Interesting conversation guys!! Because of the big money the majority of the new cards are for speculating not collecting!! With the modern cards it is no longer a hobby but all out gambling!!
So much of the ultra-modern hobby is chasing the next BIG THING before it becomes the BIG THING. That’s the allure of prospecting - to get in early on the bottom floor with the next Shohei before his prices go through the roof. The sad part is that for every 1 Shohei, there are 500 other prospects that don’t pan out, so anything invested in them essentially drops to near zero. Gambling in this way doesn’t really appeal to me, as I prefer to go after fun 90s inserts of HOFers like Maddux, Griffey, Big Hurt, and honorary HOFer Bonds. There’s not as much volatility, or at least not the big risk of the values of their cards dropping to zero. My preferred flavor of hobby gambling looks more like carefully selecting cards to grade and increasing value of my cards by getting 9s and 10s, selling, and then using that cash to fund more card purchases. It’s definitely a gamble to an extent as you never know exactly what PSA will do with a card, but with careful inspection using the loupe that Dylan Double D recommended, I feel like the deck is stacked a bit more in my favor.
Great new intro boys. I enjoyed your conversation. It seems like your guys really know what you’re talking about. I’m glad you are both enjoying the MLB card collecting hobby. It was fun collecting cards together as you were growing up. You really got me hooked because I collected Barry Bonds cards exclusively for 35 years. During that time I accumulated 9,500 different Bonds pieces. Now that I’m retired, I’m gradually liquidating my collection. I’m pleased you are both more selective with the cards you are collecting. It makes a lot of sense and it will make it easier for you to sell off your personal collections in the future. Good job boys. Love, Dad
😂😂😂 I believe reverse edge chipping is the singular most common condition issue with 90s inserts. Period. THAT’s where PSA docks points. That’s what makes a “10” looking card into an “8”.
Hey, Dylan! I got that Clemens in your slab! 95 centering grade FTW!! Technically it’s at my parents’ house in Pittsburgh, but next time I visit, I’ll have it in hand! Thanks again for slabbing that card up for me! WAY better than PSA!
Very interesting conversation, fellas! It'll be very interesting to see what happens with Beckett moving forward. I had never thought about the different eras of a players autograph either. Very thought-provoking!
It’s tough to predict what hobby trends may take hold in the future. In the early 90s, getting a vintage card signed was taboo and seen as ruining the card. I can easily see how autograph eras for a given player may distinguish one rarer example from other more plentiful ones. Time will tell, but I feel pretty solid about that.
@HighPopProfessor It's definitely an interesting concept for sure! I remember when autographs were seen as ruining the card! You would have never had someone's rookie card autographed back then. It's interesting to see how things evolve!
I also appreciate the discussion here about past and modern iconic rookie cards. I agree with Iconic Al that there are still easily identifiable and definable rookie cards for players like Ohtani, Judge, Soto etc… the question is can do those cards penetrate the consciousness of collectors the way that classic vintage iconic rookie do. I can speak for my own experience with Shohei. I love the guy and share the same assessment you both have of his career and place in the game. I like him enough to where I want him represented in my long term personal collection, but as I write this I can honestly tell you I’m having a hard time conjuring the image of his flagship Topps rookie card. I think I can see it in my minds eye? But my visual vocabulary for Shohei is so so so jam packed with images that I’m not sure. I do have Shoehei RC cards! All three of his Topps Heritage issues from 2018 - and I can tell you the action variation of him pitching is my favorite… and when I think of my Shoehei rookie that’s the image that occupies my consciousness (right or wrong) Anyway - I’ll stop, but I just wanted to share my experience because this conversation was so fun and thought provoking!
I think the one that sticks in my head is the Topps flagship pitching image, but clearly the hobby has not yet formed a consensus here which is a little surprising considering that the Griffey 89 UD rookie was almost immediately THE Griffey rookie to get. The 93 SP Jeter was THE Jeter rookie to get, and although it took longer than the Griffey, Jeter started playing in 96, a few years after that card came out, so it makes sense for it to catch on after he’s making a big impact in the game. Shohei made an impact in the game almost immediately, yet here we are 6 years in and the jury is still out. I do think that within another 6 years, there will be consensus, but who’s to say if it’s Topps archive, Topps flagship, Topps Chrome, Bowman Chrome, or something else?
Thanks, Orlando! It’s funny - these are basically organic conversations that we would probably have anyway, but we just hit the record button and upload it here for others to check out if interested. I think even if there were no viewers for these videos, we would still make them anyway because we have such a blast doing it!
Thanks, Mr. President! Glad you enjoyed it! Yeah, ever since we were 12 and 15 years old respectively, we would have a blast taking the T down to Bucco games and getting autographs of the players before and after games. Those years from 1997 - 2000 were magical for us. We probably went to about 35 games every summer, because children’s general admission tickets were $1, so I’d buy them all! 😂 Even after they increased that to $3, it was still very doable on allowance and snow-shoveling money. Al may be my big brother, but he’s like a best friend I’ve always had.
Always love these and the intro is fantastic!!! You guys hit the nail on the head with the gambling analogies and the full immersion of it when it comes to sports and the hobby and society as a whole. Being in PA myself, there is a skill machine available for play in almost every establishment around anymore. When I got back in the hobby in 2013, I was amazed how the hobby had evolved since the late 90s when I stopped collecting. For several years, I definitely chased the “hits” via packs and boxes. While it was definitely fun I also wish I could have all that hobby budget back to by the cards I really wanted. It was at least a lot cheaper mistake 10 plus years ago. Haha Great stuff from The Duo!!!
I’m glad you enjoyed it, Joe! Yeah, I couldn’t have foreseen the degree to which gambling has encroached upon the hobby and society as a whole. At this point, is anyone surprised when Shohei’s interpreter got busted or perhaps even took the fall for Shohei’s own gambling debt? Also, with it so normalized, I have to think that it’s only a matter of time before Pete Rose is inducted into the Hall of Fame. If he had a “lifetime ban”, then that has now been fully served. Let him in!
Great conversation and insights. I enjoyed your thoughts on gambling and regulation. I am skeptical there will ever be real regulation. A few states, MIGHT try to tax the income, but no one is going to regulated sports cards any time soon. The hobby will just move to another state or over seas. I am shocked when I meet a hobbyist that doesn't gamble.
Regulation seems tricky to do. Unlike slot machines that can be programmed to yield specified win rates with % returns guaranteed, the value of sports cards fluctuates so rapidly and dramatically (especially ultra modern) that no consistent monetary return could be guaranteed. Even if they were audited and ensured that the hits and pack odds were properly adhered to for inserts / parallels / autos, etc. almost ALL of the value of those hits depends on hitting the Pareto player(s) in that insert set / auto / etc. My preferred method of “gambling” in the hobby involves PSA submissions and going for 90s cards in 9s (and the occasional 10). For a while there, it seemed like getting a 90s card graded in a PSA 9 essentially doubled the value over ungraded. That’s a nice return, and then the 10s can be really crazy too! I feel like I have an edge in the grading game by carefully going over my cards with a loupe and only sending in the best candidates that will grade out well. It will be curious to see what impact this rampant gambling will have on the hobby in 5-10 years. Will it become like a casino - a sad place where addicts go who can’t stop themselves from their own destructive behavior? The hobby I grew up with seemed like such a happy, exciting environment. I’d hate to see it devolve further. After all, looking around at the people pulling those slot machine levers (and now buying wax or buying into breaks), you’ll notice that no one is smiling in the casino. The house always wins. Thanks for watching and commenting!
We would be honored to have you on as a guest sometime, Graig! I think I speak for both Iconic Al and myself when I say that we would welcome an opportunity to be a guest on your channel as well! You can always reach me at my email address: highpopprofessor@gmail.com!
@ My channel goal for 2025 is to do a livestream once per month every month. I have the first couple of months lined up, but maybe for March or April, you two could be my livestream guests!! That would be awesome.
I think one of the biggest changes in the hobby for example, in 1975. Yes, going back 50 years. A pack of baseball cards was, like 15 cents, or maybe 25 cents. Which in today's economy would be, about a dollar, if that. There's probably not many packs in 2025, where kids and teenagers could buy, a new pack of cards, for a dollar. Maybe there was some wherewithal that, George Brett rookie card , has monetary value. But maybe not. Grading was still more than 15 plus years away. Ebay wasn't around until the mid 1990's. I often think to myself, that maybe I grew up in the wrong collecting era. My biggest concern, however would also be, with the hobby's gambling culture. Throwing away base cards because they are base cards. And spending hundreds, even thousand dollars on some unknown player, or just flavor of the month. I suppose this was all happening 30 and 20 years ago, but just maybe I don't know more amplified now. The prices are definitely more bonkers, too. Well anyway just some of my thoughts. Great to see another episode. And you both had a lot of great points!
Yep - everything is just amped up to 11 now compared to the 70s / early 80s. Starting in the late 80s, there was a lot of prospecting and investing for new hot up and coming players / prospects. Gregg Jeffries, Kevin Maas, Brien Taylor, Ben MacDonald, Todd Van Poppel, David Neid, and the list goes on. People were stacking these guys’ cards in anticipation of them doing great things, but even a Brien Taylor base rookie was only going to set you back $2.50. Todd Van Poppel’s Leaf gold rookies card was a $15 card, as was Brien Taylor’s Stadium Club Dome RC. That was about as expensive as they got, and even with inflation factored in, they’re still not $100 in today’s dollars. The financial loss when speculating on these prospects was somewhat minimized then, but compare that to now where people can and do drop 5-6 figures on an unknown rookie… that’s life-changing money. As a risk-averse individual, it still turns my stomach to think about it too much. Thanks for watching, Andrew!
@@HighPopProfessor that's just the Nostalgia for the Beckett Monthly price guide talking; their poor track record of decision making the last decade is why they've lost collectors' support and their place in the hobby as a tier 1 grading and hobby service provider
@@Dufex_of_LifeAll fair points. And I never said Beckett didn’t DESERVE to lose thier position in the market. The company has been mishandled and mismanaged for a long time. My only point was - this is likely a nice ‘buy low’ moment for cards sitting in BGS slabs
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
Interesting conversation guys!! Because of the big money the majority of the new cards are for speculating not collecting!! With the modern cards it is no longer a hobby but all out gambling!!
So much of the ultra-modern hobby is chasing the next BIG THING before it becomes the BIG THING. That’s the allure of prospecting - to get in early on the bottom floor with the next Shohei before his prices go through the roof. The sad part is that for every 1 Shohei, there are 500 other prospects that don’t pan out, so anything invested in them essentially drops to near zero.
Gambling in this way doesn’t really appeal to me, as I prefer to go after fun 90s inserts of HOFers like Maddux, Griffey, Big Hurt, and honorary HOFer Bonds. There’s not as much volatility, or at least not the big risk of the values of their cards dropping to zero.
My preferred flavor of hobby gambling looks more like carefully selecting cards to grade and increasing value of my cards by getting 9s and 10s, selling, and then using that cash to fund more card purchases. It’s definitely a gamble to an extent as you never know exactly what PSA will do with a card, but with careful inspection using the loupe that Dylan Double D recommended, I feel like the deck is stacked a bit more in my favor.
Great new intro boys. I enjoyed your conversation. It seems like your guys really know what you’re talking about. I’m glad you are both enjoying the MLB card collecting hobby. It was fun collecting cards together as you were growing up. You really got me hooked because I collected Barry Bonds cards exclusively for 35 years. During that time I accumulated 9,500 different Bonds pieces. Now that I’m retired, I’m gradually liquidating my collection. I’m pleased you are both more selective with the cards you are collecting. It makes a lot of sense and it will make it easier for you to sell off your personal collections in the future. Good job boys. Love, Dad
Thanks, Dad! I’m so glad to still be able to enjoy the hobby with my family all these years later! ❤❤❤
I’m so glad you increased the 2025 show budget and spent it on that introduction, brothers. What a fun episode!!!
Hey, we spare no expense on this show! 😂 That’s why people come back to watch the next one!
Glad you liked it, Mookie!
Thanks Mook 😂 glad you enjoyed it sir!
1996 leaf signature series reverse edges are like my golf game, always subject to chipping
😂😂😂
I believe reverse edge chipping is the singular most common condition issue with 90s inserts. Period. THAT’s where PSA docks points. That’s what makes a “10” looking card into an “8”.
All right my 2 favorite brothers are back !!!
Hey, Dylan! I got that Clemens in your slab! 95 centering grade FTW!! Technically it’s at my parents’ house in Pittsburgh, but next time I visit, I’ll have it in hand! Thanks again for slabbing that card up for me! WAY better than PSA!
Finally ha ha ha well I took even longer than PSA 🤣🤣🤣. Im listening to you guys right now on the beach and loving it
Thanks for the love DD! 🤙
Very interesting conversation, fellas! It'll be very interesting to see what happens with Beckett moving forward. I had never thought about the different eras of a players autograph either. Very thought-provoking!
It’s tough to predict what hobby trends may take hold in the future. In the early 90s, getting a vintage card signed was taboo and seen as ruining the card. I can easily see how autograph eras for a given player may distinguish one rarer example from other more plentiful ones. Time will tell, but I feel pretty solid about that.
@HighPopProfessor It's definitely an interesting concept for sure! I remember when autographs were seen as ruining the card! You would have never had someone's rookie card autographed back then. It's interesting to see how things evolve!
Absolutely! I remember those times as well! That’s “hobby evolution” for ya! 😂
Fanatics teamed up with BGS would be a Quality Control blackhole
They deserve each other! 😂
Killer Bonsai Tree analogy. Love the brotherly insights here. Great discussion. Speaking my language. 👊🤙
Thanks DK - love you buddy!
Glad you enjoyed it, DK!
I also appreciate the discussion here about past and modern iconic rookie cards. I agree with Iconic Al that there are still easily identifiable and definable rookie cards for players like Ohtani, Judge, Soto etc… the question is can do those cards penetrate the consciousness of collectors the way that classic vintage iconic rookie do.
I can speak for my own experience with Shohei. I love the guy and share the same assessment you both have of his career and place in the game. I like him enough to where I want him represented in my long term personal collection, but as I write this I can honestly tell you I’m having a hard time conjuring the image of his flagship Topps rookie card. I think I can see it in my minds eye? But my visual vocabulary for Shohei is so so so jam packed with images that I’m not sure.
I do have Shoehei RC cards! All three of his Topps Heritage issues from 2018 - and I can tell you the action variation of him pitching is my favorite… and when I think of my Shoehei rookie that’s the image that occupies my consciousness (right or wrong)
Anyway - I’ll stop, but I just wanted to share my experience because this conversation was so fun and thought provoking!
I think the one that sticks in my head is the Topps flagship pitching image, but clearly the hobby has not yet formed a consensus here which is a little surprising considering that the Griffey 89 UD rookie was almost immediately THE Griffey rookie to get. The 93 SP Jeter was THE Jeter rookie to get, and although it took longer than the Griffey, Jeter started playing in 96, a few years after that card came out, so it makes sense for it to catch on after he’s making a big impact in the game. Shohei made an impact in the game almost immediately, yet here we are 6 years in and the jury is still out. I do think that within another 6 years, there will be consensus, but who’s to say if it’s Topps archive, Topps flagship, Topps Chrome, Bowman Chrome, or something else?
I missed you Al! Great episode bros 👊👊
Glad you liked it, Adam! I’ve got to do another video about collecting goals for 2025…
Thanks Adam - it was great to get the “Duo” back together!
great conversation! The intro 😂
That intro will live on for all future Brothers’ Duo! Videos! 😂😂😂. Glad you enjoyed it!
Really enjoyed the conversation. Keep up the good work guys
Thanks, Orlando! It’s funny - these are basically organic conversations that we would probably have anyway, but we just hit the record button and upload it here for others to check out if interested. I think even if there were no viewers for these videos, we would still make them anyway because we have such a blast doing it!
Thanks for watching Orlando!
This was great. You guys make a good team.
Thanks, Mr. President! Glad you enjoyed it! Yeah, ever since we were 12 and 15 years old respectively, we would have a blast taking the T down to Bucco games and getting autographs of the players before and after games. Those years from 1997 - 2000 were magical for us. We probably went to about 35 games every summer, because children’s general admission tickets were $1, so I’d buy them all! 😂 Even after they increased that to $3, it was still very doable on allowance and snow-shoveling money. Al may be my big brother, but he’s like a best friend I’ve always had.
Thanks for watching John!
I love this topic and you guys did a great job goving an overview
Thanks, The Drew! Glad you enjoyed it!
Nice job guys! Congrats on 300, Low Pop! 🤛🏻
Thanks Brent! I made it to 300 subs! Woo!!
Always love these and the intro is fantastic!!! You guys hit the nail on the head with the gambling analogies and the full immersion of it when it comes to sports and the hobby and society as a whole. Being in PA myself, there is a skill machine available for play in almost every establishment around anymore. When I got back in the hobby in 2013, I was amazed how the hobby had evolved since the late 90s when I stopped collecting. For several years, I definitely chased the “hits” via packs and boxes. While it was definitely fun I also wish I could have all that hobby budget back to by the cards I really wanted. It was at least a lot cheaper mistake 10 plus years ago. Haha Great stuff from The Duo!!!
I’m glad you enjoyed it, Joe! Yeah, I couldn’t have foreseen the degree to which gambling has encroached upon the hobby and society as a whole. At this point, is anyone surprised when Shohei’s interpreter got busted or perhaps even took the fall for Shohei’s own gambling debt? Also, with it so normalized, I have to think that it’s only a matter of time before Pete Rose is inducted into the Hall of Fame. If he had a “lifetime ban”, then that has now been fully served. Let him in!
Fun conversation fellas!!
Glad you enjoyed it, Nate! Are you bummed or excited about the Bonds autos being released in new products?
Great show. Great discussion. Thank you for recording it. Happy hunting in 2025
Thanks, EP! Glad you enjoyed it!
Great conversation and insights. I enjoyed your thoughts on gambling and regulation. I am skeptical there will ever be real regulation. A few states, MIGHT try to tax the income, but no one is going to regulated sports cards any time soon. The hobby will just move to another state or over seas.
I am shocked when I meet a hobbyist that doesn't gamble.
Regulation seems tricky to do. Unlike slot machines that can be programmed to yield specified win rates with % returns guaranteed, the value of sports cards fluctuates so rapidly and dramatically (especially ultra modern) that no consistent monetary return could be guaranteed. Even if they were audited and ensured that the hits and pack odds were properly adhered to for inserts / parallels / autos, etc. almost ALL of the value of those hits depends on hitting the Pareto player(s) in that insert set / auto / etc.
My preferred method of “gambling” in the hobby involves PSA submissions and going for 90s cards in 9s (and the occasional 10). For a while there, it seemed like getting a 90s card graded in a PSA 9 essentially doubled the value over ungraded. That’s a nice return, and then the 10s can be really crazy too! I feel like I have an edge in the grading game by carefully going over my cards with a loupe and only sending in the best candidates that will grade out well.
It will be curious to see what impact this rampant gambling will have on the hobby in 5-10 years. Will it become like a casino - a sad place where addicts go who can’t stop themselves from their own destructive behavior? The hobby I grew up with seemed like such a happy, exciting environment. I’d hate to see it devolve further. After all, looking around at the people pulling those slot machine levers (and now buying wax or buying into breaks), you’ll notice that no one is smiling in the casino.
The house always wins.
Thanks for watching and commenting!
#NewIntro
Enjoyed it fellas!
😂😂😂
If you guys ever have a guest, I hope you’ll consider me. I love these videos and would love to be in on a discussion.
We would be honored to have you on as a guest sometime, Graig! I think I speak for both Iconic Al and myself when I say that we would welcome an opportunity to be a guest on your channel as well! You can always reach me at my email address: highpopprofessor@gmail.com!
@ My channel goal for 2025 is to do a livestream once per month every month. I have the first couple of months lined up, but maybe for March or April, you two could be my livestream guests!! That would be awesome.
Sounds fantastic to me - I’ll have to get with Al and see about coordinating with his schedule!
@@MidLifeCardsThanks for watching Graig. I’d be honored to join in on a livestream in the future!
Do it! Graig definitely needs more air time for exposure for his fledgling channel.😉
Just kidding. You know I love you Graig
I think one of the biggest changes in the hobby for example, in 1975. Yes, going back 50 years. A pack of baseball cards was, like 15 cents, or maybe 25 cents. Which in today's economy would be, about a dollar, if that. There's probably not many packs in 2025, where kids and teenagers could buy, a new pack of cards, for a dollar.
Maybe there was some wherewithal that, George Brett rookie card , has monetary value. But maybe not. Grading was still more than 15 plus years away. Ebay wasn't around until the mid 1990's. I often think to myself, that maybe I grew up in the wrong collecting era. My biggest concern, however would also be, with the hobby's gambling culture. Throwing away base cards because they are base cards. And spending hundreds, even thousand dollars on some unknown player, or just flavor of the month. I suppose this was all happening 30 and 20 years ago, but just maybe I don't know more amplified now. The prices are definitely more bonkers, too. Well anyway just some of my thoughts. Great to see another episode. And you both had a lot of great points!
Yep - everything is just amped up to 11 now compared to the 70s / early 80s. Starting in the late 80s, there was a lot of prospecting and investing for new hot up and coming players / prospects. Gregg Jeffries, Kevin Maas, Brien Taylor, Ben MacDonald, Todd Van Poppel, David Neid, and the list goes on. People were stacking these guys’ cards in anticipation of them doing great things, but even a Brien Taylor base rookie was only going to set you back $2.50. Todd Van Poppel’s Leaf gold rookies card was a $15 card, as was Brien Taylor’s Stadium Club Dome RC. That was about as expensive as they got, and even with inflation factored in, they’re still not $100 in today’s dollars. The financial loss when speculating on these prospects was somewhat minimized then, but compare that to now where people can and do drop 5-6 figures on an unknown rookie… that’s life-changing money. As a risk-averse individual, it still turns my stomach to think about it too much.
Thanks for watching, Andrew!
It's actually YOGI not getting the Hobby love, not the BGS slab
They could both use more hobby love! They’re deserving!
@@HighPopProfessor that's just the Nostalgia for the Beckett Monthly price guide talking; their poor track record of decision making the last decade is why they've lost collectors' support and their place in the hobby as a tier 1 grading and hobby service provider
@@Dufex_of_LifeAll fair points. And I never said Beckett didn’t DESERVE to lose thier position in the market. The company has been mishandled and mismanaged for a long time. My only point was - this is likely a nice ‘buy low’ moment for cards sitting in BGS slabs