Who's the real UFC P4P? | WEIGHING IN
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
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Big John McCarthy and Josh "The Punk" Thomson discuss the recent comments made by Dana White on the current pound for pound rankings.
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The problem with the whole conversation is p4p wasn’t even part of the question. The guy asked about Islam and his place in the greatest lightweights. Dana for whatever reason injected p4p, and popped a jones hard on.
Pin it!
Dana acts like Jones (84' reach) didn't have more size advantage vs DC (72' reach) compared to Makhachev (70' reach) and Volk (71' reach) size difference. Volk himself said he is heavier than Lightweight Dan during fight day.
@@timurjack8773 not to mention it’s not even objective. “Here’s what would happened if we locked the two of them in a room!”
“Okay, cool. Let’s lock the two of them into the octagon.”
“Sorry, nope. Got to lock him in there with stipe.”
Dana: "Put 'em in a room. Who walks out?" Put Jon & Aspinall in a cage. Who walks out? *Lol* Jon ain't P4P1 even by Dana's criteria.
Reyes and Usada beats JJ . JJ ducking Aspinal...
Reyes lost to Jon jones.
@@Cnote779 dana believes Reyes won that fight.. including the whole world, pro journalist, media...
Cry all you want. The only three people that matters says that jones won. Dom had him and dom took his foot off the gas
@@Naksu..jones destroyed Reyes the last three rounds easily won the fight
@@davidmartinez2833 ok wife beater
It is hard for me to understand how people,even big John😂😂... can say JJ is UNDEFEATED....if you break the rule, then you lost... USING DRUG IS CHEATING...simple as that... if we all acknowlegde CHEATING..then for sure,it will be CHAOS in this world...ops,it is already has😂😂😂
1. He popped later in his career. 2. All the other fighters used stuff too
@@stevend481 1.nice point you got here pal🤣..that just meant, 'did he used DRUGS in his previous fight& got lucky?????' I think i can make that case ya...i can 'assume' he use DRUGS in ALL his fight, but only got cought twice...TWICE...🤣🤣🤣...my assumption is not an absurd one ya,coz we have CASES....
2. Tell that to GSP, KHABIB...theylll choke you for sure🤣🤣🤣...this generalization only exist in JJ fanboy...want to make a case for their boy..to make WRONG into RIGHT...thats an absurd claim pal
@deunfortunated that's all speculation and no proof bud. If no evidence then means nothing. We do know for sure Chael Vitor Shogun were all on stuff. JJ has the best strength of schedule. Most title defenses ever
@@stevend481 of course its speculation...but im just using your standard...coz you accusing GSP, KHABIB & others using DRUGS..WITHOUT PROOF..... im just pointing your point is absurd bro 🤣🤣
@@stevend481 title defense????? Sorry, just like REAL SPORT...if you cought cheating,your record NULL..your medal taken back....so,im just applying the SAME STANDARD... so JJ means NOTHING...🤣🤣
*Activity,*
*Recent competition*
Olivera - Volk - Volk - Dustin
VS
Anthony Smith -Thiago Santos - Dominik Reyes - Cirel Gane
Jones DUCKING Aspinal, the interim champ. Makhachev not ducking jack.
Makachev ducking arman
@meatrocket6979 , Makhachev beat Arman when Makhachev wasn't healthy in the 1st fight, Makhachev still won. Then Makhachev accepted a rematch with Arman 2 times, but Arman refused 2 times to rematch Makhachev. Arman could fight Makhachev instead Poirier.
@@timurjack8773 Ofcourse arman refused why would he take another short notice fight against Islam he needs full camp for title shot he doesn’t want to make same mistake volk made Islam is avoiding that rematch at all costs arman his toughest fight right now
@@meatrocket6979He beat him already. Said he'll beat him again in his last post fight interview. Don't lie.
@@meatrocket6979Ah. So a healthy AT literally declining to fight Islam twice isn't ducking to you. Islam saying he'll fight AT again if needed but his first preference is new competition? To you, that's ducking. Got it, got it lol. You're one of those guys eh. What a shame.
Dana wasn't asked about islam being pfp José youngs asked him about islam in lightweight history and dumb dana couldn't hold himself from incerting jon just to promote his fight against stipe
Jones fought middle weights at lhw
Machida, Jackson, Gus, Rashad. Shogun etc....
Smaller Aging guys on their way out of the sport at that time while he was getting to his prime juiced to the stratosphere and after he got back with active USADA he got beat by Reyes and arguably Santos who aren't at the top LHW right now at all and couldn't finish Smith and almost got DQued cause his du.. a.. kneed him illegally.
Couldn’t agree more
@@peacefuldecadence328that’s alot of hate for someone who hasn’t accomplished anything in life!!
Sure, DC who was a heavyweight champ, was a middleweight. Got it
Remember from now on if you bring up Jones failed test so he’s not the best, remember by your standards your boy Usman Nurmagomedov, doesn’t matter how good he gets he can never be the best. keep that same energy.
Cringe
usman never took steroide, since when u see someone took steroide and gets to keep his belt !! just cringe !
Jones lost to Reyes and fought mostly undersized opponents in one of the weakest divisions. Also, people have been calling out Usman for showing potential signs of being on roids.
@@moriyokiri3229 Cope.
Keep that same energy 😂😂 spoken like a true spastic
Francis went to a decision with Cyril
What you talking about
People remember that Anthony Smith fight all wrong. Jon completely destroyed him and it was so effortless. Jon lost two points for the illegal knee and still didn’t lose the round. It wasn’t a close fight at all.
Still, Pictures cheated multiple times
But he lost to Reyes and almost lost to One-Legged Santos. Defeated Light Heavyweight’s that were short and small for the weight class. When he fought ppl close to his size he didn’t look that great. Can’t finish fighters with his fists despite taking all the steroids in the world.
That said he should have been disqualified. Smith made the choice to continue which is his choice and Jones won. Felt he lost the Reyes fight clearly though but I haven't watched it back.
Cheating, steroids, inactivity, and even when he was active he only fought 1 time in a year! What are we talking about! Jon was the first UFC super star! Nobody is taking that away from him! But even getting your hand raised and you know you have taking juice is an absolutely disgrace! And we are not talking about a mistake from a Doc or he accidentally took a small dosage from a pill!
A sadistic ceremony performed on smith by Jones. Anthony loves it so much but less than when glover did it to him
What is the criteria for the pound for pound best? Unitl that is established these conversations are a matter of opinon.
P4p is based on equal sizes who would be better. But acting like Jones (84' reach) doesn't have more size advantage than DC (72' reach) compared to Makhachev (70' reach) and Volk (71' reach) difference makes no sense.
What about the Reyes fight. You could argue that he got the best of Jones but judges didn't see it that way.
Didn’t Jon tear a pec? Whats the recovery and rehab time on an injury like that?
6 months but it's he's first time... He's never got injured and now he's showing signs of such long career... JJ has been in ufc before USADA came into picture 😂...
Fax he’s gotta be 35-36 by now. I get why he isn’t chasing an aspinall fight too. No money in it lol. Stipe, even tho he is prolly washed is still one of the greatest HWs of all time and can solidify a legacy.
No it is not like that too... It is about being active... It can b like if jon had more fights in these 4 years may b he may have a loss and that would put him below Islam... It is all about "current time" not what he did back then... It is about who is no 1 p4p "now"..
You can't flip the coin to one side and say because of this. I don't think Jones being at a different weight class changes the work he would put in to be the best or just natural talent he has to do so. If Islam was heavyweight would he be as well rounded grappler? We don't know this from the acclaimed analogy heavyweights don't try to be superior wrestlers. You could dispute Jones would be the might mouse of lightweight division.
Islam is P4P rn. Jon Jones GOAT. Why we’re all still debating this is beyond me.
They need to SuperFight it out.
Facts from big john
EZ: The champ is back so strip Aspinal's interim title 🤷♂️
Listen guys! When Jon Jones was in his prime, there are no one Dagestani Fighters in UFC. And guys, listen! Do you know Adlan Amagov vs Jon Jones sparring ☝️☝️☝️🦁So guys, if Jon Jones Fought Emelianenko in his prime, Fedor would kill him
He was pretty explosive when he head kicked the fuck out of DC Josh
If Islam and Jon are stuck in a room and only one can come out of that room who comes out? Jon Jones in one minute.
Make it 155 or 170. You dare to say Jon gonna walk out again?
“khabib never looked human” jon has also had more title fights than khabib did total ufc fights🧐 tell the whole story
Jones took PEDs and *that* is his story
Jones is Greatest in UFC Ever but Khabib & Islam other Level
At the time Gane was the best. Francis was gone. Jones beating him was more impressive vs anything Islam has done.
If you put Islam at heavyweight he gets walked through by Jones
Even Stipe Beats him
fools. like playing cards with my brother’s kids. you measure a guy’s size by the lowest weight class they can make. from there, you measure how big they can win. Could JBJ make 205 anymore? doubt it
If Islam moves up he will be facing Leon Edwards, a good striker, but who is also ranked P4P#3 because he has good wrestling defense; a more complete fighter.
But where was Ciryl Gane ranked in the P4P rankings when Jon fought him? Jon waited for Francis to leave and returned to fight the easiest most incomplete fighter in the hw top 5. And now instead of unifying the title, he’s ducking Tom to fight semi-retired, fulltime firefighter grandpa Stipe.
GOATs/P4P👑s don't duck to fight elderly folks. 👎
Poke your eyes out
So John is going to ignore Tank's appearance on JRE? Probably a whole lot of truth was spoken then.
Unsubscribed
Does it matter who is p4p #1 do they get a pay bonus or something like who gives a shit
…
Jon “steroids cheat” Jones. No goat. GSP sure. Jon got away w cheating for a while
alex won two titles before islam fought twice
I agree with dana most times. But not with this
Josh is p4p for that commercial 😂
The reason why ppl can put jones over khabib as goat was because of the striking… well guess who’s very good at striking… Islam… ISLAM P4P #1
BIG JOHN IS NEVER RIGHT.
ALWAYS WRONG BIG JOHN.
This is just lame. The lower weight classes are much better and have 10x times more black belts as well. Jon should have stopped being P4P number 1 in 2018 once Khabib became the champ. And Jon has fought once during the last 4 years against Gane who has done MMA for 4 years. Islam has fought 8 times during the last 3 years and finished every single opponent during this time period by beating P4P top fighters.
Forget about black belts, even Pereira got some belts. The simple arguments is; divisions between 135-170 has each around 80 ufc fighters, 155 division even has around 100 ufc fighters. While 205 and 265 divisions have around 40 ufc fighters compete. More people compete = harder to win. Since not every MMA fighter can fight in ufc, they need to be on some decent level to sign with ufc so more ufc fighters = harder to win. Winning 155 belt 1 time is like equal to winning 205 belt 3 times. If Pereira was 155 size, he couldn't be champ at 155.
@@timurjack8773 That's actually a very good point and a lot of knowledge right there. Surprised that nobody has brought this up in such details. There's certainly something about how you can get away with being less technical from 185 and onto heavyweight with little experience and knowledge about MMA. Even the lower weight classes have 3-5 degree jiu jitsu black belts as Oliveira, Pettis, Nate, Nick, BJ penn, Maia, RDA amongst others and jiu jitsu champions unlike the higher weight classes, which only has Glover who is a 2 degree jiu jitsu black belt and it stops there.
Islam barely beat Volk the first time. Arguably lost
@stevend481 , when its arguably 49-46 Makhachev winning on Australia despite 24 hours rehydration time disadvantage (less rehydration time = advantage for smaller fighter), definitely Makhachev didn't lose.
1. P4P and GOAT is two different conversations.
2. The reporter asked how does Islam rank amongst the greatest lightweights of all time. He said nothing about P4P. Dana somehow turned it into a P4P discussion
3. P4P is based on current activity, so Dana lost this battle before he even started. End of discussion. Islam is the #1 P4P
dana was waiting for a chance to promote his psychopath.
If Islam and Jon are stuck in a room and only one can come out of that room who comes out? Jon Jones in one minute.
And with gorilla
Jon Jones is much bigger, it's called pound for pound.
Are your parents related?
No Jon cums out due to 12-6 elbows
Room fight has no rules, if one of them uses a weapon than anyone can win by using a weapon. Also p4p means ''if they were same size''.
Pretty sure the reporter only asked where Islam stands amongst the greatest lightweights and mentioned nothing about p4p. Dana randomly went on a rant about Jones being p4p.
I love the response from Firas Zahabi on this “If anyone tested positive once, they should be stripped of all their achievements”. I know some people might say all of them take roids. Well, prove that, innocent until proven guilty for me!
Hey man if you wanna live life with your eyes closed cuz it makes things more pleasant go for it brotha
@@giovanniperez4131 Hey bud, I know its incomprehensible for people like you to even think that there are people out there for whom God comes before everything and then dignity. I know it’s unthinkable for you that people like Islam or Khabib wouldn’t cheat to become champions because winning isn’t everything for them. So, you’re the one with closed eyes not us.
Is it specifically a sin to take steroids? Lot of room for interpretation when it comes to religion and spirituality…
@@giovanniperez4131 that’s again another common misconception. No room for individual interpretation in Islam.
@@Xathos-cl9px so what does the religion of Islam specifically say about steroid use?
Islam is the King of ufc p4p1
What happened was a lack of respect from the company's manager on the day his employee won the award for the best consecutive employee in his department.
When asked about the status of this employee among other great employees in his department, he began his answer by praising another employee in a different department.
Exactly took.all spot light from islam.
Just watched tank abbott’s JRE. Tank loves John McCartney!
I see you even got the name he called him lol and I get you sarcasm after watching a clip
Islam is P4P #1
End of the discussion! 🤝
Fight for it
Steroids 😂
No he isn’t phag
@stangovation6459
Oh... Jones, the guy who fought 1 time in over 3 or 4 years, same guy DUCKING the interim champ, is your P4P #1? Why not the guy who knocked out the former P4P#1 to become the P4P#1??
Jones lost to Reyes
this is why you can’t always say Dana is doing what Promoters do. is say their guys are the best but both guys are his guys..
"Nobody has really ever beat him", well, except Reyes. Clearly
No what about hammil he beat him by tko I believe it said it on his record on sherdog
Wasn't clear. Jon won
JJ is not tge GOAT. Cheaters are not goats
They're all cheaters. Both have popped for roids
Islam has openly agreed they got enhancement throughout their amateur career in Russia and they didn't even know it... Go do some research... Giving enhancement at such young age will give them huge advantage because there's already evidence it enhance growth for lifetime...
All those Dag fighters are very clearly on PED’s too. Grow up , open your eyes , majority of guys are probably running some sort of exogenous help…
@@THUGPUTINthe truth man. A lot of folks still in the dark tho…
@@not_your_mailman8410exactly
Dana just promoting his fighter because i think john jones probaly put the clause in his contract that he must be called GOAT and P4P.😂😂😂
The whole P4P topic was never as big when Volkanovski was P4P No.1, now it is Islam and the drama has begun. Typical American/USA ... behavior
WATCH STIPE KO JON. THAT WILL BE HUMILIATION 😂😂
Dana is doing a media tour trying to hype the Jones Stipe fight because on ones to see it, and hes bringing down his greatest champion while he does it.
Interim belts should never be defended
True. But I believe this is JON's last fight in the UFC and he decided to fight Stipe before the interim title. I believe Jon's career allows him to decide his last fight which he sees as an Accolade he wants. Beeting Stipe who is xonsidered the best heavyweight in history of the UFC is more valuable then beating Aspinal. Remember he had 10s of "The one who will beat Jon" and none of them did it.
Remember when arlovski and Barao kept defending the interim bel?
If he wants legacy fights instead of #1 contender fights he should be stripped
Reyes ran through Jones and so did steroids a hundred times
Ran through? Relax😂
Need to hear Johns response to Tank Abbott
But he was talking about some guy named a john McCartney 😂
John said everything tank said was absolutely right and true
JOSH IS RIGHT. JONES WAS DQ'D HES NOT UNDEFEATED.
I don't know how dana turn to be stupid like that and disrescpectful to our minds and to makhachev to discuss thing like that
I rescpect whatvjohn did but he doesn't deserve te be put in top 5 p4p
You have peds, controversial decisions can't be be pound for pound. Dana is trying to hold on to his only American cash cow. If no peds and possible losses to Reyes, Santos no goat talk. Gsp, khabib soon Islam and fedor are goat considerations
Keep being a Homer for AKA, Josh, because me too.👊👊
UFC and Dana white aka Shrek is playing games with p4p fighter things . And is to promote Jon fight that is coming.
Islam Makachev, The King of P4P. but Khabib Nurmagomedov is The G.O.A.T , Undisputed Dagestan's Legacy.🇷🇺✌️
Come on guys. It’s not rocket science. Dana is promoting jones vs stipe.
Jon Jones shouldn't be allowed in out sport. He's a proven cheater. Failed for a an anabolic and two post cycle drugs. A long with 3 testosterone tests which showed his natural testosterone was extremely low almost as low as a castrated male... he was juicing hard. Also Islam has been active and on a tear. Sure put up a good fight but Islam got the finish. Jon was literally gifted a decision over Reyes just a few fights ago.
Cheating aside. Do you honestly think if a natty prime Jones took his skill set down to 155 he's beating Khabib? How?
Jon’s take is spot on 💯.
Accurate 🎯
Islam is P4P KING. Anyone with a brain knows this 🔥
Very disrespectful to Islam. Dana is a POS for that. Islam saved that card.
Volk weighed more on the first fight. Dana sold that fight as "winner gets pfp#1".
Dana didnt have a problem them Kamaru or Volk was pfp#1... whats rhe problem now?! Danas definition is wrong pfp is not a GOAT list.
Dana didn't sell the fight as "winner gets p4p#1"... he doesn't do the rankings... it's the media who vote on the rakings.
Wtf lmfao the Michael Vick betus ad got me ahhaa
John Is spot On. Currently, An Islam same weight class as Jon is better, but A PEAK JON would kill a Peak Anyone.
If you’re talking pound 4 pound nothing else then Islam and even Tom aspinall are well ahead of Jon you can’t have someone who’s fought once in 4 years as p4p when you have active fighters
Unpopular opinion: jon jones beat a bunch of former Champs that were around 10 years older than him ~25 > ~35
He has a few very impressive wins like machida
I think GSP despite being a "boring point fighter" who "has 2 losses" that he vindicated is the greatest of all time. Also where's the mighty mouse love??
Shogun was 29 when Jon beat him. Rampage, Machida, and Rashad were still in their early 30’s. Glover was in his prime and on a 20 fight win streak. Not to mention Jon was doing this at 23-25 when most fighters that age are still being coddled and protected. Jon didn’t get the long drawn out build up you’re seeing with guys like O’Malley and Paddy. No matter what his first championship reign can’t be downplayed.
@antw9770 nah shogun had a lot of miles under his belt, look at his record post jon jones fight. Also there's a 6 year age gap which makes a difference. Rampage is pretty self explanatory so is the glover one although glover did fight until he was old as dirt and was still successful
@@antw9770 Rashads record post jon is even worse tbh
@@TheFancyCrawdad Their record after a fight doesn’t diminish what happened that night. As fans of this sport we know one fight can change a fighter. Is Gaethje’s win over Ferguson less impressive now? What about Frankie’s win over BJ. And the age is what makes the run more impressive. Do you think 23 year olds have the advantage over 30-34 year olds? Why do you think O’Malley wasn’t getting ranked fighters earlier? You act like there’s just tons of 25 and under champions in the UFC. Let’s also not forget that was Shogun coming off his best UFC performance when he dusted Machida and Jon took the fight on short notice.
@antw9770 I believe unless your chin goes yeah your record after means a lot it shows you were on a start of a decline with that loss. True most become champs closer to 30 but it's also true many fighters start to fall off in their early 30s. Don't forget I said this would be an unpopular opinion. I never cared for jones and always thought he was talented obviously just over rated (again my unpopular opinion) I think the people he fought were not washed but diminishing except for a few examples like machida & dc which are great wins. Also makes sense he would see a chance to move up the least skilled division where wrestlers dominate & fight a guy with no wrestling to become champ.
Its not about if everyone weighs the same, its no matter what your weight is, who would beat everybody no matter what they weigh. Like the Kieth Hackney fight, minus the rabbit punches...
The devisional skill gap needs to be mentioned as well. Jones moving up to the worst devision and beating a 1D fighter isn't impressive. Jones' wins at LHW are not as impressive as any Islam win at LW.
JONES IS #1 BULL$HIT
Jones style is the Kryptonite to Islams style... even If they were the same size, Jones would neutralize and stuff all of Islam's takedowns, when have grapplers ever done well against jones? NEVER, in terms of striking Jones is more creative and more versatile and has a way better chin, Not to mention Jones adaptability and fight IQ. Jones is a bad matchup for Islam.
Youre talking about Jon Jones. Have some respect to the GOAT.
1. Dana: "Put 'em in a room. Who walks out?" K. Put Jon & Aspinall in a cage. Who walks out? *crickets* Jon ain't P4P1 by Dana's own criteria.
2. Check the rankings. Islam is the P4P1. He beat the last P4P1 *twice* to get it. Jon may be the GOAT but he ain't P4P1 right now. He's the guy who makes Stipe noises if asked to fight Aspinal.
3. The actual P4P definition: who wins in a fight if both guys are physically equivalent (e.g. height, size, weight, etc)? To answer this hypothetical, we compare their skillsets. Judging by their skillsets, Islam probably beats Jon in a fight (right now).
on point 🔥🔥
If you could shrink Jones down to the smaller weight classes, these figures would represent his height.
middleweight 6' 1.3"
welterweight 5' 11.3"
lightweight 5' 9.1"
featherweight 5' 7.6"
bantamweight 5' 6.0"
flyweight 5' 4.3"
If you’re going by their last fight, then you’ve got to call Holloway the p4p. Now if you go for p4p goat Islam is not in the top 10. As impressive as Islam has been in his fights he just haven’t put in the quality body of work. 155 imo is old minus tsurkyan. A lot of miles on those top fighters. Dustin had to dig deep against st. Denis. If we go off current fights I’d say Alex is the p4p. If you look at career, how many fights has jones had 5 round title fights? What year was his past 3 rounder?
What is josh record in the ufc? Did he ever be champ? Cuz the way he riding islam D is crazyyyy😂
Jones beats every fighter in any era ppl that bring up usada don’t know how many people in islams camp including him popped😭😭😭
😂😂😂😂 Did Jones threaten to beat up your mum or something?
@@RaptureCentralControl did Islam rape you?
If you’re going by their last fight, then you’ve got to call Holloway the p4p. Now if you go for p4p goat Islam is not in the top 10. As impressive as Islam has been in his fights he just haven’t put in the quality body of work. 155 imo is old minus tsurkyan. A lot of miles on those top fighters. Dustin had to dig deep against st. Denis. If we go off current fights I’d say Alex is the p4p
BBBBBSS!!
Stipe went through an entire training camp (not to mention working at the station whew!!!)
You're just going to throw stipe away like that?? You guys suck!!
I don’t have to listen to this one. I know the guys will advocate for Islam. Even if Jon had 5title defences at HW. They will bring the drug testing issues.
jones beat 3 generations of the top fighters with over a decade undefeated , until he officially retires, he is the P4P. Islam has been ko'd and hasn't had nearly enough time to build the resume he would need to match accomplishments with Jones
Everyone was riding volkd d%$ saying he was p4p and then he gets beat twice by islam then at lightweight. Now nobody even talks about him. Same thing will happen to islam.
Why are people arguing over this 😂. So childish lol. Arguing whonis better. Ones a heavy weight and the other is a lightweight. This p4p stuff is so bs
Are you guys really not going to respond to Tank Abbott talking all that crap about Big John and his wife on multiple podcast????
Can Islam make 145? No so Volk is smaller. Islam needs to beat more then 2 contenders.
Should be the champs next fight but Dana’s a fucking homer. Stipe should’ve been out of the rankings a long time ago
I still wonder if Khabib could woop Jon Jones ?? no weight to cut at all sooo that's a fight ide love to see that will never happen , I just want someone to shut that Jon Jones bullshit p4p for good
Jon Jones was taller than his opponent, 90% of the time 🤔 hmmm. Just ONE thing that's not logical 😂
Anatoly Malykhin 3 weight champion is the p4p best
Jones doesn't even fight
IF ISLAM BEATS LEON. HE WOULD HAVE BEATEN 3 DIFFERENT WEIGHT CHAMPS. OLIVERA, VOLK, LEON. NO ONE DID THIS.
So basically once they popped him his performance went down... Imagine that.
If Islam were HW would his skillset beat Aspinall?