My only issue with the deck is "your opponent cannot activate card effects during the battle phase" bruh you telling me I can't even attempt to try and save myself?
Yeah if the hand was good enough sometimes they’d just open fieldspell + the ability to make transcendent so you actually can’t do anything the entire turn!
@@gameguru42392 😂 You are very much correct, but "cannot activate" and "negate the activation" is completely different to me, I can understand one or two negate because of the state of the game but to shut down the interaction completely is just awful.
Any deck that has this one card that make them invulnerable during their turn (Sangen Summoning, Gimmick Puppet Field Spell) are the dumbest deck ever designed.
Gimmick Puppet field spell is even worse than Summoning imo, put them in defence mode if you're not playing XYZ then you can only get over them with a Kaiju or piercing. When i first went against it in MD i was actually shocked they printed a card that stupid (i was playing Kashtira tho so my Arise-Heart could banish them no problem, if i was playing something like D-Link tho I'd have had to just cope and scoop)
I disagree principally, but in practice, the Gimmick Puppet field is definitely unfair because the deck only uses the main phase and wins first turn before the 2nd player can setup. Sangen Summoning isn't so bad because the deck wins through the battle phase and it's difficult to get the level 10 to protect the battle phase before then, and makes it harder to dish out that damage against a full board if you do. Tenpai in general, while powerful, is in my opinion overrated. A well-timed book of moon or compulse effect stops them dead in their tracks more often than not. It just so happens many meta decks don't have that option, but it goes to show how vulnerable tenpai actually is when rogue decks do better against it than other meta decks.
6:57 ON THIS NOTE. I was wondering "Why did people who loved tear, and loved that tier zero format, hate Tenpai so much?" Also "Why isn't tenpai considered tier 0?" and I think there's different answers to both of those questions after having played Tenpai. For one thing, Tenpai mirrors are very swingy. You essentially compare hands with your opponent, and whoever gets the first battle-phase has a big advantage. Tear mirrors had a lot of effects going off from both players as cards would be hitting the grave and you'd have to be careful about what effects to trigger when and how to chain-block. Tenpai has none of that depth. The reason it's not tier 0 is because it is still a blind 2nd deck, and there are *some* boards you can make in this game that are *actually* unbreakable. Also in MD Tenpai came in right around the time Gimmick puppet got to full power, and I got FTK'd by random strategies multiple times. So in short I think the reason people hate tenpai so much is actually it's lack of depth.
As much as Ishizu Tear has traumatized the YGO community for its 45 minute long mirror turns, it’s genuinely such an interesting game to watch and play in a way that still feels like YGO. Is it Tier0? Yes. Did people hate Havnis for enabling turn 0’s? Yes. But did you actually get to play the game in spite of that and engage in your opponent in a way where you had to think about what decisions you had to make to win? YES! And that’s what Tenpai lacks.
So… we either get. T0 formats where you play nothing but T0. (I’m looking at you Tear format). Or the usual, if you can’t stop the set up T1 you have to deal with floodgate.board or negates.board. Or in the case of Tenpai. Go second meta in MD…. And tenpai being one of the few OTK going second decks that can consistently win… There’s no winning for YGO isn’t it?
I feel like the real problem here is that there aren't multiple great budget decks. People are tired of going against Tenpai. Tenpai wouldn't be so prevalent if every other damn deck wasn't so expensive.
Exactly. I get why people don't like Tenpai, but it'd be a lot less of a problem if most meta decks were actually affordable instead of requiring you to have a six figure income to be able to reasonably and reliably afford them. There are card games that allow people to play meta strategies without requiring you to sell a kidney, and they do pretty well. Pokemon is a classic example, and it's one of the big 3. Yu-Gi-Oh has no excuse.
I think that the very idea of a "budget deck" indicates an even deeper problem here. A children's card game should not expect you to spend upwards of $1000 on a meta relevant deck.
Well as far as Budget decks go in Master Duel. You have a couple of decks that rely on less than 10-15 URs like Memento, Melodious, or Ritual Beast. But those decks are not as flashy and they are very combo intensive meaning if you don't practice or study the deck and it's interactions vs other decks it's hard to win
this is talking about master duel where tenpai is arguably just as if not more pricey than everything else since its jamming 20 hand traps most of which are sr or ur and the entire tenpai engine itself is also sr ur i guess you could argue the extra is cheaper than some other decks but thats barely even true
The irony that probably the best Tenpai counter I’ve seen is another OTK deck. Ancient gears specifically, chaos max giant completely turns off their battle phase stuff and forces them to route to monster effect destruction since its immune at spell and trap board breakers
I really don’t get people defending Tenpai. Yes people hate cards that say “the opponent doesn’t get to play while you OTK them.” That doesn’t contradict thinking turn 1 is too strong.
While Sangen Summoning is understandable as Tenpai doesn't do much in Main Phase 1 and really just wants to go to BP asap, Transcendient basically goes against what I'd want from a battle focused deck. Wdym no epic battles involving card activations from both players ?
@gameguru42392 You may not think Tenpai isn't a problem, but it is a part of the problem. Feedback and interactions in the community rather than fighting is best. Heck I played Kashtira with Destruction Sword at my locals and admitted I felt dirty playing Kash at that time even if I didn't play it pure for maximum efficiency. Nothing wrong with liking cards or decks and admitting there is a problem. It shows more character and humility rather than blindly saying everything is fine well the house is burning down.
I agree with people saying Tenpai is result of 'going 1st too powerful' problem in Yugioh. The deck is just as cancerous as combo decks that go 1st and set up auto-win field, as they both have same goal: playing as little Yugioh as possible. I hate the fact that Tenpai can jam in 25 handtraps and board-breakers AND the remaining 15 cards (except Fadra) are 1-card OTK. Tenpai being very hard to interact only adds the pain going against it. "Oh they have Sangen Summoning on field. But that's okay i still can make play in battle phase", yeah good luck with that if Transcendant Dragion hits field in main phase 1. Going 1st too powerful is an actual problem in Yugioh. But i don't think Tenpai is good answer for it in terms of game healthiness. I really wish for going second deck that has a lot of interaction with opponent (i don't really consider hand-trapping opponent 5 times interaction), and also doesn't automatically win game on the spot.
But lab and other decks playing d barrier and anti spell fragrance isn’t more cancerous? Yubel and snake eyes taking 15-20 mins of peoples time to not let them play whatsoever isn’t cancerous? You know what other decks can fit that many hand traps? Literally the ones I just mentioned oh and math mech not as many but pretty close and their turn 1 potential is way better and if they have enough on the field can stop tenpai just like they stop every other deck. Tear and other formats were way worse and the deck is overhated because their favorite RUclipsr that they live vicariously through said the deck was so oppressive and cried about it yet tear and others were perfectly fine.
I think the idea behind "Tenpai is a cheap deck" is based around the idea that in the TCG, you don't need to spend 100 billion dollars on the actual Tenpai cards. I love Maliss. Been looking forward to playing em for a minute. I had to buy the whole core from a friend for 200. That's just the MALISS cards. I have 6 URs that cost that much from Maliss alone, I definitely would have payed more had I bought from TCGPlayer. In reality, buying all the staples is still expensive, but at LEAST they transfer to other decks I own. I don't even necessarily NEED to play them to win (They do HELP though. Like Fuwaross.)
Watch one tenpai game in MD. They will attack with all 3 dragons on your 2k attack monster before synchro summoning to beat over it, instead of doing that first, then having one spare dragon to attack with. Tenpai isn't just brainless, it made so brainless people could get decently high in the ranks (easily hit master, for example), while other meta decks would punish the hell out of you for missing a single opportunity.
They can overkill you by 20K damage anyways. That 4K damage ain’t gonna do nothing. They attack three times beforehand to trigger chandra, fadra, and fulfill the conditional on their synchro monsters before they synchro and have less monsters to attack with. Otherwise interaction can shut down their ability to summon their synchro from grave. Say they synchro first then you negate their synchro. They would be fucked since their chandra or fadra are now stuck in the grave. Say you blow up their synchro. They would be fucked as they wouldn’t have enough attacks. Attacking beforehand is safer, even if you do no damage.
Multiple aspects of tenpai feel unfair. Tenpai has multiple 1 card starters with lots of room for non-engine, most rogue decks cant compete with that. Only the best combos can survive getting blasted by boardbreakers and handtraps, the game doesnt have that many options. So im forced to use a meta deck if i want to compete, i see some people run lab stun too, its causing lots of stun players to appear because they see its unfair and dont have other responses
On the floodgates note, I'm pretty sure I've seen some tenpai lists play rivalry of warlords in the side, sometimes main, deck in the early days of the deck so the whole "tenpai doesn't play floodgates" take is just BS
lol every decks plays floodgates. people do forget that in MD we do play the Maxx c minigame. every tenpai deck plays at least one maxx c because it's bat shit insane
I know that they side stuff like heatwave and koaki meru dragon, but bro is a master duel player so he probably was just talking about it within a format without siding
I mean you don’t even need those. They have a card that literally says, you can not activate cards or effects for the entire battle phase while it’s on field. That is by definition a floodgate. I will hear an argument that Sangen Summoning isn’t a floodgate because you can play around it but Transcendent is a floodgate, plain and simple
What I absolutely hate about tenpai is when they droplet your anti tenpai monster (my case scareclaw tri heart cuz I play scareclaw). It’s just stupid, I make a decent board out of actual creativity and they just stomp you for playing anything other than pure floodgates guess that’s why friggin spellcaster forest has been a thing now (which I actually agree until konami bans both forest and tenpai fadra. I swear fadra’s like their key card because without it tenpai actually has to mind which card they friggin hit)
@codyhanson1344 Well the chances of that should be very slim if you are playing these decks that are built to give you the consistent boards with all the starters you could have in your deck or have a ridiculous amount of hand traps as interruption.
@@ThaRealElementX yeah but you say its to punish making strong boards, so naturally the counter should be to not make a board right? Otherwise it's just damned if you do, damned if you don't, isn't it?
@@codyhanson1344 No, maybe you should play the outs necessary to beat that deck if you feel like that's reason you are losing. Maybe makes your deck less consistent, but people shouldn't be building decks to just facilitate their own gameplan and the only thing to patch up potential weaknesses is to slap in all the generic hand traps with some "spicy" tech sprinkled in. I'm not saying that tenpai is the answer, but modern Yu-Gi-Oh is literally whoever goes first format for nearly forever. I think they should add more decks that are incentized to go second. Honestly they need to rework this game. It's too dumb how much of an advantage you have for going first smh
I can sympathize with Josh. I know Konami always one-ups itself in powercreep, i mean that's the description of the word there but making a second going deck that can virtually insulate itself for two phases in a consistent manner is insane.
14:01 The problem with Tenpai is it is cheap, easier to learn than most decks, and it can compete. Simply put, give a new player Tenpai and they will be able to win. Give them Ritual Beast or Snakes-Eyes, they will quit before they ever win.
Tenpai was the final form of Going Second. This game really needs to stop printing nonsense cards and archtypes that keep aggressively pushing a general gameplay style that ends in "Stop or play through as much interaction as you can".
A crutch deck being meta is not great, but crutch decks in general are a great tool imo. I came back to yugioh at the release of master duel, and I played crusadia otk which while very simple allowed me to understand how modern yugioh is played
main issue I see with rant videos like this is that it doesn't necessarily suggest any solutions... everyone's done it, "Tenpai sucks to face", "Swordsoul is braindead", "Fuck Tear", yada yada yada... I don't often have the means to try the really powerful shit out myself until after it gets nerfed, so it's just a waste of my time whining... people want to win, and they know Tenpai can do it... Yugioh has often had a going first issue, and the few times going second actually becomes something a player would want, it's with a deck that slams their fist on the scale in the other direction. it's clear something needs to change, but outside of the common complaints that are easy to meme with, nobody can really agree on anything beyond a handful of basically mandatory cards. I, as a pendulum fan, still hold resentment over the TCG for keeping Electrumite and Astrograph banned for little good reason beyond "FUCK PENDULUM"... so, I'm not wasting my money buying paper cards for TCG events. they obviously don't like players like me, so fine, I'll stick with Master Duel...
Tenpai would be a thousand times more tolerable if we were able to interact with it at all during the battle phase. The fact that they trigger all of their effects in Damage Step is ridiculous.
@@JanizMakudomaru well, kinda of, yes, they just upgraded it too much. I would be fine with battle phase immunity but having also main phase 1 total immunity is silly. I think if field spell was banned, it would be fine idk.
@@Xero-rr2ol Good because it's cancer when it just ignores interaction. Honestly, I think it's more interesting if the Tenpai player had to go into their 3k guy to gain the BP immunity because at least that forces them to make a suboptimal play to keep them in the game.
Tenpai is a symptom, not the disease (kinda same for tear, but its easyer to notice in tenpai) Tenpai shows how fragile the current game is currently Just being able to dodge common hand traps is already enough to stirr up the meta enough to make a deck go from mid to deadly Similar goes for cards like dimension shifter, maxx c, or the tear deck, etc They all attack a certain thing in the meta, but everything in there is so established and required that even disrupting a single feature temporarily causes a loss for the opponent Most of the game feels like a one trick pony rn, where the strategy from everyone is basically the same, and uses the exact same pathways Load a bunch of 1 card starters into your deck, load some handtraps in there, load some anti handtrap cards in there, ad a few extenders and combo pieces in there, and done Now how every deck plays... use your 1 card starter, occasionally try to block your opponents hand traps with your own, spam your board with monsters, use the monsters to make some generic disruptive cards (and in rare cases even a in-archetype disruptive card), end your turn, and watch your opponent not able to do anything because they get all their stuff negated and maybe even floodgated, then next turn you win Ofc a deck like tenpai would cause some chaos there if it can just ignore the negates in those strategys, or ofc would tear win (or dim shifter) by taking the GY combo pieces away The current meta really feels like a game both people try to throw bricks at a mirror being held by the other person... something narrow which can guarantee the win, and the goal is to stop the other... but as soon as somebody decided to put a blanked over their own mirror, or decided to instead aim the brick at the others feet to make them stumble and drop the mirror, then its shows just how fragile and stupid that game actually is
Tenpai is just a newer version of Numeron. Uses a lot of handtraps/board breakers/going second cards then wait for one card combo and otk. The thing about Tenpai is that outside of the field spell and Sangenpai the cards do nothing to the opponent besides battle damage. They dont negate, banish, flip face down, become untargetable, blow up your field on summon with adventage (SEFK style), or even become a threat until there are multiple on field. Outside of a specific hand of tenpai cards they arent getting the field spell, kaimen, and chundra out at the same time in mp1 which means they arent summoning sangenpai during their main phase which means if you have about 2 disruptions by their battle phase they lose. And if they Sangenpai during mp1 then either they arent gonna otk, or, like any deck, they had a great hand to finish you off with. And if they have to pass turn they are most likely dead because of 0 protections
People hated unga bunga Numeron and Mikanko, and those decks were never meta. They were just annoying rogue decks that steal wins sometimes off of Kaijus and breakers. Tenpai is Numeron on crack. The part I hate most about the deck is that it's like 65% non engine, so you get those same cringe ass games as in Snake Eye format where hand trap wars determine who wins. As a result, non-Tenpai are playing stun, all gas combo decks or cancer Thrust targets like D Barrier so they can stand a chance against activate Summoning, normal Paidra. Tenpai made the entire format more toxic than ever because Konami decided to fight fire with fire instead of trying to balance their game, so the players did the same. This banlist won't kill the deck either, so look forward to 9 Maxx C Tenpai in the near future.
Tenpai was just a symptom of turn 1 being way too fucking strong. It was either play Tenpai or play some busted turn 1 deck that just wins anyways. Yugioh has become a game of allowing as little interactions as possible
@@Anima556tear was pretty competitive and still had a lot of interaction with it, it's just that stuff like gravekeepers (anti grave) have been around for a long time while this doesn't really have any counter archetype besides 1 turn ftks which just isn't fun for most people.
Its been like that for a decade. I started really playing during the degen dragons vs spellbook era and if you weren't playing either deck you were playing something like mermail otk. The game has been turn 1 focused long before Tenpai.
They had a way to make going 2nd viable, but Tempai was definitely not it for a healthy game state due to their field spell not allowing interactions. Mikanko, Yubel, and Gladiator Beasts have the most balanced makings of second turn doable as you can still interact with the board during their effects.
Yubel isn't in any way balance, it puts up more disruption than your opponent has cards in hand and can insulate the combo with phantom of custom cards, you can't even out it with a drnm.
@ Yubel does have some issues which got toned down though Fiendsmith made them stronger than necessary due to fiend compatibility. However like I said at least you can interact with the cards to interrupt some level of play compared to Tempai which is set field spell and can’t counterattack then take everything to the face. Knowing Konami, they are letting Fiendsmith do whatever then nerf em to the ground then release another broken set. Rinse and repeat.
Imagine having a full board set up for your opponent to just slap mystic mine on board then normal summons chundra and you cant do a single thing about it because of mystic mine ☠️
Out of the last 10 games against tenpai where i had terahertz on the field. 7 times they had freakin forbidden droplet in hand. At this point i hate that card more than tenpai.
Yes, decks that say "you can't interact with me" are not fun. The problem is the field spell, if it was limited to monster effects or spell and trap effect it would atleast have some degree of counter play.
What's the difference between Tenpai asking the turn 1 player for an out to field spell (Ghost Ogre or your endboard if it has it) vs SE Ash asking the turn 2 player for an Imperm or Veiler? You can easily argue that requiring a more specific out is about equal to being able to use your entire endboard vs only your hand.
@@MistAssassin69 because turn 2 player can bait those options out and continue turn one player can't bait out the field spell because it is a field spell
@@zsatroof5219 Not really? Those options are pretty much subscribed to field spell there's nothing else to hit unless it's an omni. Even if they weren't, shouldn't the turn 2 player have that advantage of playing reactively and baiting answers? The so called interaction is happening and the turn 1 player has massive other advantages. Also the turn 1 player doesn't need to bait out field spell, they're the one demanding answers from turn 2's opening hand or they will build an obscene board (Yubel's god board doesn't give a shit about field spell). The best thing about Tenpai is that they play so much nonengine that they'll often have the answers. And there's been these very resilient to handtrap turn 1 decks over the last year, you can argue that they've been FTK-ing and inflicting the same thing to you that Tenpai does.
@@MistAssassin69 that's the inherent problem is there is no need to argue a hypothetical ftk when tenpai will literally just ftk you with no interaction. They get so much non engine in the deck it doesn't solve the turn 2 issue it just flips the issue the other way which doesn't lead to any positive results for the game. It just makes turn 1 the new bad die roll instead of turn 2
13:37 Bro literally mentioning my regionals run in August, went with labrynth, didn’t win a single match (yes, it was skill issue) but 5 out of 8 matches were tenpai and this part simply explains my pain
Yugioh needs less power creep, more cards with real restrictions, more archetype exclusive boss monsters, less generic ones. less decisiveness of the coin flip. more formats. Tenpai is a solution to a problem... but it's a ''solution'' that doesn't properly address the problem of overtuned dumb cards so it creates more overtuned dumb cards and the result is things continuing to get worse overall anyway. For some reason we humans keep doing things like that and think we're being reasonable at the same time. Tenpai is basically ''hmmm how do we make sure we are playing a fun and healthy game? oh I know, let's blow everything up and destroy the game because if there is no game anymore so that means the problem is gone!" but konami sells it as "SEE! the game is NOT broken! we just made going second great again so it's all fine! y'all can cool off now! and don't forget to buy our products!" it's basically acceleracionism in archetype form and we know that never works lol. If y'all then say "but MONEY!" then... that's the problem, money is the problem and it's certainly not exclusive to Yugioh and we need to stop being afraid to address it.
Ironically, Tenpai was the one deck I had the highest winrate against during this format But man, opponents just consistently drawing all 3 handtraps needed to destroy me, 2 combo starters, and both Crossout with Called By for the entire tournament was what made me quit for awhile
11:28 Yes, Tenpai is easy to learn compared to most decks. In terms of outreach, your going to get a lot more players if you give them Tenpai than if you give them Plants or Ritual Beasts.
alt title "how bad is going 2nd in yugioh" the deck that is good going 2nd wins as much as any other nerfed top deck btw, yubel incomplete, snake eyes hit and incomplete, ritual beast i was really hoping for ban every top deck or ban nothing this DC, but i guess konami has its favorites back to the coin flip meta we go
Tbh as a returning player to Yugioh, I got so traumatized by Tenpai in the duelist cup (Played Dragon Link), that in any case of the opponent forcing me to go second or the second I see some weird bullshit I immediately call that I'm facing tenpai and go dragoon turbo and pray... (Which sometimes work and other times doesn't, specifically the cases where they had a second sangen summoning after I negated the first one)
I had a great matchup against Tenpai, my biggest issue were the Bug and random decks I had no gameplan for like Labyrinth and Spright. I can run though a few hand traps, I can completely shut down the board breakers but if I don't stop that Bug from multiplying, instant loss.
The problem i have is that tenpai is that its busted for these 2 reasons: 1.- no side deck: you cant play negate attack on main deck as it is not realistic, however, in side deck you can because NOW its god sent against tenpai. 2.- no activation of effects during BP: even if i bring avramax, is not gonna be enough because NOW i cant boost my attack, it does lead to a tie and one card getting send to the hand, but still pretty dumb how even battle tricks are negated by just ONE syncho
Like, here's how brain dead the deck is: I picked up my freind's Tenpai deck, put in some board breakers that he needed, and proceeded to rofl stomp him twice in a row. The deck is an auto-pilot deck. There's this one kid that scammed a win at locals against me once when he was playing Tenpai. Not even full power Tenpai which makes this even worse. What this kid is normally on is normal summon Elemental HERO Avian or some shit , set one and pass. I wanted to die that night when he won against me with Tenpai. On the opposite side of the spectrum, there's another Tenpai player that blinds going first that ends on double Cosmic Blazar and Seals pass and it's actually pretty consistent. It's definitely a change of pace from what I normally see in Tenpai and opens up a lot of different options. Make me go first? Okay, you're not breaking my board. Make me go second? Okay, I'll just OTK you.
just got back into master duel on 7th of dec and tenpai was what i crafted first so im only sad because now it gone and i dont wanna sit in a long match
Yeah, Tenpai is totally the problem. Yeah no. I've played Yugioh for a while now and the problem happened several formats ago. No one ever said anything except Stun, Mine Burn, and any other deck which could be considered unique is "bad" and a "crutch deck" just because it requires a couple cards to help boost it's wins in an unoptimized meta game. Remember guys, You can only attack in Yugioh as a win condition. Obviously after your opponent combos out half their deck for 3 negates after 20 minutes.
While Tenpai is getting feedback I'm over here thinking about that Master Duel Chimertech Megafleet Dragon, then Duality into Cyber Twin Dragon turn 2 kill feeling a little like Tenpai, myself.
It speaks a lot about it's fairness how the deck can only exist in 1 of 2 states; either completely busted and pretty much unstoppable going second or absolutely massacred with it's central pieces limited. There's no in between.
Finally someone has the balls to tell the the truth. All i've been hearing this entire duellist cup is how broken dragoon is. A card thats outed by atleast 30 of the most common/staples in the game, and in a month or so anacondas gonna get banned so best case scenario one monster and 2 backrow nice turn. All while 70 to 80% of people are just using tenpai and playing the exact same braindead way,summon 1 monster.. is there a response no gg.
i think the big difference between this and league ladder is that rank 1 doesnt give you a spot at worlds and is just an achievment you can optinally go for
Even on paper the duelist cup is a joke don't defend it! You can go on streaks of losing coin toss after coin toss and while it's not automatically a lost game right away if you dont draw a very specific hand of either hand traps or bord breakers and engine or your opponent just does nothing because they bricked you are out of luck.Yes my coin toss luck is really bad I gone on multiple 5 streaks of losing coin tosses and even over that and on top of that in the few cases that I finally won coin tosses there is the risk of running into tenpai or yubel. Really fun game design but even on paper the DC is a joke and you are a clown if you defend the format.
No one defend it, even for someone who likes to grind like ryan, said there has to be better system than we have now, if you watched the full podcast. Thats just how any pvp game manipulate their player' competitiveness, forcing them to compete on bad system.
TCG player here I played pure Tenpai before second wave support came out and after it was released I stopped playing the deck and used the common card deck core in my Horus deck as an engine because it synergizes with the old LV Horus cards especially Sangen Kaimen let me Sp. Summon Horus LV6 during the BP and run over weak monsters to get the LV8 during the EP and infinite Spell negates the next turn. The recent banlist update on Chundra and Sangen Kaimen doesn't hurt as much since I just picked apart my pure Tenpai deck and added Paidra to the Horus deck to make it a bit more consistent now and it feels like a deck with a bit more variation.
dawg, so many people complained about Tenpai just cuz it's a deck that can bust through a bunch of strategies that set up a bunch of negates and big monsters. I mean... cry about it? XD I think it's nice to have a deck that not hard to learn, isn't insanely expensive, and that also WINS. Sorry your $1k deck couldn't handle some dragons synchro summoning during the battle phase. I never lowkey liked Tenpai, I highkey LOVED IT. Fight me.
The most interactivity I've seen with Tenpai is with my own favorite archetype from 2016. Destruction Sword. They just hateeeee Buster Blader the Dragon Destroyer Swordsman. Which is an archetype you can easily hybrid with other stronger or more modern archetypes. Such as Kashtira, or Centur-ion. An archetype which is actually more budget on Master Duel than Tenpai's supposed "budget" 3 cards are UR 2 are SR and you really only need 4 UR crafts and 3 SR crafts, for some recovery to the engine or you can full minimal with 1 each of said cards. But Buster Blader the Dragon Destroyer Swordsman just full stops Tenpai as its continous effect prevents dragon monsters from activating effects and their forced into defense position. You have to play carefully however due to the deck full of non engine counters, its GG if they Have Forbidden Droplet and go Transcendeint before battle phase, or a Called By/DD Crow. Tenpai needs Erratas, which won't happen in this day and age as thats rarer than bans and costs Konami money thus meaning it's a system that is once in 5 years at best with current modern Konami. Seriously why does every Tenpai have the quick effect to synchro that isn't hard once per turn. Lets look at a synchro deck that plays during your opponents turn that has a balanced effect like this. Ghoti. All their tuners are once per turn, but come back after being banished every single standby phase. Imagine how broken Ghoti could be if it was soft once per turn. Honestly Tenpai isn't fun because of the same reason Labyrinth and Runick isn't fun. Its hard control that their isn't much interactivity with and is pretty much just one person playing by themselves well the other just sighs and rolls their eyes. You have to run super specific counters that can damn you against many other decks.
I had been playing Snake Eye/Fire King and then Tenpai came out, and I went totally back to Labrynth. You use the trap the forbids a type (Synchro) in this case and usually it’s gg. Been playing a ton of White Forest lately, it does pretty well too against it if you end with Dragoon, Blazar and another negate or two.
As a Yubel/Neos player, the thing about Tenpai that pisses me off is that despite Yubel having the obvious advantage over Tenpai, Yubel still loses to it. Even if they don't slap droplets and 0tk you even through half damage, they can still counter Yubel's main game plan thanks to Freaking Paidra! They knew Yubel would be an easy counter to this deck so they gave one of the main combo pieces a passive effect that nullifies battle damage! And their boss monster prevents cards and effects from activating in the battle phase so Yubel can't burn them either! After waiting so long for Yubel to become an actual deck, they just immediately made a deck that counters nearly everything Yubel wants to do! It feels like Tenpai was made the way it was just to spite Yubel.
@@ratioed1438 it's strong no doubt about it, but the thing that really pushes it over the top is the fiend link pile. Unchained and Fiend Smith abuse other decks so easily that they can practically fit in nearly anything.
Lab player here, and I totally feel this against Tenpai and to a lesser effect Snake-Eyes. Any other deck would kill to have the kind of protection and consistency Tenpai has for essentially free.
Came back versing a Tenpai player for the hundredth time... Whomever thought that this was the answer to the going first combo decks was obviously on something. You're telling me that I can't activate ANY cards to defend myself?! Very interactive, Konami. 🤦🤦🤦
Not to mention I met some nasty Tenpai Players on Master Duel. Always boasting how I should just surrender even one went on a full rant when I was using Road Rollers effect on him to prevent him from attacking.
IMO opinion its not that Tenpai was too OP or anything its just that the DC favored getting as much wins as possible instead of factoring in a win /loss ratio which is why people play Tenpai since its a fast deck.
Specially where master duel is concerned in a best of one format. In my opinion Tenpai makes the game healthy. There are too many going first decks by an overwhelming majority in a best of one format. They should make more decks like Tenpai in the future specially where MD is concerned. Unless they change the format of MD in some shape or form. I'll stand on this that Tenpai is healthy for MD.
Yea i play MD on and off, highest I'd ever gotten pre-Tenpai was Diamond II because i don't play super often. During the month Tenpai released, i got from Plat V to Master V within a week, then Master I the week after. And i didn't feel like i accomplished anything, the climb was not only easy but boring, Tenpai is no fun to play and it's even worse to play against. I just hope Konami nukes this miserable deck, sick of having to play it/play against it.
man you guys all yapping so much and being hypocrites Going First OP = yaps now Going Second OP = yaps 😂😂 and Going First deck have some record being Tier 0
Speaking of that Newbie Friendly point. Giving tenpai for a newbie that learning about this card game is like giving cocaine for people that want to know narcotics effect on people. I would prefer Swordsoul any time for newbies instead of this unhealthy overpriced tumor. I tried to play this deck during the Duelist Cup and i can feel my brain dying just after two matches and then gladly playing my 60 cards Plant-Link pile or Fire King Snake-Eye White Forest and it feels like heaven and much more fun compared to Tenpai
I honestly agree been playing with white forest. They set that damn feild spell all my interaction goes out the window. It's honestly infuriating why I could never seem to play my rda build to
Yugioh has always been a poorly designed TCG, that I can certainly concede, however, with just the right card design, it does have the potential to be an amazing game. It's just that Konami's design philosophy has never truly been in the right place. Early on they refused to have a proper banlist while creating cards that were seemingly never properly tested, perhaps a symptom of inexperience, but now that the game has grown enough to understand how to design for it better, the way Konomi chooses to go about it just doesn't make for very welcoming gameplay. With the vast card pool that currently exists, I'm sure there is a combination of at least a few hundred cards that when legal together would make for an amazing format. It's just a matter of finding and testing the right combination of cards, although such task is made more difficult by the stubbornness of yugioh players not want to play a "custom" format.
@@Austin-l1j Difference is Tear wasn't free win If you suck with it. A baby could play Tenpai BLINDFOLDED and still snatch win. Tear required at least SOME braincells. And was way cheaper than tenpai btw
@ it was a free win it was by far and away the best deck. You could just click buttons and win. You didn’t have to do anything. Sure you could Play a card and have “Interaction” but your card wouldn’t do anything so really what’s the difference? There isn’t one. Idk why the argument is always “hurrr durrr tear had interaction” when in reality it didn’t yeah it was cheaper I guess but at least you didn’t have to only play tear to be competitive which is not the case for tenpai. Tear also carried terrible players to masters due to the power discrepancy between it and every deck at the time so this argument is moot also tear’s card art is ugly unlike tenpai oh and it’s turns are shorter and it doesn’t play on your turn hardly.
@@Austin-l1j Tear was skilled ONLY if you played Tear yourself. Tear mirrors are skilled apparently, and extremely tedious to play against with any other deck. Ppl who like Tear loved the mirror, nothing else. Tenpai mirror is not that skilled & interactive. If you ask me, we need neither but what do I know.
I think it's dumb to complain about Tenpai rather than Konami forcing players to switch over to it because they're tired of losing with rogue decks. I'd love to go back to playing decks like HERO and Ra, but I don't wanna get my ass kicked
@troytheboy1985 Absolutely. Borderline unplayable in the current meta. Meta decks are just vastly better than anything rogue to the point it invalidates most of the games card pool
while watching I got otk by a tenpai player on MD... rudy rose my tear GY and then got my teeth kicked in... as everyone says, a combat focused deck and dragons and synchro all cool - but unaffected is just such a sad thing - as you said its like stun you sit there with all your interaction cant do shit.
Theres a reason the normal average tenpai player, couldnt top a local till tenpai and now struggle that the deck is neutered. the deck played itself and im tired of pretending its not it was a flood gate deck that just killed you turn 2. Maining shifter playing all these you cant play cards.
Its simple all they need is 2 board wipes and then why does tenpai lock off any interaction for 50% of the opponents turn and it can still otk through a prosperity half damage effect....a cabbage could win with this rubbish
I don't get it. So they say Tenpai is budget, and you respond by saying that the core is budget but the staples are expensive, so that means Tenpai is expensive? Makes no sense. I feel like the video just proved the points correct.
Fully agree, only psycopath sees cards that read: your opponent cannot activate cards or effect during the battle phase; fire dragon monster you control are unaffected by card effect during MP1; and think "Huh, this is neat, definitely not a floodgate."
Synchro summoning during the battle phase is a neat gimmick.. but if the thing you're summoning says "your opponent can not activate anything".. bruh
Especially when the deck has main phase protection.
Yeah, saying Tenpai isn't a floodgate deck is straight up lying
As usual, the problem isn't any of the Summoning mechanic, but how busted they make the effects are.
That card needs to be at 0. I don't care if sangen is at 3 if that god damned dragon is at 0.
Now they're getting smart and just summoning the boss boss first.
My only issue with the deck is "your opponent cannot activate card effects during the battle phase" bruh you telling me I can't even attempt to try and save myself?
Yeah if the hand was good enough sometimes they’d just open fieldspell + the ability to make transcendent so you actually can’t do anything the entire turn!
The entire game of yugioh is about playing 18 cards that all say your opponent cant play and this is where you draw the line lmao
@@gameguru42392 😂 You are very much correct, but "cannot activate" and "negate the activation" is completely different to me, I can understand one or two negate because of the state of the game but to shut down the interaction completely is just awful.
@@gameguru42392 "cannot interact" and "negate the activation" are COMPLETELY different things.
Tenpai was allowed to exist when Numeron couldn't have Number S0: Utopic ZEXAL
So real
Utopic Zexal was banned for other unhealthy reasons...
Any deck that has this one card that make them invulnerable during their turn (Sangen Summoning, Gimmick Puppet Field Spell) are the dumbest deck ever designed.
Gimmick Puppet field spell is even worse than Summoning imo, put them in defence mode if you're not playing XYZ then you can only get over them with a Kaiju or piercing. When i first went against it in MD i was actually shocked they printed a card that stupid (i was playing Kashtira tho so my Arise-Heart could banish them no problem, if i was playing something like D-Link tho I'd have had to just cope and scoop)
I disagree principally, but in practice, the Gimmick Puppet field is definitely unfair because the deck only uses the main phase and wins first turn before the 2nd player can setup. Sangen Summoning isn't so bad because the deck wins through the battle phase and it's difficult to get the level 10 to protect the battle phase before then, and makes it harder to dish out that damage against a full board if you do. Tenpai in general, while powerful, is in my opinion overrated. A well-timed book of moon or compulse effect stops them dead in their tracks more often than not. It just so happens many meta decks don't have that option, but it goes to show how vulnerable tenpai actually is when rogue decks do better against it than other meta decks.
6:57 ON THIS NOTE. I was wondering "Why did people who loved tear, and loved that tier zero format, hate Tenpai so much?" Also "Why isn't tenpai considered tier 0?" and I think there's different answers to both of those questions after having played Tenpai. For one thing, Tenpai mirrors are very swingy. You essentially compare hands with your opponent, and whoever gets the first battle-phase has a big advantage. Tear mirrors had a lot of effects going off from both players as cards would be hitting the grave and you'd have to be careful about what effects to trigger when and how to chain-block. Tenpai has none of that depth. The reason it's not tier 0 is because it is still a blind 2nd deck, and there are *some* boards you can make in this game that are *actually* unbreakable. Also in MD Tenpai came in right around the time Gimmick puppet got to full power, and I got FTK'd by random strategies multiple times. So in short I think the reason people hate tenpai so much is actually it's lack of depth.
As much as Ishizu Tear has traumatized the YGO community for its 45 minute long mirror turns, it’s genuinely such an interesting game to watch and play in a way that still feels like YGO.
Is it Tier0? Yes. Did people hate Havnis for enabling turn 0’s? Yes. But did you actually get to play the game in spite of that and engage in your opponent in a way where you had to think about what decisions you had to make to win? YES! And that’s what Tenpai lacks.
ishizu tear was the most fun i've ever had in this dog shit game
So… we either get.
T0 formats where you play nothing but T0. (I’m looking at you Tear format).
Or the usual, if you can’t stop the set up T1 you have to deal with floodgate.board or negates.board.
Or in the case of Tenpai. Go second meta in MD…. And tenpai being one of the few OTK going second decks that can consistently win…
There’s no winning for YGO isn’t it?
@@ecthelionv2nope, happy new year tho.
“Nearly ruined” is a generous way of putting it
I feel like the real problem here is that there aren't multiple great budget decks. People are tired of going against Tenpai. Tenpai wouldn't be so prevalent if every other damn deck wasn't so expensive.
3 out of all tenpai cards are not UR, their entire deck is almost URs. i dont think other decks being expensive is the issue here
Exactly. I get why people don't like Tenpai, but it'd be a lot less of a problem if most meta decks were actually affordable instead of requiring you to have a six figure income to be able to reasonably and reliably afford them. There are card games that allow people to play meta strategies without requiring you to sell a kidney, and they do pretty well. Pokemon is a classic example, and it's one of the big 3. Yu-Gi-Oh has no excuse.
I think that the very idea of a "budget deck" indicates an even deeper problem here. A children's card game should not expect you to spend upwards of $1000 on a meta relevant deck.
Well as far as Budget decks go in Master Duel. You have a couple of decks that rely on less than 10-15 URs like Memento, Melodious, or Ritual Beast. But those decks are not as flashy and they are very combo intensive meaning if you don't practice or study the deck and it's interactions vs other decks it's hard to win
this is talking about master duel where tenpai is arguably just as if not more pricey than everything else since its jamming 20 hand traps most of which are sr or ur and the entire tenpai engine itself is also sr ur i guess you could argue the extra is cheaper than some other decks but thats barely even true
The irony that probably the best Tenpai counter I’ve seen is another OTK deck. Ancient gears specifically, chaos max giant completely turns off their battle phase stuff and forces them to route to monster effect destruction since its immune at spell and trap board breakers
I really don’t get people defending Tenpai. Yes people hate cards that say “the opponent doesn’t get to play while you OTK them.” That doesn’t contradict thinking turn 1 is too strong.
While Sangen Summoning is understandable as Tenpai doesn't do much in Main Phase 1 and really just wants to go to BP asap, Transcendient basically goes against what I'd want from a battle focused deck. Wdym no epic battles involving card activations from both players ?
Yeah if this is what it takes for a go second deck to compete, yugioh cannot be saved.
Yall been playing go fish for over a decade now tenpai is not the problem.
No one complains if you go first and build multiple negates and interactions before the second player even draws. 🤡
@gameguru42392 You may not think Tenpai isn't a problem, but it is a part of the problem. Feedback and interactions in the community rather than fighting is best. Heck I played Kashtira with Destruction Sword at my locals and admitted I felt dirty playing Kash at that time even if I didn't play it pure for maximum efficiency. Nothing wrong with liking cards or decks and admitting there is a problem. It shows more character and humility rather than blindly saying everything is fine well the house is burning down.
I agree with people saying Tenpai is result of 'going 1st too powerful' problem in Yugioh. The deck is just as cancerous as combo decks that go 1st and set up auto-win field, as they both have same goal: playing as little Yugioh as possible.
I hate the fact that Tenpai can jam in 25 handtraps and board-breakers AND the remaining 15 cards (except Fadra) are 1-card OTK. Tenpai being very hard to interact only adds the pain going against it. "Oh they have Sangen Summoning on field. But that's okay i still can make play in battle phase", yeah good luck with that if Transcendant Dragion hits field in main phase 1.
Going 1st too powerful is an actual problem in Yugioh. But i don't think Tenpai is good answer for it in terms of game healthiness.
I really wish for going second deck that has a lot of interaction with opponent (i don't really consider hand-trapping opponent 5 times interaction), and also doesn't automatically win game on the spot.
But lab and other decks playing d barrier and anti spell fragrance isn’t more cancerous? Yubel and snake eyes taking 15-20 mins of peoples time to not let them play whatsoever isn’t cancerous? You know what other decks can fit that many hand traps? Literally the ones I just mentioned oh and math mech not as many but pretty close and their turn 1 potential is way better and if they have enough on the field can stop tenpai just like they stop every other deck. Tear and other formats were way worse and the deck is overhated because their favorite RUclipsr that they live vicariously through said the deck was so oppressive and cried about it yet tear and others were perfectly fine.
@@Austin-l1jmultiple things can be true at once
@@worthywill9294 yea they can be but acting like tenpai is the most oppressive thing in the world is just not true
@@Austin-l1j sure, but slightly less oppressive is still an issue.
Granted, a good portion of the ppl complaining have no rights to speak
Having a bad answer for going first, is better than no answer at all.
🎶 "It's fun to play in the CHUUUUUUUUUNDRA DC!" 🎶
I think the idea behind "Tenpai is a cheap deck" is based around the idea that in the TCG, you don't need to spend 100 billion dollars on the actual Tenpai cards. I love Maliss. Been looking forward to playing em for a minute. I had to buy the whole core from a friend for 200. That's just the MALISS cards. I have 6 URs that cost that much from Maliss alone, I definitely would have payed more had I bought from TCGPlayer. In reality, buying all the staples is still expensive, but at LEAST they transfer to other decks I own. I don't even necessarily NEED to play them to win (They do HELP though. Like Fuwaross.)
Watch one tenpai game in MD.
They will attack with all 3 dragons on your 2k attack monster before synchro summoning to beat over it, instead of doing that first, then having one spare dragon to attack with.
Tenpai isn't just brainless, it made so brainless people could get decently high in the ranks (easily hit master, for example), while other meta decks would punish the hell out of you for missing a single opportunity.
Might as well trigger 3 attacks declared ig? Playing around some weird punish vs getting in for inconsequential damage
They can overkill you by 20K damage anyways. That 4K damage ain’t gonna do nothing.
They attack three times beforehand to trigger chandra, fadra, and fulfill the conditional on their synchro monsters before they synchro and have less monsters to attack with. Otherwise interaction can shut down their ability to summon their synchro from grave.
Say they synchro first then you negate their synchro. They would be fucked since their chandra or fadra are now stuck in the grave. Say you blow up their synchro. They would be fucked as they wouldn’t have enough attacks.
Attacking beforehand is safer, even if you do no damage.
I understand that its a joke, but i know personally that multiple people played on a specific account that finished first at these events
Which account?
@jeremydyar7566 eric
You can't have multiple people logged in
It boots the old log location when you log somewhere else.
However taking turns works
tenpai players got so mad about the banlist they're running mods to not follow the banlist.
You've got to be trolling 😂
@worthywill9294 yes there are modders on yugioh master duel
@@Cardlimitsthose "hits" don't even hurt anything 😂
@@worthywill9294 not the issue. It's the fact they need to cheat to win
Tenpai players speedrunning getting banned? Thank you based Darwin
Multiple aspects of tenpai feel unfair. Tenpai has multiple 1 card starters with lots of room for non-engine, most rogue decks cant compete with that. Only the best combos can survive getting blasted by boardbreakers and handtraps, the game doesnt have that many options. So im forced to use a meta deck if i want to compete, i see some people run lab stun too, its causing lots of stun players to appear because they see its unfair and dont have other responses
No deck should be playable with more then 10 non engine 1 card full combos has and will always be a fucking mistake
On the floodgates note, I'm pretty sure I've seen some tenpai lists play rivalry of warlords in the side, sometimes main, deck in the early days of the deck so the whole "tenpai doesn't play floodgates" take is just BS
lol every decks plays floodgates. people do forget that in MD we do play the Maxx c minigame. every tenpai deck plays at least one maxx c because it's bat shit insane
@MrTungson true
I know that they side stuff like heatwave and koaki meru dragon, but bro is a master duel player so he probably was just talking about it within a format without siding
@PolaristhePure then the cheap argument is also bs in that case because the deck is manly URs
I mean you don’t even need those. They have a card that literally says, you can not activate cards or effects for the entire battle phase while it’s on field.
That is by definition a floodgate. I will hear an argument that Sangen Summoning isn’t a floodgate because you can play around it but Transcendent is a floodgate, plain and simple
What I absolutely hate about tenpai is when they droplet your anti tenpai monster (my case scareclaw tri heart cuz I play scareclaw). It’s just stupid, I make a decent board out of actual creativity and they just stomp you for playing anything other than pure floodgates guess that’s why friggin spellcaster forest has been a thing now (which I actually agree until konami bans both forest and tenpai fadra. I swear fadra’s like their key card because without it tenpai actually has to mind which card they friggin hit)
Tenpai is revenge for all of these break my board scenarios that people have relied on for probably a decade at this point
what happens when you are forced to go first against Tenpai and you just pass your turn to make them make the first move?
@codyhanson1344 Well the chances of that should be very slim if you are playing these decks that are built to give you the consistent boards with all the starters you could have in your deck or have a ridiculous amount of hand traps as interruption.
@@ThaRealElementX yeah but you say its to punish making strong boards, so naturally the counter should be to not make a board right?
Otherwise it's just damned if you do, damned if you don't, isn't it?
@@codyhanson1344 No, maybe you should play the outs necessary to beat that deck if you feel like that's reason you are losing. Maybe makes your deck less consistent, but people shouldn't be building decks to just facilitate their own gameplan and the only thing to patch up potential weaknesses is to slap in all the generic hand traps with some "spicy" tech sprinkled in. I'm not saying that tenpai is the answer, but modern Yu-Gi-Oh is literally whoever goes first format for nearly forever. I think they should add more decks that are incentized to go second. Honestly they need to rework this game. It's too dumb how much of an advantage you have for going first smh
@@ThaRealElementXand how do you propose that they fix going first I’m curious.
I can sympathize with Josh. I know Konami always one-ups itself in powercreep, i mean that's the description of the word there but making a second going deck that can virtually insulate itself for two phases in a consistent manner is insane.
He just isn’t good enough to beat it. Sucks for him
@@masterflamewing234 nobody was; rank 1 was a generic Tenpai deck and that player isn’t gonna do anything at worlds there are no winners here
14:01 The problem with Tenpai is it is cheap, easier to learn than most decks, and it can compete.
Simply put, give a new player Tenpai and they will be able to win. Give them Ritual Beast or Snakes-Eyes, they will quit before they ever win.
Tenpai was the final form of Going Second. This game really needs to stop printing nonsense cards and archtypes that keep aggressively pushing a general gameplay style that ends in "Stop or play through as much interaction as you can".
A crutch deck being meta is not great, but crutch decks in general are a great tool imo. I came back to yugioh at the release of master duel, and I played crusadia otk which while very simple allowed me to understand how modern yugioh is played
main issue I see with rant videos like this is that it doesn't necessarily suggest any solutions... everyone's done it, "Tenpai sucks to face", "Swordsoul is braindead", "Fuck Tear", yada yada yada... I don't often have the means to try the really powerful shit out myself until after it gets nerfed, so it's just a waste of my time whining...
people want to win, and they know Tenpai can do it... Yugioh has often had a going first issue, and the few times going second actually becomes something a player would want, it's with a deck that slams their fist on the scale in the other direction. it's clear something needs to change, but outside of the common complaints that are easy to meme with, nobody can really agree on anything beyond a handful of basically mandatory cards.
I, as a pendulum fan, still hold resentment over the TCG for keeping Electrumite and Astrograph banned for little good reason beyond "FUCK PENDULUM"... so, I'm not wasting my money buying paper cards for TCG events. they obviously don't like players like me, so fine, I'll stick with Master Duel...
Tenpai would be a thousand times more tolerable if we were able to interact with it at all during the battle phase. The fact that they trigger all of their effects in Damage Step is ridiculous.
So they're an upgraded Dragon Ancient Gear?
@@JanizMakudomaru well, kinda of, yes, they just upgraded it too much. I would be fine with battle phase immunity but having also main phase 1 total immunity is silly. I think if field spell was banned, it would be fine idk.
It would also be borderline unplayable garbage. Going 2nd decks cant exist without immunity to effects. board breakers dont cut it anymore going 2nd.
But if it's not intractable then where is the GAME aspect of it? Ban that field spell.
@@Xero-rr2ol Good because it's cancer when it just ignores interaction. Honestly, I think it's more interesting if the Tenpai player had to go into their 3k guy to gain the BP immunity because at least that forces them to make a suboptimal play to keep them in the game.
the first battle focused deck to ever been banned in less than a year. it is what it is.
Tenpai is a symptom, not the disease (kinda same for tear, but its easyer to notice in tenpai)
Tenpai shows how fragile the current game is currently
Just being able to dodge common hand traps is already enough to stirr up the meta enough to make a deck go from mid to deadly
Similar goes for cards like dimension shifter, maxx c, or the tear deck, etc
They all attack a certain thing in the meta, but everything in there is so established and required that even disrupting a single feature temporarily causes a loss for the opponent
Most of the game feels like a one trick pony rn, where the strategy from everyone is basically the same, and uses the exact same pathways
Load a bunch of 1 card starters into your deck, load some handtraps in there, load some anti handtrap cards in there, ad a few extenders and combo pieces in there, and done
Now how every deck plays... use your 1 card starter, occasionally try to block your opponents hand traps with your own, spam your board with monsters, use the monsters to make some generic disruptive cards (and in rare cases even a in-archetype disruptive card), end your turn, and watch your opponent not able to do anything because they get all their stuff negated and maybe even floodgated, then next turn you win
Ofc a deck like tenpai would cause some chaos there if it can just ignore the negates in those strategys, or ofc would tear win (or dim shifter) by taking the GY combo pieces away
The current meta really feels like a game both people try to throw bricks at a mirror being held by the other person... something narrow which can guarantee the win, and the goal is to stop the other... but as soon as somebody decided to put a blanked over their own mirror, or decided to instead aim the brick at the others feet to make them stumble and drop the mirror, then its shows just how fragile and stupid that game actually is
Tenpai is just a newer version of Numeron. Uses a lot of handtraps/board breakers/going second cards then wait for one card combo and otk. The thing about Tenpai is that outside of the field spell and Sangenpai the cards do nothing to the opponent besides battle damage. They dont negate, banish, flip face down, become untargetable, blow up your field on summon with adventage (SEFK style), or even become a threat until there are multiple on field. Outside of a specific hand of tenpai cards they arent getting the field spell, kaimen, and chundra out at the same time in mp1 which means they arent summoning sangenpai during their main phase which means if you have about 2 disruptions by their battle phase they lose. And if they Sangenpai during mp1 then either they arent gonna otk, or, like any deck, they had a great hand to finish you off with. And if they have to pass turn they are most likely dead because of 0 protections
People hated unga bunga Numeron and Mikanko, and those decks were never meta. They were just annoying rogue decks that steal wins sometimes off of Kaijus and breakers. Tenpai is Numeron on crack. The part I hate most about the deck is that it's like 65% non engine, so you get those same cringe ass games as in Snake Eye format where hand trap wars determine who wins. As a result, non-Tenpai are playing stun, all gas combo decks or cancer Thrust targets like D Barrier so they can stand a chance against activate Summoning, normal Paidra. Tenpai made the entire format more toxic than ever because Konami decided to fight fire with fire instead of trying to balance their game, so the players did the same. This banlist won't kill the deck either, so look forward to 9 Maxx C Tenpai in the near future.
Tenpai was just a symptom of turn 1 being way too fucking strong. It was either play Tenpai or play some busted turn 1 deck that just wins anyways. Yugioh has become a game of allowing as little interactions as possible
Thats what it's always been players just keep projecting "interactions" because they aren't competitive.
@@Anima556tear was pretty competitive and still had a lot of interaction with it, it's just that stuff like gravekeepers (anti grave) have been around for a long time while this doesn't really have any counter archetype besides 1 turn ftks which just isn't fun for most people.
Its been like that for a decade. I started really playing during the degen dragons vs spellbook era and if you weren't playing either deck you were playing something like mermail otk. The game has been turn 1 focused long before Tenpai.
They had a way to make going 2nd viable, but Tempai was definitely not it for a healthy game state due to their field spell not allowing interactions.
Mikanko, Yubel, and Gladiator Beasts have the most balanced makings of second turn doable as you can still interact with the board during their effects.
Yubel isn't in any way balance, it puts up more disruption than your opponent has cards in hand and can insulate the combo with phantom of custom cards, you can't even out it with a drnm.
@ Yubel does have some issues which got toned down though Fiendsmith made them stronger than necessary due to fiend compatibility. However like I said at least you can interact with the cards to interrupt some level of play compared to Tempai which is set field spell and can’t counterattack then take everything to the face.
Knowing Konami, they are letting Fiendsmith do whatever then nerf em to the ground then release another broken set. Rinse and repeat.
15:09 funny way to end up as a police officer.
Imagine having a full board set up for your opponent to just slap mystic mine on board then normal summons chundra and you cant do a single thing about it because of mystic mine ☠️
Out of the last 10 games against tenpai where i had terahertz on the field.
7 times they had freakin forbidden droplet in hand. At this point i hate that card more than tenpai.
i like the format you've choosen; doing a PowerPoint is a good mix of conversational and informative
0:18 why does he sound like Finn the human?
Yes, decks that say "you can't interact with me" are not fun. The problem is the field spell, if it was limited to monster effects or spell and trap effect it would atleast have some degree of counter play.
What's the difference between Tenpai asking the turn 1 player for an out to field spell (Ghost Ogre or your endboard if it has it) vs SE Ash asking the turn 2 player for an Imperm or Veiler? You can easily argue that requiring a more specific out is about equal to being able to use your entire endboard vs only your hand.
@@MistAssassin69 because turn 2 player can bait those options out and continue turn one player can't bait out the field spell because it is a field spell
@@zsatroof5219 Not really? Those options are pretty much subscribed to field spell there's nothing else to hit unless it's an omni. Even if they weren't, shouldn't the turn 2 player have that advantage of playing reactively and baiting answers? The so called interaction is happening and the turn 1 player has massive other advantages.
Also the turn 1 player doesn't need to bait out field spell, they're the one demanding answers from turn 2's opening hand or they will build an obscene board (Yubel's god board doesn't give a shit about field spell). The best thing about Tenpai is that they play so much nonengine that they'll often have the answers. And there's been these very resilient to handtrap turn 1 decks over the last year, you can argue that they've been FTK-ing and inflicting the same thing to you that Tenpai does.
@@MistAssassin69 that's the inherent problem is there is no need to argue a hypothetical ftk when tenpai will literally just ftk you with no interaction. They get so much non engine in the deck it doesn't solve the turn 2 issue it just flips the issue the other way which doesn't lead to any positive results for the game. It just makes turn 1 the new bad die roll instead of turn 2
13:37 Bro literally mentioning my regionals run in August, went with labrynth, didn’t win a single match (yes, it was skill issue) but 5 out of 8 matches were tenpai and this part simply explains my pain
YES THE POWERPOINTS ARE BACK
Yugioh needs less power creep, more cards with real restrictions, more archetype exclusive boss monsters, less generic ones. less decisiveness of the coin flip. more formats. Tenpai is a solution to a problem... but it's a ''solution'' that doesn't properly address the problem of overtuned dumb cards so it creates more overtuned dumb cards and the result is things continuing to get worse overall anyway. For some reason we humans keep doing things like that and think we're being reasonable at the same time. Tenpai is basically ''hmmm how do we make sure we are playing a fun and healthy game? oh I know, let's blow everything up and destroy the game because if there is no game anymore so that means the problem is gone!" but konami sells it as "SEE! the game is NOT broken! we just made going second great again so it's all fine! y'all can cool off now! and don't forget to buy our products!" it's basically acceleracionism in archetype form and we know that never works lol. If y'all then say "but MONEY!" then... that's the problem, money is the problem and it's certainly not exclusive to Yugioh and we need to stop being afraid to address it.
Ngl I actually really like this “PowerPoint format” for a video lol
Ironically, Tenpai was the one deck I had the highest winrate against during this format
But man, opponents just consistently drawing all 3 handtraps needed to destroy me, 2 combo starters, and both Crossout with Called By for the entire tournament was what made me quit for awhile
11:28 Yes, Tenpai is easy to learn compared to most decks. In terms of outreach, your going to get a lot more players if you give them Tenpai than if you give them Plants or Ritual Beasts.
alt title "how bad is going 2nd in yugioh"
the deck that is good going 2nd wins as much as any other nerfed top deck btw, yubel incomplete, snake eyes hit and incomplete, ritual beast
i was really hoping for ban every top deck or ban nothing this DC, but i guess konami has its favorites
back to the coin flip meta we go
Bro really said "gren maju, striker and dinosaur" as viable going 2nd deck with a straight face
gren maju saw comp play during toss format, striker still sees play to this day, and dinosaur was like the best adamancipator counter on planet earth
Tbh as a returning player to Yugioh, I got so traumatized by Tenpai in the duelist cup (Played Dragon Link), that in any case of the opponent forcing me to go second or the second I see some weird bullshit I immediately call that I'm facing tenpai and go dragoon turbo and pray... (Which sometimes work and other times doesn't, specifically the cases where they had a second sangen summoning after I negated the first one)
I had a great matchup against Tenpai, my biggest issue were the Bug and random decks I had no gameplan for like Labyrinth and Spright.
I can run though a few hand traps, I can completely shut down the board breakers but if I don't stop that Bug from multiplying, instant loss.
What bug?
@@codyhanson1344 maxx c
Maxx c of course the scariest bg
The problem i have is that tenpai is that its busted for these 2 reasons:
1.- no side deck: you cant play negate attack on main deck as it is not realistic, however, in side deck you can because NOW its god sent against tenpai.
2.- no activation of effects during BP: even if i bring avramax, is not gonna be enough because NOW i cant boost my attack, it does lead to a tie and one card getting send to the hand, but still pretty dumb how even battle tricks are negated by just ONE syncho
Like, here's how brain dead the deck is: I picked up my freind's Tenpai deck, put in some board breakers that he needed, and proceeded to rofl stomp him twice in a row. The deck is an auto-pilot deck. There's this one kid that scammed a win at locals against me once when he was playing Tenpai. Not even full power Tenpai which makes this even worse. What this kid is normally on is normal summon Elemental HERO Avian or some shit , set one and pass. I wanted to die that night when he won against me with Tenpai.
On the opposite side of the spectrum, there's another Tenpai player that blinds going first that ends on double Cosmic Blazar and Seals pass and it's actually pretty consistent. It's definitely a change of pace from what I normally see in Tenpai and opens up a lot of different options. Make me go first? Okay, you're not breaking my board. Make me go second? Okay, I'll just OTK you.
11:18 ahh you mean the ol “I normal summon alister” combo
Going to be hilarious bringing it to locals if people get this mad 😂
just got back into master duel on 7th of dec and tenpai was what i crafted first so im only sad because now it gone and i dont wanna sit in a long match
Yeah, Tenpai is totally the problem. Yeah no. I've played Yugioh for a while now and the problem happened several formats ago. No one ever said anything except Stun, Mine Burn, and any other deck which could be considered unique is "bad" and a "crutch deck" just because it requires a couple cards to help boost it's wins in an unoptimized meta game. Remember guys, You can only attack in Yugioh as a win condition. Obviously after your opponent combos out half their deck for 3 negates after 20 minutes.
While Tenpai is getting feedback I'm over here thinking about that Master Duel Chimertech Megafleet Dragon, then Duality into Cyber Twin Dragon turn 2 kill feeling a little like Tenpai, myself.
It speaks a lot about it's fairness how the deck can only exist in 1 of 2 states; either completely busted and pretty much unstoppable going second or absolutely massacred with it's central pieces limited. There's no in between.
Finally someone has the balls to tell the the truth.
All i've been hearing this entire duellist cup is how broken dragoon is.
A card thats outed by atleast 30 of the most common/staples in the game, and in a month or so anacondas gonna get banned so best case scenario one monster and 2 backrow nice turn.
All while 70 to 80% of people are just using tenpai and playing the exact same braindead way,summon 1 monster.. is there a response no gg.
i think the big difference between this and league ladder is that rank 1 doesnt give you a spot at worlds and is just an achievment you can optinally go for
Even on paper the duelist cup is a joke don't defend it! You can go on streaks of losing coin toss after coin toss and while it's not automatically a lost game right away if you dont draw a very specific hand of either hand traps or bord breakers and engine or your opponent just does nothing because they bricked you are out of luck.Yes my coin toss luck is really bad I gone on multiple 5 streaks of losing coin tosses and even over that and on top of that in the few cases that I finally won coin tosses there is the risk of running into tenpai or yubel. Really fun game design but even on paper the DC is a joke and you are a clown if you defend the format.
I know the feeling. That also happens to me, not only the DC cup but also rank duel.
No one defend it, even for someone who likes to grind like ryan, said there has to be better system than we have now, if you watched the full podcast. Thats just how any pvp game manipulate their player' competitiveness, forcing them to compete on bad system.
I can't be the only one who feels that rating duels made the Duelist Cup obsolete, right? Or at least should've
Tenpai was the reason I put waboku and the labyrinth engine to get access to the card it as quick as possible and that sometimes wasn’t enough
TCG player here I played pure Tenpai before second wave support came out and after it was released I stopped playing the deck and used the common card deck core in my Horus deck as an engine because it synergizes with the old LV Horus cards especially Sangen Kaimen let me Sp. Summon Horus LV6 during the BP and run over weak monsters to get the LV8 during the EP and infinite Spell negates the next turn. The recent banlist update on Chundra and Sangen Kaimen doesn't hurt as much since I just picked apart my pure Tenpai deck and added Paidra to the Horus deck to make it a bit more consistent now and it feels like a deck with a bit more variation.
dawg, so many people complained about Tenpai just cuz it's a deck that can bust through a bunch of strategies that set up a bunch of negates and big monsters. I mean... cry about it? XD I think it's nice to have a deck that not hard to learn, isn't insanely expensive, and that also WINS. Sorry your $1k deck couldn't handle some dragons synchro summoning during the battle phase. I never lowkey liked Tenpai, I highkey LOVED IT. Fight me.
The most interactivity I've seen with Tenpai is with my own favorite archetype from 2016. Destruction Sword. They just hateeeee Buster Blader the Dragon Destroyer Swordsman. Which is an archetype you can easily hybrid with other stronger or more modern archetypes. Such as Kashtira, or Centur-ion. An archetype which is actually more budget on Master Duel than Tenpai's supposed "budget" 3 cards are UR 2 are SR and you really only need 4 UR crafts and 3 SR crafts, for some recovery to the engine or you can full minimal with 1 each of said cards.
But Buster Blader the Dragon Destroyer Swordsman just full stops Tenpai as its continous effect prevents dragon monsters from activating effects and their forced into defense position. You have to play carefully however due to the deck full of non engine counters, its GG if they Have Forbidden Droplet and go Transcendeint before battle phase, or a Called By/DD Crow.
Tenpai needs Erratas, which won't happen in this day and age as thats rarer than bans and costs Konami money thus meaning it's a system that is once in 5 years at best with current modern Konami. Seriously why does every Tenpai have the quick effect to synchro that isn't hard once per turn. Lets look at a synchro deck that plays during your opponents turn that has a balanced effect like this. Ghoti. All their tuners are once per turn, but come back after being banished every single standby phase. Imagine how broken Ghoti could be if it was soft once per turn.
Honestly Tenpai isn't fun because of the same reason Labyrinth and Runick isn't fun. Its hard control that their isn't much interactivity with and is pretty much just one person playing by themselves well the other just sighs and rolls their eyes. You have to run super specific counters that can damn you against many other decks.
I had been playing Snake Eye/Fire King and then Tenpai came out, and I went totally back to Labrynth. You use the trap the forbids a type (Synchro) in this case and usually it’s gg.
Been playing a ton of White Forest lately, it does pretty well too against it if you end with Dragoon, Blazar and another negate or two.
As a Yubel/Neos player, the thing about Tenpai that pisses me off is that despite Yubel having the obvious advantage over Tenpai, Yubel still loses to it. Even if they don't slap droplets and 0tk you even through half damage, they can still counter Yubel's main game plan thanks to Freaking Paidra! They knew Yubel would be an easy counter to this deck so they gave one of the main combo pieces a passive effect that nullifies battle damage! And their boss monster prevents cards and effects from activating in the battle phase so Yubel can't burn them either! After waiting so long for Yubel to become an actual deck, they just immediately made a deck that counters nearly everything Yubel wants to do! It feels like Tenpai was made the way it was just to spite Yubel.
Lets not sit there and pretend yubel was a healthy deck either.
Yubel has such ugly card art tho I hear you but it’s still better than tenpai man.
@@ratioed1438 it's strong no doubt about it, but the thing that really pushes it over the top is the fiend link pile. Unchained and Fiend Smith abuse other decks so easily that they can practically fit in nearly anything.
@@ratioed1438 I dont think there are any healthy decks in MD. We cant talk abouth healthy game when the length of it is 1-2 turns xD
I totally forgot about duelist cup didn’t even bother with it.
Lab player here, and I totally feel this against Tenpai and to a lesser effect Snake-Eyes. Any other deck would kill to have the kind of protection and consistency Tenpai has for essentially free.
i equaly hate tenpai as much as maliss and the previous meta decks this year, 1 card combo does too much and konami must stop printing link 1 cards
As long as new decks incentivize as little yugioh play as possible the meta will not be good, this game is now like playing golf.
Came back versing a Tenpai player for the hundredth time... Whomever thought that this was the answer to the going first combo decks was obviously on something. You're telling me that I can't activate ANY cards to defend myself?! Very interactive, Konami. 🤦🤦🤦
14:38 - bro, I just saw the Tenpai Deck list... What the heck?! How is this deck legal?
tempai was a cool idea, bad execution
Not to mention I met some nasty Tenpai Players on Master Duel. Always boasting how I should just surrender even one went on a full rant when I was using Road Rollers effect on him to prevent him from attacking.
10:13 lots of decks play expensive hand traps. Tenpai is cheaper when compared to other meta decks.
IMO opinion its not that Tenpai was too OP or anything its just that the DC favored getting as much wins as possible instead of factoring in a win /loss ratio which is why people play Tenpai since its a fast deck.
Specially where master duel is concerned in a best of one format. In my opinion Tenpai makes the game healthy. There are too many going first decks by an overwhelming majority in a best of one format. They should make more decks like Tenpai in the future specially where MD is concerned.
Unless they change the format of MD in some shape or form. I'll stand on this that Tenpai is healthy for MD.
Like on Reddit it was funny seeing a lot people get to master for the first time when tempai came out.
Yea i play MD on and off, highest I'd ever gotten pre-Tenpai was Diamond II because i don't play super often. During the month Tenpai released, i got from Plat V to Master V within a week, then Master I the week after. And i didn't feel like i accomplished anything, the climb was not only easy but boring, Tenpai is no fun to play and it's even worse to play against. I just hope Konami nukes this miserable deck, sick of having to play it/play against it.
I love the fact that for whatever reason red reboot is legal in master duel
Would you consider Dino to be a crutch deck?
man you guys all yapping so much and being hypocrites
Going First OP = yaps
now
Going Second OP = yaps
😂😂
and Going First deck have some record being Tier 0
that's called maturity in this community
Speaking of that Newbie Friendly point. Giving tenpai for a newbie that learning about this card game is like giving cocaine for people that want to know narcotics effect on people. I would prefer Swordsoul any time for newbies instead of this unhealthy overpriced tumor. I tried to play this deck during the Duelist Cup and i can feel my brain dying just after two matches and then gladly playing my 60 cards Plant-Link pile or Fire King Snake-Eye White Forest and it feels like heaven and much more fun compared to Tenpai
A newbie deck just needs a simple to understand gameplan and not have weird interactions often, as well as being decent.
I honestly agree been playing with white forest. They set that damn feild spell all my interaction goes out the window. It's honestly infuriating why I could never seem to play my rda build to
Tenpai Dragons is the reason why I play Raidraptors with Kali Yuga.
It doesn't matter what decks come out or new cards. Yu-Gi-Oh is just a bad game and always was from the very beginning.
Yugioh has always been a poorly designed TCG, that I can certainly concede, however, with just the right card design, it does have the potential to be an amazing game. It's just that Konami's design philosophy has never truly been in the right place. Early on they refused to have a proper banlist while creating cards that were seemingly never properly tested, perhaps a symptom of inexperience, but now that the game has grown enough to understand how to design for it better, the way Konomi chooses to go about it just doesn't make for very welcoming gameplay.
With the vast card pool that currently exists, I'm sure there is a combination of at least a few hundred cards that when legal together would make for an amazing format. It's just a matter of finding and testing the right combination of cards, although such task is made more difficult by the stubbornness of yugioh players not want to play a "custom" format.
What is the DC? What is Tenpai? What is Yu-Gi-Oh? What is a Game? What is Entertainment? What is Existence? Thanks for the explanation, appreciate it.
I don’t see why the tenpai hate is so strong. Compared to the full power Tear format this was much better.
It sure did feel good to win against tenpai dumbasses, and it's still a more realistic goal than winning against full power tear ishizu
Exactly but bro wasn’t crying about that format.
@@Austin-l1j Difference is Tear wasn't free win If you suck with it.
A baby could play Tenpai BLINDFOLDED and still snatch win.
Tear required at least SOME braincells.
And was way cheaper than tenpai btw
@ it was a free win it was by far and away the best deck. You could just click buttons and win. You didn’t have to do anything. Sure you could
Play a card and have “Interaction” but your card wouldn’t do anything so really what’s the difference? There isn’t one. Idk why the argument is always “hurrr durrr tear had interaction” when in reality it didn’t yeah it was cheaper I guess but at least you didn’t have to only play tear to be competitive which is not the case for tenpai. Tear also carried terrible players to masters due to the power discrepancy between it and every deck at the time so this argument is moot also tear’s card art is ugly unlike tenpai oh and it’s turns are shorter and it doesn’t play on your turn hardly.
@@Austin-l1j Tear was skilled ONLY if you played Tear yourself. Tear mirrors are skilled apparently, and extremely tedious to play against with any other deck. Ppl who like Tear loved the mirror, nothing else. Tenpai mirror is not that skilled & interactive. If you ask me, we need neither but what do I know.
@@boraaksitozgun9912 I agree 100%
I think it's dumb to complain about Tenpai rather than Konami forcing players to switch over to it because they're tired of losing with rogue decks. I'd love to go back to playing decks like HERO and Ra, but I don't wanna get my ass kicked
heros are weak to you?
@troytheboy1985 Absolutely. Borderline unplayable in the current meta. Meta decks are just vastly better than anything rogue to the point it invalidates most of the games card pool
Video starts at 4:08
while watching I got otk by a tenpai player on MD... rudy rose my tear GY and then got my teeth kicked in...
as everyone says, a combat focused deck and dragons and synchro all cool - but unaffected is just such a sad thing - as you said its like stun you sit there with all your interaction cant do shit.
Theres a reason the normal average tenpai player, couldnt top a local till tenpai and now struggle that the deck is neutered. the deck played itself and im tired of pretending its not it was a flood gate deck that just killed you turn 2. Maining shifter playing all these you cant play cards.
The only thing I like about tenpai is that it made labrynth more relevant...also stun...which sucks
Its simple all they need is 2 board wipes and then why does tenpai lock off any interaction for 50% of the opponents turn and it can still otk through a prosperity half damage effect....a cabbage could win with this rubbish
I don't get it. So they say Tenpai is budget, and you respond by saying that the core is budget but the staples are expensive, so that means Tenpai is expensive? Makes no sense.
I feel like the video just proved the points correct.
Guys I know how to fix Yu-Gi-Oh:
We ban all tuners
Does that mean they can unban Halq
Tenpai is probably among the worst designed decks this game has ever seen
Fully agree, only psycopath sees cards that read: your opponent cannot activate cards or effect during the battle phase; fire dragon monster you control are unaffected by card effect during MP1; and think "Huh, this is neat, definitely not a floodgate."
the fact it protects fire dragons and not exclusively Tenpai is gonna backfire at some point.
Stage 2 is actually just an unemployment test
When tenpai got revealed I hoarded all my dragions and went to my locals and dug through all their bulk for more copies 😂
How close is ryzeal to a scam deck