Excellent video with lots of useful information. We are having the most amazing hardware nowadays, unfortunately software companies have been known for many years to notoriously not making use of hardware improvements and really utilising it to its full potential. Most of the time software just gets a little bit faster by adding raw performance improvements on the hardware. Most of the times software companies focus on new functions or changing the UI because that’s visible to the customer and something to work with for the marketing department, but fixing bugs or optimising the program unfortunately doesn’t fall into either category.
Thank you ! these are precisely the comparisons I was looking for. Bought the base level M1 Max with 32Gb of RAM in a pinch last year but, as someone who regularly works with extremely large image files, I think I'll be switching to the M2 Ultra 192Gb.
Thanks for all the test results. I’m sticking with 64gb but upgrading from my MacBook M1M to the M2 Ultra Studio with 76 core GPU cores. I mainly work with 6 and 12K RAW video files.
@@secretgoldfish all kinds of stuff 🤣. Mainly narrative film production. 12k allows for more flexibility in post production, plus I love the look of the camera. It can easily go through 1TB at full quality in under 30mins of filming though 😲
@@GlenReed Interesting, cheers!....Yeah the HD manufacturers must love you. I'm still finishing most stuff in 2k (even for cinema) where 4k gives me more than enough wiggle room. Are you using the BM cam? (I beta tested it for them early on).
Thank you for running these test. Now I don't have to wonder if I should have went with the 128GB model. The base model M2 Ultra is working really well for me right now.
This is great investigation in that it tested on many popular graphic programs, especially AE which I was looking for. Thank you for saving the pockets of many people including me who can't just by one and say "Oh, it wasn't enough". It would be even better if I could see how AE preview is more available in 128GB compared to 64GB.
With After Effects memory is what the system uses to store your (RAM)preview so most of the times more memory means being able to watch longer video's in preview. Although with the new caching to SSD this has become less of an issue, it's still worth remembering if you do a lot of complex animations.
This is very interesting. I have an M1 16" Macbook pro.. and was considering trading in for the new M3 Machines with the M3Ultra. Almost seems not worth it. I did learn a lot from this video. The Memory Pressuere and history you showed with Istats. WOW, that was telling. I have a 64gb memory and have hit 30% pressure in 30 days. That sure tells me I would never need more than 64. Decision time... upgrade for processor and better battery or no? Would love to see new M3 benchmarks compared to M1 and M2
Can the Mac Studio M2 Max handle well with well-known editing programs such as Adobe Premiere, Final Cut, and Da Vinci, smoothly and easily for video clip production and wedding production, because I work in the field of wedding photography and I have a photography camera such as the Sony A7S3 and Canon Mark IV 5D Please, I want a frank answer. Thank you
Thanks Art you just reconfirmed that for LRC users upgrading to the new new MS2U from last years MS1U is not worth it at all and also good to know 128GB of RAM is also not necessary . I would also add as Adobe continues to optimize there software all new Macs based on Apple silicon should benefit the same
You are so right. I have the Studio Max 10/24 with 64GB/1TB configuration and I see the machine going to hard drive for swap all the time. My next Mac will have at least 128GB RAM, maybe even max out at 192.
@@gsanchez922 I have a Sony A7RIV with 172MB TIFF files and if I open them as 16bit which is almost 100% of the time, then they are 344MB files! I have to process these files and I take advantage of masking in PS RAW and do a fair amount of panoramic images from as many as six or seven of these files. You need a lot of power (CPU/GPU) and lots of RAM. I ordered 64GB RAM thinking it was enough but as it turned out I can use more RAM and processing power. My Mac gets the job done and it does it relatively fast but I know I can save time with a more powerful machine with more RAM.
@@boristahmasian9604 😅 Sony is memory Hungry!. My R5 in RAW is around 50MB and CRAW event smaller. I normally work with around 500 pictures but one at the time and also work with 8K CRM and my Mac handle well with 32GB and M1 Max.
Thanks for the last couple of videos on the M2 Mac Studios. You've bumped me from a M2 Max to a M2 Ultra. I'm about to order my Ultra in the next week. I'm going with the base model but I'm trying to decide if I want to bump up the storage to 2TB instead of 1TB. My current iMac has 512GB of internal storage. All my data is stored on an external drive. How does the Unified Memory work? My understanding is if the system needs memory, it uses storage for swap. Is this true? And if so, would 2TB make it more efficient? Or would upgrading memory to 128GB be better for machine performance instead of upgrading the hard drive? Does anyone know if the 2TB SSD is faster than the 1TB SSD? Thanks!
More memory is going to be better than larger SSD. But if you don't have a use for either consistently, this does not really make sense to spend that kind of money to upgrade, You are looking at $400 on the SSD and $800 for the Memory or a combo of $1200 is a huge amount of money for resources that may not get utilized. :)
@ArtIsRight : I am very curious about your presentation setup. You appear to do things wirelessly from your iPad. I am asking because I occasionally do overhead presentations on the road and I'm wondering what it would take to do a wireless setup. Could you do a video on this? Thank you for your time and attention.
Thanks for all the videos you do. Super helpful. Is there any way I can get a copy of your 1000 photos so I can test it out on my PC? I’m happy to share results with you 😊
I would love to but I am unable to do this. Made a mistake by choosing client files for testing. I might be able to give you alternative set. Let me see what I can do
Thanks so much for this vid. Planning on live streaming along with audio production and video editing and am trying to pick the right Mac. I wonder if the 128GB RAM would make a noticeable difference for live-streaming vs the 64GB.
Hello ! I just can't stop watching your videos, you're very neutral and explain a lot. It helps being aware of certain things, but I'm kinda lost right now. I'm working on a 27" iMac (4,2Ghz quad i7, 32Go RAM, 1TB SSD, Radeon Pro 575 4Go) and it goes slower and slower when I'm working on Capture One and Photoshop. I'm a photographer, working with Fujifilm GFX medium format cameras. So big files to handle. The 27" monitor is great (to me), and I never experienced anything else. So I'm wondering : Mac mini VS Mac studio ? Apple Studio Display VS any other display ? Macbook Pro ? I'm very lost, but can't thank you enough for your help and for sharing all your advices and thoughts. Take care, Colin
For photographers especially with the file that you work with, I would be more inclined to recommend the Mac Studio with the Max chip at the minimum. Or get the M1 Ultra, they are rather cheap now. About the display, if you print consider BenQ SW series, if not PD series will do.
Hey art, first I just want to say, thank you for another great video now, I’m in somewhat of a conundrum. I have an iPad Pro m2 12.9 8gb ram which I can do some light editing and have portability on the go for emergencies or studying, I sold my pc because i want to go for an apple pc, I’m in between a max studio m2 max base model or a M1 Max macbook 16 in with the same specs (32gb ram and 512gb) for about the same price or maybe a little cheaper on the max studio side, considering I already own a monitor (not as good as an apple monitor but really good nonetheless) and peripherals (which I can use with the notebook docked) what are some thoughts you can give on the matter ? I’d appreciate your insight
I look forward to your updated results, with more recent results. FYI, I have a 14” M1 Max with 64GB and 4T disk in San Diego. I use Photoshop and Lightroom on a BenQ 321c. I tried dual display, using the MacBook Pro for the primary display (with Lightroom Develop, etc), and using the BenQ for the secondary (image display) and noticed a rather severe performance degradation. Have you tried that?
I would not spend the money on 76 cores, yes some apps like LRC/LR can use it but only for export and the ultra by itself is mighty fast already, I mean I can export 1K raw in less than 5 min, the extra 16 GPU core boost will do very little to change that.
Great video, Art. I can appreciate your methodology to individual app testing for the purpose of clean data, but I would contest it is not real world for a lot of busy photographers/videographers. For context, the following scenario is rather common, at least for me: I shoot high end events, and sometimes weddings. I can be in a position where I can have a video rendering, and while that is happening, I want to be in LRC processing images. Then, I may want to send multiple images across to photoshop for layering, or other batch processing. Whilst there, I may look to open those images in Topaz plugin for noise etc, back into photoshop, and ultimately back into LRC for export. Even in the absence of the video scenario, this is a common workflow. App switching and working across multiple applications chews up the RAM very quickly, and importantly, memory headroom is a real thing to consider also. I’ve been reading a lot of the comments suggesting upgrading is a waste of time based on your tests. Whilst not everyone has the need for headroom, or memory intensive workflows now, they could find themselves in this scenario by landing their next client, and I would argue the upgrades should be considered in this light. Finally, exports aren’t a big deal, slow computers while actually editing is way more frustrating. Something to consider, and I’d love to see some real world tests like this. Thanks again.
Each to their own, real world or not it is what we do in my studio and how myself and my associates edit and work. If you push your machine that hard that is great, configure it appropriately. What you are doing is multiple task at the same time, again not the scope of this test, like I said mine is different than yours.
@@ArtIsRight Yes, each to their own, but you might not have considered, that you are a trusted source amongst the ‘click-bait’ nature of a lot of other channels. Also, you’re more detailed in your analysis… with those two things in mind, I would think a multitasking workload video from you would do well, and inform the rest of us with a level of confidence. Thanks again.
I have considered and done those test before. It is not the purpose of these tests. With that, I can't determine how the OS, App and silicon is performing, too many variables. These test takes a lot of time as it is already. Multi tasking test will take more time on top of what I do. And I don't prefer to play in the click bait game, but many of my videos are not doing as well as the click bait either.
@@ArtIsRight I understand. You can only do so much, and your current tests do make absolute sense for the purpose intended. I for one am glad you don’t play the click-bait game. Authenticity is rare these days. Much appreciate your work. Thank you.
The comparison is very thorough, but I wonder given the lack of M1 Studio Ultras around if an M2 max with more memory, a processor upgrade and a Hard drive upgrade could get near to the M1 Ultra for about £3K. I was looking on KRCS webpage at an M2 Max to include 38 core GPU, 96GB Ram and a 1TB hard drive at £3134. All the Ultras have 64GB Ram so it is hard to understand how adding Ram to the M2 Max may benefit at a mid price between M2 Max at £2K and the M2 Ultra at £4K
I don't think there a lack of M1 Ultra, you can still get those and upgrading everything on the MAX will not bring you close to the Ultra. Max just does not have the CPU and GPU cores to compete. RAM is part of the equation but only for extremely large files. For me I'll take 64GB in an ultra any day over 96 in the MAX
Hey, good to see you and very nice video, could you please make a video review about the Mac Pro or Mac Studio performing with 8 monitors connected to it?
Good video/testing as usual Art. Thanks. I see you added an Adobe Denoise test ... thanks. You are right, the NE are not being used. Adobe admitted this, due to an Apple issue with NE apparently, discussed on the Adobe Community. No info on what the problem is or a fix. Testing I've collected so far align timing with number of GPU cores, though the M1 Ultra is a little less efficient.
Do you have a link to the community post. The way how I see it, AI done on GPU is the models used on PC without dedicated GPU cores. My guess, NE issue aside, is that it makes software dev easier as well, starting from a similar code based that utilizes GPU and just port them over. NE/ML requirer dedicated coding or more code for a singular platform. And there are so many wonky results this cycle with M1 Ultra, it is rather disappointing.
I don't think you are going to see that much variation. Resolves uses GPU but most of what is used is the encoder / decoder engine. And like the M1 Ultra gen, the variation is extremely small in video and photo apps. I don't think you are missing anything really.
Being that there’s no M3 or M4 Studios out yet (2025?). At this point in 2024, is it still good to get a M2 Max for professional work using Lightroom & Photoshop. I’m currently using a 2019 intel MBP.
That will be a big leap. Personally If you are going to upgrad the M2 Max then I would look at a refurb M1 Ultra Instead. Way better machine and Apple is now selling them at lower prices.
@@ArtIsRight way better performance for strictly Lightroom and Photoshop use? I’m editing / retouching Sony A1 50mp raw files. Base model M1 Ultra, 64gb ram, 2tb ssd?
Thanks for all your great work! I don't know how I can donate to you. Question, Imagine I would buy a (used) M1 Ultra 20/48-core 64 GB 1 TB SSD. Do I reach almost the same speed in LrC with 1:1 previews when I would have the actual photos on an EXTERNAL SSD? And is For example Sandisk V2 with 2000 MB/S beneficial compared to Samsung T7 Shield 1000 MB/s or is 1000MB/s fast enough? 1 TB internal is very easily filled with my photography life (and also video captures). And internal SSD is very expensive. I use 12 TB seagate external HDD for storage now. I am afraid that this is too slow for using with LrC and is only for storage.
Thank you Art for this video. I was always wondering about the 64GB vs. 128GB debate. When I go to the next machine, 128GB will be the minimum. Perhaps 192GB if I can swing it. Your MS M1M 10/24 test machine has 32GB/512GB and is lagging way behind all three Ultra configurations.. My MS M1M 10/24 has 64GB/1TB. I am wondering how the times might improve in all the tests with 64GB vs. 32GB RAM?
Not much and not the rate that we are going about this. Each OS release and App Version, things keeps getting slower.... sadly. It is all software at this point, not hardware that is the culprit.
@@ArtIsRight Got you. The are other things I have noticed too. My internal SD card reader is slow even with UHS II cards. I am using an inexpensive dongle type Anker hub with SD card reader and it is almost twice as fast as my internal SD card reader. That is an Apple issue too. There are other port speed issues as well. I am attributing them to Apple's OS and IO implementation.
I can imagine Art being in an apple store after an announcement and availability of new macs comparing it to a 7 year old child in a brand new huge toy store haha
When it comes to Topaz, it just uses CPU and may be GPU. I don't believe that they have made any attempt to use the encoder/decoder engine. I'll have a look but I don't think that getting the ultra to use with Topaz app is a good idea, mostly, the app can't use the power and it not money well spend. Let me see what I can do.
Perhaps i'm blind i don't see any reason to upgrade from M1 to M2 based on any computational result. What is your daily workflow, just 100% converting/exporting files. Don't you have constant interaction with your system. I assume even if you compare an MBA M1 Basemodel and a MS M2U wellspecced and you place two people with the same workingorder (not just exporting, but also work where you need human brain and artistic abilities) you will notice at least perhaps an advantage of 30 min for complete working day if any. As you absolutely correct stated having a well specced system makes work for sure more comfortable, i fear its nearly impossible to justify any upgrade economically. I think the best compromise is M2P 32 GB 1 TB, to give the most fluffy feeling (but only if you really have such a big part of just exporting all day in and out, but i think this can also be manged by my cleaning woman, pressing a button from time to time, for the next export. Thats not the valuable working hours where my erpertise is needed. Its there where to decide what footage is used what not, How to crop a picture, how to arrange a timeline, to decide what B-roll is used,.... all that work done in your memory, and thats not a millisecond faster or slower if using a MBA M1 Basemodel, only perhaps more inconvenient.
Unified memory is shared between the CPU and GPU. It will just depends on what the apps needs. You can saturate the GPU cores with the app uses and request GPU rendering, not by how much memory is used.
@@ArtIsRight Isn't the point of unified memory is that the CPU reads the instruction and instead of having to copy it to the GPU memory, the GPU simply gets the memory address? And then to saturate all the GPU cores those GPUs need to be constantly fed data by RAM to process? Wouldn't there be a minimal amount or RAM needed to keep that pipe between RAM and the CPU cores saturated? M2 Max has what, 400GB/s bandwidth and Ultra 800? Your results seem to show that that doubling doesn't really matter at all.
No it does not matter because for you to get the max of those bandwidth you need to have the app using the CPU, GPU, NPU and saturating all of them at the same time whilst using a lot of memory. Simply put, no app can really do that today. These SoC are in a way too futuristic.
@@ArtIsRight I don't understand your explanation here. Bandwidth and RAM limit the amount of data you can have the GPU working on per second. They need a certain amount of RAM to keep the GPU cores saturated, no matter what the CPU and neural cores are doing because the speed of the cores data processing are faster than that bandwidth, right? Are you simply saying that even the default RAM/bandwidth far outstrip the needs of the GPU cores? As long as the CPU isn't using too much of that RAM?
Hi Art. I'm not a Lightroom user. I use Photoshop, Bridge & ACR. One advantage of Photoshop is that you have control over Scratch disks. Have you ever thought of doing a video comparing several external drives as Scratch discs - size, speed, Thunderbolt/USB etc, to supplement RAM?
RAM Is going to be faster at end of the day, we are talking for instance on the Ultra with speeds up to 800 GB/s, that is approaching terabyte territory. Even with an PCIe NVMe card inside the Mac Pro 16X slot, I am only able to get up to 10 Gb/s so there are going to be a huge variation. I'll take this into consideration for a future video if time permits.
Macs don't make a lot of sense as desktops. Did the ai denoise test on my pc on FIVE yo hardware and got very similar results to the M2U. Clear that for my next update Mac studio might not be the best option!
About AI Denoise in LRC, there's a bug in the neural engine which is why you are getting results that you are getting because Adobe as of now is by passing the NPU all together.
not quite and blanket statement like these are neither useful nor helpful. each has their own workflow and that matters. sensitive and understanding is key, that the issue with most tech people
@@ArtIsRight It's not a blanket statement, just a piece of advice to perhaps consider (especially with the tests you showed)....alongside that sensitivity and understanding of course!
Is that rhetorical? Then you must know the answer already... And there are more to what you stated but if that is all that you got out of this, well....
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Nice. I purchased the m1 studio ultra base model with 64GB refurbished on the m2 studio launch day. It was the best value for money.
I know!
Excellent video with lots of useful information. We are having the most amazing hardware nowadays, unfortunately software companies have been known for many years to notoriously not making use of hardware improvements and really utilising it to its full potential. Most of the time software just gets a little bit faster by adding raw performance improvements on the hardware. Most of the times software companies focus on new functions or changing the UI because that’s visible to the customer and something to work with for the marketing department, but fixing bugs or optimising the program unfortunately doesn’t fall into either category.
That is something that I have been saying in various videos all along, ditto!
Thank you ! these are precisely the comparisons I was looking for. Bought the base level M1 Max with 32Gb of RAM in a pinch last year but, as someone who regularly works with extremely large image files, I think I'll be switching to the M2 Ultra 192Gb.
If you work a lot with large files 32GB will be the biggest hinderance, So 192 or even 128 will do you a lot of good.
Thanks for all the test results. I’m sticking with 64gb but upgrading from my MacBook M1M to the M2 Ultra Studio with 76 core GPU cores. I mainly work with 6 and 12K RAW video files.
Nice!
What are you doing with 12k RAW video files?
@@secretgoldfish all kinds of stuff 🤣. Mainly narrative film production. 12k allows for more flexibility in post production, plus I love the look of the camera. It can easily go through 1TB at full quality in under 30mins of filming though 😲
@@GlenReed Interesting, cheers!....Yeah the HD manufacturers must love you. I'm still finishing most stuff in 2k (even for cinema) where 4k gives me more than enough wiggle room. Are you using the BM cam? (I beta tested it for them early on).
@@GlenReed Daaaaaam
Thank you for running these test. Now I don't have to wonder if I should have went with the 128GB model. The base model M2 Ultra is working really well for me right now.
Totally!
Why are u wondering that ?
this was all the information i was looking for to help me decide! thank you so much! liked and subscribed!!
Awesome! Thank you!
This is great investigation in that it tested on many popular graphic programs, especially AE which I was looking for. Thank you for saving the pockets of many people including me who can't just by one and say "Oh, it wasn't enough".
It would be even better if I could see how AE preview is more available in 128GB compared to 64GB.
You're Welcome!
Unbelievably detailed and well done!
Many thanks!
With After Effects memory is what the system uses to store your (RAM)preview so most of the times more memory means being able to watch longer video's in preview. Although with the new caching to SSD this has become less of an issue, it's still worth remembering if you do a lot of complex animations.
👍🏼
Great channel. One of very few worth watching and doing useful tests. Thank you!
Thank you!
Just a great content with best tests❤🎉
Thank you!
Came from Intel based 32GB machine to M1M 64GB, and my memory usage sits at 55GB while doing work. I never knew I needed that much RAM.
This is great! At least you configured the correct machine
Thank you Sir 🫡
I really appreciate your video! This has helped me choosing the right computer 🖥️ for me !👍🏽
You are welcome!
holy shit these deep dives are so useful. thank you!
😀
Wonderfull video: a big thank you !
Many thanks!
Amazing review , the very best!!
Thanks a lot!
Love it! Thanks! One question: are the times for the M2 max 16” comparable to the m2 max studio used in this test?
They are going to come in really close or identical with each other.
Really interesting and well done! Thank you
Thank you!
This is very interesting. I have an M1 16" Macbook pro.. and was considering trading in for the new M3 Machines with the M3Ultra. Almost seems not worth it. I did learn a lot from this video. The Memory Pressuere and history you showed with Istats. WOW, that was telling. I have a 64gb memory and have hit 30% pressure in 30 days. That sure tells me I would never need more than 64. Decision time... upgrade for processor and better battery or no? Would love to see new M3 benchmarks compared to M1 and M2
I would just keep what you have. And M3 Ultra will come in a Mac Studio Only :)
Can the Mac Studio M2 Max handle well with well-known editing programs such as Adobe Premiere, Final Cut, and Da Vinci, smoothly and easily for video clip production and wedding production, because I work in the field of wedding photography and I have a photography camera such as the Sony A7S3 and Canon Mark IV 5D Please, I want a frank answer. Thank you
Yes, it all depends on how much effects you have as well but for the most part it won't be an issue.
I hope reviewers focus more on Stable Diffusion and LLM when benchmarking. Not everyone buying those devices uses them for video editing.
And other channels look at it from that aspect. This channel focuses on photos and videos; always has.
wow this is what I was looking for and more.
nice
Excellent review/test, as always. 🔝
Thanks again!
Thanks Art you just reconfirmed that for LRC users upgrading to the new new MS2U from last years MS1U is not worth it at all and also good to know 128GB of RAM is also not necessary . I would also add as Adobe continues to optimize there software all new Macs based on Apple silicon should benefit the same
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Subscribed. Thank you.
Thank you too!
Photoshop eats any amount of RAM you have on your computer as well as free space on your hard drive. :)
You are so right. I have the Studio Max 10/24 with 64GB/1TB configuration and I see the machine going to hard drive for swap all the time. My next Mac will have at least 128GB RAM, maybe even max out at 192.
That is why if you use PS a lot just get more RAM and SSD
@@boristahmasian9604what do you do in PS?
@@gsanchez922 I have a Sony A7RIV with 172MB TIFF files and if I open them as 16bit which is almost 100% of the time, then they are 344MB files! I have to process these files and I take advantage of masking in PS RAW and do a fair amount of panoramic images from as many as six or seven of these files. You need a lot of power (CPU/GPU) and lots of RAM. I ordered 64GB RAM thinking it was enough but as it turned out I can use more RAM and processing power. My Mac gets the job done and it does it relatively fast but I know I can save time with a more powerful machine with more RAM.
@@boristahmasian9604 😅 Sony is memory Hungry!. My R5 in RAW is around 50MB and CRAW event smaller. I normally work with around 500 pictures but one at the time and also work with 8K CRM and my Mac handle well with 32GB and M1 Max.
great sir
Thank you!
Thanks for the last couple of videos on the M2 Mac Studios. You've bumped me from a M2 Max to a M2 Ultra. I'm about to order my Ultra in the next week. I'm going with the base model but I'm trying to decide if I want to bump up the storage to 2TB instead of 1TB. My current iMac has 512GB of internal storage. All my data is stored on an external drive. How does the Unified Memory work? My understanding is if the system needs memory, it uses storage for swap. Is this true? And if so, would 2TB make it more efficient? Or would upgrading memory to 128GB be better for machine performance instead of upgrading the hard drive? Does anyone know if the 2TB SSD is faster than the 1TB SSD? Thanks!
More memory is going to be better than larger SSD. But if you don't have a use for either consistently, this does not really make sense to spend that kind of money to upgrade, You are looking at $400 on the SSD and $800 for the Memory or a combo of $1200 is a huge amount of money for resources that may not get utilized. :)
@ArtIsRight : I am very curious about your presentation setup. You appear to do things wirelessly from your iPad. I am asking because I occasionally do overhead presentations on the road and I'm wondering what it would take to do a wireless setup. Could you do a video on this? Thank you for your time and attention.
I made one already ;) Here it is ruclips.net/video/LZlnNVSpJwU/видео.html I should put this link in the video description
i was trying to decide between the m2 ultra studio OR the new macbook pro m3 max. looks like i can save some money and just stick with the m2 ultra
Totally
Thanks for all the videos you do. Super helpful. Is there any way I can get a copy of your 1000 photos so I can test it out on my PC? I’m happy to share results with you 😊
I would love to but I am unable to do this. Made a mistake by choosing client files for testing. I might be able to give you alternative set. Let me see what I can do
Thanks so much for this vid. Planning on live streaming along with audio production and video editing and am trying to pick the right Mac. I wonder if the 128GB RAM would make a noticeable difference for live-streaming vs the 64GB.
probably not, even with multiple apps running, if you just stick with the essential, it would be hard to break pass 64gb
What about DaVinci Resolve? Could you please include it the future tests? Thank you for your amazing tests!
looking to incorporate that
Hello !
I just can't stop watching your videos, you're very neutral and explain a lot. It helps being aware of certain things, but I'm kinda lost right now.
I'm working on a 27" iMac (4,2Ghz quad i7, 32Go RAM, 1TB SSD, Radeon Pro 575 4Go) and it goes slower and slower when I'm working on Capture One and Photoshop.
I'm a photographer, working with Fujifilm GFX medium format cameras. So big files to handle.
The 27" monitor is great (to me), and I never experienced anything else.
So I'm wondering : Mac mini VS Mac studio ? Apple Studio Display VS any other display ? Macbook Pro ?
I'm very lost, but can't thank you enough for your help and for sharing all your advices and thoughts.
Take care,
Colin
For photographers especially with the file that you work with, I would be more inclined to recommend the Mac Studio with the Max chip at the minimum. Or get the M1 Ultra, they are rather cheap now. About the display, if you print consider BenQ SW series, if not PD series will do.
Wow @@ArtIsRight , thank you so much for your quick answer !
I'll write that down and start counting my euros... :)
Im hoping to get a Mac Studio MS Max 64g I want to really get into my editing.
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Hey art, first I just want to say, thank you for another great video now, I’m in somewhat of a conundrum. I have an iPad Pro m2 12.9 8gb ram which I can do some light editing and have portability on the go for emergencies or studying, I sold my pc because i want to go for an apple pc, I’m in between a max studio m2 max base model or a M1 Max macbook 16 in with the same specs (32gb ram and 512gb) for about the same price or maybe a little cheaper on the max studio side, considering I already own a monitor (not as good as an apple monitor but really good nonetheless) and peripherals (which I can use with the notebook docked) what are some thoughts you can give on the matter ? I’d appreciate your insight
If you need portability go with the laptop, otherwise, desktop will be faster.
I look forward to your updated results, with more recent results. FYI, I have a 14” M1 Max with 64GB and 4T disk in San Diego. I use Photoshop and Lightroom on a BenQ 321c. I tried dual display, using the MacBook Pro for the primary display (with Lightroom Develop, etc), and using the BenQ for the secondary (image display) and noticed a rather severe performance degradation. Have you tried that?
yes extensively ruclips.net/p/PLjlr8rlxl_q65mOyASWU2naUlPCr78nxi
Please defined "severe performance degradation" for me, behavior and etc.
Thanks
Welcome
Great video - well done - any feeling for how valuable the 76 core GPU is versus the 60 core on the Ultra for photography work?
I would not spend the money on 76 cores, yes some apps like LRC/LR can use it but only for export and the ultra by itself is mighty fast already, I mean I can export 1K raw in less than 5 min, the extra 16 GPU core boost will do very little to change that.
Great video, Art. I can appreciate your methodology to individual app testing for the purpose of clean data, but I would contest it is not real world for a lot of busy photographers/videographers. For context, the following scenario is rather common, at least for me: I shoot high end events, and sometimes weddings. I can be in a position where I can have a video rendering, and while that is happening, I want to be in LRC processing images. Then, I may want to send multiple images across to photoshop for layering, or other batch processing. Whilst there, I may look to open those images in Topaz plugin for noise etc, back into photoshop, and ultimately back into LRC for export. Even in the absence of the video scenario, this is a common workflow. App switching and working across multiple applications chews up the RAM very quickly, and importantly, memory headroom is a real thing to consider also. I’ve been reading a lot of the comments suggesting upgrading is a waste of time based on your tests. Whilst not everyone has the need for headroom, or memory intensive workflows now, they could find themselves in this scenario by landing their next client, and I would argue the upgrades should be considered in this light.
Finally, exports aren’t a big deal, slow computers while actually editing is way more frustrating. Something to consider, and I’d love to see some real world tests like this. Thanks again.
Each to their own, real world or not it is what we do in my studio and how myself and my associates edit and work. If you push your machine that hard that is great, configure it appropriately. What you are doing is multiple task at the same time, again not the scope of this test, like I said mine is different than yours.
@@ArtIsRight Yes, each to their own, but you might not have considered, that you are a trusted source amongst the ‘click-bait’ nature of a lot of other channels. Also, you’re more detailed in your analysis… with those two things in mind, I would think a multitasking workload video from you would do well, and inform the rest of us with a level of confidence. Thanks again.
I have considered and done those test before. It is not the purpose of these tests. With that, I can't determine how the OS, App and silicon is performing, too many variables. These test takes a lot of time as it is already. Multi tasking test will take more time on top of what I do. And I don't prefer to play in the click bait game, but many of my videos are not doing as well as the click bait either.
@@ArtIsRight I understand. You can only do so much, and your current tests do make absolute sense for the purpose intended. I for one am glad you don’t play the click-bait game. Authenticity is rare these days. Much appreciate your work. Thank you.
Thank you!
The comparison is very thorough, but I wonder given the lack of M1 Studio Ultras around if an M2 max with more memory, a processor upgrade and a Hard drive upgrade could get near to the M1 Ultra for about £3K. I was looking on KRCS webpage at an M2 Max to include 38 core GPU, 96GB Ram and a 1TB hard drive at £3134. All the Ultras have 64GB Ram so it is hard to understand how adding Ram to the M2 Max may benefit at a mid price between M2 Max at £2K and the M2 Ultra at £4K
I don't think there a lack of M1 Ultra, you can still get those and upgrading everything on the MAX will not bring you close to the Ultra. Max just does not have the CPU and GPU cores to compete. RAM is part of the equation but only for extremely large files. For me I'll take 64GB in an ultra any day over 96 in the MAX
Hey, good to see you and very nice video, could you please make a video review about the Mac Pro or Mac Studio performing with 8 monitors connected to it?
thanks!
Good video/testing as usual Art. Thanks. I see you added an Adobe Denoise test ... thanks. You are right, the NE are not being used. Adobe admitted this, due to an Apple issue with NE apparently, discussed on the Adobe Community. No info on what the problem is or a fix. Testing I've collected so far align timing with number of GPU cores, though the M1 Ultra is a little less efficient.
Do you have a link to the community post. The way how I see it, AI done on GPU is the models used on PC without dedicated GPU cores. My guess, NE issue aside, is that it makes software dev easier as well, starting from a similar code based that utilizes GPU and just port them over. NE/ML requirer dedicated coding or more code for a singular platform. And there are so many wonky results this cycle with M1 Ultra, it is rather disappointing.
@@ArtIsRight Hi Art, I sent you an email with several links and comments.
Thank you! Much appreciate your contributions
Definitely love to see a gpu upgrade video with resolve tests. I got base and wonder if it was a mistake.
I don't think you are going to see that much variation. Resolves uses GPU but most of what is used is the encoder / decoder engine. And like the M1 Ultra gen, the variation is extremely small in video and photo apps. I don't think you are missing anything really.
Being that there’s no M3 or M4 Studios out yet (2025?). At this point in 2024, is it still good to get a M2 Max for professional work using Lightroom & Photoshop. I’m currently using a 2019 intel MBP.
That will be a big leap. Personally If you are going to upgrad the M2 Max then I would look at a refurb M1 Ultra Instead. Way better machine and Apple is now selling them at lower prices.
@@ArtIsRight way better performance for strictly Lightroom and Photoshop use? I’m editing / retouching Sony A1 50mp raw files. Base model M1 Ultra, 64gb ram, 2tb ssd?
Thanks for all your great work! I don't know how I can donate to you.
Question, Imagine I would buy a (used) M1 Ultra 20/48-core 64 GB 1 TB SSD. Do I reach almost the same speed in LrC with 1:1 previews when I would have the actual photos on an EXTERNAL SSD? And is For example Sandisk V2 with 2000 MB/S beneficial compared to Samsung T7 Shield 1000 MB/s or is 1000MB/s fast enough? 1 TB internal is very easily filled with my photography life (and also video captures). And internal SSD is very expensive.
I use 12 TB seagate external HDD for storage now. I am afraid that this is too slow for using with LrC and is only for storage.
You can use the tip jar in the description or RUclips super thanks!
M1 Ultra external SSD ruclips.net/video/-8UfQ-Tw9aw/видео.html
Thank you Art for this video. I was always wondering about the 64GB vs. 128GB debate. When I go to the next machine, 128GB will be the minimum. Perhaps 192GB if I can swing it.
Your MS M1M 10/24 test machine has 32GB/512GB and is lagging way behind all three Ultra configurations.. My MS M1M 10/24 has 64GB/1TB. I am wondering how the times might improve in all the tests with 64GB vs. 32GB RAM?
Not much and not the rate that we are going about this. Each OS release and App Version, things keeps getting slower.... sadly. It is all software at this point, not hardware that is the culprit.
@@ArtIsRight I hear you. Just wondering, when you say software, you mean PS, LR or Mac OS?
By software I mean Mac OS, Adobe Suite and other creative apps as well. Very few of them are well optimized even Apple own Apps have bugs.
@@ArtIsRight Got you. The are other things I have noticed too. My internal SD card reader is slow even with UHS II cards. I am using an inexpensive dongle type Anker hub with SD card reader and it is almost twice as fast as my internal SD card reader. That is an Apple issue too. There are other port speed issues as well. I am attributing them to Apple's OS and IO implementation.
Yes this is an apple hardware issue. Most company like to include an SD card reader but does not necessary engineer it right to get the best result.
I can imagine Art being in an apple store after an announcement and availability of new macs comparing it to a 7 year old child in a brand new huge toy store haha
That sounds about right. You should see me in a Apple store!
Would a m1 ultra 128gb work faster than a M2 Ultra 64gb ? What video programs will benefit from the 128 ram ?
not necessarily, it would depend on the task. As far as video program, AE would be one, or a heavy timeline.
@@ArtIsRight wow .. after effects can use up 128gb of ram ? What kinda projects?
it just uses a lot of RAM for the computation of difficult and multi-layered effects.
@@ArtIsRight what’s most ram u ever used and for what programs ?
Can you test with Topaz Video AI please ? I’m seriously thinking about buying a M2 Ultra for this, thx!
When it comes to Topaz, it just uses CPU and may be GPU. I don't believe that they have made any attempt to use the encoder/decoder engine. I'll have a look but I don't think that getting the ultra to use with Topaz app is a good idea, mostly, the app can't use the power and it not money well spend. Let me see what I can do.
Oh man, my poor M1 Max Macbook pro can finally rest in peace. I constantly run into red memory pressure on 64GB. 192GB is a saving grace.
There you go!
Perhaps i'm blind i don't see any reason to upgrade from M1 to M2 based on any computational result.
What is your daily workflow, just 100% converting/exporting files. Don't you have constant interaction with your system. I assume even if you compare an MBA M1 Basemodel and a MS M2U wellspecced and you place two people with the same workingorder (not just exporting, but also work where you need human brain and artistic abilities) you will notice at least perhaps an advantage of 30 min for complete working day if any. As you absolutely correct stated having a well specced system makes work for sure more comfortable, i fear its nearly impossible to justify any upgrade economically. I think the best compromise is M2P 32 GB 1 TB, to give the most fluffy feeling (but only if you really have such a big part of just exporting all day in and out, but i think this can also be manged by my cleaning woman, pressing a button from time to time, for the next export. Thats not the valuable working hours where my erpertise is needed. Its there where to decide what footage is used what not, How to crop a picture, how to arrange a timeline, to decide what B-roll is used,.... all that work done in your memory, and thats not a millisecond faster or slower if using a MBA M1 Basemodel, only perhaps more inconvenient.
You assessment is correct not blind at all. As far as systems goes it all depends on the need. Each person is going to be different
Please test Topaz Video AI
I'll see what I can do
@@ArtIsRight Great! Looking forward to it:)
Is there any documentation on how much memory is needed to saturate the GPU cores?
Unified memory is shared between the CPU and GPU. It will just depends on what the apps needs. You can saturate the GPU cores with the app uses and request GPU rendering, not by how much memory is used.
@@ArtIsRight Isn't the point of unified memory is that the CPU reads the instruction and instead of having to copy it to the GPU memory, the GPU simply gets the memory address? And then to saturate all the GPU cores those GPUs need to be constantly fed data by RAM to process? Wouldn't there be a minimal amount or RAM needed to keep that pipe between RAM and the CPU cores saturated? M2 Max has what, 400GB/s bandwidth and Ultra 800? Your results seem to show that that doubling doesn't really matter at all.
No it does not matter because for you to get the max of those bandwidth you need to have the app using the CPU, GPU, NPU and saturating all of them at the same time whilst using a lot of memory. Simply put, no app can really do that today. These SoC are in a way too futuristic.
@@ArtIsRight I don't understand your explanation here. Bandwidth and RAM limit the amount of data you can have the GPU working on per second. They need a certain amount of RAM to keep the GPU cores saturated, no matter what the CPU and neural cores are doing because the speed of the cores data processing are faster than that bandwidth, right? Are you simply saying that even the default RAM/bandwidth far outstrip the needs of the GPU cores? As long as the CPU isn't using too much of that RAM?
Faster and higher spec resolution in a camera i always quadruple my memory and hard drives size
there you go
Hi Art. I'm not a Lightroom user. I use Photoshop, Bridge & ACR. One advantage of Photoshop is that you have control over Scratch disks. Have you ever thought of doing a video comparing several external drives as Scratch discs - size, speed, Thunderbolt/USB etc, to supplement RAM?
RAM Is going to be faster at end of the day, we are talking for instance on the Ultra with speeds up to 800 GB/s, that is approaching terabyte territory. Even with an PCIe NVMe card inside the Mac Pro 16X slot, I am only able to get up to 10 Gb/s so there are going to be a huge variation. I'll take this into consideration for a future video if time permits.
I want to get 128gb ram not because i need it, but because i want it.
you'll grow into it
Macs don't make a lot of sense as desktops. Did the ai denoise test on my pc on FIVE yo hardware and got very similar results to the M2U. Clear that for my next update Mac studio might not be the best option!
Each to their own, may be not for you but for other it does. There's more to Mac vs PC
@@ArtIsRight I don’t intend on a Mac vs pc debate, just that apple should consider going back to discrete Gpus on desktops.
About AI Denoise in LRC, there's a bug in the neural engine which is why you are getting results that you are getting because Adobe as of now is by passing the NPU all together.
learn to close your background apps and save money!
not quite and blanket statement like these are neither useful nor helpful. each has their own workflow and that matters. sensitive and understanding is key, that the issue with most tech people
@@ArtIsRight It's not a blanket statement, just a piece of advice to perhaps consider (especially with the tests you showed)....alongside that sensitivity and understanding of course!
All that stuff on the desk = $$$$$$$$$$$$
Most are clients machines!
@@ArtIsRight Okay. Phew! I was worried about your wallet 😂
Why I was about to watch a 30 minutes keynote?
Is that rhetorical? Then you must know the answer already... And there are more to what you stated but if that is all that you got out of this, well....
@@ArtIsRight I watched the rest and you're right. Thank you for you putting this information together and delivering it. My apologies.
No worries! Glad you found it helpful!