7 "Ruth" Theories | Doctor Who Breakdown
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- Опубликовано: 4 дек 2024
- After many, many hours pondering this question, it's time we explain where we believe is the most likely place the Ruth Doctor, as played by Jo Martin, could fit on the Doctor Who Timeline. We reference many, many episodes in this video, across new and Classic Doctor Who, to figure out where the new Jo Martin female Doctor, from Fugitive of the Judoon, fits. We have two prevailing theories. We explain why she can't be before Hartnell, why she can't be after Jodie Whittaker's Thirteenth Doctor, and why most regeneration spots are taken. Please comment your thoughts, and don't forget to like the video!
For a transcription of the entire video, please see our blog: geekritique.ne...
Our followup video: The Timeless Children Changes EVERYTHING (part 1)
• Is Doctor Who Changed ...
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Our followup video: *The Timeless Children Changes EVERYTHING (part 1)*
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Geekritique well no matter what Chris chibnal says she can't be an incanation of the doctor before hartnal the chameleon cercate broke in the junkyard
so her TARDIS can't be stuck a police box the only place i can see her fitting if she isent retconed by next season it between war and 9th as it's the only regen we haven't seen on screen yet
also you spelt ruins wrong I've never seen someone try and spell that with a c before but oh well
yea
it's the Timeless children ruins everything
well more like it razes it to the ground and has the entire cannon implode explode and then implode again
@@vanimapermai maybe the Tardis chose that form before and seeing the Doctor liked it, kept it forever
Omg I was hoping you did a follow up. Watching next. This was a pretty good theory until timeless child came out.
What exactly is Chris Chibnall trying to do? He has already trampled over canon with the pointless Timeless Child nonsense, and then just to make sure he has truly destroyed Dr Who, he throws in this not needed extra doctor. How the hell is he going to square this circle? Is Chibnall working under orders to destroy Dr Who once and for all?
The timeless children destroyed the character. You are not supposed to answer the question of, doctor who? Chin balls did that and also throughout more than 50 years of work done by others. More of this communist cultural revolution of throwing out the old and good and replacing it with the new and terrible.
I don't think the Ruth Doctor's reaction to the sonic screwdriver necessarily meant she didn't know what it was, it felt more like she was making fun of 13 for having one. She also says "I am smart enough not to need one" implying that she understands what it does.
I agree. I think she dismisses it a something she is 'smart enough' not to need, rather than not recognising it.
Exactly.
Not so sure. It seemed to me she didn't know what it was.
Came to the same thought watching this 😂👌 hopefully that was a subtle misdirection and Doctor Ruth turns out to be a future or next incarnation that just dislikes the sonic. It does get used alot by the 13th lol
Came across to me like she didn’t recognise it rather then she just didn’t know what it was and thought it was unnecessary when she was told what it was
The ‘12 regeneration limit’ puts so much more of a meaning in David Tennants final line ‘I don’t wanna go’, as he knows this is his final life. His last chance. Even after however long he lived for, he’s still afraid to die
And then takes away from all of 11th doctor's whole finale
So if the doctor knew he didn’t have any more regens left, he must have known that his enemies knew that too right? So who was he trying to fool at the moon landing episode when he got shot on the beach? He started to regen then but then was shot again.
@@my2randomcents how?
@@patricgmuer2988 That was a light show. By that miniature human robot, that was never the doctor. It was to fool silence.
@@Scroteydada 11 got old because he couldnt regenerate. Clara begged gallifrey to give doctor new regenerations. The whole episode is useless if there was just one more doc.
You can clearly see War becoming 9. Am I the only one who's seeing that? I feel like it's right there...
@@illuminor Right! Thank you, I thought I was going crazy
I just watched it back frame by frame and AT MOST you see the start of a morph happen from Hurt which may have ended up as Ecclestone and it's heavily implied that he turns into 9 with the 'hope the ears are less conspicuous this time' comment but there is definitely room for ambiguity there.
We believe he regenerates into 9, but we were simply counting complete regenerations.
@@Geekritique No, you can see him turning into 9. We believe he's turning into nine because he IS turning into nine
Geekritique We aren’t talking about counting. We’re talking about how in that scene, John Hurt’s face is digitally morphed into Eccleston’s face. It isn’t shown to completion, but it’s very clearly Eccleston. Especially the nose and eyes. Less than a second of screentime, but clearly there
You can slightly see the 9th Doctors face start to from in The War Doctors regeneration.
Exactly. I feel like he should have at least rewatched the scene.
apap apap I never thought she was between The War Doctor and the 9th Doctor. The guy who made the video forgot to mention how 9s face can be seen forming. I was debunking the theory that Ruth came before 9.
We rewatched the scene. We put it in our video. It’s not a complete regeneration. Which is why we didn’t count it as such. You can start to see Eccleston’s face superimposed over Hurt’s but it does not completely change. That’s what we meant.
Do you seriously think that a producer whom went to great lengths to separate his tenure as much as it could stretch to get away from what came before, is seriously going to bring in some obscure, 'deep fan theory' of this supposed '6B Season', that even most DW fans are unaware of, never mind your average person on the street that likes to casually watch the show and who make up the largest portion of the show's current audience figures. No, I don't think so.
@apap apap I think you need to read my post again, properly.
The Ruth Doctor could also be a byproduct of one of the times the Doctor just sort of broke time, like with the Pandorica or Angels Take Manhattan. If that made 2 Doctors that would kind of make a sort of sense.
Capaldi also entered his own time stream
BadluckTribe as did smith.
This could be a good way of explaining what happened on Orphan 55, if some time breaking stuff was going on then it make sense why earth was able to do that
I still think she is the 13th Doctor that came about from time being broken when the Doctor, Ruth or Jodie's Doctor go(went) back to prevent the destruction of Gallifrey, the best time would be on that ship that was caught in the black hole, if she could stop the master there, then 12th's companion wouldn't become a Cyberman, Missy wouldn't get killed, and Gallifrey would be saved, and all this would most likely alter 12th's regeneration into Ruth's Doctor instead of Jodie's Doctor.
It could also be Rose s doctor on the other earth and the regeneration gift also went to that doctor
I think it's river
She's been brain washed like in the episode where David Tennant finds the doctor who's fake
My money's on her being a regeneration from between Troughton and Pertwee. It simply works so well! Remember, it's been arguably canon for years now that the Second Doctor was made to run missions for the Time Lords after his trial. The "Season 6b" theory is often used to explain his aged appearance in later crossovers with other Doctors. It's easy to imagine that that life finally ran out, and the new Doctor decided to quit being an errand girl for Time Lord black ops.
Regarding the life limit, I wouldn't put it past the Time Lord government to promote a false standard by claiming that having more than thirteen lives is impossible in spite of having the resources to extend the limit indefinitely. They certainly gave Matt Smith's Doctor a bunch of new regenerations without much apparent trouble. So who's to say they couldn't slide an extra life into the Doctor's biology while also altering his memory at the beginning of Pertwee's run?
So, yeah, my guess is that the "Fugitive Doctor" was running from conscripted service, having grown sick of spending years of her second life as a secret agent for the CIA. She probably had lots of secrets that they wanted to keep hidden. So when they eventually caught her they scrubbed her from every record and removed all memory of her in addition to TARDIS mechanics from the "Third" Doctor's mind before letting him on his merry way, never suspecting he was missing a whole lifetime. Heck, maybe her training as an agent was how he actually picked up Venusian Aikido!
As for her not recognizing the Sonic Screwdriver, well, Jodie's version does look quite different from the original model. It's not unreasonable to guess that "Ruth" just didn't know it at a glance because it bears no resemblance to the first one.
As I see it, it's the best theory available. So I'm hoping!
I think that probably fits best too, but it still feels a little unfair to the newer viewers. I felt like she recognised the Sonic, but just felt that she was "above" using one, which felt a little odd to me. The latest episode, though very dramatic, offered us little insight to Ruth doctors identity, and though I'm rooting for her being between Troughton and Pertwee, It still feels a little off. My friend suggested that she could be some sort of clone of the doctor, though Chris Chibnall's comment sorta disproves that. I just really hope the show runners don't make some really poor excuse for Ruth doctor's existence. Also, what did you think of the latest episode, pretty dramatic, right?!
@@smolone1623 Haven't seen the latest episode yet, I'm playing catch-up after leaving the show for a while. I only came back because of Martin's Doctor!
As for it being unfair to new viewers, well, look at it this way: They've established that this new Doctor must have some very convoluted and mysterious origin which probably harkens to the Doctor's distant past. The ultimate solution isn't likely to be simple. The Season 6b theory at least has canonical ties to the show's mythos. Building on something tangible is much less contrived than coming up with some completely new, heretofore unexplored chunk of the Doctor's life! It's a reasonable explanation, and it probably won't confuse new viewers any more than another explanation requiring a bucket of new lore out of nowhere.
@@JoeEnglandShow I agree that it's defiantly the best possible explanation, and I hope that is what the show-runners decide to go with
Plus she calls her Tardis her “ship” Only the early doctors did that.
I think we learned one thing today....
How to count to 13...
Great job!
“The long way round”
Is that linear counting or timelord counting?
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 war 9 10 11 reset 12 13
@@maxiwaxi1958 wrong, 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 war 9 10 *10 again* 11 reset 12 13
Theory: She comes between two and three. 2 is granted an extra regeneration to disguise himself becoming the Fugitive Doctor. She is sent to do missions for the time lords but rebels. The events of Fugitive of the Judoon happen. After another encounter with 13 she is apprehended by the time lords and memory wiped and regenerated. But some aspects of her encounter seep through. For example although 2 used the screwdriver first 3 was the first to use it in almost all episodes. He was inspired by 13 but doesn't realise it.
Imagine she's actually missy. Just turned good and messing with the doctor 😂
hey missy you so fine you blow my mind
*hey missy*
*hey missy*
I thought it’s River song messing with everyone 😂.
I hope it still is and the master was lying
that would be funny lmao
God I hope that's what it is.
The master said "every thing we were told is a lie" or something like that, so maybe it's a lie that a timelord only has 12 regenerations and the total of the doctor's regeneration is not a problem
Single Timelord Theory?
Considering what happened to the Master and considering 11 couldnt regenerante and then could
shimonnym what if it is a mental block installed at initiation into the academy, and all that happened with 11 was a message(pheromones or something) to remove the block.
I say this because it's worded that the doctor is granted a new cycle which could mean they just allow him to do what his body would naturally do 12 more times. And the "final" death of a timelord could be the result of a build up of energy with no release killing the cells rather than repairing them.
@@thecoloradokid5418 I doubt it because Rassilon needed to look for a way to do it by himself as a founder of time lord society it's likely any limit wouldn't be placed on him without his consent in the same way.
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That style of Police Box was designed by a Scottish man Gilbert Mackenzie Trench- so calling it an "English" box is wrong - to avoid offending Scottish, Welsh & Northern Irish people, it's best to say "British " rather than "English".
Thanks
BBC better put that money to the Show's budget. 😒
I disagree with the idea that those additional faces are meant to be Morbius for a number of reasons. One is the dialogue. Upon seeing that Baker's incarnation is the 12th, he asks the Doctor how long he's lived? The 13 rule is, stupidly, created later that year. The Timeless Child offers a multi-faceted explanation. Had the Time Lords not interfered, Smith's Doctor might've gotten a great surprise when he regenerated anyway. As Division is super-secret, a possible shadow government, the Lords proper could have no knowledge of the ancient history before they forced the Doctor into the Hartnell version's childhood with the Master. The other is having read something, awhile back, where they listed the people who's faces were used for earlier Doctors.
I personally think that she comes from a previous regeneration cycle that includes the Doctors seen in the Brain of Morbius, perhaps coming from the earliest days of Time Lord society. When the Doctor reached their final incarnation, the Time Lords could've granted them a new regeneration cycle, mind wiped them. Their TARDIS might have been reset to factory settings, but it would still retain the police box form in its memory banks and therefore revert back to it when the Doctor "stole" it again (after being led to it by past Clara).
That’s really interesting. I’ll think about it.
One theory I had was that if Doctor Ruth was a pre-Hartnell regeneration that was mind wiped; then possibly she had that TARDIS before and that it was then it originally developed the fault with the chameleon circuit (specifically sticking as a Police Box). Then when running away as Hartnell, he could have been drawn to the TARDIS (unknowingly) via the pyschic link and not being fixed the chameleon circuit fault eventually re-surfaced and it defaulted back to being a Police Box (I always wondered why a Police Box in a scrapyard?). Of course, the mind wiped Hartnell wouldn't remember the original fault.
We saw all four faces of the Doctor in that match, there were no others of him, the rest were Morbius.
The unknown faces that were shown were those of Morbius as its been firmly established in canon that Hartnell was the first Doctor. In any case, none of the faces shown bore a resemblance to Ruth.
@@SimonJohnOwen Exactly, that scene has been either misunderstood or taken out of context.
The scene went like this:
Morbius, a Time Lord, was challenged by the 4th Doctor to a deadly mind-bending contest. They held on to a machine to begin the contest. It had a monitor that displayed the faces of previous incarnations of whichever Time Lord was being pushed backwards into their previous incarnations by their opponent's mind. Initially, it displayed the current faces of both opponents and the struggle began.
- First, we saw 1 mysterious face on the screen. Morbius was struggling but then he managed to push the 4th Doctor back to his 3rd, then 2nd and finally to his 1st incarnation with his mind. The faces of Pertwee, Troughton and Hartnell flashed on screen. The Doctor looked weakened while Morbius kept trash talking.
- Then, we saw about 8 other mysterious faces appear on the monitor screen. Morbius screamed in agony and there was a bang inside his braincase. Looked like a short circuit with blue light flashing for a second. His braincase got filled with smoke.
- Him and the Doctor disconnected from the machine. Morbius walked away unsteadily while holding onto his braincase with his hand and groaning in pain. The Doctor fell sideways and died because he was pushed to his limit, to his 1st incarnation. He had to be brought back to life with the Elixir of Life later on.
- Morbius won but he clearly took some damage since there was a bang in his braincase AFTER those 8 mysterious faces appeared on the screen. That was followed by him walking away unsteadily in a weakened state. It wasn't deadly for him because he wasn't pushed to his farthest limit but he was clearly pushed far back by the Doctor's mind.
In conclusion, those mysterious 8 faces plus the 1 in the beginning were Morbius' previous incarnations while he was being pushed back right before his braincase got damaged. Those were not the Doctor's previous incarnations.
- - -
The 12 regenerations limit rule was established in a Tom Baker episode that came after 'The Brain of Morbius' called 'The Deadly Assassin' (November 1976).
Either way, the fact that Hartnell was the 1st Doctor was established within the show by characters both BEFORE and AFTER Tom Baker's era in Classic Who.
>BEFORE: In 'The Three Doctors' (1972), the Time Lord President sent in the 2nd Doctor to help the 3rd Doctor. When another Time Lord told him that the two Doctors refused to cooperate, the President said "I see. We'll soon settle that. Show me the EARLIEST Doctor." Their monitor showed William Hartnell's Doctor. They made him talk to the two Doctors to keep them in order.
>AFTER: In 'Mawdryn Undead' (February 1983), the Davison's Doctor said, "I can only regenerate 12 times. I have already done so 4 times". Then, in 'The Five Doctors' (November 1983), Hartnell's Doctor was talking to the Davison's Doctor and said, "Goodness me. So there are 5 of me now."
I hope that Ruth is from a parallel universe or something. It will bring in some more writing complications but at least it won't disrespect the legacy of William Hartnell. Just let him stay as the first. Please just leave it alone.
Here's my take. The new Doctor is a clone of The Doctor we know from way back when, and The Master we met in Spyfall is also a clone of The Master proper (Missy.) Hense why he feels betrayed, he knows he's not 'real' and was made as a tool of Gallifrey. He finds out and goes ballistic destroying them for what they have done.
If she's a clone why does she not look like 13 or a previous incarnation? Well as far as I can see regeneration happens differently for our Doctor and the New Doctor because of the circumstances of their lives and deaths (12 looking like that Roman dude proves this.) So they are both The Doctor, it doesn't mess with canon and can contribute to the series arc.
I thought of same thing but to me the Doctor has been cloned along his second incarnation right before Pertwee because of the appearance of TARDIS and memories. While the Master could be a clone made prior the time war explaining why he hates so much the Doctor, that one never was Missy and learning he is not the genuine Master made him destroy Gallifrey.
I really like this theory, the only problem I can see with it is that it doesn't explain how there is another Tardis with the chameleon circuit stuck on the exact same design. Though if the Time Lords can clone The Doctor and The Master I guess it wouldn't be beyond the realms of possibility for them to do the same with the Tardis...
@@smitha1994 yeah it's not a perfect theory but it makes alot of sense to me. Id prefer it to trying to shoehorn in another regen, I guess we could ignore the metacrisis regeneration but it would seem a little hamfisted.
@apap apap I have to agree about moffats era. I loved 11 & 12, but the writing was trying way too hard to be clever. And the really cringey names like 'the impossible girl.' Im not the biggest fan of the new seasons writing, but I'm preferring the individual stories with a series arc sprinkled in like Russel T Davis era.
@@smitha1994 yes having cloning him and the Doctor not being that much used to his TARDIS yes I think they could even give another TARDIS the same appearance or copy its mind into it
The whole thing where Chibnall says there’s no parallel universe thing going on could be a complete lie, he’s lied about what the show was going to do before...
well the thing is he wrote himself in a hole he either retcons some shit or he straight up lies about what he said and reveals shes from a parallel universe because he wrote himself in a hole he couldnt get out of.
get a good amount of veiwers?
I read a suggestion that she was a regeneration of River Song. The person never explained how they came up with the idea though
@@winterwashbrook8502 and she is biologically identical to 13, so she can't be river at all.
I actually thought Missy and Tasha lem were River at first.
@@FairyNuffMuffin2 so like a clone... like Jenny? We've never seen her regenerate but that doesn't mean she cant.
It is possible because River was part timelord because her parents concieved her on the TARDIS and at times the doctor and River did feel like one person plus River was always the more trigger happy out of the two but she would always find every other solution first
@@matthewjones2566 River did regenerate. I think it was in a WW2 themed episode. She was a young woman then became the version we know
My theory, entirely within the Chibnall era: In the Woman Who Fell to Earth, some regeneration energy escaped out of Grace's window when 13 is recovering and is never seen again. Could this somehow have given us another doctor as a split regeneration. Now during this episode the TARDIS is absent, having ejected 13 before dematerialising. It, being a sentient time machine, may have recognised the split regeneration as a paradox and rejoined the 'other' (ie Ruth) doctor, before ending up as the Ghost Monument. The sonic screwdriver comment could be the Doctor just being snarky.
In other cases of regeneration, the energy goes off in the work and nothing is happened. I.e the seven/eight regen
No no no! No human can absorb time lord energy and Rose & Donna proved that. now stop trying to provoke chibnal to do more damage to the show!
@@eastenders4k251 seriously.
I personally root for a pre-Hartnell incarnation. In many medium, like books or Big Finish audio, we were introduced to the concept of Looms. And while it was never discussed in the TV show as of yet, the Looms do provide a perfect solution for all the other "Doctors" we don't know about, like the Morbius Doctors.
In the novel turned audio Cold Fusion story, the 5th and 7th Doctors meet this woman, Patience, who used to be their wife, a long time ago. She tells them she used to know the Doctor when he had a beard.
The author of the book had in mind the Douglas incarnation in my mind, one of the faces seen in The Brain of Morbius.
Furthermore, in the book Lungbarrow, the 7th Doctor goes back to Gallifrey with Ace to investigate a murder in the House where he grew up. At the end of the book, we see glimpses of Gallifrey's past, when Rassilon was still alive, and "friend" with the entity known as "The Other". The Other was mentioned during the 7th Doctor era, and a cut scene from one of the 7th Doctor episode has him saying "I am far more than just a timelord". This is, in fact, because in Lungbarrow, the Doctor is revealed to be the reincarnation of The Other. Not regeneration, no, but reincarnation.
And this concept gives more details about the Looms. The Other, to escape Rassilon, threw himself into a Loom, a machine able to unravel one's DNA while storing his or her memories in the Matrix, to save one's knowledge.
The Other is described as being a Timelords from the future, here to help Gallifrey. He was also Patience's husband, and Susan was his granddaughter. We then see the 1st Doctor fleeing his own era, coming to the past of Gallifrey, during Rassilon's "death" parade. Susan sees him and immediately call him grandfather, recognizing his brain thought or waves or something. The point is, she recognizes The Other's DNA/brain in The Doctor. This is because, Timelords are "loomed" at their death, but also at their birth.
In the DW lore, Rassilon took over Gallifrey when the planet was ruled by a group of superstitious witches. The leader of those witches, upon being thwarted, cursed Gallifrey into sterilization. Timelords could still regenerate, but could never reproduce again. To counteract this curse, the Other invented the Looms, which uses dead or dying Timelords' DNA to create new ones. Kinda like recycled paper in a way. The story written on the pages is wiped clean, and the new sheet of paper is a clean slate.
In the case of the Other, because of his importance in Gallifreyan history, or because of his great mind, a trace of him is hinted to have survived the Looming process when he threw himself into it, alive. Which is why the 4th Doctor remembers faces before his actual 1st incarnation.
The Morbius Doctors are hinted, in Cold Fusion, as being the Other's previous incarnations too. And in light of the series 12 finale, with the Timeless Children etc, it would make sense for the Looms to be a part of the process.
The timeless children are experimented on, and forced to be loomed, to become a full-fledged Timelord. The newly loomed timelord would then have the faces seen in Morbius + Ruth, have kids with Patience (natural born ones) before becoming the Other and going back in time to create the Looms to save Gallifrey from extinction, and then threw himself into a Loom and be Loomed into the 1st Doctor.
Well, at least that's my headcanon 😅
Is it possible that ruth is a regeneration of the doctor's daugter that is suppose to be similar to a clone so she is the doctor
Her being the valeyard is something I can actually believe.
I kind of feel like that is SORTA moot. Like Series 10 reintroduced the Mondasian Cybermen but I doubt a lot of New Who knew about that. I really hope its the Valeyard too.
@Kevin McDougall well, yeah but I believe that he could’ve been given a regeneration cycle. Or just a few regenerations by the Timelords.
Kevin McDougall but the valeyard has changed his form without regeneration this could just be another example of that. It would also explain why the Ruth doctor isn’t afraid to use guns
@Kevin McDougall This is only because I saw this yesterday but there was lore that the Valeyard (becoming a War Valeyard) was granted some regenerations to change his scope and become a better Time Lord. There's no way of knowing if that is canon or not, but on the off chance it is, there COULD be potential Ruth is actually the Valeyard poised as the Doctor under a more positive namesake.
@Kevin McDougall The Valeyard couldn't regenerate back when The Doctor only had twelve regenerations. Now that this restriction has been lifted, The Valeyard itself must have changed in some way. All bets are off now.
Don’t forget the character “The Valeyard” said he was the Doctor before he was ended. It was said a possible alternate universe Doctor, but Timey-Whimey.
We put the Valeyard in here.
@@Geekritique Although, recently watching the episode where the Master explains about the Valeyard. He does say that the Valeyard is before the Doctor's "final" regeneration. So the Valeyard does not have to have come anywhere during the Doctor's first 12 regenerations.
I have another theory. Ruth is a regeneration of the Doctor’s daughter who is technically also the doctor since she is a clone. I’ll have to rewatch that episode but I think this theory will fit quite nicely.
Wow, that was amazing. Thank you for all the hard work that you put into this Doctor Who Regeneration Class. I could begin to say where I think it goes, but am glad that you are here to help us through this. I do hope that Chris Chibnall knows what he’s doing and has a plan that is “fairly” fool proof. I believe that we will get most of our answers within this season, and am happy to know that Jodie Whittaker will be back for the next season. Again, thank you.
Thanks for the comment, Graff. Glad you liked the video!
I'm loving Whittaker as well and I was really nervous about her run. She's such a brilliant Doctor.
The way I see it is this: Hartnell into Troughton, as per The Tenth Planet; Troughton is sentenced to exile as per The War Games, but is first offered a temporary reprieve. Basically, the shadowy Time Lord bureau called the Celestial Intervention Agency (CIA) offer the Second Doctor a chance to prolong his existence by doing some unofficial work for them. This explains his older appearances in later stories, especially The Five Doctors and The Two Doctors. At some point after this, the Doctor undergoes a necessary regeneration, into the Ruth Doctor. She, along with her Time Lord companion, is forced to go into hiding, leading to the events we see in Fugitive of the Judoon. Now at some point, the Time Lords catch up with her, give her a change of clothes, and regenerate her into Pertwee. It then goes Pertwee, Baker, Davison, Baker, McCoy, McGann, Hurt, Eccleston, Tennant, Smith. The latter, believing it to be true, thinks the cliffhanger ending to The Stolen Earth counts, but he's mistaken. We then get the second regeneration cycle of Capaldi, Whittaker etc. As for the Ruth Doctor not recognising the Sonic Screwdriver; he didn't use it all that often and when he did it was used to remove screws via soundwaves and looked nothing like 13's. As I say, that's my theory.
Additionally, there is a fan film called Devious, which featured an interim incarnation between Troughton and Pertwee, played by Tony Gardner. In this film we see Pertwee reprise his role as the Third Doctor. Unless explicitly stated otherwise, it's also possible that the Time Lords returned the Doctor back to his Troughton incarnation prior to regeneration, leading into the events of Devious. I realise it's long and convoluted, but I'm trying to cover all bases.
Interesting. Thanks for sharing, Andrew. 👍🏻
That theory makes next to no sense
@@jackeccles1333 In what way? Have I not explained it very well, because I can assure you, given what we we've seen onscreen over the years, it's the only theory that makes a lick of sense.
To give credence to this theory, there is a scene in the five Doctors where Troughton has a hallucination or something of Jamie and Zoe, but is fully aware that their memories were wiped by the time lords, even though their memories were wiped a few minutes before the Doctor was sentenced into exile.
@@jagothegamer5750 That, and the fact that a significantly older Second Doctor and Jamie are working for the Time Lords in The Two Doctors. It's certainly a fun avenue to explore.
I'm going with the Ruth Doctor being an unknown regeneration between 2 and 3. This has already happened in the fan film Doctor Who Devious, which has Tony Garner as the 2.5 Doctor and Jon Pertwee (in his last appearance) as the 3rd Doctor. After some adventures, the film ends with 2.5 regenerating into 3, and then falling out of the Tardis in the opening scene of Spearhead From Space.
Chibnal could have been unaware of the film, could have used it as the basis of the Ruth Doctor, or as in the case of the Big Finish 8th Doctor Mary Shelly story, just ignored the fact that there was a similar story.
How about, Ruth is a regeneration of the Doctor/Donna. Sometime in the mid 21st century Donna dies. The Doctor blocked her memory because he thought that being the Doctor/Donna would burn her out, but did not look hard enough and did not realise she would regenerate on death. The regeneration burned away the human elements of the Doctor/Donna, so she was in effect a new incarnation of the Doctor. All this strange outburst of regeneration energy on Earth attracted the attention of the Time Lords, who were wondering if they had perhaps got rid of Troughton too soon. The new Doctor could be recruited by the CIA, had her memory wiped and be given some but not necessarily all the memories of the 1st and 2nd Doctors and be provided with companion Lee and a cloned Tardis to support her missions. Season 2C, simple (in an insanely convoluted way).
I was going to make a comment to that effect myself!
Remember also that both Jack and the (other) metacrisis Doctor have TARDIS coral which can grow into full-TARDISes, given enough time. Maybe the Doctor/Donna got her hands on one of those (which would explain why Jack isn't using his)
There are also two other people that can regenerate and could be her, A. River song which is pretty unlikely as she was 'saved'. And B. The doctors daughter has returned even though it was said she had died but she can regenerate and it's a high possibility
@@kalebsambrook6266 yeah, but neither of them would call themselves The Doctor
Nope, this is THE Doctor, no tricks
@@akaakaakaak5779 the Doctor/Donna is The Doctor. She has his mind, his knowledge and everything else. All supercharged with her human instincts and creativity. And she'd be angry at the Doctor for walling that off in her mind. Hiding as a tour guide would be exactly the sort of thing she'd do.
Note 1: Missy said she knew the Doctor back when he was a little girl.
Note 2: What if Ruth is a clone of Doctor 2, because the Timelord bank timecard DNA, and clone them without their knowledge--leading the Master to be very angry, and destroy Gallifrey in the most recent arc.
I have same theory :)
I feel like we came ignore note one because of the well- white leg we saw
Yeah but Missy says "Since always! Since the Cloister Wars, since the night he stole the Moon and the President's Wife, since he was a little girl!" I wouldnt call her a reliable source of information
@@spntageous5249 Missy was making fun of the Doctor. ;-)
@@spntageous5249 12 was asked about the moon thing and said "it was the presidents daughter." wasn't it a pick a truth scenario?
This is the best set of theories I have seen so far, well presented.
I now go for Jo’s Doctor being something else entirely and I look forward to that revelation. 👍🏻
What do you mean?
I just like the idea of Jo’s Doctor being a future incarnation with parts of her memory somehow not fully restored yet. An entirely new explanation for this new Doctor would probably make the best sense, even if reflecting on the enigmas of past Doctors is agreeably worthy of our imaginations.
Mike Basil that’s what I hope as well because having her be a future incarnation both respects Jo Martin as an actress and her performance as her incarnation of the Doctor but also respects and maintains the integrity of Troughton and Pertwee’s work and their memory
As a long term Dr who fan this season really needed this story as some of the past episodes have been quite weak. Great content by the way, really liked the video.
The device built out of "Sheffield steel" barely looks like the device used by 9-12, or War. The device used by 8 resembles the one 5 lost, and the one 5 lost was consistent with the one 4 carried. That one was more advanced looking than the one 3 used, which was a variant of the one 2 invented. So the fact that the no-longer-Ruth Doctor or (Ruth-less Doctor) didn't recognize it is understandable. I favour the Doctor 2b theory myself.
Great video! It's so nice to see that the show still has people excited enough about it to discuss and get excited about different theories. This series, although miles above the last, is still a bit shaky on its feet, but we've had some really intriguing episodes (I loved the last one with Mary Shelley). This video was an excellent breakdown for someone interested in the overall Who timeline.
I reckon, when the Sisterhood of Karn regenerated McGann into Hurt, they inserted 12 regenerations of War Doctor, which ended with War-Doctor 12 jumping back onto the original track, and becoming the Ecleston Doc. So Hurt was just the first of 12 War Doctors, and Ruth is another one.
Actually, I reckon it'll never make sense and never be explained. But, you know.
Oh! I like this very much. Martin's Doctor is far more War Doctor than Doctor Doctor.
@@jacarandadancer (Please.) lol
Yup, that’s everyone coming up with these theories reminds me of the speculation around Snoke in Star Wars, she won’t have a satisfactory explanation, people shouldn’t get their hopes up for one
That's a good theory but it wouldn't make sense as john hurt would have been both the first war doctor and the last war doctor. Judging by the end of the power of the doctor, and the new teasers Jodie Whittaker regenerating into or back into David Tennant is the first time that the doctor has regenerated into a previous regeneration so therefore this theory doesn't work. You were on the right track though. I believe that John Hurt regenerated into Jo Martins doctor, and this doesn't mess with the whole timelords only have twelve regenerations, because when Paul McGann Regenerated into John Hurt on Karn it didn't count as a regeneration. The Sisterhoood of Karn tells the eight doctor that timelord science is elevated on Karn and that their elixir can trigger his regeneration and that it doesn't have to be random. What if their elixirs trigger the doctors regeneration and force him to regenerate without using up a regeneration, or it counts as a regeneration but it gives him an extra regeneration. The caveat being that the elixir makes him forget the next regeneration after the one the elixir regenerates him into. Jo Martins regeneration is the doctors ninth regeneration but the doctor doesn't remember this regeneration which is why Matt Smiths doctor says the line ha are we forgetting captain grumpy I didn't call myself the doctor during the time war but it was still a regeneration, because he forgot Jo Martins regeneration. On top of that Paul McGann probably didn't know about the elixirs other effects when he drank it, and so he assumed that he was using up one of his twelve regenerations.
The most interesting facts for me are: she doesn't have a sonic screwdriver; she has an older style TARDIS; she doesn't recognise 13.
I think these elements all point to Ruth either being pre-Harnell, post-Trouton, or something separate entirely (a parallel Doctor or a genetically engineered Doctor.)
Personally, I'd only ever be happy with the latter. Something creative which doesn't fuck with cannon (I'm just crossing my fingers that the Doctor *isn't* actually the Timeless Child.)
There’s no way she’s an after regeneration, they would have to sign her on for the future otherwise. Great actress though, would be good seeing her as the dr for a few seasons
I think you've put more thought into this than chibnil ever did.
I think the only way any of this makes sense is if the Fugitive doctor is a future incarnation that got memory wiped or something
She says "smart enough not to need one" not quite the same, plus the Sonic has changed it's form from looking more like a rod or rachet to what it looks like now
That’s fair, but the Doctor does say she doesn’t recognize the sonic screwdriver, and she doesn’t deny it.
I always assumed that since Ruth's regeneration was erased from the Doctor's memory, the Time Lords also added an extra regeneration so the Doctor wouldn't be wondering where that regeneration went. Or maybe the 11th doctor only assumed the 10th doctor regenerating into himself counted. He might have been able to tell it was his last regeneration, and tried to rationalise why.
I know you all just want to comment about a) your personal theory, or b) how poor you think the writing is, but take a moment to let us know how we did on this breakdown!
Pretty, pretty, pretty good.
I think it was good theories and very good way of croosing out what's impossible but there has to be something added a twist that can't be totally guessed or hardly so I think the possible slots are right but not the ways it has happen.
I appreciated the careful laying out and the attention to detail in terms of actual viewed regenerations. Troughton's Doctor was nowhere near as violent as Martin's though so I can't imagine how it could be him with a different face.
Yay was excited to see take man! Glad you gave us all of the things you were thinking about. My initial thought was that it was the meta crisis doctor, I feel like it could be possible to write in a way it worked. Then CC put out that statement about it not being AU and I was stumped
If they write it in a way that makes sense, I’d be down for it!
@@Geekritique I came up with the idea that maybe an unkown duplicate of the Hartnell Doctor and his companions and the TARDIS were created when the original TARDIS jumped a time track at the start of "the space museum". The duplicate Ian, Barbara and Vicki were killed and the Doctor fell into the clutches of the Timelords who used him as their agent with overseer Gallifreyan companion. The Doctor and his companion later rebelled fleeing the Timelords to eventually hide out on Earth as Ruth and Lee whilst Gat was sent to hunt them down. This would explain:
1 Ruth's TARDIS being a police box.
2 Ruth coming from a line of Doctor's from the Hartnell duplicate who never used a sonic screwdriver.
3 Ruth being regenerated from a duplicate of the Hartnell Doctor would mean she and Jodie 's versions would not recognise each other.
4 I always figured that the Timelords had moved Gallifrey outside of normal space time in order to monitor time and prevent anyone tampering with their past. Meaning that once you left Gallifrey you could only return to a point relative to your departure - not in the distant past or future. If Ruth, Lee and Gat had left a thriving Gallifrey they would not be aware that it had been destroyed. Jodie's Doctor did not know until the Master told her.
5 Therefore once Lee and Gat were dead the existence of Ruth as another version of the Doctor would never reach the Timelords. Who once contacted by Troughton's Doctor after "The war games" would naturally assume that since that incarnation followed Hartnell it was the same one Gat had been hunting. Then the Troughton incarnation would be followed by Jon Pertwee 's Doctor and the subsequent regenerations.
Well that's my theory for how th Ruth Doctor came about from the facts that were presented in "fugitive of the Judoon". It is one of many Ideas I have come up with over the years including a concept i wrote to the BBC for the Valeyard prior to his appearance on the show. Also I had ideas on the origin of the great intelligence, the Timelords' weapons programs for the time war and their eventual resurrection with the Genesis ark by the Doctor using himself as a template which would have given him an indeterminate number of regenerations.
If 'Ruth' was a regeneration of the Second Doctor and put to work before being exiled to Earth as the Third Doctor, would it have been possible if the Time Lords would have wiped the Doctor's memory and gifted an additional regeneration in order to cover up this fact? That would explain why neither 'Ruth' or 13 could remember one another. That would in theory put the 'Ruth' time stream at a point BETWEEN WarGames and Spearhead from Space (escape from Time Lord custody and avoiding exile), and it is perhaps that in this current story arc, that 'Ruth' will finally accept her fate and agree to regenerate again and become Third Doctor. This would also go well with the comment made during 'Villa Diodati' about not wanting to interfere with the past and prevent the Cyberman. If 'Ruth' is Doctor 2.5, and she tried to outrun the Time Lords and her exile to earth for too long, it may end up in the entire Doctor timeline post Second Doctor, never occurring.
I´m pretty sure the universe is changing because of a change somewhere in the Doctor´s past. That would explain this "alternate timeline" Doctor (not alternate universe), the new Master, etcetera. "Time is swirling around me", said the Doctor. Let´s trust her Timelord senses.
What if the time lords have reset the universe multiple times to try to save themselves keeping it a secret between council members, and Rassilon ,but every time they reset it Gallifrey ends up burning. one reset we see when 10 and 11 help war change the past by having gallifrey turned in to a painting instead of destroying it ,but what if in the original timeline instead of becoming Eccelston the war doctor became Ruth who would be the "9th" doctor in this original timeline, but now because of previous resets that we have not seen ,and a reset that occured this time now that the master has destroyed gallifrey we are in an intermediary period between resets created because Time just can't handle being started and stopped and started again so many times ,and it's unraveling. This would create a huge work space for a series arc to take place in.
Great video.
I’d been thinking down the series 6B idea that she’s between 2 & 3 and working for the Time Lord CIA, or that the Idea of the Loom form the 90s novel “Longbow” is being brought in to tv cannon.
I’ve always wanted Michael Jayston to return as the Valeyard, Trial is one of my favourite series of Who.
We now the Time Lords have had the ability the grant more regenerations from the time of the 5th Doctor as they offered the Master a new Life Cycle in the Five Doctors.
Ignoring alternate realities there are 3 places where Ruth fits.
1) 2b. Probably as a special independent cycle nominally under Timelord control (eg Division), being a separate cycle this means we can ignore using up the Doctor's normal regenerations
2) During the Time War. The Timelords resurrected the Master so I see no issue with them resurrecting a covert side Doctor. Especially if War has given up using the name himself.
3) In the Doctor's personal future. But with memory shenanigans. It'd explain how 11 got an extra cycle so easily. It'd also explain the Valeyard.
The first option fits more with what we've seen on screen as highlighted by this video.
Best logic so far
(I’m copy pasting this to multiple people to see their opinions)After rewatching the 12s run it was bothering me that when stuck in the dial he was pretty much cloned over a million times using a teleporter, but since missy talked about the doctor using a teleporter before, it’s pretty much been confirmed that the real doctor has been dead for a long time before the new series and cloned before then, so I feel like people are avoiding the idea of Ruth’s doctor being a second teleport(maybe around the time of the war doctor?)
I have this seriously out there theory. The timeless child is actually a version of the Doctor but a twin. So therefore shares the same DNA code etc. So yes Ruth Doctor can be the doctor but actually be our current Doctor's sibling. Hows that for a theory. Plus since the title of a future Who episode is called the Timeless Children i believe. So maybe this is what it is about.
Twin wouldn't have the same TARDIS and name but a clone yes :).
greysfan / Twins don’t share dna. She is a clone or copy
the valeyard one seems a bit more likely
@@user-uq1fq6gs3i Twins do share DNA. Identical twins have identical DNA. One zygote (the first stage after fertilization) splits into 2 viable fetuses.
Ruth is not from the current doctor time line or even from the same dimension, she is from the dimension Rose Tyler and her half human clone doctor were trapped in years ago, also that is where the cyberman in last week's episode is from... That's my theory, Ruth's doctors TARDIS jumped to " our doctors" dimension. The TARDIS / Ruth's TARDIS can or probably could do this that's what TARDIS means... Time And Relative Dimensions In Space. Dimensions being the key word here........
you can very subtly see the 9th doctor's face in the war doctor's regeneration, but they didn't film the full thing because christopher eccleston didn't want to be in the special
I’m just spitballing here, but what if Ruth is a regeneration of “The Other” one of the founding member of the Timelord society? I read somewhere on the TARDIS wiki, years back and now, that The Doctor is said to be the genetic reincarnation of The Other. So it’s possible that Ruth would have part of The Other’s regeneration cycle before her death and reincarnation into William Hartnell’s Doctor.
Oooh, that sounds pretty promising!
This is the first theory I've read that I'm actually 100% behind :D
Great video.
Chibnall has said she isn't a parallel world Doctor. What if she is a parallel timeline?
We had talk in episode 8 of how Ryan would cease to exist if Shelly died due to the Cyberium that had been sent back in time. Perhaps she is past regeneration that has to sacrifice herself by allowing a future event affect the past to cause her to cease existing?
Perhaps something similar to the Cyberium being sent back in time occurred? This changed a major event in the Doctors life.
So instead of a past Doctor regenerating into Ruth they now regenerate into one of the familiar Doctors we know.
My favourite theory by far is that Ruth is the original doctor and the doctor we've known for so long is an alternate universe doctor. I don't like this theory as such, but it's the only one that doesn't break the history of the show, so that's what I'm going for.
Important thing to mention - Curator exist. So there is possibility that one Doctor regenerated twice into one face and forgot in some accident all regenerations in between.
And there is also possibility that Doctor was granted not full regeneration cycle, throughout the series. I mean he healed River and she healed him. Tennant's Doctor also did a trick.
Also for all we know - the cycle count may be the lie Master was talking about. And actually there could have been for example 13+ regenerations, but Galifrey makes them a special agents as mandatory service and later erase their memories.
But I do like the explanation you gave around 12:20. His appearance was changed and his memories disturbed, before his third incarnation. All of it without regenerating and maybe thats the reason why Ruth is a wanted criminal, cause she didnt agree with the exile and only after she actually regenerated she agreed to stay on Earth.
The Valeyard theory would be also nice.
I'm just watching Rise of the Cybermen and something was mentioned about how Time Lords were able to "pop between realities and be home in time for tea and then they died and took it all with them."
I don't think Gallifrey is dead. Ruth is the same Doctor, just from another reality. Chibnall could be lying also. I've been thinking about the whole Ruth thing all day. I've even gone back and looked at old episodes, Hartnell and Troughton in particular and the console is the same. On top of that, the time capsule the Doctor, (Capaldi) stole has the same console. Which leads me to believe, that Ruth is the first or second Doctor from another reality.
This is driving me crazy not knowing 😂
Before the reboot it was Time And Relative Dimensions In Space. After the reboot it became singular Dimension. If I remember right, one of the Doctors said the ways to other dimensions closed after the Time War ended
My theory is that the Ruth Doctor is another timelord, they might do a little bit of a retcon where the first doctor in his youth was taken on an adventure and decided to take the name and maybe some of the morals, alternatively they could be the doctors mother/father...
You forgot to rule out the possibility that the Ruth could be A regeneration of the Doctor Donna Know That She did Become half timelord
Excellent run through of the possibilities. Personally I'm going with an alternate timeline, as mentioned at the end of Orphan 55, but you've given me ideas to ponder that I hadn't thought of before.
It was stated in The Three Doctors that Hartnell was the Doctor's earliest incarnation.
Yeah but Chibs will fix it.
Apologies beforehand if this is a bit confusing to follow.
A Tardis sees all of time at once, and they are sentient. It wouldn't be a stretch to assume it chose that form. It was never stated that Ruth's Tardis is stuck in that from. Why do people keep saying it is? Ruth's reaction to 13's sonic seemed more of disgust, rather than ignorance (ahh, you touched on this, but I'll just leave it in). Also, 13 mentions a bioshield (which I don't believe Chameleon Archs use, considering it rewrites the DNA rather than just masking the person). Which may give more credence to being the Valeyard.
The Watcher is stated as being a future incarnation of the Doctor. Those who participated in the Time War were given more regenerations (take this as what you will).
But with that said, I think Ruth might be either The Other or The Valeyard (right, the line is: "...between 12th and final..." keyword final [Trial of a Time Lord - 1986] not sure if this was the earliest, but it was established that new regeneration cycles can be granted [The Five Doctors - 1983]).
I originally thought she might b the doctors daughter Jenny.
that is possible she is essentially an extention of the doctor and can regenerate as well you see Jenny regen and heal herself but then you never see her again
I think that Ruth is in the doctor’s future, but was taken by a weeping angel, and maybe the angels evolve in the future and send the doctor back through the iterations
The answer will be revealed by the time we know the whole story of the “Timeless Child”, because just like the cloth creature (forgot the name) said, the Doctor didn’t know about him/ herself, and just like the Master said, there are some surpressed memories inside the Doctor’s mind, and it’s the truth
Problems: Of course I have thought from the beginning of the scene in the Brain of Morbius. And I noticed the old TARDIS interior. I also theorised the Fugitive could be between 2 and 3 or War and 9. But none of this is possible. You explained why. And remember: The 1st Doctor called himself „quite the original, you might say.“ in The Five Doctors. In The Three Doctors the Lord President himself called him „the earliest Doctor.“ and 2 3s predecessor or something like that. In Twice Uppon a Time 1 is also confirmed the 1st. The change from 2 to 3 did happen sometime AFTER the Two Doctors. It is explained in other media, that the Celestial Intervention Agency (CIA) intercepted him and made him their hired gun for a number of missions. Beween season 6 and 7 there was a Comic that showed him beeing shot by Scarecrows in the TARDIS. As the change started, they left. In flight.
I did not thought of the Valyard. This would be also a Problem. I had seen the Movie before I saw The trial of a Timlord. So I knew that the executed Master was at least the 14th incarnation. I also knew immediately, that 12th and final is not 12th and 13th. When 11 talked about Captain Grumpy, I asked myself what is with the Valeyard? He should come. And than 11 was 13? So I knew that the Valeyard must still be in the future. Maybe the next. So Ruth must be most likely be before 1. However. And rememer what the Master saied at the End of Spyfall Part 2.
Today I saw The Timeless Children. I was less shocked from the truth, then I thought. But I was right with above thoughts.
Sadly the Master is not the Doctors Brother. In Planet of Fire his last words were „to your own…“ The wrighter himself said it would have ended with „brother.“ Martha thougth he could be „a secret brother.“ The doctor said: „You're watching to much TV.“ I read a commantary of a fan, that did not know Planet of Fire and other sources saying or at least indicating, that they are brothers, that the Doctor needed for him or her to long to answer to Martha. So it could be. I thought until today, it could be right.
Maybe adopted?
I believe that the faces in Morbius are actually the incarnations of Morbius.
Same.
Maybe it should show the future. And in a remastered edition they would insert all the faces they really used. It would somehow fit to the story, that future and past are somehow always in the doctor.
My head cannon is timeless child is a lie but she’s actually the 3rd Doctor.
While you cover a lot of good information, there is one key thing that you miss, and that is where my own theory fits in....
Time is chasing our Doctor? Why? Unless....she's the alternate version. Therefore, time would wish to erase her and her previous iteration from history. This would also make Ruth the 'official' Doctor, just not 'our' Doctor.
Of course, this means something happened to alter the timeline, which I think means the timelords altered the timeline to be the way we have seen it, and ultimately, the ending would come down to, 13 sacrificing herself to let the original timeline happen, effectively rebooting DW, or, her stopping the original timeline from happening, essentially being the thing that caused the alternate timeline to happen (dooming Galifrey), and saving herself.
Option 1 would be hated by fans, and option 2 would go against who the Doctor is, but I see option 2 happening. Notice the dark tone of S12.....
I hate both options. But... can see it happening.
Nice work on this analysis. Now that I've had some time since "Fugitive of the Judoon" to think about it, I feel as though Ruth probably fits best between Troughton and Pertwee...assuming, of course, that we ignore all the Timeless Child insanity, which is what I prefer to do, personally.
We don’t want any Ruth theories. Just for her to go away.
Hear me out for a second, after the war doctor. There are 13 regenerations and heartnel was the first doctor meaning 0 regenerations then the 2nd doctor was the first regeneration the 3rd the 2nd ... 8th doctor and the 7th regeneration and the war doctor is the 8th regenerations and since we dont see who the war-doctor regenerates into that leaves the war doctor on a cliffhanger on who he regens into leaving us to think he becomes the 9th doctor using the 9th regenerations but that would mean that 11th doctor still had 1 regeneration left so there mustve been a regeneration sometime before 11th doctor regeneration and the only actual time we dont see who the doctor regenerated into on screen is the war doctor.also the war doctors tardis has roudles. Sorry if i accidentaly repeated anything i am very tired
I think her being the valiard doctor would make more sense given that he was still the doctor technically speaking
Between 12 and 13. The doctor didnt have a companion then which lines up with the fugitive doctor. And there arent enough regenerations (12) to fit the fugitive doctor any sooner than 12th doctor
My belief... She's between Troughton & Pertwee, the only regeneration that was never filmed. Ruth didn't recognize Jodi's hand made sonic screwdriver... but it was hand made, so that's no surprise. Troughton used a sonic 3 times, but it was Pertwee who started carrying one routinely. Ruth says she never felt stupid enough to need one. That implies she never chose to carry one out of need... but doesn't rule out the occasional usage of one, out of convenience. My belief is that the Ruth Doctor was pressed into service by a covert Gallifreyan group.. the character of Gat..... And this group later erased the Third Doctor's memories of his time as Ruth, forcing the change into Pertwee and giving the Doctor an extra regeneration, to help cover up Ruth's existence.
@apap apap Her TARDIS interior is a clue as well... it's an obvious callback to the earliest Doctors.
Great analysis - just a thought, but Romana seemed to be able to 'try on' various new appearances, before finally settling on the Lalla Ward version... I'm not sure the limitations were ever exactly stated, but it appears that a timelord can choose to change without 'wasting' a regeneration. If this is the case then the Ruth doctor could be either a temporary change for Paul Megan's doctor, or a 2b doctor.
The lack of familiarity with the sonic might be put down to it's rather unusual construction?
In any case, great content, keep up the good work!
What’s your best Ruth theory? What did you think about ours? While you’re at it, like this video if you think others should check it out!
There's one piece of evidence about regeneration, that I haven't heard much mention of. In the time of the Fourth Doctor, actress Lalla Ward took over the role of Romana, the Doctor's fellow Time Lord. Prior to that, Ward had appeared as Princess Astra.. Romana voluntarily regenerated & chose to look like Astra.. in fact, she changed her appearance several times until she forced the Doctor to grudgingly accept her new appearance. This implies that Time Lords can change their appearances even multiple times but without necessarily expending a full regeneration for each 'look'. What if a full regeneration, out of the 12, is ONLY expended when the Doctor's body is so injured that it must fully regenerate to survive? And since a regeneration was FORCED on the second Doctor when he *wasn't* injured ... so even though he went from Troughton to Ruth to Pertwee, only one full regeneration was used for both changes?
Ooo! Good catch. I like that. I like that very much.
Geekritique Perhaps we’re overthinking this. Doctor Ruth could be an elderly American sex therapist.
I think in between 2 and 3 or the ninth incarnation of the morbius doctors
Another Awesome video Dakota
Another awesome comment!
Geekritique thanks lol ❤️
I've always thought that the regeneration of the 4th to the 5th Doctor was odd and could have been away of gifting the Doctor with an extra regeneration that they forced him to use up earlier. The watcher could have just been an generic blank Timelord form that was merged with him to extend his regenerations. There is also the possibility that when we get a story gap mid-Doctor with no companions that the timelords could have forced him to change to the Ruth Doctor then change back to his previous form wiping the Doctor's memory.
I always assumed initially Tom baker was last..8 in morbius and then 4 more
@@NeilCWCampbell I kind of thought that also until the end of 11. It would have been interesting if that had been the start of a new cycle of regenerations.
Idk anything about her but that little bit of audio click you showed made me love her.
Lol nice.
How about this: We know from River Song that a half Human half TimeLord can regenerate. Maybe the Meta-Crisis Doctor can too.
I haven't seen the finale yet, but what I hope it is is that the other wasn't the last regeneration of his original set, and loomed early. Then later, took on the name of the doctor, which the current doctor inherited. How ruling works in the comic books is basically like one-to-one cloning, so the other could very well have gone by the name of the doctor, and it has been shown that Chameleon Circuits break. frequently, I might add. This means that Ruth might be a free Hartnell Doctor, and also be connected to the valleyard and or the watcher by being an offshoot regeneration of the other, who was being hunted by timelords because of a secret that he knew to much about, which was the stated reason he loomed in the first place, to get away from Rassilon and Omega.
Maybe they bring back "The Other" and the story of Rassilion and Omega. It would fit to how the story arch started in Spyfall, the information that all the old Gallifrey stories are a lie. And the Information that the Doctor somehow ist "The Other" but is not fully connected (yet?).
She's an reincarnation of the Rowan Atkinson Doctor!
I think the clue had been given to us in fugitive of the judoon itself, jack says to the fam at a certain point that "the alliance" has sent something to the past to prevent the cybermen to raise again; i think this has changed the timelines in some way, due to them being malleables since gallifrey is no more again, and so ruth's is an alternative version of some doctor we know
The alliance sent the Cyberium back to Percy Shelley. That was the "something" they sent.
@@kaizoisevil oh, i must have missed that
There are plenty of times where the Doctor was split, cloned, duplicated, hidden, forgotten or had children or grand children. The War Doctor was also unknown. The Doctor can basically disappear for a couple of moments and live several lifetimes before returning from "the bathroom". So anything is possible.
I think she could be Jenny the doctor’s daughter. She was a clone of the doctor and thus would have the same DNA and thus technically be ‘the doctor,’ but not really.
Good idea, but then how did she get a hand on the Police Box Tardis?
@@seiggrainhart4719 she stole it when the doctor died for good?
i live in gloucester, the cathedral is like a small drive away from me. i felt so good knowing they filmed it in gloucester
So she can't be a future incarnation
She can't be before Hartnell
She isn't a parrelelle doctor
I doubt between war and 9 as we saw Chris face when war regenerated
She can't be the meta crisis doctor
She could be part of the morbius doctors (unlikely police box)
She could be the other
She could be between doctors for instace
2nd to 3rd the only problem with this is Jon Pertwee is wearing Patrick's clothes
Its most likley she is the valeyard what with his disguises, the darkness, working for the time lords also the similar Colin baker shirt colour this means between 12 and 13 meta crisis doctor also was dark and neither of them saw the sonic screwdriver even though Jodie says you don't recognise it's actually possible she recognises it but despises it so I think meta crisis or valeyard or both
My own theory is that the Valeyard is the key. When the Valeyard was created, he wasn't just a one-off of that present Doctor. The Valeyard's creation created a whole secondary line of past-regenerations (hey, they're Time Lords. Nothing they do is simple or without consequences.) of which Ruth was the "Hartnel", the First Doctor of the Valeyard line.
Here's my theory... this is a very poor retconn...
And you are goddamn right.
It isn’t poor nor a retcon, it adds more mystery to the character
@@DoctorWhoHugh If you like it then that's fine, but it is a retcon. You can't really argue that it isn't. It's changing the doctor's origins retroactively.
@@DoctorWhoHugh Huh? This series is retcon central. Stop making shit up.
@@Mrbluefire95 you are right it is a retcon. I just think that word has a negative stigma to it.
I think that series 13 will show the 13th doctor running from the division (from a different point of time before gallifrey was destroyed, again) because she found out about the timeless child. Maybe the divison captured her and forced her to regenerate and wiped her memory, making her a normal time lord who lives her life on gallifrey ( before time war) knowing not knowing about her life as the doctor. Then maybe out of instinct she feels the need to leave gallifrey and steals a TARDIS again and becomes The Doctor once again, as this is who she is destined to be! This explains why she is so similar to the first doctor calling the TARDIS ‘ship’ and not having a sonic... Would be an epic story
Ruth is somehow tied up with the backstory of the Valeyard. Trust me.
What if Ruth is River Song and she just pretended to be the doctor to mess with everyone’s heads.
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What about when River Song/Melody Pond sacrificed all of her regenerations to The Eleventh Doctor (Matt Smith) when she kills him but rescues him, she expends all her regenerations to bring him back from death, as of which could she have possibly transferred it allowing The Doctor to regenerate once more than he was meant to?
@@joshua211111 Yeah. But it doesn't really fit with continuity, since he was Matt Smith right until he got new regernatioms anyway.
Maybe he regenerated into Ruth and back at some point, while he was on Trenzolore, but that would kind of ruin the idea that he got old just by staying there for a long time.
I made a video, detailing what I think happened:
River Song starts out with 12 Regenerations:
I'm going to assume she uses up at-least 2, before she becomes the child in the astronaut, since she already seemed very familiar with the idea of regeneration, at the end of Day of the Moon. (Bringing her down to 10)
She then regenerates into more child-versions of herself say every 10 years, until the 2000s. (1970s, 9, 1980s, 8, 1990s, 7)
She then regenerates into Melody, from Let's Kill Hitler, and Amy and Rory's childhood. (Still at 7)
Then into River Song. (6)
Then another regeneration, when she gets shot by cops at the bottom of a building, but she doesn't change this time, since she was still in the process of the previous regeneration. This complexity in regenerating 2 times at once could even go as far as to knock out another regeneration to keep her body in-tact; Sort of as punishment for her carelessness. (5)
She then gives all her reverberations to Matt Smith, who uses 1 to heal himself. (4)
He then channels a bunch of his reverberations, into the teslectea, to do all that nonsense. (1)
He then uses 1 last one, to heal River Song's wrist in The Angles Take Manhattan, to return the favor of her giving Him her regernerations.
A new theory, what if Ruth isn't the doctor, and the show-runners want us to think she is.
@@TheEgoChallenge Possible. Moffat often lied. :)
Geekritique what about Jenny the doctors daughter
Um 5 doctors is when we learn that time lord can be given more lives as that was what the masters bribes with a new cycle to help the time lords
I didn't see the watch thing so that is rather interesting. I do think this is a great video properly looking at all the possibilities.
One thing for Ruth being between 2 and 3. It is often believed the second doctor's appearance in the 2 doctors actually comes after the war games which suggests if true the doctor works for the timelords, probably the CIA. This is often used to explain how they are working for the timelords in the episode and have aged.
My theory is that the second doctor works for the timelords and regenerates into Ruth. She finds out what the timeless child is and goes on the run. She is forced to regenerate and her mind is wiped to protect the secret. Somehow the timelords have found a way to grant rengenerations maybe secretly and give the doctor an extra one to further hide the Ruth's doctor
I like the idea that Ruth's doctor is the regeneration of the 10th doctor's clone that was created from his severed hand
The should have kept hartnell as the first and didn’t make it where the doctor can regenerate endlessly. It ruins hartnells legacy and smiths regeneration.
I like your breakdown, but biggest issue with her being the Valeyard is Chibnall's remark "she's definitively the Doctor, no tricks." Plus the TARDIS, if perhaps the Valeyard was given a TARDIS, why would it be in the shape of a Police Box? Ruth's Doctor said she landed in the 90's, so no reason the TARDIS would have chameleon'd itself as a 60's era Police Box. But, let me add some evidence onto the Theory 6B aka what you called the Doctor 2b. The TARDIS itself. You touched on the exterior and interior, but I can go a step further on the exterior look. 1) As stated, it's a Police Box, so must be after Hartnell. 2) The box itself has a flat-ish roof, which means after Hartnell but before Davison (who got the leveled roof back and beyond). 3) The "Use of the Public" sign is white, which means Ruth must be before Pertwee, whose box started the sign being exclusively black or TARDIS box color. 4) There is no St. John's Ambulance logo, which means she's after Troughton, whose box had the logo most of his run like Hartnell. Conclusion - Just using the TARDIS exterior, I can say, minus some production errors, that she definitely fits between Troughton and Pertwee. ADDED EVIDENCE - During the Three Doctors, the 2nd Doctor admits to working for the Time Lords. During the Five Doctors, the 2nd Doctor is confronted by visions of Jamie and Zoe but he dismisses them claiming they were mind-wiped and sent home by the Time Lords (which means Five Doctors is after War Games). During the Two Doctors, both Jamie and the 2nd Doctor discuss the Time Lords and working for them, which again means after The War Games. THE SONIC - Up until 13 says "Sonic Screwdriver", Ruth had only seen 13 using it to scan things, which means she didn't know it's full capabilities. Once 13 does say "Sonic Screwdriver", unlike David Bradley's 1st Doctor in Twice Upon A Time, Ruth's Doctor doesn't respond with "what, sonic what?" Instead she just implies she's smart enough not to need a gadget. Also remember, when Troughton's 2nd Doctor used the sonic, it literally was only a screwdriver. It didn't have any other capabilities shown on screen. Obviously, writers can do whatever they feel and clever writing can fix anything, BUT I do believe in the Theory 6B, that Ruth is a forced change or given regeneration between 2nd and 3rd. That the 2nd Doctor continued to work for the Time Lords until he could take no more, ran off, changed and used the Chameleon Arch with the companion Lee. Sometime down the road, Ruth will get captured by the Time Lords, they will mind-wipe her because she knows too much and force her to change into Pertwee's 3rd Doctor and initiate the sentence of being exiled on Earth. Now, as you said the Time Lords changing someone might not count as a #'d Regeneration. SO, If I'm right, 2nd used a regen to turn into Ruth, but the Time Lords use their own energy to change Ruth into 3rd.
Great breakdown!
@@Geekritique I originally thought I was probably wrong, that they wouldnt do a deep cut and had Ruth's TARDIS look different just so we wouldn't confuse it with 13's, but then came the name drop of the Guardians and the Celestial Toy Maker, and I started thinking, it's too coincidental for them to be bringing up this many deep cuts from Classic Who. Even the Master mentioned the tower the 4th Doctor fell off. So... fingers crossed, because those rumors before the season started about am entire regen cycle before Hartnell, I really hate that idea. Lol
well they said the ruth doctor is the real doctor but what if the timelord we believe to be the doctor is actually not the doctor
Rikuri I haven’t seen the episode where Ruth doctor (stupid name) appears so how did she appear did the doctors shenanigans fuck stuff up or is Ruth just there
Great video. 👍
It's possible Ruth is the doctor's Daughter. Just as a older regeneration of her
Why would she have a TARDIS in the shape of a police box?
@@Geekritique stole it for a bit
Maybe Ruth IS the 14th Doctor and maybe the reason why The Tardis looks more like the Classic Who Tardis is maybe The Tardis wanted to go for something more classic...
That’s totally possible!
I wouldn’t call the Meta-Crisis Doctor a new regeneration. Half of the artron energy was used to heal and the other was used to create the Meta-Crisis. Cloning the Doctor with Donna’s human side actually was the second use of that regeneration.
Well, the actual act of the Doctor aborting his regeneration into the hand is counted as a regeneration. Sorry, should have been more clear.