im also running non intercooled e85 stock 4.8 tho on 25 pounds i bet its makin close to 800. all i ever here is i cant do this or i cant do that thanks for proving it can happen
Hey Joe would you be able to make a video about all the boost control stuff?? Like setting up safety's etc etc. I've read all the Holley material and have a decent understanding of it but would definitely be easier to grasp if it was explained from an experienced tuner. Thanks love all the videos
I’m on lesson 20 of your Tune the Trilogy course. So far it has been super easy to follow 👍 My Holley Terminator X is going on in the next couple weeks. I went with the coil near plug option and the dual sync distributor for the cam/crank signals. (Have you used the dual sync before?) 484” Pontiac, IA2 block, KRE highport heads, 13-1 compression on race gas. My car is a 1970 Trans Am. Once I get a handle on the EFI tuning I will be going with a large single or twin turbos mid 2023.
I'm an old Pontiac guy, and it sounds like you'll have a badass car brother. The only issue I see is the compression being too high to add boost later. If it's not too late, you might want to drop the compression ratio down to 10.5:1 ish. Not only will you be able to run pump gas, but then when you add boost you'll have the ability to add race gas, E85, Methanol or even an alky injection system that comes on and sprays only when under boost that you can use with regular pump gas. Running race gas even in N/A trim gets old quick, I've been there. You end up not driving the car nearly as much as you'd like to. I'm also an old Grand National guy, so I was running 25 psi on pump gas and an alky injection system. I used ported stock iron heads, so you'll have even more detonation tolerance with the aluminum KREs. If you remember one thing: Detonation is what kills any boosted engine.
@@RonniePTexan GN’s are cool as hell 👍 In current form my TA runs 10.40’s with a Prosystems dominator carburetor. Next rebuild I will be lowering the compression to around 10-1, changing to a turbo cam, new ring package, and rods. Also destroking the 484” engine from a 4.21” stroke to a 4” stroke to take some of the side load off the cylinders. New bore will probably be 4.3” and with a 4” stroke will be 464”. Shooting for 1200hp-1300hp
@@505Tempest Awesome stuff brother. When I ran Pontiac stuff in the early-mid-1990s I didn't have the aluminum heads and other fun stuff and I hadn't gotten into the GN/turbo world yet, so I was just having to spray nitrous on it. I ran 428s, 400s, and then later a 440. It was a 455 with a 421/428 crank, so basically a destroked 455 at 12.5:1 compression. I was spinning them to 7,800-8,200 RPM with a custom Isky cam. Everyone told me a Pontiac should never spin past like 6,500 RPM but with good valvetrain it was never a problem. I know a good bit about turbo stuff too and if your combo is right and by your ET is sounds like close to 700HP so it is right, I wouldn't change to a "turbo cam" unless you don't like your power curve that you have now. I'd change pistons and rings, then add turbos. Everyone over complicates things but the basics always work. At sea level there is 14.7 PSI in the air we walk around with. If you want to double your current HP, you run 14.7 PSI of boost. Obviously the turbo has to be sized correctly (a nice 88mm turbo with a large a/r should do it), and there are some losses due to inefficiency so it's probably best to look at it as you needing to run 15 PSI to double HP. Plus 15 PSI is an easy round number. Your 700 HP turns into 1,400 HP at 15 PSI, and assuming the turbo/turbos are big enough, it'll add another 700 HP for every 15 PSI. Things like intercoolers and fuel type will lower the incoming air (aka charge temperature) and things under pressure create heat so those things become more important the more boost that you run. I say all of this because people will try to sell you special "turbo cams" and intake manifolds etc for "turbos" when in reality that's a waste. Just double the air pressure and in effect you are doubling the engine size. Something cool about turbos is that it makes things much much easier on your pistons, rods and crank. It seems to cushion the "yank" on the piston/pin/rod at the top of the bore so it's not as violent on them. Turbos will be harder on your head gaskets, so either o-ring the block/heads if you're doing a fresh build/rebuild, or spend the extra money on good head gaskets and studs. Sounds like you'll have a 7 second Pontiac once you're done.
Joe I am in NY what state are you in ? I ask because i have the HP Coil on plug sequential multi port set up on my 434.. And would love to get a quality tuner to set it up
NEVER GIVE UP, I lost my father to a freak accident and I am far more determined to push the engineering envelope for the D-Series engine with a Y8 head that I'm cutting out the "low flow" port and bowl that I have to cut into the cooling chamber but I will TIG Weld a custom port bowl and attempt to match a Z6 head flow with a Y8 head for the Quench pads to reduce the combustion chamber temperatures and allow for more ignition timing in theory!!!!
Hate to rain on your parade. You are pursuing details that don't add up to significant HP gains. I dyno tested a ton of d16 combinations. Very heavily ported z6 and y8 heads. The "theoretical" HP gain from the y8 quench pads doesn't happen na or turbo It does affect the ignition timing used for max HP vs the z6 tho.
Whats your thoughts on a non intercooled setup on e98. Really want to stay clear of dual injectors and don't want all the billet atomizer issues that would come with running methanol . Engine is a 370ci ls with everything supporting for 1500+ hp. Rather large twin 80mm chargers. Drag race use only no drive time, you think it would work or would I be better off just going straight to methanol from the start? Love all of the videos! Just bought your full course. Thanks for everything!
Madness with no IC but hey if it works it works. It would make more with an IC but honestly if the turbos out of air it wouldnt matter🤔 very interesting! Tbh I'd love to ditch my IC so my rad could get some more air
What was the base fuel pressure? Could lower it to regain more injector control. Shit, even 25-30psi base if you had to. Plus, that'd stretch out a borderline fuel pump if you needed to.
I ran 38-40psi non intercooled on E85+meth with a 10v 5cyl Audi. The engine lived, but I'll never do it again. Tuning it was awful, and it was picky about weather. The relationship of pre compressor to post compressor temp isn't 1:1, so that affected the flash point of the methanol and everything else in the tune.
@@JoeSimpsonAtTempest yea forgot about that. I’m IC but it’s to the point it’s restrictive so its either a2w and add weight or m1. Haven’t wanted to chance detonation non IC with e85 so I have been researching non IC setups. Love the content man, learned a lot about Holley. 🔥
It’s odd to me how smooth your ve table looks my engine didn’t want a perfectly smooth hill in the ve table to get the least correction it looks nothing like yours but I’m no professional
If i were to run e85 is their a reccomended fuel pump to use to where id only have to run 1 and still make 6/700hp or do i have to run twin pumps……on a lsa 370” lq9, or centrifugal blown 4.8 …..more than likely be the 4.8…… the lsa runs tits on high octane in my nova with race gas concentrate….the 4.8 hasnt had the fuel tank installed yet and i dont wanna run an intercooler if i can get away with it on e85 dont plan on anymore than 12psi max….its on a ‘73 c10
Nice... wonder how that would do with meth injection at the base where the carb would go.??? Anybody have imput on that.... basically like a nitrous plate ?
Lol more Ls junk in a foxbody remember folks the Ls NEEDS the foxbody the foxbody doesnt need the Ls, all the guys I know who do real racing with Ls stuff just spin bearings or bend rods and lock up motors lol thats something people dont talk about by the time you go through 4 or 5 Ls motors you could have built a Dart block SBF setup!
That conversation on the stock bottom end holding better than the "built" stuff needs to be talked about more
Ya I mean stock you know works because it has 200,000 miles already but people do shitty jobs or use weaker parts and or push parts harder
I'm also curious about this. I have some theories, but I'm not a professional tuner, nor am I a professional engine builder.
@@gofastwclass hell, might as well get a discussion going, let’s hear those theories
Which is why all those no prep guys and drag week cars are all running stock bottom ends....
@@BLAC_WORX I gaurantee any of these guys weather no prep or drag week who are fast dont have junk yard stuff
im also running non intercooled e85 stock 4.8 tho on 25 pounds i bet its makin close to 800. all i ever here is i cant do this or i cant do that thanks for proving it can happen
What kinda air temps do you see?
Hey Joe would you be able to make a video about all the boost control stuff?? Like setting up safety's etc etc. I've read all the Holley material and have a decent understanding of it but would definitely be easier to grasp if it was explained from an experienced tuner. Thanks love all the videos
I’m on lesson 20 of your Tune the Trilogy course. So far it has been super easy to follow 👍 My Holley Terminator X is going on in the next couple weeks. I went with the coil near plug option and the dual sync distributor for the cam/crank signals. (Have you used the dual sync before?) 484” Pontiac, IA2 block, KRE highport heads, 13-1 compression on race gas. My car is a 1970 Trans Am. Once I get a handle on the EFI tuning I will be going with a large single or twin turbos mid 2023.
I'm an old Pontiac guy, and it sounds like you'll have a badass car brother. The only issue I see is the compression being too high to add boost later. If it's not too late, you might want to drop the compression ratio down to 10.5:1 ish. Not only will you be able to run pump gas, but then when you add boost you'll have the ability to add race gas, E85, Methanol or even an alky injection system that comes on and sprays only when under boost that you can use with regular pump gas. Running race gas even in N/A trim gets old quick, I've been there. You end up not driving the car nearly as much as you'd like to.
I'm also an old Grand National guy, so I was running 25 psi on pump gas and an alky injection system. I used ported stock iron heads, so you'll have even more detonation tolerance with the aluminum KREs. If you remember one thing: Detonation is what kills any boosted engine.
@@RonniePTexan GN’s are cool as hell 👍 In current form my TA runs 10.40’s with a Prosystems dominator carburetor. Next rebuild I will be lowering the compression to around 10-1, changing to a turbo cam, new ring package, and rods. Also destroking the 484” engine from a 4.21” stroke to a 4” stroke to take some of the side load off the cylinders. New bore will probably be 4.3” and with a 4” stroke will be 464”. Shooting for 1200hp-1300hp
@@505Tempest Awesome stuff brother. When I ran Pontiac stuff in the early-mid-1990s I didn't have the aluminum heads and other fun stuff and I hadn't gotten into the GN/turbo world yet, so I was just having to spray nitrous on it. I ran 428s, 400s, and then later a 440. It was a 455 with a 421/428 crank, so basically a destroked 455 at 12.5:1 compression. I was spinning them to 7,800-8,200 RPM with a custom Isky cam. Everyone told me a Pontiac should never spin past like 6,500 RPM but with good valvetrain it was never a problem. I know a good bit about turbo stuff too and if your combo is right and by your ET is sounds like close to 700HP so it is right, I wouldn't change to a "turbo cam" unless you don't like your power curve that you have now. I'd change pistons and rings, then add turbos. Everyone over complicates things but the basics always work. At sea level there is 14.7 PSI in the air we walk around with. If you want to double your current HP, you run 14.7 PSI of boost. Obviously the turbo has to be sized correctly (a nice 88mm turbo with a large a/r should do it), and there are some losses due to inefficiency so it's probably best to look at it as you needing to run 15 PSI to double HP. Plus 15 PSI is an easy round number. Your 700 HP turns into 1,400 HP at 15 PSI, and assuming the turbo/turbos are big enough, it'll add another 700 HP for every 15 PSI. Things like intercoolers and fuel type will lower the incoming air (aka charge temperature) and things under pressure create heat so those things become more important the more boost that you run. I say all of this because people will try to sell you special "turbo cams" and intake manifolds etc for "turbos" when in reality that's a waste. Just double the air pressure and in effect you are doubling the engine size.
Something cool about turbos is that it makes things much much easier on your pistons, rods and crank. It seems to cushion the "yank" on the piston/pin/rod at the top of the bore so it's not as violent on them. Turbos will be harder on your head gaskets, so either o-ring the block/heads if you're doing a fresh build/rebuild, or spend the extra money on good head gaskets and studs.
Sounds like you'll have a 7 second Pontiac once you're done.
Love watching your vids/work from Australia Joe 👌, keep up the good work mate 👍
Hey Joe, do you have any experience tuning LS turbo notches on Holley?
lmao
Shit, you offer a tuning course, I guess I know what the wife is getting for Christmas 🤣
Joe I am in NY what state are you in ? I ask because i have the HP Coil on plug sequential multi port set up on my 434.. And would love to get a quality tuner to set it up
I believe he is in Maryland
That’s it I’m throwing all my intercoolers in the trash
Dude, what is up with the AFR not working on Holley stuff lately?
Cheap Chinese injectors
Cheap Chinese o2 sensors
Cheap Chinese parts
People expecting them to operate like quality builds lol
NEVER GIVE UP, I lost my father to a freak accident and I am far more determined to push the engineering envelope for the D-Series engine with a Y8 head that I'm cutting out the "low flow" port and bowl that I have to cut into the cooling chamber but I will TIG Weld a custom port bowl and attempt to match a Z6 head flow with a Y8 head for the Quench pads to reduce the combustion chamber temperatures and allow for more ignition timing in theory!!!!
Hate to rain on your parade. You are pursuing details that don't add up to significant HP gains. I dyno tested a ton of d16 combinations. Very heavily ported z6 and y8 heads. The "theoretical" HP gain from the y8 quench pads doesn't happen na or turbo It does affect the ignition timing used for max HP vs the z6 tho.
Whats your thoughts on a non intercooled setup on e98.
Really want to stay clear of dual injectors and don't want all the billet atomizer issues that would come with running methanol . Engine is a 370ci ls with everything supporting for 1500+ hp. Rather large twin 80mm chargers. Drag race use only no drive time, you think it would work or would I be better off just going straight to methanol from the start? Love all of the videos! Just bought your full course. Thanks for everything!
I’d just do methanol on that. Totally understand your concerns with the injector options. Unfortunately it just is what it is haha
Great stuff. Learning more every day.
Madness with no IC but hey if it works it works. It would make more with an IC but honestly if the turbos out of air it wouldnt matter🤔 very interesting! Tbh I'd love to ditch my IC so my rad could get some more air
Nothing upsets me more than the big holley dash with the HUGE black border... like a flat screen TV from 10 years ago
Very nice. Simple setup great power. Vsracing 7875 FTW! In the last run you didn’t touch timing?
Got you trilogy and learning.
Same here!
Same
Same
What was the base fuel pressure? Could lower it to regain more injector control.
Shit, even 25-30psi base if you had to. Plus, that'd stretch out a borderline fuel pump if you needed to.
You’re a Wizard my friend!👍
Wha was the air temps on that last pull?
Odd combination of a 6 point cage, a turbo ls, no intercooler, a 9" rearend and a smallish turbo. Still be a fun lil car though.
We need more videos thank you
I ran 38-40psi non intercooled on E85+meth with a 10v 5cyl Audi. The engine lived, but I'll never do it again. Tuning it was awful, and it was picky about weather. The relationship of pre compressor to post compressor temp isn't 1:1, so that affected the flash point of the methanol and everything else in the tune.
Pretty sure its the Foxbody Gods saying no more LS Swaps! forbidden...;) Some are just a pain for sure. going over clients builds.
What sized engine is this and what Ar rear housing on the turbo. Those 7875s with the 0.96 fall over up to with a 6.0.
I kept waiting to hear what the IAT’s were when you switched to ethanol at those power levels? Any insight?
Air temp sensor is before the fuel injectors so there is no change as a result of the fuel
@@JoeSimpsonAtTempest yea forgot about that. I’m IC but it’s to the point it’s restrictive so its either a2w and add weight or m1. Haven’t wanted to chance detonation non IC with e85 so I have been researching non IC setups.
Love the content man, learned a lot about Holley. 🔥
What kind of timing did it end up liking?
Great work....
I wonder what it would of made power wise with a blow thru carb or a super sniper getting the fuel up higher in the intake manifold
Bad ass tuner
It’s odd to me how smooth your ve table looks my engine didn’t want a perfectly smooth hill in the ve table to get the least correction it looks nothing like yours but I’m no professional
👍👍👍
830 whp with no IC...... are you kidding me. There you have it guys, LS turbos for the win & the $$$.
Hey man what’s you’re opinion on non intercooled e85 set ups? Are they pretty streetable?
I’d never not use an intercooler unless you physically couldn’t fit one
@@JoeSimpsonAtTempest well sounds like my s10 is getting a intercooler lol. Love the videos man
You know a company that builds custom headers I have a problem with cracking them
Why do you have car backed in? Why not have pulled into bay and have the exhaust already vented
what cage setup do you have?
If i were to run e85 is their a reccomended fuel pump to use to where id only have to run 1 and still make 6/700hp or do i have to run twin pumps……on a lsa 370” lq9, or centrifugal blown 4.8 …..more than likely be the 4.8…… the lsa runs tits on high octane in my nova with race gas concentrate….the 4.8 hasnt had the fuel tank installed yet and i dont wanna run an intercooler if i can get away with it on e85 dont plan on anymore than 12psi max….its on a ‘73 c10
A walbro535 or 525 should get you there.
830 with no intercooler. Damn!
Mine made 800 2 weeks ago with no cooler and temps only got to 139
Intake temp on last pull?
Your like a wizard or somethin.....😁
I want to buy the trilogy but I'm in hard times right now... Wish I could have got the black Friday discount
I just got it three days ago for 300
Nice... wonder how that would do with meth injection at the base where the carb would go.??? Anybody have imput on that.... basically like a nitrous plate ?
Meth (Snow system) does work but I would be concerned about distribution since it's typically a single nozzle.
I just got my built motor running please don't jynx me.
You touched on something way too common these days, all the budget on efi and the car has a mild steel 6pt cage!!!!
Yay, another LS swapped fox body.
There’s a guy with a gn 2000hp without intercooler for the last 10 years 6:98@201
On methanol it’s not needed but that’s another world
@@Bacongrease00 I know that. Thanks
Meth significantly cools charge Temps.
@@kensmechanicalaffair really like I didn’t already know that .lollipop. I am making 1900 hp on vp116
@@MrBlackbutang cool let’s see some videos on your channel. That sounds awesome
Your a badass
Lol more Ls junk in a foxbody remember folks the Ls NEEDS the foxbody the foxbody doesnt need the Ls, all the guys I know who do real racing with Ls stuff just spin bearings or bend rods and lock up motors lol thats something people dont talk about by the time you go through 4 or 5 Ls motors you could have built a Dart block SBF setup!
Ls mustangs 😢 there should be a law against ruining one like that super original tho lol it is an engine so I’m forced to accept it
if coyotes were the same price as LS then i would love to run one. or if SBE SBF could hold the same power a SBE LS could then id also consider that.
@@kyleorsak ya u can’t beat a $200 engine I just can’t do it . for an older truck definitely a good choice but that’s just me
I'm like if you want to run Chevy shit, just ditch the shitty Ford all together. It's basically blasphemy.
@@kensmechanicalaffair makes no sense to me most of the fastest cars around are at least part ford so
@@shadetreeracer3715 It's more than likely less pocket friendly.
Need them 5.0 badges removed 🤬