyxP8/видео.html
The very first comment I saw was from a pilot
Go by the book and you won't get killed. Private pilot here. A safe pilot is always learning.
There’s so many small plane crashes now that I can’t tell if it’s a new one on the news or the same and it keeps being a new one!
News lady stole Jerry’s puffy shirt
I have flown with that 180 hp Arrow with 4 on board with fuel at the tabs. They had a turf 3000’ runway. I would have not taken off with a 3000 grass which may have been a soft field. It’s kinda doggie even with a paved runway. You can land that plane under those conditions but not takeoff with 4 on board. You can expect the gear to drop automatically if you get to a low speed.
Plus the air is less dense in the summer. So the load of the plane in the fall, winter and spring may be too heavy for the summer.
I agree, an arrow with 180 HP sounds underpowered for those conditions, did they do a weight and balance, a worst-case estimate for takeoff and climb out? Sounds like a little bit of get- home itis as well.
RIP Fellow aviators! God Speed and prayers for all affected by this tragedy.
it was probably preventable, he probably let her takeoff
3 adults, 1 teenager, and fuel ... in a pa-28 ... i wonder what the weight and balance said.
My thoughts exactly. Especially taking off a grass runway. That maybe was a little soggy if it got rain on Saturday like we did in Connecticut.
A Piper Arrow shouldn’t had had a problem with that, especially with no bags. One passenger was a young girl.
@@stevez6499Who was in the pilot seat?
Flew my PA- 28 for 25 years. You can’t safely take 4 passengers with full fuel (50 gallons) and not exceed gross weight. It was a 2 hour flight so you needed at least 25 gallons minimum for the trip
(10 gallon per hour plus 30 minute VFR reserve). I would never recommend that trip with minimum fuel on board because you wouldn’t have enough to divert if conditions or events came up ( like a headwind which would increase trip time). There will be a record of how much fuel he got before departure so that should give an indication if he was overweight.
@@crphilipp Depends on the PA-28. A Warrior can’t realistically fill the seats. A 235/Dakota, no problem.
One of the two pilots on board was 88 years old. Then there was the student pilot high school girl. Finally the flying 51 year old high school teacher. It will be interesting to learn which was at the controls when they crashed.
Wait did they say that one of the people is originally from Lebanon? As in Lebanon NH? (I know they were Connecticut residents)
there's a lebanon in connecticut i think thats what they mean but idk for sure
Lebanon, CT. Right next to Columbia and Hebron. Home of the CT Ren Faire. Almost bought a house there.
dang why they crash in Vermont? that's a bad idea... bless them
RIP :(
it is sad, be careful.
A small plane crash seems to be happening every other day 😮
Rest in Peace to the 4 victim's.
🕊️🕊️🕊️🕊️
Of COURSE. It’s a HORRIBLY DANGEROUS way to travel. DON’T we have SEVERAL places to have lunch in Connecticut???
Automobiles seem to be crashing everyday with fatalities!
@@Tryp-j9da pilot has to not only be current but also highly proficient..
Small planes are very problematic. They are more likely to have issues and crash than a commercial airliner jet. So many other factors such as weather and flight experience are contributors to small plane crashes.
@@Tryp-j9dha. Driving your car to work will always be way more dangerous.
Chances of dying in a car crash: 1 in 103
Chance of dying in a plane crash: 1 in 11,000
Source: National Transportation Safety Council
Look like off the end of runway Basin.
Just had 4 killed in a small plane in Indiana. Fly commercial…..
I’m beginning to think I never want to ride in a piper aircraft. Those things seem to have so many accidents.
The accident is caused "by the aircraft" in maybe one in a million flights. The problem comes with people not maintaining control of the plane...i.e., good piloting.
I have quite a bit of time in the PA28 series both as student and instructor. If the aircraft is well maintained, it is a solid and reliable vehicle. It is very tolerant of new pilots and it is a modest aircraft for intermediate pilots.
@@arthouston7361 the millions of uneventful hours of flying every year doesn't get reported on. Falling down the stairs is exponentially more frequent. No fatality is inconsequential, however, it's statisticaly insignificant.
Been flying my Piper Archer all over the country for 22 yrs. It is a very reliable and stable platform, especially if maintained properly.
You shouldn’t have any distrust in piper, you should have distrust in the FAA, lawmakers, and FAA employees, they are are the folks who caused the issues, this crash is their fault.
No tail number? How difficult would it be to report that?
N3757T - it took me less than a microsecond to find it.
@@rayray8687 of course we can find it. It's just a 3 minute long news report that couldn't mention that detail is disappointing.
@@wjatube: That’s because this is a general public newscast and the tail number is completely meaningless to 99% of the public. They did give the make and model which is of interest to a few more people who want to know if it was a Boeing because that’s the only airplane they’ve ever heard of. When there are small boat crashes they never give you the ID number or even the make and model because frankly nobody cares.
@@rayray8687 makes a point of how fast to find my answer then writes a 10 minute dissertation. Good use of your time bud. I'm proud for you.
@@wjatube: Thank you! Just trying to be helpful!! Also I’m sorry it took you 10 minutes to read my explanation - I re-read it twice and it took 25 seconds each time, but I’ll admit it probably took 90 seconds to write. Anyway, all the best in your future quest for knowledge!! Dare to think outside the Tube!! 😊
Free flight lessons!!!??? Dam why couldn’t I find that CFI
those free lessons aparently sucked
Are you a young pretty 😍 girl
@@BRC332 you get what you pay for
Wet grass field, wet weather. Expired health certificate.
Unfortunate.
“Health certificate “that’s ridiculous. They shouldn’t exist. This crash is the fault of the FAA and FA employees and “lawmakers “.
@@davidthompson6636 what’s a health certificate?
@@mmayes9466 Pilots, in the United States and most other places, are required by Federal law to have medical authorization to legally fly (like most things you can build a hypothetical scenario where there may be an exception to what I just stated, but in general that is the law). The FAA authorizes certain physicians (Medical Doctors) who have completed the additional FAA mandated specific training to be designated as FAA authorized AMEs (Aviation Medical Examiners). These AMEs are then authorized to conduct/offer FAA pilot medical examinations and upon successful completion of the physical examination then issue the appropriate FAA medical certificates to the "airman" (pilot) who is applying for the medical.
There are different "classes" of medicals: each with different standards (strictness) ; intended for different levels of flying; commercial aviation has different requirements from personal/private flying. And the different classes of FAA Medical Certificates (1st Class, 2nd Class, 3rd Class) have different time limits before they expire (months/years). In the United States these are called "Medical Certificates" not "health certificate".
As a current airline Captain flying domestically in the United States I apply for (online questionnaire {FAA Form 8500-9} and then schedule an appointment with my AME) and sit through a physical examination, twice a year, to renew my FAA 1st Class medical. If my medical lapses, or I develop any disqualifying medical events/symptoms I am prohibited from flying. If I do not physically have my copy of my current (not expired) medical with me I am also prohibited from flying. The specifics of the medical exam, especially the background medical history review are interesting, but that's a deeper dive into the subject and this reply is too long as it is .....
Everytime I hear "single engine 4 people on board" it makes me scared. I do not believe ANY single engine plane should carry a full load regardless of the fact its "rated" for 4 people it really is a common cause, weight and imbalance. I'm NOT saying that that was the cause "a stall" but it is a common cause.
Regardless so so sad for these 4 beautiful souls.
There are many single engine airplanes rated to carry six people
Each aircraft has a flight manual stipulating its limits. Some singles cannot handle 4 adults, some can.
@@GBEdmonds-j1i Cessna Caravan is a single engine airplane that can carry 9 pax without grunting
The carrying capacity of an aircraft varies by air density/temperature. The carrying capacity of a wheeled vehicle is unaffected by those factors.
@@davidmann4533 In fairness to the original poster (OP) they sail "full load" which is of course open to interpretation. But the OP's observation that many single engine airplanes are not really able to fill every available seat with passengers plus their personal items, and carry a full/reasonable load of fuel while remaining under the manufacturer's maximum gross takeoff weight and/or center of gravity limitations is valid. What you say is true as well, that many single engine airplanes are able to carry six people. One can fill up all the seats provided all the other limitations are adhered to-both statements are true.
In many accidents, I believe the OP was summarizing; all the seats on the accident flight are occupied, the aircraft is overweight and out of center of gravity limits. Unfortunately, that scenario it is a common element/error in numerous aviation accidents. I'm with the OP on this one, when I hear single engine (four seat) four people on board" I automatically see red flags.
-Respectfully
It's sad as hell but an average of 115 people every day of the year in car crashes in the US - that's 3450 people a month. Flying strikes many people as risky because every time a plane goes down (and they're almost always general aviation accidents - small, non commercial aircraft) - there's a media frenzy over the crash. Commercial flight is insanely safe.
Sure. But that’s exactly why it’s news. Because it’s rare. And dramatic.
You are correct commercial flight is insanely safe, but those statistics are not the same for privately owned pleasure craft.
Seems like lately it's always a Piper...
He was giving the young girl free flying lessons 🤔🤔😯
Zzzzzzzzzz
Man when you keep up with them these small plane crashes happen all the time.
Handing controls to a 13 year old. What can go wrong????
It's funny that you think this is the first time a teenager has gotten flying lessons.
With an experienced pilot on the *other* set of controls, not much. I've flown easily over 100 kids, and most of them ended up taking controls. Sometimes you need to override their inputs and it is trivial to do. It's not like a car with only 1 steering wheel and set of pedals, there are dual controls in just about every plane.
I received my private pilots license on my sixteenth birthday, I had been flying beside my Uncle since I was nine years old. I'm sure she wasn't the cause of the accident.
A crash happened about a year ago in a Piper. It was a discovery fright from what I'm hearing and the controls were given to the student pilot on landing.
@@JohnBaleshiski "Not much" other than what yo see in the video.
Good to see elderly, female pirates can find work in this economy…
Gravity always win
The FAA, FAA employees, and lawmakers are at fault for this, and should be held accountable.
What exactly is wrong in your head? Hater
Why anyone would fly in a single engine plane is beyond belief.
Why not? Pa-28 Warriors are sturdy single engines..
Multi-engine planes are not safer. You have a very small window to take corrective action when 1 engine fails. If you don't do it right, you will crash. I fly single engine all the time, and practice engine out landings regularly. Far safer than driving.
Having a second engine doubles your odds for an engine problem. I won't get into climb performance of light twins.
The second engine is there to fly the plane to the crash site.
why do people fly in these unsafe little planes?
Why do people drive in those unsafe little cars?
💰
It's not a matter of "unsafe little planes". You are aware that some people cannot parallel park their cars, or make a safe left turn out of an intersection? Some of them become lousy pilots. That's what is unsafe.
It's not the planes that are unsafe, it's the pilots!
They LIKE doing DEATH DEFYING STUNTS!!!