Get the download pack for this battle: PredictableDesigns.com/battle3 Download pack includes DESIGN FILES, MANUFACTURING FILES, and DESIGN REVIEW REPORTS for each battle participant's PCB design. It also includes a PCB design review checklist that you can use for your own board designs, as well as my guide "From Prototype to Production with the ESP32".
This competitions have really improved a lot, I love the review at the end, it really helps me identify what i can improve on my designs. Please make more of this. Invite fans to participate or smth like that would be nice.
This was the best yet!!! I have watched all three battle videos so far and this was fun. I loved the design review at the end. Congrats to all three engineers who did a wonderful job under pressure!
Thank you for the download pack! These battles are getting more thrilling in each video, as I see how electronic engineers design their unique PCBs. It’s fascinating to witness how their creativity and precision blend in together!
They've missed a bunch of ESD protection - though that's a schematic rather than a layout thing. (i.e. ensuring when the user presses the buttons, the ESD is managed). In terms of ESD, though, there's not too many high speed emitters - the exception here is probably the LED if they're doing PWM. The USB traces are reasonably well matched, and differential, so you wouldn't expect much radiation from there. The power rail isn't likely to have high frequency components - the beauty of using a precert module! The most likely one to have EMC issues, I think, is Victoria's and that's just due to ground plane impedance (not enough stitching, so current loops will get long in some places).
That's a very interesting idea. Any suggestions on how to make it more for beginners? I'm thinking of a race with beginners who design a really simple board.
Not taking credit here, but this is exactly how I suggested they run the competition on the last PD video I watched. Victoria is wondering why she can't see the fill on KiCAD PCB but she has the "show fill" button deselected? (7th button from the botom on the left). Kevin went with the smallest possible JLC via but that substantially increases the price (They don't mention it on that page). I think 0.2/0.3 is where it stops before they charge you extra. If Kevin would have went 4 layer (which is the same cost at that size) and fixed the antenna issue, his easily would have been the best
Thanks for the feedback on both videos. I listened and implemented most of the suggestions that people commented on the last video, including the design reviews, getting to a finished design, and picking an actual winner.
I come from the days of moving "puppets" around on mylar sheets and running red/green tape traces on the appropriate layers. Typically we worked at 2:1 scale and then the camera(!) sized it down. Computers revolutionized the industry. I cut my teeth on and still use the old skool DOS version of OrCAD386+ SDT(Schematic capture) as well as PCB layout for the past 30+ years now. I can create ANY part/package I need. The only thing it doesn't do is generate a 3d cad rendering, which is fine...
I enjoy watching these battle videos, but as someone who doesn't have any PCB design experience myself, I think it would be great to have the purpose of the PCB more explicitly explained. I still am unsure what products this type of board would be used in even after watching the video.
Very cool. Snap. I’ve spent the last few weeks designing esp32-s3 PCBs (6 of them with Kicad). It is interesting to see others tackling the same design issues I did. I must admit that after using Altium for the last 15 years Kicad is nice and usable. Kicad has certainly improved a lot over the last couple of years. I’m now wrangling with esp-idf to bring the boards up.
Why you said that Kevin's choice of 3V3 power routing is less than optimal? Isn't SIG-GND-GND-SIG the best stackup for EMC? It was simple power rail powering few components and I wouldn't use whole plane for that too.
It's true from an EMC standpoint that a stack up of SIG-GND-GND-SIG is usually ideal. Although some will say GND-SIG-SIG-GND is better but since the components mount on the top and bottom that creates holes in your ground planes. Having a solid, uninterrupted ground plane is what's most important for EMC. But dedicating two layers for ground isn't usually feasible, so SIG-GND-PWR-SIG is usually more common. Kevin's design was only two layers so he doesn't have a solid ground plane. For this simple design routing power with a trace is fine, but usually not ideal for more complex or power consuming designs. Thanks for watching and commenting!
@@PredictableDesigns There is a setting in the toolbar on the left, where you disable the fill for the copper pour. It was set to filled in the beginning, but was changed to outlines only in the middle of the video. Maybe through a hotkey by accident. It is in the third group of icons from the bottom. But it is a great video overall 👍
Victoria differential pair is not done correctly the via crossing should be acopanied by GND vias at every crosing. For the other 2 boards doing a differential pair whit 90ohm impedance on 2 layers is a very bad idea because the traces have to be very thick. I don't agree whit you on the winner on this one. Victoria should take the win, because quality comes first before anything else, and also Kevin small design dosent keep decent clearance for the components to the edge of the board.
I mostly agree. I initially discussed the need for ground vias near her diff pair vias, but then cut it out because I didn't want to get too complicated. Craig's board was 4 layer, and Kevin didn't even use a diff pair. For future battles I do plan to count design quality at 2x the others. Thanks for commenting!
4 layer boards are more expensive and clearly not needed. As an extremely cheap person who also likes to save every mm of size possible I'm glad he won. Although I would have used the back of the board to for a little cleaner layout and take a few more mm off the size.
![[4K] Watch SpaceX Catch A Starship Rocket From Space!!! #IFT5](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/pIKI7y3DTXk/mqdefault.jpg)
Get the download pack for this battle: PredictableDesigns.com/battle3
Download pack includes DESIGN FILES, MANUFACTURING FILES, and DESIGN REVIEW REPORTS for each battle participant's PCB design.
It also includes a PCB design review checklist that you can use for your own board designs, as well as my guide "From Prototype to Production with the ESP32".
really happy I found this type of competition; this is peak nerd shit. Please more
Lol. Love it! Thanks, and will do!
would you include a real life test of the boards in the future videos? would be amazing
Great idea!
This competitions have really improved a lot, I love the review at the end, it really helps me identify what i can improve on my designs. Please make more of this. Invite fans to participate or smth like that would be nice.
Really awesome to hear that, thank you! I really tried to incorporate much of the feedback from the first two. You all are helping make these better!
This was the best yet!!! I have watched all three battle videos so far and this was fun.
I loved the design review at the end.
Congrats to all three engineers who did a wonderful job under pressure!
Wow, thanks!
It’s encouraging to see other seasoned engineers say it’s not working so it’s not just me as a hobbyist electrical engineer hitting those speedbumps.
Everyone hits speed bumps, they just get smaller with experience:)
Thank you for the download pack! These battles are getting more thrilling in each video, as I see how electronic engineers design their unique PCBs. It’s fascinating to witness how their creativity and precision blend in together!
That's so awesome hear, thank you!
Design a PCB fast 👌😎 (no problem)
Design a PCB fast with EMC Compliance 💀🔥 ( maybe in the 5th revision)
They've missed a bunch of ESD protection - though that's a schematic rather than a layout thing. (i.e. ensuring when the user presses the buttons, the ESD is managed). In terms of ESD, though, there's not too many high speed emitters - the exception here is probably the LED if they're doing PWM. The USB traces are reasonably well matched, and differential, so you wouldn't expect much radiation from there. The power rail isn't likely to have high frequency components - the beauty of using a precert module! The most likely one to have EMC issues, I think, is Victoria's and that's just due to ground plane impedance (not enough stitching, so current loops will get long in some places).
I really enjoy these videos! It would be amazing if you could create a version tailored for electronics students and PCB design beginners.
That's a very interesting idea. Any suggestions on how to make it more for beginners?
I'm thinking of a race with beginners who design a really simple board.
Not taking credit here, but this is exactly how I suggested they run the competition on the last PD video I watched. Victoria is wondering why she can't see the fill on KiCAD PCB but she has the "show fill" button deselected? (7th button from the botom on the left). Kevin went with the smallest possible JLC via but that substantially increases the price (They don't mention it on that page). I think 0.2/0.3 is where it stops before they charge you extra. If Kevin would have went 4 layer (which is the same cost at that size) and fixed the antenna issue, his easily would have been the best
Thanks for the feedback on both videos. I listened and implemented most of the suggestions that people commented on the last video, including the design reviews, getting to a finished design, and picking an actual winner.
I come from the days of moving "puppets" around on mylar sheets and running red/green tape traces on the appropriate layers. Typically we worked at 2:1 scale and then the camera(!) sized it down. Computers revolutionized the industry. I cut my teeth on and still use the old skool DOS version of OrCAD386+ SDT(Schematic capture) as well as PCB layout for the past 30+ years now. I can create ANY part/package I need. The only thing it doesn't do is generate a 3d cad rendering, which is fine...
Another fun episode, i actually enjoyed watching it.
Great to hear!
I enjoy watching these battle videos, but as someone who doesn't have any PCB design experience myself, I think it would be great to have the purpose of the PCB more explicitly explained. I still am unsure what products this type of board would be used in even after watching the video.
Good point, thanks for commenting.
Very cool. Snap. I’ve spent the last few weeks designing esp32-s3 PCBs (6 of them with Kicad). It is interesting to see others tackling the same design issues I did. I must admit that after using Altium for the last 15 years Kicad is nice and usable. Kicad has certainly improved a lot over the last couple of years. I’m now wrangling with esp-idf to bring the boards up.
Glad you liked it, and thanks for commenting!
Hey! Where is Fusion 360 Electronics?
I can't have them all in the same battle, but stay tuned for it to appear soon:)
i want to see their reactions to where they placed
I would love to see Xpedition vs Altium vs Allegro
Hey ,Is there any way to participate one of your vedio :3 I can share my details!
Sure, let's chat. You can just email me. You can find my email address on my channel page or my website about page.
Great Video! Next time EMC Compliant? 😅
keep it up
great video idea
Glad you enjoyed it
This is so cool!
Glad you liked it!
Why you said that Kevin's choice of 3V3 power routing is less than optimal? Isn't SIG-GND-GND-SIG the best stackup for EMC? It was simple power rail powering few components and I wouldn't use whole plane for that too.
It's true from an EMC standpoint that a stack up of SIG-GND-GND-SIG is usually ideal. Although some will say GND-SIG-SIG-GND is better but since the components mount on the top and bottom that creates holes in your ground planes. Having a solid, uninterrupted ground plane is what's most important for EMC. But dedicating two layers for ground isn't usually feasible, so SIG-GND-PWR-SIG is usually more common.
Kevin's design was only two layers so he doesn't have a solid ground plane.
For this simple design routing power with a trace is fine, but usually not ideal for more complex or power consuming designs.
Thanks for watching and commenting!
You should try flux next!
Creativity? For a head shaped PCB? Lol
Anyways. I'd give Design Quality and Speed the most points.
But quality of design should be x2, i think
I actually almost did that, and I kind of agree. Next time.
Love it
Thank you!
bit unfair, everyone should start with all footprints otherwise it's not a match
Yeah that was a mistake. She was supposed to have all the footprints.
She had draw zone outlines only 🤦♂️ of course she couldn't see them
You always draw the outline, but when she filled them you should see the pour.
@@PredictableDesigns
There is a setting in the toolbar on the left, where you disable the fill for the copper pour.
It was set to filled in the beginning, but was changed to outlines only in the middle of the video.
Maybe through a hotkey by accident. It is in the third group of icons from the bottom.
But it is a great video overall 👍
Victoria differential pair is not done correctly the via crossing should be acopanied by GND vias at every crosing.
For the other 2 boards doing a differential pair whit 90ohm impedance on 2 layers is a very bad idea because the traces have to be very thick.
I don't agree whit you on the winner on this one. Victoria should take the win, because quality comes first before anything else, and also Kevin small design dosent keep decent clearance for the components to the edge of the board.
I mostly agree. I initially discussed the need for ground vias near her diff pair vias, but then cut it out because I didn't want to get too complicated.
Craig's board was 4 layer, and Kevin didn't even use a diff pair.
For future battles I do plan to count design quality at 2x the others.
Thanks for commenting!
My dream job is to become a PCB design Engineer. I ended up becoming Software Engineer.
It's never too late:)
👍👍
4 layer boards are more expensive and clearly not needed. As an extremely cheap person who also likes to save every mm of size possible I'm glad he won. Although I would have used the back of the board to for a little cleaner layout and take a few more mm off the size.