The problem with D&D Liches (and also that OGL thing)
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- Опубликовано: 12 янв 2023
- So that OGL thing sure is fun! And you know what else is? Liches. Liches are also fun. Let's talk about both
Check out the Intoner HERE!
docs.google.com/document/d/16...
Here's a video that explains the OGL situation very thoroughly in case you live in bliss and want to stop doing so:
• The OGL, D&D, & Wizard...
Video Editing by the amazing Bia: / bnazf
Writing, Illustration, and Narration by me: / antodemico
Additional sketches by the amazing Fey: / feymilde 
Развлечения
![Sean Rii, Karyon, Sharzkii - Taungule [My Love] (Official Music Video)](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/eJoMuypbSzQ/mqdefault.jpg)
La la la
You should spend an hour giving the podcast Opening Arguments episode 675 a listen!
Lawyer Andrew Torrez, who's also the lawyer for the D&D Minus Podcast crew, has some very interesting things to say about the OGL debacle.
It turned out that I was far from the only fan of the OA podcast who wanted him to look at the case, so that's wonderful.
I also have to say, after listening to the OA episode 675 I can't help being a bit disappointed with the RUclips D&D sphere.
It has uncritically been parroting the article that leaked the draft.
I had to wait for Andrew Torrez to break it down before I got a far more nuanced perspective on the whole OGL issue...
@@gorillaguerillaDK I'm aware that the legality of revoking the OGL is in question, but that is a question that will have to be decided in court, and no third party creator can afford a million dollar lawsuit to find that out, so that point is moot. Paizo has stated that they are prepared to do so, but we should do our best to ensure it doesn't come to that.
From what I can tell, the sentiment from DDB Corporate execs is that they see the subscription fees as _their_ money. And the payers and 3rd party creators as obstacles to said funds. Despite the 3rd party work tradition, gaining a consistently paying customer base by any means necessary seems to be the WOTC bottom line.
From where I stand, a long term loss of subscriptions is the only way to make them change their tune.
Edit: I was going for - this - effect before, and I got -this- ... which, I didn't even know was a thing.
I cancelled my Beyond Subscription a few hours ago... Didn't even see there was an update about the OGL on Beyond. I think I'm gonna keep it cancelled until we have official writing...
Shakespeare is the *ultimate* entoner. Dead for centuries, but his work is still taught and produced as plays and movies. Hell, he's such a famous bard that people call him *The Bard.* Dude's gonna live forever. I love this creature idea, especially that it could be played as sympathetic or as some kind of evil mind leech. ♥️
You know what? It's weird
Adam Shulman, husband to Anne Hathaway, looks an awful lot like William Shakespeare, husband to Anne Hathaway
You don't think...
Shakespeare? Try Homer. More than 3000 years rather than measly 400 :D And the gods and stories he codified are everywhere
I was thinking Beethoven. Living on through a simple "Dun Dun Dunnn"
My first thought was Rick Astley. I think that's enough internet for me today...
I was thinking the Magnum Opus should be in Trochaic Tetrameter, the meter that the Weird Sisters use in Macbeth and the Fairies use in A Midsummer Night's Dream. It's a spooky and magical rhythm.
DnD was built on the promise that you can build your own world, you can make your own stories, monsters and choices.
Stopping that takes away the soul of D&D.
Also I love everything you're doing
homebrew is actively encouraged in multiple official books, and D&DBeyond, now owned by WotC themselves, has homebrew up there for free. And yet wizards tries to pretend it's a threat to their profits?
The homebrew isn’t the problem for the OGL the real issue is people publishing there homebrew content for monetary purposes. WOTC want a cut of that profit and to also discourage what they think is a competitor.
@@kingheroknight On top of that is the "we own everything you come up with under our system, and don't have to pay you royalties to use it. We're free to use any of your content without asking, because the new OGL licenses all of your creations to us." That's not wanting a fair chunk of change from Critical Role. That's stealing IP from individuals who happen to like making fancy house rules.
You can still do that as much as you like!
@@Undomaranel WotC finally has a chance of releasing good content because it won't be made by them
Your Intoner gave me a great idea for an emotional story moment. Imo, they can't perform their magnum opus in undeath not because they're physically or magically prevented, but because doing so ends in death. The story moment then involves a particularly old Intoner deciding or being convinced that it's finally time to pass on. And so, the party gets to witness the chillingly beautiful final performance of a masterpiece by its author, and at the end, as the piece reaches its conclusion, the Intoner's last breath is a content sigh, finally resting in peace.
The Magnum Opus literally needing to end in death is a good twist
That is so cool
And with that, the magic infused into the song unravels. Most mearly stop remembering it. A few, who knew the song by heart, simply don't feel like playing it again, only finding it slightly odd that their favorite song no longer inspires them. To them, and anyone else who may someday play it on a whim, its only a pleasant song, with no particular meaning or feeling to it.
It wasn't just the Intoner's final performance. Their Magnum Opus died with them.
I imagine this Intoner having a massive party, and the group is invited by the ‘mysterious owner’ to the top of the mansion, leading to a castlevania style dungeon as they ascend floor after floor, however, the Intoner’s ‘minions’, which are all animated furnishings, never actually seem to attempt to ‘kill’ the party, they bruise them badly at best. There’s even some helpful items, and a place for them to restore a few spell slots right before the staircase to the top floor.
Eventually, the party reaches the top, the moon looming abnormally large in the night sky. There the Intoner reveals themselves, and why they led the party up here.
You see, they have lived a very, very long time, they’ve lived a life that’s full, they have seen and done so many things. And now, they feel it’s time.
They wish to move on, to whatever may lie next, even if that means somewhere unpleasant since they cheated death. They will see to whatever comes next with the same kindness and optimism they have always shown for their town and those around them.
But they didn’t want to go quietly. They wanted their last night on this plane to be a celebration of life, a celebration of who they were.
And so, they ask the party a single request: allow them to dance in the field of battle one final time.
As his Magnum Opus starts playing one last time, the party and the Intoner clash. As the battle goes on, the Intoner sings and cherishes every beautiful moment they’ve seen, every experience they’ve had through both theirs and others eyes.
Finally, one of the PCs lands a ‘killing blow’ and only at that moment, does their Magnum Opus start playing its last minute. The Intoner congratulates the party, and feels content, having truly lived a life well lived. They look towards the moon, and sing the last verses with a smile on their face, as their body then turns into sparkling stardust and scatters towards the moon, the wind sounding like a happy and serene sigh, their soul finally at peace.
The freaking DnD community has more creativity than any d*mn Hollywood writer for the past 20 years.
That could be either the end of a film or an episode in a TV series.
The intoner sounds so cool, when you were describing it I was imagining something like a good NPC, a legend or something, wich it's magnum opus were a song about resisting tyranny and freedom, but people are not allowed to sing it, but do it in secret in hopes that this old hero might come back and save them. It's a really interesting concept
Intoner reminds me of a joke: they exhumed the body of Beethoven and found him erasing sheet music in his grave. He was decomposing.
*groan*
Seriously though, this made me chuckle.
oh geeze.... an Intoner whos magnum opus was rooted in puns...
Combining this with the King in Yellow could make an amazing horror campaign.
Just what I thought
Famn, thats such a cool idea!
Sign me up for that game immediately!
That's exactly the inspiration for my current campaign.
I am yoinking this full stop.
i really like the idea of an artist immortalizing itself on it's art, but i do think that limiting it only to a song is a bit constricting on roleplay, just imagine, a book so profound that every person who reads it feels compelled to share it with others, a painting so magnificent that on can't help but admire it, a dance so elegant that one can't stop looking once it's eyes fall upon it, a play so tragic that one wishes to perform it on stage as well, i believe that this can be so much a BBEG, a helpful NPC or even the end goal of a player, just imagine a wizard which on it's quest for the arcane, accidentally created a book so grand that it became a magnum opus, becoming an Intoner after dying of old age.
Great elaboration on the idea, mate
We even have a classical literary character who somewhat fits this role in Dorian Grey (yeah, he did not choose to became what he became and did not create his "phylactery" himself, but there are parallels)
I think the dance and the play are both pretty easy to resolve since their power is linked to the performance of the art. For the painting or the book, it really leans heavily on the memory of the art. The key to becoming the intoner's phylactery is that it has to cause a shift in the person's soul. The art was so moving that it fundamentally altered their being. I think that's where the resonance comes in, and what sets the intoner's phylacteries apart from the general population.
I think there's also opportunity here to add some additional requirements for this expanded interpretation. Not just anyone can spread the magnum opus--only someone touched by the magnum opus in such a way as to become a phylactery can successfully reproduce the magnum opus' effect and keep the intoner's memory alive. That becomes one of the reasons these undead bards seek out new students--and often covet them to the point of madness. Their students, simply by the pressure to maintain their unlife, get selected because they are the ones touched by the magnum opus. Willing or no, the intoner must shape these poor souls into an artist to propagate their memory, lest their unlife cease to be.
The painters, authors, dancers, and other artists who have been touched by the magnum opus all weave the essence of it into their works, knowingly or not. And if you were touched by the opus but are just a humble cabbage farmer without an artistic bone in your body, you should expect a particularly famous artist--suspiciously youthful given their age--to be calling upon your farm very soon to make you a tempting offer...
For the painting, a variant of the Grey Portrait would accomplish a similar thing
@@warmachine5835 infectious moonwalking
Almost like the King in Yellow.
My Valor college bard became accidentally an entoner after adapting the adventures of the campaing to a stage play, it took him various decades to capture the feelings and personalities of the party members, so when he finished it and was played for the first time he died due to he having no other goal and being the only party member alive after so many years. In our next campaing we found him as an NPC wanting to die and reunite with his comrades.
This could be such an amazing suprise villain. Have an npc musician that helps the party out and is almost always found in their studio studying a piece they're working on. Only for their big performance to climax and in a horrid and unforgettable display the composer is transformed into an arcane creature beyond life and death before them. Scarring both the audience, and the party for life. Who could ever forget a performance like that.
I’m stealing this, but I’m gonna leave a like because I’m not an asshole
I think it shouldn't just be a song but instead a play because you can just do general tragedy and it would fit better. A musical works the best because it incorporates both parts. I would imagine they would finish the song and the play but at the end actually ingest poison like Romeo and Juliet. Then, once they're carried off to the morgue, they could probably come back and run away. This gives more mystery to the character because they just disappear afterwards, or come back and pretend to have been performing the whole time cementing their role as a incredible performer.
A long-forgotten intoner lays in her final resting place. A brutal tyrant, whose actions have been lost in the depths of history. A few scholars enter her chamber, exploring an ancient castle. One of them wanders over to a distant piano with sheet music opened to a specific page. He plays the tune slowly, thinking nothing of it. It’s catchy…
He finishes the melody with a satisfied sigh. He gets up and turns around to see the woman, who was previously frowning, now sporting a slight grin as her eyes slowly open.
@@FestustTheRoboDragon The smile turns to a scowl, however. The woman tilts her head, her body twitching and convulsing. Something is wrong. Unfortunately, having been neglected for centuries, the piano is significantly out-of-tune. The song has been twisted. Warped. But if this is the version of the song that has been played, can she regain her full strength? Or will she change as the music has?
All three of you deserve an award that’s epic
@GrndAdmiralThrawn He runs from the room, terrified. He knows of this Intouner and the horrors of her rule. He reaches the rest of the expedition crew, explains the situation, and they all draw their weapons. They return to the chamber where the Intouner was, but now all that is left is a mask and a broken "Melody"
A "Melody" is what happens when an Entouner's Magnum Opes is changed to a degree that it is no longer recognized by the Intouner themselves. The Melody will wander, hopelessly looking for someone who could bring them back. When the Melody finds a musician with enough talent, they will appear as an item, a mask that makes everyone who hears their music fall in love with it. Wile in the back of their mind, the Melody will reright their Magnum Opes. And, on the same day the original Intouner debuted her song, it will bring her back.
well good thing there is no way that piano is still in tune
Oh man, I just realized: you could make the Phantom of the Opera an Intoner!
Think about it- he's trying to teach Christine Dae a special song (his magnum opis), he looks undead in some depictions, and he knows spells (or how to make stage magic that looks like real magic).
I was already planning on making a Bard character based on the Phantom. Who says he can't be an aspiring Intoner?
@@ThePa1riot That's the (undead) spirit!
An artist remains "immortal" so long as their work remains beloved. Making this literal is brilliant.
"Liches should require intelligence, thus other classes don't really fit the type."
Artificer Liches: "Am I a joke to you?"
Okay but hear me out artificer Lich to become one build an automaton and push your soul into it of course the body has to be made out of a specific type of metal(the recipe a deep kept secret) or the soul won't resonate properly and the way an artificer lich comes back is by jumping bodies to a different automaton so by building more of them they have more returns destroy all the bodies destroy the artificer Lich
I've run Artificer liches more like they spend years creating a giant machine capable of running an automaton with their soul attached. Kind of like an Ultron, House of the Worm kind of story, with a dungeon being their machine to find their soul at the heart of it all.
“From the moment I understood the weakness of my flesh, it disgusted me. I craved the strength and certainty of steel. I aspired to the purity of the blessed machine. Your kind cling to your flesh as if it will not decay and fail you.
But I am already saved. For the Machine is Immortal.”
An Artificer Lich sounds delightfully cyberpunk
Brain in a jar commanding an army of robots. Unliving the dream!
I think one of the precursors to Liches (from what my boyfriend told me) has to be Koschei the Deathless, a reoccurring antagonist from Slavic folklore. His epithet for deathless or immortal, comes from a spell that he has on himself that prevents him from dying. According to one of the tales, his soul is hidden in a needle that is hidden inside an egg, the egg is in a duck, the duck is in a hare, the hare is in a chest, the chest is buried or chained up on a far island called Bouyan. Destroying the needle inside the egg is the key to killing him permanently, often by crushing the egg in one's hand. There's another story where his soul is in an egg, encased in a chest hidden under a mountain. He can cast powerful spells on people and is pretty much the main antagonist in every story he's in.
This is absolutely one of the foundational building blocks for the concept, and I'm a little sad it wasn't found or mentioned in the video.
so you're telling me the first Lich's Phylactery was a TURDUCKEN!?
This is the type of lore I actively search for.
Having a spell on yourself that prevents you from dying is actually a pretty smart and simple way to stick around.
There are similar stories in various cultures. The undying caster is a very old tale
" Why, to achieve literal immortality through music, one would have to create a piece of such sublime perfection, such a breathtaking work of indescribable beauty that the world must be better for it."
*drum intro* "We're no strangers to love...."
Oh thank you for the new idea for thing.
"Anyways here's wonderwall"
And the Rickroll was actually his plan all along, to stay alive forever?!!
AHHHHHHHHHHHHH
While I do get the Mummy Lord being a Cleric version of a Lich, I honestly think making a Lich variant based around the idea of the catacomb saints would be interesting. I’m thinking they act like an extension of a deity and mostly only come about when the deity a Cleric follows is close to being forgotten or dying. Could even work in the fact that most catacomb saints just used random bodies instead of using the actual bodies of saints, with this Lich variant being able to live on by having its vestments placed on another body and possessing it.
I had a similar idea of grave attendants in which a willing subject agrees to become part of the phylactery of the patron lich, in exchange for a round about sort of lichdom. There is no downside as the attendant is completely subservient to the lich in addition to requiring no phylactery maintenance of its own, the lich even gains further magical power from the process. The only drawback to becoming an attendant is that they cannot respawn on their own, instead relying on their master to actively respawn them in the event of an incident.
I love the idea of an Intoner for a modern or even futuristic/dystopian fantasy campaign, where the Intoner essentially runs (or shadow runs) a massive production company that generates earworm pop music that people can't stop singing. And then industry plant popstars are their warlocks doing their musical bidding, gaining more and more fans and harvesting their adoration for their Patron. People ask, "why do all these pop songs sound the same" and that's because they have the same through-line, melody, etc., as the Intoners swan song.
Tot Musica waa an intoner
So just real life
Pachabel is an entoner thats why Canon is in every genre
Rick Astley is aspiring entonerdom
This is basically Daft Punk’s ‘Interstella 5555’ animated album short film
The "different liches for different classes" can also work really well for druids. Maybe they become a part of the forest or landscape they come from/ connect with. Becoming a guardian of the land or something idk.
DnD Swamp Thing would slap
LichenLich
That's in the secrets of candle Keep mysteries book
Evil druids would corrupt the land they soak into. A rotten poisonous swamp, a blighted desert, a industrial mega-farm. That sort of thing.
A druid-style lich would probably use spores instead of the usual necromantic energies. Super cordyceps zombies
Ooooh, an Intoner who runs an ancient and well respected bard college, an entirely bard party, solving mysteries until the end of the year (or maybe the final year of college) where for their final grade they are required to perform the magnum opus, in front of all their friends and family of course, could be a super fun mix of Scooby-Doo style mystery solving and the series that shall not be named magic school experience
Series that shall not be named?
@@iremainteague5653 hairy pothead
"Alright, students you are all familiar with the tune of your final exam? very good, very good; now you are going to be performing in a concert in front of all your family (plus anyone who bought a ticket) so today we are going to practice the lyrics. Johnathan, please remember to balance your head voice and your chest voice, you've had trouble with that in the past."
Not only is the entoner not restricted to good/bad, but there is such an extreme range of possibilities. It's like Santa living on in the hearts of children.
I can imagine the Druid equivalent of lichdom involving binding your soul to a tree and using it to grow a new body, or even to an entire forest, which, when you die, your soul enters the body of one of the beasts of the forest which gradually, over a number of days, changes to match your previous form.
druidic liches: (as above)
dryads: look what they need to mimic a fraction of our power!
Druids: jokes on you we get free fursuits
Druid liches are just max level druids. At 20 they more or less stop aging all together. As boring as that is, its the same for the monk. Can't wait for death knights tho, the lich paladins aka "lich kings"
Wouldn’t the Druid lich just be a regular Druid with fellow druids willing to cast reincarnate?
@@valencrow i forgot reincarnate wasn't 9th level. Good point
Had the concept for a lich that is just trazyn the infinte but he just hangs around his own pocket dimension stealing/acquiring stuff/people
As long as you keep him away from the Emperor i will support this idea
Pokemon gotta catch them all!🎶
I wanna be the very best
Like no one ever was
To catch them is my real test
To display them is my cause
I will travel across the galaxy
Searching far and wide
Each display to understand
In Solemnance they’ll reside
Trazynmon!
Love that
Had a GM with a character like this, he used it as a moderator for his parties, when someone suddenly spikes in power he'd let them ride the high for a while before the Lich comes to collect them. If RNGesus gives the party something spectacularly evil or powerful (like say a cauldron filled with coins that can grant wishes) he also uses the Lich to trade for it, sometimes for a favor, sometimes for an alternate reward. I eventually met the requirement when I woopseed an industrial revolution as an artificer, "I will take you, in exchange your heirs and decedents shall be granted a Boon." Our group has taken to calling Ascendancy.
All characters I create with that GM get some kind of bonus at character generation, from a thousand extra gold (or ten percent, whichever is higher), to a free ability point, an extra level or two to counter the penalty for monstrous races, extra skill points per level, inherent bonuses to saves/AC, etc. His requirement is that your next three characters must not be the same class as your Ascendant and must have a different stated goal (thanks to a player who created three monks in a row with the goal to become gods, he played those suckers 'sabotage the party for my goals' evil. My Artificer didn't tell him to watch out for the intake on jet engine, woops).
One of the other players has 15 of these boons, his characters can start as royal heirs (they rarely get to actually take office, war is blind after all). He's been my go-to DM for almost two decades at this point.
The intoner had me thinking of Hastur and "the king in yellow". Makes for some cool lore potential
The King in Yellow is like an anti-Intoner
Don’t read the play
The bard is such a cool idea. Imagine it being like a nursery rhyme or something thats been around for ages. I think it would also be cool if as peoples memories change a bit and the tellings of the story differ slightly, so does the bard, where the different memories of the song actually change the bard
There’s a forgotten realms series that has a bard in the first 2 books but just before the third book “undead” the bard becomes a lich on accident fighting szass tams forces. Worth a read if you’re interested.
Imagine composing a classic piece of music, untouched for centuries just for somebody to remix it like "Beethoven virus"
You should look into "Kashey Bessmertny" which is an old Slavic folk tale about a king, whose name essentially translates to "Kashey Without Death" and even Kashey is similar in sound to the word for "bone". The only way to vanquish him is to find a hidden needle that contains his soul, otherwise if his body is destroyed he'll come back to life. He's probably the original Lich in folk lore and where the inspiration is drawn from.
There's also a myth from ancient Greece about a prince whose life was tied to a piece of wood. Once the wood burned away, he died. I think there are also similar myths involving candles and lockets.
The more common translation of his name is Koshtey the deathless.
@@andrewphilos Kashey was actually much more lich like than many of those stories, and I actually found out just now they made a movie about him in 1945 in the Soviet Union. The actor has something that literally looks like D&D bone sorcerer bone armor based on the IMBD images which is funny.
Kashey Bessmertny is also kinda a dark wizard, he could turn into animals (which is a common ability in slavic tales) and had a castle to live in.
To defeat him you need first to learn secret to his immortality, then you have to find the needle in sort of Matrioshka doll challege. Rough quote: "Kashey's death is hidden on the edge of a needle, the needle is hidden in an egg, egg is in a duck, duck is in a bunny and bunny is in a wolf". So you need to hunt down these animals one by one to get the needle. Also, as you can see in the quote, the story is quite vague about how directly needle is related to his death. More than that, story basically ends on a moment when hero gets the needle, so its not only stops Kashey's immortality, it kills him outright
A very interesting character, one of the most cleaely evil ones too. And unlike many other paranormal Slavic creatures, its quite hard to point out what exactly he is supposed to represent. I guess we all need just big scary bosses from time to time
There's also possibly related Moldovian character called Limbe-limbeu - literal dragon, whose death was hidden in the beetle inside of an egg inside of a giant iron hog. First recorded dracolich
I love the idea of an Entoner who has performed their swan song for a lich, a death knight and a buffed up revenant so then the party can’t kill the Entoner without first killing the others. Could be fun
Have it this way.
The Entoner performed for a person who later became a revenant seeking to kill the Entoner. Probably because it learned what the Entoner did to him.
Never ending fight.
@@ODDnanref" the never ending finale"
Could be a great plot center
y'now... or they could just play a new song to get stuck in their heads. probably easier. maybe not as much fun...
... for the fighter anyway.
@@slavesforging5361 the song is magically stuck in their head
I just had a thought, One Winged Angel is a Swords Bard Intoner's Magnum Opus.
intoner honestly reminds me of coco and how the spirits continue living as long as people keep their memory alive, except theyre undead instead.
As a Bleach fan, thank you for using clips of Baraggan here.
Also, that Intoner concept is incredible. This is basically the first thing that's made me want to make a bard character. I can just think of a person who growing up, lacked attention due to any number of factors, so became a bard to get their name out there and make sure that at least one person knew they existed.
Rot, Arrogante
Someday, as a follow-up, how about Monk Liches? There are those instances of mummified monks who supposedly are not dead, just meditating super duper hard. The monks at the end of the shrines in Zelda Breath of the Wild are based on this too.
so maybe the "lichfication" is a permanent meditation, and now they can only interact with the world by the use of Ki, manipulating the stings of fate and capable of a permanent astral projection.
@@hyuugo7462 Sounds like a monk-ghost where the desiccated body is their phylactery.
There is a real practice where a monk will transition their diet to only things like pine needles and barely eat. They can actually slowly mummify themselves alive while they starve to death.
@@crazydud2432 that's metal as fuck, ngl
@@crazydud2432 I think we're talking about the same thing.
Pathfinder has a druid "lich" in the form of the Siabre. They specifically became such to fight off a demon invasion of their lands but they attack anything living. They have a ritual, it involves necromancy infused standing stones, etc.
Heretics
There's even a martial version (sadly mostly for fighters due to the armor used for it needing to be heavy) though this version is 100% evil due to the requirements and there's a chance of it failing completely
There's so much cool stuff one could do with the Intoner. Just imagine a Bard of the College of Whispers becoming one.
You spend your life gathering information and learning secrets - secrets the world's rulers kept hidden for decades, secrets that could topple governments, incite revolts if they were ever revealed.
Finally, one day, you decide it's time. You stand in the middle of a concert hall, surrounded by adoring fans, waiting for your performance. You greet them, welcome them - they should be honored to witness your magnum opus. And then, you sing.
A personalized diss track against the global elites and the ruling classes, consisting of revealing every shameful secret they've kept hidden for so long.
As the public outrage grows, the news spreads, and so does your song. The global status quo changes forever. And as those you've slighted with your song have you killed for what you've done, you laugh in their face - for they have just completed your ascent.
That would be amazing.
Sick story
I will be taking heavy inspiration from this for my secret evil person omg! I think thats amazing, I was planning on them being a wizard but this is so much better !!
Go ahead! I'm glad you found inspiration from me c:
Dude that is a SICK villain origin story!
The earworm nature of the magnum opus reminds me of a homebrewed elder evil by the name of Agolied which is in essence a living song which once heard, sticks in the mind to such a degree that eventually, the can do nothing but sing the song until they die, and even then their corpses will sing it.
And it is infectious.
Like The Hiss from Control?
@feuerling Perhaps, but I've never played Control so I can't say for certain.
@@rossedwards1043 If you like 3rd person shooters, it's really fun to play. You get superpowers and infinite ammo, and the lore is fun to figure out.
Basically the Hiss is a frequency-based entity attacking the Bureau of Control (basically the scp foundation) that uses people and paranormal objects as "amplifiers" to spread its influence to more people and paranormal objects. It takes the form of a kind of earworm, a strange incantation repeated over and over by the infected employees as they float mindlessly in the air, and a red "fog" rippling around infected objects. It also sends out corrupted victims, twisted into various shapes to fight the survivors.
@@feuerling Speaking of SCP... there's quite a few things in the SCP multicanonverses that could resemble the hiss, from infohazards to the pattern screamers to memetics. There's quite a few that are infectious after all.
@@dr.cheeze5382 imagine hiss-corrupted SCPs. Ouch.
Man this is so good. I can imagine some cowled masked figure in a tavern listening to a musician and crying quietly, completely wrapped in a musicians performance. Receiving odd looks from patrons and maybe some brave young man asking the old man/woman if this was their wife or husband's song they shared... Just sounds like the beginning of a great movie about a Bard Lich
Take it further. The lich is done with it and wants death after so long, but the people keep replaying and performing the song.
@@HappyBeezerStudios damn that is good
My setting has a group known as the 15 Immortals. They’re all basically my take on various lich style things. This isn’t one of them, but it seems really cool. There’s the Wild, who fused herself to nature itself. There’s the Parasite that keeps himself going by stealing the life energy of others. The Chained has basically taken the brute force approach of making chains that holds his soul in place, making it so that he can’t die. The Pride made a machine that he put his soul into. The Knight bound herself to the heart of a mountain. And the Dead is a traditional lich, but he hollowed out the planet of the setting and made it into his phylactery.
What are the others? Your setting seems very cool.
well thats one way to keep people from destroying your phylactery
Could you please tell me each ones classes
So good, more please.
Shit I like that world is my phylactery, your original idea?
Many things to say on this:
1. Surprised Koschei the Deathless didn't get a mention.
2. Intoner is a cool idea. I'm thinking an intoner preforming a musical version of the King in Yellow for the magnum opus would be a fun villain for an eldritch horror game.
3. Skeletor isn't technically a lich. He's either a cambion or a half-elf (depending on version) who lost his face but is still theoretically alive.
4. Warlocks have deathlocks and clerics also have Heucuva
I kinda imagine a lich who swore to upheld justice forever and sacrifice villians in the dnd story and slowly starts becoming more merciless to villians .
I cannot thank you enough for your perspective on the OGL catastrophe.
Edit: you said "lich bards" and I immediately said out loud "wait what" so needless to say I'm here for this
Absolute trip and a half that this was released right when it was. My best friend had just passed and I was his pallbearer. That dude was the _reason_ I got into D&D.
It looks like I'll be making an Intoner built for him.
Thank you, Pointy Hat.
... Now, I don’t mean to belittle or downplay your grief, it sucks that that happened. But a bard attempting to finish a friend or partner’s work and turn it into a Magnum Opus to try and bring them back sounds like a great plot hook
@@LegendWeaver25 thank you. You don't belittle or downplay anything. Hell, he would tell me to "quit acting like a bitch" and go find something to have fun with.
On to the Magnum Opus - does this become the passed friend's work and resurrect him as the Intoner? Or does this become the living bard's work and _they_ become the Intoner? Or, since it's made by two separate bards, does this mix the two together and BAM - Synthesis Intoner?
@@cmykrgb1469 Many things to think about, especially the drama if the friend is brought back and is horrified at being turned into an undead without their consent and, in the case of both becoming a synthesized Intoner, now sharing a body with the person who thought it was a good idea
@@cmykrgb1469 Hmmmm, actully an intresting idea would be they both are resurrected and turned into intoners, their souls linked. This could mean it can scale up as work gets larger, however I'd imagine the complexity will grow in turn. Also, I just really want to see a big band made entirely of Intoners, that would be absolutely horrfying
There technically already exist a lich bard in D&D. They’re called Coronachs, I think one showed up in an AL adventure for 5e. Their phylactery is their musical instrument, and it can only be destroyed by playing the first song the bard ever learned with the instrument. They typically became undead for the purposes of trying to learn more stories or songs or legends or art and whatever.
This is it. Your one chance to impress the great Intoner Mariah Carey. You've scraped every bit of money you could, and bought her a plot of land. Just right for her to build her keep on, to live in comfort as your dread queen. As you present the deed to her, though, she turns away. Tears in her eyes. Just before the darkness takes you, you hear her quietly whisper, "I don't want a lot for christmas..."
I love the idea of the characters finally slaying the intoner, only for their minion to escape, and right at the end pour one out for their supposedly dead master, but the intoner rises from the poured water and continues their rule
Just had an idea for a way to use this in one of my games, in life the Intoner managed to climb the social ladder within the court of a well established kingdom to the point they became very close friends with the monarch, they then convinced that monarch to let them write a new national anthem for the kingdom, then travel around to the towns of the kingdom teaching it to local performers to be able to play at future events, their swan song performance would have been at some big event in the capital in front of the biggest crowd possible, they then wouldn't need to ever perform their magnum opus again because it would be forever ingrained in the history of that kingdom, the only thing then is making sure that the nation keeps a good level of patriotism by using their social abilities to influence decision makers that they would already likely have been in contact with in the right direction to keep the people happy and loyal and keep the kingdom stable and safe from outside influences that could ruin the kingdom, in essence they could live for as long as the kingdom stands, if it's a kingdom that the players are in support of then they might one day get a visit from the Intoner tasking them with something to maintain the kingdom, if it's a kingdom the players are against their visit could be a lot more sinister.
Wow, Antonio! Your Intoner concept is absolutely brilliant!!! So rich in possibilites, story-wise. I hadn't intended to have a lich of any kind in an urban setting I'm developing but now, darn it, I guess we're going to *have* to have an Intoner pulling strings in the background. Thanks so much for the brilliant inspiration! ❤
Rasputin from Anastacia(btw i appreciate the love him and that movie got during this vid) is the PERFECT example of a warlock lich, especially if you count the amount of times he says "the dark forces" plus he even says he sold his soul for power and the ability to live forever and utilize his magic. Also the Kobold press books have some amazing alternate liches for warlocks and bards, they have the Virtuoso lich which is basically a phantom of the opera type.
The intoner is so inspired. Liches are already drama queens, so giving them an artistic bard twist feels so natural and right.
I wanted to make an evil ghost bard BBEG tied to his ghastly white violin but I think he's going to be an intoner now.
Maybe do a demi-lich subvarient that has no body but possesses those who perform their magnum opus?
Make the Intoner a fundamentally unstable existence. As generations pass, their Magnum Opus is 'reinterpreted', 'reinvented', 'revived', and put into countless 'new styles' with countless 'new twists'. This warping of the Magnum Opus similarly warps the Intoner, possibly making them preternaturally adept at integrating into modern cultures, but also possibly giving them a kind of cultural Multiple Personalities, and possibly slowly driving them mad or even forcing them into a distorted caricature of what their original culture was.
@Colin Smith yeah I was wondering what would happen in an "Ice Ice Baby" and "Under Pressure" situation. Could a new Intoner try to claim parts of an older Intoner's magnum opus?
@@affsteak3530 I think that it could be cool if in that case the Intoners could change when they transform, being influenced by the older one
The possession idea feels very good, the party would try what usually works against possession and realize it doesn't completely work, the same way a lich bends some rules about usual undead
It could be stuck into possessing people because somthing messed up during the process, making it agressively determined to regain control and/or desperate to always posess more people by fear of desappearing
@@GBS4893 Perhaps they can't exorcise the intoner because the possessed is willing. As long as there are people who enjoy the magnum opus, they will be willing targets for the intoner.
This is still my favourite of the bunch, love the never ending sound, imagine teaching it to crows and birds who sing it so people will know the song
Imagine it: the party has tracked down an Entoner. The battle is about to begin. "Do you think we took out everyone who heard their song?" The sorcerer asks as they prepare for battle.
In a raspy, echoing voice comes the reply "Neveeeer(never... never.... never...)
...
...
...
NEVER GONNA GIVE YOU UP, NEVER GONNA LET YOU DOWN"
I like the theme of Undeath twisting everything it touches. The Intoner survives on the memories of others and exists more as an ideal of himself rather than a direct continuation. A Magnum Opus with too little of the Intoner's soul would leave them vaunrable to misinterpretation, making them little more than an unstable Tulpa. Putting in too much of themself could risk overwhelming the minds of their phylactories, leading to madness like obsessive behavior or delusions of identity. An evil Intoner likely wouldn't care much about the later problem.
Talk about "death of the artist" lol.
Not only that if someone manages to change the song they can change the Entoner in turn.
As Entoners have to put their personality into the song, maybe knowing more about the life of the Entoner allows you to better understand the song, maybe deduce where he has been if you are looking for the people who heard his song. Having a full understanding would allow someone to insert verses that for the song so seamlessly that no one can tell the original from the modified version. Heck maybe a more skilled musician can improve upon the song, changing the Entoner's personality forever as his original lesser song gets replaced by the better one.
@SuperJumanji21 It means to be susceptible to change or damage, except I probably spelled it wrong.
D&D’s Lich may have been inspired by the Slavic tale of Koschei the Deathless, a wizard who hid his soul away in a needle, and the only way to kill him was to destroy it. His name is also meaningful as one translation for it is “walking skeleton.”
It absolutely is. But slavic folklore is very obscure in western media because most of it is not sufficiently translated and our people also don't go out of their way to popularize it :D
A needle, in an egg, in a duck, in a hare, in a box, under a tree, on an island in the sea...
@@sticky-soupalso that a good amount of slavic folklore that is popular (vampires,witches, the lich, etc.) aren’t recognized in the west as slavic inspired
@@Funstun-yk7oo for real. I even seen a dude who was arguing that "Baba Yaga" originated from John Wick
You are using clips of my favorite ASMR channels and I’m loving it
This is an awesome concept, and really plays with the idea of "living forever." Very, very good job.
Pretty sure Koschei the Deathless was busy doing classic lich stuff like hiding his soul in an object and being a general villain centuries before D&D, but I'll accept that D&D codified the trope as it's being used today.
Was waiting for someone to mention Koschei the Deathless.
Pretty sure that's where the idea of liches came from.
He and a few others, Lich specifically is just an old term for a corpse that got reused by HP Lovecraft to give a blanket name to something that never had a name previously, and then D&D took that modernized version Lovecraft made and ran with it. Most mythological "liches" were just magically empowered tyrants that somehow got their claws on immortality. Koschei really doesn't get enough credit for being the OG seemingly immortal evil tyrant
@TheRauzKindred according to Gygax himself the mm description was pretty much lifted from Robert E Howard's The Sword of the Sorcerer. Robert E Howard was a huge fan of Lovecraft so it makes sense. People give D&D too much credit. The Liche king is not a wizard in WC 3 he's the king of corpse and references the original term. It had undead wizards. They were warlocks. D&D had tons of competition in the time this stuff was made and no single source should be give credit for a cultural concept that the supposed creator of admits he lifed from combining bits of other at the time copyrighted works.
@@Huntanor Yarp, its fun trying to trail this stuff though, earliest use of the word in the somewhat general sense was Lovecraft, but where the evil magical Lich King style villain started is waaaay more vague since people took Lovecrafts works and had fun with it since he encouraged it. Lovecrafts Liches were more "HolyshitNOPE", horror movie monsters that happened to be a sentient magical corpse of some lunatic cultist and magic user.
Tbh, Koshey is more of a Fighter Lich
I don't like buying source books because they're expensive, but honestly? I'd pay more than full price for all of your content. It's just so great and I love it.
Also now I'm going to be thinking about Lich Druids for the next couple of days...
If the OGL 2.0 thing continues, sure you can, because WotC could steal his content and not giving anything to him
We're all waiting for Pointy Hat's Tome of Twisted Ideas
Holy crap, the Intoner is freaking awesome! Thank you so much!
"liches work well as just wizards" but then my favorite series which lich is born
We are all here to support you Hat! Keep (trying) to do what you do best!
100% agree
whenever pointy hat uploads, it's always a good time
Another genius idea. Really glad this channel showed up in my suggestion list.
I am adapting ALL of these class liches to my Pathfinder setting, thank you.
I already had a troupe of lich bards written out years ago, making them intoners is such a more natural way to do this
This is one of your best homebrews yet! The idea is super inspired and immediately gets my brain thinking of a story for it.
Suffice to say if things do go on fire and you're no longer able to make homebrew content with the OGL, you have a ton pf people willing to support you to keep going!
I think, especially given the OGL chaos, that it's worth mention that the actual concept of the Lich pre-dates D&D by hundreds of years. The oldest example I could find was the myth of Koschei the Deathless, a legend from Russia about a sorcerer that sealed his soul inside nested objects so that he could live forever. And while in his story, it's in the eye of a needle, inside an egg, inside a duck, inside a rabbit, inside a box, and buried... /what/ a Phylactery presents as is itself just a trope. Crystals, glass vials, canopic jars, amulets... these are all just objects that appear convenient for the concept. D&D does not own Liches, any more than they own Orcs, Dragons or Elves. A lot of what D&D did was simply codify a lot of mythical and fantasic elements into a coherent system, and I think we're going to be seeing a lot of those older roots being reminded as this situation progresses. WotC does not own as much as they think they do.
Your best ideia until now! Intoners are simply awesome!
This idea is absolutely genius. I'm in awe of you.
This is *such* a good idea! Not even just for D&D, just in general. I *love* this, and I like how they're not inherently evil like your regular Lich is since the process doesn't involve a ton of murder. Lol.
Now I’m thinking about other spellcaster litch variants…
Imagine an Artificer litch, who replaces their mortal body with an immortal machine!
Or a sorcerer litch who manages to become pure magic incarnate, forgoing death.
An artificer Lich sounds like a Necron from Warhammer 40k
Warlock-lich is basically an Eldrich lich
What about a druid lich who gives their soul to a part of nature, like a swamp or a forest.
They would inhabit the bodies of creatures that died in their biome of choice, spending their time protecting it from outside threats.
That's just Viktor and Xerath from LoL
@@badideagenerator2315 Oooh that would be awesome.
HOW AM I JUST FINDING YOU!!! THIS is the content I live for!!!
Can you imagine an Intoner that bound his soul to that universes version of happy birthday? Hed be basically impossible to kill
The Intoner is such an AMAZING idea, as it is even harder to get rid of than a Lich permanently. The fact in the stat block it gives the ability to have the PC themself become part of the Magnum Opus makes it so that unless they kill EVERYONE part of the Opus, including themselves, this thing is coming back eventually. Could even be that the Magnum Opus is a folk song popular in a region could mean so many unwilling souls are a part of the Magnum Opus. So much story potential there.
Absolutely using this. Thanks, Antonio!
Its a bard not a wizard, just trap him in a temporal field and wait out the lives of the people who carry the memory of his spell. And/Or just use divination to find the people who know the spell and kill them.
@@plamenyonkov9154 If the bard has just become undead maybe, if the song is popular enough the party needs some sizable genocide just to get rid of one lich
@@HappyBeezerStudios Hence the time trap, the song will die down eventually, and if he is spending eternity in the time trap he cant to squat to stop it. Something quite powerful like 10 000 seconds pass outside for every 1 second inside or something plus a lot of magical restrains, he is a bard not a proper spell caster he aint getting out anytime soon and if you damage his vocal cords and instruments he aint singing his way out.
I have yet to hear of a bard that can charm his way out without their silver tongue.
@@shocknawe They are fighting an idea, hell a country might even consider it its national hymn or something, its hard to destroy since you are trying to kill a song, but the people need to know the exact song. An off shoot or a changed notes wont work, the song will still sound nice but it shouldn't take/imprint in to the minds of people. So fighting an information war by spreading misinformation. Eventually people will forge the original song as the Bart Lich cant teach the song itself.
Keep doing exactly what you've been doing. Don't change a single thing. After that “serious start” you literally had me laughing my pants off two seconds latter.
You’re currently my favourite D&D RUclipsr and you represent exactly what has kept this community alive all this time; Creative Freedom.
I’m no data specialist, but that may be the reason “along with your unparalleled comedy” that made you so popular to begin with. There will always be another “Min-Max video” or “Class Review”, but there is only one channel, to my knowledge, that looks beyond the number-crunching and RAR.
That channel is everyone’s favorite sentient magic item. The one, the only, Pointy Hat.
Not a fan of the "lul so random XD" humor.
Antonio, you're awesome. Keep doing what you do and thank you for your hard work! Great video.
Such a great start to your series.
"Leg and dairy actions."
-A kool hat
I really love the concept of the Intoner. Very unique; definitely one of your best so far. It's like mixing Liches with the Phantom of the Opera. 👍
Consider: an Intoner in a modern campaign who works as an advertising executive and writes catchier and catchier earworms in order to perfect their Magnum Opus
Revisiting this series as I prepare for my next session. My players are reaching the point where they are gathering information on the Lich BBEG and this series originally inspired me to make my Lich. Thanks for all you do! I hope you eventually revisit the Wizard Lich. I'd love to see the classic lich... with a twist!
You've easily become one of my favorite content creators, not just in DnD, but generally over the last year. I really hope this OGL nonsense gets sorted so you can keep doing what you and we all love!
I love this channel, I'm running a modern dnd campaign and I have an unhealthy need to do something unique with every encounter. Which this channel provided in spades, I can't just have a lich, I have to make it different to prove that a modern setting is worthy of carrying a campaign by itself.
An actor version of an Intoner would be amazing for modern settings, how many Hollywood figures seem to never age? Or have near clones of themselves show up?
I mean, Freddie Mercury is an obvious choice. Bohemian Rhapsody sounds much more like a dark spell than an coherent song and I don’t know a single person who doesn’t know at least the first verse by heart
Christmas themed bard lich would be unstoppable
That was awesome, I love the idea of the Intoner!
A star walks into a black hole but doesn't seen phased. The black hole then turns to the star and says, "I don't think you understand the gravity of this situation."
What?
When the world ends and there is silence, the destroyer of all watches and listens. He admires his accomplishment, and smiles, embracing the silence…until, somehow, there is a sound, Human speech, the Destroyer is confused. He listens, and hears the following chilling words:
“A star walks into a black hole but doesn’t seen phased. The black hole then turns to the star and days, ‘I don’t think you understand the gravity of this situation’”
And so it ends, the sound, as quickly as it came into existence, leaves.
Nice
That's a pretty good one but I've heard it before uncle mark.
I see this comment under some video every single day. It never ends, every single day I find a video and this stupid joke is always the top comment. I’m so sick of it. Just stop.
Having a Bard Lich that lives on in the memories of other beings kinda somehow reminds me of Ember McLain from Danny Phantom - a ghost whose power is directly drawn from and directly scales with how many people know of her, chant her name, are fans of her, remember her music, etc.
Omg! Ember's song still plays in my head from time to time!
2e had a Bard Lich… wish I could remember his name.
I thought of tot Musica from one piece. The movie that somewhat recently came out
Or a bard lich whose phylactery is a magical song that rides on the winds, becoming an earworm to bards across the plane. If the lich dies, whoever plays the song next, summons the lich, who drains the aspiring bard of their power and soul
There was an optional rule somewhere that said when liches raise undead, they're raise permanently; which I like, because it's much more in line with the lich fantasy we see in various forms of media (games, books...etc), and it also explain why people, even nations hate and fear them so much. Unless stopped early, their army of minions keep snowballing.
That's such a cool idea! I love this concept!
Your whole thing about the Entoner reminds me of the King in Yellow, which is about a play that does the exact same thing and more. Coincidentally, Hastur, the king in yellow in the title, is also a god in Pathfinder, and he is said to have a particular liking to bards.
It ought to work with paintings too. Like Dorian Grey.
@@llamatronian101 Indeed. If a class existed for such things they would all create immortal arts that serve as phylacteries.
Keele from Konosuba is a great way to give a twist to a lich in terms of their story and character. So much so that it's safe to throw at low levels because the twist is that he's not hostile and just wants someone to give him a ceremonial forgiveness so he can be sent to the afterlife
the present day Intoner are youtubers. As long as someone watches one of their videos and remembers what happens, they never truly die
I still remember when I was into making my own stories and thought of a cursed family of bards that sheltered massive church organ that was kept in the catacombs under their estate. While lying the pipes were enchanted to play along the melodies in the air; the father lied about his stillborn son being the semi-living element of the piece. Eventually after the children grew to leave the nest, the melodies became more erratic after the patriarch perished, and the organ music became more audible throughout the nearby province. Attracting a cult following dubbed "The Listeners, or The Grand Audience."
Kind of like a Phantom of the Opera to Lala from D.Gray-Man.
An 'intoner song' should be one that inspire dread and awe to all who listen, a song that spread fear to listener but yet evoke a urge to shared to others, a song that no matter how many eons passes will never let you down, that will turn around and desert you, that never say goodbye tho the minds of all people.
I hate that I get the reference.
Have a like
bia's little notes on the screen give me such joy :')
Hope your doing good now, PointyHat! You bring me endless joy to me when I'm at work and help me get through my DnD while always offering resources -- for free!
An Entoner with an Echo Stone is such a terrifying concept
Antonio, seriously don't sweat it. There's no way the new OGL is going through. If it does, we'll follow you into the next system you cover. You make awesome content and you're really really good at what you do. Just keep doing it. Cheers brother
Intoners are so cool! I now want to make a warlock of the undead, who is the only one who still knows his patron's song. Maybe they found an ancient note page, or their grandparents used to humm this melody when warlock was little. I think they're my favorite of your monsters!
Multiclass into Bard of Spirits.
The Intoner is so freaking cool! Love it so much!
Imaging an entoner that runs a grocery store chain and has a bard at each store required to play there magnum opus as background music so that You'd literally have to kill millions to get rid of everyone's that's heard it
I always find it funny how this is the way most wizards go to live forever, when the [Clone] spell exists. It seems far more easy, doesn’t require any forbidden knowledge, daily sacrifices attracting unwanted attention, you don’t become a withered bag of bones. I mean I guess Lichs get some innate powerful necromancy, but in both paths you’re already a high level Wizard! You already got the gud magic!
Because Maruts will get you for breaking the contract of mortality, and you really don't want that to happen.
But also, if you think Clone is convenient, Reincarnation is a fifth level spell (meaning you can cast it into the Ring of Spell Storing) that brings you back to life from anything, including old age. Any ranger or druid can just get a friendly beast that will check up on them every week and cast the spell out of the ring if they kick the bucket.
This is fantastic, It would be awesome to have undead versions of other classes as well. Paladins trying to carry out their oaths after life (basically just revenants) Druids that are kept alive by the plants the cultivated in life while their bodies are slowly turned to plant (basically Nurgle cultists from WH40k) Sorcerer's who's bodies are corrupted by their gifts after death. Warlocks who are blackmailed with death to serve their patron.
Honestly I would imagine a Druid more turning into something akin to a Witcher 3 Leshen.
Some form of the "death knight" imagery for the paladin I guess, though the name is a bit boring. There are examples in fiction like the headless horseman, or even that immortal knight dude from Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade.
Druids becoming a whole corrupted ecosystem would be awesome. They could form a temporary body from vegetation to fight the party but short of burning down the forest, draining the swamp, or greening the blighted desert they can't be defeated. "Argh, you have discovered my only weakness, large scale civil engineering."
@@TheTriforceDragon I'm unfamiliar with the Witcher but I'm intrigued enough to look into the thing you mentioned.
@@llamatronian101 honestly that's awesome, and second "ha industry wins take that nature!"
Why not expand it to the martial classes, too? Fighters that were so great, gods turned them into their immortal champions, rogues so good their souls evaded the pull to the afterlife, monks so inured with energy, their bodies became an extension of their deathless souls and rooted themselves to this plane of existence.
Barbarians and rangers are a little tougher, admittedly, because they greatly overlap with druids, but still, I can kinda see it. Maybe a barbarian who ascends to the rank of a nature spirit, and a ranger who found ways to hunt celestials and combine their powers with nature to turn themselves into a sort of perpetual spring of life?
The Intoner that made “Old Mc’Donald had a farm” is cashing arcane checks to this day lol
Intoners sound really cool and could work in an artist way since people always know an artist's style and imitate them when they really like it!