♥️♥️ this def helps!! Always still a place for the balance parameter (when you want to adjust volume in each ear)…but no doubt this true stereo pan will get you better placement in the mix if that’s what the goal is!!
3:00 really cool difference, I didn't know about this! In Cubase (which I use) it's "Stereo combined panner" and it actually had this effect, it didn't reduce the volume.
And this is why I started using the stereo rack plugin, my old daw didn't pan correctly. Plus I love that I can create and save chains with panning right there in one space.
Great tutorial and yes, even though I've been mixing for a "long" time, I can admit being fairly new to the DAW world this problem has been a head scratcher a couple of times. Thanks for the clarity!
I did this to percussion loops all the time, asked myself why it still sounded louder on one side even though I panned it 90% the other way, and why it would be so quiet when I panned it 100%. Thanks for the tutorial
This method is much underused Especially for people that record their hardware, synthesisers in stereo and find it hard to fit in the mix You just got a new subscriber 🖐
I admit i too did this before i saw this... although thank fully i never panned any stereo track in the mix that way but i could have and would'nt even know how i am losing stuff in the mix xD .. Thanks a lot !!!
Thanks so much for all of your tutorials are incredible!! I think this may be particularly inherit issue in Ableton because in ProTools your mixer gives you both left and right panning channels so you’re sort of forced to go full left or full right if you want to pan properly …. But yeah I’ve used Ableton a few times and I had no idea this was the case thanks for the tip and saving me a headache 😊😊
You're welcome!! ❤️👊 Really you just want to know the difference between the pan modes so you can always use the one that works best for your current sound/mix...happy this can help!
Incredible. Thank you for bringing this to my attention. I never knew. I find the ableton two-knob UX for "stereo pan" unintuitive but I'll have to play with it.
Pretty interesting, thanks, didn't realise some DAWs did this! As a ProTools user I've never had this issue; as I'm sure you'll know (as you didn't list ProTools ;-] ) stereo tracks have split-stereo panning by default.
@@TheCosmicAcademy Actually hahahah, btw, I was looking to do the same inside a channel or rack, and doing some experimentation ive made a little ableton effect you guys can maybe use
Protools is like this by default. That being said, it is important to export things in the best possible format. I’m actually liking to remove all effects and outputting to mono :) I can make things stereo then and it sounds better
This is the same issue in Logic Pro as well. I don't understand why this is the default. I figured this out like 2 years ago. My rule of thumb now is that if my track lane is Mono, then the balance pan is fine. If my track lane is Stereo, then I most likely want to use the Split Stereo Pan. Annoying to have to think about it, but this is what I do.
Yup! Spot on! And balance can still be helpful if you did want to adjust the level of the left and right channel in a drum loop let’s say. Or a single sample. But yeah I feel ya…that’s my basic starting point for everything too! ♥️👊
❤ and just to be clear...theres def still a use for the regular "Balance" parameter too! When you want to adjust the volume between the L&R channels in a sound that's still great. But often times it's going to produce a much different sound when trying to "place" a stereo sound in the mix. This is where that extra bit of control def comes in handy!
I always thought the pan knobs suck and somehow would listen to it but hadn't realized exactly how and what's going on behind the scenes. A better name would be "LR Crossfader" I guess.
you're welcome!!! happy to help. And there def can be phase issues when the two channels begin to overlap, 100%. That's ultimately why we always have to use our ears. Although something like this might technically be the "right" way to pan a specific sound in the mix, it could also create a whole new set of issues haha 😅So think of this as another way to use the tool, another option to try. But always go with what sounds best ❤
I did know that 100 L muted R, and 100 R muted L. But i had no idea i can actually move a sound on the right channel to the left and vice versa, until i looked it up when i needed that feature
So, panning internal to a synth vs. method 1 vs. method 2... all seem to have different nuances to it... Each method results in different peak amplitudes: No panning: -12.5dB 100% Left or 100% Right Internal to Synth: -8.24dB Method 1 100% L or 100% R: -9.61dB Method 2 100% L or 100% R: -6.60dB IDK if calling one method 'correct' or 'wrong' makes any sense, but it just from this it seems each method just has different nuances to it... probably a good thing to deep dive on.
♥️ absolutely! and really, the only thing that matters is how things sound (no matter what method we use). It just helps to always understand the many ways to place sounds around the mix!
@@TheCosmicAcademy shot bro. If you ever need dope music for one of your videos, I’d be happy to gift you one. This is a game changer. Thanks again 🔥👊🙏🏼
panning, specifically a stereo sound, is kind of an open space where the devs can do what they want. Why? real life sounds are not naturally stereo, you always have one single source where the audio waves originates from, so panning a mono sound is ways simpler, it's just about leveling left and right. How ever :) Been doing some research and small tests. Stereo is not what you think it is, which I found out by doing a completely different test, "the doppler effect", So, programattically, I setup two receivers (2 ears) and a mobile single source of sound generator moving around the space in various speeds and ways. That test made me realize, that stereo is not as much left and right levels as it is left and right delay. A simple test to verify this is to have the same mono sound in two channels, one completely panned left, the other completely panned right. Then offset one of the channels by a tiny bit (up to around 1, millisecond, or at 44.1KHz, about up to 44 samples) and you'll feel like the sound comes from the side where to sound were not offset. So what does this mean for non offset stereo sources? No solution is right basically. You can keep left when panning left and sort of mix in right, and vice versa, but that leaves other artifacts. the sound will sound more either panned or untouched (depending on the implementation). The "scientific" solution is to work with angels, but in the end you'll end up with the same issue, over amplified or underamplified.
What a well explained lesson. To this day, I just can't understand how the hell we can't move the whole signal left or right with 1 knob in Ableton. that split stereo option is ugly to use. still doesn't let you pan left to right using 1 button.
Not only is this an incredibly useful technique I will be trying out immediately. But I also just found out that my left and right speakers were mixed up. 🤣 God, every time I think I'm getting good I discover more baby errors
the same concept/routing does apply for groups! Would always depend on what you're goal is. If your goal is to just balance the volume of the L&R channel then the default pan is fine. If the goal is to move channels around, then yeah you'd have to switch it to "split pan" ❤️👊
thanks a ton...this was f*ckin with me on my last song and I couldn't figure out what was happening....I would pan 20 left and be like....now I just hear mono but no change in positioning........ geesh.
![Guitar Panning Solutions! [Mixing Technique]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4vafpOwvY9k/mqdefault.jpg)
🤯Stuck with your music career? Need PERSONALIZED help and development? Apply to our program… www.cosmicacademy.com
Vin Diesel without steroids and actually being a cool guy
Thanks? I think? 😂♥️
😂
🤣🤣🤣
I had never thought about the pan knob like that before, thanks for shedding light on this! This will undoubtedly be useful in future productions.
You’re welcome. Glad it was helpful and really appreciate you watching ♥️👊
I agree blew me away
Just tested it out and indeed this tip is an absolute GAME CHANGER for panning piano. BLESS YOU
Happy it helps!!! 👊♥️
As always, I hope this helps! ❤
♥️♥️♥️
I think I‘ve seen a tutorial on this before but definitely forgot about it and continued panning the „wrong“ way 😃
♥️♥️ this def helps!! Always still a place for the balance parameter (when you want to adjust volume in each ear)…but no doubt this true stereo pan will get you better placement in the mix if that’s what the goal is!!
Красавчик!!! Этот чувак открывает все секреты сведения. Респект.👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Да я тоже это заметил. ЛАЙК от меня. Молодец!!!
3:00 really cool difference, I didn't know about this! In Cubase (which I use) it's "Stereo combined panner" and it actually had this effect, it didn't reduce the volume.
Bro!! This is GOLD!! Your video explains why I struggled with my mixing. Thank you!!
You’re welcome! Happy it helps!
OMG I've been working in Ableton for 5 years and never right clicked the pan knob 🤯🤯🤯 And I've never seen anyone mention this before. Thanks you!
Hahahha!! I know the feeling…there are things like this I come across daily where I’m like “how did I never see this?!” 😂 I’m happy this can help!! ♥️
Thank the spirits someone who takes their time explaining, who actually shows the right method on both daws instead of just the one you're on
And this is why I started using the stereo rack plugin, my old daw didn't pan correctly. Plus I love that I can create and save chains with panning right there in one space.
So many years doing wrong...thanks Zack your videos are clarifying
Yep. I've been doing it wrong all this time. Never realized the pan knob worked this way. Can't believe how much of a difference this makes.
Wow def did not know channel pan just decreases the l/r volume… crazy. Great vid zack
Happy it helps!! What’s most important is just realizing the difference between the two because they each have their use case ♥️👊
Great tutorial and yes, even though I've been mixing for a "long" time, I can admit being fairly new to the DAW world this problem has been a head scratcher a couple of times. Thanks for the clarity!
I did this to percussion loops all the time, asked myself why it still sounded louder on one side even though I panned it 90% the other way, and why it would be so quiet when I panned it 100%. Thanks for the tutorial
as someone learning ways of ableton, i tought pan sounded iffy and never "full" but thank you for the full clarification.
happy this helps!!! 👊❤️
Never really knew that works this way. Thank you for the explanation!
You just changed the game for my fam!!
happy it helps!!
Thanks for showing me the mistake I’ve been doing all along
This method is much underused
Especially for people that record their hardware, synthesisers in stereo and find it hard to fit in the mix
You just got a new subscriber
🖐
Thanks!! Appreciate you joining our fam here!! 👊♥️
これは私が長らく疑問に感じていた項目です。
素晴らしい動画をありがとう。
Who knew! I sure didn't. This is a pretty big thing to have gotten wrong. I'm a Logic user. Thx for shedding the light!
excellent coverage of this misconception.
I've been making music for longer than I'd like to admit in this comment and never knew this! Thank you! Subscribed
I admit i too did this before i saw this... although thank fully i never panned any stereo track in the mix that way but i could have and would'nt even know how i am losing stuff in the mix xD .. Thanks a lot !!!
Small detail yet so important.
very small indeed haha but helps to know! 👊
I LEARNED SOMETHING NEW!! Had this issue with a loop and could NOT figure out how to fix it but you helped me thank you!! Subscribed 👌🏽👌🏽👌🏽👌🏽👌🏽
lets gooo!! happy it helped and appreciate you joining our cosmic fam here on YT ❤👊
i actually realized this a long time ago when i was working on my mix but didnt know how to fix it, your video saved me dude ❤btw have a nice day!
Wow! I never knew this before viewing this video! Thanks for this awesome content!
Thanks so much for all of your tutorials are incredible!! I think this may be particularly inherit issue in Ableton because in ProTools your mixer gives you both left and right panning channels so you’re sort of forced to go full left or full right if you want to pan properly …. But yeah I’ve used Ableton a few times and I had no idea this was the case thanks for the tip and saving me a headache 😊😊
It's crazy I've been doing it wrong this whole time... Thanks for the tip!!!
You're welcome!! ❤️👊 Really you just want to know the difference between the pan modes so you can always use the one that works best for your current sound/mix...happy this can help!
This is exactly the video I was looking for
I liked the synthwave background track at the end 😊
Hahaha not made by me. It’s part of some subscription for royalty free music…there’s some awesome songs in there though! Really talented producers
I admit.. I did it wrong the whole time. You are a genius! Thank you 🙏
Incredible. Thank you for bringing this to my attention. I never knew. I find the ableton two-knob UX for "stereo pan" unintuitive but I'll have to play with it.
Can def take some getting used to! Happy it helps and always appreciate you watching 👊♥️
Earned my sub because you took the time to show how to do it in other daws. I use FL, appreciated
WTF? ????This tip changes my whole Mix Mindset!!!!!!!!!!
Amazing video explanation, bro. Short, sweet, detailed, and super clear. I had no idea about this function. Thank you so much.
Pretty interesting, thanks, didn't realise some DAWs did this! As a ProTools user I've never had this issue; as I'm sure you'll know (as you didn't list ProTools ;-] ) stereo tracks have split-stereo panning by default.
Holy no way!!!! This is actually super big for my production style
happy it can help!! 👊❤️
His has just blown my mind, wow
😂👊
Didn't know that dom toretto is giving the craziest mixing and mastering lessons on youtube. Liked and subscribed
also "Pana - Natural Panner" is a big relief.
Thank you I'm learning a lot from your channel and correcting lots of misunderstanding ❤ Hope you have a nice day.
Thanks for show us, how to do it in FL
This is an insane tip, thank you
You’re welcome, happy to help! 👊♥️
Thank you so much!!!! This is Fire. I've ben doing it wrong foe years.
You’re welcome!! Happy it helps!! Def use cases for both, but it’s nice to know what each does!! 👊♥️
omg thanks!!! this is all i've been wanting to know! great video and the editing is awesome, gained my sub! :D
You’re very welcome! And thank you for being part of our fam here on YT! 👊♥️
thanks boss. i was bamboozled for the longest!
I admit my mistake and it was true I've been thinking this whole years
I was looking for a video like this, couldnt find it and suddenly this one appears on my feed, thank god : O
And thank you xD
hahaha its scary how youtube can read your mind right?!!? happy it could help
@@TheCosmicAcademy Actually hahahah, btw, I was looking to do the same inside a channel or rack, and doing some experimentation ive made a little ableton effect you guys can maybe use
Protools is like this by default. That being said, it is important to export things in the best possible format. I’m actually liking to remove all effects and outputting to mono :) I can make things stereo then and it sounds better
You guys are just amazing, Thank u so much
greatlyyyyyy appreciated!! ❤️👊
FL Studio You have to use the Fl Studio Stereo Shaper, You gave me an Idea to make a Split Stereo Patcher Preset...Thanks
The master strikes again..as usual very useful video
Thanks brother!! ♥️👊
This is the same issue in Logic Pro as well. I don't understand why this is the default. I figured this out like 2 years ago. My rule of thumb now is that if my track lane is Mono, then the balance pan is fine. If my track lane is Stereo, then I most likely want to use the Split Stereo Pan. Annoying to have to think about it, but this is what I do.
Yup! Spot on! And balance can still be helpful if you did want to adjust the level of the left and right channel in a drum loop let’s say. Or a single sample. But yeah I feel ya…that’s my basic starting point for everything too! ♥️👊
Great tip!
Man! That is a game changer!!!
Al put my hands up I didn’t look at it like this before 🤦♂️😅😅😂 amazing work thanks 🙏
Thanks Zack!! I'll be first to admit that I was definitely doing this wrong :)
❤ and just to be clear...theres def still a use for the regular "Balance" parameter too! When you want to adjust the volume between the L&R channels in a sound that's still great. But often times it's going to produce a much different sound when trying to "place" a stereo sound in the mix. This is where that extra bit of control def comes in handy!
Wow thank you! Now I finally get how the pro's make it sound good like that (sort of) !!! ;)
Seriously... watching some of yall's tutorials lately... i just need to right click EVERYTHING in Ableton... jeeez
Yessss!! 😂 so funny but that right click opens up a whole new world
Im gonna try this out!
Def give it a shot!! In many cases it can give you the control over “placement” that you’d be looking for when mixing instruments!!
Awesome! Thanks a ton for the explanation! Very useful!
Nice Video Never thought about this
Thanks! Happy it can help! 👊♥️
Great tutorial... RESPECT 🙏🙏
Thanks for this tip 🔥
You’re welcome!! Hope it can be useful moving forward! ♥️👊
Thanks Vin! 🙃
I always thought the pan knobs suck and somehow would listen to it but hadn't realized exactly how and what's going on behind the scenes. A better name would be "LR Crossfader" I guess.
hahaha happy this cleared it up! And totally...the way they word it makes it confusing! ❤️👊
Why has Ableton made this as a default? I never knew this 🙈
Thank you for sharing!
Hahaha! You’re welcome - Appreciate you watching and happy it helps! 👊
To avoid phase issues
I admite
Keap doing great content❤
Never realised till now. Thanks guys!
What about phase correlation? Is there any associated issue?
you're welcome!!! happy to help. And there def can be phase issues when the two channels begin to overlap, 100%. That's ultimately why we always have to use our ears. Although something like this might technically be the "right" way to pan a specific sound in the mix, it could also create a whole new set of issues haha 😅So think of this as another way to use the tool, another option to try. But always go with what sounds best ❤
Thank you very much!
Much love for the cosmic academy
♥️♥️♥️ back at ya
Just found this...... So much time doing it wrong. Dang! Thank you
Thats f@#king awesome Thank you you just solved one of my many mysteries for real love your videos
Thank youuu!! Happy these have been able to help!
thats awsome . thanks , by the way the name of the software is "Live" and not Ableton ... also blown my mind after years of producing
Console users are laughing at us 😂
I did know that 100 L muted R, and 100 R muted L. But i had no idea i can actually move a sound on the right channel to the left and vice versa, until i looked it up when i needed that feature
So, panning internal to a synth vs. method 1 vs. method 2... all seem to have different nuances to it...
Each method results in different peak amplitudes:
No panning: -12.5dB
100% Left or 100% Right Internal to Synth: -8.24dB
Method 1 100% L or 100% R: -9.61dB
Method 2 100% L or 100% R: -6.60dB
IDK if calling one method 'correct' or 'wrong' makes any sense, but it just from this it seems each method just has different nuances to it... probably a good thing to deep dive on.
♥️ absolutely! and really, the only thing that matters is how things sound (no matter what method we use). It just helps to always understand the many ways to place sounds around the mix!
This is amazing bro
I didn’t know this tip thank you
You’re welcome! Really happy it helps! ♥️👊
@@TheCosmicAcademy shot bro. If you ever need dope music for one of your videos, I’d be happy to gift you one.
This is a game changer. Thanks again 🔥👊🙏🏼
Man... Thanks for one!
You’re welcome!! 👊♥️
Thanks. Subscribed 👍
this is for stereo signals but with mono guitars panning hard left and right its ok to pan without split the Channels
yep
absolutely insane ive never heard anyone talk about this before
♥️ appreciate you watching and hope it can be an immediate help! 👊
panning, specifically a stereo sound, is kind of an open space where the devs can do what they want. Why? real life sounds are not naturally stereo, you always have one single source where the audio waves originates from, so panning a mono sound is ways simpler, it's just about leveling left and right. How ever :) Been doing some research and small tests. Stereo is not what you think it is, which I found out by doing a completely different test, "the doppler effect", So, programattically, I setup two receivers (2 ears) and a mobile single source of sound generator moving around the space in various speeds and ways. That test made me realize, that stereo is not as much left and right levels as it is left and right delay. A simple test to verify this is to have the same mono sound in two channels, one completely panned left, the other completely panned right. Then offset one of the channels by a tiny bit (up to around 1, millisecond, or at 44.1KHz, about up to 44 samples) and you'll feel like the sound comes from the side where to sound were not offset.
So what does this mean for non offset stereo sources? No solution is right basically. You can keep left when panning left and sort of mix in right, and vice versa, but that leaves other artifacts. the sound will sound more either panned or untouched (depending on the implementation). The "scientific" solution is to work with angels, but in the end you'll end up with the same issue, over amplified or underamplified.
I just feel like ableton back stabbed me
What a well explained lesson. To this day, I just can't understand how the hell we can't move the whole signal left or right with 1 knob in Ableton. that split stereo option is ugly to use. still doesn't let you pan left to right using 1 button.
What if you made the track mono or bounced the stereo file into a mono file? Would it sound the same as using stereo pan?
yup! mono files can just use the default balance parameter (because its the same information in both L&R channels)
Not only is this an incredibly useful technique I will be trying out immediately. But I also just found out that my left and right speakers were mixed up. 🤣 God, every time I think I'm getting good I discover more baby errors
Am I suppose to do this when I group my tracks as well?
the same concept/routing does apply for groups! Would always depend on what you're goal is. If your goal is to just balance the volume of the L&R channel then the default pan is fine. If the goal is to move channels around, then yeah you'd have to switch it to "split pan" ❤️👊
Thank you
thanks a ton...this was f*ckin with me on my last song and I couldn't figure out what was happening....I would pan 20 left and be like....now I just hear mono but no change in positioning........ geesh.
You’re very welcome Ryan 👊♥️ always happy to hear these tips help!!
My problem is usually with applying Stereo Delay on panned synths. I never know what to expect / how to control the outcome...
you can do this in ableton mixer as well, just like in FL studio..
thank you very much!
does anyone know how to pan right in fl studio?
You’re welcome! In FL there is the channel pan, and mixer pan. The channel pan is a “balance” parameter. The mixer pan knob is a “stereo pan”
Thanks
I literally stopped mixing in ableton and switched to protools because of this thing and 8 years later realize I had it in the wrong setting 🤦🏾♂️
Hahahaha ♥️ I feel that pain!!