This stream was before the one where RDC was arguing on if Rock Lee was faster than Pain. So if you were wondering why they were so heated in that argument, it was because this isn't the first time they argued this. Just goes to show how fun and chaotic RDC still is off stream, which is why when they finally tell us the stories it feels genuine, like when Dylan and John argued about basketball for YEARS. Check my community posts for frequently asked questions as well as the current status of my edited vids.
People let JJK's animation carry too much water in this argument. Base Lee minus leg weights is at least keeping up with him, once he starts opening those gates it's over
Based off what tho? U saying jjk animation carrying but what in naruto was confirmed in terms of speed? Your also assuming based of animation. (In terms of 5 gates lee in early naruto
@@dmetriusmarch JJK characters really dont scale that high on AVG in comparison to other verses. Their top tiers are just big fishes in a small pond. They get cooked up in the Big 3 verses and got a lot of problems dealing with a couple current anime
Naruto speed be inconsistent.people say Kakashi is as fast as lighting and say that rock Lee is faster than sound. Then would say Drunk Lee is speed of light like huh???
Toji ain't beating no god damn shippuden ninja, just regular ninjas are fast as a bitch let alone someone specializing in speed, put him against Minato, shisui or sasuke and he's cooked
@@N3XTL3V3L I ain't talking about no god damn retrieval team dumbass, I was talking in general, was Minato and Shisui in the retrieval team? read before you talk
Also if you just wanted to go off of eye test, Lee in the chunin exam with the weights off was literally doing what Toji was doing to dagon, that might be the last time they’re equal in strength and speed 💀
The two of them have only superficial similarities. Their personalities and roles in their series are totally different (especially considering Toji actually had a role).
@@zaveionchambers3809that’s why it’s called a debate. Thats like debating what restaurant is the best, it’s all subjective but it makes for good conversation it’s a stream and that’s what they do is entertain.
The problem for Toji is that his whole kit is tailored to assassinating sorcerers specifically. the shinobi of Naruto would already be familiar with stealth strats and more than likely be better at it, already use other senses to track foes and don't need CE, and undoubtedly have a greater fighting background than Toji. In a fair fight, Toji isn't touching Lee once he pulls out the gates
Toji Fushiguro is a powerful anomaly in the world of Jujutsu Kaisen, possessing inhuman speed, strength, and senses despite having zero Cursed Energy. Don’t talk if you don’t do your research. Toji isn’t give Rock lee no chance of winning. Toji killing rock lee in an instant before he even open his gate and take off the weights. I did my research and my homework.
@@supremetrippie399 ima be so fr rn, Toji himself don’t even scale to the version of Gojo that reaches the top tiers of the verse meanwhile Lee was blitzing Gaara at the damn chunin exams
Me. Idk why a guy who stomped a small crater into the ground with ease, threw a propane tank, and poked rubble individually as fast as bullets is being downplayed. He is for sure stronger, more strategic, and has a killer instinct. Speed doesn't beat all that 100% of the time.
@doc8187 My thing is, does Toji seem the type to allow Lee to take his weights off, or open his gates. Toji is going for the kill, period. Lee aint about that. I love Naruto too, but get real Lee doesnt walk around in gate form and it takes a second. Toji will not wait. Lee will be killed, sorry.
@@TheGostboy7 Lee's base speed is enough to outspeed garaa's sand defense which was moving at mach 30. When Lee opens a gate it increases his speed by 5x. Lee 3 gates would be enough to outspeed Toji by a landslide along with the entire JJK verse.
@@exilewarrior7760 wasn't specifically stated, but Garaa's sand made a full barrier fast enough to defend a young Garaa from an explosion upfront. That would've required the sand to move at Mach 30 and Garaa has only gotten stronger/faster since. Lee was able to outspeed it by taking off his weights.
Toji getting rocked tbh, the Naruto power scale is out of control. Most old shows power scales are tbh, mfs was moving “light speed” like that wouldn’t destroy the whole planet 😂 Speed aside, Toji had a knife and no magic, like niggas in Naruto aren’t used to dealing with that
@funnymano7497 Dude lightning is jot the speed of light 😂. This is how it goes sound< lightning < light. If you watch videos of lightning you can see the lighting actually coming down faster than the sound can appear
Are you kidding me ? Toji is getting destroyed. Think about it , the retrieval team is Naruto , Choji , Shikamaru , Akamaru/Keeba and Neji. Neji will see the guy where ever he goes, shikamaru will be able to a Track his shadow , one shot from choji he’s dead , Keebas beast mode can sniff him out if he hides and Naruto don’t need to do shit
Thank you. Recency bias got ppl on edge! They overscale over shows but when it comes to Naruto they'll say shit like "oh you can't use that feat cuz I think it's bad writing that the kids can beat my favorite anime characters"
@@dmetriusmarch Kiba will keep up then or Nine Tail eyes Naruto😂. And its over for Toji if he gets hit with a Rotation thinking he's about to just rush up on Neji
none of them have a damn clue 😂😂😂, in mach speed terms, light speed is around about mach 874,030 desmond said and i quote " He was moving at mach 3? thats damn near lightspeed"
Toji is moving at subsonic+ max and rock lee is moving hypersonic+ at most. A lowball for rock lee hes moving at the same speed as toji without gates. Rock lee with gates wipes toji.
Not true. Maki was able to dodge mach 3 speeds from cursed naoya which is wayyy faster then subsonic and hypersonic speeds. And right after that she was stated to be equal to toji so that feat upscaled toji. Yea Lee wipes in gates I agree but dont downplay toji speed.
@@touka6589Toji isn’t give Lee no chance to do nothing. Lee don’t have the Battle QI like Toji has. Don’t have killer instincts like Toji. Lee killed if he faces Toji has. I’m sorry but it’s true. Toji isn’t playing no games with lee
@@supremetrippie399 base lee already had the feats to hold him off lmao. He let Gojo get off a hollow purple...... Lee is def getting gates off on toji. He also couldn't even kill megumi in the time he was fighting him lol mind you that was a heavily weakened megumi who just got done having a tug of war domain battle with a special grade curse.he only realized that was his son at the end of the fight so the fight itself was him thinking he was fighting a random . Lee is def doing a way better chance
@@touka6589 that’s Gojo but Lee getting gates off that’s not happening. Do you know who Toji is. when he came back to life. He was demon time. He’s going to one shot Lee. If you said lee is winning. You delusional asf. Toji is tossing his salad.
the problem for toji is that his stealth and speed won't really matter. lee, neji, naruto, and choji all have feats that put them higher than toji in just physicals alone. but if you wanna add the others that's just over kill
@@supremetrippie399 naruto scaling vs jjk scaling isn’t even funny. you can wank 3-4 gates lee to light speed, nobody in the jjk verse other than maybe sukuna and gojo MAYBE can even scale to his speed.
Y'all aren't even talking facts here. Kakashi could move faster than lightning during the Kakuzu fight. And he didn't have any physical boosts. This means Rock Lee can easily surpass light speed if he opens his gates. By the start of Boruto, when Lee is the around the same age as Toji, he can most likely open 7 gates. It's gg for Toji in terms of both speed and power at that point
Wait wait wait, how is Kakashi faster than lightning in the Kakuzu fight and how does that boost Lee to faster than light?? Lightning and light move at two very different speeds, light being massively faster…
@@nakedbeefcake4168Its baffling how many times I have seen in this comment section people mistaking faster than lightning meaning faster than light. Its hilarious
@@timbrady1176They sometimes move at the speed of light and other times move at the speed of lightning. in Naruto they have combat speed, movement speed and their various forms of teleportation/blinking.
There goes no day by where people don't shit on Naruto. People even claiming Luffy is way faster than Naruto etc. People need to get over their pride and go with the facts.
all of them are. Aint no way even for a second thought mach7 was lightspeed. And everyone is just interprating what they see on the screen and not actual feats.
@SupaSoldierLegend nah every time he said something it was blatantly stupid. Des one of my favorites and even I can admit nothing he said made actual sense. He was arguing animation quality to justify speed
@@illest71 weightless Lee is hypersonic mach 3 and above. stop the cap. Toji is gonna have his hands full with Lee and possibly drunken lee who is high jonin level off his fight w kimmimaru (bone guy) then choji of a food perc, Neji cloak naruto and shikimaru with his intelligence it's up for toji bro.
@@sircondones1032 I wanted to say he'd cook em off rip but then I remembered bro actually legit fast af too so idk,what I do know is he aint half the tank Gaara was at 13,and Toji my boy,but he not surviving the MAD DANCE OF INFINITY let alone a Hidden Lotus 🤣
Unless we giving kid Naruto lightspeed b/c of the Haku fight then it depends on info. If Toji knows about the retrieval team then he speed blitzes Shikamaru first before handling the rest of the team extreme-difficulty. If Toji doesn't know about the retrieval team then he tries to sneak one of them, Neji locates him, Shikamaru possesses Toji & the rest jump him mid-diff.
@@Mr.Rendo1 strengh doesnt matter if toji is moving faster than lighting because he dodge nue's lighting. and durablity doesnt matter either because soulsplit sword negs durablity
@@Mr.Rendo1 Toji wouldn't fight fair, his dura neg sword & stealth is taking out any of the kids if he catches them off guard. He doesn't need to box them.
@@funnymano7497 thats reactionary speed vs travel speed. A toji level maki was having trouble with mach 3 speeds. Kid lee was easily mach 10-20 after dropping his weights and entering the gates. Soulsplitter doesent matter if he can’t touch him.
@@funnymano7497 dosent naruto dodge mf hakus lightspeed ass not two mf arcs earlier neji would detect that nigga instantly hes getting thru that invisibility shit rock lee in gates was on some jounin level shit he was blitzing like crazy
@@K-qm4ktmaybe rock lee after 5 gates but still. Everyone in the official team get cooked by Toji with a gun. Then again he likely does because dead Naruto means a free 9 tail fox. The extra support? Also get cooked by a Toji with a gun outside of Gaara. Then toji just stab him with that knife that negate cursed techniques. If it works on chakra, Gaara is fucked. Then again, it be a tailed beast freed so Toji still fucked.
Hashirama cells aren’t compatible with anyone who isn’t an Uchiha or Senju decedent. That’s why when Danzo was losing his fight against Sasuke his arm turned into a tree and his back had twigs growing out of it. 😭😭
Naruto verse as a whole washes the JJK verse not only through sheer numbers but versatility(not counting Hokage level or gojo ) . They are faster and stronger with literally being trained to kill as apart of their life. RCT is the only thing i feel JJK verse has that is better than Naruto . But ultimately like only 5 folks can use it though 😅.. The sasuke retrieval squad not even being Jonin Lvl shows how much the JJK world would get stomped..
@@Whereisyoaimidstop characters in Naruto way to smart to charge in recklessly and keep in mind I don’t seen no one in jjk keep up with the heavy hitters in Naruto
I’ll put it like this. It required a sharingan and Byakugan to track and even understand what was going on with Lee as a child. Toji wouldn’t even be able see him let alone get bounced around like a ping pong ball. Bruh.
Ppl seem too forget that Zabuza and the special units of each village are Kage candidates, so Haku b n stronger than him makes him a Kage level threat like kimimaro
@@foresightmystery9845 kimimaro has more solid proof though because he literally helped orochimaru kill a kage before. Haku lost a tailless naruto while kimimaro was effortlessly folding naruto with clones, I don’t think that’s putting haku near kage level.
@cinemaphar There's your misconception. Haku didn't lose to kyuubi Naruto, he just didn't want to kill him. And each Village kage is completely different in power. The Mizukage at the time was far stronger than the Kazekage (Yagura) as he was a perfect Jinchuuriki of the 3tails and Kage level in base. Zabuza is quoted to be the strongest user of the Executioner's Blade and the previous owner, Juzo the partner of Itachi, was stronger than Itachi at the time he joined, who was at the top of the strongest clan in the world! Juzo was manhandling the Mizukage while Itachi of all ppl, who had just clowned Orochimaru prior to the battle, was struggling even with Amaterasu and Zabuza was stronger than him while Haku was stronger than Zabuza. He is indeed Kage level. Hell, even more concrete, Kakashi is kage level at the time, and Haku is stronger than him! He was comparable to Tsunade, the legendary Sannin that was chosen as Hokage! Blatantly stated by all 3 Sannin!
and lee has no speed feats above mach(idk) And toji at very least is mach3+ as vengeful cursed spirit naoyah is mach3 and maki no diffed him naoyah couldnt even touch maki after fully realised
@@funnymano7497that's his reaction speed he can't keep up such speed in a fight. Maki has been stated to be Mach 3 and they are exactly the same strength so stop acting like jjk characters are crazy in physical stats they are all hacks
Using logic, no one moving light speed in anime😂. Not one person has ignited the atmosphere when apparently moving light speed. Also the force of being hit by someone or something moving that fast would end up with them looking like saitama punching someone with a serious punch…
That’s what I’m sayin everyone just throwing these words out not realizing the Arthur’s just wrote them to hype up the story. But none of these characters move remotely closely to light speed. I don’t think people understand just how fast that actually is.
@@nowonprzn7442 that's why these authors give these characters crazy durability? name anyone in real life not getting their whole body torn apart by a tiny rasengan?
@@AhmedHajjaj-yh6iiNot....in Naruto...Naruto doesnt need to see because he can use pure chakra to fight and in Shippuden was able to destroy a forest with just roaring. Speed isnt the deciding factor here at all
@@funnymano7497 Toji didn’t dodge it Maki did, and she is his equal. And she is shown to have mach 3 reaction time. I am begging you, actually read the manga instead of googling feats 😭
@@KanekiAogiri5 yeah and no one compared to hakus speed at that time. Kakashi got speedblitzed by haku went kakashi is full series with sharringan on. And later on in war arc haku heavly nerfed by edo tensei was still blitzing and outspeeding ms kakashi.
@@funnymano7497 Don’t know what Naruto you watched but Haku did not fight Kakashi in part 1. Kid Sasuke and Naruto did and Sasuke both dodged and attacked a lightspeed Haku giving him a lightspeed reaction speed at worst in the very first arc of the series. And since this whole argument is above Toji vs the kids at the end of part 1, that alone is a better speed feat than anything Toji has going for him and it was done by a Sasuke who was far weaker and slower than himself by the end of part 1. Edo Haku wasn’t nerfed in any way. Kabuto’s reanimation was perfect and brought people back just as strong as they were when they died and in special cases made them even stronger, like with Madara. MS Kakashi also wasn’t “struggling” to keep up at all lmao.
Choji caught a punch and overpowered a dude who casually lifted him up and threw him in the air while he weighed over 100,000 tons Naruto stops a charging giant snake dead in its tracks with a single punch that was calcd to be town busting levels of force A truck is as light as a feather to these children
Ok so let’s have this discussion In terms of this fight the only person that stands a chance is Lee (which is honestly a cop out since Lee wasn’t on the original retrieval team but let’s include him anyway) and here’s why Typically when u have these debates u keep what the characters normally have on them as well as equalizing the power systems Meaning cursed energy and chakra is the same Because of that neji instantly becomes the weakest person in this fight for 2 reasons 1. Because toji doesn’t have any cursed energy it would follow he would have no chakra, since they are one and the same in this fight, meaning neji wouldn’t have a way to attack him since gentle fist is about hitting chakra points and using one’s chakra to influence the persons chakra your hitting to damage them But as we just established toji has no chakra so again neji has no way to deal any damage since as the name implies GENTEL fist doesn’t do a lot of physical damage in and of itself And 2. Because we know toji always keeps the inverted spear of heaven on him and it completely nullifies the curse techniques/ energy It comes in contact with, since we are equalizing the powers it’s going to do the same with chakra meaning his rotation is going to instantly get nullified with one slash taking away nejis entire kit Now onto Choji whose arguable the next weakest in this match up Choji is the tank of the group, the muscle, the heavy hitter The issue is even at Choji largest He is still smaller then the giant sea monsters we saw dagoon manifest in his domain that Toji easily and effortlessly dealt with so like neji choji is getting packed up Now onto the third weakest Kiba again even with his transformation he is no where near faster then the sourcerer with the frames ability let alone the fish we saw dagoon attack Toji with, he also gets packed up, hell Tojis likely to kill his dog since we know he has no issue killing animals and that’s really ggs Next up shikumaru Who if he can catch him with the shadow paralysis might do something but we never find out if there is a limit to how much force they can hold back, if there is then it’s not doing anything to Toji but even if there isn’t the move itself isn’t fast enough to catch him, and with no prior knowledge on who he is or what he can do it’s going to be almost impossible for him in that kind of situation to come up with a plan Next up naruto I genuinely don’t think naruto does much here Even with his clones because of how weak they are to damage toji runs through them And people say what about his Kurama mode The issue with that is the inverted spear of heaven again it’s going to cut through the chakra dispelling it and taking him out of that mode The only person up for conversation is Lee and even then I would still argue he loses Everyone talks about how fast the characters are but let me ask u a question If they are so fast why do they need chakra to run on water Toji could with just speed alone If they are faster shouldnt they also be able to? Plus Tojis senses are levels above everyone else’s in this conversation Need I remind everyone here that Toji can not see any of the curse spirits or techniques he fights against And yet he still wins consistently Let me ask y’all this to make it as simple as possible If u put this entire team up against Dagoon in his domain An enemy they can’t see, hear, or smell Could they win as a team? Helllllll No But Toji did I’m giving it to Toji
You wrote all that to just be so wrong lol got to do some more research bro. For starters.. chakra is life force so Toji would be dead by your logic. Also they use chakra to stand on water. People aren’t using full speed 24/7 lol. Even if that is plot. To say a cursed tool has those effects but nothing really seen like that in Naruto is a tough point to make as well. Only thing you can do is take their feats and compare
Your points about neji on how his attacks doesn't work on toji because he has no cursed energy makes no sense and it's pretty biased, you do realize if you simply just done research, you would look up that chakra is mix with spirit energy and physical energy, that's like saying hollow purple wouldn't work because toji has no cursed energy but dies to it anyway. The way you pointed it out in terms of speed on why naruto characters needed chakra to be above water level, so according to your logic, tojj born with heavenly restriction was reason why he's strong. At this point, it just seems a pretty bad narrative to come up with this logic.
not boutta read allat everyone besides shika and kiba claps ts out of toji, they can tank all his attacks, are faster than him, and they can literally 1 tap him, naruto in just 1 kyubbi can destory mountain by yelling cmon now
@@Thatboygtmike no not really because if we are equating the power systems chakra and cursed energy and toji in a world where everyone and even items have cursed energy, but he doesnt then why would he have chakra? AGAIN if we are equating cursed energy and chakra, making them one and the same for the sake of this fight Why wouldnt it be able to work on chakra if it can work on cursed energy the thing we are making equal to said cursed energy?
I love JJK and Toji, but he is getting maxed. The characters in Naruto are regular humans too with super human strength as well. They can just channel Chakra for multiple things. Rock without weights as a kid may be on him a little. As an adult he is maxed within secs
raikage larret was alr stated to be lightspeed and raikage v2 cloak is also lightspeed already and baby gold naruto who stole kuramas chakra blitzed raikage
@@namelessvoid9725 lee almost died to kimimaru bro we’re talking about ninjas in training vs a assassin with a pact that gives him superhuman strength … it’s a weird debate man
Spoilers In the manga of JJK Maki gets a buff, basically becoming female Toji. In a fight she got hit by and attack moving in "mach 3"(speed of sound x3) Maki is still getting use to her new body but compared herself to Toji saying if he was in her position he would've dodge the attack or even parry it. So maybe he can move faster than mach 3? People just say mach 3 because of what Maki said, but there really is no sold answer on his speed
You know that a 1km/h difference in speed is MASSIVE right?. Ya'll act like to blitz or react to someone you have to be 3x their speed. Humans can register and react to things moving at 100s of km/h even though the fastest man in real life runs at 40km/h.
Toji vs the retrieval team from OG naruto is no contest, he'd kill them all almost instantly if it was his objective. If its Shippuden? Toji going back to sleep
saw a video talking bout maki, when she caught a bullet in season 1 iirc someone calculated it and that took like mach 100+ maki jjk powerscalings dont exist- plus if kid gaara can react to rock lee im psure toji can
lmao "Not a real bulelt" i guess sasukes lighting isnt real LMAO. Its literally almost a 1:1 copy of a real gun OTHERWISE there is literally no reason to use it.@@SupaSoldierLegend
@@C3l3bi1 um you clearly don’t understand. The bullet was created so it was obviously modified and without driving into JJK manga spoilers just know that the bullet was much weaker than a real round because Mai would never try to kill her sister.
@@SupaSoldierLegend 1. it was a 1:1 replica of a bullet thats her technique 2. at the time she did want to beat maki she kinda stupid tho like its mai dont plea reason, but yeah she hated her atp but then they cuddled after she got folded 3. then why was every other bullet real lol, and I mean kind of hard to propel scorching iron at someones head and not cause a fatal injury, and she was shocked by the catch so its not like it was meant to be avoidable
Lee beats him with ez, Lee cna jsut dodge to hits and shinobis cna touch there soul, for example when naruo pull his sould back in when nagato took it out, plus Lee's faster and stronger and has battle experience, he also beats him in combat, what's stopping Lee form using the 8th gates, Lee stomps
@ajaidenmatthews5328 you have to take away Toji's tools for Lee to stand a chance...matter fact I'll say Lee low different if Toji has no tools but that's a nerf
1) Lee & gaara isn’t part of the retrieval team 2) if lee and gara show up late they’d also lose. 3)Naruto might be able to plot it out if they keep him alive. Otherwise they all get deleted
This is the kid version, right? Even in the Naruto world, the team was barely getting through their fights. Toji will blitz them, giving them no room to set up their good counter moves. They need prep time, but he doesn't at least half the teams gone within seconds.
Yeah barely getting thru the fights in THEIR verse. If they were in jjk they would ace their missions no diff. Lee needs 2 gates if that, naruto cloak comes on its over, neji tracking his ass, shikamaru tracking his ass
Brio I'm not gonna lie, this is some hard recency bias. The team don't need prep to beat toji whereas toji needs prep to stand a chance. Just bcuz they're kids doesn't mean they can't win. Lee, Neji, and Naruto can fight him solo at their max as kids and actually kill him let alone with a master strategist, another sensory Ninja, and an extra tank with butterfly Choji or even worse, adding the sand siblings and Lee. That's a blatant L
lee would beat dagon. Toji deadass no diffed dagon and dagon isnt even as fast as speed of sound getting blitzed my naobito who is just flat out speed of sound. And toji beat young gojo sure. But a gojo who had to keep his mind trying to get amanai safe so he got cought off guard and blatenly said he didnt want to take gojo head on so he wanted to exhaust him by making him keep limitless up and then tiring him out. And then proceeding to sneak attack him before the actual fight. Toji says himself he wouldnt want to take him head on
Dagon has city level destruction. Toji toyed with him and he was fast enough to be invisible to a dude that has eyes that can see EVERYTHING … Toji would be compaired to guy sensai
If its verse equalization then toji's weapons should be the deciding facors here. His inverted spear od heaven would instead disable all chakra (so essentially if naruto could even land a rasengan it woulsnt matter since toji could hit it with the sword and deactivate the chakra)
I don't think the inverted spear of heaven stops the force of the cursed energy/chakra attack though. Example of this is the Toji vs Awakened Gojo fight, he was still sent flying by red while using the spear to block it.
@@randomyoutuber2633 what force? the force behind the rasengang is just naruto pushing it with his hand, the reason the blade couldnt stop purple is because of its giant area. the blade itself was untouched
Why do people do this equalization shit if your weapon cancels cursed energy then that's what it does you don't suddenly start bullshitting and say it cancels Chakra
@@drins6427that's how it's supposed to work if your ability is specific to your powersystem it should stay that way. Different power systems follow different rules ki, magic, cursed energy don't work like Chakra
The speed argument is irrelevant considering gojo can move literally instantaneously teleport yet still got bodied by toji. Toji would murk kid naruto/rock leee w.e. And would arguably kill them in shippuden too. If yall giving naruto characters consistent light speed than im giving toji cursed tools to apply to chakra as well as cursed energy since there so closely linked/related. And evem with all your made up light speed they still getting bodied by his skill and heavenly spear
@@ajaidenmatthews5328kekkei genkai can be more than multiple elements. iirc Dojutsu is also considered Kekkei Genkai. It can also be jutsu used only by certain families like the Uzumaki chakra chains or Bone Pulse from the rare cases in the now extinct Kaguya clan since Kimimaro. It gets confusing because Kekkei Tota is 3 elements and Kekkei Mora is only for those that gain powers from consumption of the Chakra fruit. Thats is a curveball considering Madara Rinnegan and the Hyugas' Byuakugan are just Kekkei Genkai while Hagoromo's Rinne and Kaguya's Byakugan are Kekkei Mora. Even though Kaguya had her Byakugan before eating the Chakra Fruit With that said, I think Naruto's 6PSM and Sasuke's Rinnegan are Kekkei Mora since they were given to them from Hagoromo. And I guess there's rare cases of Kekkei Mora now as well but I stopped watching once Shippuden ended
Ngl, this shit was entertaining to watch, but like, the lack of basic power-scaling understanding is pretty palpable. Still fun to watch and I love you guys. Also nothing wrong with not knowing much about power-scaling either. It’s just a small part of the anime community anyway.
This stream was before the one where RDC was arguing on if Rock Lee was faster than Pain. So if you were wondering why they were so heated in that argument, it was because this isn't the first time they argued this. Just goes to show how fun and chaotic RDC still is off stream, which is why when they finally tell us the stories it feels genuine, like when Dylan and John argued about basketball for YEARS.
Check my community posts for frequently asked questions as well as the current status of my edited vids.
Chat acting like the kids in Naruto ain’t trained to take a life from the age of 7 onwards
7 onward is lowkey generous when u consider kakashi is jonin at 6 lmfao. Like how many bodies do u need b4 you get that recognition.
@@Youknow6969able Kakashi doing casual genocide fr
Kakashi is different tho. Just look at narutos squad
So was toji
@@Youknow6969able kakashi was not jonin at 6 lol
People let JJK's animation carry too much water in this argument. Base Lee minus leg weights is at least keeping up with him, once he starts opening those gates it's over
Based off what tho? U saying jjk animation carrying but what in naruto was confirmed in terms of speed? Your also assuming based of animation. (In terms of 5 gates lee in early naruto
@@dmetriusmarchhe tryna say their animation be fast pace but in reality they not that fast
@@dmetriusmarchkids be dodging sound attacks in Naruto forest of death.
@@dmetriusmarch JJK characters really dont scale that high on AVG in comparison to other verses. Their top tiers are just big fishes in a small pond. They get cooked up in the Big 3 verses and got a lot of problems dealing with a couple current anime
@@kelvin3855they said IN THE MANGA Toji is Mach 3+
Idk why people keep downplaying naruto smh
Because it is popular and was one of the first animes to hit mainstream
Naruto speed be inconsistent.people say Kakashi is as fast as lighting and say that rock Lee is faster than sound. Then would say Drunk Lee is speed of light like huh???
@@christhechillednobody said drunk lee is that speed if anything they’re talking about his speed increase if he would be in 5th gate
cause they ass
@@christhechilledno one said drunk lee was fast u just saying shi atp😂😂😂
Toji ain't beating no god damn shippuden ninja, just regular ninjas are fast as a bitch let alone someone specializing in speed, put him against Minato, shisui or sasuke and he's cooked
Toji is shitting on the sasuke retrieval team doubt pre time skip???? Are you slow
Toji could definitely fight a lot of the ninja in Naruto
@@N3XTL3V3Lno he isn’t 💀
@@N3XTL3V3L I ain't talking about no god damn retrieval team dumbass, I was talking in general, was Minato and Shisui in the retrieval team? read before you talk
Shisui? With all his 0 feats and 10 anti feats from getting beat by Danzo.
Mach 7 being light speed the funniest shit I’ve heard in a while🤣🤣🤣🤣
I’m saying 😂😂 and they was believing that bs too 😭
By the way nothing moves faster than light so anybody saying anything about faster than light is bullshitting and making it up on the fly js
@zebrachair2264 Buddy it's a fucking cartoon lmao
@@uwantdamoney1643Homie thinks he’s the “light speed lawyer”
@@zebrachair2264that pfp really matches the retarded shii you just said😂
chat is killing me mappa animation really done fried their brains
Facts toji ain’t running as fast the flash 😂
@@ShisuiDUchiha either is rock lee but somehow in battle he can do laps around the planet, naruto feats never made sense
@@Thewing2001jjk no made sense too
i swear toji fans are the next gen itachi fans 😭
Itachi top 5 so that’s good 😂
@@mastertoki1case in point
no fr 😂
@@mastertoki1 yuh
Going off strictly canon(manga) material I think folks forget a surpressed Lee uprooted a entire root😅
A tree root that was bigger than himself
With light work
That was a giant 'forest of death' Tree Root.. with one hand.
Also if you just wanted to go off of eye test, Lee in the chunin exam with the weights off was literally doing what Toji was doing to dagon, that might be the last time they’re equal in strength and speed 💀
Don't yall ever disrespect Rock Lee like that again. Chill out
Boruto disrespected him enough! He doesn’t need anymore disrespect!
@@sterlingsilver7563 facts lol
You respect a nigga that never got a W
His own show disrespected him. Rock Lee is easily the most overrated character in Naruto
@@christianw935 "easily the most overrated character" boy nobody asked for your opinion lol
toji is just rock lee if he got some cheeks 😂
Doesn't Rock Lee have a son?
He has a whole kid 💀
No wife tho
@@ace3589ten ten
The two of them have only superficial similarities. Their personalities and roles in their series are totally different (especially considering Toji actually had a role).
I hate these arguments shit just turns into lying and hypotheticals.
that makes it fun tho
Ong that’s power scaling 2 characters from 2 different anime not in the same universe and debating on who would win a fight it’s stupid
@@zaveionchambers3809that’s why it’s called a debate. Thats like debating what restaurant is the best, it’s all subjective but it makes for good conversation it’s a stream and that’s what they do is entertain.
because you're not supposed to take it serious and makea big deal out of it lol
@@Reak00own that fraud !
The problem for Toji is that his whole kit is tailored to assassinating sorcerers specifically. the shinobi of Naruto would already be familiar with stealth strats and more than likely be better at it, already use other senses to track foes and don't need CE, and undoubtedly have a greater fighting background than Toji. In a fair fight, Toji isn't touching Lee once he pulls out the gates
Toji Fushiguro is a powerful anomaly in the world of Jujutsu Kaisen, possessing inhuman speed, strength, and senses despite having zero Cursed Energy. Don’t talk if you don’t do your research. Toji isn’t give Rock lee no chance of winning. Toji killing rock lee in an instant before he even open his gate and take off the weights. I did my research and my homework.
@@supremetrippie399 if you did your research, you’d actually have seen the numbers and the sheer gap between the two lmao
@@thatguy779is you dumb or dumber. Toji have inhuman speed with no limits. Toji is killing rock lee dumb ass. Use you Brain not your ass
@@thatguy779Toji isn’t give him no time to do nothing. Rock lee can also get slower. He Don’t get even faster
@@supremetrippie399 ima be so fr rn, Toji himself don’t even scale to the version of Gojo that reaches the top tiers of the verse meanwhile Lee was blitzing Gaara at the damn chunin exams
Who tf is out here thinking Toji would actually win 💀💀
Me. Idk why a guy who stomped a small crater into the ground with ease, threw a propane tank, and poked rubble individually as fast as bullets is being downplayed. He is for sure stronger, more strategic, and has a killer instinct. Speed doesn't beat all that 100% of the time.
@@kry4973in no world is toji stronger than lee. once lee takes off the weights its wraps he wont even need to open the gates
@@lowpurgeLee don’t even need to take off the weights to wax toji
@@kry4973lee with just the gates alone would destroy toji dawg
@doc8187 My thing is, does Toji seem the type to allow Lee to take his weights off, or open his gates. Toji is going for the kill, period. Lee aint about that. I love Naruto too, but get real Lee doesnt walk around in gate form and it takes a second. Toji will not wait. Lee will be killed, sorry.
If Toji had prep time he could kill him. Only reason Toji stood a chance again Gojo was because he had prep time.
That is true and shikamaru is better at making plans In the middle of battle.
Tell me you’re a Batman fanboy without telling me you’re a Batman fanboy
@@gt-hoverclown3338Batman solos all
It’s no where near close to being the same prep time still wouldn’t jack
he had to prep for gojo cause the mf has the six eyes plus infinity he had to weaken his ct output to blitz him
Toji is Mach 3. Most of the naruto cast were above lighting speed in their youth rolf
You are capping hard pls tell me the pages that state that are lighting speed bro
@@TheGostboy7 Lee's base speed is enough to outspeed garaa's sand defense which was moving at mach 30. When Lee opens a gate it increases his speed by 5x. Lee 3 gates would be enough to outspeed Toji by a landslide along with the entire JJK verse.
@@wokeuplikedis1500I’m tryna see what kinda dumb shit he replies with 😂
@@wokeuplikedis1500Where is it stated that garra's sand defense is that fast specifically?
@@exilewarrior7760 wasn't specifically stated, but Garaa's sand made a full barrier fast enough to defend a young Garaa from an explosion upfront. That would've required the sand to move at Mach 30 and Garaa has only gotten stronger/faster since. Lee was able to outspeed it by taking off his weights.
Toji getting rocked tbh, the Naruto power scale is out of control. Most old shows power scales are tbh, mfs was moving “light speed” like that wouldn’t destroy the whole planet 😂 Speed aside, Toji had a knife and no magic, like niggas in Naruto aren’t used to dealing with that
a knife? wut? its literally a auto cancel blade, "the power sclaing" doesnt fucking exist, its all arbitrary, they arent actually moving at lightspeed
@@C3l3bi1 yes, a knife, the same shit niggas in Naruto warm up with. You know the fight hasn’t even started yet when they’re still using knives.
@@C3l3bi1to cursed energy doesn't mean it does the same to Chakra
@@C3l3bi1Naruto is a stronger verse it’s not close look at the enemies of Naruto. Kaguya touch down in jjk tf they gone do
@@C3l3bi1 they are, they are literally moving faster than lightning
Toji moves faster than the speed of sound but not light speed
faster or faster than light dodging nue's lighting attack while barely trying
@@funnymano7497light is much faster than lightning
@funnymano7497 Dude lightning is jot the speed of light 😂. This is how it goes sound< lightning < light. If you watch videos of lightning you can see the lighting actually coming down faster than the sound can appear
@@funnymano7497 Yo ass ain’t never pay attention to science class. Light is significantly faster than lightning.
@@EugeneHKrabsNow everybody in the comments an expert on high level speed lmao.
Who y’all think you fooling. This is NOT common knowledge
Kid kakashi literally caught and sliced lightning in half, the raikiri is literally named lightning cutter because of that same scene
Toji also physically dodged lightning
@@rngnakka9850 rember when Toji started beating on his son, and got hit wit nue
@@rngnakka9850but we don’t know if that was ACTUALLY lightning speed
@@rngnakka9850also he didn’t physically dodge anything bro that’s all I have to say blud turned his head be fr
@@DeadLogto catch lightning you'd have to in theory be as fast or faster
The Toji glazing is crazy💀💀
Are you kidding me ? Toji is getting destroyed. Think about it , the retrieval team is Naruto , Choji , Shikamaru , Akamaru/Keeba and Neji. Neji will see the guy where ever he goes, shikamaru will be able to a
Track his shadow , one shot from choji he’s dead , Keebas beast mode can sniff him out if he hides and Naruto don’t need to do shit
Thank you.. a smart person here
Thank you. Recency bias got ppl on edge! They overscale over shows but when it comes to Naruto they'll say shit like "oh you can't use that feat cuz I think it's bad writing that the kids can beat my favorite anime characters"
Neji will see him but doesnt mean he can keep up.
I agree but don’t forget Toji’s weapons are a problem oh and Naruto can potentially go onto 1-tail
@@dmetriusmarch Kiba will keep up then or Nine Tail eyes Naruto😂. And its over for Toji if he gets hit with a Rotation thinking he's about to just rush up on Neji
Do ppl truly know how fast the speed of light is 😂😂😂😂😂😂
none of them have a damn clue 😂😂😂, in mach speed terms, light speed is around about mach 874,030 desmond said and i quote " He was moving at mach 3? thats damn near lightspeed"
At another point I believe its mark says the chat said Mach 7 was lightspeed. 😂😂😂
My nigga toji got prep time 😭😭😭😭
Bro is basically a homeless batman
Toji beating lee...toji is a smart fighter he beat the character who can't be touched.
And why are they focused on speed.
@@Skip_56 because speed is kinda important especially if you can blink and someone is right behind you 💀
@@KanekiAogiri5 facts but toji is fast too💀 its not like lee is that fast that toji can't even react.
@@Skip_56 he isn’t that fast apparently because people are saying his best feat is Mach 3 💀 Lee 5th gate is way past Mach 3
Somebody on here already did this matchup and Toji can’t even get past neji and even if he did he’d have no chance against rock lee in shippuden
Exactly. Most of these kids flashy animation get the better of their senses
@@bruhhmomentumm fr
Nah I don’t think Neji would be able to do much if anything to Toji
@chidorirasenganz gentle fist would literally be his crytonite
Quite literally says Sasuke retrieval arc. Toji is waxing all dem genin.
Toji is moving at subsonic+ max and rock lee is moving hypersonic+ at most. A lowball for rock lee hes moving at the same speed as toji without gates. Rock lee with gates wipes toji.
Shimamura is also a genius not to mention neji,naruto and choji+kiba are inculded in the fight
Not true. Maki was able to dodge mach 3 speeds from cursed naoya which is wayyy faster then subsonic and hypersonic speeds. And right after that she was stated to be equal to toji so that feat upscaled toji. Yea Lee wipes in gates I agree but dont downplay toji speed.
@@touka6589Toji isn’t give Lee no chance to do nothing. Lee don’t have the Battle QI like Toji has. Don’t have killer instincts like Toji. Lee killed if he faces Toji has. I’m sorry but it’s true. Toji isn’t playing no games with lee
@@supremetrippie399 base lee already had the feats to hold him off lmao. He let Gojo get off a hollow purple...... Lee is def getting gates off on toji. He also couldn't even kill megumi in the time he was fighting him lol mind you that was a heavily weakened megumi who just got done having a tug of war domain battle with a special grade curse.he only realized that was his son at the end of the fight so the fight itself was him thinking he was fighting a random . Lee is def doing a way better chance
@@touka6589 that’s Gojo but Lee getting gates off that’s not happening. Do you know who Toji is. when he came back to life. He was demon time. He’s going to one shot Lee. If you said lee is winning. You delusional asf. Toji is tossing his salad.
the problem for toji is that his stealth and speed won't really matter. lee, neji, naruto, and choji all have feats that put them higher than toji in just physicals alone. but if you wanna add the others that's just over kill
Lee solos fr probably at 3-4 gates
yeah, the verse😭
@@joeysblindToji killing Lee. Toji isn’t give him no chance.
@@supremetrippie399 toji mad weak in the naruto verse
Nah you tripping there no way lee gets past gojo or sukuna or even mahito@@joeysblind
@@supremetrippie399 naruto scaling vs jjk scaling isn’t even funny. you can wank 3-4 gates lee to light speed, nobody in the jjk verse other than maybe sukuna and gojo MAYBE can even scale to his speed.
Are y'all fr? Toji gets smothered
Toji getting fucked up and don’t even start with the nine tails😂😂😂
Toji getting fried in milliseconds
Pre timeskip. And in the manga toji is Mach 3
@@vanessahenriquez1377bro lee was probably faster than that with weights on and no gate lol
@@vanessahenriquez1377 toji is not mach 3
Toji is Mach 3 because of manga stuff
Toji ain’t Mach 3 that was a mistake gege made he admitted as much
Y'all aren't even talking facts here. Kakashi could move faster than lightning during the Kakuzu fight. And he didn't have any physical boosts. This means Rock Lee can easily surpass light speed if he opens his gates. By the start of Boruto, when Lee is the around the same age as Toji, he can most likely open 7 gates. It's gg for Toji in terms of both speed and power at that point
They mention he has it mastered in the final episodes of Shippuden
Even kid kakashi.
Wait wait wait, how is Kakashi faster than lightning in the Kakuzu fight and how does that boost Lee to faster than light?? Lightning and light move at two very different speeds, light being massively faster…
@@nakedbeefcake4168Its baffling how many times I have seen in this comment section people mistaking faster than lightning meaning faster than light. Its hilarious
@@timbrady1176They sometimes move at the speed of light and other times move at the speed of lightning.
in Naruto they have combat speed, movement speed and their various forms of teleportation/blinking.
There goes no day by where people don't shit on Naruto. People even claiming Luffy is way faster than Naruto etc. People need to get over their pride and go with the facts.
Luffy can be counted as faster than naruto. Neither move at light speed travel wise, but both can battle wise
One Piece characters have crazy speed scaling, Luffy included. Luffy is way faster than Naruto currently
@@ohblivianI’m a one piece fan but no Naruto is faster
If we are talking about Kid Naruto from the Naruto series, then Yeah.
Luffy is way faster, Base Naruto is not even speed of sound.
@@crocoboi7936 that boi luffy been dodging light since pre time skip don't play ma boi
Rock Lee without the weights on his legs is packing up Toji
Lee washing the verse respectfully
Fuck no
nah he beats toji, but chill lol
The dope you smoke smh
@@MiLLz830 Adult Lee with 8th Gates. heck even 7 gates Lee desortyed a whole meteor in half. He washing majority of the verse
What's he doing against Gojo?
People seem to forget Lee has used nunchucks too. Imagine if he gets ahold of Toji’s Playful Cloud
Dez be sounding stupid asf in these arguments. It be pissing me off fr😂😂
Dude he barely said anything
all of them are. Aint no way even for a second thought mach7 was lightspeed. And everyone is just interprating what they see on the screen and not actual feats.
@SupaSoldierLegend nah every time he said something it was blatantly stupid. Des one of my favorites and even I can admit nothing he said made actual sense. He was arguing animation quality to justify speed
@@foresightmystery9845 yeah like if thats the case entire dbz dbs is getting smacked by crayonshinchan
Why they kept ignoring John when he was saying speed is not the only important thing. Smh
Cuz he’s kinda wrong
@@illest71 no he wasnt
@@3azy0nS3t he is. Speed is the most important thing in vs battle if you out scale in speed by a lot which the naruto characters do
@@illest71 weightless Lee is hypersonic mach 3 and above. stop the cap. Toji is gonna have his hands full with Lee and possibly drunken lee who is high jonin level off his fight w kimmimaru (bone guy) then choji of a food perc, Neji cloak naruto and shikimaru with his intelligence it's up for toji bro.
@@johncrowley3322 yeah ik Toji loses lmao
If Lee start opening gates issa wrap
if we being fr once rock lee takes them weights off toji is done
@@sircondones1032 I wanted to say he'd cook em off rip but then I remembered bro actually legit fast af too so idk,what I do know is he aint half the tank Gaara was at 13,and Toji my boy,but he not surviving the MAD DANCE OF INFINITY let alone a Hidden Lotus 🤣
y’all letting nostalgia get to you toji is killing those kids
Let him get past Mach 3 before comparing him to children faster than lightning with better strength feats 🤣
Rock Lee’s speed stat goes crazy
I can see why ppl call them frauds 😂🤣
Unless we giving kid Naruto lightspeed b/c of the Haku fight then it depends on info. If Toji knows about the retrieval team then he speed blitzes Shikamaru first before handling the rest of the team extreme-difficulty. If Toji doesn't know about the retrieval team then he tries to sneak one of them, Neji locates him, Shikamaru possesses Toji & the rest jump him mid-diff.
Haku only moves at light speed between mirrors
@@MatthewCJoy Kid Naruto reacted, dodged, & caught Haku while he was moving between mirrors. ruclips.net/video/TWhJwd3y8kE/видео.html
Dude the gap in strength is insane Toji getting smoked
@@Mr.Rendo1 strengh doesnt matter if toji is moving faster than lighting because he dodge nue's lighting. and durablity doesnt matter either because soulsplit sword negs durablity
@@Mr.Rendo1 Toji wouldn't fight fair, his dura neg sword & stealth is taking out any of the kids if he catches them off guard. He doesn't need to box them.
Im so disappointed in these Toji fans. Good animation makes yall lose yall media literacy
he dodges lighting at close range from nue LIGHTNING attack + soulsplitter katana that negs durablity nothing else matters
@@funnymano7497 thats reactionary speed vs travel speed. A toji level maki was having trouble with mach 3 speeds. Kid lee was easily mach 10-20 after dropping his weights and entering the gates. Soulsplitter doesent matter if he can’t touch him.
@@funnymano7497toji caps at Mach 3
@@funnymano7497 dosent naruto dodge mf hakus lightspeed ass not two mf arcs earlier neji would detect that nigga instantly hes getting thru that invisibility shit rock lee in gates was on some jounin level shit he was blitzing like crazy
Toji wins it’s really not a debate. It’s not just speed. The gaara fight was the highlight of his career and he lost. Even then toji is faster.
rock lee is so fast u cant even see him on on panel😭😭 rock lee alone is cooking toji😭
They said “Des pregnant “ 😭
HE HAS A GUN
They move faster then guns
@@K-qm4kt buddy toji is an assassin can they move faster then a gun they can't see
@@slugawful. you Toji fan boys are something else lmao he loses simple as that😂
@@K-qm4ktmaybe rock lee after 5 gates but still. Everyone in the official team get cooked by Toji with a gun.
Then again he likely does because dead Naruto means a free 9 tail fox.
The extra support? Also get cooked by a Toji with a gun outside of Gaara.
Then toji just stab him with that knife that negate cursed techniques. If it works on chakra, Gaara is fucked.
Then again, it be a tailed beast freed so Toji still fucked.
@@heavyc4450lee slams
Bro lee open them fucking gates bro 😂😂😂😂 he’s decimating unc
I wanna know how Sasuke and Naruto got a new hand but Guy sensei still hopping around on one foot! 😤
It has to be a choice thing which makes sense if you know Guy. Getting Hashi Cells would go against the point of him and Lee.
Sasuke didn't get a new arm and Naruto's arm was made out of Hashirama cells, which not everyone is compatible with
@@luisalejandrolopezbuendia9686 thanks. I forgot about that
Hashirama cells aren’t compatible with anyone who isn’t an Uchiha or Senju decedent. That’s why when Danzo was losing his fight against Sasuke his arm turned into a tree and his back had twigs growing out of it. 😭😭
@@skinnymelo I forgot about that
Bro was demolishing that food
The utter disrespect for my boy Toji is overwhelming 🤨😤😅
Toji literally speed blitzed Megumi and threw him outside without him realizing he got tossed outside
Mac 3 ain’t nothing to Mac 30 plus with the gates lol
@@trYKGa lol I made I mistake. I’m not tryna cross verse power-scale
@@trYKGamach 3 Mach 3 that’s just people taking just from one anti feat, that wasn’t even Toji. It’s no fun.
@@trYKGabro you are a joke
and that feat got buffed after
@@freemarz3816
It’s actually crazy how much faster naruto characters are than JJK characters are
Naruto verse as a whole washes the JJK verse not only through sheer numbers but versatility(not counting Hokage level or gojo ) . They are faster and stronger with literally being trained to kill as apart of their life. RCT is the only thing i feel JJK verse has that is better than Naruto . But ultimately like only 5 folks can use it though 😅.. The sasuke retrieval squad not even being Jonin Lvl shows how much the JJK world would get stomped..
Tf is they gonna do to domain expansion
@@Whereisyoaimidstop characters in Naruto way to smart to charge in recklessly and keep in mind I don’t seen no one in jjk keep up with the heavy hitters in Naruto
@@UtoWasHere sukunna domain expansion is a 300 mile radius there cooked
Regardless
@@Whereisyoaimids there to fast for that he has to say the the words domanin
@@Whereisyoaimidsthat wouldn’t do anything to them dumass
I’ll put it like this. It required a sharingan and Byakugan to track and even understand what was going on with Lee as a child. Toji wouldn’t even be able see him let alone get bounced around like a ping pong ball. Bruh.
John just says anything at any point. There's never a complete thought. It's just him approaching an idea and then abandoning it.
😂😂😂😂
Haku is a Kage level opponent tho which is crazy
Ppl seem too forget that Zabuza and the special units of each village are Kage candidates, so Haku b n stronger than him makes him a Kage level threat like kimimaro
@@foresightmystery9845 kimimaro has more solid proof though because he literally helped orochimaru kill a kage before. Haku lost a tailless naruto while kimimaro was effortlessly folding naruto with clones, I don’t think that’s putting haku near kage level.
@cinemaphar There's your misconception. Haku didn't lose to kyuubi Naruto, he just didn't want to kill him. And each Village kage is completely different in power. The Mizukage at the time was far stronger than the Kazekage (Yagura) as he was a perfect Jinchuuriki of the 3tails and Kage level in base. Zabuza is quoted to be the strongest user of the Executioner's Blade and the previous owner, Juzo the partner of Itachi, was stronger than Itachi at the time he joined, who was at the top of the strongest clan in the world! Juzo was manhandling the Mizukage while Itachi of all ppl, who had just clowned Orochimaru prior to the battle, was struggling even with Amaterasu and Zabuza was stronger than him while Haku was stronger than Zabuza. He is indeed Kage level.
Hell, even more concrete, Kakashi is kage level at the time, and Haku is stronger than him! He was comparable to Tsunade, the legendary Sannin that was chosen as Hokage! Blatantly stated by all 3 Sannin!
@@PherretfishHaku coulda been killed Naruto
@@Nisowyd and he got immediately folded by the second weakest kyuubi amp.
Toji getting played with
Pause
Toji is Hypersonic at most, Lee blitzes Toji and turns him into a apple logo just like Gojo
lighting speed at most dodging nues lighting attack at close range while having his head turned
and lee has no speed feats above mach(idk) And toji at very least is mach3+ as vengeful cursed spirit naoyah is mach3 and maki no diffed him naoyah couldnt even touch maki after fully realised
@@funnymano7497 Lee is Massively hypersonic+
@@funnymano7497that's his reaction speed he can't keep up such speed in a fight. Maki has been stated to be Mach 3 and they are exactly the same strength so stop acting like jjk characters are crazy in physical stats they are all hacks
@@funnymano7497 reaction speed isn't travel speed
toji deadass not putting hands on rock lee bro💔
He is.
Yall gota remember toji fight regular people they physically normal people
Using logic, no one moving light speed in anime😂. Not one person has ignited the atmosphere when apparently moving light speed. Also the force of being hit by someone or something moving that fast would end up with them looking like saitama punching someone with a serious punch…
That’s what I’m sayin everyone just throwing these words out not realizing the Arthur’s just wrote them to hype up the story. But none of these characters move remotely closely to light speed. I don’t think people understand just how fast that actually is.
A light speed punch ripping thru anything infront of it no difficulty at all 😭
@@nowonprzn7442 that's why these authors give these characters crazy durability? name anyone in real life not getting their whole body torn apart by a tiny rasengan?
Anime fans are dumb 😂 are you new
Rock Lee throwin hands but Toji got Glock-Kun. Ion think Lee bulletproof 😂
faster than a bullet though?
Lee will just dodge lol
This is why I don't like talking to power scalers.
These kids aren’t power scalers these are meat riders 💀 all this is is popularity and recency bias, Toji stands no chance
clown
@@Pherretfish
@@R.X.V.E.N.Z.E jester
@@Pherretfish retard
@@R.X.V.E.N.Z.Eonly clown is u wit this weak ahh bait comment
Y’all gotta remember Tojis weapons like a lot of people don’t know that Geto got playful cloud from tojis armory and playful cloud scales to its user
Speed = win... Make it make sense bruh
It dont = win but if you moving so fast the ither guy cant keep up and everyone can damage each other its up
toji faster bc dodges lighting from nue. Soulsplit katana that negs durablity
@@AhmedHajjaj-yh6iiNot....in Naruto...Naruto doesnt need to see because he can use pure chakra to fight and in Shippuden was able to destroy a forest with just roaring.
Speed isnt the deciding factor here at all
@@Jordaxioyeah and that was with just two tails right ?
@@funnymano7497 Toji didn’t dodge it Maki did, and she is his equal. And she is shown to have mach 3 reaction time. I am begging you, actually read the manga instead of googling feats 😭
Toji caps at around mach 3 chat needs to read the manga lmao
gege backtracked that statement
@@R.X.V.E.N.Z.Eno he didn’t lying ass😂
@@jordonthompson6317 quick google search 😔
@@jordonthompson6317 responding to a statement 8 months ago
@@jordonthompson6317 if you really want me to disprove Mach 3 right now I can
If they don't say light speed in the show it ain't light speed. None of them moving like Shinra
y shinra ad a comparison lol.
Haku was said to be that speed
@@KanekiAogiri5 yeah and no one compared to hakus speed at that time. Kakashi got speedblitzed by haku went kakashi is full series with sharringan on. And later on in war arc haku heavly nerfed by edo tensei was still blitzing and outspeeding ms kakashi.
@@funnymano7497 Don’t know what Naruto you watched but Haku did not fight Kakashi in part 1. Kid Sasuke and Naruto did and Sasuke both dodged and attacked a lightspeed Haku giving him a lightspeed reaction speed at worst in the very first arc of the series. And since this whole argument is above Toji vs the kids at the end of part 1, that alone is a better speed feat than anything Toji has going for him and it was done by a Sasuke who was far weaker and slower than himself by the end of part 1. Edo Haku wasn’t nerfed in any way. Kabuto’s reanimation was perfect and brought people back just as strong as they were when they died and in special cases made them even stronger, like with Madara. MS Kakashi also wasn’t “struggling” to keep up at all lmao.
@@skinnymelo speedblitz kakashis chridori and blocked the shot for zabuza
That “Alright” is GOLDEN.. 😭😭
None of these kids throwing a truck pls stop
Choji caught a punch and overpowered a dude who casually lifted him up and threw him in the air while he weighed over 100,000 tons
Naruto stops a charging giant snake dead in its tracks with a single punch that was calcd to be town busting levels of force
A truck is as light as a feather to these children
Shows that you never watched Naruto, or ever even try to Google that info before you write this stupid comment.
Toji is saucing those kids
Toji is washing rock lee respectfully, bro still holding on to that gaara fight lmao Highlight of his career
Only mf who can hang with Toji speed wise is Minato no cap
Everyone in the war is fast enough to outspeed toji
@@Fiftyzachwtf are u saying Minato ain’t even top 5 fastest in end of shippden bro
@@drins6427 Tweaking name 4 mfs at the end faster than Minato
@@Fiftyzachlol what maki with Tobjis powers was getting blitzed by vengeful spirit naoya and he had a top speed of Mach 3 😂
Ok so let’s have this discussion
In terms of this fight the only person that stands a chance is Lee (which is honestly a cop out since Lee wasn’t on the original retrieval team but let’s include him anyway) and here’s why
Typically when u have these debates u keep what the characters normally have on them as well as equalizing the power systems
Meaning cursed energy and chakra is the same
Because of that neji instantly becomes the weakest person in this fight for 2 reasons
1. Because toji doesn’t have any cursed energy it would follow he would have no chakra, since they are one and the same in this fight, meaning neji wouldn’t have a way to attack him since gentle fist is about hitting chakra points and using one’s chakra to influence the persons chakra your hitting to damage them But as we just established toji has no chakra so again neji has no way to deal any damage since as the name implies GENTEL fist doesn’t do a lot of physical damage in and of itself
And
2. Because we know toji always keeps the inverted spear of heaven on him and it completely nullifies the curse techniques/ energy It comes in contact with, since we are equalizing the powers it’s going to do the same with chakra meaning his rotation is going to instantly get nullified with one slash taking away nejis entire kit
Now onto Choji whose arguable the next weakest in this match up
Choji is the tank of the group, the muscle, the heavy hitter
The issue is even at Choji largest
He is still smaller then the giant sea monsters we saw dagoon manifest in his domain that Toji easily and effortlessly dealt with so like neji choji is getting packed up
Now onto the third weakest Kiba again even with his transformation he is no where near faster then the sourcerer with the frames ability let alone the fish we saw dagoon attack Toji with, he also gets packed up, hell Tojis likely to kill his dog since we know he has no issue killing animals and that’s really ggs
Next up shikumaru
Who if he can catch him with the shadow paralysis might do something but we never find out if there is a limit to how much force they can hold back, if there is then it’s not doing anything to Toji but even if there isn’t the move itself isn’t fast enough to catch him, and with no prior knowledge on who he is or what he can do it’s going to be almost impossible for him in that kind of situation to come up with a plan
Next up naruto
I genuinely don’t think naruto does much here
Even with his clones because of how weak they are to damage toji runs through them
And people say what about his Kurama mode
The issue with that is the inverted spear of heaven again it’s going to cut through the chakra dispelling it and taking him out of that mode
The only person up for conversation is Lee and even then I would still argue he loses
Everyone talks about how fast the characters are but let me ask u a question
If they are so fast why do they need chakra to run on water
Toji could with just speed alone
If they are faster shouldnt they also be able to?
Plus Tojis senses are levels above everyone else’s in this conversation
Need I remind everyone here that Toji can not see any of the curse spirits or techniques he fights against
And yet he still wins consistently
Let me ask y’all this to make it as simple as possible
If u put this entire team up against Dagoon in his domain
An enemy they can’t see, hear, or smell
Could they win as a team?
Helllllll No
But Toji did
I’m giving it to Toji
You wrote all that to just be so wrong lol got to do some more research bro. For starters.. chakra is life force so Toji would be dead by your logic. Also they use chakra to stand on water. People aren’t using full speed 24/7 lol. Even if that is plot. To say a cursed tool has those effects but nothing really seen like that in Naruto is a tough point to make as well. Only thing you can do is take their feats and compare
And Dagoon gets blitzed bro. (Toji W though)
Your points about neji on how his attacks doesn't work on toji because he has no cursed energy makes no sense and it's pretty biased, you do realize if you simply just done research, you would look up that chakra is mix with spirit energy and physical energy, that's like saying hollow purple wouldn't work because toji has no cursed energy but dies to it anyway. The way you pointed it out in terms of speed on why naruto characters needed chakra to be above water level, so according to your logic, tojj born with heavenly restriction was reason why he's strong. At this point, it just seems a pretty bad narrative to come up with this logic.
not boutta read allat everyone besides shika and kiba claps ts out of toji, they can tank all his attacks, are faster than him, and they can literally 1 tap him, naruto in just 1 kyubbi can destory mountain by yelling cmon now
@@Thatboygtmike no not really because if we are equating the power systems chakra and cursed energy and toji in a world where everyone and even items have cursed energy, but he doesnt then why would he have chakra?
AGAIN if we are equating cursed energy and chakra, making them one and the same for the sake of this fight
Why wouldnt it be able to work on chakra if it can work on cursed energy the thing we are making equal to said cursed energy?
I love JJK and Toji, but he is getting maxed. The characters in Naruto are regular humans too with super human strength as well. They can just channel Chakra for multiple things. Rock without weights as a kid may be on him a little. As an adult he is maxed within secs
Rock Lee gettin worked. Toji like that y’all delusional af
Them fools ain't light speed until the fight with Juubi Madara. Fhack you mean?
In addition to that, the retrieval team was struggling with SOUND based attacks.
Ong lol they tryna revise the anime 😂
They were light speed way before that 💀
raikage larret was alr stated to be lightspeed and raikage v2 cloak is also lightspeed already and baby gold naruto who stole kuramas chakra blitzed raikage
Theres literally multiple things in the Naruto verse that are blatantly stated to be light speed waay before light fang such as Kirin
This shouldn’t have never been a debate bro 😂 Toji is a menace
@jaylnjackson104 Toji is also not beating a 5th gate lee 🤣Also
stop the bs the moment that choji pops that red pill toji will die in
one hit.
@@namelessvoid9725 lee almost died to kimimaru bro we’re talking about ninjas in training vs a assassin with a pact that gives him superhuman strength … it’s a weird debate man
@@namelessvoid9725 I do feel like might guy could beat him though
Toji is literally Mach 1, he gets blitzed by rock Lee, yall niggas are crazy
Neji is clapping him easily
Spoilers
In the manga of JJK Maki gets a buff, basically becoming female Toji. In a fight she got hit by and attack moving in "mach 3"(speed of sound x3) Maki is still getting use to her new body but compared herself to Toji saying if he was in her position he would've dodge the attack or even parry it. So maybe he can move faster than mach 3? People just say mach 3 because of what Maki said, but there really is no sold answer on his speed
You know that a 1km/h difference in speed is MASSIVE right?. Ya'll act like to blitz or react to someone you have to be 3x their speed. Humans can register and react to things moving at 100s of km/h even though the fastest man in real life runs at 40km/h.
Toji smacking them kids. This is why powerscaling is dumb asf tho
The scaling shows y he doesn't
Toji vs the retrieval team from OG naruto is no contest, he'd kill them all almost instantly if it was his objective. If its Shippuden? Toji going back to sleep
He too slow And too weak
Toji can't even beat Kiba 1v1
Toji is for sure beating rock lee out his fucking socks
Drunk Lee would rock Toji
Toji dodged lighting
saw a video talking bout maki, when she caught a bullet in season 1 iirc someone calculated it and that took like mach 100+
maki
jjk powerscalings dont exist- plus if kid gaara can react to rock lee im psure toji can
It technically can’t be calculated because it wasn’t a real bullet
lmao "Not a real bulelt" i guess sasukes lighting isnt real LMAO.
Its literally almost a 1:1 copy of a real gun OTHERWISE there is literally no reason to use it.@@SupaSoldierLegend
@@C3l3bi1 um you clearly don’t understand. The bullet was created so it was obviously modified and without driving into JJK manga spoilers just know that the bullet was much weaker than a real round because Mai would never try to kill her sister.
@@SupaSoldierLegend
1. it was a 1:1 replica of a bullet thats her technique
2. at the time she did want to beat maki she kinda stupid tho like its mai dont plea reason, but yeah she hated her atp but then they cuddled after she got folded
3. then why was every other bullet real lol, and I mean kind of hard to propel scorching iron at someones head and not cause a fatal injury, and she was shocked by the catch so its not like it was meant to be avoidable
If she stopped a mf bullet that’s a Flash level feat wtf
btw tojis and maki is mach 3 while rocklee was putting up faster than lightning stats 🤣
toji is a straight up killer lee isn’t. he blitzes lee before he can even power up
Toji needs pre cog for Mach 3
While lee blitz gaaras sand that blocks an explosion
Toji has a sword that aims directly for your soul..rock lee has no chance
Lee beats him with ez, Lee cna jsut dodge to hits and shinobis cna touch there soul, for example when naruo pull his sould back in when nagato took it out, plus Lee's faster and stronger and has battle experience, he also beats him in combat, what's stopping Lee form using the 8th gates, Lee stomps
@ajaidenmatthews5328 omg there is no dodging he swings it and it targets your soul, you can be as fast as you wanna fuckin be
@ajaidenmatthews5328 you have to take away Toji's tools for Lee to stand a chance...matter fact I'll say Lee low different if Toji has no tools but that's a nerf
@BBWatson100 even if toji had tools lee still no diff toji
@@BBWatson100 if nerf lee, he can't use his gates, even out the gate lee wins
1) Lee & gaara isn’t part of the retrieval team
2) if lee and gara show up late they’d also lose.
3)Naruto might be able to plot it out if they keep him alive. Otherwise they all get deleted
stop copingl lol naruto alone bullies toji
And he don't even need to go full power.@@panda_422
bro rock lee beats the dog shit out of toji with just dropping the weights
Reminds me of the people who think kakazu could beat pain. But people are entitled to their opinions just dont be toxic. I think Lee alone wins.
Lee has no Ws in all of Naruto
Let that sink in.
Kimimaru =drunk
Curry Fight= filler and drunk also
Gaara=lost
Sound ninja=lost
Sasuke= W 🤔
Rock Lee at the end of shippuden doesn’t even need to take off his weights to pack toji up
Good fight but I got toji because of experience and skill set, also the killing intent
Delusional
Fr 😭
bro said experience like if these kids weren't trained to be ninja at the age of 7
@@Pherretfishthat’s not delusional dumb that’s facts. Toji winning against rock lee
@@jinmori4256 yall don’t know what Toji was doing as kid stfu. Training at Age 7 don’t mean nothing on Toji
This is the kid version, right? Even in the Naruto world, the team was barely getting through their fights. Toji will blitz them, giving them no room to set up their good counter moves. They need prep time, but he doesn't at least half the teams gone within seconds.
The other thing is while naruto is trying his talk no jutsu toji already going for the kill
Yeah barely getting thru the fights in THEIR verse. If they were in jjk they would ace their missions no diff. Lee needs 2 gates if that, naruto cloak comes on its over, neji tracking his ass, shikamaru tracking his ass
Brio I'm not gonna lie, this is some hard recency bias. The team don't need prep to beat toji whereas toji needs prep to stand a chance. Just bcuz they're kids doesn't mean they can't win. Lee, Neji, and Naruto can fight him solo at their max as kids and actually kill him let alone with a master strategist, another sensory Ninja, and an extra tank with butterfly Choji or even worse, adding the sand siblings and Lee. That's a blatant L
Toji maxing out rock lee, John was right speed ain’t the only factor. He uses a gun 😭 plus he fast ash lee not beating that squid curse and young gojo
A gun??? Lee gonna knock his block off 😂
lee would beat dagon. Toji deadass no diffed dagon and dagon isnt even as fast as speed of sound getting blitzed my naobito who is just flat out speed of sound. And toji beat young gojo sure. But a gojo who had to keep his mind trying to get amanai safe so he got cought off guard and blatenly said he didnt want to take gojo head on so he wanted to exhaust him by making him keep limitless up and then tiring him out. And then proceeding to sneak attack him before the actual fight. Toji says himself he wouldnt want to take him head on
Nigga said “toji has a gun so he’s gon win” no way 😭😭
Dagon has city level destruction. Toji toyed with him and he was fast enough to be invisible to a dude that has eyes that can see EVERYTHING … Toji would be compaired to guy sensai
Rock lee is a skilled ninja who massively out scales toji in everything
Rock lee getting packed up, cooked and digested ngl
zip it up when you done
Lee is beating the shit out of toji what are on about bro😂😂
No way you think he beating 5th gate lee
@@Scumxixxx base lee is cooking that nigga.
If its verse equalization then toji's weapons should be the deciding facors here. His inverted spear od heaven would instead disable all chakra (so essentially if naruto could even land a rasengan it woulsnt matter since toji could hit it with the sword and deactivate the chakra)
I don't think the inverted spear of heaven stops the force of the cursed energy/chakra attack though. Example of this is the Toji vs Awakened Gojo fight, he was still sent flying by red while using the spear to block it.
That’s not how that works that’s like saying a obito can put Goku and a genjutjet when it only works on ppl with chakra n Goku don’t got nun he got ki
@@randomyoutuber2633 what force? the force behind the rasengang is just naruto pushing it with his hand, the reason the blade couldnt stop purple is because of its giant area.
the blade itself was untouched
Why do people do this equalization shit if your weapon cancels cursed energy then that's what it does you don't suddenly start bullshitting and say it cancels Chakra
@@drins6427that's how it's supposed to work if your ability is specific to your powersystem it should stay that way. Different power systems follow different rules ki, magic, cursed energy don't work like Chakra
The speed argument is irrelevant considering gojo can move literally instantaneously teleport yet still got bodied by toji. Toji would murk kid naruto/rock leee w.e. And would arguably kill them in shippuden too. If yall giving naruto characters consistent light speed than im giving toji cursed tools to apply to chakra as well as cursed energy since there so closely linked/related. And evem with all your made up light speed they still getting bodied by his skill and heavenly spear
Gojo needs a certain amount of time to teleport and toji can't beat cloaked Naruto or 5 gates lee
@@dachos3n facts
First of all toji is getting bodied by a regular ninja, they have superhuman strength and can use different elements to combine into a kekkai genkai
@@ajaidenmatthews5328kekkei genkai can be more than multiple elements. iirc Dojutsu is also considered Kekkei Genkai. It can also be jutsu used only by certain families like the Uzumaki chakra chains or Bone Pulse from the rare cases in the now extinct Kaguya clan since Kimimaro.
It gets confusing because Kekkei Tota is 3 elements and Kekkei Mora is only for those that gain powers from consumption of the Chakra fruit. Thats is a curveball considering Madara Rinnegan and the Hyugas' Byuakugan are just Kekkei Genkai while Hagoromo's Rinne and Kaguya's Byakugan are Kekkei Mora. Even though Kaguya had her Byakugan before eating the Chakra Fruit
With that said, I think Naruto's 6PSM and Sasuke's Rinnegan are Kekkei Mora since they were given to them from Hagoromo. And I guess there's rare cases of Kekkei Mora now as well but I stopped watching once Shippuden ended
Shippuden characters? Toji don’t got a fucking chance especially against shippuden naruto😭😭u crazy
Ngl, this shit was entertaining to watch, but like, the lack of basic power-scaling understanding is pretty palpable. Still fun to watch and I love you guys. Also nothing wrong with not knowing much about power-scaling either. It’s just a small part of the anime community anyway.
toji fkn rock lee up
I doubt anyone on Naruto or JJK moves at light speed. Light speed is damn near 200k miles per second let’s stop 😂
Sage of six paths and adult Naruto yes
broski haku was literally moving at light speed we been knew they not one of them
light moves wayyyy faster than that
@@russellyoung609haku only moves at light speed traveling between mirrors
@@MatthewCJoy this is irrelevant as naruto is already stated above his ice mirror speed