I was concerned about her uptime but honestly it’s not that big of a deal, just feels a second shorter than Raiden’s. Plus it fits the theme of her overwhelming enemies with her speed rather than brute force like most carries.
Very lovely video with interesting ideas and teams that requires more skill than have right now. Also do you play HSR? If so, then who's your favorite character?
I love those niche creative Ideas, gonna try Kokorinde today. Just out of interesst, where is the case for Sarah over Fishl in the first Show comp? Isn't Fishl just more reactions and dmg?
You can see my follow up vid for Fischl including builds. This video was more of an "early ideas" vid since we will start discovering more as time goes on.
Honestly I found this point hilarious because like, I don't even see people having an issue for this for Arle There's also Cyno alhaitham and so many characters without this so, why is it specifically a clorinde issue?
I guess it's because her duration is too short, so dogding would end up with worse damage than most of the cases. Like, others just are longer and Arrle doesn't consume her Bol when she dodges.
@@see0707to be fair, arle often incorporates dash cancels into her kit, where for clorinde this would be a dps loss, and she often uses xingqiu clorindes healing and repositioning do help a lot though
Finally I have the feeling that they nerf her E duration is so she can work with Sara Yet every time I said so, those people reply back with “her multipliers is shit”
Like I get what you are saying, but can you do a more detailed breakdown about the interaction? I want to know more about the interaction other than "time it well". Also, no Nahida please - everyone does that.
In my latest vid I run a Nahida-less variant so check that out. I think my vid does a good job explaining it. You need to look at your jellyfish and BoL and determine when to press the inputs. Steps: It is not hard to lunge into a jellyfish (clear BoL) and get healed, press Clorinde Q and then you have BoL plus the second tick healing for more BoL before lunging again. Alternatively, you lunge into Jellyfish (clear all BoL, instantly press Alt + Q on Kokomi to refresh jellyfish, attack for 2-3 secs on Kokomi to heal everyone and then go Clorinde Q (gaining BoL to save up)/Other Abilities. In any case, Kokomi acts as a buffer, bloom spawner, healer and even tank.
i think this video is good and a unique take on the clorinde discourse, given no one i knew of was talking about the synergy. i know this is not a xingqiu video, but i feel like your points against using him over kokomi were a bit hand wavy, especially given his dmg reduction *is* extremely significant and so is his ir to some extent, his lack of aoe is offset by his vastly superior rate of hydro application, and his personal damage is notably above kokomi's in the same team. i feel like, while there is a lot of skill expression and even comfort in using kokomi, you could've made a bigger argument against him here
I have talked about Xingqiu a lot in the past and he is far less impressive than most people realise. There are a few old vids on this. The problem in hyperbloom is the inherent rate limit of 2 dendro cores per enemy so additional hydro application is not necessarily helpful. It really depends on situations but the caveat is that you have to normal attack with someone in order to get hydro app (whereas Kokomi gives it offield regardless) and otherwise you lose it. In fact, in a raw hydro application test on-field Kokomi wins (We have tested this against enemies and overworld constructs - see old vids). Kokomi with Ocean Hued Clam can definitely keep up with the dmg. You also need a lot of energy recharge since Xingqiu is the solo hydro (sac sword) whereas prototype amber helps Kokomi (her ER requirement is also less) with that and additonal healing which acts a cushion. Kokomi has faster animations and variable hydro app which allows for its own flexibility. I dont believe dmg reduction/interuption resistance is that big of a deal, especially against some bosses and enemies that will still cleave through it (see latest combat event). As you become more skilled, you weave in animations and i-frames and learn "roll recovery" from being knocked back. For slower playstyles or having a "key onfield carry" you can make the argument for Xingqiu, but in quickswap teams with animation cancels and burst i-frames that utility is nearly useless. That is my experience (coming from someone that has played Xingqiu since day 1). So feel free to disagree, but give specific examples because I have a ton as well.
@@KokomiClan i first want to clarify: i’m not talking about xingqiu vs kokomi in a general sense- only as related to clorinde quickbloom teams. i am aware and acknowledge many arguments for or against either unit in many teams, and i think the topic is nuanced and is open to interpretation. with that, xingqiu in this clorinde team has multiple upsides over kokomi, and a few downsides. i believe xingqiu in this team has better hydro application, more personal damage, better sustain for clorinde, and is more comfortable to play. i also see that xingqiu has lower quicken uptime and does not contribute to team sustain as well as kokomi does. (gonna counter some quick points here: xingqiu relying on normal attacks to apply hydro is not a limiting factor in clorinde teams, she likes to normal attack constantly. on field kokomi hydro application is next to irrelevant in this team. xingqiu requiring high er in this team is both not necessarily true, and is also not a downside [at c6, sac sword covers essentially all of his energy needs, and in clorinde xingqiu nahida fischl, non er weapon er reqs will be ~200%. this is not difficult to build for, so i do not see this as a noteworthy downside.] when comparing an off field xingqiu and kokomi’s hydro application (all future mentions of the two units refer to c6 and c0 respectively), kokomi applies hydro in a suitable aoe every 2 seconds, while xingqiu applies ~1.3/s against a single target w/o orbitals, and ~1.5 with 50% orbital uptime, which seems like a more realistic assumption. xingqiu, then, has higher hyperbloom and lower quicken uptime, which is at the very least a dps neutral tradeoff, dependent on number of targets and clorinde investment. kokomi notably does not significantly benefit from aoe hydro application past 2T (due to bloom dmg icd), and her hydro application suffers against a single target. xingqiu’s useful hydro app does not notably scale on the number of enemies. i want to stress that i do not believe that kokomi having aoe hydro makes her a better hydro applicator for clorinde in multi target, as xingqiu will still surpass her bloom count. xingqiu’s personal damage is significant, and is notably higher than an off field clam kokomi’s personal damage in this team. kokomi has some on field potential, but i still am not convinced that her on field damage *in this team* will eclipse xingqiu’s. clorinde gets extra bol from kokomi, which does marginally increase her damage. kokomi’s sustain in clorinde teams has a core issue: healing during her on field duration does not impact her hp directly. however, kokomi’s healing will lead to more lunges, which will indirectly incerase hp gain by a noticeable amount. however, i believe xingqiu’s damage reduction (and interrupt resistance to some extent) is superior to kokomi’s sustain in regards to her field time. xingiqu offers nearly 50% dmg reduction, which leads to clorinde effectively having a doubled hp bar (and healing, by extension, will take you twice as far), which will lead to a net increase over the bol increase offered by kokomi. this dmg reduction will persist the entire rotation, and is not gated to an aoe like jellyfish. i acknowledge that jellyfish is very possible to play around, but the convenience this offers is non-negligible. not being locked into a circle and having some ir for easier face tanking is also notable, as clorinde would be able to dash less in her on field time, but she isn’t as reliant on this ir as other characters are, such as hu tao. however, while xingqiu offers the same dmg reduction to the entire team, and i would personally find this team comfortable to pilot, kokomi does beat him out in sustaining the rest of the team, and can heal clorinde back up during off field time. to conclude, xingqiu and kokomi are both strong options in this team, and while no one unit is a direct upgrade over the other (while i have a preference), i think bringing up kokomi is important. she undoubtedly has synergy with clorinde, and offers an alternative playsytle that appeals to you and many other players. i also did not expect xingqiu to be a focus of this video, or for this much time to be spent talking about him. still, for the time you brought him up as another popular option, i don’t think the counterpoints you offered were strong enough to “ignore xingqiu”, because her hydro is aoe, among other points you made in the video. i do not think your video is claiming to completely disregard him, but the video, in my opinion, does not offer points that would suggest ghat this language be appropriate *regardless* of skill expression. i want to emphasize this last part, as your video does mention that a lot of this synergy really shines with skill and familiarity with kokomi, but my arguments in this critique do not hinge on the player being unable to perform their best with kokomi. thank you for taking the time to read my comment.
Right. I have recorded enough gameplay and will put out a vid on this tomorrow (or next 2 days) with a detailed VOD review on many different runs using the different teams. You can reply then on that vid. Your critical flaw in thinking is assuming Clorinde does the bulk of the dmg but that is also not true in a hyperbloom context as I will demonstrate and that the choice of Kokomi vs Xingqiu has other implications for the rotations and Clorinde downtime. Btw, I highly suggest you watch my vids on gacha probabilities to understand that a C6 four star IS NOT equiavent to a C0 5 star mathematically (avg 93.5 for a C0 5 star vs 250 for a C6 4 star). Hence the conversation should be around C1~2 vs C6 4 star, but that will literally not matter for tomorrow's vid in any case.
@@KokomiClan i'll wait, sure. i do wanna mention though, that while i usually agree with the "c6 4* is more expensive than a c0 5*" logic, 1. most of my points would still apply (notably, hydro app would differ somewhat) at lower cons, and 2. xingqiu has been given for free in 3 lantern rites, 1 event, has been in shop twice per year since launch, and is a 1.0 unit. he's also rate up on many banners, like the first kokomi banner. most players who have played over a year probably would have or would be close to c6 xingqiu, if they wanted to
Actually wrong again. Older players would have C6 but newer players will not due to the ever increasing pool of 4 stars and spreading out 4 stars. Additionally, your assumption is that people would waste around 7 wishes in the star glitter shop specifically on him when it is less optimal to do so by virue of waiting for an event. Again, just be careful because those assumptions are easy to challenge: New players having an abundance of rewards and early game primogems could easily get Kokomi to C1 even or other chracters like Furina. Let's stick to the mathematical argument since I can also bring attention to things like guarantees, free pink fates given out during monthly resets, primogems given out during all the events which will go to your favourite 5 star..., etc. All of this drastically reduces the number of wishes needed to get a limited 5 star .
I think you missed a chance for a teaser team with koko :( (even if its not meta) i hav seen a lot of showcase with dendro and overload teams... but a koko clorinde miko/fischl/beidou + anemo unit team where koko drives with burst and when koko burst ends clorinde is the driver. We need more koklorinde teams!!
i find quite funny how people complain about the time of her on field, when this character feels like a new way to use teamcomps. Keep on mind the game it's not finish yet and they are more characters to come who could make her even stronger. Personally i don't complain about it, i like how she was released and the fact Kokomi can help her it's a massive win for me. Btw 0:07 lmao 😂😂 the sarcasm and the way you move the cursor it's hilarious to me xD Edit: 3;12 What do you think about using Prototype Amber on Nahida on this team? i ask because i have seen some people saying that's a good way to heal the team without having a healer on it.
It can work but then you lose out on EM sharing via her passive plus Nahida ult takes forever. You also need to time it when Clorinde has no bond of life
@@KokomiClan I see, so that's preferible to not use it on that way, specially if i really want to not lose EM to share. Great, i'll pass from that option.
I actually didn’t expect him to say obviously Koko, god I’m f**king stupid 🤦🏾♂🍷
Lmao 🤣
I was concerned about her uptime but honestly it’s not that big of a deal, just feels a second shorter than Raiden’s. Plus it fits the theme of her overwhelming enemies with her speed rather than brute force like most carries.
Thank you for all the beautiful information
Our pleasure!
Dont have Clorinde but I love Kokomi so here I am 😊
Same , only here for Kokomi too.
Very lovely video with interesting ideas and teams that requires more skill than have right now. Also do you play HSR? If so, then who's your favorite character?
Yes, my fav character is Acheron and then Bailu and then Sparkle followed by Black Swan. Are you on EU? You can add me. Just drop your uid below
@@KokomiClan no I'm on HK
Same, too hard for me without ZhongLi
I love those niche creative Ideas, gonna try Kokorinde today.
Just out of interesst, where is the case for Sarah over Fishl in the first Show comp?
Isn't Fishl just more reactions and dmg?
You can see my follow up vid for Fischl including builds.
This video was more of an "early ideas" vid since we will start discovering more as time goes on.
Bu but.... but... Muh resistance to interruption how could i ever play without that??? XD
Honestly I found this point hilarious because like, I don't even see people having an issue for this for Arle
There's also Cyno alhaitham and so many characters without this so, why is it specifically a clorinde issue?
I guess it's because her duration is too short, so dogding would end up with worse damage than most of the cases. Like, others just are longer and Arrle doesn't consume her Bol when she dodges.
@@see0707to be fair, arle often incorporates dash cancels into her kit, where for clorinde this would be a dps loss, and she often uses xingqiu
clorindes healing and repositioning do help a lot though
Please tell me how to get to that beautiful location
There are a few holes in Fontaine that Hoyo forgot to patch...I am sure you can find how to get out of bounds on some youtube vids ;).
Finally
I have the feeling that they nerf her E duration is so she can work with Sara
Yet every time I said so, those people reply back with “her multipliers is shit”
Like I get what you are saying, but can you do a more detailed breakdown about the interaction? I want to know more about the interaction other than "time it well". Also, no Nahida please - everyone does that.
In my latest vid I run a Nahida-less variant so check that out.
I think my vid does a good job explaining it. You need to look at your jellyfish and BoL and determine when to press the inputs.
Steps:
It is not hard to lunge into a jellyfish (clear BoL) and get healed, press Clorinde Q and then you have BoL plus the second tick healing for more BoL before lunging again.
Alternatively, you lunge into Jellyfish (clear all BoL, instantly press Alt + Q on Kokomi to refresh jellyfish, attack for 2-3 secs on Kokomi to heal everyone and then go Clorinde Q (gaining BoL to save up)/Other Abilities.
In any case, Kokomi acts as a buffer, bloom spawner, healer and even tank.
i think this video is good and a unique take on the clorinde discourse, given no one i knew of was talking about the synergy.
i know this is not a xingqiu video, but i feel like your points against using him over kokomi were a bit hand wavy, especially given his dmg reduction *is* extremely significant and so is his ir to some extent, his lack of aoe is offset by his vastly superior rate of hydro application, and his personal damage is notably above kokomi's in the same team. i feel like, while there is a lot of skill expression and even comfort in using kokomi, you could've made a bigger argument against him here
I have talked about Xingqiu a lot in the past and he is far less impressive than most people realise. There are a few old vids on this.
The problem in hyperbloom is the inherent rate limit of 2 dendro cores per enemy so additional hydro application is not necessarily helpful. It really depends on situations but the caveat is that you have to normal attack with someone in order to get hydro app (whereas Kokomi gives it offield regardless) and otherwise you lose it.
In fact, in a raw hydro application test on-field Kokomi wins (We have tested this against enemies and overworld constructs - see old vids). Kokomi with Ocean Hued Clam can definitely keep up with the dmg.
You also need a lot of energy recharge since Xingqiu is the solo hydro (sac sword) whereas prototype amber helps Kokomi (her ER requirement is also less) with that and additonal healing which acts a cushion. Kokomi has faster animations and variable hydro app which allows for its own flexibility.
I dont believe dmg reduction/interuption resistance is that big of a deal, especially against some bosses and enemies that will still cleave through it (see latest combat event). As you become more skilled, you weave in animations and i-frames and learn "roll recovery" from being knocked back. For slower playstyles or having a "key onfield carry" you can make the argument for Xingqiu, but in quickswap teams with animation cancels and burst i-frames that utility is nearly useless.
That is my experience (coming from someone that has played Xingqiu since day 1). So feel free to disagree, but give specific examples because I have a ton as well.
@@KokomiClan i first want to clarify: i’m not talking about xingqiu vs kokomi in a general sense- only as related to clorinde quickbloom teams. i am aware and acknowledge many arguments for or against either unit in many teams, and i think the topic is nuanced and is open to interpretation. with that, xingqiu in this clorinde team has multiple upsides over kokomi, and a few downsides. i believe xingqiu in this team has better hydro application, more personal damage, better sustain for clorinde, and is more comfortable to play. i also see that xingqiu has lower quicken uptime and does not contribute to team sustain as well as kokomi does. (gonna counter some quick points here: xingqiu relying on normal attacks to apply hydro is not a limiting factor in clorinde teams, she likes to normal attack constantly. on field kokomi hydro application is next to irrelevant in this team. xingqiu requiring high er in this team is both not necessarily true, and is also not a downside [at c6, sac sword covers essentially all of his energy needs, and in clorinde xingqiu nahida fischl, non er weapon er reqs will be ~200%. this is not difficult to build for, so i do not see this as a noteworthy downside.]
when comparing an off field xingqiu and kokomi’s hydro application (all future mentions of the two units refer to c6 and c0 respectively), kokomi applies hydro in a suitable aoe every 2 seconds, while xingqiu applies ~1.3/s against a single target w/o orbitals, and ~1.5 with 50% orbital uptime, which seems like a more realistic assumption. xingqiu, then, has higher hyperbloom and lower quicken uptime, which is at the very least a dps neutral tradeoff, dependent on number of targets and clorinde investment. kokomi notably does not significantly benefit from aoe hydro application past 2T (due to bloom dmg icd), and her hydro application suffers against a single target. xingqiu’s useful hydro app does not notably scale on the number of enemies. i want to stress that i do not believe that kokomi having aoe hydro makes her a better hydro applicator for clorinde in multi target, as xingqiu will still surpass her bloom count.
xingqiu’s personal damage is significant, and is notably higher than an off field clam kokomi’s personal damage in this team. kokomi has some on field potential, but i still am not convinced that her on field damage *in this team* will eclipse xingqiu’s. clorinde gets extra bol from kokomi, which does marginally increase her damage.
kokomi’s sustain in clorinde teams has a core issue: healing during her on field duration does not impact her hp directly. however, kokomi’s healing will lead to more lunges, which will indirectly incerase hp gain by a noticeable amount. however, i believe xingqiu’s damage reduction (and interrupt resistance to some extent) is superior to kokomi’s sustain in regards to her field time. xingiqu offers nearly 50% dmg reduction, which leads to clorinde effectively having a doubled hp bar (and healing, by extension, will take you twice as far), which will lead to a net increase over the bol increase offered by kokomi. this dmg reduction will persist the entire rotation, and is not gated to an aoe like jellyfish. i acknowledge that jellyfish is very possible to play around, but the convenience this offers is non-negligible. not being locked into a circle and having some ir for easier face tanking is also notable, as clorinde would be able to dash less in her on field time, but she isn’t as reliant on this ir as other characters are, such as hu tao. however, while xingqiu offers the same dmg reduction to the entire team, and i would personally find this team comfortable to pilot, kokomi does beat him out in sustaining the rest of the team, and can heal clorinde back up during off field time.
to conclude, xingqiu and kokomi are both strong options in this team, and while no one unit is a direct upgrade over the other (while i have a preference), i think bringing up kokomi is important. she undoubtedly has synergy with clorinde, and offers an alternative playsytle that appeals to you and many other players. i also did not expect xingqiu to be a focus of this video, or for this much time to be spent talking about him. still, for the time you brought him up as another popular option, i don’t think the counterpoints you offered were strong enough to “ignore xingqiu”, because her hydro is aoe, among other points you made in the video. i do not think your video is claiming to completely disregard him, but the video, in my opinion, does not offer points that would suggest ghat this language be appropriate *regardless* of skill expression. i want to emphasize this last part, as your video does mention that a lot of this synergy really shines with skill and familiarity with kokomi, but my arguments in this critique do not hinge on the player being unable to perform their best with kokomi. thank you for taking the time to read my comment.
Right. I have recorded enough gameplay and will put out a vid on this tomorrow (or next 2 days) with a detailed VOD review on many different runs using the different teams.
You can reply then on that vid. Your critical flaw in thinking is assuming Clorinde does the bulk of the dmg but that is also not true in a hyperbloom context as I will demonstrate and that the choice of Kokomi vs Xingqiu has other implications for the rotations and Clorinde downtime.
Btw, I highly suggest you watch my vids on gacha probabilities to understand that a C6 four star IS NOT equiavent to a C0 5 star mathematically (avg 93.5 for a C0 5 star vs 250 for a C6 4 star). Hence the conversation should be around C1~2 vs C6 4 star, but that will literally not matter for tomorrow's vid in any case.
@@KokomiClan i'll wait, sure. i do wanna mention though, that while i usually agree with the "c6 4* is more expensive than a c0 5*" logic, 1. most of my points would still apply (notably, hydro app would differ somewhat) at lower cons, and 2. xingqiu has been given for free in 3 lantern rites, 1 event, has been in shop twice per year since launch, and is a 1.0 unit. he's also rate up on many banners, like the first kokomi banner. most players who have played over a year probably would have or would be close to c6 xingqiu, if they wanted to
Actually wrong again. Older players would have C6 but newer players will not due to the ever increasing pool of 4 stars and spreading out 4 stars. Additionally, your assumption is that people would waste around 7 wishes in the star glitter shop specifically on him when it is less optimal to do so by virue of waiting for an event. Again, just be careful because those assumptions are easy to challenge: New players having an abundance of rewards and early game primogems could easily get Kokomi to C1 even or other chracters like Furina.
Let's stick to the mathematical argument since I can also bring attention to things like guarantees, free pink fates given out during monthly resets, primogems given out during all the events which will go to your favourite 5 star..., etc. All of this drastically reduces the number of wishes needed to get a limited 5 star .
I think you missed a chance for a teaser team with koko :( (even if its not meta) i hav seen a lot of showcase with dendro and overload teams... but a koko clorinde miko/fischl/beidou + anemo unit team where koko drives with burst and when koko burst ends clorinde is the driver. We need more koklorinde teams!!
I tried, but I don't think it is that strong in this Abyss (unless you are running constellations)
i find quite funny how people complain about the time of her on field, when this character feels like a new way to use teamcomps. Keep on mind the game it's not finish yet and they are more characters to come who could make her even stronger.
Personally i don't complain about it, i like how she was released and the fact Kokomi can help her it's a massive win for me.
Btw 0:07 lmao 😂😂 the sarcasm and the way you move the cursor it's hilarious to me xD
Edit: 3;12 What do you think about using Prototype Amber on Nahida on this team? i ask because i have seen some people saying that's a good way to heal the team without having a healer on it.
It can work but then you lose out on EM sharing via her passive plus Nahida ult takes forever. You also need to time it when Clorinde has no bond of life
@@KokomiClan I see, so that's preferible to not use it on that way, specially if i really want to not lose EM to share. Great, i'll pass from that option.
There is something wrong with your Kokomi. She is not using TTDS.
For this particular showcase, she doesnt need to 😁