No Longer Calvinist | Jason’s Testimony
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- Опубликовано: 20 июл 2023
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I can relate to you Alana. I’m very sensitive and am on high alert every time I listen to a sermon. I’m always hearing about how vile and unworthy we are as opposed to hearing about the joy and beauty we can now experience in Christ. I’m also concerned about the young people in my church who are being sucked into this doctrine.
People are waking up to the simplicity of the gospel and the LOVE of our Heavenly Father! Praise the Lord!
I am so encouraged to see YOUNG people questioning this cults; (anything that points us away from TRUE Scripture and Jesus) false gospel. I am 76 and was not reborn til 46 so ALL of my teaching came from Scripture and two mentors.
When exposed to Calvinism I found it strange. It reminds me of the RCC.
Thank you!
Jesus convinced me that Calvin got it wrong when he said "I am the resurrection and the life, he that believeth in me though he were dead, yet shall he live and whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die."
Calvinists say if you're dead you cannot believe.
Calvin was right, dead people can't believe. Only God gives life. No one comes to the Son unless the Father draws him (John 6:44). One cannot believe apart from God enacting that belief in them, the same way it is God who grants repentance (Acts 11:18), anything else is adding works to grace and salvation by works.
Thank you for this Alana 🙏 caught the live half way and rewatched just now. These videos mean more than you know, blessings ❤️
It so resonated with me when Alana said...it wasn't necessarily what was being said by those in the Calvinistic church but what was not being said.
When God orchestrated for me to begin listening to a non Calvinistic Bible Church - everything I was hearing seemed like I was hearing Scripture for the first time. So grateful for every piece that has been shared in your journeys out of Calvinism. It has been an encouragement to me.
Shannon: We hear a pastor claim that some humans were assigned heaven, others hell...but go evangelize....and we do not think, "wait a minute, if one group is assigned heaven and another hell, and we cannot which is which, what would be the point of evangelizing. Humans can be like birds that never question the food they are being fed.
God created humans with the capacity to think and reason. It's our fault if we fail to think and that we are too lazy to study.
@@sheilasmith7779 I had plenty of things said to me. Like sincerely asking any theological question was being divisive. And to struggle with anything was to have my faith questioned. After thinking I was going crazy or truly worthless I started figuring out I had a doctrinal difference. I had a conversation about whether I was elect with the pastor. It has been a difficult last couple years. I left the reformed church I had been in for 29 years in May. I still cry every day because I miss my church family but I have to stand on my convictions.
@@shannonsundby5725 Yes, I understand. I still miss the RCC church, the parish I was raised in.....but I will never go back.
And Shannon, it's the reason many don't leave, even when they know the truth.
Stay strong and God bless.
@@sheilasmith7779 Also raised in the Catholic Church. My family is still all very devote practicing Catholics. Before leaving the reformed church I already went through being told I was going to hell from my Catholic family. They treat me as unsaved. Still it was much easier for me to leave the Catholic Church and know it wasn't right than to leave all the relationships built over 3 decades in my former church. Also much much harder taking my 5 kids away from the church they grew up in. Every aspect of my life was tied to the church. Just like I'm the only one in my family to leave the Catholic Church, I've been the only one to leave the reformed church for theological reasons. Been a lonely road but God is good. Learning that grief and peace can exist together.
@@shannonsundby5725 Well said, and completely understandable.
Christians are going to be shocked on judgement day to discover God cares more about our bevior than our beliefs. They appear to ignore the first Comandment.
Amen for saying it brother. Calvinism is a philosophical construct that is placed over the top of Scripture. In loving God with all our minds we must take all philosophies and drill them down to their logical conclusions. When Calvinists proclaim that we are being "too emotional" when we've taken that philosophy down to its logical conclusions then we are doing the right thing with our minds. We need to treat it as what it is....philosophy that is making big claims stating that Scripture supports it. To a lot of Calvinists, they, like the culture we're experiencing right now, will not believe the truth of Scripture that clearly refutes their teaching but will yield back to the false philosophy that they've been taught. Their proof texts are Scripture taken out of context with very poor exegesis without considering sound hermeneutical principles for interpreting those Scriptures. Even compatiblism can be found among atheists. I think it's horrible how people are shamed for arriving at and speaking out about the logical conclusions that their systematic is making about man, about God and about the gift of salvation.
Alana and Jason, I truly enjoyed this conversation, God bless you and your families 🩵 I just subscribed to Jason’s channel!
About 5 years ago, I watched a video by Mike Winger on why he thought Calvinism was unbiblical. That was 5 years ago. It took me 4 years of slowly coming out of Calvinism. Why did it take that long? Truly, because I wanted to sound "smarter than". Calvinist truly do usually sounds smarter than everyone. The other reason is expository preaching . I am a pastor who preaches three times a week. I go verse by verse. We have been in Romans for a year and a half and we are now about to begin Romans 10. Going that slow begun to solidify that Calvinism was unbibical.
I then started listening to Leighton, Provisionalist Perspective, Beyond the Fundamentals, Calvinist Contradiction and John 17 Apologetics. Those channels have helped me greatly in my confidence to come all the way out of Calvinism.
I went from J-Mac, Lawson and Washer to Adrien Rogers, AW Tozer and Steve Gains.
On a side note, Steve Gains is an expositor and a very solid one.
Alana, your videos on leaving Calvinism and you walking through Ephesains 1& Romans 9, that was also very helpful.
My question is this. Did you get rid of all of your Reformed books and other resources?
I want to, but I have so many I do not know where to begin
👏🏼 praise God❤
It is nearly impossible to escape the influence Reformed Theology has had on scholarly literature. Though my Bible College was not Calvinistic, the library had a number of Calvinistic commentaries and books, all there by donations. Ridding yourself of these resources is a decision you'll have to come by on your own. Some works still have value. Speaking for myself, I did a complete overhaul of my books and resources when I left Calvinism but then again I admit I behaved like a fighting fundamentalist who disposed of these resources like a man who got saved and poured all his liquor down the drain.
PTL!🙌🏻
Thank you for sharing your experience, it was very helpful to me.
Question: Why don’t you dump all of your books in the garbage…or burn them in a pasture like I did my new age books 24 years ago?😊
@Maryneal2123
Yes,or like Acts 19, but the truth is I have literally thousands of dollars in books. I would like to go basically 1 for 1. 1 thrown out, 1 bought.
I need to save us to justify not have a lot of books as I read 2 books a week.
The title of Dave Hunt's bok: What Love is This? Calvinism's Misrepresentation of God" ,says it all!
I’m reading that now and it’s an eye opener!!
Starting around 21:00 in video.
I cannot stress enough how important this is.
The adversary gets into the minds of those closest to us. To use them to hurt us through intentionally creating misunderstandings between friends.
Time manipulation through creating "bad luck" for us is also a main tactic of the adversary.
God bless. 🧠
Despite some technical difficulties, a very excellent discussion. Thx!
Roman’s 1:20 was where Calvinism all fell apart to me. I love how after I prayed for clarity that’s the verse God put in my head…. You have no excuse! And amazingly, that verse came out in many other testimonies of those who came out of Calvinism. God is so amazing!
If by no excuse you mean something like if God chooses that gives the unbeliever an excuse...that is not the claim of Calvinism...the claim is that God is sovereign AND that humans are culpable. You can disagree and say those things are not compatible but it is simply a straw man to say Calvinists are contending that they have an excuse.
@@Adam-ue2igI don't believe that's what she's saying.
Rather the excuse is that God did not pick them for salvation unilaterally.
Eg: if that's the case then there is no way to be saved if one is not picked. But of course Calvinists, soft ones at least say, "we don't know who's picked"
Except that's not even gospel nor is it throughout the word. Calvinism only has a smattering of verses that can be interpreted in that way. But also can be interpreted another way. There's no one Calvinism verse that is a slam dunk. Some may be close, but when you get to the context, original language and overall message of God and sending Christ, then it falls apart
@@Richardcontramundum I understand the basic contention...I don't think reasserting it advances the discussion.
@@Richardcontramundum The interpretation is obviously the thing in question (nor do I think Calvinist would agree that it's only a "smattering" of verses).
I'm confused, a chapter dealing with God's wrath over homosexuality, and all types of sin is why you left calvinism. And you can't see how depraved man is from birth?. Rom.1 & 3 describe the depravity of man so clearly.
hello from Alaska. I've been watching your channel, Jason
1:41:43 Alana you’re right that was not healthy to have to feel that way, but it’s completely normal that you would being in that setting. It’s so sad that you are thinking the problem was you and not them. Let me assure you, you were not the problem. You were not being hypercritical in a spirit of hatred. They were being deceptive (knowingly or unknowingly) at every turn and your heart could not take it. The Spirit inside of you was grieving and crying out. Experiencing righteous anger every time you go to church is definitely not healthy but is only normal in that environment, which is why you couldn’t stay. Nothings wrong with you for feeling that way and the problem was not with you Alana 🙏🏻
I definitely am not making excuses for them, I am just trying so hard to think the best of all these people that I love that I feel are following a false doctrine. I have long relationships and history with these people and it’s hard to think of them in a negative light. I definitely think they are deceived, but I am trying to be careful to not speak hatefully towards anyone. I don’t feel gaslit anymore and I don’t feel bad for the way I feel. :) I appreciate your perspective.
I’m striving to be gracious and have a clear conscience before the Lord;)
@@AlanaL3absolutely. I know it is hard to know someone’s tone over text only and in comments. I’m a lot like you and I tend to say things matter of factly but also like you my tone is that of concern and love. There’s never a reason to speak hatefully of anyone, especially people you were so close to and have such a heart for. I don’t want to be encouraging that to stop, I just don’t think you should being using that as giving them a pass and thinking you were the problem. In my firm warning and rebuke of these Calvinists I do not believe I am being hateful. I’m only saying that the pastors in the pulpit (who you love and that’s a good thing) were at the very least being unknowingly deceptive and it’s no wonder you were feeling the spiritual angst. So long as you were not being hypercritical with a hateful spirit, your reaction is completely valid. No way were you the problem. How do you think Jesus would feel if He was in the flesh sitting in the service knowing their crafty and calculated descriptions preaching limited atonement, purposely changing words, twisting the gospel, and trampling over His character? I’m sure He would have some righteous anger. I do not know your previous pastors, but I do hope that Calvinist pastors are saved, I really hope many of them are and are ignorantly just preaching what they think is true. Even then though some people are sincere but they are sincerely wrong and that doesn’t make them saved. I guess God can only judge that, I do not wish for any of them to perish and do not have ill will toward them. Depending on how high they land on the “doctrine of demons” (I know it’s crass, but it is literally a doctrine of demons) scale and just how much calvinism is an idol, and to what degree they have willfully rejected God as revealed in the Bible, God only knows. But with falsely interpreting hundreds of scriptures and preaching a distorted (if not false) gospel if they are teaching explicitly calvinism from the pulpit that is scary because I would not want to face God on judgement day being unrepentant of that kind of handling of the scriptures as a shepherd to a congregation. God may have mercy, I certainly hope so.
@@AlanaL3also in case you didn’t know, I have been following you for many years, years before you came out of calvinism :) i remember watching that very first video when you were over the moon about just discovering calvinism was not true. You were beaming and I was beaming watching you being soooo glad you saw the light! I was always sad you were a Calvinist but believed you were a sister in the Lord and learned a lot from your videos. I really adore you and always have!
Being in the middle of the conversation… concerning the filters, reminded me what i read recently in a book on the times of reformatiom “Biblical interpretation in the anabaptist tradition” - when Protestant reformers find out that there other groups, in particular Radical reformers, and that when they read Scriptures they come to different conclusions, they started to emphasize that one should read Scriptures through filters. Reading through filters is built in within the Protestant reformation quote below -
“Patristic theology tended to treat Scripture in the light of doctrinal beliefs, but the link between doctrine and biblical interpretation was gradually loosened in the Middle Ages. The Reformers disagreed with this development and reasserted the importance of interpreting Scripture in line with doctrinal commitments. Scripture must be understood in relation to justification by faith and the work of Christ. Hermeneutics was tied to pre-existing doctrinal assumptions. Luther urged that Scripture be approached through the "filter" of the catechism, which would provide a framework for its interpretation.37 Melanchthon, too, taught that theology could be organized around a single doctrine that effectively provided the key to understanding Scripture. For him, as for Luther, this was the doctrine of justification by faith alone. Calvin insisted that to attempt to go back to the Bible while ignoring or rejecting dogmatic theology was naive and would lead to dangerous consequences.
For Anabaptists, using such a doctrinal filter meant excluding other issues that they regarded as equally important but did not fit neatly into the Reformers' main interests. Such a filter might hinder true interpretation; it was a different but equally unhelpful way of reasserting traditional ecclesiastical and creedal authority. The Anabaptists' hermeneutic was thus more radical than the Reformers', yet closer to the medieval approach.”
That was fantastic!!
That experience of hearing something that catches your attention is what I experienced with John MacArthur. I didn't know anything about Calvinism, except the name John Calvin. So I rewound the the sermon video 45 seconds, 3 times. My thought was, " that's not in scripture."
The problem is preachers will make statements like, "irresistible grace, " without explaining or defining what is meant by it.
We must insist that any preacher teacher define what is meant by these labels or terms. We assume that we all share the same understanding of "God's sovereignty " without realizing we don't. So if we dismiss or acccept a teaching without knowing what is meant by a word or term by the speaker, we will accept errors.
For example when a calvinist says God is sovereign, they mean that God is power AND is controlling everything.
We non calvinist, believe that while God can do anything, He did not do what Calvinists claim God did. We agree God predestined certain events, but disagree that God predestined every event.
We agree in regeneration, but disagree that it precedes faith.
We must insist that pastors explain what they mean by the labels and terms they use. We must stop with labeling persons into a group of "Arminian," or
" Calvinist," as though that's a supportive argument. It isn't.
I don't care if a person claims to be a member of the "Mickey Mouse," club....what does he/she believe.
The solution:
Read and study scripture; and listen to every word and sentence being preached.....and pray daily to the Holy Spirit for truth. God will always deliver the truth. Always.
Perhaps, praying daily to the H.S. is the FIRST thing we should do, followed by reading scripture, and listening closely to the teachings.
Amen sister!!! Amen. I’m with you 100%
Really good medicine, good job reading your Bible more 👏
Exactly. I did not understand the labels and terms when I heard about calvinism for the very first time. Two instances happened around the same time. First was with Matt Chandler. I was watching one of his sermons and he mentioned “tulip” I was like what the heck is tulip?? I googled it and found the acronym with a very basic maybe one sentence explanation for each label, I skimmed it and thought “oh I believe that” but I still didn’t get what they meant because I thought they were defining words the way I was. I also remember hearing Matt Chandler always say the “elect” I alwayssss thought he meant “the people who have chosen to put their faith in Jesus and are saved” it wasn’t until later that I discovered he packed way more into that word than I ever knew. The second time I ever heard of calvinism was when I was listening to Jeff Durbin and he said in a sermon that “everyone should be going to a reformed church” and I was like what is a reformed church?? What does reformed mean? I yet again did a quick google search skimmed over a 2 sentence explanation of what it means to be “reformed” and yet again I thought that was what I believed.
It wasn’t until about a year later that my brother in the Lord who wasn’t a Calvinist (but was open to it) one night explicitly explained what calvinism was to me and I literally felt a dark cloud come over me and a sinking feeling in my chest. It was terrible. I never swallowed that pill.
@@Loves2HugItOut Jeff Durbin stands outside my church and protest 😕
@@clearstonewindows hi there 👋 are you LDS?
thank you for your work alana! i go to your chanel to look at new calvanist videos you have. bc i had nvr heard of calvinist. &i wana understand it.
ive been a believer all my life. Pentecostal.
I believe it’s important for us to see the word, actions, and heart of those God gives us as examples in His word. When we limit ourselves to different camps and not exclusively the word of God, we limit. So much of how we learn God is based on growth that happens through the engagement of relationship with Him. We know How to see Him by His word.
We can’t dismiss any part of scripture because it doesn’t fit our current level of understanding of who He is. This is not only an individual life long process - but one in which we grow up “together” in Him. Love all people the same way we see that Jesus did and the apostles strove to do. Where you see your great weaknesses in that, be propelled to continue to learn His grace with the body of Christ.
Take the mindset Paul did: count all other things of your life as loss compared to knowing Him in the power of His resurrection and the fellowship of His suffering.
Grace & Peace
Love like Jesus did here…
John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
50:07 Alana, you do not have to be gaslighted into thinking your righteous anger is only just a little “pet peeve”. I want to affirm that these Calvinist who do the things you’re describing are being deceptive plain and simple, and the righteous anger you feel is a fraction of what Christ feels. I’m done making excuses for them and feeling gaslighted into “well your being divisive” “your being unloving” “you’re walking in the flesh”. No I’m not. I assure you my heart feels like it’s breaking every time I hear this stuff and I don’t know sometimes if I’m sad or angry. This is 100% righteous anger.
Amen. It took me about two years of processing everything before I quit "soft" refuting... Because now that I have a firm understanding of what Calvinism is, I can confidently say, "I don't know that God".
The Calvinist God IS a different God than the God I know-- we ARE talking about two different gods. As a result, I realized I am NOT on the same team as Calvinists, even born-again Calvinists.
I'm not saying a born-again Calvinist won't make it to heaven-- because sometimes when they talk about Jesus I can tell they're talking about the real Jesus (and everything they say completely debunks their Calvinist beliefs, thankfully lol).
But as long as I am in the trenches trying to bring people to Christ; I cannot work side by side with anyone who holds to Calvinism anymore.
1. They aren't helping fall aways turn back to Jesus-- instead they are letting them drown and are even pushing them further back into the fire.
2. Calvinism is a false gospel. Their hope is not in the cross. It is in being "pre-created" for salvation.
3. They push people away from Jesus and put all kinds of obstacles and weights on those of us trying to bring people to Him.
4. They are not trying to convert people to Jesus, they are trying to convert people to Calvinism. That's a big deal. A HUGE deal.
I recently had to stop with all the "soft" "un-divisive" thinking. Absolute thinking helps to maintain my sanity, keep clear boundaries, AND helps to keep my focus on pointing both the atheist AND the Calvinist to Jesus lol.
I think we're actually causing more division than unity by allowing lies to stay in our midst without gently, yet firmly, gutting them out.
Hello! This is how I see it (hope what I say helps):
Many (from what I know) that are Calvinists are compatible-ists which produces a cognitive dissonance in their thinking. They really do believe much of what the Bible says, because it’s a “mystery” how God is sovereign from the Calvinists perspective. By Gods grace they preach true Gospel, believe the true Jesus and just don’t know how it all makes sense. I see this as God’s grace for those who believe in Calvinism. And bc I think this is the case for most, we need to speak the truth in love. Being harsh may only affirm them in Calvinism, and miss the opportunity to help them see.
I think even many Pastors are missing this also. But there are some that are full blown determinants that have a different Gospel, different God bc they are 100% consistent with their theology and these are the ones we need to be careful for and warn against. Hopefully my next video emphasizes this points well.
There are so many ways the Bible speaks about communication, and it’s hard to know (sometimes takes time) to learn who we’re talking to and how to correctly and Biblically communicate with someone. My focus is to communicate mainly to those who are the compatible-ists as I see most don’t know what they’re even in.
@@LivingChristian thanks for clarifying 🙏🏻 I totally see a lot of what you’re saying here. Trust me there’s a few popular Calvinists that I REALLY love and listen to even on a regular basis (Shane and Shane for worship and Jimmy needham also his old worship stuff is some of my favorite Christian music and now I believe he is a pastor- very much a compatablist. I don’t really listen to his preaching. But I LOVE his wife Kelly Needhams blog and I learn so much from her I adore her 🥰) so i get it. Everyone is different, I just know with me of course I want things told to me in a loving way but I like to hear things STRAIGHT UP. When I first started following Jesus I went to a watered down seeker friendly church and I was SO stuck in sin and my ways of thinking because no one would tell me straight up Gods ways for holy living and just gave me a bunch of fluff. Calvinists-even compatablists- are so deceived in many areas and it’s truly heartbreaking. They are conditioned to deceive and this behavior is unacceptable and I’m not going to treat this ungodly behavior with kid gloves because I do not think it is doing them any favors but is encouraging them to continue to deceive themselves into these false doctrines. Again, this does not mean you are not doing it in love or in the Spirit or even not walking gently with them. I think a firm wake up call is in order but that doesn’t mean it’s fire and brimstone every time lol I actually think calvinism ingested to any degree is an abomination to the Lord (limited atonement is so offensive to the Lord I can only imagine) not to mention what unconditional election and total depravity does to Gods character this is blasphemous. There are Calvinists I have a great amount of compassion for but they need to hear just how bad and just how dark the level of heresy they have been deceived into believing is.
@@LivingChristian I think ultimately there is truth in your comment and truth in my comment and we just need to allow God to give us discernment on a case by case basis and walk in the Spirit balancing the two approaches. I just think there could be a danger (or less effectiveness) if I had a mindset ONLY on what I said and rejecting the side of the coin you described. Likewise, I think having ONLY the mindset you wrote in your comment and rejecting the side of the coin I described would also not always be the most wise and can be less effective
Great video, very helpful. 1:35:45... Amen... Most Calvinists were saved and believers in Christ before they became convinced of Calvinism. Technically, affirming TULIP does not preclude anyone from salvation. Man can be saved no matter how confused he may become about "how" it happened. It just undermines the personal relationship with our Heavenly Father which Christ came and died to make possible.
What I believe is so powerful here is the importance of finding the 'validation' that one is not alone in these questions so common to nominal Calvinist.. I've never been a Calvinist... but it is so obvious many people are caught up in it who are privately 'troubled' by the consequences of the doctrine which simply cannot be addressed head on. And if they ask tooooo many questions they are reprimanded for questioning God when they're really just questioning TULIP. Afraid of being branded a 'troublemaker' they submit to 'authority', sit down in silence. We know many often experience a quiet, private fear' of their own salvation with nowhere to turn, they bow their head and just "hope for the best" because there's nothing else to do... it breaks my heart.
THAT is why these videos are so very important! And thank God it's why they are gaining more steam every day.
Don't worry too much about the rhetoric in the comments section. Calvinism cannot hold up to the light of clear examination without obviously having to defend the nature and character of our Heavenly Father from the claims of its own system... it's a bad look no matter how you view it.
The more they rail.. the more obvious it is to the silent 3rd party who observes but never engages ... they 'get it'. The cognitive dissonance necessary to maintain the "tension" with which Calvinists have become so comfortable is mind-numbing and obvious to anyone not filtering scripture first through the lens of TULIP.
I used to be an unsaved Pelagian like most of you currently are. It was Romans 9 together with John 6 , John 10 that opened my eyes that TULIP is the Gospel. It was ONLY when the Lord Jesus Christ showed me that I was Totally depraved and totally unable to do anything that He granted me true saving Faith to lay Hold of Him as He is offered in Scripture. Most of you have a fake faith which is never going to last. Your jesus is NOT the Lord Jesus Christ of the Bible
@@franciscusgomarus5086 Gee Franciscus... Thanks for sharing. How do you know you do for sure you do not have 'fake faith'?
@@R.L.KRANESCHRADTT ONLY in the Lord Jesus Christ you will know your calling and Election. The Blood of the Lord Jesus Christ is ALL I look to and is my ONLY Boast. None of you Pelagians can ever say that and truly mean it. Because deep down you people "know" that it is your "free choice" that saves you.
@@franciscusgomarus5086 Sorry, maybe you misunderstood. I asked "How do YOU (franciscus) know you do for sure you do not have 'fake faith'?"
@@R.L.KRANESCHRADTT I just answered. I know my Salvation in the Lord Jesus Christ ONLY. I look to His Blood ONLY. Never to myself. If you were truly born again, this would be obvious. But you Pelagians have only a notional faith not Saving Faith
wow! praise God!
Very nice discussion Alana and Jason. So glad you were able to come out of this deception. Its had another run in the church for decades now and from appearances looks like its heading out with Leighton, Kevin, you 2 of course and many others. I appreciate Jason's declaration as Calvinism being a false gospel. Leighton won't do that and I wish he would. The only way we keep it out is by taking a tough stance against it. That's why I appreciate Kevin "no fear" Thompson. It is a "tough love" as Jason mentioned. As a suggestion and admonition for finding a church to go to that is expositional, I suggest the Word of Faith churches. However, I must say that I've moved away from the institutional form of church to gathering with smaller groups where interaction and discussion can take place. Another problem in that 3rd century time is what Constantine did to formalize the church in buildings. In any event, I suggest teaching of the full gospel which includes spiritual gifts. This truncated version such as the Baptists doctrine is where we get into trouble. We create a vacuum for much false teaching such as Calvinism, New Age, etc. If we teach the full gospel, we won't make room for these. Thanks again and keep up the good work. Many are being freed from the false gospel of Calvinism.
I propose that instead of using the terms ‘monergism’ versus ‘synergism’ we should use ‘non-consensual’ versus ‘consensual’.
I’m so excited to watch this! I would loooooove it if you would go on Allie Beth Stuckey’s show and have a discussion on total inability. 💕
Such a Great points for example on 52 min.
Most Calvary Chapel churches teach verse by verse and are not Calvinist. I can relate to learning a ton from expository teaching. I had the same experience.
Skip Heitzig, Greg Laurie, and Chuck Smith, are a few of those teachers that go verse by verse. Oh yeah, and Mike Winger!
Issue I have with CCs is Dispensationalism. That system also has huge implications for Christians as does Calvinism.
Jack Hibbs
@Alana L Even with the glitches, I enjoyed the conversation. I have the odd experience of having "come out" of Calvinism without ever having been a Calvinist. My involvement came through groups like Gospel Coalition and the prolific publishing arm of Reformed theology. While I never adopted a Calvinist framework, I now recognize the subtle influence on my thinking that relied on Calvinist interpretations of scripture. It was at the beginning of the Covid lockdowns that I discovered Soteriology101 and got angry. Since then I have become hyper aware of Calvinistic interpretation in print and media resources, even for small children.
I relate to the "mellowing out" that happens over time as we pursue love of God's people. In my experience (admittedly limited), unless someone is a Calvinist Theologian, most Calvinists Christians don't act like Calvinism is true in how they actually live. Be it through an appeal to mystery or the day-to-day realities of human experience that invalidate Calvinist soteriology, most Calvinists on the ground tell people God loves them and that Jesus died for their sins. That's not to say that there are no severe knock-on effects (see the many deconstruction videos out there that are distinctly post-Calvinist flavored) which grieve and anger me still, but the leading of the Spirit and the overwhelming message of scripture that can't quite be squeezed into the Calvinist mold, covers a multitude of mis-apprehension...including my own.
I completely agree that we need to be intentional about remaining in the Spirit, we do not want our righteous anger to turn into something we are not calling out in love. But do not apologize for having righteous anger over this. Having righteous anger is not a sin.
Many Calvary Chapel Churches almost exclusively teach Expository. I view Calvary Chapel Greeley Colorado every week online and Pastor Jeff Figg is adamant about it.
David Guzik of Calvary Chapel in California is an outstanding preacher.
It's the military side of Kevin that makes him a tough straight shooter when he speaks and I appreciate it.
Very well said U2 👍
How Holy Spirit led me to question Calvinism was through the early church writing 👍
You need to dig into the 'Anabapists '
And their history ( scroll publishing)
Keep up the good work Alana and Jason. Well done! It warms my heart when I see the Calvinists Trolls show up and try to do damage control. It means God is working through your ministry. It is bearing much fruit against the Doctrine of demons.
Truth in love
That you call Calvinism a doctrine of demons and Alana hearts it is uncharitable and inconsistent...She has said that she believes Calvinists are saved in previous videos...so it's double speak inconsistency to claim Calvinism is just a bunch of doctrine of demons and affirm they are saved at the same time. As for the "trolls" comment that is uncharitable...RUclips is an open forum public discourse so if people don't like that some actually disagree and engage in discourse online that is just too bad...the content creators should just leave the comment section off if they want a fan club of people in agreement with them and praising them.
"Doctrine of demons" "trolls" etc yeah that's really truth in love 😆
@@Adam-ue2ig Yes 'Doctrine of Demons" is harsh sounding. Calvinists don't like it much, as they are always softening harsh words.
Eg. They change "Selective lottery salvation" "One cast to Hell and one cast to Heaven" to soft comforting fluffy words like "Sovereign Grace"
Yes baby Christians on the bottle, who get drawn into the flame of Calvinism can be saved in that evil system, as long as they don't grow. Then they leave the building screaming as the many on youtube testify!
As far as the Troll word I used, it should not seem strange. A Demonic Troll by any other name would be. Tempter, evil spirit, son of hell, false teacher... etc. They all have the same desire. To keep out the light or squash any light that comes into the blackness of false religion.
So in conclusion. Calvinism is a "Doctrine of Demons" and those who know what it stands for like Piper, MacArthur, Washer, Boucham, Lawson, White have become the high priests of 'Another Gospel".
See how simple the truth can be?
Truth in Love
@@Adam-ue2ig Yes 'Doctrine of Demons" is harsh sounding. Calvinists don't like it much, as they are always softening harsh words.
Eg. They change "Selective lottery salvation" "One cast to Hell and one cast to Heaven" to soft comforting fluffy words like "Sovereign Grace"
Yes baby Christians on the bottle, who get drawn into the flame of Calvinism can be saved in that evil system, as long as they don't grow. Then they leave the building screaming as the many on youtube testify!
As far as the Troll word I used, it should not seem strange. A Demonic Troll by any other name would be. Tempter, evil spirit, son of hell, false teacher... etc. They all have the same desire. To keep out the light or squash any light that comes into the blackness of false religion.
So in conclusion. Calvinism is a "Doctrine of Demons" and those who know what it stands for like Piper, MacArthur, Washer, Boucham, Lawson, White have become the high priests of 'Another Gospel".
See how simple the truth can be?
Truth in Love
@@Adam-ue2igFor what could be kinder or more caring than to warn people that their very souls are in danger.
Do you want to be inclusive at any cost or do you want the truth? Some times the truth hurts! But it always heals!
2 Timothy 4:3 For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions,
Truth in (tough) love
Sorry for all the comments but I just want to clarify that I do not think all Calvinists are necessarily being PURPOSELY deceptive (almost all though are consciously being calculated with their words though and God is not pleased) but I do understand that this is often a case of “deceived people, deceiving people” maybe not all are being maliciously deceptive, but that’s besides the point because they are being deceptive none the less in the name of God and it’s absolutely unacceptable. Jesus would be flipping tables.
How can you have a knowledge that ALMOST all are being "consciously calculated " with their words (whatever that exactly means in your mind). You simply can not have that kind of knowledge because their is alot of Calvinists in the world and you have only met a small portion of them. I'm sorry you tried to amend your previous statement and instead you basically doubled down and made it just as bad or worse than your original comment.
@@Adam-ue2ig did you watch the video? Both former Calvinists (and I’ve heard plenty of Calvinist preaching and have interacted with many Calvinists online) said calvinists are “consciously being calculated” meaning they are purposefully choosy about their words because they have to be in order to bow down to their Calvinist doctrines over biblical doctrines. So instead of saying things like “Jesus died for you” or “Jesus loves the whole world” they have to be choosy and careful to say “Jesus loves His people” or “Jesus died for sinners”. Calvinists cannot just say what the Bible says because they are more concerned about representing calvinism than biblical Christianity. Calvinists would never utter the phrase “God wants all to come to salvation and repentance” because that would offend their calvinism even though it clearly wouldn’t offend the One True Living God since He had it written in His word.
I know this sounds bad. Because it is. What Calvinism has done to people is bad. It’s caused them to be deceptive and consciously(on purpose) calculated (choosy) with words to appease calvinism more than the Living God. That really just is the reality of what’s going on and I’m exposing it.
@Loves2HugItOut again even if you have interacted with "many" within that many is actually only a relatively very small amount of all the total Calvinists...so no matter how you slice it you have no legitimate ability to claim that you know MOST Calvinists are "deliberately being calculated "
Are you sure you want to say Jesus is flipping tables...what if your wrong when you meet Him and he is not flipping tables as you say...or your position is that it is an impossibility for you to find out when the Lord returns that you were actually wrong?
@Loves2HugItOut Also I am sorry but I think you know (or should know) that the fact that 2 former Calvinists claim that Calvinists are being "purposely consciously calculated" is not some kind of proof that "almost all Calvinists " are being consciously calculated...the claim of 2 former Calvinists can not serve to represent ALL of Calvinists or even a majority of them.
A person will inevitably become like the God they believe in!
Hallelujah!!!
Yep. Babies born with an invisible stamp on their soul. "Heaven" or "Hell". From before the foundation of the world. That's Calvinism. Heartbreaking.
I don't think that is a fair statement at all for Calvinism because those whom are going to heaven is because of the work and righteousness of Christ and those going hell is because they are rebellious sinners.
I’ve only been taught under a “Calvinist” teaching, and we were taught that babies and children, among others, cannot know or understand sin and repentance, and that because God is a loving, compassionate God, he would not send any to hell who do not have that understanding. See the story of King David and how he knew he would see his infant son again, but Absolam’s death he wept over.
@@eclipse3048 In Calvinism they cannot be other than rebellious sinners by God's unchangeable decree and he intentionally withholds the necessary "grace" necessary as required by their doctrine. Calvinists use Eph.1 as their way of trying to support the idea that the choice regarding the eternal destiny of all men is predetermined before the foundation of the world. The term some are "elect" and most others are "doomed from the womb" is an historical fact in their writings.
@@grllopez2644
God can have mercy on whomever He desires to have mercy, but God is perfectly just to send the sinner in Adam to punishment in hell because God is a righteous and perfect judge. The age of the sinner has no affect on if God shows mercy, but if God is willing He will save all whom He pleases.
That’s sounds nice but it’s just hopeful thinking with no scripture. The consistent view of Calvinism sends babies to hell. Every human is born guilty and totally depraved, some elect, some not. Only the elect babies would not go to hell if we wanted to be consistent with the doctrine.
If you want to be consistent with Scripture however, we can say that everyone is judged according to their deeds. Babies have no deeds yet and are not born guilty of anything since they haven’t done anything so naturally, they will go to heaven, because God is good, righteous, loving, and just. David understood the true character of God. He’s right, his baby was with the Lord.
It was hearing that God loved me and that he would save me if I came to him in faith and repentance, that convinced me to become a Christian. I never heard that in the Reformed church I grew up in, where all I ever heard was worm theology. There is NO HOPE in this religion.
This is begging the question...the Reformed or Calvinistic contention is not that God doesn't save those who put their faith and trust in Him...the dispute is over the decisive cause about why one puts their Faith in Him.
@@Adam-ue2ig In Calvinism "salvation" itself is begging the question.
In order to be saved you have to have been in peril.
If God chose from eternity past then no one is "saved" because those who go to heaven were never in danger to begin with.
@@ericfisher1360 even in your understanding as a non Calvinist your complaint also would go against you then.
@@ericfisher1360 Ephesian 1:3-4 Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ. 4 For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love
@ericfisher1360 Regardless of how you understand and interpret passages like this...even the non Calvinist believer has to say they were chosen before the foundation of the world (even if you say it was dependent on your own free will choice to choose to believe in Jesus). So even in your system God at the very least knew thus the idea that "you were never really in danger" applies to the non Calvinist that is saved to...but as an after thought I don't see how that is so troubling...It seems like it should be rather comforting that despite of ourselves and our wreathed sinfulness the grace and power of God overcame our stubborn pride.
😊 Tozer’s claim that a god less powerful than our God would be afraid to give man free choice (paraphrase) is one of my favorites, and I give Mike Winger credit for labeling a new logical fallacy: arguing from piety. I’m not sure what the Latin for that would be-argumentum ulta-glorificatum-? 😅
argumentum pietatis maybe? haha
On knowing what/who the church is was highlighted to me when we took Jesus to prison. 18 of us met with 42 inmates in one of the prison gyms (bowels of the prison) and part of the program (KAIROS) points to WE are the church. It's not a building it is the people.
Arminianism = Calvinism lite
Oh my goodness, I've been saying this forever!! Exactly
Arminianism started with Calvinism in an attempt to extract the obvious fallacies. Start with the bible and read the early church fathers ( not a force into a very narrow selection of teachings) and you will come up with something close to Catholicism.
Imho, the idea of man having responsibility for what he does is a HIGHER view of God’s power and sovereignty. I NEVER claim God is not sovereign. He is over all, in all, and through all. To give choice is the only just way to
judge people for the choices they make. To STILL be able to make all of his plans come to pass AND “work all things for the good of those who love him and are called according to his purpose” requires more power than to just program it all and let it run.
Secret knowledge IS Gnosticism.
53:50 I have been in a backNforth with Calvinist today who is offended at R. C. Sproul's reluctant acknowledgment that Salvation in Calvinism is akin to 'Spiritual Rape'. He calls it blasphemous ..... but can't explain why it is not accurate. Alana, your comparison to the conversations on abortion is 'spot on'.... I'm gonna steal it. I'll give you credit the first couple times... after that it's mine😎
Why not spiritually "made alive" such as Lazarus. Or "spiritually unblinded"? Why add an emotionally charged term that no where is used in Scripture on this topic?
@@philipmurray9796 The Calvinist's assumption is based in a false premise that men are 'born" unable to believe and respond positively to God... There is NO verse or passage in proper context which ever establishes that is the condition of man "from Birth" Biblically. It doesn't exist. Without the "T" there is no need for "ULIP" and the whole system falls apart. Christianity does not need Calvinism. The suggestion that man's separation from God precludes him from realizing his need and seeking God or responding to the Gospel when confronted is totally incompatible with Paul's message at Mars Hill. Paul was not a Calvinist, it's obvious.
It is not uncommon for Calvinists to recoil when the unavoidable consequences of their doctrines are stated in plain terms. They usually prefer to 'soften the blow' and avoid confronting the harsh reality of TULIP.
The consistent implications Calvinism cast a long shadow against the nature of our Heavenly father. Calvinist are forever forced to defend the character God from the claims of their own system. In the end all they can claim is "mystery". But when TULIP is abandoned ... they mystery vaporizes.
The story of Lazarus is not a demonstration of salvation. Jesus was very clear in telling his disciples why he tarried in coming which resulted in the death of Lazarus... who was already a friend and 'believer', both to God and Jesus. He was definitely not 'spiritually dead' unable to believe, as Calvinists try to 'sell' the story to support their misunderstanding of the effects of sin coming into the world.... And he died again.
Jesus' own story of the Prodigal Son is a representation of the undeserved grace and forgiveness available in salvation.
Here is what Dr. Sproul actually wrote in his response.
Dr. Sproul was asked to respond to the polemic accusation that salvation under Calvinism is no more than 'spiritual rape'. He responded that he did not appreciate the term... but he could not dispute the sentiment. He wrote;
"I personally do not like the term “rape” for the Reformed position concerning regeneration (i.e being born again) prior to belief. Yet with that said, I think I understand why non-Reformed folk invoke the term, for despite protestations, when one breaks down Reformed soteriology, one is left with the fact that regeneration occurs against the will of the unregenerate sinner-the sinner has NO CHOICE in the matter; as such, there is some truth to the claim that it is “a forced love”."
Dr. Sproul agrees with it but like to say it 'nicer'.😎 Which is typical of Calvinists when confronted with their own doctrine in 'plain' terms'.
No one can honestly disagree that "Forced Love" is NOT love. And our Heavenly Father, who is the very personification of 'Love', (a noun), would know the difference, it would not be satisfactory for it is no more than deception, which is diametrically opposed to God's nature.
Calvinists have God slipping man a 'mickey' to make him think and act 'as if' he loves God because he cannot risk the rejection of a man who might freely refuse him. Calvinists have the supreme ruler of the universe playing checkers with himself to keep from losing.
@@R.L.KRANESCHRADTT No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. That's inability. You were dead in trespasses and sin. That's Lazarus like spiritual death You're defining love like it's squishy cotton candy. Was it loving for God to use ancient Israel to absolutely destroy ancient Canaan civilizations which God commanded them to do? Your problem is not with Calvinism, but with God. Even Paul assumes your objection. How can God find fault for who resists his will? But who are you o man to question the creator? Paul knows you will ask "how is that fair?"
@@philipmurray9796 quoting individual verses without regard to the specific context establishes nothing.
Lazarus is not about 'salvation'. Jesus was specific in saying what the purpose of that miracle was.
Paul literally contradicted the fundamental premise of Calvinism in his message at Mars Hill.
As for John 6; Read the entire chapter. All these had seen him feeding the thousands and followed him to Capernaum looking for more food and miracles. In this passage of John 6 Jesus it not yet revealed as The Christ to the world. In fact, he was still telling the twelve not to disclose who he was, even though the Holy Spirit had revealed it to them.
Paul, later says in hindsight that the Jews would not have crucified him if they had known who he was. There are many following Jesus as 'disciples' beyond the twelve God had given him... Jesus knew most of them should not be there at this time. This is why Jesus intentionally speaks in terms of 'cannibalism' and says things the Jews would consider blasphemous to run them off, knowing how offensive it will be.
Please continue reading .... vs.66
"From that time many of his ""disciples"" went back, and walked no more with him. 67 Then said Jesus unto the TWELVE, Will ye also go away? 68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life. 69And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God. 70 Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil? 71He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve."
These 12 specific men were given to him by the Father.... even Judas. And later, in the Garden, just before submitting to his destiny, (which he told Peter he could avoid by simply asking God for legions of angels which would definitely have been granted that night to deliver them that night), Jesus prayed in John 17:12 and said to the Father that he had not 'lost one' that the Father had given him except Judas that prophecy be fulfilled. AND it must not be minimalized or overlooked that Jesus 'reminded' the Father of the significance of this accomplishment in prayer at this very crucial moment in his life on earth. Knowing their different backgrounds and temperaments... it must have been like herding cats!
It's important to note in John 6 exactly when Jesus was speaking ...prior to the Cross/resurrection. And to whom he was speaking, and for what purpose. Jesus later says in John 12, that If he be raised up... 'crucified'... He Will Draw All men to him. Before the Cross it is God who calls, draws, 'elects', certain people for certain purposes, at certain points in time. But NOW it is Christ who draws ALL men to himself just as he promised.
Scripture says the Gospel IS the Power of God unto salvation to those who will believe. God was never obligated to save anyone, and no man can ever do anything that will "merit" salvation. God has 'graciously' determined to save all who will believe and put their faith in Christ. There is no verse in proper context anywhere in scripture which establishes anyone ever was, or is, "Born Unable" to believe or respond positively to God. Therefore, it is a fact, and not a mystery, that some will believe... and some will not... but anyone can.
And that is "Good News" for everyone.
@@R.L.KRANESCHRADTT lol, you missed the point "you were dead in your trespasses and sin". They weren't literally dead, but spiritually. "But God made you alive in Christ Jesus." If you can't understand that simple point, how would you understand scripture?
1:44:37 exactly Alana. It’s everything they DONT say. I work as a teacher at a Christian school teaching 6-9 year olds and also teach the preschoolers at Sunday school at my church. All the things we explicitly say not having the baggage of calvinism silencing the good news is what makes all the difference.
Amen
@@LivingChristian Jason, I’m so glad to have heard your story and get to learn from your channel. The video on Ephesians 1 literally blew my mind. I even commented a third of the way in saying how I respectfully disagreed, then continued to watch the rest of the video and I was SHOOK! You started breaking it down and showing all the evidence and so I deleted that comment lol I texted my pastor right away and we are having a meeting next week to go over it 😂🙏🏻 I’m still going through Ephesians 1 now on my own to make sure that interpretation is my firm conviction but yes it blew my mind haha.
@@Loves2HugItOut hey! Glad it was helpful. I remember seeing your comment and was planning to respond to it but then couldn’t find it, lol, now I know why. I think there is a lot of strong points with it, although it’s not one of those texts that if you do believe verses 3-12 is for all (from the non Calvinist perspective) there are still many valid points there as well. There’s so much to think through, it’s exciting to explore and find the truth! Thanks for your comment and complements, they have been very encouraging to my soul😊
@@LivingChristian also I’m really excited to watch your counseling videos because I used to suffer with extreme mental illness and was diagnosed by a psychiatrist with religious OCD (I was happy to have a name for what I was experiencing but that label never defined me and still does not define or even have power over me now) Jesus has met me in the trenches and walked me so gently one day at a time yet powerfully out of that pit and completely renewed my mind through His word! I have found real victory and His love has casted out all my fear. I love that your channel also is for deep biblical encouragement for people suffering with mental and emotional illness. It’s so needed because many “Christian counselors” are progressive and rarely crack open the Bible to offer any help (that was my personal experience with them) A biblical counselor who helped me tremendously during that time was a woman named Jaimie Eckert. She is on RUclips and has a website scrupulousity.com. I joined her online zoom once a week sessions with others who were suffering and the way she opened and spoke of the biblical truths really helped break the strongholds I had and she also would bring in the scientific cognitive side of things and how God has made our brains to work. 😊
@@LivingChristian exactly! I still think now for us who have the full biblical revelation (unlike the Ephesians at the time Paul wrote the letter) do have some personal application with verses 3-12. But I am really seeing that in the specific letter at that specific time Paul was referring to himself and the apostles.
I don't like Calvinism, but not many good churches around my area. One sermon I counted the words "Calvin" and "Calvinist" used over ten times each. I prefer the Gospel according to Jesus Christ, and not according to John Calvin (or John MacArthur). People in my Reformed church pray "God please save your elect." My husband has gotten enticed into it over the 28 years we've been there.
Wow…that sounds VERY hardcore
Hi Alana! I’m currently reading a book called, “Rock and Sand: An Orthodox Appraisal of the Protestant Reformers and Their Teachings.” It’s BLOWING my mind. I’d be really curious if you’ve read it and what your thoughts are. If you haven’t read it already, I highly recommend it. As I break away from the teachings of Calvinism, I am being drawn to Eastern Orthodoxy. 🙏🏻
Enjoy…I honestly probably won’t read it. I have a full plate with a new school year plus juggling making life fun and balanced for my children. I’d love to hear about it though if you ever feel like sharing specifics :)
Did you hear "Faith is a work" from John Piper? I wrote down a quote on this by him but I can't find the source anymore.
I love Kevin Thompson too.
I like him too.
Very thought provoking!
Colossians 2:8
See to it that there is *no one* who *takes you captive* through *philosophy* and *empty deception* in accordance with *human tradition* , in accordance with the elementary principles of the world, rather than in accordance with *CHRIST* .
All those who have rejected the truth of what the spiritually dead call "Calvinism" have been taken captive with Godless mans false manmade freewill gospel. They are all completely blind, lost, and deceived. Repent!
16:30 excellent points.
I congratulate you both for the courage to help others not fall into the false doctrine of predestination that is leading many people to hell.
Just the complete opposite. Search predestination/election/choosing in Scripture and youll see they are biblical. You wont see "free will" at all. Free will is human invention.
Total depravity was the doctrine that caused my Calvinism to collapse. I came to Calvinism under a 4 point Calvy church that never taught LA, so I assumed you could reject it without rejecting the whole system. I had already moved away from Calvinism when I began to understand pre faith Regen. That was so overtly opposite of scripture that I realized that reformed claims that they were properly handling the Word were very much overstated.
Prefaith regeneration is so unorthodox, I almost find it to be a phenomenon that someone can read the Bible and manage to hold on to it. It proves that calvinism is an idol, it’s idolatry.
Any of the five points that fails nullifies any of the other points. I praise God you were awakened to the truth of Scripture and Biblical theology.
The doctrine of pre existence is the reconciliation between the errors of calvinist and a plan
@@clearstonewindows can you explain pre existence? I’ve never really heard that phrase before
@@Loves2HugItOut the doctrine is that we all lived with God as his spirit children before we came to Earth. Before we came to our father wanted us to grow more (learn to freely choose good over evil without being forced by the fact of his presence, etc) of course we would falter, so Jesus Christ (before time) was ordained to be our law giver, savior and judge. So most of us choose to leave his presence and follow Adam and Eve into this life.
So God's plan was well before the was formed. So he knows each of us, and that is the for ordained and choosing talked about it the scriptures.
I've been so grateful for this knowledge that this life isn't a mistake but a plan.
Sorry could write more but not sure if I'm a great writer.
Does that make sense?
1:14:43 you’re making so many good points Alana. What your describing is “I see what the Bible says but I love my man made doctrine more than the One True God. I love the God I have created in my own image more than actually knowing the real God of the Bible. Phew! That unbiblical satisfactory answer allows me to hold on to my religious idol of calvinism”
I know it’s intense, but that is actually what’s going on. I can only imagine how hard it is for a Calvinist to come to terms with this and admit that is what is happening.
No...obviously that is not what Calvinists contend is going on...They legitimately believe that their beliefs are what the Scripture actually means and says...they are not just holding on to a man made set of beliefs as you falsely claim...I have to call out Alana for putting a heart on these comments. I'm pretty sure I have heard her say (at some point) something to the effect that she believes Calvinists sincerely believe they have the actual Biblical interpretation correct so for her to heart this uncharitable straw man is inconsistent. IF it is the case that she is hearting this stuff (to some extent) to affirm or keep her fan base rather than be rigorously consistent, charitable and honest across the board i hope she examines her heart and changes course.
@@Adam-ue2ig yes I know that’s not what Calvinists say is happening. That really is the point of the comment. Of course a Calvinist doesn’t say this is what is happening because they are still in the thick of holding onto and justifying their calvinism idol. Anyone in the middle of a deception doesn’t know or doesn’t admit the justifications they make. I think Alana related to the quote because at the time of her being a Calvinist she wouldn’t say or would never want to admit that is what she was doing, but hindsight is 20/20 and she sees that this was actually her thought process
@Loves2HugItOut no because the comment alludes to the idea that the Calvinist actually knows the Bible doesn't teach X but they disregard that for the sake of their man made system...which is uncharitable and speaks to their character which is ad hominem.
What your now describing by way of attempted explanation is not actually what the comment conveyed.
@Loves2HugItOut I get that it was her describing then and looking back in hindsight...but you said this is what actually is the case for all Calvinists.
And…you can get this program for your church. My friends church has this and they looked into it. I could not believe it myself.
@Alana - i am struggling with finding clarity between INFANT baptism and ADULT baptism now that i have rejected Calvinism.
I was born and raised in a Reformed church and was baptized as an infant. Then at 19 i proffessed my faith in front of the church ... I have 4 children who also were baptized as infants...
Now, since finding Leighton and then you, i have questions regarding what to do now. How do I find a bible understanding of Gods COVENANT from both view points?
Please help ❤
I’m not sure if I will be much help here, but if this is of any help to you: I view baptism in the name of The Father Son and the Holy Spirit as simply a proclamation to the world that you are following Jesus. It is a symbolic cleansing of the old you and the new resurrected you in Christ. It’s that simple to me. Maybe there’s more to it that I don’t grasp and I’m OK with that. I hope this gives some help to your situation.
I hope it won’t confuse you even more, but I would like to comment on that one. About seven years ago I tried to ‚put my glasses off‘ while reading God’s word, and I found all baptisms in Acts to be done in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and quite some references in the letters that correspond to this fact. Since I believe that scripture doesn’t contradict itself and by exegeting scripture with scripture I was compelled to believe that it is an important issue for the Lord, because it was the last command of the Lord and the first of Peter in Pentecost, and I decided to being rebaptized in the name of Jesus. When I did that I really felt like a new creation, and I would recommend every Christian to do that. (I was raised and baptized at 18 in the titles in a rigid Baptist church in Germany, no “Jesus only” people around here) So, IF you decide to be rebaptized, consider to do a deep Bible study on the Name of the Lord. There is only one name given under heaven that we are saved by!
Lots of love from over the sea, sister 🤗
Compatibalism is just camouflaged determinism 🤷♂️
I agree.
Yeah, it just kicks the can down the road. In the end God is the one who has determined everything.
@@awesomefacepalm Which the Bible does not say in any way.
@@believein1 Exactly
@@awesomefacepalm God doesn’t “determine everything” which would include sin. There is no darkness or evil in God, and to claim so by way of false doctrine is blasphemy.
47:05 ALANA this is RIGHTEOUS anger and you do not need to apologize for it for a second 48:08 ya we don’t need to keep giving Calvinists a pass and making excuses for them… Calvinists are being straight up deceptive and need to be called to repentance on their face before God, not cushioned with excuses for their behavior
Hi Alana. Can you link Jason’s channel? I don’t know his last name so I can’t find him. I also can’t find my comment that I left you last night thanking you for this video and for Jason leading me to the author Adam Hardwood. I hope it went through.
Galatians 1:6-10
I marvel that you are *turning away* so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, *to a different gospel* , which is not another; *but there are some who trouble you* and want to *pervert the gospel of Christ* . But even if WE, or an angel from heaven, preach ANY OTHER GOSPEL to you than what we [the apostles] have preached to you *let him be accursed* . As we have said, so now I say again, if *ANYONE* preaches *ANY* other gospel to you than what you have received, *let him be accursed* .
For do I now persuade men, or GOD? Or do I seek to please men? For if I still pleases men, I would not be a bondservant of Christ.
Yes, those who have been snared into the apostate churches freewill gospel have turned away from the truth, gospel, and the Christianity of the Bible. They are the accursed of God. They are the vessels of wrath made for destruction. Repent!
I'm curious, (as a never-been Calvinist), what is the value of TULIP for evangelism if the inherent determinism isn't front and center? If its "God loves you, Jesus died for you" at the outset, why is it important for Calvinists to insist (perhaps later on in discipleship) that he really only died for some and that his love to some is expressed in predestining them to hell? Is it connected to the idea of maximizing God's glory or is it "because that's what the Bible teaches"?
I don’t think a Calvinist would be able to say “God loves you, Jesus died for you” (which to me is the heart of the gospel); God’s love is really only for the elect. Jesus’ death is limited only to the elect. That is the problem with Calvinism, to me it changes the very gospel
@@ruthmayforth5933does God love the sinner who wi d up in hell? Without the bad news we will never appreciate the good. Reformed theology teaches the free offer of the gospel to all men .
@@dfischer5878 Yes, God loves everyone on earth, everyone He has made: Psa 145:9 “The LORD is good to everyone; His compassion rests on all He has made.” John 3:16. Part of the reason Jesus came and died for ALL men is because of His/God’s love for all men, not just the elect. (Rom 5:8, 1John 2:2, Heb 2:9). I do agree with you that God’s wrath is upon those who are in hell. I cannot reconcile reformed theology with any of these verses, tho.
I disagree that Reformed theology teaches the free offer of the gospel to all men - if not all men can receive the gospel as per reformed theology, it is a disingenuous offer to the non-elect. I would agree with you that the true gospel does genuinely offer the gospel to all men, and ALL men can choose to receive it, repent, and believe (although sadly most do not choose to receive it.) 1 Tim 2:4-6. If you think I am misunderstanding reformed theology, please explain, but I don’t believe I am. I have given scripture to support my understanding. If you disagree, please give scripture that supports your position.
In my opinion, Reformed theology, while desiring to exalt God’s sovereignty, actually limits it - i.e., they seem to believe that if man has free will, it somehow threatens God’s sovereignty. I believe that God’s sovereignty supercedes, despite men truly having free will and having the ability to choose or reject God. I believe that God delignts in and is glorified more by the praise and love of men who freely choose Him. (Wouldn’t you treasure the love of a spouse who freely chooses to love you, rather than one who had been given some secret love potion and therefore had no choice but to love you?)
I've been studying soteriology for years now. This is such a difficult subject to resolve in scripture. I have yet to find a view that doesn't contain a paradox. Either God’s sovereignty is complete yet man is still responsible, or God's future knowledge of free creatures with no basis in himself (ie Molinosm) , or open theology where God doesn't know yet can predict the future. Or God isnt in control of everything and yet somehow brings about history and providence. At this point, im still searching and generally agnostic on the issue.
I think you may be confusing Soteriology with how God works. Those are two different subjects. I think Soteriology is easy to see in Scripture, but how God works is diverse, not deterministic, in scripture and we cannot fully grasp it. :)
How we are saved is simply believing that Jesus is the son of God, and that he rose from the dead. :-)
detached: You are attempting to resolve a false dichotomy. It is not either/or....because the premise of calvinist, "sovereignty," is incorrect.
No serious christian disagrees that God is omnipotent (all powerful) and omniscient (all knowing)
Calvinist meaning of "soverign," is that God controls everything, determines everything...including the preacher and the rapist....for His glory.
We non calvinists agree God is omnipotent, omnicient,, but disagree that He is determining, orchestrating everything.
Biblical evidence shows us that He created humans with the ability to accept Him and reject Him. The evidence is in the story of Adam and Eve (in Eden) and Cain and Abel (outside Eden).
Keep in mind that there is no evidence that a created thing can EXCEED its design parameters.
An auto designed with a maximum speed of 120mph, cannot move at 130 mph, nor that auto fly.
The designer determines the characteristics of his design....which include limitations.
Adam and Eve, Cain and Abel could NOT obey or rebel without that capacity built in them. God created humans with the capacity to choose.
What is Jason’s RUclips channel?
What was that channel you mentioned about testimonies? Maybe gwm?
I meant he shares his testimony, but he has several other videos as well. It’s not all testimonies sorry!! Yes GWM :)
I can understand the longing to still want to express love and acceptance of past Calvinistic friends, but after experiencing the 'covert' judgemental attitudes from them, when all we wanted to do was express our understanding of God's love and grace for everyone, we were literally yelled at, at our Bible study! We left our Calvinistic church and though it pushed us deeper into the Word, which I am grateful for, I cannot in good conscience believe they are brothers in Christ. I am not able to accept their doctrine as anything other then evil.... God's stamps little babies with, 'this one is for heaven, this one is for hell!' This is the 'God' they worship!!!
Sorry, can't do it.
I can see what you are saying to be true for some, but not all. And there’s no way we could really know anyway. I can share stories that would surprise you as well if what my “Christian friends” have done and said to me since leaving church. It’s still unbelievable to me, but I can’t say if they’re believers or not. The most I can say is they’re blinded or living with unrepentant sin.
My advice is guard your heart from thinking the worst, sinful anger or hardness.
I know, right?? One of the things that scares me about a lot of Christians is how quickly they will turn on you for innocent things-- like believing that Jesus loves all people and desires everyone to be saved. 😮😳. Rather than rejoice in the beautiful truth with you-- they turn on you and actually villainize you!!
I once had seemingly nice Christians make fun of me for changing my career from bartending to caregiving, after I was saved-- and they actually tried sabotaging my new job! It's terrifying watching coverts switch to overt; over the most innocent of things.
Ugh I'm so sorry you had to go through the shock of all that. And I'm sorry for everything you've been dealing with, too, Alana.
But I also agree with Alana... Sometimes I want to fight back, but I'd rather keep a clear conscience before God.
I do believe the Bible says we need to refute lies (gently), but I no longer question their salvation because I KNOW God wants them, and me, to be saved. And many of them have been born-again, so they ARE my family. I believe in falling away, but I also believe God will give everyone who falls chance after chance to come back before it's too late.
But I do break fellowship with aggressive or complacent Christians, and I don't dine with Calvinists anymore. It's just not possible to work alongside them, they put so many mental and spiritual obstacles in the way. I believe holding onto our sanity is important, personally.
@@nowhere_else_to_go_thanks for sharing your thoughts! The falling away element is something I’m working through. Praying for discernment there. Blessings to you!
@@AlanaL3 good advice ! God bless.
The way you describe it is evil; it however is not what reformed theology teaches.
We are attracted to passion. Mistakenly we hear the "passionate," preacher and believe that it is the truth. Or we hear the kindness, softness and careful teaching of John Piper, and accept it as truth.
I know of no one that formed calvinist beliefs from reading scripture. TULIP was taught to Christians from their home or their pastor, and not derived from scripture.
Evidence from scripture.
Imagine a detective that believes before viewing a crime scene, that the victim committed suicide. It's what he has been told by his supervisors. He will enter that scene in search of evidence that supports suicide.
Excellent analogy.
Serious?
Most people I know who are reformed knew nothing of tulip; Calvin or anything else. I grew up in the soft teaching of a Methodist church and walked away; I then attended several “ soft “ teaching churches and could not find scripture to align with the teaching That everyone has the ability to “ accept “ the gospel. Or that we are all inherently good. Scripture does not teach this. I saw on my own Bible reading that I could not ; I needed God to move first as I may have been seeking the gifts if God but surely not the holiness of God. I sat under the gospel message many times and walked away unchanged. It was not till God in His mercy opened my eyes that I believed. I can simply agree with “ nothing to the cross I bring simply to the cross I cling” . I had no part in my salvation nor does anyone else.
@@dfischer5878 Well you got some or all of the tulip from all those times sitting and listening to someone, not from reading scripture.
If you had nothing to do with salvation, then you are the first and only human that was born blind, deaf and without thought and emotions, or a will.
Truly a miracle that you wrote that comment.
No non calvinist believes that we are all "inherently," good. It is the calvinist teaching that preaches a dichotomy.....we are either born totally depraved....or we must be totally good. We do not believe either.
BTW, God DID, "move first," in creating humans with the capacity to KNOW Him, and to accept or reject Him....just as Cain and Abel were.
@@dfischer5878 God did move first…creation, isreal, prophets, Jesus, apostles, the Bible. He is still moving. Can you respond to His several “first moves?” I say the Bible definitely teaches yes.
I think that the healthiest people are those who can leave a church and still say good things about it. I think they are way more credible than people who leave and act like there was nothing good. I think those people are not very believable
Hi Alana, would you mind explaining what limited atonement is?
That the atonement for sins made by Jesus on the cross was only effective for the elect.
@@AlanaL3 thanks for that.
@@chrisharris9710
“The doctrine of definite atonement (also known as limited atonement) focuses on the question of the design of Christ’s atonement. It is concerned with God’s intent in sending Jesus to the cross.
Anyone who is not a universalist is willing to agree that the effect of Christ’s work on the cross is limited to those who believe. That is, Christ’s atonement does not avail for unbelievers. Not everyone is saved through His death.
Everyone also agrees that the merit of Christ’s death is sufficient to pay for the sins of all human beings. Some put it this way: Christ’s atonement is sufficient for all, but efficient only for some.
This, however, does not really get at the heart of the question of definite atonement. Those who deny definite atonement insist that Christ’s work of atonement was designed by God to atone for the sins of everyone in the world. It made possible the salvation of everyone, but made certain the salvation of no one. Its design is therefore both unlimited and indefinite.
The Reformed view holds that Christ’s atonement was designed and intended only for the elect. Christ laid down His”“life for His sheep and only for His sheep.
Furthermore, the atonement insured salvation for all the elect. The atonement was an actual, not merely potential(Alana”s view)work of redemption.
In this view there is no possibility that God’s design and intent for the atonement could be frustrated. God’s purpose in salvation is sure.
Reformed theologians differ over the question of the offer of the atonement to the human race. Some insist that the offer of the gospel is universal. The cross and its benefits are offered to anyone who believes. Others insist that this concept of a universal offer is misleading and involves a kind of play on words. Since only the elect will in fact believe, in reality the offer goes out only to them. The benefit of Christ’s atonement is never offered by God to the impenitent or the unbelieving. Since belief and repentance are conditions met only by the elect, then ultimately the atonement is offered only to them.
“John writes that: “He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world” (1 John 2:2). This text, more than any other, is cited as scriptural proof against definite atonement. At first glance it seems to argue that Christ’s death was intended for everybody (the whole world). However, if it is taken in that sense the text proves more than non-Reformed people want it to prove. It becomes a proof-text for universalism.
If Christ indeed propitiated or satisfied God’s demands for the punishment of the sins of everybody, then clearly everybody would be saved.
If God punished sins that were already propitiated then He would be unjust.
If the text is understood to mean that everyone’s sins have been conditionally propitiated (contingent upon faith and repentance) then we are back to the original question of only the elect satisfying the conditions.
The other way to view this text is to see the contrast in it between our sins and those of the whole world. Who are the people included in the word our? If John is speaking only of”“fellow believers, then the previous interpretation of the text would apply. But is that the only possible meaning of our?
In the New Testament a frequent contrast is made between the salvation enjoyed by Jews and that enjoyed by non-Jews. A crucial point of the gospel is that it is not limited to Jews but is extended to people all over the world, to people from every tribe and nation. God loves the whole world, but He does not save the whole world; He saves people from all parts of the world. In this text, John may merely be saying that Christ is not only a propitiation for our sins (Jewish believers) but for the elect found also throughout the whole world.
In any case, the plan of God was decided before anybody was in the world at all. The atonement of Christ was not a divine afterthought. The purpose of God in Christ’s death was determined before the foundation of the world. The design was not guesswork but according to a specific plan and purpose, which God is sovereignly bringing to pass. All for whom Christ died are redeemed by His sacrificial act.”
Alana doesn’t want to deal with the problems her position reveals, so she plays on emotional responses because most don’t know the problems her position holds
So… could you stay in a church with a Calvinist pastor who tries not to preach too Calvinistically? (Struggling here!). Stuff comes through- things come through in the way he handles the word. And I’m less and less able to see these things as ok. Any advice?
The church wants to be “big tent” when it comes to soteriology, but the pastor is a Calvinist. And I just figure that out. 😢
I couldn’t but you must go to the lord about it. I don’t think there’s one answer for everyone.
So Jason must've opened the Bible and read it and said "oh wait Jesus died for everyone. How could election according to Calvinism be true?" Amen🙏
Jesus absolutely did not die for everyone. Jesus died only for the few who are his chosen ones, his elect. If you were not spiritually dead and blind, you would understand this FACT!
Your (the 100% apostate churches) freewill gospel is a manmade fraud. It is the gospel of the accursed. Repent!
If He died for everyone that His plan failed. Does not sound like the God of scripture to me.
@@dfischer5878 Of course Jesus did not die for everyone. He only came for and only died for the few who are his chosen ones, his elect. This is why the entire church is apostate, the 100% false manmade freewill gospel is a manmade fraud and has filled the entire church with counterfeit christians.
Jesus's chosen ones have nothing to do with the apostate church and its false freewill gospel and its counterfeit (antichrist) christianity.
@@dfischer5878 No, His character is intact and consistent with Scripture. He died so that all might be saved.
The church that I am attending currently has an elder who is slowly trying to bring in calvinistic teachings. I am curious to see how deep he is into it. So I'm just going to ride along with it.
You should ask him
To ride along with it is very dangerous remember what our lord said
Our Lord further called them “hypocrites…blind guides…white sepulchers…serpents…and you generation of vipers” (Matthew 23:23-34). Yet, we are told today that we are to fellowship with men whose doctrines are just as unscriptural as those of the Pharisees. Some say that these kinds of people are Bible believing Christians and insist on working with these heretics. And, according to many, we are not supposed to rebuke them for compromising the Word of God. Remember the Pharisees believed in God and were supposed to be the most religious group of all and Jesus rebuked them sternly.
I urge you, brothers and sisters, to watch out for those who cause divisions and put obstacles in your way that are contrary to the teaching you have learned. Keep away from them” (Romans 16:17). Those whose conduct and teaching contradicts the Word of God we are to watch out for and strictly avoid.
If it were me I would move out and find a church that teaches the true word of the gospel.
@@johndennison3140wow so you are saying reformed believers do not have the true gospel?
@@dfischer5878 are you saying non-reformed believers do not have the true gospel?
I don't like how some Calvinists say (indirectly) that believing or not believing in Calvinism is the same as believing that the Scriptures are true or that they are false. Or put another way, non-Calvinists can believe in Sola Scriptura too.
2 Peter 2:1-3
But there were also false prophets among the people, *even as there will be false teachers among you* who will *secretly bring in destructive heresies* , even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. And *many will follow their destructive ways* because of whom *THE WAY OF TRUTH IS BLASPHEMED* . By covetousness they will exploit you with *deceptive words* ; for a long time their judgement has not been idle, and their destruction does not slumber.
Yes, absolutely. Anything other than what the blind, lost, and deceived call "Calvinism" is manmade fraud and is another gospel and another christianity. Your freewill gospel is 100% false manmade fraud. It is the gospel of the accursed. Repent!
I think what Calvinists present as a false dichotomy is also called "false dilemma"
They certainly do.
What's ya'lls stance on OSAS that's also rampant in Calvinsim?
OSAS is actually not the same as Perseverance of the Saints in TULIP.
P is more into Lordship salvation i.e. very simplified, a slippery slope into works based salvation.
Yes, Paul was definitely given a revelation/information that no one else before him ever received - MY gospel.” Eph 3:1-9; Gal 1:11-12, 16-20, 2:1-2, 7-9; Rom 2:16, 16:25-26; Col 1:25-27; 1 Cor 2:7-8; 1 Tim 1:15-16; Titus 1:2-3.
You reject the authority of Paul's epistles?
@@PaDutchRunner No, I emphasize it. See the verses above.
I don’t understand the difficulty with Romans 9. It’s so plain if you take it for what it says. Abraham, Isaac, children of the promise, Jacob, Esau. It’s all about Israel, God’s chosen, elect, set-apart people (Deut 7:6, 14:1-2; Isa 41:8-9, 44:1, 45:4; Ps 135:4, etc). In the book of Romans, Paul is telling the Roman Jews about this new thing God is doing, “the dispensation of the grace of God” (Eph 3:1-9), salvation by faith alone in Jesus alone, apart from Israel, apart from her laws (Acts 13:38-39).
I think it’s hard to see in context when you’ve been told it says something different for years. Lots of buzz words in this text
@@AlanaL3 Yes, you’re right. We all have been taught for centuries to allegorize/spiritualize the Bible instead of letting it simply mean what it says. What a privilege to be part of the generation who is untangling man’s preconceived ideas and getting back to a literal read of the Bible.
CALVARY CHAPELS!!!!
Misreading Scriptures With Western Eyes is very helpful ad so ir Misreading Scripture With Individualist Eyes!
Alana I would love to talk. I do understand these issues. i.e... Faith is a work ,the doctrines of grace, covenant theology ( which is not talked about at all it seems and it is key to this discussion) and how baptism fits into this.
There are Calvinist churches I would not got to. Why? Because they don't believe man has a real choice to make in salvation. the Bible teaches we do. Jordan and I will make the 2nd video soon. I will email you if you like. I have thought for a year that I would like to talk and see were we each came from and how we now see things. ( not a public conversation )
Thanks Dave
I’d love that;)
The freeze at 28:07 is the Sovereighnty of God.. "that's not really true."
Yes, my dear Theistically Determined Self Determinists, God does get ALL the glory to and from Himself, from the saved and unsaved.
How do you glorify God by claiming He is the one who makes man sin, and is actually the author of sin?
By Calvinist doctrine, God predetermined Adam and Eve to sin, made them sin, allowed them to sin, then cursed all of mankind because of His own manipulation of them. Does that even seem right? Was God admonishing them knowing He had caused them to do that sin?
No, this does not glorify God in any way. Sovereignty is the ability to act with no restraint from outside forces. It does not equal tyranny in that God uses that sovereignty to control everything, and so all evil is His doing also.
This blasphemes God, in fact
@@believein1 Like always, consistent Lovers of Self appeal to the senses of the first birth nature. Sola Scriptura. Stick with the Word of God. Gods glory isn't dependent on the creatures imaginary autonomous free will. His glory is.
@@believein1 2 Corinthians 2:14-17
Now thanks be unto God, which always causeth us to triumph in Christ, and maketh manifest the savour of his knowledge by us in every place. [15] For we are unto God a sweet savour of Christ, in them that are saved,👉 and in them that perish: [16] To the one we are the savour of death unto death;👈 and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who is sufficient for these things? [17] For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God: but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ.
Philippians 1:28-29
And in nothing terrified by your adversaries: 👉which is to them an evident token of perdition👈, but to you of salvation, and that of God. [29] For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;
@@ManassehJones How does God clearly giving man the ability to choose whether to follow affect His deserving of glory?
Don’t you understand what the gospel is? Man choosing to repent and believe doesn’t “earn salvation”, God grants pardon to those who repent and believe.
And this gross misunderstanding of the gospel in and of itself is one of the greatest causes for ignorance among Calvinists. Then like a Calvinist you resort to snide responses that aren’t even becoming of a Christian, yet are commonplace for Calvinists following a false theology. Go figure.
You don’t glorify God by declaring a false gospel or painting Him to be the cause of man’s evil.
Deformed, Sovereign Grace, 5-Point Calvinism is a Doctrine of Demons from the pit of hell from the pen of Satan himself! Thanks for making that clear Manasseh. You never disappoint with your twisted view of God's love for mankind and have replaced it with your Calvi-god you serve. No thinking Christian follows a thing you say. A child can see the dripping hatred you have for God's love for mankind.
You continually fight against these truths, how sad and pathetic!
1 Timothy 2 : 3-6 This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4 who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus, 6 who gave himself as a ransom for all people.
1 John 2:2 He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.
Acts 2 :21And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.’ 38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 This promise belongs to you and your children and to all who are far off-....
John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Calvi-god and calvi-god has none of this
God predetermined Adam and Eve to sin.
God forbade them to commit that sin.
God allowed them to commit that sin.
God admonished them for committing that sin and cursed them and all of mankind because of the sin He made them do.
This is Calvinism.
God made the man from corruption. The flesh.
God put the temptation in front of him and said “in the day that you eat“
That was the intention all along because of the lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
@@aletheia8054 God made them sin so that Jesus could die for their mistake?
That is blasphemy and you need to repent of it.
@@believein1 he created them to sin, so the lamb slain from the foundation of the world would fulfill his purpose.
It wasn’t an accident
@@aletheia8054 God has no darkness in Him, and He doesn’t create evil or makes anything do evil.
You don’t understand how wicked your theology actually is.
Calvinism has come and gone four times in church history as a fad, each time being disproven and expelled.
I think that’s something you aren’t educated about either.
@@believein1 There was no entire universe in God either but he created it out of nothing
God literally said he creates darkness and evil
And I’ll keep repeating Gods word till I die if you deny it for the elect who will hear.
Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
I’m not a Calvinist.
What’s his channel I didn’t catch
This so weird! We're loving the show but it keeps cutting out at the most important parts 😕
At around 45:00 Jason explains why many Calvinists are saved even though they believe a twisted gospel. We are supposed to look at their fruits and he know so many Calvinists who serve one another and demonstrate good fruit so he sees them as brothers and sisters. I don’t completely agree. Many Mormons demonstrate tons of what could be seen from the outside as good fruit… they are genuinely kind, gentle, loving, serving, faithful, and are zealous about God. I understand they have a works based gospel, while Calvinism does not. So in that way it’s very different. But calvinism DOES absolutely distort the gospel and we cannot ignore that. Luckily, many calvinists are extremely inconsistent so I do think there are some who are truly in the faith. But I think we have every right to put a big question mark on anyone who is a staunch 5 point calvinist. There are wayyyyyy too many layers of false doctrine that completely distorts the very gospel, character of God, view of fellow humanity, and your view of yourself and how God relates to you. It affects literally your entire world and twists almost every verse in scripture. I’m not going to make excuses for this. This is a big deal. Especially regarding the pastors/teachers/scholars that explicitly teach the false doctrines and the false gospel. We can not desensitize ourselves to this and justify this.
Amen. Mormons are a great example.
The Calvinist “gospel” and image of God is completely distorted and false, and by logic is not able to save. I can of course understand why her and Jason would wish that were not true, as I have myself been a former member of John MacArthur’s church and knew many who were “God loving” people, but loving God in and of itself does not bring one to the saving grace of God.
If a Calvinist is truly knowledgeable of their theology and is honest about it, it paints a different gospel and a way to be saved which paints a way that is actually wholly out of the control of the person to believe and repent and allows them to simply accept what God had planned. Absolutely fatalistic.
Since in Gal 1:8 Paul calls anyone who preaches a different gospel “accursed” or “anathema”, are Calvinists who espouse a different gospel brothers and sisters in Christ? (I could say the same for Catholics). Yet I know many Calvinists personally who seem to have a deep and personal relationship with Christ.
You make yourself the judge when in fact Christ is when you say you have a right to put a big question mark on the salvation of those that disagree with you i.e Calvinists.
Also there are a ton of individual Scripture verses and you claim Calvinism twists almost every one of them...im sorry but come on listen to yourself this is hyperbolic extreme nonsense.
No predestination (no matter how you understand it) is not fatalism...another straw man.
When a parent tells their child who truly believes in God and hell that GOD might not love them and might have created them for the sole purpose of going to hell theyre guilty of child abuse , emotional and spiritual child abuse . It's child abuse no matter how one looks at it .
No that's a false argument straw man...The Calvinists do not argue that God does not save those that truly have faith and trust in Christ...unless you mean a different conception of God in that case Scripture says Jesus is the only way to the father, and he is the way the truth and life etc.
Again I recommend stop hearting these comments Alana...I think you probably know it is misrepresenting the Calvinist position.
Jason's comments at the end (1:30 ) are dead on. I know personally every point you guys are making. Our church is based on expository preaching and is full of Love and Joy for the Lord and teaches the doctrines of grace . I barely have a Sunday I am not wiping my eyes. I said to somemone years ago in life group that those concepts are not mutually exclusive.
Your church is a manmade fraud, same as all the others. Everything called the church is 100% apostate from God and from the truth of the Bible. You are completely blind, lost, deceived, and 100% steeped/snared into the Godless worlds counterfeit (antichrist) christianity.
Mankind does not have freewill. What the spiritually dead and blind call "Calvinism" is the only truth/gospel/Christianity of the Bible. Everything else is another gospel and another christianity. Repent!
Mark 10:19 ASV
Thou knowest the commandments, Do not kill, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Do not defraud, Honor thy father and mother.
That’s six out of 10 right? :-)
Chuck Smith and J Vernon McGee did some expository teaching and have DVDs on sale that will give you thousands of hours of teaching for about $50
David Guzik, Enduring Word, Calvary Chapel, California. Expository teaching/preaching.
Jason's sound cuts out around minute 28:00.
Whats Jason's YT acct?? I followed "Living Christian" but it doesnt look like him
Hello! There’s another channel with the living Christian title. But here’s mine:
youtube.com/@LivingChristian
@@LivingChristian thank you
I’m not alone in my hunt for a non-Calvinist church that preaches expositional sermons.
Me too!!!
what is Jason's website
He came back
🎉🎉
I had commented on Jason’s channel about the issue of Calvinists believing in a false gospel and a god who is not the God of the Bible by the misinterpretation of His character.
I understand that you and Jason both come from Calvinist churches and therefore have many friends that still abide by those teachings, and thus I ask you, would you hold the same opinion that they are saved if that wasn’t your history and if you didn’t have many people in your life who you wished to be saved?
Although Calvinists claim that they also believe that if one repents and believes that they are saved, they truly haven’t thought out the ramifications of God predestining people to do so and what responsibility this then gives the believer in accountability.
For example, a pastor once told me of a girl who used to go to his church who became a Calvinist. Him and his wife happened to run into her at a public place where she was clearly intoxicated from alcohol. They of course tried to admonish her and plead to her senses, with her response being “what does it matter? If I’m predestined to be saved then God will take me out of this and I won’t be able to resist that. If God predestined me to be condemned then no matter how hard I want to repent I won’t be able to, so I might as well have as much fun as I can.”
This is indeed heartbreaking, but it also shows the huge difference in gospel perspectives that a true and honest Calvinist holds compared to someone who adhered to a Biblical gospel. Can one blame her if she is condemned in her sin, and is this compatible (no pun intended) with the real gospel and can one be saved who follows this?
The basis for the gospel is that they who believe and rest their thoughts of salvation on Jesus’ death and not their adherence to the law shall be saved. Calvinism is, by definition, not this. Calvinism states that no matter what one chooses to do, God has already predetermined whether they will be saved or not. It goes beyond a perspective in time and the ability to say “that’s what God had predetermined all along”, it says that no matter what I do it has already been decided.
How far can we stray from the gospel and true character of God before a false gospel no longer saves? Are Mormons saved? JW’s? Does the Bible not say that anyone including angels who bring a false gospel be accursed, and why is this logically made to be such an abomination to God? Can something so horrendous be able to save as well?
Can you please share your thoughts on this?
Great questions that written answers won’t be sufficient. But my hope is that in this series I can answer as much of these as possible.
Video glitches! 😢
I didn’t grow up even knowing about Calvinism, but the past few years I’ve learned a lot about it. It seems there’s a pattern where people think they know some amazing new epiphany about God when they learn Calvinism…. But then you learn that under Calvinism, God creates people to either torture or to be in Heaven with him. If you are created to torture, then you have no choice to change…. Free will doesn’t exist. That is most definitely not the loving God that I know. Jesus died for everyone…. Yes not all will accept his free gift of eternal life, but as the Bible says “He does not want anyone to perish. “
I believe the love of God results in the saving of those he loves. It’s a perfect love never fails to say the ones that he loves.
Do you think He doesn’t love everyone, then? I think belief in Calvinism would give me a moral dilemma when presenting the gospel to children.
You would have to say “Jesus died for some people. You might be one of them. He created some people to hurt and torture them, and others to save. Would you like to trust in Jesus today? It’s not actually your choice…. But we can pray with you and pretend you have a choice today to accept Jesus into your heart.”
I doubt many would choose to accept Jesus if they were presented with the full points of Calvinism right away.
@@julielarsen6501 I believe God’s love is perfect, and that it results in salvation. So obviously, God doesn’t love everybody.
Making fun of Calvinist doesn’t change that
I would never make fun of a Calvinist! I truly believe they love God and are trying to seek the truth about Him. I think they have been deceived by teachers that twist scripture to fit the Calvinist beliefs.
It’s not possible to have assurance of our salvation in Calvinism. We hope that we are on the elect…. We hope that he chose us….It would be so hard to live wondering.
We can all have assurance that we are saved. We can point to when Jesus called and we answered and chose to accept His free gift of eternal life.
@@julielarsen6501 You don’t believe that God’s love leads to the salvation of those he loves?
What kind of love of God would fail to save someone? What kind of love is that?
Seminaries, and not recognizing the distinctive differences between the Gospel accounts of Christ under law coming to Israel and the Body of Christ under grace not law in the New Testament Epistles, and incredible egos of so many, as well as poor teaching, and finding Elders outside of their own congregation, are some reasons for the tremendous problems in the environs of Christian leadership and congregations.
I am partial to vs x vs expository teaching (with minimal preaching). Unfortunately, that does not guarantee proper context!! Some teach: Oneness/Anti-trinitarianism, Baptismal-Regeneration, Speaking in tongues is THE evidence of one's salvation, You MUST keep both covenants/SDA, a Prosperity-Gospel, you MUST repent of your sins/stop all sinning before receiving Jesus & Some teach some are randomly pre-chosen in eternity past for Glorification or Damnation via Meticulous Determinism. All of these are taught via scripture OUT OF CONTEXT!!
Everything called the church is all 100% apostate from God and from the truth of the Bible. There are no Christians in anything called the church. The few actual Christians that exist (Gods chosen ones, Gods elect) are all completely outside of everything known as the church.