I load my Brown Bess carbine the same way! I usually get a lecture from folks for not loading it “period correct” with a .69 ball and paper wadding. I could never get decent accuracy with that load so I switched to the .735 ball and a cork or fiber wad over the ball.
Oh my, yes some folks get worked up about things of that nature. In a smooth bore, if it works and it is safe, stick with it I say! Nice to meet you here Jake. Used your powder method today. I used about 1/2 a teaspoon of quebracho bark powder to the BP putty before graining. Works like the dextrin but no fouling trouble. Funny, it seems for every guy there is a different "recipe" for powder lol! Lots of fun!
Concerning cut-down Brown Besses you might find this interesting. Now I forget where I read this, or maybe a British friend of mine who was into muzzle-loading told me, but back in the 1790's the British Army tried an experiment of cutting down a Brown Bess to see where the performance of the musket fell off. (They used what was called a ballistic pendulum as a target, no chronographs in those days!) Long story short they cut the barrel down to 28 inches before they noticed a substantial performance drop, so they knew then they really didn't need to make the barrels as long as they did. However, the standard 42" barrel length was kept anyway strictly for "reach" in bayonet fighting and defense against cavalry. Barrel lengths wouldn't shorten until the smokeless powder era.
@@HoffmanReproductions You're welcome! There's a lot of history behind the Brown Bess, especially with the legendary Colonial Rangers of all kinds! (Roger's Rangers weren't the only ones, just the most famous. Not that they didn't deserve their fame!)
I wonder if you would have seen this done more often to the captured French arms, due to the widespread usage of those in light infantry units due to size and the issues the British were having on fielding muskets. Especially after the fall of Louisbourg and the capture of many firelocks.
@@mikef3808 In the British Army I'd doubt it, it would have complicated ammunition supply. However it wouldn't have been unusual to find captured French arms used by American militia or provincial units up to and including the period of the Revolution. Possibly British personnel assigned to garrison duties and not likely to be used in field service may have been issued captured French muskets, but I'm not sure on that.
Shorter muskets present a problem with linear formations/tactics, where there are two ranks of soldiers.....and this is probably why muskets stayed so long, even through the US Civil War. If shorter muskets are used, then then rear rank muskets muzzles would be much closer to the front rank soldier's ears, as if standard length muskets weren't loud enough. Just my thoughts.
Excellent presentation! Exigent shooting. I like the history,on the Ranger Brown Bess Musket.I hope to have one of these one day.Do you hunt with any of these guns.I have hunted with a 50 cal muzxloder..David Back Menifee county Kentucky.
I just shoot for fun but many Folks do still hunt with them. Still as effective today as they were 250 years ago. Thank you for watching and glad you like it!
They are basically a 1st model Bess that has been cut down or "bobbed" as it was called during the 1700's. We sell & build Brown Bess muskets. Please feel free to check out our website at www.hoffmanreproductions.com Thanks!
It is VERY rare to see anyone using a correct off hand position. You keep your head up and the bring the stock straight back into your shoulder. This is what we taught to our students at FLETC. If I may make a suggestion, after bringing the butt stock straight back into the shoulder more butt plate contact (and therefore more shooting comfort) can be attained by raising the right elbow high as possible (Above the horizontal at least) and then leaning into the weapon much like a trap or skeet shooter. By using those two suggestions you will experience full butt plate contact. 😀
Would it be possible.....would the weapon still be viable.......if it were shortened further, say to and inch or so forward of the front sling swivel? Are there any historical writings about this being done, either intentional or to muskets that had been damaged? Thanks.
There is period reference to muskets being bobbed or cut down as we say now. Yes Sir, it would still be a usable gun. How short was the shortest ever done, not sure.
I know I'm a little late to the party but had a couple questions. Would this kind of carbine have been used during the french and Indian war? Also how did you cut the barrel down for the project
Hey Brandon, Loyalist Arms sells the gun but I cut down a full sized one just like the old boys during the 1700's did when building them new for guys. Your welcome!
@@HoffmanReproductions thank you very much. I'm thinking about doing a traditional hunt dressed like a person in the french and Indian war. I'm thinking this may be the best version of the Bess to use on that hunt. You have definitely earned a sub from me
I have a "captured " 1728 Charlyville musket that I am thinking about cutting down to woodsrunner length. I figure to move the front barrel band back to where the second barrel band is. That would get rid of the sling swivel and shorten the musket by about 10 inches. Should be a fun project. I would then Brown the barrel and barrel bands. I am probably going to restain the stock too. I am working towards a 1750s ranger look. I still have to drill the touch hole and tune the lock. I want to shoot it a bit before I do anything major too it. One step at a time. I can cut it but I can't un-cut it, if you know what I mean.
Yes it can be used. However, I would recommend real BP. Pyrodex tends not to give the best performance in flintlocks at lest in my experience. It would be worth trying to find some or traveling to where it can be purchased.
@@HoffmanReproductions I understand that, however sometimes it just isn't possible to find a reliable supply or even an affordable price as shipping costs kills it pretty quick.
@@turtlewolfpack6061 pitching in my two cents. I tried shooting a frontier style flintlock rifle with pyrodex recently and it WOULD NOT ignite. I wore down my flint trying to get it to go off. It's safe, but "poor performance" doesn't describe it in my case, it simply wouldn't work. It may be worth it for you to try it, but keep your expectations low.
@@bubbleheadft That's been the problem with Pyrodex since it came out in the 1980's. A work-around was to use BP as priming and as an igniter charge for the Pyrodex load, but that's so much of a hassle you might as well use BP to begin with.
Both work good. I like 3 f for priming. Some guys feel they get better accuracy with 3 f rather than 2. If 2 f works well i your 62, I would say stick with it. Thanks for watching!
I shot percussion guns left-handed with very little issue it would be the same as a double barrel percussion shotgun either way the lock is near your face how would this be shooting as a lefty
Most guys I know that shoot, consider whatever hand is pressing the trigger denotes left or right handed gun as the lock is set up to follow that. However, I know some that prefer to shoot a left handed gun being right handers. So, no rules really.
Very very nice! I’d like to to get one on order. Please reply to my email and let’s see what you’re backlog looks like. Much more success for you and your wife!
As a first time viewer, I enjoyed your presentation & the fine lookin' gun. Wish though you would have shown some good CLOSEUPS of your gun. Nothing beats some good "lusty closeups" of a gun!! Your beautiful "wooded backdrop" was quite a pleasure to see! Your Bible verse "indicates" you could be a Born Again Christian in Jesus Christ!!! Then you would know the "Salvation message" that only by FAITH in the shed blood of Jesus Christ & what HE did for YOU on the cross will get you to eternity in Heaven! I was SAVED on April 24th, 1978 & am a proud member of a fine Independent Fundamental Baptist Church in far north central Illinois. Looking forward to seeing more good gun videos again. I think I will now become a new & happy SUBSCRIBER! "Hallalujah" und "Gesundheit" und pass da LUTEFISK poleaze!
Also, yes Sir. I've been a proud follower of Jesus Christ since I was 8 years old. My hope is the Bible verses will help minister to those that are lost. Thanks so much again for watching!
Don't get so high and mighty Ardshiel. As one who shot these things for close to 40 years let me tell you if you haven't made the mistakes yet of loading a ball with no powder, or shooting your ramrod downrange, or loading the thing TWICE without realizing it (Until you pull the trigger!) let me tell you, one day you will. Me? Two out of the three. We all make mistakes.
I've been shooting flintlocks for over 40 years. Sometimes things just don't go the way we wanted them to go. He could have edited out that part of the video, but he didn't. I appreciate his honesty. But, you go ahead and criticize if that's what makes you happy.
Each gun is different. You just have to experiment and see what works best is what I have found. Generally, .45 cal and under use 3f. Above .45 cal. 2 or 1 F. Not a rule however.
I load my Brown Bess carbine the same way! I usually get a lecture from folks for not loading it “period correct” with a .69 ball and paper wadding. I could never get decent accuracy with that load so I switched to the .735 ball and a cork or fiber wad over the ball.
Oh my, yes some folks get worked up about things of that nature. In a smooth bore, if it works and it is safe, stick with it I say! Nice to meet you here Jake. Used your powder method today. I used about 1/2 a teaspoon of quebracho bark powder to the BP putty before graining. Works like the dextrin but no fouling trouble. Funny, it seems for every guy there is a different "recipe" for powder lol! Lots of fun!
@@HoffmanReproductions glad to hear it! I hope it works for you.
Having fun is what its all about. Patches work great in the smoothies.
Very cool video. You may start a new craze for Ranger pattern muskets. New sub.
Thanks so much! We'll see! We appreciate your subscription!
This is excellent; don't see enough of this sort of history preserved; thank you.
Thank you Matt! Really grateful for your viewing!
Concerning cut-down Brown Besses you might find this interesting.
Now I forget where I read this, or maybe a British friend of mine who was into muzzle-loading told me, but back in the 1790's the British Army tried an experiment of cutting down a Brown Bess to see where the performance of the musket fell off. (They used what was called a ballistic pendulum as a target, no chronographs in those days!) Long story short they cut the barrel down to 28 inches before they noticed a substantial performance drop, so they knew then they really didn't need to make the barrels as long as they did. However, the standard 42" barrel length was kept anyway strictly for "reach" in bayonet fighting and defense against cavalry. Barrel lengths wouldn't shorten until the smokeless powder era.
Very cool! Thank you for sharing!
@@HoffmanReproductions You're welcome! There's a lot of history behind the Brown Bess, especially with the legendary Colonial Rangers of all kinds!
(Roger's Rangers weren't the only ones, just the most famous. Not that they didn't deserve their fame!)
I wonder if you would have seen this done more often to the captured French arms, due to the widespread usage of those in light infantry units due to size and the issues the British were having on fielding muskets. Especially after the fall of Louisbourg and the capture of many firelocks.
@@mikef3808 In the British Army I'd doubt it, it would have complicated ammunition supply. However it wouldn't have been unusual to find captured French arms used by American militia or provincial units up to and including the period of the Revolution.
Possibly British personnel assigned to garrison duties and not likely to be used in field service may have been issued captured French muskets, but I'm not sure on that.
Shorter muskets present a problem with linear formations/tactics, where there are two ranks of soldiers.....and this is probably why muskets stayed so long, even through the US Civil War. If shorter muskets are used, then then rear rank muskets muzzles would be much closer to the front rank soldier's ears, as if standard length muskets weren't loud enough. Just my thoughts.
Would a shorter brown bess have less power or muzzle velocity than a longer one?
Excellent video brother... I’ve a pedersoli “Bess”. And it’s one of my go to pieces for everything... Greetings from NW Missouri...
Thank you! A Bess is a great choice!
Excellent presentation! Exigent shooting. I like the history,on the Ranger Brown Bess Musket.I hope to have one of these one day.Do you hunt with any of these guns.I have hunted with a 50 cal muzxloder..David Back Menifee county Kentucky.
I just shoot for fun but many Folks do still hunt with them. Still as effective today as they were 250 years ago. Thank you for watching and glad you like it!
How did you stain and finish the wood and metal on that gun. It looks very nice
How can I purchase one of these? Been trying to find a repro that Stark might have carried. This being tied to Rogers Rangers this might be relevant
They are basically a 1st model Bess that has been cut down or "bobbed" as it was called during the 1700's. We sell & build Brown Bess muskets. Please feel free to check out our website at www.hoffmanreproductions.com Thanks!
It is VERY rare to see anyone using a correct off hand position. You keep your head up and the bring the stock straight back into your shoulder. This is what we taught to our students at FLETC. If I may make a suggestion, after bringing the butt stock straight back into the shoulder more butt plate contact (and therefore more shooting comfort) can be attained by raising the right elbow high as possible (Above the horizontal at least) and then leaning into the weapon much like a trap or skeet shooter. By using those two suggestions you will experience full butt plate contact. 😀
Thanks Kent! Much appreciated Sir!
How is the bayonet lug attached to the barrel? I am thinking about shortening a Pedersoli Bess. Would I need to solder on a new lug?
Yes Sir you would need to re solder it or braze. Some like to cut a very slight dovetail for it in a addition to soldering.
@@HoffmanReproductions Thank you.
I assumed Roger’s Rangers used Pennsylvania long rifles
They did use rifles, but brown Bess muskets, both cut down and full sized filed the ranks by and large.
Excellent!!!
Thank ya!
That's pretty quick ignition.
Did you have to do much to the lock to get it to work that fast?
Also what drill size did you use for the touch-hole?
Yes Sir, did a lot of work on her. 1/16" on the touch hole.
I was wondering which size .70 caliber ball were you shooting? Thanks.
Hi Tom, .730 or .73 cal. The gun is technically a .75 cal. I just like the easy loading of a smaller ball and up to 50-75 yards, gives good accuracy.
@@HoffmanReproductions Thank you.
Would it be possible.....would the weapon still be viable.......if it were shortened further, say to and inch or so forward of the front sling swivel? Are there any historical writings about this being done, either intentional or to muskets that had been damaged? Thanks.
There is period reference to muskets being bobbed or cut down as we say now. Yes Sir, it would still be a usable gun. How short was the shortest ever done, not sure.
Dang… I want one of these.
Thank you!
I know I'm a little late to the party but had a couple questions. Would this kind of carbine have been used during the french and Indian war? Also how did you cut the barrel down for the project
Yes Sir it would have. Some Light Infantry units and others, cut down or "bobbed" their muskets to make them shorter and lighter during the 1750's.
@@HoffmanReproductions thank you very much for the reply. How do you find a shorter barrel for these muskets
Hey Brandon, Loyalist Arms sells the gun but I cut down a full sized one just like the old boys during the 1700's did when building them new for guys. Your welcome!
@@HoffmanReproductions thank you very much. I'm thinking about doing a traditional hunt dressed like a person in the french and Indian war. I'm thinking this may be the best version of the Bess to use on that hunt. You have definitely earned a sub from me
I have a "captured " 1728 Charlyville musket that I am thinking about cutting down to woodsrunner length.
I figure to move the front barrel band back to where the second barrel band is. That would get rid of the sling swivel and shorten the musket by about 10 inches.
Should be a fun project.
I would then Brown the barrel and barrel bands.
I am probably going to restain the stock too.
I am working towards a 1750s ranger look.
I still have to drill the touch hole and tune the lock. I want to shoot it a bit before I do anything major too it.
One step at a time. I can cut it but I can't un-cut it, if you know what I mean.
What is it's barrel's length?
36"
Is it safe to use pyrodex in these reproductions? With the lack of availability of actual blackpowder in some areas it would be good.
Yes it can be used. However, I would recommend real BP. Pyrodex tends not to give the best performance in flintlocks at lest in my experience. It would be worth trying to find some or traveling to where it can be purchased.
@@HoffmanReproductions I understand that, however sometimes it just isn't possible to find a reliable supply or even an affordable price as shipping costs kills it pretty quick.
@@turtlewolfpack6061 pitching in my two cents. I tried shooting a frontier style flintlock rifle with pyrodex recently and it WOULD NOT ignite. I wore down my flint trying to get it to go off.
It's safe, but "poor performance" doesn't describe it in my case, it simply wouldn't work. It may be worth it for you to try it, but keep your expectations low.
@@bubbleheadft That's been the problem with Pyrodex since it came out in the 1980's. A work-around was to use BP as priming and as an igniter charge for the Pyrodex load, but that's so much of a hassle you might as well use BP to begin with.
Is this from Loyalist arms or military heritage?
Loyalist.
Great video
Thank you!
Good vedio, why 3 f , I use 2 in my .62 , is any cleaner than 2?
Both work good. I like 3 f for priming. Some guys feel they get better accuracy with 3 f rather than 2. If 2 f works well i your 62, I would say stick with it. Thanks for watching!
Should use 2f powder and the paper as the wad as was done in the 18th Century.
Cool
I shot percussion guns left-handed with very little issue it would be the same as a double barrel percussion shotgun either way the lock is near your face how would this be shooting as a lefty
Most guys I know that shoot, consider whatever hand is pressing the trigger denotes left or right handed gun as the lock is set up to follow that. However, I know some that prefer to shoot a left handed gun being right handers. So, no rules really.
Hey Ben, just purchased one just watching your video, is the sling a regular brown bess sling? Thank you sir! Roy...
Cool! You'll have fun with it! The sling is one I made. Thanks!
I wish i had a property like yours to shoot my muskets...
Hey you make these?
Yes Sir I do.
Can I talk over email
@@dylancolucci4360 Sure. hoffmanreproductions@yahoo.com
good info!
Thank you!
That is awesome! Is that an original piece?
Thank you! No, reproduction I built for one of our customers.
Very very nice! I’d like to to get one on order. Please reply to my email and let’s see what you’re backlog looks like. Much more success for you and your wife!
Thank you Joe! Will be in touch via email on Monday. All the best, Ben
I'm sure this musket would even have a place in Hawaii. And why not? It should be much easier to own and use in paradise compared to other firearms.
Just as fun there I'm sure!
Your kit is of first rate
Thank you!
As a first time viewer, I enjoyed your presentation & the fine lookin' gun. Wish though you would have shown some good CLOSEUPS of your gun. Nothing beats some good "lusty closeups" of a gun!! Your beautiful "wooded backdrop" was quite a pleasure to see! Your Bible verse "indicates" you could be a Born Again Christian in Jesus Christ!!! Then you would know the "Salvation message" that only by FAITH in the shed blood of Jesus Christ & what HE did for YOU on the cross will get you to eternity in Heaven! I was SAVED on April 24th, 1978 & am a proud member of a fine Independent Fundamental Baptist Church in far north central Illinois. Looking forward to seeing more good gun videos again. I think I will now become a new & happy SUBSCRIBER! "Hallalujah" und "Gesundheit" und pass da LUTEFISK poleaze!
Thanks for watching! We have some new musket videos planned in the near future. Will be sure to have a few close up shots. Thanks again!
Also, yes Sir. I've been a proud follower of Jesus Christ since I was 8 years old. My hope is the Bible verses will help minister to those that are lost. Thanks so much again for watching!
?
Vladimir Putin!
Huylo !!
Attempts to prime then realises his priming horn is empty, learn the Craft Boy then walk the talk.
Horn still had powder in it. After the filming, I found a small amount of powder had plugged the tip as it was a very hot and humid day.
Don't get so high and mighty Ardshiel. As one who shot these things for close to 40 years let me tell you if you haven't made the mistakes yet of loading a ball with no powder, or shooting your ramrod downrange, or loading the thing TWICE without realizing it (Until you pull the trigger!) let me tell you, one day you will.
Me? Two out of the three.
We all make mistakes.
I've been shooting flintlocks for over 40 years. Sometimes things just don't go the way we wanted them to go. He could have edited out that part of the video, but he didn't. I appreciate his honesty. But, you go ahead and criticize if that's what makes you happy.
Great video
Thanks!
How do you decide on Fg size per particular flintlock. I would have thought 1F or maybe 2F. ?
Each gun is different. You just have to experiment and see what works best is what I have found. Generally, .45 cal and under use 3f. Above .45 cal. 2 or 1 F. Not a rule however.