Double or nothing!
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- Опубликовано: 2 дек 2024
- We used Bifacial panels for the first time at this double array, double Sol-Ark install!
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Adding a layer of white rock beneath/behind each array would boost backside gain, and show off bifacial panels strength of improved production on cloudy days. It would bring better balance to production, particularly in snowy regions where you may otherwise bounce between great (for winter) production when snow has accumulated, which drops as the reflective snow melts to reveal grass, dirt, etc. instead of something more reflective like white rock. Backside gain also hastens snow melt on the top side by heating the cells up.
A highly-reflective painted concrete would be better, but a dump truck full of white rock is considerably cheeper and easy to spread out. And BTW, ambient light from both sides can make the difference to producing usable power at all on bad days for PV production. I think bi-facial panels will become a no-brainer for most new ground mount arrays. No downside other than $.01/watt during panel purchase...and extra weight.
I have 18 bi-facial panel’s fitted and so glad I did and 16.4 kWh li-po batteries 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
Li-Po or LIFEPO?
@@tanishqbhaiji103 lithium ion phosphate
Question: Why don't you build the two banks facing slightly east and west to spread out the power curve? You could reduce the maximum potential amperage and theoretically a wire size, while making decent power for longer in the day. Show me where I'm thinking wrong, and I'll thank you for it.
Love what you do, Scott & crew!
Production curve yes, smaller wires no.
For winter off-grid only South...
Simple, your idea will create less watt hours per day.
i have bifacial panels fitted , LG was used but the solar panel itself doesn't use glass which makes them a lot lighter , i believe the solar elements are embossed in a sort of plastic
They'll make more power if you have a reflective surface behind them. If not, you probably won't see much of a difference, but there will be some.
Unless you are in a location that snows. And then they melt off real fast.
You guys should sell Abrahams Pink Hats on your merchandise page. Embroider "A different Kind of Man" on the back. Lol - those will definitely sell.
The surface below the array makes a difference, the 20% more power may be for arrays mounted above a reflective roof(like a flat roof painted white). Grass would only give you 10%. Imagine what snow could do for these panels, "powered by snow blindness"
Hm, I wonder how far it would be worth taking that idea? How about mounting mirrors below a ground array? Or at least something more reflective, as a sun reflection booster compared to grass or dirt? Might be worth it.
@@chrisdaniel2759 just be careful of heat load. Adding heat will reduce conversion efficiency. And, really, if you could target just the junction frequency of the panel you'd be optimal energy vs heat.
Hell of a system. Thanks for sharing.
Try adding gypsum, crushed sea shells, and/or white gravel under the panels
If you grow some white/light colored plants/ flowers in the back of solar panels you could get 5-10% more power from reflected light I have same type of bifacial panels. Power on 👍👍🏾🤙🤘🏾💯
I understand bi-facial excel in snow conditions.
I wonder how much additional power could be generated if you were to put white or light colored pebbles beneath the arrays. Plus it would cut down on the lawn mowing requirements.
Probably about the equivalent of purchasing a few more solar panels for a few hundred dollars.
That's one impressive (and expensive) system, nice job! It's hard to believe people use this much electricity... I think on average we use about 7.5 KW a day, but use NG for DHW and some heating.
where I live we do not have NG available. So my home everything is electric except for my furnace which is fuel oil. If I could I would try out an electric furnace as well especially now that fuel prices are starting to skyrocket. I do wish that all we used was 7.5 kwh a day get rid of that decimal and that is what we use.
@@Pappy-1 It's just two of us in the house so we don't consume too much. I've set up the house to have energy options. We can heat with NG (I converted from oil back in 2008) via the main boiler (hasn't been used in many years) or separate NG fireplaces. We also have a catalytic wood stove which will heat the entire house. Also have a mini-split system for AC that runs 7 months out of the year, and heat during the shoulder seasons before I turn it off from late Oct through early March.
I've been blown away with how little electricity the MS system uses... We average the mentioned 7 to 7.5 kw a day including running the AC all summer. In August we might hit 8 kw, but never more. Likewise I ran a test yesterday to see how much electricity we would use if we heated the house only using the MS for 24 hr. Our total household consumption was 10.5 kw, high temp outside was 52 degrees, low was 32 degrees (F). So it probably only used about 4-5.5 kw itself to hold the house at 66 degrees.
If I didn't have other options, I would 100% use the MS system for all AC and heating year round, they are so damn efficient and have really become affordable. Pretty easy to install yourself too. Mine is about 11 years old, the newer models are even more efficient.
I've been looking into installing solar to possibly go this direction, and to reduce our carbon footprint. The zoning/permits make it a hassle (but doable) for a DIY person, and the ROI for someone like myself that doesn't use much isn't all that great, but I will do something. I might just buy a couple of panels and use micro inverters tied to the MS in a plug and play configuration. The payback for this is attractive. I really don't want to go through the power company where I pay $0.20/kwh and get paid $0.02/kwh for net metering, plus have to deal with the zoning crap. Ideally having a full off grid system would be the goal, but again the ROI for us at today's prices is way out there...
Did the customer have a soft start installed on the AC unit? It cuts the start amps in half on most AC units. Helps out significantly on solar.
He mentioned that as a possibility later.
@@HylanderSB it is totally worth it. I do HVACR on top of off-grid. My customers have been so happy. I had one customer that had a draw issue in his double wide. I stated it would be more costly searching for the issue than just reducing the load. Especially since we couldn't find anything on a standard inspection. He is incredibly happy and sold 3 more soft start installs for me.
I would have spread the panels out a little bit instead of cutting off som much of the extension. It would have increased the backlight available to the middle group of panels even if just a little.
I think the clips anchor two panels at a time when installing this way-spreading them out would require double the panel clips
@@balrog006 You’re likely right but I’d venture to guess that the additional light to the back would more than cover more clips over the lifespan of the system. Obviously, I don’t actually know that. 🍻
Not sure if the trade off or payoff for that change either, just pointing out what I thought was good to know on panel/clip pairing
@@balrog006 agreed.
Loved watching the video at an unknown location!
Off the wall question...at 17:56, there is a toilet. When we had electrical work done, we had to build a wall between any water source and any electrical source. Our code said they couldn't be within 6 feet of one another without a wall. Is the code there different or is it a non functioning toilet?
Thankfully the toilet was disconnected and out of service. You are correct on the code there - no breaker boxes in bathrooms.
DC Grounding procedures typically "follow PV conductors," but not necessary through the IMO DC Isolators? Makes sense where they're non-metallic enclosures, I just see a ton of diagrams showing ground running through DC Disconnects.
where we live in northern cali, ground mounts need massive concrete footings to prevent uplift and wind load issues. Surprised you just drive in supports 6 feet and that is code compliant.
Wouldn’t likely be compliant there with wacky Cali regulations-but they offer an engineered ballasted foundation option for those situations as well as special designs for higher wind or snow loads so while not cookie cutter, they could design something for you there too.
Scott what is the cost difference between bifacial panels and the normal panels?
pretty sure he said $0.01 per watt
Yes $0.01 more per watt
I see this type of stuff and it reminds me of the warm fuzzy feeling I got 25 years ago building a computer. How much something like that run, approximately?
more like building your own computer in the sixties: he mentioned $90,000 in another thread
I would love too have you build up a system for us but we live in northern Minnesota. We are two years away from building a new super off grid small home.
St cloud Mn
Getting ready to order. 🙏
QUESTION: If the owner spread a whiteish sand or gravel under and around the two arrays would that improve the generation of the system since the panels are bi-facial? Just curious…
Yes about 10%
My profile pic is what you described
Yes we're going to get the owner to do this as he has plenty of white sand.
@@engineer775 good looking system man.
@@engineer775 i am curious if one can shut down the wifi feature of the solarc's and if software needs to be updated. the reason i ask is i would NOT desire bad actors to even monitor my usage, production, or make any changes.
i DO consider every government employee or contractor a BAD ACTOR!!!
i do NOT know much about solar but i have lived off grid and used solar in the past.
i love your videos SCOTT and have watched them for at least 8 years! youtube/google keeps banning me for life, so i have to create new accounts in different names etc.. and then hunt down the creators i have subscribed to!
and the government HAS given me personally plenty of reasons NOT to trust anything they say or do since i was about 10 or 11 years old, me personally and NOT my family!
forgot to mention that i worked at a natural gas fired generation plant (AP&L, now called ENTERGY) in the late 1970's traioning to be a boiler operator.
i would NEVER send even 1 watt to the grid even if they would pay me cash at the rate they charge me for a watt!!!!!!
their fees like line maintenance are ROBBERY and why the hell should i pay 1 cent to upgrade the power lines to provide power to walmart. governments giving corporations money, land and free infrastructure, and tax free for x number of years to build in their area while increasing my taxes is GOVERNMENT CORRUPTION!!
the city i live in today has an contract with a company that builds houses to be moved to other places. this contract is at least 10 years old and renewed just last year. this contract gives this company a percentage of SALES TAX from the sale of those homes to the company so they can expand etc... that is the sales tax from the purchase of the house by a person, NOT any tax the company paid out!!
Great project.
You can probably increase solar input by putting reflective ground cover like white stone or sand as ground cover around the panels
How about 12” of snow? We will have that from November to March.
@@gubbool That will help but during spring, summer and fall a more reflective surface can't hurt
Directional line boring is some kind of black magic. ☠️❤️
Well I don't know about black magic but it is much appreciated.
I'm not within range but need some post pounded in.
Need to put down some white rocks or something to get more energy from back side.
Wow, think mirrors solar tracked to shine on back of those panels.......
What did this type of set up cost with material and labor after everything?
This is one of my favorite set ups I have seen.
As a hvac technician a KS1 Start relay will lower the LRA on that compressor and also make sure the run cap mfd is also not low.
Everything was 90k installed.
@Agent Smith "everything" means everything. "Everything installed was 90k"
@Agent Smiththat included the battery cost
Honestly that $90,000 may sound like a lot, but considering you are the very best that is actually a dang good deal!
Nice job! Wish y’all serviced Texas area
Another vote for "come to Texas"
Three. 👋🏼
Can't believe I've been watching you since your wood gas truck days...
They don't make some kind of end cap to put on those cantilevers? or some bright orange paint or an angled cut or something other than sharp corners waiting to snag a shirt or gouge a forehead or cut an arm!?
A pool noodle? I agree with you. I keep seeing those ends just hanging out there and I know kids would love playing around them. I wonder how long it is until there is a run to the ER for stitches.
Did I miss someone saying which Q-Cell are being used, there are several models and variants of models. I have 42 430W Mono Duo G6.2 panels coming in shipment. .
I have 48 same model as you. I think he said 410 bifacial.
How do you calculate these bifacial in to not exceed the sol ark input? Do you base it on the first rating or do you base it on front and back combine potential?
Big arrays makes yard beautiful ...look at that
By the way Scott you guys really do some nice looking work.
Proper brick trench to be made for cabling not just dig the ground if any problem in future
I am putting in an EMP hardened sol ark 12k with a 10.8 kw ground mount array. I am using a 200amp, 48v Ark battery and bought a spare BMS component for it. Is there any other EMP hardening I need to think about on my system? I thought I heard you mention EMP hardening at the array?
BTW, I love seeing the systems you guys build, thank you for the solid content.
They make emp arresting cores that go around the MC4 wires on the back of the panels, similar to the cores that Sol-ark has you place around the 48v battery wires.
Love all your videos. I am in awe with the systems you build. Wish you guys were closer to Northwestern PA. I would love to have you install one for me. What is your take on those bifacial panels?
Do you still do the flying V array setups? 1 facing SSE and 1 facing SSW to get maximum sun exposure from early morning to late afternoon.
We haven't been doing that as most of these systems have a great connection so we can sell power back. It's really only on the off-grid builds where we employ that.
Is that supposed to be a 320A (400A peak but S base meter lugs can't handle more than 320A continuous) service? Cuz the utility fitted a 200A current limit meter.
It’s kind of a “legacy service”. It was well done (if old) in all copper with well connected (crimped) current carrying conductors and properly (after some love) grounded. The current limit meter won’t be an issue considering the customer’s demand and the customer’s generation/storage.
Outstanding
How do I retro fit a 28 panel 10Kw grid tied system ? Do i just need the interverter and batteries?
Scott/E775. How are these bifacial panels doing as far as the extra production potential? Thanks in advance.
Scott, could say something about the wiring troughs that you prefer to use. In the May 6 2020 “Sol-Ark 12k… video, it seems that two or more were joined; that system appears to be what I want to duplicate. What are the inside dimensions? What is your preferred vendor?
What gauge wire do you run between the solar array to the house? Thx
#8 thhn
Nice job i want to learn solar
The only thing I say that I dnt like . When u pay the extra money for bifocal panels and know the racking is in the wrong place . Sence it’s blocking some of the back . Is there a reason why you didn’t reposition the racking
What brand of bifacial did you use? I'm looking at using the LG 440 bifacials for my system.
Hanhwa Qcell 415
Beautiful
What make is that ground mount please?
Sinclair
I have noticed you are using a lot of Sinclair ground mounts. I am trying to decide IronRidge or Sinclair. For the DIY inexperienced person (me) I am leaning to IronRidge since I will rent a 24” auger and setup all my racking before I pour concrete. The Sinclair seems to go in nice but I would have to find a place to rent the special machine to pound in the posts. It might be nice to have the option to tilt the array seasonally like the Sinclair can. So are you still installing the bifacial a from Q Cell? I was looking at these for my place. If you have any advice I am all ears.
Sinclair will cost about 30% less than iron ridge and a much cleaner look. Although, if hand digging I can see where the smaller holes could be the only benefit. Also, the tilt jacks are great for small installations.
You can use the same 2’ auger to install Sinclair posts. They have 3 methods for installing, pounding is just one of them. Most DIY’ers who use them will auger or dig holes.
Some systems I have seen have a little optimizer box installed for each panel. Do you not need those with the inverter you are using?
How did you EMP harden the panels?
So I’m curious… when I’m designing my system with bifacial, which output rating should I base my calculations on?
I have honest questions. Why are folks running DC ALL the way inside instead of having a converter close to the panels? Also, isn't AC wiring both smaller and cheaper or have I been misinformed?
I think the ground mounts on large acreage have no shading issue so they can avoid the cost of the microinverters. They can run $150 per panel...
First, they didn't use micro-inverters at the panels to convert DC to AC. Also, you can run higher voltage with DC, which means less amperage. Running long wire runs back to the house would require thicker wiring if the amperage was higher. So by going DC at high voltage/lower amperage, they can use thinner wiring to the house and save a significant amount in wiring alone.
As well as the other reasons stated in the replies to your comment below DC direct to the inverter is more efficient, especially if charging batteries. Converting back and forth from DC to AC to DC to AC at 9X% efficiency means you loose production.
What batteries was on that job.
All the safeties during that meter pull huh
Any experience with Victron Energy?
Love these videos guys Thumbs Up !
Love the way Americans do stuff! I'm building a small off grid system in Scotland near Loch Ness, does anyone know where I could buy some tilting cranks and have them shipped from the US? Can't find any here, but tilting makes good sense. We're putting white gravel under our array, I thought I'd invented that idea but you guys had already thought of it it seems!
The tilting cranks are just trailer tongue jacks. Look around at trailer stores, parts suppliers etc for a hand crank type of trailer tongue jack and you should be able to find something usable.
Where are you guys located at? I’m in Michigan bear metro Detroit / Ann Arbor and looking for someone build me a solar Pergola… I could use some help with coming up with Hybrid Grid Tie with a Battery backup that holds the home usage, and eventually installing it would you be interested?
What in particular make it EMP hardened?
How much for the silver Silverado Z71 in the driveway......lol
Another job well done. That’s freaking awesome!
Beautiful 🤩
Why bifacial? The location and how they are mounted doesn't look to be able to fully utilize the feature. No sand, no white rock, no reflectivity.
Look closer
I read on a bunch of websites that you can't parallel those solark 12ks. I'm assuming if you're doing it, that's not true? I started looking at different inverters because of it. Also do you have any experience with the issues those have with tripping using 110/120? (Dave poz video about them tripping and resetting)
SOK arks can absolutely be set up in multiples, E775 has many videos on just that. poz has an agenda and deliberately put his SA inverter into a failure to prove a point and get clicks/views.
Are you worried about max Isc input when paralleling those bi-facials? Max 25A per MPPT stated in the manual. Or are you counting on clipping to occur (20A @450Voc/300Vmp or 18A @500Voc/400Vmp)??
I only ask because I have limited space and would love to do bi-facials but Sol-ark tech support advised against it for the reason above 😳. Any help would be greatly appreciated ☺️🙏.
Great question and we are counting on clipping by the Solark.
@@engineer775 awesomeness, thanks for the reply! Might you have a source in Virginia Beach, VA. For these panels? I've already installed everything else.
Funny storytime
My Chief asked me: what's a shore stationed sailor to do... I answered with: study solar and create your own system! Lol 🤣
@@meganwinters5163 they are 29 panels per pallet and we can ship them to you from Pennsylvania to Virginia Beach no problem. If you're interested send an email to info@ap.org peppers.com and will give you a quote including shipping.
Anyone know the shear strength of a 3/4” sheet of plywood? I want to hang several wall-mount batteries on a wall along with a Sol-Ark. I thinking the total weight is about 1,000 pounds .
I’m not an engineer. I don’t know the exact numbers, but I would use more than one sheet of the best grade 23/32”, lots of construction adhesive and long, strong torx screws going into at least 2x6’s 12” oc.
The South, you say?!?! Not much renewable love here. Which state??
NICE!!!
Thumbs up and subscribed! Wow Huge job, God bless and good luck!
23:00 Why do you jump from talking about watts then kilo watts then back to watts... Good thing its metric LOL
When pounding post, what do you guys do when you get into rock?
We have a couple of options if we're if we've reached the minimum in bed meant we will just pound as much as we can into the Rock then we will cut the top of the post and re-drill. Sometimes we also move to a new location and try there or we put the bucket on the excavator and dig up the rocks and pour concrete again.
@@engineer775 thanks for responding... I'm asking cuz I live in Rockvale, TN... don't ask me why they named it that... ;>)
btw - what can a guy get a Sol-Ark 12kw hybrid inverter for?
AWESOME...!!!!
I have 500 bufacels there ET 385 266 watts in back
Easy to tell people that put in systems like that have LOTS of money.
Yes sistema 🔋 ⚡ 🔌 💡 👍
Wrong racking. Lot of shadows at backside 😞
Come install me a sol-ark
6 parallel strings of lead acid lol gotta love customer engineering
But hey that's a future problem right
With proper care I’ve seen them last 6-8 years. Without proper care, well… you’re right.
Ballpark: How much USD should a guy budget to build this system? Arkansas is not the friendliest when it comes to solar. I’m itching.
I'd still like to see a video of a system that the average Jack/Jill of all trades can purchase from retail stores and assemble him/her self.
No such thing
I don't believe that @@GainSolarPower
I'm not talking about something that will power an entire house or even climate control a building. I'm talking about lights, fan, 12v appliances maybe a TV. I know it can be done. I'd just like to see someone who knows what they are doing to do a start to finish video of an adequate system. Not the best money can buy, made of the best components.
@@1100wing whats the budget for this jack and jill system. Why not by the best if it fails when you need it then what good is it?
Its disappointing the cost of these systems is never disclosed on each install.
Your looking at 50 to 60k solar. The batteries are probably cost since the home owner runs a shop that sells them. That would be to unknown price. I bulk paid $3600 for qty 18 200ah AGM batteries. You would need a lot more than that to run a full size home.
such a big array but no solar tracker? That is pure waist, could have installed less panels with a better curve there.
Between the higher cost of the mounts, the equipment, the power use and the fiddling with them they almost never pay for themselves in a residential application. In large solar farms, commercial applications yes.
Subscribed! Nice video. We just started our channel here at Lucky Dog Farms. J
I have been watching you for a while now and I love the work you do. I am getting ready to upgrade an outback system on a 3 bedrooom house (on 40 acres) I have in Mohave County Arizona. I am also building house on another 40 acres a stones throw away. Both properties are completely off grid. I know you don’t travel this far west, but do you have someone you could refer me to that shares your work ethic and knowledge? I would appreciate your help. Thank you.
Best wishes. Thanks for sharing, Lord-Jesus-Christ dot
+1
Jealous of the system except those batteries. I don't understand why anyone uses lead acid. Lifepo4 is better in every way.
It's because of the EMP protection the customer desired.
First!
😁👌🖖✌👍😎
Unfortunately people who are just barely paying the bills can only dream of this! But that’s ok one day Jesus is coming and no more stress!!!
Living on Social Security, managed a 1 kw array, 5kw batteries, 3.5 kw psw inverter to keep all 120v house power on .Installed sub panel feed with contactor interlock so spouse can push button to flip from grid to solar.
false christ comes first .... the most frightening thing the world will ever see
Must be comforting to know that the sun is not that far away !!!